Re: do not overtreat the thyroid - NEWBIE

[Guest guest]

Hi Bee,

I'm new to the group and having been lurking for

awhile. But this post struck me. I was also

diagnosed with Grave's disease and have been learning

a great deal about thyroid, adrenal and food allergies

for the last few years. I mentioned in another group

that whenever I cut back on carbs I feel like I'm

withdrawing from heroin (though I have to point out

that I've never done heroin), and someone suggested my

issue might be related to candida, which got me to

this group.

While I agree overtreating the thyroid is a dangerous

idea, I've seen a lot of people have problems and have

to lower their thyroid meds after starting iodine

therapy. I'm also reluctant to add iodine into my

regime, but I continue to find evidence that it's an

essential mineral that without it actually may have

triggered some of my problems - low thyroid (I have

Grave's, but never had a very overactive thyroid), low

cortisol, low progesterone, low testosterone, food

allergies and suspected candida and leaky gut

problems.

One of the reasons why I'm slightly reluctant to

accept my suspected candida issues is that several

years ago I did the Atkins diet, while exercising a

great deal for over a month. I didn't lose any

weight, and then one day woke up with what turned out

to be the Grave's eye disease. I always wondered if

the low carb diet triggered it. Aside from the severe

(die-off effects???) symptoms I get from reducing

carbs, I haven't noticed any weight loss, even with

exercise and I worry that my body just doesn't like

it, since I feel like (right or wrong) was punished by

getting Grave's when I did it.

You mentioned that you had your thyroid ablated. I've

known several who went on to have numerous problems as

the result of the radioactive iodine, even 10-20 years

later. Can you attribute any to this? Do you include

iodine in your diet now?

SAMMIE

--- Bee <beeisbuzzing2003@...> wrote:

>

> >

> > Anita,

> >

> > Are you charting your basal body temperatures to

> keep an eye on your

> > thyroid? Your temps pre-ovulation should be above

> 97.6. If they

> are below that, it indicates a potential thyroid

> problem. Coconut

> oil is good for bringing the temps up.

> >

> ==>Marla, it isn't a wise idea to keep track of

> basal body

> temperatures to regulate thyroid treatments or meds.

> The reason is

> because the thyroid is not the only organ involved

> in regulating body

> temperature and treating the thyroid may be the

> wrong cause. I

> followed that protocol when I had candida; taking my

> basal body

> temperature, and treating my thyroid with Lugol's

> iodine and

> dessicated thyroid. It was obviously the wrong

> things to do. At one

> point my thyroid went into such a tizzy that it

> became highly

> overactive, Grave's Disease. It was so serious that

> it had to be

> zapped with radiation to kill it. I attribute the

> problem to over-

> tampering with the thyroid when the true cause was

> candida. Candida

> in turn also caused adrenal malfunctioning, hormone

> imbalances, etc.

> and because candida toxins cause all of the body's

> cells to go rigid

> thyroid and other hormones aren't as able to get

> into cells to do

> their job. However the thyroid could still be

> functioning fine. The

> focus should be on getting rid of candida.

>

> The best in health, Bee

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

>

> Hi Bee,

==>Hi Sammie. Welcome to our group.

>

> I'm new to the group and having been lurking for

> awhile. But this post struck me. I was also

> diagnosed with Grave's disease and have been learning

> a great deal about thyroid, adrenal and food allergies

> for the last few years. I mentioned in another group

> that whenever I cut back on carbs I feel like I'm

> withdrawing from heroin (though I have to point out

> that I've never done heroin), and someone suggested my

> issue might be related to candida, which got me to

> this group.

>

> While I agree overtreating the thyroid is a dangerous

> idea, I've seen a lot of people have problems and have

> to lower their thyroid meds after starting iodine

> therapy. I'm also reluctant to add iodine into my

> regime, but I continue to find evidence that it's an

> essential mineral that without it actually may have

> triggered some of my problems - low thyroid (I have

> Grave's, but never had a very overactive thyroid), low

> cortisol, low progesterone, low testosterone, food

> allergies and suspected candida and leaky gut

> problems.

==>Grave's disease is not low thyroid function, it is high thyroid

function, i.e. an overactive thyroid. Your body only requires trace

amounts of iodine - there are plenty of foods sources on my diet plus

iodine contained in the ocean sea salt I recommend (Electrolyte

Drink). Taking too much iodine is just as damaging to the thyroid as

having too little.

==>All of your symptoms definitely point to candida.

>

> One of the reasons why I'm slightly reluctant to

> accept my suspected candida issues is that several

> years ago I did the Atkins diet, while exercising a

> great deal for over a month. I didn't lose any

> weight, and then one day woke up with what turned out

> to be the Grave's eye disease. I always wondered if the low carb

diet triggered it.

==>Protruding eyes can be caused by Grave's disease, which is an

overactive thyroid. I acquired Grave's disease while doing the

candida program 20 years ago, but that was after tampering with my

thyroid by taking Lugol's iodine and dessicated thyroid medications.

My thyroid went into a tizzy, going from underactive to highly

overactive. A low carb diet definitely does not cause Grave's

disease. Candida does cause thyroid malfunctions because the toxins

it puts out makes all of the body's cell go rigid, making it

difficult for thyroid and other hormones to get into the cells where

they are needed to do their job.

==>The candida diet is very different than just a low-carb diet like

Atkins, because all foods that feed candida must be eliminated,

including grains, seeds, nut, legumes, sugar (including fruit, except

lemon), high carb veggies, etc. like my diet outlines.

> Aside from the severe (die-off effects???) symptoms I get from

reducing carbs, I haven't noticed any weight loss, even with exercise

and I worry that my body just doesn't like it, since I feel like

(right or wrong) was punished by getting Grave's when I did it.

==>It is apparent that the low carb diet did cause die-off effects.

Some people do not lose weight on a low-carb depending upon the kind

of low-carb diet and also what their health issues are. Again,

Grave's is not caused by a low-carb diet otherwise the Eskimos and

other primitive people who ate all meat and fat diets would have died

out long ago from thyroid disease, however they didn't.

>

> You mentioned that you had your thyroid ablated. I've

> known several who went on to have numerous problems as

> the result of the radioactive iodine, even 10-20 years

> later. Can you attribute any to this? Do you include

> iodine in your diet now?

==>Since I have no thyroid I take dessicated thyroid tablets every

day. I do not take iodine except for what is contained in my foods

and ocean sea salt. I seem to be fine even 20 years after having the

radioactive iodine treatment. I'm sure other people do not eat the

high good fat diet I do however.

Bee

[Guest guest]

I have proof that this diet raised my thyroid levels

as I had lab work done before the diet and 1 year

later. Just my experience.

Luv,

Debby

San , CA

--- Sammie Baker <jigscam@...> wrote:

> Hi Bee,

>

> I'm new to the group and having been lurking for

> awhile. But this post struck me. I was also

> diagnosed with Grave's disease and have been

> learning

> a great deal about thyroid, adrenal and food

> allergies

> for the last few years. I mentioned in another

>

-------------

Caring for myself is the best way I know to care for others and to find the

good in everything.

My son Hunter Hudson (10/11/04) http://debbypadilla.0catch.com/hunter/

[Guest guest]

ohhh. See, that's what I thought. Do you get your

anti-bodies tested on a regular basis, too? How high

did they get??

SAMMIE

--- Debby Padilla-Hudson <debbypadilla@...>

wrote:

> I have proof that this diet raised my thyroid levels

> as I had lab work done before the diet and 1 year

> later. Just my experience.

>

> Luv,

> Debby

> San , CA

>

> --- Sammie Baker <jigscam@...> wrote:

>

> > Hi Bee,

> >

> > I'm new to the group and having been lurking for

> > awhile. But this post struck me. I was also

> > diagnosed with Grave's disease and have been

> > learning

> > a great deal about thyroid, adrenal and food

> > allergies

> > for the last few years. I mentioned in another

> >

>

> -------------

> Caring for myself is the best way I know to care for

> others and to find the good in everything.

>

> My son Hunter Hudson (10/11/04)

> http://debbypadilla.0catch.com/hunter/

>

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[Guest guest]

>

> ohhh. See, that's what I thought. Do you get your

> anti-bodies tested on a regular basis, too? How high

> did they get??

==>Sammie, the antibody theory is not valid; see articles on my website

about them.

Bee

[Guest guest]

--- Sammie Baker <jigscam@...> wrote:

> ohhh. See, that's what I thought. Do you get your

> anti-bodies tested on a regular basis, too? How

> high

> did they get??

I'm not sure what an antibody test would be. I know

that my cholesterol was down 50+ points as well as my

BP, my thyroid levels were up and my markers for

diabetes were normal instead of pre-diabetic. If you

want me to show you my before numbers let me know.

All other tests done showed normal readings from what

I could see, neither too low nor too high.

Also keep in mind that I had been on a more liberal

low carb diet for a year at the time the first tests

were taken, so it shows that either I improved a lot

more in that year or that this is a lot better than

your average low carb diet, or both.

Here is what my tests were as of October I believe,

after a year on the diet (BP was 112/76 if I recall

correctly):

CHOLESTEROL

Value: 193 Low: <239 High: Unit: mg/dL

HDL

Value: 52 Low: >45 High: Unit: mg/dL

LDL DIRECT

Value: 135 Low: >129 High: Unit: mg/dL

HGBA1C %

Value: 5.2 Low: 4.6 High: 6.0 Unit: %

TSH

Value: 3.7 Low: 0.2 High: 5.5 Unit: uIU/mL

T4 FREE

Value: 1.1 Low: 0.8 High: 1.7 Unit: ng/dL

GLUCOSE, RANDOM

Value: 79 Low: 60 High: 159 Unit: mg/dL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY

Value: 36 Low: 20 High: 100 Unit: ng/mL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D3

Value: 36 Low: High: Unit: ng/mL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D2

Value: <4 Low: High: Unit: ng/mL

WBC COUNT

Value: 7.9 Low: 3.5 High: 12.5 Unit: K/uL

RED BLOOD CELLS COUNT

Value: 5.18 Low: 3.60 High: 5.70 Unit: M/uL

HGB

Value: 14.7 Low: 11.5 High: 15.0 Unit: g/dL

HEMATOCRIT

Value: 44.9 Low: 34.0 High: 46.0 Unit: %

MCV

Value: 87 Low: 80 High: 100 Unit: fL

RDW, RBC

Value: 14.1 Low: 11.9 High: 14.3 Unit: %

PLATELETS COUNT

Value: 294 Low: 140 High: 400 Unit: K/uL

NEUTROPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 69 Low: 50 High: 70 Unit: %

LYMPHOCYTES %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 24 Low: 20 High: 50 Unit: %

MONOS %, AUTO

Value: 6 Low: 1 High: 14 Unit: %

EOSINOPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 1 Low: 0 High: 4 Unit: %

BASOPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 0 Low: 0 High: 2 Unit: %

Luv,

Debby

San , CA

-------------

Caring for myself is the best way I know to care for others and to find the

good in everything.

My son Hunter Hudson (10/11/04) http://debbypadilla.0catch.com/hunter/

[Guest guest]

Hi Debby,

Bee said that she didn't consider getting antibodies tested very important,

but I don't know if I totally agree. When I was diagnosed with Grave's disease,

my thyroid levels weren't high, but I had very high Grave's anti-bodies and had

the eye disease. Going on anti-thyroid meds was really the only option for me

to ease my eye disease. I just shouldn't have been on such a high dose for so

long. Woulda-coulda......

I'm surprised that your doc isn't testing you for Grave's and Hashi's

antibodies, which are usually involved with thyroid disease - not always with

low thyroid, but most often with overactive. Grave's anti-bodies typically

raise the thyroid and Hashi's can raise or lower. Hashi's is pretty hard to

manage in my opinion, and I would think this would be an important test to take.

Many Hashi's folks can't take iodine treatment or they will swing Hyper very

quick.

It would be interesting to see if the anti-bodies increase/decrease with any

dietary changes. At this point, I try to get them tested once a year, and

they've slowly gone down. But if they peaked for any reason, I would want to

address any recent changes. Then again, Bee may be onto something about not

thinking they are important. I've been trained to think that they are, based on

my history and time spent on the thyroid support groups.

At any rate, your TSH seems pretty high to me. That range is totally

arbitrary and pointless. I would be severly Hypo-thyroid with a TSH at 3.7, and

I've been there. The ranges are often useless, because it's a average of

numbers given by healthy people who take a thyroid test saying they feel normal

or not. Some people might feel great with a TSH of 2.0, other's would feel Hypo

(I would). So, having a doc say it's " normal " because it's in a given range, is

BS. It's important to realize this and know that you need to find out where you

feel optimal.

Have you been tested for Free T3? I wish I was more helpful regarding the

others tests, but I don't know much about their relevance. I know vitamin D is

important relative to auto-immune disease. I just don't remember which test is

important.

SAMMIE

Debby Padilla-Hudson <debbypadilla@...> wrote:

--- Sammie Baker <jigscam@...> wrote:

> ohhh. See, that's what I thought. Do you get your

> anti-bodies tested on a regular basis, too? How

> high

> did they get??

I'm not sure what an antibody test would be. I know

that my cholesterol was down 50+ points as well as my

BP, my thyroid levels were up and my markers for

diabetes were normal instead of pre-diabetic. If you

want me to show you my before numbers let me know.

All other tests done showed normal readings from what

I could see, neither too low nor too high.

Also keep in mind that I had been on a more liberal

low carb diet for a year at the time the first tests

were taken, so it shows that either I improved a lot

more in that year or that this is a lot better than

your average low carb diet, or both.

Here is what my tests were as of October I believe,

after a year on the diet (BP was 112/76 if I recall

correctly):

CHOLESTEROL

Value: 193 Low: <239 High: Unit: mg/dL

HDL

Value: 52 Low: >45 High: Unit: mg/dL

LDL DIRECT

Value: 135 Low: >129 High: Unit: mg/dL

HGBA1C %

Value: 5.2 Low: 4.6 High: 6.0 Unit: %

TSH

Value: 3.7 Low: 0.2 High: 5.5 Unit: uIU/mL

T4 FREE

Value: 1.1 Low: 0.8 High: 1.7 Unit: ng/dL

GLUCOSE, RANDOM

Value: 79 Low: 60 High: 159 Unit: mg/dL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY

Value: 36 Low: 20 High: 100 Unit: ng/mL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D3

Value: 36 Low: High: Unit: ng/mL

VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D2

Value: <4 Low: High: Unit: ng/mL

WBC COUNT

Value: 7.9 Low: 3.5 High: 12.5 Unit: K/uL

RED BLOOD CELLS COUNT

Value: 5.18 Low: 3.60 High: 5.70 Unit: M/uL

HGB

Value: 14.7 Low: 11.5 High: 15.0 Unit: g/dL

HEMATOCRIT

Value: 44.9 Low: 34.0 High: 46.0 Unit: %

MCV

Value: 87 Low: 80 High: 100 Unit: fL

RDW, RBC

Value: 14.1 Low: 11.9 High: 14.3 Unit: %

PLATELETS COUNT

Value: 294 Low: 140 High: 400 Unit: K/uL

NEUTROPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 69 Low: 50 High: 70 Unit: %

LYMPHOCYTES %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 24 Low: 20 High: 50 Unit: %

MONOS %, AUTO

Value: 6 Low: 1 High: 14 Unit: %

EOSINOPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 1 Low: 0 High: 4 Unit: %

BASOPHILS %, AUTOMATED COUNT

Value: 0 Low: 0 High: 2 Unit: %

Luv,

Debby

San , CA

-------------

Caring for myself is the best way I know to care for others and to find the good

in everything.

My son Hunter Hudson (10/11/04) http://debbypadilla.0catch.com/hunter/

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[Guest guest]

--- Sammie Baker <jigscam@...> wrote:

> Bee said that she didn't consider getting

> antibodies tested very important, but I don't know

> if I totally agree. When I was diagnosed with

> Grave's disease, my thyroid levels weren't high, but

> I had very high Grave's anti-bodies and had the eye

> disease.

Hi,

I don't have any major health problems so I don't

consider it important for me to test for that sort of

thing. Mostly I go by how I feel and I feel great!

Mostly my issues were pretty minor but I had a lot of

them, and they are pretty much all cleared up now.

Just continuing to work on the weight loss.

> I'm surprised that your doc isn't testing you for

> Grave's and Hashi's antibodies, which are usually

> involved with thyroid disease - not always with low

> thyroid, but most often with overactive. Grave's

Well I don't have thyroid disease or thryoid issues at

all so there would be no need to test it. I tested my

thyroid levels initially because I wondered if that

had anything to do with my weight issues, but I know

for sure now that my issues are related to candida and

any thyroid levels are just a symptom of that.

I only posted my tests to show that my numbers look

good even after a year on this diet in case people are

worried about tests scores. Also to show that my

thyroid levels have gone up even though they were not

too low before.

> At any rate, your TSH seems pretty high to me.

> That range is totally arbitrary and pointless. I

> would be severly Hypo-thyroid with a TSH at 3.7, and

> I've been there. The ranges are often useless,

> because it's a average of numbers given by healthy

I'm not sure what the numbers mean as I have not

researched that topic. What I know is that they are

in range, and that the levels are higher than when I

started, which I assume is a good thing? Also when I

looked up the symptoms of hypothyroidism I found this

list:

Fatigue

Weakness

Weight gain or increased difficulty losing weight

Coarse, dry hair

Dry, rough pale skin

Hair loss

Cold intolerance (can't tolerate the cold like those

around you)

Muscle cramps and frequent muscle aches

Constipation

Depression

Irritability

Memory loss

Abnormal menstrual cycles

Decreased libido

Since being on this diet I have tons of strength and

energy, have lost a good deal of weight, skin and hair

look great, never had hair loss, have always been way

TOO hot, have no constipation/depression/memory loss,

brain fog is improved, have too much libidi and

menstrual cycles are like clockwork.

So perhaps some of my issues were thyroid issues, and

this diet has cleared that up, or maybe it was

unrelated. Perhaps the good fats and proteins helped

me rebuild the cells of my thyroid or produce more

hormone, or perhaps the candida was causing issues.

What ever it is, I can judge my own success based on

seeing my symptoms decrease, and the test results the

way I've read them seem to support what my body feels

and my mind knows.. this diet is healing!

Luv,

Debby

San , CA

-------------

Caring for myself is the best way I know to care for others and to find the

good in everything.

My son Hunter Hudson (10/11/04) http://debbypadilla.0catch.com/hunter/