Re: Abx Question

[Guest guest]

How about Doxy 3 to 400 mgs per day? That's usually the recommended dosage if

you can handle it... Good Luck and keep us posted!

[Guest guest]

My doctor told me that he prefers Ceftin over doxu because doxy

prevents bacteria form reproducing and is good for things like Step

whereas Ceftin kills the bacteria. Don't know how accurate this

is.....

Lyra

> Okay y'all ... I have an appt. Tues. with my non-Lyme

literate/Family Practice Dr., but who LIVES to learn about Lyme. He

has read everything I have ever given him and whenever I go see him,

he'll spend at least 30 mins. with me asking me questions. (I'm sure

his other patients are NOT happy about this, but I am.) *Grin*

>

> So anyway, I think it's time to go back on abx, after not being on

anything for eight years. The headaches are back with a vengeance,

the brain fog is getting worse, backaches are getting worse, etc.

>

> My question is ... what abx (oral) should I tell him I want, what

amt. of dosage, and for how long? I was thinking for asking for Doxy

for about six weeks????? I won't go on IV again as I don't think I

need it at this point. I'm not THAT sick. Just need something more

than the headache meds that have stopped working. I know a herx now

would help. (And hopefully keep me going for another eight years!!!)

>

> Thanks in advance for your advice!! :-)

>

> Jean

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Lyra,

It is actually exactly opposite- Ceftin works by inhibiting the cell wall

synthesis- so it is effective against the spirochetal form during the

replication or multiplication of the bacteria and doxy works by inhibiting

protein synthesis called bacteriostatic- so therefore helpful against the cell

wall deficient form or L form.

Edina

[ ] Re: Abx Question

My doctor told me that he prefers Ceftin over doxu because doxy

prevents bacteria form reproducing and is good for things like Step

whereas Ceftin kills the bacteria. Don't know how accurate this

is.....

Lyra

> Okay y'all ... I have an appt. Tues. with my non-Lyme

literate/Family Practice Dr., but who LIVES to learn about Lyme. He

has read everything I have ever given him and whenever I go see him,

he'll spend at least 30 mins. with me asking me questions. (I'm sure

his other patients are NOT happy about this, but I am.) *Grin*

>

> So anyway, I think it's time to go back on abx, after not being on

anything for eight years. The headaches are back with a vengeance,

the brain fog is getting worse, backaches are getting worse, etc.

>

> My question is ... what abx (oral) should I tell him I want, what

amt. of dosage, and for how long? I was thinking for asking for Doxy

for about six weeks????? I won't go on IV again as I don't think I

need it at this point. I'm not THAT sick. Just need something more

than the headache meds that have stopped working. I know a herx now

would help. (And hopefully keep me going for another eight years!!!)

>

> Thanks in advance for your advice!! :-)

>

> Jean

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Whish is best for Lyme?

Lyra

> Lyra,

> It is actually exactly opposite- Ceftin works by inhibiting the

cell wall synthesis- so it is effective against the spirochetal form

during the replication or multiplication of the bacteria and doxy

works by inhibiting protein synthesis called bacteriostatic- so

therefore helpful against the cell wall deficient form or L form.

> Edina

d]

[Guest guest]

I don't know that anyone has proven that one is " better " than another, and in

fact, many LLMDs use one of each type in combination when treating chronic Lyme

disease. In a new case, doxy has got the added benefit of also being effective

against Ehrlichiosis, but with summer it brings the issue of sun exposure into

play. A recent exposure might reasonably have a spirochetal germ load as it

wouldn't have had cause to evade the immune system yet therefore Ceftin or

another bactericidal antibiotic might be chosen to act against the spirochetes.

Edina

[ ] Re: Abx Question

Whish is best for Lyme?

Lyra

> Lyra,

> It is actually exactly opposite- Ceftin works by inhibiting the

cell wall synthesis- so it is effective against the spirochetal form

during the replication or multiplication of the bacteria and doxy

works by inhibiting protein synthesis called bacteriostatic- so

therefore helpful against the cell wall deficient form or L form.

> Edina

d]

[Guest guest]

For some reason the MD I saw said that doxy is hard to get a

concentration with. He said that since I was not having a problem

with the sun (while at the beach) that it probably wasn't a high

enough concentration. He decided to pout me on Ceftin which he said

was the closest you can come to IV in oral form. He also said that

doxy was " static " meaning that it prevents bacteria from replicating

whereas ceftin would get rid of the bacteria already there. Maybe I

should get a second opinion...

Lyra

> I don't know that anyone has proven that one is " better " than

another, and in fact, many LLMDs use one of each type in combination

when treating chronic Lyme disease. In a new case, doxy has got the

added benefit of also being effective against Ehrlichiosis, but with

summer it brings the issue of sun exposure into play. A recent

exposure might reasonably have a spirochetal germ load as it wouldn't

have had cause to evade the immune system yet therefore Ceftin or

another bactericidal antibiotic might be chosen to act against the

spirochetes.

>

> Edina

[Guest guest]

And so begins the dilemna of whose treatment protocols are for you... some of

the physicians maintain that orals are completely effective in all stages or

manifestations of Lyme disease, another says you need IV because orals don't

cross the blood brain barrier with a high enough concentration and won't give

only orals, needless to say, it is all very difficult to sort out. I have seen

some check blood levels to determine how well your body is absorbing the

antibiotic. Intuition certainly plays a role in it as well.

Yes, bacteriostatic antibiotics are capable of retarding bacteria growth and

multiplication but the confusing part is that not all forms of Lyme actually

replicate and doxy acts by inhibiting protein synthesis. The cell wall deficient

form still causes damage, and it can also spontaneously mutate back into the

spirochetal form for whatever reason (lack of explanation provided as to why it

mutates back other than no perceived threat) but it does not reproduce so

bactericidal antibiotics do not work on this form. Bactericidal (Ceftin for

example) inhibits cell wall synthesis, causing the cell wall to be osmotically

unstable, which leads to cell death. If something doesn't have a cell wall

obviously it can't work on something that isn't there. I have read and also

heard the explanation that the spirochetes mutate to other forms when there is a

threat from our immune system.

best wishes,

Edina

For some reason the MD I saw said that doxy is hard to get a

concentration with. He said that since I was not having a problem

with the sun (while at the beach) that it probably wasn't a high

enough concentration. He decided to pout me on Ceftin which he said

was the closest you can come to IV in oral form.

[Guest guest]

So...Doxy acts on one kind of bacteria and Ceftin acts on

another...which can both be seen in Lyme disease. Are you saying

that you may need both to kill the different forms of bacteria? Are

there any that are bacteriostatic and bactericidal?

Lyra

> Yes, bacteriostatic antibiotics are capable of retarding bacteria

growth and multiplication but the confusing part is that not all

forms of Lyme actually replicate and doxy acts by inhibiting protein

synthesis. The cell wall deficient form still causes damage, and it

can also spontaneously mutate back into the spirochetal form for

whatever reason (lack of explanation provided as to why it mutates

back other than no perceived threat) but it does not reproduce so

bactericidal antibiotics do not work on this form. Bactericidal

(Ceftin for example) inhibits cell wall synthesis, causing the cell

wall to be osmotically unstable, which leads to cell death. If

something doesn't have a cell wall obviously it can't work on

something that isn't there. I have read and also heard the

explanation that the spirochetes mutate to other forms when there is

a threat from our immune system.

> best wishes,

> Edina

>

> For some reason the MD I saw said that doxy is hard to get a

> concentration with. He said that since I was not having a

problem

> with the sun (while at the beach) that it probably wasn't a high

> enough concentration. He decided to pout me on Ceftin which he

said

> was the closest you can come to IV in oral form.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/18/01 3:41:19 PM Central Daylight Time,

lms@... writes:

<< For some reason the MD I saw said that doxy is hard to get a

concentration with. He said that since I was not having a problem

with the sun (while at the beach) that it probably wasn't a high

enough concentration. >>

I will tell you that a high enough concentration of doxy will *definitely*

cause sunburn. I was taking 1200mg a day and went and played golf. Put SPF

15 on the neck, arms and face (all I've ever had to use since I don't have a

fair complexion) and I started burning about the 10th hole. No additional

sunscreen helped so I was definitely taking a lot.

Other thing is I *believe* that doxy is one antibiotic that can be measured

in the bloodstream to see if you are getting a strong enough concentration.

I know there are some they can measure and some they can't.

[Guest guest]

I was only on 200mg of doxy a day. I hope I have the right amount of

Ceftin with 1000md a day.

Lyra

> In a message dated 7/18/01 3:41:19 PM Central Daylight Time,

> lms@v... writes:

>

> I will tell you that a high enough concentration of doxy will

*definitely*

> cause sunburn. I was taking 1200mg a day and went and played

golf. Put SPF

> 15 on the neck, arms and face (all I've ever had to use since I

don't have a

> fair complexion) and I started burning about the 10th hole. No

additional

> sunscreen helped so I was definitely taking a lot.

>

> Other thing is I *believe* that doxy is one antibiotic that can be

measured

> in the bloodstream to see if you are getting a strong enough

concentration.

> I know there are some they can measure and some they can't.