the latest

[Guest guest]

Marla, I believe it is the other way around. Increased cortisol can be a factor

for hypothyroidism.

 

http://www.royalrife.com/hypothyroid.html

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

 

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

From: flatwoodfarms <marlum@...>

Subject: Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 9:38 AM

Unfortunately it seems that anything one does involving the thyroid can cause

hair loss; any change in hormone up or down, on or off, any " intrusion " into the

gland such as FNA or surgery.  It's all very sensitive.  Personally, about 20

minutes after a FNA, I go into a heavy brain fog, to the point that I can't

remember how to navigate the streets to find my way home.

Hypothyroid can cause increased cortisol, which can drive up the pulse directly,

or through the involvement of adrenalin.  It's all so freakin' complex...

Marla

>

>

> Thanks .  It seemed to be working well, except for the fact I've been

losing so much hair on such a small dose.  Do you think there are other forms

that might not have that side effect?  I didn't notice much hair loss until

after going on the medication.

>

> Barb

>

> Re: The Latest

>

>

> 

>

> Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

>

> Best,

>

> .

> .

>

> > Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> > <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> > matchermaam <matchermaam>

> >

> >

> > Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

> >

> >

> >

> > I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> > like me, it creates all kinds of

> > reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> > stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> > both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> > medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> > Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> > sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> > instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> > feel better. I think

> > it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> > system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> > treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> > have any operations.

> >

> > <>Roni

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

Betty

________________________________

From: Roni Molin <matchermaam@...>

hypothyroidism

Sent: Sun, November 7, 2010 2:19:43 PM

Subject: Re: Re: The Latest

, your estimation of how manyn people are not being adequately treated with

T4 alone I believe is skewed. There are more and more people who have troubles

with it alone.

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:51 AM

Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

Best,

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

>

>

>

> I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> like me, it creates all kinds of

> reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> feel better. I think

> it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> have any operations.

>

> <>Roni

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

On 11/5/2010 10:54 PM, H wrote:

>

> Thanks Chuck. I had already made that decision and planned to have it

> this week, until I found out I couldn't. Now it can't be done until

> November 30th, because that's the first available appointment after

> three weeks without the meds.

>

> I read today that a needle biopsy is the best and only way to check for

> Cancer. So when I go to the endocronoligist on the 17th, I plan to ask

> him about that.

>

> " * Consider early referral to a endocrinologist specialist for FNAB of

> the thyroid before performing any diagnostic imaging.

I believe that is what I have been saying. The move to an imaging test

before a biopsy still seems premature. The fact that your doctor also

did not know to take you off T4 prior to either procedure makes me

wonder whether he has a good justification, or indeed any justification,

for giving you 3 mCi of radioactive iodine so he can have an image that

may not tell him anything.

Doctors are supposed to do a risk benefit analysis for such procedures.

The fact that no one you asked could explain why this procedure was

ordered also gives me pause, although it is consistent with no one

knowing who was supposed to schedule it.

Again, the ultrasound and uptake tests can tell you if a biopsy is

really warranted. If growth is very slow or nil, size from palpation and

ultrasound is small, and T4 output responds normally to iodine, it says

the biopsy is probably not needed. It is an " ordinary " goiter. It does

not make sense to me to concurrently order a test that could rule out

the need for a biopsy and one that would normally come after a biopsy

has come up positive.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Barb,

You wrote:

> ... Does it seem strange that the lump appeared two months

> later? I think it was Chuck who said it could be the result of

> undertreatment.

I don't exactly recall saying that, but a goiter can definitely come

from a chronically high TSH. A fatty deposit or cyst away from the

thyroid is another matter, although being hypoT can cause all sorts of

minor metabolic malfunctions, so it might be indirectly related.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much for replying Chuck. All of this must seem very petty compared to

what you have been going through with you son, but you take the time to respond

anyway. I appreciate it.

Barb

Re: The Latest

On 11/5/2010 10:54 PM, H wrote:

>

> Thanks Chuck. I had already made that decision and planned to have it

> this week, until I found out I couldn't. Now it can't be done until

> November 30th, because that's the first available appointment after

> three weeks without the meds.

>

> I read today that a needle biopsy is the best and only way to check for

> Cancer. So when I go to the endocronoligist on the 17th, I plan to ask

> him about that.

>

> " * Consider early referral to a endocrinologist specialist for FNAB of

> the thyroid before performing any diagnostic imaging.

I believe that is what I have been saying. The move to an imaging test

before a biopsy still seems premature. The fact that your doctor also

did not know to take you off T4 prior to either procedure makes me

wonder whether he has a good justification, or indeed any justification,

for giving you 3 mCi of radioactive iodine so he can have an image that

may not tell him anything.

Doctors are supposed to do a risk benefit analysis for such procedures.

The fact that no one you asked could explain why this procedure was

ordered also gives me pause, although it is consistent with no one

knowing who was supposed to schedule it.

Again, the ultrasound and uptake tests can tell you if a biopsy is

really warranted. If growth is very slow or nil, size from palpation and

ultrasound is small, and T4 output responds normally to iodine, it says

the biopsy is probably not needed. It is an " ordinary " goiter. It does

not make sense to me to concurrently order a test that could rule out

the need for a biopsy and one that would normally come after a biopsy

has come up positive.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

That could explain why I got the enlarged thyroid, or goiter, or whatever it is,

after taking Levothyroxin for two months.

Thanks,

Barb

Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:51 AM

Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

Best,

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

>

>

>

> I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> like me, it creates all kinds of

> reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> feel better. I think

> it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> have any operations.

>

> <>Roni

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

On 11/7/2010 10:31 AM, H wrote:

>

> Thanks . It seemed to be working well, except for the fact I've

> been losing so much hair on such a small dose. Do you think there are

> other forms that might not have that side effect? I didn't notice much

> hair loss until after going on the medication.

Barb,

Before dropping the T4, I would recommend you get the T4 dose right, get

the TSH below 2. Then, if you still have symptoms consider the

alternative. I think you are in the category of never getting a proper

dose. That is consistent with all the other incompetencies which have

been inflicted on you.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Thanks again Chuck.

Re: Re: The Latest

Barb,

You wrote:

> ... Does it seem strange that the lump appeared two months

> later? I think it was Chuck who said it could be the result of

> undertreatment.

I don't exactly recall saying that, but a goiter can definitely come

from a chronically high TSH. A fatty deposit or cyst away from the

thyroid is another matter, although being hypoT can cause all sorts of

minor metabolic malfunctions, so it might be indirectly related.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

On 11/7/2010 4:41 PM, Betty wrote:

> I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

That is not at all true for the dozen or so doctors that have treated

hypoT people in my family. Out of six of us, two eventually tried T3.

Only one is still on it.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

In my neck of the woods they only look at TSH.How stupid huh? Thats why I am my

own doctor and loving it.LOL

Betty

________________________________

From: ChuckB <gumboyaya@...>

hypothyroidism

Sent: Sun, November 7, 2010 6:04:28 PM

Subject: Re: Re: The Latest

On 11/7/2010 4:41 PM, Betty wrote:

> I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

That is not at all true for the dozen or so doctors that have treated

hypoT people in my family. Out of six of us, two eventually tried T3.

Only one is still on it.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Only considering the TSH may be a little primitive these days when there are

credible theories of TSH suppression with a high Reverse T3. In other words, a

low TSH does not always indicate a flood of useable hormone at the cellular

level.

Marla

> > I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

>

> That is not at all true for the dozen or so doctors that have treated

> hypoT people in my family. Out of six of us, two eventually tried T3.

> Only one is still on it.

>

> Chuck

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Roni, I think the cortisol/thyroid interchange runs both ways. Certainly if the

metabolism is sluggish, the adrenals may kick into a higher gear to compensate.

Marla

> >

> >

> > Thanks .  It seemed to be working well, except for the fact I've been

losing so much hair on such a small dose.  Do you think there are other forms

that might not have that side effect?  I didn't notice much hair loss until

after going on the medication.

> >

> > Barb

> >

> > Re: The Latest

> >

> >

> > 

> >

> > Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> > gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> > exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> > people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

> >

> > Best,

> >

> > .

> > .

> >

> > > Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@

> > > <mailto:matchermaam@?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> > > matchermaam <matchermaam>

> > >

> > >

> > > Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> > > like me, it creates all kinds of

> > > reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> > > stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> > > both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> > > medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> > > Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> > > sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> > > instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> > > feel better. I think

> > > it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> > > system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> > > treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> > > have any operations.

> > >

> > > <>Roni

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

All of the T4 in all of the hypothyroid medications are bioidentical

AFAIK; as is that from the thyroid of an animal such as a pig or cow.

The main difference between medications is that some are T3 rather than

T4; or may be a combination of T3 and T4. The only difference I know of

between different brands of T4 may be the fillers, binders, coloring

agents and so on. These are typically chosen to be inert as far as

possible.

Best,

..

..

> Posted by: " H " macbarb0503@...

> <mailto:macbarb0503@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> westieabbey <westieabbey>

>

>

> Sun Nov 7, 2010 8:32 am (PST)

>

>

>

>

> Thanks . It seemed to be working well, except for the fact I've

> been losing so much hair on such a small dose. Do you think there are

> other forms that might not have that side effect? I didn't notice much

> hair loss until after going on the medication.

>

> Barb

>

> Re: The Latest

>

> Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

>

> Best,

>

> .

> .

>

> > Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam%40>

> > <mailto:matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam%40>?Subject=%20Re%

> 3A%20The%20Latest>

> > matchermaam <matchermaam

> <matchermaam>>

> >

> >

> > Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

> >

> >

> >

> > I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> > like me, it creates all kinds of

> > reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> > stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> > both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> > medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> > Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> > sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> > instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> > feel better. I think

> > it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> > system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> > treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> > have any operations.

> >

> > <>Roni

[Guest guest]

TSH is the only test I've ever had. That is typical of most hypothyroid

patients, who then take T4 only and have no other problems. Mostly it's

only those who continue to have symptoms who go for further testing.

I know; I'm one of the lucky ones...

..

..

>

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Sun Nov 7, 2010 12:17 pm (PST)

>

>

>

> , is that all you were ever tested for? Have you ever been tested

> for freeT3, freeT4

> which shows how much of the hormome is in your blood, not your cells?

>

> <>Roni

> Immortality exists!

> It's called knowledge!

>

> Just because something isn't seen

> doesn't mean it's not there<>

>

>

>

> From: <res075oh@... <mailto:res075oh%40verizon.net>>

> Subject: Re: The Latest

> hypothyroidism

> <mailto:hypothyroidism%40>

> Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:41 AM

>

> When I was diagnosed as hypothyroid my wife exclaimed: You CAN'T be

> hypOthyroid; everything about you screams hypErthyroid. I've always had

> a fast pulse rate and a hyperactive mind that I cannot quite no matter

> how I try.

>

> I do think my hypothyroidism was discovered _very_ early because I never

> had any specific symptoms of it; just the high TSH readings in my annual

> exam bloodwork.

>

> Best,

>

[Guest guest]

Our opinions differ on that matter and that's okay. My opinion may not

be totally accurate; I'm no expert on anything. I believe Chuck has

about the same opinion and that he has posted the number of doses sold

of some of the most popular medications which seem to support that view.

It is IMHO this and similar groups that present a skewed view. They

tend to self-select for those who DO have problems with standard

treatment due to the simple fact that most people who get excellent

results from same do not tend to spend nearly as much time learning

about the condition as those who have problems.

In any event: There is little doubt that some number of hypothyroid

patients DO NOT get desirable results from T4 alone. Whether that is

due to some form of the disease that is different in some way from most

others or whether it is due to some other ailment or combination of

ailments that may or may not be properly diagnosed is IMHO not clearly

established.

Regards,

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Sun Nov 7, 2010 12:19 pm (PST)

>

>

>

> , your estimation of how manyn people are not being adequately

> treated with T4 alone I believe is skewed. There are more and more

> people who have troubles with it alone.

>

> <>Roni

> Immortality exists!

> It's called knowledge!

>

> Just because something isn't seen

> doesn't mean it's not there<>

>

>

>

> From: <res075oh@... <mailto:res075oh%40verizon.net>>

> Subject: Re: The Latest

> hypothyroidism

> <mailto:hypothyroidism%40>

> Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:51 AM

>

> Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

>

> Best,

>

[Guest guest]

It sounds like you are , and I hope you continue to be one of the lucky

ones.

Barb

Re: The Latest

> hypothyroidism

> <mailto:hypothyroidism%40>;

> Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:41 AM

>

> When I was diagnosed as hypothyroid my wife exclaimed: You CAN'T be

> hypOthyroid; everything about you screams hypErthyroid. I've always had

> a fast pulse rate and a hyperactive mind that I cannot quite no matter

> how I try.

>

> I do think my hypothyroidism was discovered _very_ early because I never

> had any specific symptoms of it; just the high TSH readings in my annual

> exam bloodwork.

>

> Best,

>

[Guest guest]

,

There is no doubt that people who get excellent results from standard

treatments, are much less likely to be here learning about why they're still not

feeling well, or what their latest symptoms might mean. They are probably out

doing other things, and don't even think about thyroid problems until it's time

to take their pill a day. I'm happy for them.

Barb

Re: The Latest

> hypothyroidism

> <mailto:hypothyroidism%40>;

> Date: Sunday, November 7, 2010, 7:51 AM

>

> Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

>

> Best,

>

[Guest guest]

That is so true. In my case the low TSH was because my body was not converting

the T4 to T3 and so it was just flowing around in my blood and never getting

into the cells.

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

 

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

From: flatwoodfarms <marlum@...>

Subject: Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Monday, November 8, 2010, 7:27 AM

Only considering the TSH may be a little primitive these days when there are

credible theories of TSH suppression with a high Reverse T3. In other words, a

low TSH does not always indicate a flood of useable hormone  at the cellular

level.

Marla

> > I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

>

> That is not at all true for the dozen or so doctors that have treated

> hypoT people in my family. Out of six of us, two eventually tried T3.

> Only one is still on it.

>

> Chuck

>

> 

>

>

>       

>

>

[Guest guest]

Cortisol levels are produced by adrenal glands and then work with thyroid

hormones.

 

http://www.virginiahopkinstestkits.com/cortisolzava.html

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

 

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

From: flatwoodfarms <marlum@...>

Subject: Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Monday, November 8, 2010, 7:32 AM

Roni, I think the cortisol/thyroid interchange runs both ways.  Certainly if the

metabolism is sluggish, the adrenals may kick into a higher gear to compensate.

Marla

> >

> >

> > Thanks .  It seemed to be working well, except for the fact I've been

losing so much hair on such a small dose.  Do you think there are other forms

that might not have that side effect?  I didn't notice much hair loss until

after going on the medication.

> >

> > Barb

> >

> > Re: The Latest

> >

> >

> > 

> >

> > Bear in mind that levothyroxine is T4, which is what a healthy thyroid

> > gland produces. It just makes sense as a first approach to replace

> > exactly what is missing. That appears to work well for 90% or 95% of

> > people; but you're the proof that it doesn't work for everyone.

> >

> > Best,

> >

> > .

> > .

> >

> > > Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@

> > > <mailto:matchermaam@?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> > > matchermaam <matchermaam>

> > >

> > >

> > > Sat Nov 6, 2010 2:44 pm (PDT)

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I think the levothyroxine is only good for some people. For others,

> > > like me, it creates all kinds of

> > > reactions. I know Chuck won't agree with me, but if it was me I would

> > > stop the levothyroxine. When I got so sick on the Armour which has

> > > both levothyroxine and liothyronine, I stopped the

> > > medicaton as soon as I realized what was causing it. My wonderful

> > > Rheumy had me tested for everything to find out what was making me so

> > > sick. When we found out that my body was turning the T4 into RT3

> > > instead of mostly T3, he rxd T3 only for me. I'm still on it and I

> > > feel better. I think

> > > it's worth a try. Your body will continue to have the levo in your

> > > system for weeks anyway. By then, if the nodules are not cancerous, T3

> > > treatment might be the way for you to go without having to

> > > have any operations.

> > >

> > > <>Roni

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Where does your referencecome from for how many people are PROPERLY treated on

T4 alone?

There are many people that are not feeling well and attribute it to other

things, not even

realizing that it's because of an undertreated thyroid.

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

 

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: The Latest

hypothyroidism

Date: Tuesday, November 9, 2010, 7:07 AM

OTOH when a patient has symptoms that indicate possible hypothyroidism

and a blood test indicates elevated TSH and T4 is prescribed and

titrated to the proper TSH level and the symptoms disappear [as happens

with about 95% of patients] then there is little incentive [or need] to

continue testing.  From everything I've seen I suspect the percentage of

hypo patients with a reverse T3 problem is probably in the low single

digits.  If anyone has any different info on that I'd appreciate a

reference.

..

..

>       Posted by: " flatwoodfarms " marlum@...

>       <mailto:marlum@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

>       flatwoodfarms <flatwoodfarms>

>

>

>         Mon Nov 8, 2010 7:27 am (PST)

>

>

>

> Only considering the TSH may be a little primitive these days when

> there are credible theories of TSH suppression with a high Reverse T3.

> In other words, a low TSH does not always indicate a flood of useable

> hormone at the cellular level.

> Marla

>

>

> > > I know doctors that check TSH do not put people on enough of T4.

> >

> > That is not at all true for the dozen or so doctors that have treated

> > hypoT people in my family. Out of six of us, two eventually tried T3.

> > Only one is still on it.

> >

> > Chuck

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

On 11/9/2010 11:46 AM, Roni Molin wrote:

> Where does your referencecome from for how many people are PROPERLY

> treated on T4 alone?...

About 10 years ago, Armour grossly dominated the dessicated market. In

that period the number of levothyroxine prescriptions filled each year

was more than 20:1 over Armour. That means more than 95% use T4. If you

look up the most commonly prescribed drugs, they group Synthroid and all

the generics together. They don't do the same for T3 or dessicated types.

Chuck

[Guest guest]

Of course they don't. The prevailing attitude of the AMA is that the only thing

to give

hypothyroid patients is one of the synthroid meds (T4). However, if a patient is

not

converting the T4, they are not getting anything (or hardly anything). Under

those circumstances I and many others like me become very ill, and if left that

way long enough could die.

<>Roni

Immortality exists!

It's called knowledge!

 

Just because something isn't seen

doesn't mean it's not there<>

> Where does your referencecome from for how many people are PROPERLY

> treated on T4 alone?...

About 10 years ago, Armour grossly dominated the dessicated market. In

that period the number of levothyroxine prescriptions filled each year

was more than 20:1 over Armour. That means more than 95% use T4. If you

look up the most commonly prescribed drugs, they group Synthroid and all

the generics together. They don't do the same for T3 or dessicated types.

Chuck

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

I don't know if my cortisol was high or not; but I certainly had the

high metabolic rate. It never showed in any blood work but I don't know

if it is tested in routine check-ups. However, it is unlikely that my

thyroid was " languishing " because it was caught when the TSH was just

barely above " normal " and then it increased before the next test several

weeks later. That's one of the reason I suspect it was caught very

early; if my TSH had been increasing at that rate for very long it would

have been much higher. Plus I presume I would have developed some of

the symptoms often reported.

Luck,

..

..

> Posted by: " flatwoodfarms " marlum@...

> <mailto:marlum@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> flatwoodfarms <flatwoodfarms>

>

>

> Tue Nov 9, 2010 7:53 am (PST)

>

>

>

> But it sounds like this was your situation; the higher heart rate may

> have been due to high cortisol levels and their effect on the

> metabolism, even while the thyroid was languishing.

> Marla

>

>

> >

> > That certainly was not the case with me. My metabolism was high with

> > the higher heart rate that one would expect from a patient who is hypEr

> > rather than hypO. We're probably all different in one way or another.

> >

> > Given the extreme problems that some here have I frankly sometimes have

> > a hard time believing I even have the same illness... Despite the

> > repeated high TSH results. No symptoms , ever; and I only take 75

> > mcg/day of T4.

> >

> > It does seem very probable that my hypothyroidism was caught VERY

> > early; if I had gone longer with no treatment it's quite possible I

> > would have developed the sluggish metabolism and other symptoms.

> >

> > Luck,

> >

[Guest guest]

The most definitive info I have is that quoted by Chuck for the number

of prescriptions of T4 alone compared to those of Armour when Armour

pretty much dominated the T4/T3 combination market.

If you're asking if I can PROVE that everyone taking T4 alone is

properly treated then you know the answer if you are aware of the nature

of scientific " proof " . However, it does seem reasonable to assume that

most likely when someone has symptoms of hypothyroidism and go to the

doctor and are treated with T4 alone and are sufficiently satisfied with

that treatment that they do not seek further treatment that the

treatment is most likely effective.

There is considerable credible research that supports the fact that if

T4 is given to a patient deficient in it it will correct the underlying

problem in the majority of cases.

I would truly like to see some numbers for the number of patients who

have an RT3 problem. I don't doubt they exist but I suspect they are so

small that the typical doctor has never run into one... And thus is very

unlikely to even think about testing for it. Please, if anyone has any

credible info post it here.

Regards,

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Tue Nov 9, 2010 9:46 am (PST)

>

>

>

> Where does your reference come from for how many people are PROPERLY

> treated on T4 alone?

> There are many people that are not feeling well and attribute it to

> other things, not even

> realizing that it's because of an undertreated thyroid.

>

> <>Roni

> Immortality exists!

> It's called knowledge!

>

> Just because something isn't seen

> doesn't mean it's not there<>

>

>

>

> From: <res075oh@... <mailto:res075oh%40verizon.net>>

> Subject: Re: The Latest

> hypothyroidism

> <mailto:hypothyroidism%40>

> Date: Tuesday, November 9, 2010, 7:07 AM

>

> OTOH when a patient has symptoms that indicate possible hypothyroidism

> and a blood test indicates elevated TSH and T4 is prescribed and

> titrated to the proper TSH level and the symptoms disappear [as happens

> with about 95% of patients] then there is little incentive [or need] to

> continue testing. From everything I've seen I suspect the percentage of

> hypo patients with a reverse T3 problem is probably in the low single

> digits. If anyone has any different info on that I'd appreciate a

> reference.

>

>

> .

[Guest guest]

That is of course the sad result. It's very painful for you to

experience and for those who care about you to know about. And I think

you know there are a number here who do in fact care about you, even

though we have never met you.

Unfortunately I don't have a solution. Personally I suspect the number

of hypo patients with an RT3 problem is probably less than one percent;

simply based upon the reports I've seen. I don't have any credible

source giving an actual number; but am basing it pretty much completely

on the absence of any positive evidence. It is possible of course that

the number would be shown to be quite a bit higher if everyone were

tested for it. It is also possible that there are available numbers and

I just haven't seen them.

Regards,

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20The%20Latest>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Tue Nov 9, 2010 4:41 pm (PST)

>

>

>

> Of course they don't. The prevailing attitude of the AMA is that the

> only thing to give

> hypothyroid patients is one of the synthroid meds (T4). However, if a

> patient is not

> converting the T4, they are not getting anything (or hardly anything).

> Under those circumstances I and many others like me become very ill,

> and if left that way long enough could die.

>

> <>Roni

> Immortality exists!

> It's called knowledge!

>

> Just because something isn't seen

> doesn't mean it's not there<>

>

>

> > Where does your referencecome from for how many people are PROPERLY

> > treated on T4 alone?...

>

> About 10 years ago, Armour grossly dominated the dessicated market. In

> that period the number of levothyroxine prescriptions filled each year

> was more than 20:1 over Armour. That means more than 95% use T4. If you

> look up the most commonly prescribed drugs, they group Synthroid and all

> the generics together. They don't do the same for T3 or dessicated types.

>

> Chuck