75% of cholycystectomy patients suffered heart attacks!

[Guest guest]

This is interesting:

I found those E-mails on the web:

http://www.medicinegarden.com/archive/00003793.htm

Excerpt from one of the mail below:

" And has discovered through independent research that fully 75% of

cholycystectomy patients later suffered heart attacks! "

(cholycystectomy = gallbladder removal surgery)

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Re: gallbladder

Ciara ( (no email) )

Sun, 09 Nov 1997 17:10:28 PST

This recipe for a gallstone flush comes from the Dulwich Health Society.

I got it from a good friend who swears it works. She says that it

softens the gallstones to such an extent that you could squash them in

your fingers.

Drink 2 litres of fresh, pure apple juice daily for 5 days.

On the 6th day, skip dinner.

At 9pm take 1 or 2 tablespoons Epsom salt dissolved in 1-2 tablespoons

of warm water.

At 10pm shake together half cup (4oz) unrefined, cold-pressed olive oil

and 2oz lemon juice and drink.

Immediately, go to bed and lie on your right side with your right knee

drawn up toward your chin. Remain in this position for 30 minutes

before going to sleep, to help the olive oil to drain. Another Epsom

salt solution may be needed during the night, so prepare one before

going to bed.

According to my friend, the next morning you will pass green stones that

are as soft as putty, some as large as your thumb, without feeling a

thing. Has anyone ever heard of this?

Warm regards,

Ciara

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From this page:

http://www.medicinegarden.com/News/archive/00003835.htm

Re: gallbladder flush

Ciara ( (no email) )

Mon, 10 Nov 1997 15:20:23 PST

Dear Athena Friends,

I am so sorry if anyone misunderstood my question about the gallbladder

flush! In no way was I endorsing or recommending this treatment!

Rather, I just wanted to know if anyone had heard of it, as I never had

till my friend told me about it. She has used it 3 or 4 times in the

last 6 or 7 years, each time after medical tests confirmed gallstones,

and surgery was scheduled. After using the flush each time, surgery was

cancelled, again by confirmatory medical tests.

My friend wishes to avoid cholycystectomy at all costs, as she is

a medical statistician (sp?), and has discovered through independent

research that fully 75% of cholycystectomy patients later suffered

heart attacks!

That scares her a lot worse than gallstones.

(She suspects that it has something to do with the bile dripping

continuously after cholycystectomy, instead of spurting from the

gallbladder in response to eating fat. Any comments?)

Thank you all who responded. I will pass your comments on to my friend.

Warm regards,

Ciara

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http://www.medicinegarden.com/News/archive/00003868.htm

Lalalawyr@...

Tue, 11 Nov 1997 12:39:48 -0500 (EST)

In a message dated 97-11-11 02:59:22 EST, Ciara writes:

<< My friend wishes to

avoid cholycystectomy at all costs, as she is a medical statistician

(sp?), and has discovered through independent research that fully 75% of

cholycystectomy patients later suffered heart attacks! That scares her

a lot worse than gallstones. (She suspects that it has something to do

with the bile dripping continuously after cholycystectomy, instead of

spurting from the gallbladder in response to eating fat. Any comments?) >>

Sounds like she has jumped from correlation to causation, which is always

problematic and potentially misleading.

For example, this correlation could also have to do with poor dietary habits

and overweight, which are factors in many gallstone patients and many heart

attack patients. I have no idea whether this is the case - just offering it

as an alternative explanation for this statistic.

And obviously, gallstone patients who need surgery probably have significant

health problems, which lead to the gallstones being bad enough to lead to the

surgery. So there could be some connection other than the surgery itself.

When I worked in the ER (ages ago), they had a " 4-F " checklist for those who

were likely to be gallstone patients - it stood for forty (or over), fat,

female and flatulant. Apparently, the first three have to do with a greater

likelihood of having gallstones, and the last is a symptom.

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Re: gallbladder

ph J. Golando ( (no email) )

Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:34:22 -0600

Dear Ciara,

Yes, the old gallbladder flush. With some variation (often coffee enemas

are involved) this procedure has been recommended on and off for many

years. However, there is some controversy as to what is actually

acomplished by doing this procedure. Indeed most people will pass the small

green objects you describe but there is some discrepancy as to what these

are. Many people will claim that they are gallstones. Other sources

believe what is actually occurring is a saponification process where the

olive oil and the epsom salt create these little lumps of a soap like

product.

There is another factor to consider. The introduction of that much oil is

certainly going to stimulate the gallbladder to contract. If a stone passes

through and lodges in the area where the common hepatic duct and the

pancreatic duct come together (an anatomical structure know as the ampullae

of Wader) then obstructive pancreatitis could ensue and the consequences

could be dire.

Joe Golando

Ciara wrote:

> This recipe for a gallstone flush comes from the Dulwich Health Society.

> I got it from a good friend who swears it works. She says that it

> softens the gallstones to such an extent that you could squash them in

> your fingers.

> Drink 2 litres of fresh, pure apple juice daily for 5 days.

> On the 6th day, skip dinner.

> At 9pm take 1 or 2 tablespoons Epsom salt dissolved in 1-2 tablespoons

> of warm water.

> At 10pm shake together half cup (4oz) unrefined, cold-pressed olive oil

> and 2oz lemon juice and drink.

> Immediately, go to bed and lie on your right side with your right knee

> drawn up toward your chin. Remain in this position for 30 minutes

> before going to sleep, to help the olive oil to drain. Another Epsom

> salt solution may be needed during the night, so prepare one before

> going to bed.

> According to my friend, the next morning you will pass green stones that

> are as soft as putty, some as large as your thumb, without feeling a

> thing. Has anyone ever heard of this?

>

> Warm regards,

> Ciara

>

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Gall Bladder concern

JoOhio1 ( JoOhio1@... )

Sat, 6 Dec 1997 18:39:55 EST

Next message: Eileen Nauman: " Re: Gall Bladder concern "

Next in thread: Debra Le Roy: " Re: Gall Bladder concern "

This month I am scheduled to have my gall bladder removed (Dec. 29th). On

this list, I saw a reply from Ciara stating that removal of the gall

bladder increases the risk of heart attack by 75%. I would like some

clarification and, if possible, references for these figures.

It is against all my intuitive judgement to have this operation done, but

of the " Lots of people get it done, no big deal " folks are pressing me. The

constant fear of getting an attack has also spurred me to this decision.

Any info and last minute miracle cures would be appreciated! I won't do

that olive oil/lemon juice flush because the gallstones are small and I'm

afraid of blockage.

Thank you...Jo Schaefer (JoOhio1@...)