Re: Misdxd with MS, Autoimmune Issues List of websites and Publications

[Guest guest]

Hi Again,

As most people with Lyme disease already know, many of the test methods used for

dxing Lyme disease are notoriously inaccurate so when you see an article saying

that " x " number of people were infected with Bb the first thing to check is how

they came to that conclusion.. what blood tests were done to include or

exclude?? I would say that if they can visualize the Bb in a sample that would

be more definitive than say a positive result to the two tier tests, especially

when the bacteria can't be visualized in the controls samples.

The rules are all the same for Ms as they are for Lyme disease. Some reports say

that abx treatment was ineffective for treating MS but these studies used a

short course of abx or abx known to be ineffective. Luanne Metz recently

completed a 2 yr trial of miocycline for MS. She saw an 85% reduction in lesions

in that time. She notes that it took a minimum of 3 mths after starting abx

before any improvements were seen.

An accurate statement about MS is that MS attacks are triggered by viruses,

infection or stress, all of these weaken the immune system and that's when the

MS attack hits us…contrary to what big pharma would have us believe... that our

immune system is so strong that it attacks us. The autoimmune theory has never

been proven, it's just a theory.... based on rabies shots observations.

There is no proof of any autoimmune reactions in MS. The way it went in MS

history is like this: A group of Drs were trying to figure out what causes

encephalitis in the few people that have been vaccinated and had a reaction. In

1933 Dr Rivers team separated the vaccine component from the rabbit brain

component and injected each into monkeys. After repeated injections (up to 100)

the monkeys injected with the rabbit brain component showed signs of

encephalitis possibly from an autoimmune reaction.

In 1947 Dr Kabat added freunds adjuvent to the rabbit brain concoction and

successfully caused encephalitis with only 1 or 2 injections rather than the

previous 100. Since encephalitis kind of resembles MS lesions they ran with the

autoimmne theory. They decided that MS is caused by an allergic reaction just

like vaccine induced encephalitis is. And that theory has just stuck. As a

matter of fact that is how they produce their mouse model of MS that they use to

test the new meds before they feed them to us.

If MS attacks occur when the body is stressed etc than it should be safe to say

that when the immune system is not up to par is when we are hit by MS. Lots of

initial attacks have been described as occuring during these periods even. If so

then it is probably safe to say that the immune system of an MS sufferer

probably doesnt produce too many antibodies... if it produces any at all. I have

a low white blood count and have been using supplements to boost it for the past

year before being tested by Igenex this month. I think it worked because the

results were positive even by CDC criteria.

I have compiled a list of websites, pubmed and other articles related to the

MS/Lyme connection:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx0gkKja11g & feature=related

This lady is part of the panel at a Lyme disease Conference in Canada. She talks

about being dxd with MS and how she has recovered after being properly dxd and

treated for Lyme disease.

http://www.lymenet.de/mattms.htm

http://www.waisbrenclinic.com/ALS-MS-lyme-disease.html

http://www.lymeneteurope.org/info/the-difficulty-of-culturing-spirochetes

http://msj.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/13/4/517 minocycline and MS

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2546763/pdf/0832-08.pdf bartonella

and MS

http://www.lymeinfo.net/multiplesclerosis.html list of medical publications

implicating lyme w MS

http://wwwmsviewsandrelatednews.blogspot.com/2009/08/lyme-disease-and-multiple-s\

clerosis-one.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12194230?ordinalpos=32 & itool=EntrezSystem2.PE\

ntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

http://cmr.asm.org/cgi/reprint/6/4/382

http://www.tickedoffandfedup.com/Lida_Video.html Lida Mattman's lecture was

videotaped. She talks about many illnesses associated with spirochetes. About ½

way thru her lecture she shows microscope images of the spirochetel bacteria

that she has found in most if not all of her MS subjects. She has lots of good

info in her lecture.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/37119 Further digging into the Faroe Islands

MS epidemic has shown that the import of dogs was banned from the Faroe Islands

way before the epidemic occurred. Further to this I have discovered that the

British troops brought their family dogs with them even though they weren't

supposed to. A neurologic dog disease epidemic developed at that time in the

Faroes and many of these dogs had to be put down. This occurred before the

advent of Lyme disease testing.

The pubmed site (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed) is a great place to look

for peer reviewed articles. The numbers below can be used to find the article on

the site:

19638446: Epstein-Barr virus infection is not a characteristic feature of

multiple sclerosis brain.No EBV found in brains of MS sufferers.

19656540: Chronic viral infections of the central nervous system: Aspects

specific to multiple sclerosis.

A connection was found between viruses in general and MS. Viruses, infection and

stress are all considered to be triggers… viruses, infection and stress are all

correlates of a weakened immune system. ….opposite to what big pharma would have

us believe. BTW, autoimmune theory is based on a reaction to the rabies

vaccine….and it's just a theory….

11787831: Association between multiple sclerosis and cystic structures in

cerebrospinal fluid.

Lyme disease bacteria was found in blood of 8 out of 10 MS patients by

observation with electron microscopy. It was not found in any of the control

group. It can remain dormant for years until conditions become favorable ie:

weak immune system caused by viruses, infection and stress.

17197115: Lyme borreliosis and multiple sclerosis are associated with primary

effusion lymphoma.

15617845: Chronic Lyme borreliosis at the root of multiple sclerosis--is a

cure with antibiotics attainable?

15122721: Minocycline reduces gadolinium-enhancing magnetic resonance imaging

lesions in multiple sclerosis. Minocycline reduces gad-enhancing MRI lesions in

MS by 85% after 2 years of abx use. Lyme disease is often treated with

minocycline too.

7611954: Multiple sclerosis and positive Lyme serology

The researcher reports positive results on lyme tests in a patient with MS and

then prescribes ceftriaxone. The patient sees no improvement. It is unclear how

long this patient was on abx but obviously it wasn't very long. Research was

completed in 1990

2388492: [Multiple sclerosis or Lyme disease? a diagnosis problem of

exclusion]

14641530: Intrathecal antibody production against Borrelia burgdorferi in a

patient with relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.

12241771: Bacterial infection as a cause of multiple sclerosis

The researcher reviews the studies of viral and bacterial infections that has

been connected to MS (EBV, Chlamydia etc) and concludes that lyme disease

appears to be the cause.

11153045: Lyme borreliosis and multiple sclerosis: any connection? A

seroepidemic study

In this study 10 out of 26 (38%) MS patients had positive results to Lyme tests

13608292: The spirochete and multiple sclerosis

18.5% of MS samples tested positive for lyme disease

13431986: Cultivation of spirochaetes from spinal fluids of multiple

sclerosis cases and negative controls.

3819785: Chronic progressive neurological involvement in Borrelia burgdorferi

infection.

3642202: Relapsing fever/Lyme disease. Multiple sclerosis.

A correlation is present that connects MS to Lyme disease

17889444: Hypothesized role of galactocerebroside and NKT cells in the

etiology of multiple sclerosis.

(GalC) is a major component of myelin and structurally very similar to Borrelia

burgdorferi glycolipid antigen BbGL-2.

16152811: Neuralgia and demyelinating plaques: MS or lyme disease?

16008535: Relevance of immunological variables in neuroborreliosis and

multiple sclerosis.26% of MS patients had a positive lyme test result

14641530: Intrathecal antibody production against Borrelia burgdorferi in a

patient with relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.

11408328: Intrathecal antibody production against Chlamydia pneumoniae in

multiple sclerosis is part of a polyspecific immune response.Again researchers

did find a higher response of MSers to Chlamydia however their other data does

not support Chlamydia as being the cause of MS.

8239571: Significance of reactive Lyme serology in multiple sclerosis.

8249668: The presence of anti-Borrelia burgdorferi antibodies in a group of

multiple sclerosis patients in eastern Sicily. Preliminary data 20% of 400 MS

patients were positive for Bb

[Guest guest]

>

>

> As most people with Lyme disease already know, many of the test methods used

for dxing Lyme disease are notoriously inaccurate

yes, the two tier tests are almost worthless (over 50% chance of NOT detecting

an existing Borrelia infection), but some tests like high quality Western Blot

are pretty good.

A related issue is how many people would test positive if you have an extremely

sensitive and reliable test. What if 99% of people (including many healthy

individuals) test positive for Borrelia, as with the Mattman QRibb test??

If Hoekstra is correct that MS is caused by a spirochete similar to Bb (sensu

lato), it is likely that percentage of MS patients testing positive for Lyme

will vary wildly, depending on the exact test kit etc. that is used. It would be

interesting to see all these cases checked with current PCR tests where the

spirochete species/strain is determined (if possible at all).

> An accurate statement about MS is that MS attacks are triggered by viruses,

infection or stress, all of these weaken the immune system and that's when the

MS attack hits us…contrary to what big pharma would have us believe... that our

immune system is so strong that it attacks us. The autoimmune theory has never

been proven, it's just a theory.... based on rabies shots observations.

yes, fully agree - just as with Lyme

> If MS attacks occur when the body is stressed etc than it should be safe to

say that when the immune system is not up to par is when we are hit by MS.

again this suggests that there is no simple ONE cause for MS, or Lyme, or most

other 'auto-immune' diseases. It is a combination of factors or multi-step

process, which is notoriously tough for science to tackle. If these diseases

develop only in immune-compromised individuals, the cause is not only the

pathogen but also the factors that casued the immune-compromised state in the

first place.

These other factors are clearly associated with the modern Western culture/

technology. They are statistically linked, but it seems impossible to pinpoint

the real cause (maybe there isn't any and it is just the sum of bad (factory and

GMO) food, modern medicine, immunisations, antibiotics misuse, poison in

food/water/air, electromagnetic radiation etc.

> I have compiled a list of websites, pubmed and other articles related to the

MS/Lyme connection:

thanks for the list