Guest guest Posted March 3, 2010 Report Share Posted March 3, 2010 Guys, I went for a yearly checkup and requested the usual things we ask for on bloodwork and here are the results. Remember, I have been off of TRT for the better part of 3 years now. Total T n 257.50ng/dl range 205-781 LH n 3.59mIU/ml range 1.24-8.62 FSH n 2.84mIU/ml range 1.27-19.26 Estradiol n 36 pg/ml range 20-75 % Free T High 3.1 range 1.6-2.9 These look like they always do...almost dead on, but I would like to add that every time I get my labs, it says my Free T percent is High...dunno what that means. Please input your opinions Vaiisking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 7, 2010 Report Share Posted March 7, 2010 > > Vaiisking I must say I don't know how you live with them levels. Your low TT with LH and FSH on the low side tells me your Pituitary is not working right. > As for your % of Free T it would help if you tested your SHBG levels this might be very low. > > Or it's your high Estradiol levels doing this. If you can get your Estradiol levels lower your TT might come up some 200 to 300 Points. Higher levels of Estradiol in men looks to the brain like it high Testosterone and the brain slows down sending the LH and FSH messages to the Testis to make more Testosterone. So you can try getting this down taking Arimidex .25 mgs every 3 days of get the supplement indolplex/DIM to bring it down. > > Do you get involuntary nocturnal erections that appear during REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep if not your Estradiol levels might be the problem. > > Phil, I get morning wood occasionally and REM is probably not happening with me because I have to take Remeron to sleep or I don't sleep. What level is recommended for Estradiol? With my level, which of the two meds to you suggest? Thanks, V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2010 Report Share Posted March 8, 2010 Arimidex works the best but most Dr.'s will not use it let alone test for Estradiol. The best level is 20 pg/ml and I was on Remeron and had wood from rem sleep. I was not on TRT at the time when I got my Testosterone up and my Estradiol levels down I sleep dam good. Co-Moderator Phil > From: vaiisking1026 <vaiisking@...> > Subject: Re: New Labs > > Date: Monday, March 8, 2010, 1:02 AM > > > > > > > Vaiisking I must say I don't know how you live with > them levels. Your low TT with LH and FSH on the low > side tells me your Pituitary is not working right. > > As for your % of Free T it would help if you tested > your SHBG levels this might be very low. > > > > Or it's your high Estradiol levels doing this. > If you can get your Estradiol levels lower your TT might > come up some 200 to 300 Points. Higher levels of > Estradiol in men looks to the brain like it high > Testosterone and the brain slows down sending the LH and FSH > messages to the Testis to make more Testosterone. So > you can try getting this down taking Arimidex .25 mgs every > 3 days of get the supplement indolplex/DIM to bring it > down. > > > > Do you get involuntary nocturnal erections that > appear during REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep if not your > Estradiol levels might be the problem. > > > > > Phil, > I get morning wood occasionally and REM is probably not > happening with me because I have to take Remeron to sleep or > I don't sleep. What level is recommended for Estradiol? With > my level, which of the two meds to you suggest? > > Thanks, > V > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 Well here is my take on this 10 grams of gel your levels went down this means your skin is not letting the T into your blood and what did get into your blood your brain seen this and stopped sending the LH and FSH messages to your Testis and your levels went down your testis stopped making what little T you were making. Now your Dr. wants you to suffer longer trying a lower dose of 3% compounded cream did he sell it to you. Most of the men that do compounded creams of gels do 5% even 10% still if your skin is not letting it into your blood your in the same house different room. Men go on shots because Gels don't work and if Androgel will not work what makes your Dr. think a compounded cream or gel will work. Androgel works better to get into your blood through your skin then Compounded creams of gels. You need to put your foot down with your Dr. telling him look I tried the Androgel and from what I know about it it is better the compounded creams or gels. Tell him you don't want to suffer anymore if he will not put you on shots your going to find a better Dr. And your Estradiol levels are through the roof WTF is he taking about when your Testosterone levels come up your Estradiol will go down. Bull Estradiol is made from Testosterone as it gose up so dose Estradiol and the higher Estradiol gets the more of a problem you will have with your Testostrone being bound up not working. You need to get your Estradiol down asap get some Arimidex from this dam Dr. and take .5 mgs every other day to get this down. Or buy some Indoplex/DIM and use this to get it down. Don't pay me no mind I just get so dam mad with I hear a Dr. do this kind of Bull Shi*. =================================================== ALL ABOUT DIM. Sure here is a few links that are all about it. But there are a lot of Co.'s out there selling DIM that don't work well. Indolplex/DIM is the best it dose not get killed in your stomach when you take it. Diindolylmethane (DIM) is a stable indole found in cruciferous vegetables which promotes a beneficial estrogen metabolism in both women and men. http://www.dimfaq.com/index.htm in this link it's full of links about it. http://qualitycounts.com/fpdim.html http://www.jbc.org/content/278/23/21136.full If you have DIM in caps it's not Indolplex so to take this and to get it to work open the cap pore the DIM into a spoon add some Olive oil and take it this helps to keep it from getting killed in your stomach. The following is some links to where you can buy Indolplex/DIM. http://www.vitaglo.com/e5336.html http://www.vitacost.com/EnzymaticTherapyEstroBalancewithDIM/searchby-PN/searchte\ xt-dim http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.estrobalance.net/ http://www.easyhealthzone.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=PP0108 & click=71 http://www.nbizz.com/longevityclinic/listings/213.html http://www.drugnatural.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD & Store_Code=DMOS & Product_\ Code=156497 http://www.smartbomb.com/itindo9.html?utm_source=mercent & utm_medium=shopcompare & \ utm_content=itindo9 & utm_campaign=mbsdb & mr:trackingCode=C6AEFBD1-E681-DE11-B7F3-0\ 019B9C043EB & mr:referralID=NA http://www.ritecare.com/cgi-bin/cart.pl?db=product_db.dat & category=natural+medic\ ine & method=any_words & search=iti-75336 http://www.naturamart.com/phytopharmica-pms-formula-with-indoplex-120-caps.html How to take Indolplex/DIM take one tablet 120 mgs at dinner time it can take 2 weeks to 2 months to get your Estradiol levels down it’s all about how high you are in your levels. What you need to do is get this down to about 20 pg/ml. When you get this low your night time and morning wood will come back so strong it will wake you up this means most of the time your at your best levels or what I call the sweet spot. Keep taking the DIM but if your wood stops your going down to low so just stop taking it. The day your wood comes back go back on the DIM but cut the tablet in half. If your Testosterone was tested and low but your not on TRT get it tested again you might find your levels came up some 200 to 300 points. http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/3/1174 ==================================================== How to take Arimidex and not go to low. What I found is if you go to low taking arimidex, it's the length of time your to low, if your too low say for 8 weeks it can take your body a longer time to make more Estradiol. Bottom line is to know how not to go to low. Keep a log on your dose and how you feel men going to low can't get it up taking Viagra. I went to low when I first tried Arimidex and did not know about going to low or how one feels to low, so I was low a good 8 weeks. I did not know I was low until my next labs. The best gage I have found to control your Estradiol levels is to gage your night time and morning wood. At good levels or what I call the sweet spot you get your night time and morning wood back so strong it will wake you up and you can hang a coat on it. Most men do good taking .25 mgs or 1/4 of a 1mg. pill, I use a pill cutter to cut the small pill in half then I stand it on the cut end and use a single edge razor to cut this in half. A good way to take arimidex is by how high your levels are. I tested over 90 pg/ml so we tried doing .5 mgs every other day after 8 weeks my next set of labs showed it did not move below 90, test said >90. So we did .5 mgs. every day in about 2 weeks I got some strong night time and morning wood back after not having them for many yrs. I kept doing this dose and in 8 weeks my next set of labs said <20 back in the day labs were like this they did not have to good labs we have today they could not read lower the 20. My Dr. told me this looks to low to stop taking the Arimidex. The one thing I noticed was my wood stopped and stopping the Arimidex my wood came back in about 7 weeks my next test at 8 weeks was 24 pg/ml. So we went back on the Arimidex but the Dr. told me to take .5 mgs every 3 days I was on this dose not a week and lost wood. This is when I figured out going to low you lose wood. And the longer your too low the longer it takes to get levels back up. I stopped the arimidex right away and got my wood back in 4 days. I then after playing with the dose for a time found the best dose is .25mgs every 2 to 3 days. So lets say your labs are less the 50 pg/ml if your take .5 mgs you can go down so dam fast your miss the sweet spot of your wood and go to low. It's best with lower levels 50 and under to do less Arimidex .25mgs every 2 days if later your lose wood when it comes back go to every 3 days. I have found estradiol is the hardest hormone to control, it goes up or down from month to month some times I need .25mgs every 2 days other times I need ..25mgs everyday most of the time I do well on every 3 days. So between wood and labs I do great and so do most of the men I have told this to. I keep a log on how much I am taking and how I feel. Doing this and reading back in my log I was able to tell when I was going to high or to low my Dr. lets me dose my arimidex by how I feel. Over the yrs. I have posted this story until I am blue in the face. Co-Moderator Phil > From: Wharff <robertwharff@...> > Subject: New labs > > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > Well, I just got back from my > doctor's appointment. After being on Adrogel, > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from 290 to > 237. Yeah!! My first > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep my sense of > humor about > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. I asked > about shots, and he wanted > to try another transdermal first. We settled on a > compounded one, 3% 100mg > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. When I > asked about treating > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the Testosterone up, > the Estradiol > would go down. That doesn't make sense to me. > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be time for a > new doctor if. " > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand up comic > routine. I guess > the good news is I get to see my new primary care doctor in > about a month. > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the problem. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 Thanks Phil. I'm already there with you. I don't feel like fighting with this doctor. If my new primary doesn't want to take on my TRT. I'll find one that does. I'll travel out of state and pay out of pocket if I have too. I'm just trying to keep my sense of humor about it. I almost laughed in his face when he said that my estradiol would come down as my testosterone went up. I already thought I was wasting my time, but that proved it. He is not selling the compounded gel, so I don't think he has an ulterior motive. He is just a conservative endo. He is not what I want or need to treat this problem. Thanks for taking the time to respond to everyone's posts. I think you are doing a good job getting the information out. . _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of philip georgian Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 12:08 PM Subject: Re: New labs Well here is my take on this 10 grams of gel your levels went down this means your skin is not letting the T into your blood and what did get into your blood your brain seen this and stopped sending the LH and FSH messages to your Testis and your levels went down your testis stopped making what little T you were making. Now your Dr. wants you to suffer longer trying a lower dose of 3% compounded cream did he sell it to you. Most of the men that do compounded creams of gels do 5% even 10% still if your skin is not letting it into your blood your in the same house different room. Men go on shots because Gels don't work and if Androgel will not work what makes your Dr. think a compounded cream or gel will work. Androgel works better to get into your blood through your skin then Compounded creams of gels. You need to put your foot down with your Dr. telling him look I tried the Androgel and from what I know about it it is better the compounded creams or gels. Tell him you don't want to suffer anymore if he will not put you on shots your going to find a better Dr. And your Estradiol levels are through the roof WTF is he taking about when your Testosterone levels come up your Estradiol will go down. Bull Estradiol is made from Testosterone as it gose up so dose Estradiol and the higher Estradiol gets the more of a problem you will have with your Testostrone being bound up not working. You need to get your Estradiol down asap get some Arimidex from this dam Dr. and take .5 mgs every other day to get this down. Or buy some Indoplex/DIM and use this to get it down. Don't pay me no mind I just get so dam mad with I hear a Dr. do this kind of Bull Shi*. =================================================== ALL ABOUT DIM. Sure here is a few links that are all about it. But there are a lot of Co.'s out there selling DIM that don't work well. Indolplex/DIM is the best it dose not get killed in your stomach when you take it. Diindolylmethane (DIM) is a stable indole found in cruciferous vegetables which promotes a beneficial estrogen metabolism in both women and men. http://www.dimfaq. <http://www.dimfaq.com/index.htm> com/index.htm in this link it's full of links about it. http://qualitycount <http://qualitycounts.com/fpdim.html> s.com/fpdim.html http://www.jbc. <http://www.jbc.org/content/278/23/21136.full> org/content/278/23/21136.full If you have DIM in caps it's not Indolplex so to take this and to get it to work open the cap pore the DIM into a spoon add some Olive oil and take it this helps to keep it from getting killed in your stomach. The following is some links to where you can buy Indolplex/DIM. http://www.vitaglo. <http://www.vitaglo.com/e5336.html> com/e5336.html http://www.vitacost <http://www.vitacost.com/EnzymaticTherapyEstroBalancewithDIM/searchby-PN/sea rchtext-dim> ..com/EnzymaticTherapyEstroBalancewithDIM/searchby-PN/searchtext-dim http://www.iherb. <http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?a t=0> com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.iherb. <http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?a t=0> com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.estrobal <http://www.estrobalance.net/> ance.net/ http://www.easyheal <http://www.easyhealthzone.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=PP0108 & click=7 1> thzone.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=PP0108 & click=71 http://www.nbizz. <http://www.nbizz.com/longevityclinic/listings/213.html> com/longevityclinic/listings/213.html http://www.drugnatu <http://www.drugnatural.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD & Store_Code=DMOS & Pro duct_Code=156497> ral.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD & Store_Code=DMOS & Product_Code=156497 http://www.smartbom <http://www.smartbomb.com/itindo9.html?utm_source=mercent & utm_medium=shopcom pare & utm_content=itindo9 & utm_campaign=mbsdb & mr:trackingCode=C6AEFBD1-E681-DE 11-B7F3-0019B9C043EB & mr:referralID=NA> b.com/itindo9.html?utm_source=mercent & utm_medium=shopcompare & utm_content=iti ndo9 & utm_campaign=mbsdb & mr:trackingCode=C6AEFBD1-E681-DE11-B7F3-0019B9C043EB & mr:referralID=NA http://www.ritecare <http://www.ritecare.com/cgi-bin/cart.pl?db=product_db.dat & category=natural+ medicine & method=any_words & search=iti-75336> ..com/cgi-bin/cart.pl?db=product_db.dat & category=natural+medicine & method=any_ words & search=iti-75336 http://www.naturama <http://www.naturamart.com/phytopharmica-pms-formula-with-indoplex-120-caps. html> rt.com/phytopharmica-pms-formula-with-indoplex-120-caps.html How to take Indolplex/DIM take one tablet 120 mgs at dinner time it can take 2 weeks to 2 months to get your Estradiol levels down it's all about how high you are in your levels. What you need to do is get this down to about 20 pg/ml. When you get this low your night time and morning wood will come back so strong it will wake you up this means most of the time your at your best levels or what I call the sweet spot. Keep taking the DIM but if your wood stops your going down to low so just stop taking it. The day your wood comes back go back on the DIM but cut the tablet in half. If your Testosterone was tested and low but your not on TRT get it tested again you might find your levels came up some 200 to 300 points. http://jcem. <http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/3/1174> endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/3/1174 ==================================================== How to take Arimidex and not go to low. What I found is if you go to low taking arimidex, it's the length of time your to low, if your too low say for 8 weeks it can take your body a longer time to make more Estradiol. Bottom line is to know how not to go to low. Keep a log on your dose and how you feel men going to low can't get it up taking Viagra. I went to low when I first tried Arimidex and did not know about going to low or how one feels to low, so I was low a good 8 weeks. I did not know I was low until my next labs. The best gage I have found to control your Estradiol levels is to gage your night time and morning wood. At good levels or what I call the sweet spot you get your night time and morning wood back so strong it will wake you up and you can hang a coat on it. Most men do good taking .25 mgs or 1/4 of a 1mg. pill, I use a pill cutter to cut the small pill in half then I stand it on the cut end and use a single edge razor to cut this in half. A good way to take arimidex is by how high your levels are. I tested over 90 pg/ml so we tried doing .5 mgs every other day after 8 weeks my next set of labs showed it did not move below 90, test said >90. So we did .5 mgs. every day in about 2 weeks I got some strong night time and morning wood back after not having them for many yrs. I kept doing this dose and in 8 weeks my next set of labs said <20 back in the day labs were like this they did not have to good labs we have today they could not read lower the 20. My Dr. told me this looks to low to stop taking the Arimidex. The one thing I noticed was my wood stopped and stopping the Arimidex my wood came back in about 7 weeks my next test at 8 weeks was 24 pg/ml. So we went back on the Arimidex but the Dr. told me to take .5 mgs every 3 days I was on this dose not a week and lost wood. This is when I figured out going to low you lose wood. And the longer your too low the longer it takes to get levels back up. I stopped the arimidex right away and got my wood back in 4 days. I then after playing with the dose for a time found the best dose is .25mgs every 2 to 3 days. So lets say your labs are less the 50 pg/ml if your take .5 mgs you can go down so dam fast your miss the sweet spot of your wood and go to low. It's best with lower levels 50 and under to do less Arimidex .25mgs every 2 days if later your lose wood when it comes back go to every 3 days. I have found estradiol is the hardest hormone to control, it goes up or down from month to month some times I need .25mgs every 2 days other times I need ..25mgs everyday most of the time I do well on every 3 days. So between wood and labs I do great and so do most of the men I have told this to. I keep a log on how much I am taking and how I feel. Doing this and reading back in my log I was able to tell when I was going to high or to low my Dr. lets me dose my arimidex by how I feel. Over the yrs. I have posted this story until I am blue in the face. Co-Moderator Phil > From: Wharff <robertwharff@ <mailto:robertwharff%40robertwharff.com> robertwharff.com> > Subject: New labs > @ <mailto: %40> > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > Well, I just got back from my > doctor's appointment. After being on Adrogel, > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from 290 to > 237. Yeah!! My first > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep my sense of > humor about > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. I asked > about shots, and he wanted > to try another transdermal first. We settled on a > compounded one, 3% 100mg > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. When I > asked about treating > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the Testosterone up, > the Estradiol > would go down. That doesn't make sense to me. > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be time for a > new doctor if. " > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand up comic > routine. I guess > the good news is I get to see my new primary care doctor in > about a month. > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the problem. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 My GOD he is an Endo wow we need to start a file of the dum crap Endo's say to use men. Co-Moderator Phil > > > From: Wharff <robertwharff@ > <mailto:robertwharff%40robertwharff.com> > robertwharff.com> > > Subject: New labs > > @ > <mailto: %40> > > > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > > Well, I just got back from my > > doctor's appointment. After being on Adrogel, > > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from 290 to > > 237. Yeah!! My first > > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep my > sense of > > humor about > > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. I > asked > > about shots, and he wanted > > to try another transdermal first. We settled on > a > > compounded one, 3% 100mg > > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. > When I > > asked about treating > > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the Testosterone > up, > > the Estradiol > > would go down. That doesn't make sense to me. > > > > > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be time > for a > > new doctor if. " > > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand up > comic > > routine. I guess > > the good news is I get to see my new primary care > doctor in > > about a month. > > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the problem. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 I agree. Sort of like " You might be a redneck if. " If your doctor says " Don't worry about that estradiol. It will come down when we get your testosterone up. " It might be time for a new doctor. If your doctor says " You've been on Andorgel without success for over a year, so let's try a compounded cream. " It might be time for a new doctor. At least I've been able to keep my sense of humor. I started arimidex and hcg 2 weeks ago, every 3 days .25 mg and 250 iu respectively. I think I'll up that arimidex to .5 every other day. _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of philip georgian Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 2:28 PM Subject: RE: New labs My GOD he is an Endo wow we need to start a file of the dum crap Endo's say to use men. Co-Moderator Phil > > > From: Wharff <robertwharff@ > <mailto:robertwharff%40robertwharff.com> > robertwharff.com> > > Subject: New labs > > @ > <mailto: %40> > > > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > > Well, I just got back from my > > doctor's appointment. After being on Adrogel, > > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from 290 to > > 237. Yeah!! My first > > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep my > sense of > > humor about > > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. I > asked > > about shots, and he wanted > > to try another transdermal first. We settled on > a > > compounded one, 3% 100mg > > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. > When I > > asked about treating > > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the Testosterone > up, > > the Estradiol > > would go down. That doesn't make sense to me. > > > > > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be time > for a > > new doctor if. " > > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand up > comic > > routine. I guess > > the good news is I get to see my new primary care > doctor in > > about a month. > > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the problem. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 Ok as long as you know how to tell if your going down to low. Co-Moderator Phil > > > > > From: Wharff <robertwharff@ > > <mailto:robertwharff%40robertwharff.com> > > robertwharff.com> > > > Subject: New labs > > > @ > > <mailto: %40> > > > > > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > > > Well, I just got back from my > > > doctor's appointment. After being on > Adrogel, > > > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from > 290 to > > > 237. Yeah!! My first > > > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > > > > > > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep > my > > sense of > > > humor about > > > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. > I > > asked > > > about shots, and he wanted > > > to try another transdermal first. We > settled on > > a > > > compounded one, 3% 100mg > > > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. > > When I > > > asked about treating > > > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the > Testosterone > > up, > > > the Estradiol > > > would go down. That doesn't make sense to > me. > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be > time > > for a > > > new doctor if. " > > > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand > up > > comic > > > routine. I guess > > > the good news is I get to see my new primary > care > > doctor in > > > about a month. > > > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the > problem. > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 I do based on the Phil wood test. _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of philip georgian Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 3:15 PM Subject: RE: New labs Ok as long as you know how to tell if your going down to low. Co-Moderator Phil > > > > > From: Wharff <robertwharff@ > > <mailto:robertwharff%40robertwharff.com> > > robertwharff.com> > > > Subject: New labs > > > @ > > <mailto: %40> > > > > > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:10 PM > > > Well, I just got back from my > > > doctor's appointment. After being on > Adrogel, > > > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from > 290 to > > > 237. Yeah!! My first > > > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > > > > > > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep > my > > sense of > > > humor about > > > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. > I > > asked > > > about shots, and he wanted > > > to try another transdermal first. We > settled on > > a > > > compounded one, 3% 100mg > > > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. > > When I > > > asked about treating > > > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the > Testosterone > > up, > > > the Estradiol > > > would go down. That doesn't make sense to > me. > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be > time > > for a > > > new doctor if. " > > > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand > up > > comic > > > routine. I guess > > > the good news is I get to see my new primary > care > > doctor in > > > about a month. > > > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the > problem. > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2010 Report Share Posted March 9, 2010 , I was never on androgel or testim. I was on 10g compounded but I didn't seem to absorb it well. I'm now on injectable T and doing much better. You may want to find another doctor. Most of us here have done our share of doctor shopping. My advice to you is press this doctor for injectable T. Don't mess around with compounded T. Please keep us informed. Jim > > Well, I just got back from my doctor's appointment. After being on Adrogel, > 10g (8 pumps) for 8 weeks my total T went from 290 to 237. Yeah!! My first > Estradiol test was 59. Yeah!! > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm trying to keep my sense of humor about > this. My doctor wanted to try Testim. I asked about shots, and he wanted > to try another transdermal first. We settled on a compounded one, 3% 100mg > per day for 6 weeks then back to the doctor. When I asked about treating > the Estradiol, he said that if we got the Testosterone up, the Estradiol > would go down. That doesn't make sense to me. > > > > I think we need to start a list of " It might be time for a new doctor if. " > Perhaps we can turn it into a calendar or a stand up comic routine. I guess > the good news is I get to see my new primary care doctor in about a month. > The endo sure doesn't seem to be helping the problem. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 > > > > > > Vaiisking I must say I don't know how you live with > > them levels. Your low TT with LH and FSH on the low > > side tells me your Pituitary is not working right. > > > As for your % of Free T it would help if you tested > > your SHBG levels this might be very low. > > > > > > Or it's your high Estradiol levels doing this. > > If you can get your Estradiol levels lower your TT might > > come up some 200 to 300 Points. Higher levels of > > Estradiol in men looks to the brain like it high > > Testosterone and the brain slows down sending the LH and FSH > > messages to the Testis to make more Testosterone. So > > you can try getting this down taking Arimidex .25 mgs every > > 3 days of get the supplement indolplex/DIM to bring it > > down. > > > > > > Do you get involuntary nocturnal erections that > > appear during REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep if not your > > Estradiol levels might be the problem. > > > > > > > > Phil, > > I get morning wood occasionally and REM is probably not > > happening with me because I have to take Remeron to sleep or > > I don't sleep. What level is recommended for Estradiol? With > > my level, which of the two meds to you suggest? > > > > Thanks, > > V > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 Take your pick in the following copy of a file I made they all are good. ================================================== ALL ABOUT DIM. Sure here is a few links that are all about it. But there are a lot of Co.'s out there selling DIM that don't work well. Indolplex/DIM is the best it dose not get killed in your stomach when you take it. Diindolylmethane (DIM) is a stable indole found in cruciferous vegetables which promotes a beneficial estrogen metabolism in both women and men. http://www.dimfaq.com/index.htm in this link it's full of links about it. http://qualitycounts.com/fpdim.html http://www.jbc.org/content/278/23/21136.full If you have DIM in caps it's not Indolplex so to take this and to get it to work open the cap pore the DIM into a spoon add some Olive oil and take it this helps to keep it from getting killed in your stomach. The following is some links to where you can buy Indolplex/DIM. http://www.vitaglo.com/e5336.html http://www.vitacost.com/EnzymaticTherapyEstroBalancewithDIM/searchby-PN/searchte\ xt-dim http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.iherb.com/Enzymatic-Therapy-Pure-Rip-with-DIM-60-Tablets/12814?at=0 http://www.estrobalance.net/ http://www.easyhealthzone.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=PP0108 & click=71 http://www.nbizz.com/longevityclinic/listings/213.html http://www.drugnatural.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD & Store_Code=DMOS & Product_\ Code=156497 http://www.smartbomb.com/itindo9.html?utm_source=mercent & utm_medium=shopcompare & \ utm_content=itindo9 & utm_campaign=mbsdb & mr:trackingCode=C6AEFBD1-E681-DE11-B7F3-0\ 019B9C043EB & mr:referralID=NA http://www.ritecare.com/cgi-bin/cart.pl?db=product_db.dat & category=natural+medic\ ine & method=any_words & search=iti-75336 http://www.naturamart.com/phytopharmica-pms-formula-with-indoplex-120-caps.html How to take Indolplex/DIM take one tablet 120 mgs at dinner time it can take 2 weeks to 2 months to get your Estradiol levels down it’s all about how high you are in your levels. What you need to do is get this down to about 20 pg/ml. When you get this low your night time and morning wood will come back so strong it will wake you up this means most of the time your at your best levels or what I call the sweet spot. Keep taking the DIM but if your wood stops your going down to low so just stop taking it. The day your wood comes back go back on the DIM but cut the tablet in half. If your Testosterone was tested and low but your not on TRT get it tested again you might find your levels came up some 200 to 300 points. http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/3/1174 Co-Moderator Phil > From: <vaiisking@...> > Subject: Re: New Labs > > Date: Thursday, March 11, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > > > > Vaiisking I must say I don't know how you > live with > > > them levels. Your low TT with LH and FSH on the > low > > > side tells me your Pituitary is not working > right. > > > > As for your % of Free T it would help if you > tested > > > your SHBG levels this might be very low. > > > > > > > > Or it's your high Estradiol levels doing > this. > > > If you can get your Estradiol levels lower your > TT might > > > come up some 200 to 300 Points. Higher levels > of > > > Estradiol in men looks to the brain like it high > > > Testosterone and the brain slows down sending the > LH and FSH > > > messages to the Testis to make more > Testosterone. So > > > you can try getting this down taking Arimidex .25 > mgs every > > > 3 days of get the supplement indolplex/DIM to > bring it > > > down. > > > > > > > > Do you get involuntary nocturnal erections > that > > > appear during REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep if > not your > > > Estradiol levels might be the problem. > > > > > > > > > > > Phil, > > > I get morning wood occasionally and REM is > probably not > > > happening with me because I have to take Remeron > to sleep or > > > I don't sleep. What level is recommended for > Estradiol? With > > > my level, which of the two meds to you suggest? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > V > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Current thinking by docs that specialize in thyroid say TSH should be kept around 1.0, and if you have autoimmune disease, like Hashi's, you'd want your TSH closer to 0 to keep the antibodies suppressed. That would mean your current thyroid dose is too low, and by your labs, only low in T3, not T4. The optimal FT4 is no higher than mid-range, and your 1.3 is exactly mid-range. The FT3 should be kept above mid-range, how high is an individual thing. Mid-range with this lab is 325, DH and I personally feel better around 375+, so I'd say you're low. When your FT4 is already at mid-range but FT3 is not, that indicates a possible rT3 problem. In any case, you need more T3, and you could either add T3 pills called Cytomel, or go to the natural desiccated thyroid like Armour or Erfa from Canada. I believe Synthroid comes in an 88 mcg size, so it's odd that you're alternating doses. Cytomel comes in 5 mcg size, which you'd take more than once per day. Armour/Erfa would also be taken more than once per day, maybe 1/2 grain 3x/day to start? Were your ferritin and cortisol levels ok? I believe when thyroid is optimal, it makes the testosterone last longer, something to do with higher SHBG aiding transport of the testosterone. So by raising thyroid, you MAY be able to continue at your current dose of TC, or maybe even just increase to 80 instead of 100. Better yet, move the shots closer together than one week apart. Even 5 days would be an improvement and not give you such peaks and valleys. You are incredibly lucky to have a doc that's actually working WITH you instead of dictating typical endo nonsense. Have patience, things will definitely get better. Barb > > Hello Barb, > > Here are my labs as of last week. These levels are at 60mg of TC per week with 250 iu of hcg two days before the T shot. Also, the thyroid levels are at 75mcg & 100 mcg of Synthroid alternate days. > > Now I think I will have to increase my TC to 100mg per week. > > TSH (3rd Gen) - 2.6 (Ref:0.4 - 4.5 mIU/L) > > T3 Free 308 - (Ref: 230- 420 pg/dl) > > T4 Free 1.3 - (Ref: 0.8 - 1.8 ng/dl) > > My doc did not order reverse T3 & T4 for what ever the reason. > > Testosterone, Total - 599 (Ref: 250 - 1100ng/dl) > Testosterone, Free - 109 (Ref: 46 - 224 pg/ml) > Testosterone, Bioavailable - 219.4 (Ref: 110 - 575 ng/dl) > > E2 - 39, (Ref: 13 - 54 pg/ml) > > I will have another set of labs for Testosterone done 3.5 days after the Test shot only with 1 tab of DIM a day. > > Based on these two I will get my 3rd set then my 4th and the 5th set. > > So I will know what exactly is my dose and if DIM is good enough or arimidex is needed etc. My doc is really cooperative to order these many labs and review them. > > I appreciate all your suggestions. > > Thank you Phil and Barb and all others once again. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 27, 2010 Report Share Posted August 27, 2010 inc_100 your Thyroid looks better then mine and I am on 250 mcgs of Generic Synthroid some would say your still to low my free T3 is 305 my free T4 is 1.2 but if your Totals are low this means nothing. My Total T3 is 110 and my Total T4 is 9.8 free is a % of your Total I did not know this until I read about it at Dr. nco's forum. http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/index.php When did you do your labs for Total Testosterone was it the morning of your next shot if done before say a day or two you don't know how low your going before your next shot. We feel bad when we fall to low by the next shot. Your E2 is to high this is binding up your Testosterone so it not working. ================================ THYROID HORMONE: A useful target if considering primarily lab tests for optimizing thyroid hormone is the following: TSH <= 1.0 Free T3 between 3.3 to 3.9 Total T4 between 8-12 If at least one lab test is below these ranges, then a person may exhibit signs of hypothyroidism. T4 levels are important since the brain does its own conversion of T4 to T3. The brain compartment can have different T4 and T3 levels than the rest of the body. The brain and body are in two different compartments, separated by the blood brain barrier. In Alzheimer's disease, brain thyroid levels are lower than the rest of the body. TSH is not as important a measurement compared to measuring Free T3 and Total T4. If a person has some metabolic problem - including having heart disease, diabetes, low iron, etc. then the nervous system cannot function well and TSH will be abnormally low since the brain will have difficulty monitoring thyroid hormone and making TSH. Co-Moderator Phil > From: inc_100 <no_reply > > Subject: New Labs > > Date: Thursday, August 26, 2010, 7:43 PM > Hello Barb, > > Here are my labs as of last week. These levels are at 60mg > of TC per week with 250 iu of hcg two days before the T > shot. Also, the thyroid levels are at 75mcg & 100 mcg of > Synthroid alternate days. > > Now I think I will have to increase my TC to 100mg per > week. > > TSH (3rd Gen) - 2.6 (Ref:0.4 - 4.5 mIU/L) > > T3 Free 308 - (Ref: 230- 420 pg/dl) > > T4 Free 1.3 - (Ref: 0.8 - 1.8 ng/dl) > > My doc did not order reverse T3 & T4 for what ever the > reason. > > Testosterone, Total - 599 (Ref: 250 - 1100ng/dl) > Testosterone, Free - 109 (Ref: 46 - 224 > pg/ml) > Testosterone, Bioavailable - 219.4 (Ref: 110 - 575 ng/dl) > > E2 - 39, (Ref: 13 - 54 pg/ml) > > I will have another set of labs for Testosterone done 3.5 > days after the Test shot only with 1 tab of DIM a day. > > Based on these two I will get my 3rd set then my 4th and > the 5th set. > > So I will know what exactly is my dose and if DIM is good > enough or arimidex is needed etc. My doc is really > cooperative to order these many labs and review them. > > I appreciate all your suggestions. > > Thank you Phil and Barb and all others once again. > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.