Re: HCG and DHEA along with my HRT??

[Guest guest]

LH and FSH are driven low from the feedback of your increasing testosterone

levels by the external application of Androgel. At this point there isn't much

value in measuring LH and FSH.

hCG will provide a signal to your testis to produce testosterone and other

hormones in a fashion similar to LH. The leydig cells in your testis will be

stimulated by hCG; your testis will then remain active and should not atrophy.

The addition of hCG should also increase your testosterone levels if you are not

primary, that is your testicles don't work. You may then need only 5 gms of

Androgel.... but be sure you follow through with determining bio-available T....

many suggest calculating this using your SHBG level or use the Quest BioT assay.

DHEA should be added if the lab results warrant. You can also trial DHEA but

watch for issues. DHEA can cause decreases in cortisol so if you already have a

decreased cortisol level you may be asking for a problem. From what I

understand, both DHEA and cortisol are triggered by ACTH/pituitary; so if DHEA

is seen as high enough then cortisol will not be triggered. The bottom line is

that once you start to adjust hormones you need to consider the results and

feedback. If you do add DHEA, you should split the dose AM/PM.

The anti-aging center seems to be on track with their additional lab tests but,

if it were me, I would not put my full faith in them yet. It is best to be

functionally educated, ask questions, and keep reading. I would stick with

Androgel unless proven to be ineffective or driving DHT too high. If cost is

the issue then T-Cyp has the advantage.

>

> What do the members on this forum think about HCG and DHEA along with my

> HRT??

>

>

> Been on Androgel for three months. 51 in good shape weights and cardio.

>

> test was 230 now about 600.

>

> I went to an aging center and they want me to start HCG shots due to my LH

> and FSH being below 1.0

>

> They want me to start taking Test. shots instead of the gel.

>

> They also want me to take DHEA.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Androgel IS BioIdentical Testosterone. Some doctors prefer gels; since they are

applied daily they deliver T in a daily pulsatile pattern more closely mimicking

what your body would do.

A low SHBG indicates that a greater level of T is not bound - more bioavailable

- good news. I would resist changing to injections. Work with your new doctor

using Androgel and move on with the other items, IMHO. Add the hCG as they

suggest, etc.

Belly fat @ 51! Not surprising Ha1c test is good idea... also look at

glucose and insulin. How's your diet - no simple carbs/low carb profile? ---

first step. Even though you are exercising I would still consider insulin

resistance and/or metabolic syndrome.

What I have learned since starting on my quest is that as we age, several

hormone systems may not be optimum or even very out of whack. Getting them all

optimized is the best plan. So if you thought that you would be fixed up with a

little T, no such luck for many of us over 50 males ... but there is hope.

I started only thinking about the symptoms of my declining T. Then I was

introduced to hCG, then AI. After that discovered hypothyroidism caused by

Hashimoto's thyroiditis. Now on synthroid. It is pretty clear that my cortisol

level is low too... but can only get my doc to move so fast.... we are working

on it! At some point I will need to address my declining GH level too. No, I

am not overwhelmed since I am feeling a great deal better then when I started

but realize now I am in it for the long haul... that's my story.

>

> Thank you for your response. I am Secondary due to a lesion/ small tumor

> on my pituitary gland. The aging canter is recommending Bio Identical

> Testosterone (Enanthate). cortisol levels are at 17 based on a blood test.

> I am doing the Salvia test now for a more accurate cortisol reading.

>

> SHBG is a 9 which is considered LOW. It should be between 18 - 47.

>

>

> I work out a lot and cant get rid of the belly fat. I am 51 in good

> physical cond. weights and cardio 4 times weekly.

>

>

>

>

> In a message dated 2/28/2010 9:10:11 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> kevinh@... writes:

>

>

>

>

> LH and FSH are driven low from the feedback of your increasing testosterone

> levels by the external application of Androgel. At this point there isn't

> much value in measuring LH and FSH.

>

> hCG will provide a signal to your testis to produce testosterone and other

> hormones in a fashion similar to LH. The leydig cells in your testis will

> be stimulated by hCG; your testis will then remain active and should not

> atrophy. The addition of hCG should also increase your testosterone levels if

> you are not primary, that is your testicles don't work. You may then need

> only 5 gms of Androgel.... but be sure you follow through with determining

> bio-available T.... many suggest calculating this using your SHBG level or

> use the Quest BioT assay.

>

> DHEA should be added if the lab results warrant. You can also trial DHEA

> but watch for issues. DHEA can cause decreases in cortisol so if you already

> have a decreased cortisol level you may be asking for a problem. From what

> I understand, both DHEA and cortisol are triggered by ACTH/pituitary; so

> if DHEA is seen as high enough then cortisol will not be triggered. The

> bottom line is that once you start to adjust hormones you need to consider

the

> results and feedback. If you do add DHEA, you should split the dose AM/PM.

>

> The anti-aging center seems to be on track with their additional lab tests

> but, if it were me, I would not put my full faith in them yet. It is best

> to be functionally educated, ask questions, and keep reading. I would stick

> with Androgel unless proven to be ineffective or driving DHT too high. If

> cost is the issue then T-Cyp has the advantage.

>

> --- In _ @hypogonadismhyp_

> (mailto: ) , gviceman77@, gvi

> >

> > What do the members on this forum think about HCG and DHEA along with my

> > HRT??

> >

> >

> > Been on Androgel for three months. 51 in good shape weights and cardio.

> >

> > test was 230 now about 600.

> >

> > I went to an aging center and they want me to start HCG shots due to my

> LH

> > and FSH being below 1.0

> >

> > They want me to start taking Test. shots instead of the gel.

> >

> > They also want me to take DHEA.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

It all sounds good here is what Dr. sent me in a reply to help me get my

Dr. to let me try HCG.

====================================================

He probably feels that since you suffer primary hypogonadism (I am guessing)

there is no use in adding HCG to your protocol. There are several reasons why

this is not so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG you take

will stimulate those who still function to produce endogenous testosterone.

This will support testicular size. We should not ignore this aesthetic

consideration.

Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT

patients are to some extent) also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which

is the first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which begin with

CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and therefore restores a more

natural balance of our hormones.

Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their regimens report an

increased sense of well-being and also libido. These are genuine quality of life

issues.

Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH receptors (including

those we have yet to discover and appreciate) unstimulated.

----------------------------------------------------

Going on HCG is how I found out I am Hypopituitary Seconday not Primary. I

found after my first shot I got this great feeling of well being. If I do the

shot subQ I don't get this feeling for hrs. So I do my HCG shots IM into my

thigh.

As for DHEA if your levels are in range I would not take it for some of us it

converts into Estradiol. So if you try this keep this in mind. I don't know

many people that take DHEA or took it that felt any better on it.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: gviceman77@... <gviceman77@...>

> Subject: HCG and DHEA along with my HRT??

>

> Date: Sunday, February 28, 2010, 8:06 PM

> What do the members on this forum

> think about HCG and DHEA along with my 

> HRT??

>

>

> Been on Androgel for three months.  51 in good shape

> weights and  cardio.

>

> test was 230 now about 600.

>

> I went to an aging center and they want me to start HCG

> shots due to my LH 

> and FSH being below 1.0

>

> They want me to start taking Test. shots instead of the

> gel.

>

> They also want me to take DHEA.

>

>

>

>

>