fats

[Guest guest]

>

> I was recently discussing fats with a friend of mine who is a dietitian.

> She is of the opinion that Coconut oil is one of the worst there is.

>

> So, of course, this leaves me confused.

>

> A short time ago there was a posting here about a web site that explained

> the various virtues and sins of a variety of fats. Does anyone remember

> what the site was? Thanks.

Your dietician gets her information from someone else's brochures rather

than the data, the research, so she's misinformed and confused too.

Here's a lot of the data. If you read it you'll know more than she does:

http://members.shaw.ca/dunancrow/tropical_traditions_coconut.hrml#referenc

es

Duncan Crow

[Guest guest]

wrote:

>

> I did my calculations and played around with the fitday website.

In order to get enough fats (my number was 66.5, do 66.5 X 2.5 =

166.25) I > would have to eat over 1900 calories. I am a forty year

old female > that exercises about 4 days a week. I do not burn this

many calories > in a day. Do most people gain weight when they go on

your diet? And, > with this number I am still getting 20g less than

I need of carbs. It > does not make sense. Bee, honestly if I am

eating food this > uniniviting, I am sure not going to gain weight

doing it! I am not > underweight for my height and I do not plan to

be overweight for it> either! My assumption is that you are going to

tell me that noone > gains weight on this, but common sense tells me

I will, and many others > probably do too.

==>It's not about calories, so don't use them as guide. Good fats do

not create body fat, carbs do. In fact good fats help your body lose

weight. Sally Fallon wrote a book called " Eat Fat, Lose Fat " . Read

the article in the Fats & Oils folder " Fat, Taking the Fear out

eating it " to understand.

Bee

>

> Please tell me wherer my reasoning is wrong because a calorie is a

> calorie. It has always been the number you burn vs the number you

take

> in. Period when it comes to weight maintenance.

>

[Guest guest]

I am having a very hard time trying to find fats to eat. I should be

having 144-201 fats a day and at the present time i have only consumed

15...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats is tuna,

meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume? My ratios are off which

i guess is why im hungry. my fats are at 59 my carbs are high at 58

and my protein is at 91and should be 57...so im off and i dont know

what to eat to bring m numbers together.

Any help from the community would be appreciated.

thanx

sue

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

Use Butter and Olive Oil or Lard when you cook your meats. Pour the

pan drippings or add more butter over your steamed veggies.

I know you can't tolerate much coconut oil yet, but when you can you

can simply eat it by the spoonful. I do htat, because it's easy and I

enjoy the taste!

jackie

>...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats is tuna,

> meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume?

[Guest guest]

Sue...

You need to add fats to your foods. Put butter on your veggies, olive oil

on salads (if you can eat them), cook your eggs and meats in fats, etc.

Also have you tried Bee's raw egg drink? It is the most amazing stuff and

tastes incredibly yummy. You can make it with extra coconut oil or butter

or both if you need to get more fats in.

I have been making myself a special treat on the weekends...I use the basic

raw egg drink recipe, add 1/2 tsp of pure orange or vanilla extract, and use

very hot organic decaf coffee in place of the boiling water. It comes out

all frothy like a cappuccino and tastes just like a concoction from

Starbucks.

I personally do not want to be consuming a lot of extracts or stevia so I

save this for my weekend breakfast treat only. The rest of the time I

either have the egg drink made with water sans stevia and extract, or eggs

scrambled in butter, or a salad with hard boiled eggs and olive oil for

breakfast.

Hugs,

Ellen

[Guest guest]

thanks ellen for the ideas

sue>3

Tiger Lily <sweettiger@...> wrote:

Sue...

You need to add fats to your foods. Put butter on your veggies, olive oil

on salads (if you can eat them), cook your eggs and meats in fats, etc.

Also have you tried Bee's raw egg drink? It is the most amazing stuff and

tastes incredibly yummy. You can make it with extra coconut oil or butter

or both if you need to get more fats in.

I have been making myself a special treat on the weekends...I use the basic

raw egg drink recipe, add 1/2 tsp of pure orange or vanilla extract, and use

very hot organic decaf coffee in place of the boiling water. It comes out

all frothy like a cappuccino and tastes just like a concoction from

Starbucks.

I personally do not want to be consuming a lot of extracts or stevia so I

save this for my weekend breakfast treat only. The rest of the time I

either have the egg drink made with water sans stevia and extract, or eggs

scrambled in butter, or a salad with hard boiled eggs and olive oil for

breakfast.

Hugs,

Ellen

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Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+

countries) for 2¢/min or less.

[Guest guest]

>

> I am having a very hard time trying to find fats to eat. I should be

> having 144-201 fats a day and at the present time i have only

consumed 15...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats is tuna,

> meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume? My ratios are off

which i guess is why im hungry. my fats are at 59 my carbs are high at

58 and my protein is at 91and should be 57...so im off and i dont know

> what to eat to bring m numbers together.

>

> Any help from the community would be appreciated.

==>You can smother your meats and veggies with melted butter, which is

delicious! You can take coconut oil by the spoonfuls (when you

increase your doses to that point), with meals, or cook with it - it

has a high burning point so it is the best fat for cooking. You can

count your fish oil or cod liver oil (see my article for when to take

them) towards your total intake of fats; you can make homemade mayo and

have it with tuna and veggies like a salad. Make homemade dressing for

salads, or even use them to drizzle over cooked veggies and meats of

all kinds. Most meats taste delicious with some lemon juice mixed with

melted butter too. Eat plenty of pork and ask for the fats at your meat

store or farmer's market, and so on and so on. Make Bee's Raw Egg

Drink with as many eggs as you like; you cannot have too many - it has

butter in the recipe. See the Recipes Folder for many food ideas! When

you get cravings take a spoonful of a good fat to curb them.

Bee

[Guest guest]

>

> I am having a very hard time trying to find fats to eat. I should

be

> having 144-201 fats a day and at the present time i have only

consumed

> 15...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats is tuna,

> meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume? My ratios are off

which i guess is why im hungry. my fats are at 59 my carbs are high at

58 and my protein is at 91and should be 57...so im off and i dont know

what to eat to bring m numbers together.

> sue

----->I do think your ratio is off. If your protien should be 57 then

I figure that your fats should be 85-142 and your carbs 45.

pat B

[Guest guest]

>

> I am having a very hard time trying to find fats to eat. I should

be having 144-201 fats a day and at the present time i have only

consumed 15...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats is

tuna, meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume? My ratios are

off which

sue

Tuna and meatballs are not high fat.

If you look at the difference between the whole egg and just the egg

yolk you can increase the fat in the ratio by tossing the white. Most

of the nutrition is in the yolk. I prepare a egg drink with 6 egg

yolks and 5T coconut oil with 2T butter and pau d'arco tea. That goes

along way toward my fat/protein goal. It is easy to prepare,easy to

take to work and quick to consume.

Pat b

[Guest guest]

ps16501 <ps16501@...> wrote:

----->do think your ratio is off. If your protien should be 57 then

I figure that your fats should be 85-142 and your carbs 45.

pat B

Really! someone calculated for me at fats between 144-201. I am 5'2 " . the p

rotein is 57 and the carbs are 46. thanks sue

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[Guest guest]

Hi ps6501 (sorry, I don't know your name)

This is how the calculation works:

5' 2 " = 157.48cm (from my Google search for conversion). So this would mean

(using a template from a previous post from Bee)::

Your height in centimeters, which is 157, and deduct

100 = 57 which is the grams of protein per day.

Take 57 x 2.5 for low end of fats = 142 grams

Take 57 x 3.5 for high end of fats = 200 grams

Take 57 x 0.8 for carbs = 46 grams

Therefore your ratios per day are:

protein 57 grams

fats 142 to 200 grams

carbs 46 grams

So, the calculations that were done for you are correct, infact they were done

using exact height (the .48 included) but mostly it's just done on rounded

numbers for simplicity. It really doesn't matter that much as it's only a few

grams either way and we all tend to round numbers differently (I had that

'argument' when I worked in Metallurgical Accounting where even a minute

discrepancy in the numbers after the decimal point made a huge difference to the

bottom line - dollars that is)! LOL

I have a little sticky note with my grams allowed, on the side of my computer,

so I can check when I enter foods into FitDay. I've not yet managed to do a

'perfect' day but it doesn't worry me. I know that I will eventually work out

which foods will do it for me.

Hope this helps.

Jen

Re: [ ] Re: fats

ps16501 <ps16501@...> wrote:

----->do think your ratio is off. If your protien should be 57 then

I figure that your fats should be 85-142 and your carbs 45.

pat B

Really! someone calculated for me at fats between 144-201. I am 5'2 " . the p

rotein is 57 and the carbs are 46. thanks sue

[Guest guest]

Dear Sue & Pat:

Sue, if your protein ratio is 57 grams, Pat is right that your carb

ratio should be 45.6 grams, or 46 grams, but Pat calculated your fat

ratios incorrectly; 57 X 2.5 = 142.5 grams (low fat) and 57 X 3.5 =

199.5 (high fat), which is 143-200 grams of fats.

Bee

Sue Wrote:

> > I am having a very hard time trying to find fats to eat. I

should be having 144-201 fats a day and at the present time i have

only consumed 15...What can i eat? What i am eating which are fats

is tuna, meatballs and eggs...what else can i consume? My ratios

are off which i guess is why im hungry. my fats are at 59 my carbs

are high at 58 and my protein is at 91and should be 57...so im off

and i dont know what to eat to bring m numbers together.

Pat wrote:

> ----->I do think your ratio is off. If your protien should be 57

then I figure that your fats should be 85-142 and your carbs 45.

>

[Guest guest]

Sue,

I downloaded the Excel file from our files section and just plug the numbers

in there to calculate. So much easier than using a calculator. :-)

According to the Excel program for ratios:

5'2 " = 62 " (x 2.54) = 157.48 cm - 100 = 57.48 = 57 (due body weight)

Therefore:

Proteins = 57 (actually 51 to 63 but 57 is ideal)

Fats = 144 (57.48 x 2.5) min to 201 (57.48 x 3.5)

Carbs = 46 (57.48 x .8) you can eat less but not more

You really need to be eating at least 144 grams of good fats. I know you

are having a hard time with the co and die-off symptoms, Maybe make Bee's

raw egg drink with lots of butter.

Hugs,

Ellen

[Guest guest]

Short answer: The fats are important because you're going to be cutting

carbs to almost zero, but you can't eat protein alone.

Your body needs a certain amount of fuel (calories) every day just to keep

operating. There are only three sources for calories: carbs, proteins or fats.

- S.

.........................................

GettingPrimitive.com - A Natural Inquiry

...... Health, Diet, Society and Survival

......... for the Humans of Poison Planet

......... http://www.gettingprimitive.com

[Guest guest]

Sue wrote:

Hi Jen,

My name is sue andi want to thank you for the recalculations. ... Do you know

why the fats are i mportant?

-----

Hi Sue

You're welcome. I see that a few folks have also posted your calculations for

you. It is in the files but it does take time to read everything and I know that

I most certainly haven't read everything yet. Slowly, slowly is the key.

I'll leave the question of fats up to Bee to answer as Bee will be able to give

you the best answer. I can only go by my interpretation of the reading I have

done.

Take care.

Jen

[Guest guest]

I read _,___

I read your post about the fat,protein,carb importance. Your response would

explain why i have low energy and have such a weight loss. I thought it had to

do with lack of carbs im down to 46 a day but i havent been able to keep my fats

up either. I guess i will keep working on increasing my fats. This whole new

way of living with foods is so opposite from what we were ever taught prior to

Bee coming into our world. Just takes some time i guess.

sue

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[Guest guest]

Pat calculated your fat

ratios incorrectly; 57 X 2.5 = 142.5 grams (low fat) and 57 X 3.5 =

199.5 (high fat), which is 143-200 grams of fats.

Bee

------------>Bee I missed the 2.5 - 3.5 calculation at the top of your

Article " Fats are calculated by taking each gram of protein

multiplied by 2.5 - 3.5 "

because I was following step #2 which states

" To calculate fats, take 68, which is your " due body weight " ,

and multiply it times 1.5 to find out the minimum amount of fat grams

to consume daily, i.e. 68 x 2.5 = 102 grams of fat. For the maximum

amount of fats to consume, take 68 x 2.5 = 170 grams of fat maximum.

Pat B

[Guest guest]

Sue wrote:

> Really! someone calculated for me at fats between 144-201. I am

5'2 " . the protein is 57 and the carbs are 46. thanks sue

==>Sue, your calculations are correct.

Bee

[Guest guest]

Sue wrote:>

> Hi Jen,

>

> My name is sue andi want to thank you for the recalculations. I

has kinda the same ratio as you but someone indicated that i was

incorrect. Do you know why the fats are i mportant?

==>Sue, you really do need to read my main article " How to Successfully

Overcome Candida " which explains why fats are so important. In fact as

a member of this group it is required reading so you can ask questions

appropriately and understand some of the discussions on our group.

Bee

[Guest guest]

>

> Short answer: The fats are important because you're going to be

cutting carbs to almost zero, but you can't eat protein alone.

>

> Your body needs a certain amount of fuel (calories) every day just to

keep operating. There are only three sources for calories: carbs,

proteins or fats.

==>I might add to that S, that it takes much less energy by the body to

burn fat as a source of fuel instead of carbs, and they are healthier

and required for every cell in the body, particularly to construct

their membranes which give them more integrity and strength. The heart

and brain prefer good saturated fats as well. Protein alone will cause

sickness as reported by Stefansson on his all meat and fat experiment

at: www.biblelife.com.

Bee

[Guest guest]

Bee,

what if the meat or fat are not organic. Wouldn't the fat be full

of toxins? I've been only eating the fat on organic meat and not

having it with regular commercial meat.

I will be near a butcher tomorrow. I want to ask for lard, tallow

and whatever else they might have that is acceptable. I've never

purchased it before. Is there anything else I need to know to ask for?

Elyse

On 16-Jul-06, at 8:27 PM, Bee Wilder wrote:

> Eat plenty of pork and ask for the fats at your meat

> store or farmer's market, and so on and so on.

[Guest guest]

>

> Bee,

> what if the meat or fat are not organic. Wouldn't the fat be

full of toxins? I've been only eating the fat on organic meat and

not having it with regular commercial meat.

==>I wouldn't worry about them in any case; the animal's body is

capable of getting rid of toxins and so are you on the diet.

Sometimes it a matter of what is the lesser of the evils, not to eat

the fat which is critical to health, or to get some toxins?

>

> I will be near a butcher tomorrow. I want to ask for lard,

tallow and whatever else they might have that is acceptable. I've

never purchased it before. Is there anything else I need to know

to ask for?

=>Not that I know of.

Bee

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jecca

As you might guess its been a long time since I checked out whats

available in margarine... & apparently I am a bit behind the times.

I suppose the recent stance against Hydrogenated fats in the USA

has put the margarine industry into a bit of a tizz...for years they

have been claiming margarine was a healthy alternative etc..with the

spotlight on hydrogenated fats now they will find it hard to defend

that line ...(unless they totally re-invent themselves like the brand

you showed...even though we know that is a poor second as well).

>

> Yep that's exactly what they do, they add thickeners and flavor

> additives, and it often has to stay refrigerated, or else it melts.

> Put olive oil in the fridge, it becomes semi solid, so with the

> addition of thickeners, its solid enough. For example this is a

> supposedly healthy margarine from Spectrum Naturals. The ingredient

> list is

>

> Ingredients:

> Expeller Pressed Canola Oil, Water, Sea Salt, Xantham and Guar Gums,

> Soy Protein Isolate, tto, Citric Acid, Sorbic Acid at 1/10 of 1%

> (anti-mold agent), Natural Butter Flavor (non-dairy), Turmeric.

>

> Who wants all that junk! Additionally, I find it funny that they

have

> to add a anti mold agent to it as well. If mold is an issue for

this

> type of food, that just shows another reason why it should be

avoided.

>

> Jecca

[Guest guest]

>

>

> If you have a product you're trying to sell and you need to market

it, you will say whatever you can to make people buy it. Witness the

soy industry. How many people think soy is healthy?

>

> Dr. Atkins in his book stated that margarine is a health hazard.

Long before I saw that, I could never stand the stuff. To me it has no

taste compared to butter.

==>Zack, that is so true! My Dad called white bread cotton, and he

wouldn't stand for having instant coffee. However, when it came to

margarine my Mother prevailed because she was extremely frugal. Dad

was not happy with it because he loved real butter, but raising a large

family on carpenter's wages wasn't easy for them. I think we first had

margarine (called oleo) when I was in high school. Since we were in

the dairy State of Wisconsin they didn't allow it to be colored at

first. It was white and came with packet of yellow dye. Yuk!

Bee

[Guest guest]

--- In , " dlsproule " <dlsproule@...> >

> How do I refute the Mayo Clinic? How do I convince these guys who

> think that they have it all figured out, that butter and coconut oil

> are actually better for you.

>

> I'd appreciate any help here. I can't just say " because Weston A.

> Price " says so.

Hi Debbie,

I'm currently reading two books which would be good references.

1) Life without Bread -- How a Low-carbohydrate Diet Can Save Your

Life by Christian B. Allan, PhD and Wolfgang Lutz, MD

Dr. Lutz has 40 years experience as a physician, most of that using

low-carb, high-fat for patients. Apparently both he and Dr Allan

were both proponents of low-fat at one time, but came around.

Although the book subtitle only says " low-carb, " the text makes it

clear they are promoting a high-fat, low-carb diet.

2) " Good Calories. Bad Calories. Challenging the Conventional Wisdom

on Diet, Weight Control, and Disease " by Taubes. This was

published in 2007 and is a substantial book. The bibliography alone

is 66 pages! The book is the result of seven years of research on

all the various studies having to do with diet and heart disease,

weight loss, etc... The book jacket says, " With precise references

to the most significant existing clinical studies, he convinces us

that there is no compelling scientific evidence demonstrating that

saturated fat and cholesterol cause heart disease, that salt causes

high blood pressure, and that fiber is a necessary part of a healthy

diet... Good Calories, Bad Calories is a tour de force of scientific

investigation... "

I've only started this book. It's not an easy read, but it is *very*

thorough. The author is a correspondent for Science magazine (a

highly regarded publication) and is the only print journalist to have

won three Science in Society Journalism awards.