Re: CD-57

[Guest guest]

Hi, Jeannie,

I think it is listed as the Stricker NK Panel CD-57. It was right on the

LabCorp lab slip - just had to check it off. Maybe not all LabCorp labs offer

all the same tests?

Good luck!!

D.

Jeannie W <jeanniew58@...> wrote: Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it

either the CD-57 or Striker CD-57? The reason I am asking is that my doc

attempted to order it awhile back when we first heard about it & LabCorp (at

least the people he & I both spoke with) said they had never heard of it! He

actually asked that I see if any of you knew if they went by it under a

different name.

I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone has that info! I hope 2007

holds healing & miracles for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

Jeannie

---------------------------------

Be a PS3 game guru.

Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Games.

[Guest guest]

Hi Jeannnie,

I believe it is called the Stricker NK Panel. I had it

done a while back.

Love ya!

Kim

--- Jeannie W <jeanniew58@...> wrote:

> Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it either the

> CD-57 or Striker CD-57? The reason I am asking is

> that my doc attempted to order it awhile back when

> we first heard about it & LabCorp (at least the

> people he & I both spoke with) said they had never

> heard of it! He actually asked that I see if any of

> you knew if they went by it under a different name.

>

> I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone

> has that info! I hope 2007 holds healing & miracles

> for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

>

> Jeannie

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Be a PS3 game guru.

> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and

> previews at Games.

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

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[Guest guest]

My understanding is that only certain Lab Corp facilities process the

test. Contact the main office and ask how you should proceed with your

local lab to have it sent to the appropriate facility. It should not be a

problem at all. Lab Corp has been doing the test for many years.

At 08:16 AM 1/20/2007, you wrote:

>Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it either the CD-57 or Striker CD-57?

>The reason I am asking is that my doc attempted to order it awhile back

>when we first heard about it & LabCorp (at least the people he & I both

>spoke with) said they had never heard of it! He actually asked that I see

>if any of you knew if they went by it under a different name.

>

>I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone has that info! I hope

>2007 holds healing & miracles for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

>

>Jeannie

>

>---------------------------------

>Be a PS3 game guru.

>Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Games.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Kim, , Jaylene, , etc...thank you so much for the info on the Striker

Panel. I greatly appreciate it!

Kim, I remember you having it done & discussing that w/my doc but we still had

no luck-crazy, huh? Thanks again...

Jeannie

kim <meme21998@...> wrote: Hi Jeannnie,

I believe it is called the Stricker NK Panel. I had it

done a while back.

Love ya!

Kim

--- Jeannie W <jeanniew58@...> wrote:

> Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it either the

> CD-57 or Striker CD-57? The reason I am asking is

> that my doc attempted to order it awhile back when

> we first heard about it & LabCorp (at least the

> people he & I both spoke with) said they had never

> heard of it! He actually asked that I see if any of

> you knew if they went by it under a different name.

>

> I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone

> has that info! I hope 2007 holds healing & miracles

> for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

>

> Jeannie

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Be a PS3 game guru.

> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and

> previews at Games.

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Hi Jeannie,

I think that you will find this link on CD 57 informative...

http://anapsid.org/lyme/strickerpanel.html

Hope this helps,

>

> > Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it either the

> > CD-57 or Striker CD-57? The reason I am asking is

> > that my doc attempted to order it awhile back when

> > we first heard about it & LabCorp (at least the

> > people he & I both spoke with) said they had never

> > heard of it! He actually asked that I see if any of

> > you knew if they went by it under a different name.

> >

> > I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone

> > has that info! I hope 2007 holds healing & miracles

> > for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

> >

> > Jeannie

> >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Be a PS3 game guru.

> > Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and

> > previews at Games.

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

>

> __________________________________________________________

> No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go

> with for Mobile. Get started.

> http://mobile./mail

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> It's here! Your new message!

> Get new email alerts with the free Toolbar.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jeannie,

My LLMD sent me to LabCorp for a CD57 recently.

On his slip he gives out he checked off the line that says:

" CD57 Natural Killer Cells, LabCorp test code 505026, to be performed at the

Raritan, NJ

branch of LabCorp if not available at your local LabCorp "

On the results I got back from LabCorp they listed it as:

" HNK1 (CD57) Panel "

It seems this includes a CBC, as my doc did not check that off but it came back

with those

results also.

I've read a little about the Stricker Panel. That's supposedly not a formal test

name, and

from what I've seen it also includes other immune subset tests in addition to

the CD57NK

subset (not to be confused with CD57 " T " cells).

That's probably all I can tell you, but if you have any other questions feel

free to private

mail me (I'm presently on the " archives only " setting for this list so I don't

get the emails,

and I don't check the archives on a regular basis).

Ann

>

> Does anyone know...does LabCorp call it either the CD-57 or Striker CD-57? The

reason

I am asking is that my doc attempted to order it awhile back when we first heard

about it &

LabCorp (at least the people he & I both spoke with) said they had never heard

of it! He

actually asked that I see if any of you knew if they went by it under a

different name.

>

> I know many here have had it so thanks if anyone has that info! I hope 2007

holds

healing & miracles for everyone & I keep you all in my prayers!

>

> Jeannie

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I'm not familiar with the CD-57 test, but if it

is a test for antibodies, it is useless for

determining whether or not you have Lyme. The

only test that counts is a test that can

directly observe tbe spirochetes.

Jack

Jessie MacMillan wrote:

>

> I got the results of my latest CD-57 test. It was 155, which according

> to my LLMD means I don't have Lyme anymore. What, then, do I have?

> Every time I stop abx, I get sick again. And when I restart, I herx. I

> know it's probably a coinfection, especially since doxy is the abx

> that works best for me.

>

> But I thought only spirochete bacteria caused herxes. The common

> coinfections aren't spirochetes, are they?

>

> I'll be asking him this when I see him at the end of the month, but

> until then, I'm hoping the collective wisdom of this group can explain

> this to me. Or at least point me toward some reading that can explain it.

>

> Thanks!

> Jessie

>

[Guest guest]

Hello tjs11@...,

In reference to your comment:

determining whether or not you have Lyme.

*********There is no cure for Lyme, HOWEVER, you can gain control of it

using several methods....if your test are within normal range, doesn't mean your

body is free of the critters....Active mutating of these critters can halt and

you can have what many call a remission....I'm in that state right now and

have been Lyme symptom free since 8/2005, but I also know the critters are

still lurking in my body....I just have to focus on doing all the right things

to keep it that way....Keeping my total body burden of pathogens reduced and

practicing good diet/nutrition is a MUST to maintain where I am....not an easy

thing to do, but I LISTEN to my body and know what I must do....

Angel Huggzz

or Angel

_www.lymecommunity.com_ (http://www.lymecommunity.com)

PS.....I do NOT and have NEVER taken antibiotics for Lyme & company....

[Guest guest]

I don't think the CD-57 is meant to indicate " cure " of Lyme. Your

155 result is still below the normal cut-off of 200. Your immune

system may be " bouncing back " based on your CD-57, but you could

still have infection left in your system. The fact that you are

still herxing on abx and if you stop you get sick again is

suspicious. I would ask about getting tested (or retested) for co-

infections. I copied and pasted my previous posting describing the

CD-57 test. Hope this helps. Laurie

The CD57 test is a test of the levels of lymphocytes in your body. A

lymphocyte is a type of white blood cell in the immune system. There

are two categories of lymphocytes, the large and the small

lymphocytes. The large lymphocytes are more commonly known as the

natural killer cells (or T-Cells). There are a number of tests to

evaluate lymphocytes. The test to assess CD-57 (along with other

tests) is also called the " Stricker Panel " , named after the

researcher who looked at this test to see if it reflected

improvement/deterioration in how Lyme Patients were doing medically.

In his study of 89 chronic Lyme patients over a year, Stricker found

that patients with chronic Lyme disease and very low CD57 NK levels

have significantly more coinfections, delayed diagnosis, more

neurologic disease and persistent immunologic defects, compared to

patients with higher CD57 NK levels. CD stands for " cluster of

differentiation " . T-Cells are a special form of white blood cells

that are thought to stimulate the immune system to fight cancer. The

CD-57 test assesses a subset of T-cells. This test is commonly used

with HIV+ patients to determine when they have developed AIDS. It is

not a diagnostic test, but rather a way of tracking the body's

response to treatment. When the CD-57 count is low, this indicates

that the immune system is compromised. The CD-57 is typically

thought to be an indicator of Chronic Borelia, i.e. how active the

infection is and an indicator of how likely a relapse is to occur

after treatment. My LLMD uses it to assess how " sick " I am, i.e. how

is my immune system functioning. As I have improved, my CD-57 has

increased. However, when I go downhill, it tends to drop. A " normal "

CD-57 level should be over 200. LLMD's look for the CD-57 to rise

above 60. When I started treatment, my Cd-57 was 13! I was pretty

much at death's doorstep at the time. I have not come across

anything definitive that states exactly when the CD-57 drops in

Lyme. I don't think the research has expanded that far. I'm not sure

about the accuracy of this test in children with Lyme. However,

since the child's immune system is not fully developed (depending on

age), I would not be surprised to read that the CD-57 test is less

reliable in pediatric populations. I don't think the CD-57 drops

significantly with acute Lyme, because the disease has not had

enough time to suppress the immune system. Where the line is

between " acute " and " chronic " Lyme is still pretty unclear, at least

to me. This decision is typically clinical and based on symptoms. I

hope this was helpful to you. laurie

>

> I got the results of my latest CD-57 test. It was 155, which

according

> to my LLMD means I don't have Lyme anymore. What, then, do I have?

> Every time I stop abx, I get sick again. And when I restart, I

herx. I

> know it's probably a coinfection, especially since doxy is the abx

> that works best for me.

>

> But I thought only spirochete bacteria caused herxes. The common

> coinfections aren't spirochetes, are they?

>

> I'll be asking him this when I see him at the end of the month, but

> until then, I'm hoping the collective wisdom of this group can

explain

> this to me. Or at least point me toward some reading that can

explain it.

>

> Thanks!

> Jessie

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Jessie,

This is mostly opinion, but ya get what ya pay for.

I do think it is possible to have Lyme even when your CD-57 is near

normal. Even though the " normal " range is listed as something like 60

to 300, most healthy people who don't have Lyme test at 180 or higher.

So, compared to the non-Lyme world, it's still a little low. For all

you know, you may have been 300 before you had Lyme.

But for a Lymie, WOW! You go, Girl! Good job!

How long are you off antibiotics before you begin to feel ill? I

think it takes at least a month to 6 weeks for Borrelia to

significantly recover from doxy. At that point, sure - you could

herx going back on antibiotics. Or the antibiotics themselves might

be causing you some problems. Doxy made me lethargic and depressed,

for example, and added to my balance problems and weird visual issues.

The co-infections are not spirochetes. But I see no reason a big

die-off of any bacteria wouldn't cause some symptoms. It's a lot for

your body to process.

Have you considered Bartonella? Doxy suppresses it, and makes you

feel much better. But when you stop, Bart seems to recover pretty

quickly and knock you right on your ass. I treated mine with Hu Zhang

(Japanese knotweed/Polygonum cuspidatum) plus Red Root and Boneset,

and it seems to finally no longer be a problem. Might be worth

trying. Consider purchasing Buhner's book, checking out the

-Buhner list, and seeing if it works for you.

I found that antibiotics did wonders for me. But once I got to a

certain level (18 months later), I plateaued. At that point,

switching to Buhner's herbal protocol and adding heat therapy allowed

me to continue to make progress. I'm feeling good these days. I

still get symptoms now and then, but they are mild, more of a nuisance

than anything. And I'm not sure how much is still Lyme, and how much

might be mercury. (Don't depend on heavy metal testing - it's no more

accurate than Lyme tests.)

Good luck getting it figured out.

D.

" Jessie MacMillan " <jessiemacmillan@...> wrote:

>

> I got the results of my latest CD-57 test. It was 155, which according

> to my LLMD means I don't have Lyme anymore. What, then, do I have?

> Every time I stop abx, I get sick again. And when I restart, I herx. I

> know it's probably a coinfection, especially since doxy is the abx

> that works best for me.

>

> But I thought only spirochete bacteria caused herxes. The common

> coinfections aren't spirochetes, are they?

>

> I'll be asking him this when I see him at the end of the month, but

> until then, I'm hoping the collective wisdom of this group can explain

> this to me. Or at least point me toward some reading that can

explain it.

>

> Thanks!

> Jessie

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, , thanks! This is an awesome response because it provides

perspective I haven't gotten elsewhere.

I was off doxy for 3 weeks before I " crashed " (as my LLMD would put

it). I thought the coinfections weren't spirochetes, which is why I

was surprised at my LLMD's note on my test results that I didn't have

Lyme.

I took the Buhner herbs for a while, but it took me a long time to get

up to the full dose and even though I herxed when I did, I didn't feel

all that much better.

I've also heard of Zhang's protocol, but haven't learned the details.

It sounds like I have some reading to do!

Congratulations on your success with your treatment! It's always

terrific to hear from people who feel better.

And thanks for your detailed and supportive response. I need to dig

out my Buhner book (I belong to the Buhner list) and find out more

about Zhang's protocol. Someday maybe I'll be able to join you with

saying that my symptoms are mild!

Jessie

>

> Hi, Jessie,

>

> This is mostly opinion, but ya get what ya pay for.

>

> I do think it is possible to have Lyme even when your CD-57 is near

> normal. Even though the " normal " range is listed as something like 60

> to 300, most healthy people who don't have Lyme test at 180 or higher.

> So, compared to the non-Lyme world, it's still a little low. For all

> you know, you may have been 300 before you had Lyme.

>

> But for a Lymie, WOW! You go, Girl! Good job!

>

> How long are you off antibiotics before you begin to feel ill? I

> think it takes at least a month to 6 weeks for Borrelia to

> significantly recover from doxy. At that point, sure - you could

> herx going back on antibiotics. Or the antibiotics themselves might

> be causing you some problems. Doxy made me lethargic and depressed,

> for example, and added to my balance problems and weird visual issues.

>

> The co-infections are not spirochetes. But I see no reason a big

> die-off of any bacteria wouldn't cause some symptoms. It's a lot for

> your body to process.

>

> Have you considered Bartonella? Doxy suppresses it, and makes you

> feel much better. But when you stop, Bart seems to recover pretty

> quickly and knock you right on your ass. I treated mine with Hu Zhang

> (Japanese knotweed/Polygonum cuspidatum) plus Red Root and Boneset,

> and it seems to finally no longer be a problem. Might be worth

> trying. Consider purchasing Buhner's book, checking out the

> -Buhner list, and seeing if it works for you.

>

> I found that antibiotics did wonders for me. But once I got to a

> certain level (18 months later), I plateaued. At that point,

> switching to Buhner's herbal protocol and adding heat therapy allowed

> me to continue to make progress. I'm feeling good these days. I

> still get symptoms now and then, but they are mild, more of a nuisance

> than anything. And I'm not sure how much is still Lyme, and how much

> might be mercury. (Don't depend on heavy metal testing - it's no more

> accurate than Lyme tests.)

>

> Good luck getting it figured out.

>

> D.

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Laurie. I didn't know that normal was considered to be 200. I

was tested for co-infections once and it came back negative. I think

I've got co-infections becaus the only abx that really works for me is

doxy.

I don't think I'll ever get rid of whatever has infected me. I'm just

hoping to find a way to live with it as a treated chronic illness.

Jessie

>

> I don't think the CD-57 is meant to indicate " cure " of Lyme. Your

> 155 result is still below the normal cut-off of 200. Your immune

> system may be " bouncing back " based on your CD-57, but you could

> still have infection left in your system. The fact that you are

> still herxing on abx and if you stop you get sick again is

> suspicious. I would ask about getting tested (or retested) for co-

> infections. I copied and pasted my previous posting describing the

> CD-57 test. Hope this helps. Laurie

>

[Guest guest]

I took MGC-5 double strenght from vitacost.And I took 4 caps a day.It worked.

I think on personalconsult.com you might find articles.

Good luck.

[Guest guest]

>

> According to my local Lyme treating doc, the CD57 only responds to Syphilis

and Lyme. 

sorry but that is wrong, just check the scientific literature ...

> The CD57 is just another useful tool that cannot give all the answers, but

along with a good clinical workup and other diagnostic tests, it can provide

info on how a specific part of the immune system is doing in the face of Lyme

Disease and ABX use.

agree about that, and this is where other general markers are valuable as well.

If you don't know exactly what you are treating (e.g. no confirmation of Bb

infection), you might as well make some general assumptions about the symptom

cause, and see if the immune markers like CD57 respond to treatment.

Please note that several studies failed to find a correlation between CD57 and

medical condition (it works for some, and it doesn't work for others).

[Guest guest]

> Also, I have a high CD57 count, at around 145 or so - the doctor said we can

have a higher count and still have Lyme, just as folks with AIDS can have higher

T cell counts and have AIDS. - Robin

yes, agree.

P.S.: folks with AIDS can also have reduced CD57 (although some people might say

this is because they have undetected syphilis, but I won't go into that debate

....).

[Guest guest]

>

> I just read something interesting. It said that when some people are

discussing the CD57 test they are actually talking about CD57 + T cells and not

CD57 + NK cells. The one that relates to Lyme is the CD57 + NK cells.

that probably explains part of the confusion. Strange that Stricker does not

mention this clearly in his articles. I start wondering what exactly these labs

are measuring when they do a 'CD57' test, it doesn't look very straightforward.

Again, it is difficult to see how this marker can be specific to Borrelia (+

Treponema) infection. It seems more likely that it is a general marker for

chronic toxic (viral, bacterial) exposure, causing aging of NK cells.

Stricker (2001/2002): " CD57 lymphocyte subset "

Marques (2009):

" It has been reported that patients diagnosed with chronic Lyme disease have a

decreased number of natural killer cells, as defined by the CD57 marker, and

that the changes in the number of CD57+ cells can be monitored as evidence of

response to therapy (8-10). CD57 was initially used as a marker for NK cells,

but it is not expressed by all NK cells and is also expressed by T-cell

subpopulations. It is thought that CD57 is a marker of terminally differentiated

cells (4). "

" Currently, the most common approach for identifying NK cells utilizes a

combination of CD56 and CD16 surface markers used together with CD3 to exclude T

cells expressing NK markers (NK T cells). The CD57 test is offered in some

clinical laboratories and is being used by some health practitioners to evaluate

and follow patients diagnosed with chronic Lyme disease. "

" We conclude that the numbers of NK cells do not differ between patients with

PLDS, individuals who have recovered from Lyme disease, and healthy volunteers

and that the number of CD57+ non-T (CD3 & #8722;) cells is not helpful in

evaluation or management of these patients. "

[Guest guest]

As I understand it, the CD-57 can be low from:

Lyme Disease

HIV/AIDS

Mycoplasma infection

Has your doctor suggested doing the IgeneX test for Lyme?

After my CD-57 came back as 46, my LLMD wanted to do the IgeneX test but I

balked at the $400 cost and the idea that even those results won't provide a

rock solid diagnosis of Lyme. Every time I see the doc he suggests I get the

test...

Heidi

>

> Does anyone know of any other reason a CD-57 count could be low?

>