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Are you suggesting the following the common " candida diet " (which

seems to be more or less the diet suggested by SCD with variations all

over the web) is not an advisable plan of action? Because it seems

like no matter where I look, whether it be for candida, leaky gut,

food sensitivities, or even autism, similar dietary advice is given.

If so, I am interested in hearing what you think is a " healthy " diet

plan.

If you are just talking about complete reliance and trust on one

source, I can agree with you there. In the past year, I have spent

countless hours reading completely contradicting approaches to similar

health goals and have found I have to decide for myself with as many

view points as I can get.

Greg

>

> In my own opinion, sticking to a " diet " is sticking to a dogma.

>

> Dogma is a demonstratably a bad thing; fo example, dogma

> seriously undermines both the Dr. protocol, which entirely

> misses out on bowel health, and also the Specific Carbohydrate

> Diet, which completely ignores bowel health in favour of dogma.

> Adherents are similarly following instuctions, to their

> detriment.

>

> The mistakes of both dogmatic approaches are highlighted on my

> inulin page:

> http://members.shaw.ca/duncancrow/inulin_prebiotic_probiotic.html

>

> I recommend that everyone instead get up to speed on the science

> and then take back the power they had givin to dogmatists and

> govern themselves accordingly; indeed, many people on this list

> have to follow a very restrictive diet and many can follow a more

> relaxed one because their bowel conditions are as individual as

> they are.

>

> Duncan

>

>

> > Posted by: " Patti Cassalia " pcassalia@... patticass

> > Date: Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:17 pm (PDT)

> >

> > If you are really sticking to the diet, any sugar is too much sugar.

>

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Greg, the SCD being all over the web doesn't make the approach any

more sound; there are followers for all manner of things out there.

Simply put, SCD allows specific fermentable carbs and disallows

fermentable inulin, but the carbs are bad and the inulin fermentation

is good. It's wrong enough on those key points alone to perpetuate

disease.

From my inulin page:

http://members.shaw.ca/duncancrow/inulin_prebiotic_probiotic.html

What About Elaine Gottschall's Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD)?

The SCD enshrines a fundamental ignorance of the difference between

FOS and inulin fractions and their specific prebiotic attributes. It

also promotes the consumption of sugars and other carbohydrates that

have been proven to promote bowel dysbiosis and, in the upper

intestine, a medical condition called SIBO (Small Intestine Bacterial

Overgrowth). By removing PREbiotic food that is already severely

deficient in the diet the SCD restricts essential probiotic

fermentation, thus Elaine Gottschall's SCD approach carries the

danger of increasing inflammatory bowel disease and cancer risk.

Proof of aberrant crypt foci and colon polyposis (cancer) increasing

in dysbiosis is seen in the research below; however, SCD apologists

choose to promote their dogma over ample prebiotic research and 5,000

years of historic practice, to a unsuspecting and trusting

population. Beware the agenda sites; think for yourself.

My diet is real easy; I leave most of the carbs and most of the omega-

6 oils, use inulin, whey, vitamins, wild fish and coconut oil, and

take whatever anti-aging supplements I can afford pursuant to my anti-

aging protocol. You'll see my protocol is well-reasoned and well-

referenced, it works and I've been right so far :)

All the best,

Duncan Crow

>

> Are you suggesting the following the common " candida diet " (which

> seems to be more or less the diet suggested by SCD with variations

all

> over the web) is not an advisable plan of action? Because it seems

> like no matter where I look, whether it be for candida, leaky gut,

> food sensitivities, or even autism, similar dietary advice is

given.

> If so, I am interested in hearing what you think is a " healthy " diet

> plan.

> If you are just talking about complete reliance and trust on one

> source, I can agree with you there. In the past year, I have spent

> countless hours reading completely contradicting approaches to

similar

> health goals and have found I have to decide for myself with as many

> view points as I can get.

>

> Greg

>

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Well, I wasn't specifically referring to SCD when I talk about the

candida diet. In fact this is the first time I had ever come across

the SCD specifically(or I just don't remember seeing it before). I

mean, allowing honey while excluding every other sugar doesn't make

much sense. But just searching the web, you will find hundreds of

sites recommending similar diets for candida, and often they aren't

selling anything so I find it hard to link to an agenda. From what I

have read in the past few monthes, I have decided to cut out pretty

much everything but vegetables(excluding nightshade) and meat with the

occasional slice of millet bread or almonds, ginger juice, and lots of

raw garlic(I smell horrible). I am avoiding sugar almost completely.

" My diet is real easy; I leave most of the carbs and most of the omega-

> 6 oils, use inulin, whey, vitamins, wild fish and coconut oil "

Are you saying you leave IN or leave OUT most of the carbs and omega 6

oils? Is your diet at all restrictive? What specifically are the

foods that the SCD says to cut out and you say should not be cut out?

Also, I have reason to believe I have a sensitivity to dairy as many

people with intestinal problems do. I used to drink whey all the time

until recently when I made this discovery. I know there is a

difference between whey and casein sensitivity, but is there a certain

brand of whey that will be sure to be PURE whey? Or do EAS 100% whey

products work fine?

Sorry for the barrage of questions, but it's not often I get to

converse with someone who has some answers.

Greg

> >

> > Are you suggesting the following the common " candida diet " (which

> > seems to be more or less the diet suggested by SCD with variations

> all

> > over the web) is not an advisable plan of action? Because it seems

> > like no matter where I look, whether it be for candida, leaky gut,

> > food sensitivities, or even autism, similar dietary advice is

> given.

> > If so, I am interested in hearing what you think is a " healthy " diet

> > plan.

> > If you are just talking about complete reliance and trust on one

> > source, I can agree with you there. In the past year, I have spent

> > countless hours reading completely contradicting approaches to

> similar

> > health goals and have found I have to decide for myself with as many

> > view points as I can get.

> >

> > Greg

> >

>

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Yeah, I agree, allowing some fermentable shot chain sugars and not

others doesn't make sense to me either.

You can and should have undenatured whey in a toxic situation; it

creates the body's most powerful detoxifier and antioxidant,

glutathione. Wheys vary and sensitivity varies, but generally, the

isolates produce NO reaction, and the concentrates MIGHT but usually

do not. I don't know about EAS; I'd have to see the ingredients and

description but you got the point that it has to be undenatured.

I agree the candida diets are similar; a few differ, and the SCD is

noteworthy for that, by going against nature by depopulating the

bowel organisms of probiotics by partially starving them, then adding

back in purchased probiotics that will essentially remain inactive

because they aren't being fed any more. The research is quite clear

that the culture must be active to provide the anti-cancer benefits

and the control of pathogens, and the proof is in the pudding; people

get well in a few months rather than years or not at all. I've helped

many people who had tried the SCD method, including candida, colitis

Crohn's and IBS patients.

I leave OUT most of the carbs and omega-6 oils; we're swamped with

them. No, my diet isn't restrictive for me but it might seem so to

some people; I don't have candida though, I'm a practitioner. I have

potatoes a couple of times a month, rice a couple of times a year,

frequently a slice of toast, pasta never, beer frequently, veggies,

meat, eggs always, whey nearly every day, coconut cream nearly every

day, nuts ad lib etc...

I think the SCD avoids fermentation generally, but only really

suppresses GOOD fementation by cutting inulin. I know the Healing

Crow version of the SCD cuts out inulin and undenatured whey, citing

that they are man-made chemicals. Talk about a unsubstantiated

suspicion-based approach, given the data, Hoo Boy!

Questions are fine, but I'm going out -- chat tomorrow Greg :)

Duncan

> >

> > Greg, the SCD being all over the web doesn't make the approach

any

> > more sound; there are followers for all manner of things out

there.

> > Simply put, SCD allows specific fermentable carbs and disallows

> > fermentable inulin, but the carbs are bad and the inulin

fermentation

> > is good. It's wrong enough on those key points alone to

perpetuate

> > disease.

>

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So generally you would cut carbs too. How do you feel about

vegetables since they obviously have carbs, Especially the sweeter

ones, namely carrots? Should more carbs be allowed in as the

" terrain " improves from taking inulin? It doesn't seem to make sense

that someone with a healthy system would have to completely avoid

nature's quicker sources of energy. None of my friends experience

noticeable problems from carbs. And I have heard that alot of those

African long distance runners eat a diet that is 25% natural sugar.

Also, as far as the whey is concerned, how do I know if it is

undenatured? Often times it does not say. Even a few of the products

you have listed on your site do not specifically say the whey is

undenatured. For example, the whey I have says it is made up of " whey

protein isolate, whey protein concentrate, and whey peptides. "

> > >

> > > Greg, the SCD being all over the web doesn't make the approach

> any

> > > more sound; there are followers for all manner of things out

> there.

> > > Simply put, SCD allows specific fermentable carbs and disallows

> > > fermentable inulin, but the carbs are bad and the inulin

> fermentation

> > > is good. It's wrong enough on those key points alone to

> perpetuate

> > > disease.

> >

>

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So you would agree that carbs should definitely be limited. Two foods

that tend to be debated alot on this topic are carrots and brown rice.

How do you feel about their consumption in battling candida? And do

you think it is necessary to continue a low carb diet from here on

out, or is that just your choice as an issue of general health?

Also, how can I be sure if a whey product is undenatured? Even some

of the whey products you have listed don't explicitly say

" undenatured. " For example I have a protein blend that is made up of

" whey protein isolates, whey concentrate, and whey peptides, " but it

does not specifically make mention of being undenatured.

Greg

>

> Yeah, I agree, allowing some fermentable shot chain sugars and not

> others doesn't make sense to me either.

>

> You can and should have undenatured whey in a toxic situation; it

> creates the body's most powerful detoxifier and antioxidant,

> glutathione. Wheys vary and sensitivity varies, but generally, the

> isolates produce NO reaction, and the concentrates MIGHT but usually

> do not. I don't know about EAS; I'd have to see the ingredients and

> description but you got the point that it has to be undenatured.

>

> I agree the candida diets are similar; a few differ, and the SCD is

> noteworthy for that, by going against nature by depopulating the

> bowel organisms of probiotics by partially starving them, then adding

> back in purchased probiotics that will essentially remain inactive

> because they aren't being fed any more. The research is quite clear

> that the culture must be active to provide the anti-cancer benefits

> and the control of pathogens, and the proof is in the pudding; people

> get well in a few months rather than years or not at all. I've helped

> many people who had tried the SCD method, including candida, colitis

> Crohn's and IBS patients.

>

> I leave OUT most of the carbs and omega-6 oils; we're swamped with

> them. No, my diet isn't restrictive for me but it might seem so to

> some people; I don't have candida though, I'm a practitioner. I have

> potatoes a couple of times a month, rice a couple of times a year,

> frequently a slice of toast, pasta never, beer frequently, veggies,

> meat, eggs always, whey nearly every day, coconut cream nearly every

> day, nuts ad lib etc...

>

> I think the SCD avoids fermentation generally, but only really

> suppresses GOOD fementation by cutting inulin. I know the Healing

> Crow version of the SCD cuts out inulin and undenatured whey, citing

> that they are man-made chemicals. Talk about a unsubstantiated

> suspicion-based approach, given the data, Hoo Boy!

>

> Questions are fine, but I'm going out -- chat tomorrow Greg :)

>

> Duncan

> >

>

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I've since communicated privately with Greg on this, but yes,

once the bowel ecology is fairly good it's also fairly resilient

and adding in carbs is OK, just not to the levels that cause

disease.

We also have diabetes, suppressed HGH ad resulting metabolic

syndome and glycation to think about in people without candida.

Carbs are still essentially bad in any more than low levels; just

realize it and govern yourselves accordingly. It's really a

lifestyle thing.

Peptides intact, undenatured, low temperature or cold processed

is the language to look for when buying whey.

Duncan

On 3 Oct 2006 at 0:05, candidiasis wrote:

>

> Posted by: " dreaminginnoother " dreaminginnoother@...

> dreaminginnoother Date: Mon Oct 2, 2006 11:12 am (PDT)

>

> So generally you would cut carbs too. How do you feel about

> vegetables since they obviously have carbs, Especially the sweeter

> ones, namely carrots? Should more carbs be allowed in as the

> " terrain " improves from taking inulin? It doesn't seem to make sense

> that someone with a healthy system would have to completely avoid

> nature's quicker sources of energy. None of my friends experience

> noticeable problems from carbs. And I have heard that alot of those

> African long distance runners eat a diet that is 25% natural sugar.

> Also, as far as the whey is concerned, how do I know if it is

> undenatured? Often times it does not say. Even a few of the products

> you have listed on your site do not specifically say the whey is

> undenatured. For example, the whey I have says it is made up of " whey

> protein isolate, whey protein concentrate, and whey peptides. "

>

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Duncan you mentioned in one of the posts that you are a practitioner and you

only eat rice a couple of times a year, which I found interesting. I am

studying Nutritional Medicine in the UK and therapeutically, rice is one of the

key foods (in most cases) to eat lots of. I would be interested in your

thoughts on this. I am currently writing up a case study on someone who is

ridden with candida.,

Anne

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Rice, like whole grains generally, isn't essential for health. Like

lots of healthy populations that never traditionally had access to

rice, my own diet provides nutrients, fiber, and carbohydrates from

other foods.

In other words, rice might be a key food in diets that happen to be

structured to accomodate this particular carbohydrate source, and a

different diet would have different key foods. The diet you are

studying might have been written by the rice industry for example, so

of course it contains lot of rice; the corn industry would respond by

writing a diet that uses corn as a key food, and other produce

growers could respond in turn by writing a diet that is high in

vegetables and legumes and very low in both of those grains.

What specific therapeutic value of rice are you referring to? I think

the question to ask is can this therapeutic value be obtained in any

other way? It certainly can with respect to the carbs ;)

Carbs are fermentable by both good and bad organisms as you know; in

a dysbiosis condition the bad organisms have a numeric edge so they

ferment them fairly quickly; they ferment the easy carbohydrdates

faster than probiotics do even when there is no dysbiosis.

But that's not why I don't eat much carbohydrate; I don't have

candidiasis or dysbiosis that one would notice.

I'm more concerned about controlling my blood sugar and glycation,

diabetes, falling tissue pH, rising toxin load, reduced tissue

oxygenation, that kind of thing that would result from eating lots of

rice or any other carb.

Duncan

>

> Duncan you mentioned in one of the posts that you are a

practitioner and you only eat rice a couple of times a year, which I

found interesting. I am studying Nutritional Medicine in the UK and

therapeutically, rice is one of the key foods (in most cases) to eat

lots of. I would be interested in your thoughts on this. I am

currently writing up a case study on someone who is ridden with

candida.,

>

> Anne

>

>

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On 10/3/06, Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...> wrote:

> I'm more concerned about controlling my blood sugar and glycation,

> diabetes, falling tissue pH, rising toxin load, reduced tissue

> oxygenation, that kind of thing that would result from eating lots of

> rice or any other carb.

And feeding tumor cells, who eat carbs much faster than normal cells...

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

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has made a excellent point particularly useful to some people

with a kind of low immune response, or a drug-induced suppressed

immune response due to steroids such as cortisone.

Cancer can be seen as a immune system issue.

Duncan

>

> > I'm more concerned about controlling my blood sugar and glycation,

> > diabetes, falling tissue pH, rising toxin load, reduced tissue

> > oxygenation, that kind of thing that would result from eating

lots of

> > rice or any other carb.

>

> And feeding tumor cells, who eat carbs much faster than normal

cells...

>

> Chris

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