Re: Healing naturally (IDEAS)

[Guest guest]

i run a natural foods dept and im also looking into the whole food connection. i

do have to take mtx and naproxin, but at considerly low doses. my goal is to not

have to ever raise the rx dose. by that i mean i do not want the disease to

progress. i feel the rx is dealing with the damage that has been done for the

past 25 years and it does prevent it from progressing. i wish i had been

diagnosed in my 20s. the damage cant be corrected but earlier diagnosis would

have been helpful. LOL. gluten is a big one. and foods with a high acid content.

but finding the balance..... thats difficult. any ideas you can pass along? oh,

lets not for get preservatives in general! the key i believe would be " whole

foods " and that is alot easier to comprehend. yogurt. i always feel better when

i eat alittle yogurt everyday. your digestive system plays a major role in your

health. also for the joint pain, arnica cream is awsome. all natural. stay in

touch! i do believe we are on the right

track. but you wont get alot of response from the regulars in this group. every

time ive brought up the whole food thing my post seems to just go away......

take care

playing basketball? good for you!

lorrie.

Seth Bates <cyberghost0072000@...> wrote:

Okay this post is for people that have been trying to fight this

disease (psoriatic arthritis) through more natural means. This means vitamins,

minerals, homeopathics, and especially eating the RIGHT foods. Unfortunately

western medicine isn't as well educated on how to treat diseases as most of us

would like, most of the medicines they give have alot of scary side effects

which i've been trying to stay away from as much as possible. I do take

Diclofenac, which is an anti-inflammatory which I have been taking for about the

last 3 years since I got this disease. Luckily through alot of my own research

along with my moms I have been able to figure out a few things about this

disease. I mentioned vitamins before but I believe the main thing that has

helped me is finding out what foods my body is sensitive too. I'm sure you've

all heard this case to, maybe you believe it maybe you don't. Take it from me

its absolutely true. Foods such as wheat, yeast, sugar, salt...

among others causes flare ups and psoriasis. *BUT.. and pay attention to this

part, I can eat some of those things I am generally allergic too as long as I

don't make it an everday practice. I do not allow these foods to build up in my

system and I can get back to about 90%. In fact.. I played a little basketball

which I wasn't able to do at all when I first got this disease.. I could barely

get out of bed for about a year! Every movement was hard, I could run about as

fast as a regular person could walk and I used to be pretty athletic. Well this

summer I played basketball a few times and I think I moved around better than I

did when I was a teenager! I am now 28 years old. Okay so now one of the MAIN

POINTS I want to make from what I've been learning right now that I believe has

been the cause for some recent imbalances in my body which have caused my

psoriasis and arthritis to slightly start flamin up again is not have the proper

ALKALINE and ACID balance in what

I am eating. On a per day average ALKALINE is to be 80% to 20% ACID foods. LOOK

UP THESE FOODS! This is very important its absolutely possible for anyone to be

pain free if they can cook for themselves and aren't afraid to give up some of

there old foods. Hell, I even drink beer from time to time without it effecting

me, and believe me I'd probably be in a wheel chair right now if it wasn't for a

TON of research. Now if anyone has any questions or can help me out coming up

with more ideas of what to do to strenghten are systems more to get rid of these

symptoms than please respond, recipes are good to, anything to get this forum

going in the right direction. People prescription drugs are not the answer,

changing your lifestyle is. Whats more important drinking a soda or being able

to walk around pain free? Anyway please respond and I'll continue filling in

ideas if anybody is interested:)

---------------------------------

Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small

Business.

[Guest guest]

Yeah its unbelievable that people haven't been discussing the only real way to

help yourself on this site, and very dishearting, its very hard to find

information pertaining specifically to psoraisis or PA. But I'm starting to

believe that alot of diseases can be treated similar, this is something that I

was discussing with my most recent naturopath, she actually had cancer and was

able to cure herself through the right diet and vitamins, basically when the

body is missing something that it alerts us by giving us these diseases, and

some of us get PA, some get cancer but the root of the problem is very similar,

and that is the American diet is throwing people off of balance. I'm really

starting to believe its all about the Ph balance though and there are things you

can look at to get that balance, I bought a book which gets into a little more

detail about what foods are alkalined based and which are not by Dr. O.A.

Pagano, I bought both his regular book and his

cookbook, both which have been helpful, I have never really used his cookbook

but I think that it would be helpful too. I'm sure your aware the benefits of

veges and fruit.. most of which are alkaline based and should be taken with

every meal, your body does need the acid foods too, but much more sparingly..

like I had said in what i wrote before about 80% alkaline and 20% acid... of

course your right your not gonna exactly do it right but just try to be aware of

what your eating that is alkaline forming and eat a LOT more of it, the exact

science I don't believe is totally necessary but you need to be aware of what

you are eating.. What you said about Gluten... absolutely true, and I have

problems with wheat, SUGAR, yeast, salt, spicy food... the thing is, when your

body does start balancing out you will be able to occasionally add these foods

into your diet, by occasionally i would say 2 times maybe 3 per week, just don't

allow it to build up in your system if you know

that your allergic to it. That book by Pagano can be found at:

http://www.psoraisis-healing.com

Psoraisis is generally linked to PA, I have both but I am able to keep it under

control, I take a small amount of Diclofenac which isn't nearly as powerful as

things like Embrel which I would never take. I know a guy who started taking

that he came over to dinner at my parents house to tell me the wonders of that

drug, he could now eat whatever he wanted all his psoriasis patches and PA had

cleared up within 2 weeks. About 2 to 3 months later, he had to be taken off of

that drug, his doctor found that it was killing his liver... the guy was in his

early 40's and he had the liver of an 80 year old. And as you probably know the

liver processes food and when it is damaged and can't process the food and the

chemicals that are in the food need to find a way to escape.. and it creates

psoriais or PA or other diseases (something like that).. i'm no expert and I'm

still figuring things out but I wouldn't listen to a regular MD for advice on

this matter. When I was first

diagnosed he said I wouldn't be able to play guitar for much longer, boy did I

show him! Anyway I appreciate you writing me and whole foods are good thing. I

don't know about the whole yogurt thing, I have had alot of people say that to

me but it didn't make me feel better... finding the right balance of Ph is where

its at.. then your body will be less sensitive, I think there is a way to slowly

get off prescription drugs and I will find it, its a slow learning process and

hopefully we can spark up some better discussions in this group that don't

involve killing ourselves with prescription drugs. Anytime you figure out more

ideas feel free to write, I'll write with more findings later. Thanks.

Seth

[Editor's Note: Many of us have NO food allergies, so following Pagano does not

help us. The Pagano diet does nothing to stem the progression of the disease.

You are free to choose your route to wellness, while others are free to choose

theirs. Some people are very wise to listen to their MDs instead of posters on

this site and instead of people who write books for money. Kathy F.]

lorrie lewis <danlorlew@...> wrote: i run a natural foods dept and im also

looking into the whole food connection. i do have to take mtx and naproxin, but

at considerly low doses. my goal is to not have to ever raise the rx dose. by

that i mean i do not want the disease to progress. i feel the rx is dealing with

the damage that has been done for the past 25 years and it does prevent it from

progressing. i wish i had been diagnosed in my 20s. the damage cant be corrected

but earlier diagnosis would have been helpful. LOL. gluten is a big one. and

foods with a high acid content. but finding the balance..... thats difficult.

any ideas you can pass along? oh, lets not for get preservatives in general! the

key i believe would be " whole foods " and that is alot easier to comprehend.

yogurt. i always feel better when i eat alittle yogurt everyday. your digestive

system plays a major role in your health. also for the joint pain, arnica cream

is awsome. all natural. stay in

touch! i do believe we are on the right

track. but you wont get alot of response from the regulars in this group. every

time ive brought up the whole food thing my post seems to just go away......

take care

playing basketball? good for you!

lorrie.

[Guest guest]

about the editors note. we are NOT saying no to the medications but additional

help to deal with the disease, reduce brain fog and increast energy. negativity

and stress. that can worsen the disease. yes it is a disease but it is possible

it can be handled. we should be able to give our info freely on this website.

and to tell what we are doing to feel and what works for us. you certainly have

a right to an opinion thats what this is for. but to encourage so much

negativity! my customers at work are mainly retired and are buying whole foods

and organics. i have seen people who were very sick slowly come back to having a

life.( i see this first hand.) and are slowly cutting back on there medication.

that includes RA, PA, and heart disease. it doesnt work for everybody but for

those of us it does work for let us talk. if this is a closed discussion group

or only for those with advance disease and who have given up and refuse to try

something new please let us know. we

should get up and be proactive and NOT be afraid to talk among ourselves. there

are probably alot of PA sufferers out there who are not willing to join in

because of closed minds or afraid of remarks like we just read. we are not

talking about FOOD allergies as in a category but about foods that may not be as

good for us as they once were. i dont have a food allergy. i can eat anything i

want.(except lima beans) LOL but i do feel a flare up with certain foods. im

aware of it and know what to do. we are not saying we can cure PA. but we can

feel better and have a rewarding life. lets use this group with an open mind and

allow others to do or say what they want. PA didnt exist 60 years ago. so what

has changed? and one more thing, we listen to our docs. that is 90% of

discussion on this site. but what about doctors taking care of progression on

this disease, and we take care of out bodies

lorrie

[Editor's Note: It sounds like you work for a health food store, is that

correct? If so, you are not exactly unbiased. Many of us on this site have

tried various food regimes over the years without any success. Some people,

apparently yourself included, have met with astounding success. Some people on

the list are able to lead almost new lives thanks to medications. Yes, PA was

not diagnosed as such a number of years ago, but neither were 90% of the

diseases we know about today. Medical science has made incredible advances and

we know a great deal more about genes, genetics, and a whole host of other

things that were unknown several decades ago. Ergo, to conclude that people

didn't have PA decades ago simply because science had no way of identifying it,

is sophistry and if that's convinced you that this is all food-related, I think

you may be way off base here. Oh, and how is it that by disagreeing with you

that I am negative? I could say that you are negative and close minded for not

agreeing with me. Levying personal attacks on me for the views I hold is not

only inappropriate, it is counterproductive. Kathy F.]

[Guest guest]

wow. im 50 years. i work grocery retail and belong to a union. ive

only been interested in whole foods and natural supplements since

being diagnosed with PA and im also conservative republican. im a

mother and a grandmother. i have had P since i was 4 years old and it

didnt go away untill i married. 30 years later im starting the P

again. i never said go off meds. if not for my meds i would probably

be bedridden most of the time. i dont remember having a day without

pain. i agree with you about how science has finally been able to

recognize this disease and give it a name. but 60 years ago people

were NOT sick all the time. (we will let this topic rest.)

you mentioned health food store as if it was a dirty name. i work for

a major grocery retail. my dept is a natural dept not a health food

store. my job is to help with making natural choices when buing food

and we were not talking about supplements. we were talking about

whole foods and foods without preservatives or additives. i do

believe in a body being in balance. did you know that foods with

additives and preservatives are not even allowed in parts of Europe?

only the fast paced USA. my choice is to add whole foods to my meds

for a healthy and positive lifestyle. PA is not food related. my doc

says it is dormant until something triggers it. we all need our meds.

but i dont want to increase the doses i take now. my body has been

warned. and im listening. and if eating whole foods and organics

works for cancer patients why not for PA

thanks for reply

lorrie

[Editor's Note: To suggest that people were healthier 60 years ago when, in

fact, both the infant mortality AND longevity rates were steeply lower than they

are today is just plain wrong. Where is the source of data you are using to

conclude that people were healthier 60 years ago? Pish.

You also made a most personal attack on me when you spoke of my being closed to

your point of view. How was I closed to your point of view when I allowed every

word of it to be printed without changing even a vowel despite the obvious

spelling errors? Allowing you to voice your opinion stifles you how? You also

said that I was negative because I don't agree with you. I guess if you can

draw the conclusion that people were healthier 60 years ago, you can also draw

the conclusion that disagreeing with you is being negative. It is not. It is

holding a point of view different from yours. Nothing more. Nothing less. For

your information, I am a cheery, optimistic person, who is also quite

knowledgable about this disease and I share my experience freely and without

financial compensation. Simply disagreeing with you does not make me negative

but if that is what you think, it is of no consequence to me, nor will it make

me shy to offer my opinions - just as I allow you to offer yours. I will NOT,

however, allow you to attack me personally again just because I disagree with

you. I am not here to take your snipes simply for not agreeing with you. It

seems to me that if there is a disagreeable person here, it is not the one I

look at in the mirror in the morning. Your views on how you choose to treat your

PA are allowed here, but your attacks on me are not. I trust you now appreciate

the difference. Kathy F.]

>

> about the editors note. we are NOT saying no to the medications but

additional help to deal with the disease, reduce brain fog and

increast energy. negativity and stress. that can worsen the disease.

yes it is a disease but it is possible it can be handled. we should

be able to give our info freely on this website. and to tell what we

are doing to feel and what works for us. you certainly have a right

to an opinion thats what this is for. but to encourage so much

negativity! my customers at work are mainly retired and are buying

whole foods and organics. i have seen people who were very sick

slowly come back to having a life.( i see this first hand.) and are

slowly cutting back on there medication. that includes RA, PA, and

heart disease. it doesnt work for everybody but for those of us it

does work for let us talk. if this is a closed discussion group or

only for those with advance disease and who have given up and refuse

to try something new please let us know. we

> should get up and be proactive and NOT be afraid to talk among

ourselves. there are probably alot of PA sufferers out there who are

not willing to join in because of closed minds or afraid of remarks

like we just read. we are not talking about FOOD allergies as in a

category but about foods that may not be as good for us as they once

were. i dont have a food allergy. i can eat anything i want.(except

lima beans) LOL but i do feel a flare up with certain foods. im aware

of it and know what to do. we are not saying we can cure PA. but we

can feel better and have a rewarding life. lets use this group with

an open mind and allow others to do or say what they want. PA didnt

exist 60 years ago. so what has changed? and one more thing, we

listen to our docs. that is 90% of discussion on this site. but what

about doctors taking care of progression on this disease, and we take

care of out bodies

> lorrie

>

> [Editor's Note: It sounds like you work for a health food store,

is that correct? If so, you are not exactly unbiased. Many of us on

this site have tried various food regimes over the years without any

success. Some people, apparently yourself included, have met with

astounding success. Some people on the list are able to lead almost

new lives thanks to medications. Yes, PA was not diagnosed as such a

number of years ago, but neither were 90% of the diseases we know

about today. Medical science has made incredible advances and we

know a great deal more about genes, genetics, and a whole host of

other things that were unknown several decades ago. Ergo, to

conclude that people didn't have PA decades ago simply because

science had no way of identifying it, is sophistry and if that's

convinced you that this is all food-related, I think you may be way

off base here. Oh, and how is it that by disagreeing with you that I

am negative? I could say that you are negative and close minded for

not agreeing with me. Levying personal attacks on me for the views I

hold is not only inappropriate, it is counterproductive. Kathy F.]

>

[Guest guest]

Well I'm going to jump in here. I was under the impression that

this group (of over 2000 members was primarily focused on educating

each other on the numerous life-altering drugs that are available to

us today. I researched groups before I joined this one. There ARE

other groups that focus on a more natural approach to treatment if

someone is interested in that. I personally eat a very healthy diet

centered around whole foods (ok...and chocolate) and have done so

since the 80s. I determined then not to be at fault for my illness

and began doing my part in making myself as healthy as I could. It

was not enough though I still believe in feeding my body foods that

will help it. The medications are what has made me human and

functional when I was on them. That is why I am in this group. I too

am not so sure about certain diseases not being around 60 years ago.

It seems more likely to me that they just went undiagnosed. What was

not around 60 years ago was the machines and diagnostic tools we now

use to view the inner workings of our bodies. There was much more

guess work done. It was not that long ago that strep throat could

kill you...or a UTI for all that matters. Life expectancy was

certainly lower and quality of life was diminished for those who

were ill unless my history books were all a big scam. I have never

known Kathy to be anything other than positive and a wealth of

information. How she has the time to do this job, I'll never

understand especially since she, like most of us does not feel well

much of the time. Without our medications, many of us in this group

would be bedridden. Kathy for one. I think that it's important for

us to seek out groups that share our point of view rather than

trying to convert others in the group. has MANY groups and

it's easy to start one. Just as you might not have much in common

with a group about Underwater Basket Weaving, you might not have

much in common with this one either Lorrie. Of course all are

welcome unless you are seeking to use this site to sell a product.

But we DO focus on prescription medications here. So maybe you might

want to consider using this group to gain knowledge on your

prescription medications and another group to share your findings

and experience on whole and organic foods. Just a friendly

suggestion. I do think it's best for a group to not be spread all

over the place. Very little gets done when the focus is wide. Those

are my ideas....- Betz

> >

> > about the editors note. we are NOT saying no to the medications

but

> additional help to deal with the disease, reduce brain fog and

> increast energy. negativity and stress. that can worsen the

disease.

> yes it is a disease but it is possible it can be handled. we

should

> be able to give our info freely on this website. and to tell what

we

> are doing to feel and what works for us. you certainly have a right

> to an opinion thats what this is for. but to encourage so much

> negativity! my customers at work are mainly retired and are buying

> whole foods and organics. i have seen people who were very sick

> slowly come back to having a life.( i see this first hand.) and are

> slowly cutting back on there medication. that includes RA, PA, and

> heart disease. it doesnt work for everybody but for those of us it

> does work for let us talk. if this is a closed discussion group or

> only for those with advance disease and who have given up and

refuse

> to try something new please let us know. we

> > should get up and be proactive and NOT be afraid to talk among

> ourselves. there are probably alot of PA sufferers out there who

are

> not willing to join in because of closed minds or afraid of remarks

> like we just read. we are not talking about FOOD allergies as in a

> category but about foods that may not be as good for us as they

once

> were. i dont have a food allergy. i can eat anything i want.(except

> lima beans) LOL but i do feel a flare up with certain foods. im

aware

> of it and know what to do. we are not saying we can cure PA. but we

> can feel better and have a rewarding life. lets use this group with

> an open mind and allow others to do or say what they want. PA didnt

> exist 60 years ago. so what has changed? and one more thing, we

> listen to our docs. that is 90% of discussion on this site. but

what

> about doctors taking care of progression on this disease, and we

take

> care of out bodies

> > lorrie

> >

> > [Editor's Note: It sounds like you work for a health food store,

> is that correct? If so, you are not exactly unbiased. Many of us

on

> this site have tried various food regimes over the years without

any

> success. Some people, apparently yourself included, have met with

> astounding success. Some people on the list are able to lead

almost

> new lives thanks to medications. Yes, PA was not diagnosed as

such a

> number of years ago, but neither were 90% of the diseases we know

> about today. Medical science has made incredible advances and we

> know a great deal more about genes, genetics, and a whole host of

> other things that were unknown several decades ago. Ergo, to

> conclude that people didn't have PA decades ago simply because

> science had no way of identifying it, is sophistry and if that's

> convinced you that this is all food-related, I think you may be way

> off base here. Oh, and how is it that by disagreeing with you

that I

> am negative? I could say that you are negative and close minded

for

> not agreeing with me. Levying personal attacks on me for the

views I

> hold is not only inappropriate, it is counterproductive. Kathy F.]

> >

>

[Guest guest]

To me, thinking that one can heal yourself with the right foods does

not make much sense. You can harm yourself with the wrong foods but

think about it...each culture has foods that are limited due to the

climate there. Not until modern times were we able to have access to

the wide variety of foods that are found in our supermarkets today.

How did our ancestors survive? Lots of questions....-Betz

i run a natural foods dept and

im also looking into the whole food connection. i do have to take

mtx and naproxin, but at considerly low doses. my goal is to not

have to ever raise the rx dose. by that i mean i do not want the

disease to progress. i feel the rx is dealing with the damage that

has been done for the past 25 years and it does prevent it from

progressing. i wish i had been diagnosed in my 20s. the damage cant

be corrected but earlier diagnosis would have been helpful. LOL.

gluten is a big one. and foods with a high acid content. but finding

the balance..... thats difficult. any ideas you can pass along? oh,

lets not for get preservatives in general! the key i believe would

be " whole foods " and that is alot easier to comprehend. yogurt. i

always feel better when i eat alittle yogurt everyday. your

digestive system plays a major role in your health. also for the

joint pain, arnica cream is awsome. all natural. stay in

> touch! i do believe we are on the right

> track. but you wont get alot of response from the regulars in

this group. every time ive brought up the whole food thing my post

seems to just go away...... take care

> playing basketball? good for you!

> lorrie.

>

[Guest guest]

People prescription

> drugs are not the answer, changing your lifestyle

> is.

--- Seth Bates <cyberghost0072000@...> wrote:

Hi Seth:

I agree that lifestyle changes can be the answer, but

for some those changes alone aren't enough. Some

people do benefit from the drug protocols and

shouldn't be encouraged to rule out those treatments.

That said, I'm also proof that changing my lifestyle

has made some dramatic changes in the way I feel from

day to day. I had my annual physical with my family dr

last week, and he was thrilled to see how well I'm

doing (last year at the annual he told me that at some

point in the next couple of years I'd have to see the

writing on the wall and admit that I'm disabled).

Here's what works for me:

1) working part-time (25 hours/week) so I don't get

overtired and have time to rest in the afternoon. I

need a lot more rest than I used to an am usually in

bed by 8:00 p.m. to rise at 6:30 a.m. When resting,

I'm applying heat or ice to my back, neck and jaw,

which are the areas still bothering me.

2) setting aside time, at least an hour a day to

gently stretch, do range of motion and a combination

of yoga and weight training to benefit my muscles and

joints.

3) avoiding sugar, white flour, pasta, and fats.

4) making sure I eat at least 2 fruits and 6 veggies a

day.

5) taking plaquenil and mobic.

After 4 years of hobbling around my feet are 90%

improved. My hands are no longer swollen, red and

painful claws. My blood pressure was excellent and I'm

going to be tapering off the b.p. medication as well

as Tricor (which was for high triglycerides). I've

also lost 11 pounds. I feel great, and friends, family

and co-workers have commented on the difference.

Now, I'm a bit superstitious about saying the " r "

word, and even my dr was cautious about going there,

but if feels so good to feel good again...I'm hoping

that this will last...but I don't think I would have

gotten here without the plaquenil (which was the 4th

med I've tried in 5 years since diagnosis).

This has gotten lengthy, and I've probably lost most

of you by now, so I'll close by saying that I believe

that each and everyone of us are unique, but we owe it

to ourselves to try to find the right combination that

works for us, whether it be through traditional or

non-traditional means. I've shared what works for me,

but can't say that this is the " magic potion " to get

PA under control. Certainly anyone can benefit from

improving their diet, but I don't believe that

everyone would see an improvement in their PA through

dietary improvements alone.

warm blessings,

jane

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Ok ...since you did not read Lorrie's posts, I'll let ya live.

lol (truthfully, I would not have the energy to hit you with a wet

noodle right now so you are safe). I feel that it is fine to

disagree as long as we don't bash or berate each other. Lorrie's

posts were a bit abrasive. We DO share healthy lifestyle tips on

here and things other than medications that help to ease our pain

and boost our level of health and we SHOULD do that. But we are

aware of the fact that there is no cure as Kathy mentioned. I

believe us to be about controlling the disease to the best of our

ability and helping each other to do that in a group setting is the

mechanism. Dang...I wish I had your ability to effectively

communicate what I wish to say. Could you coach me??? Love Betz---

In , wenko kadber <pastoork@...>

wrote:

>

> Betz: Glad to see you in a figting spirit, that may be good to

raise your blood pressure.

>

> I admit that I did not read Lorrie's email. I disagree with you

Betz however, about the focus of this group. My impression is that

ANY experience related to PA is welcome to be shared.

>

> About people were healthier 60 years ago, it may be true. The

available treatments were not as good then as now. Sick people who

can be treated now, used to die. Hence, the life span was shorter.

The chances of a sick person surviving now is much greater than it

is then. The percentage of sick people surviving now on medication

is much greater that it was then. One may conclude that it is

probably true that in primitive societies people are healthier than

in nadvanced societies now.

>

> What is the percentage of the cost of health care that is spend

on the last three months of people's life? I forgot the number but

it is unbelievably high when I heard it mentioned first.

>

> Hey Betz, finally, I find something that I disagree with you

about.

> Kathy F.: Are you pretending that you are upset so that we

doubt your sainthood? :-)

>

> Hi Brent.

>

>

>

> [Editor's Note: Hi, . Probably one of the few things that

really gets me going is people who claim to have the " CURE " . That

is what was initially being stated so I challenged the validity of

that statement. I was also accused of being negative merely because

I disagreed with a poster and said so. You have met me in person,

as has Betz who has become a friend, and I think you both know that

I laugh easily, am positive and upbeat, and I try to give more than

I take. For someone, therefore, who hasn't a clue what I am like to

label me as negative is an insult but I realize that it says a lot

more about the person who said it than it ever could about me. It

is great to see you posting again, , and we always value your

insights and opinions. Kathy F. (the moderator formerly known

as " the saint " .]

>

>

[Guest guest]

Seth to feel that you are in control of this disease is a wonderful

thing and if you can feel that way then I can only encourage you to

do what you believe is right for your body. I think that the loss of

our sense of control is perhaps one of the greatest losses anyone

experiences with disease. I just hate to see you encouraging others

to believe in a " cure " for PA. I don't want to see people I have

come to care for have their hopes raised just to see them crash down

to earth. I would love to see diet ideas of things that you feel

have helped you but cringe when I read that we can cure ourselves. I

myself need to see hard facts, legitimate statistics and credible

references before I can believe in so much as a diet plan. I need

more than personal testimonies. I can get those on Home Shopping

Network. lol. Best wishes. -Betz

>

> Hi Betz, I can sum this up really quick, I'm living proof that you

can heal yourself naturally:) Drugs only cover up symptoms that the

body is having, and they create more problems. We do have access to

a great many more varieties of food that is true and thats why we

need to take advantage of those foods. The average life span of

people has been increasing but the amount of diseases are also

increasing, now tell me why that is? Because of the " American

Diet " , we live in a world of fast food, peoples are so

oversaturating their bodies with Acid based foods they we are

killing ourselves. There are people who can make it through life

like this because they just got the lucky genes that were able to

fight of the chronic diseases that many people are suffering. Okay

I want to give you a small example of why at this moment I am

feeling great... for lunch I went over to my moms house who is a

great cook. She made me the perfect balance of 80% Alkaline to 20%

Alkaline.

> That means I had a selection of about 4 different veges to about

2 different slightly more acid based foods on my plate right out in

front of me, now I haven't been feeling absolutely great lately

because i live on my own an d i usually don't have time to prepare

my meals as well as she does, but now a couple hours after I had

that meal I am feeling almost totally pain free. For someone that

has PA really bad and their body is totally imbalanced because of

improper diet they won't feel as good as me, I have been doing this

for the last few years so my body is pretty close to being balanced

so one good meal can sometimes just give me that extra push in the

right direction. And just for the record our ancestors didn't have

all the preservatives that we have in our food today, they were

faced with other illnesses of course... western medicine does have

some advantages, but you should consider more eastern philosphies on

how to stay healthy, if everyone started eating this

> balance from when their young I guarantee it would wipe out so

many illnesses, my parents who are both nurses say that 90% of

people they see at the hospital are there because of poor diet. I

completely understand your concerns because I had them today, I'm

here a living example of what eating healthy can do to save your

joints I have done many things to prove to myself that the right

diet does work.. for example... I will switch back occasionally to

foods that I know I do have a problem with- say like taco bell,

pizza, or other types of fast food.... it doesn't take more then

about 2-3 days for me to start breaking out in Psoraisis and for my

PA to start acting up again.. thats because all that food is totally

Acid based... I switch back to the right Alkaline diet and within a

few days I'm back to my normal self again! You wouldn't believe how

amazing this is, its all really trial and error and its easy to

forget certain things that made you feel better and certain

> things that don't... but I am absolutely shocked that more people

don't know the benefits of healthier eating and what that can do to

combat diseases. I hope this has been somewhat of help:) I'm just

gonna keep adding posts with more things that i have found help me

as they come into my mind including some of the Vitamins and

Supplements I have been taking. Also one last thing I just thought

of healing your body internally is not a fast process it will take

time it took me almost a year.. part of that is because I kept

messing up and finding out I was eating things that were causing

problems.. like yeast for instance, kept building up in my system

and I didn't know it was causing problems.. same with wheat.. and

these are common problems among people with PA or in general..

anyway thats all I got for now:)

>

> Seth

>

> [Editor's Note: There isn't an iota of scientific evidence that

indicates that disease is increasing but it is a nice claim to

make. Our ability to DETECT diseases is increasing but that is

radically different. You are just plain wrong in saying that

medicines merely cover up disease symptoms. Biologic medications

have been scientifically proven to stem the progression of the

disease. People do not cure breast cancer, brain tumors or hearth

diseases by changing their diets. Changing their diets may help to

prevent the disease in the first place, but it will not cure it. So,

Seth, you go right ahead and eat your wheat germ and cleanse your

colon and may you continue to enjoy good health, but please

recognize that the anecdotal experience of a few people is not

enough to convince most intelligent people that YOU have found a

CURE. Virtually all studies also show that 10-15% of people who are

given placebos (sugar pills often) show signs of significant pain

improvement. I suppose, therefore, that one can conclude that

placebos are a cure for most diseases. Without question, a person

who has a wheat allergy would be wise to eliminate wheat and I think

most first graders know that. A person with a nightshade allergy

should eliminate nightshades. However, it doesn't help a PA

sufferer who does not have a nightshade allergy to give up

tomatoes. As stated in my earlier post, a healthy diet is essential

to a healthy body. Duh. However, it is NOT a cure for PA.

Americans generally have very poor diets and high stress lifestyles

and eating healthy would undoubtedly strengthen their ability to

combat disease as would practicing yoga, chi-gung, meditation and a

host of other disciplines. Absolutely. However, I will not stand

silent and let people here believe that any or all of this

will " cure " their PA. There is NO cure for PA but there are natural

ways to ease symptoms and medical ways to stem the progression of

the disease. I don't claim that medicine cures PA, nor would I and

I do not like to see people claiming that they know of a cure

either. You don't have a cure. Be well. Kathy F.]

[Guest guest]

WHAT IS GOING ON HERE??? PRE-LENT????????

[Editor's Note: LOL - wattsa matta - afraid to join in? Kathy F.]

>

> Hi Kathy --

>

> Great idea. A bit of support, if you will. Ummm...I'm diabetic,

so I need to give up the chocolate except for on the rare occasion,

like my birthday coming up. Anyone else?

>

> Jayson

>

> [Editor's Note: YAY, ! I think chocolate on your birthday is

mandatory! I'll join in, too. About 2 months ago I reduced my red

meat intake to no more than two times a month, instead of having red

meat maybe three or four times a week (lunch or dinner). I've

replaced red meat with poultry or vegetables. Tonight, for example,

I'm making a delicious veggie stir fry that probably takes all of 10

minutes to prepare. OK, that's three of us, including giving

up Devil Dogs. Who else wants to hop on the bandwagon? Kathy F.]

>

>

> Re: [ ] Re: Healing naturally (IDEAS)

>

>

> well personally ...I think I will give up eating devil dogs

snacks . Maybe

> it will cure me of this disease. Maybe not . Anyway if I keep

eating devil dogs

> I think it may kill me. cathy from ma

>

> [Editor's Note: No joke, , maybe a lot of people in this

group who are a tad (or a lot) overweight should collectively agree

to give up something that is not good for them and replace it with

something that is good for them. If someone likes a buttered bagel

for breakfast, for example, replace it with yogurt in your favorite

flavor and some fruit. It won't seem the same as the bagel but it

WILL fill you up and be better for you. Would anyone like to give it

a try? Kathy F.]

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

" I wish I had your ability to effectively

> communicate what I wish to say. Could you coach me??? " I take it

that you are rediculing me here, because your communication skills

are infinitely better than mine. I LOVE ya neverhteless. Hugs.

>

>

>

>

> [Editor's Note: Betz can speak for Betz, but knowing Betz, I know

that Betz meant it as a genuine compliment. You BOTH communicate

your points wonderfully. Kathy F.]

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Stay in the know. Pulse on the new .com. Check it out.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes...that is correct. It IS good for your heart. It comes from a

bean, right? And I seem to recall a rhyme from my youth about how good

beans are for your heart. -Betz

>

> Chocolate? Did someone say chocolate?

>

> Is it a nightshade? no

> Is it a " raw " milk product? no

> Has it been cooked? yes

> Is it dark chocolate? yes

>

> Medically speaking, I must eat it for my heart.

>

> But I promise to keep it to no less than 3 oz a day. lol

>

> Sandy swOhio

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well, I feel like I've already given up my goodies! I can only have

one small serving of red wine each week, instead of every night with

my dinner. Boo-hoo. (Because of taking methotrexate...) I really

miss it, but I'm very glad to miss the pain I had before. Also have

mostly given up my coffee because it upsets my stomach with all the

meds I'm taking. Switched to green tea which doesn't bother me and

should have some benefits to boot.

Other than that, I already mostly eat fresh fruits and fresh veggies.

Mostly raw or some veggies cooked just slightly. Red meat only a

couple of times a month. Chicken or pork occasionally but mostly tuna

or salmon. Rarely eat sweets. Sweeten my tea with local honey

produced only 2 miles from my house. Other than the tea in the a.m.,

I drink water all day - 6-10 bottles a day.

And I was eating that healthy diet plus exercising 6 days a week for

45-60 minutes at the time I developed PA. Go figure.

cheering everyone on,

sherry z

[Editor's Note: Applause to Sherry. It's now Sherry, from MA, and

me. We need more company! Who else? Kathy F.]

>

> [Editor's Note: YAY, ! I think chocolate on your birthday is

mandatory! I'll join in, too. About 2 months ago I reduced my red

meat intake to no more than two times a month, instead of having red

meat maybe three or four times a week (lunch or dinner). I've

replaced red meat with poultry or vegetables. Tonight, for example,

I'm making a delicious veggie stir fry that probably takes all of 10

minutes to prepare. OK, that's three of us, including giving up

Devil Dogs. Who else wants to hop on the bandwagon? Kathy F.]

>

[Guest guest]

Sandy - I like those fake eggs in an omelette with barely sauteed

veggies - onion, red pepper, mushroom, asparagus, or any combo or

whatever is on hand - and a little goat cheese or a sprinkle of fat

free shredded cheese. My fave is young, skinny asparagus. Cut them

into about 1 inch pieces and stir in just a little butter or olive

oil until crisp-tender, then add the egg substitute. Add the cheese

and your fave fresh herbs last when the egg is set. Yummy! I make

mine with the equivalent of only one egg, so it only takes a little

veggie (not much prep time) and only a sprinkle of cheese and less

than 5 minutes to make. I usually use either butter or olive oil

cooking spray and a non-stick pan. Instead of toast or muffin or

bagel, I pair mine with half a banana usually.

Sometimes if I don't have any fresh veggie handy I use either

sundried tomato or roasted pepper - the kind packed in olive oil. I

put that in the pan first and don't use any additional oil - just

what sticks to the veggie is enough.

I have those omelets about twice a week.

Some days I have just fresh fruit salad. I like to make a fruit

salad every weekend with whatever fruits are available fresh. Keeps

in the fridge for days. I don't add any sugar or sweetener - the

fruits have plenty of sugar already. A little fresh lemon or lime

juice helps keep the fruit from browning, although the browning

doesn't bother my appetite any. I add a half-palmfull of raw

almonds or raw pecans or walnuts at serving time for a little

protein. Tastes like heaven to me and if you cut the fruit small,

you can eat it from a plastic cup with a plastic spoon on the run

while you're rushing around trying to get ready for work.

Another wonderful breakfast is to take some leftover grilled chicken

breast (I grill mine with lime juice and mesquite seasoning) sliced

thin - about 1/3 to 1/2 breast - and make a small breakfast burrito

on a small whole wheat tortilla with some salsa and either goat

cheese and just a sprinkle of fat-free shredded cheddar.

For something special, try poached fish for breakfast. Sounds weird

to us Americans but it's terrific.

And the standby smoothie is a regular at our house for breaksfast as

well as for energy snack. We use a protein powder, water, ice,

fresh or frozen fruit, and yogurt. Sometimes a few nuts as well.

There are zillions of smoothie recipes - just try a few hundred

until you find one you like. You'll need to substitute something

instead of yogurt - soy milk comes to mind, or whatever works for

you.

good luck,

sherry z

>

> I'm now looking for something equally healthy and awful to eat on

> alternating days. Any other ideas?

[Guest guest]

lol...sounds like a marketing scam to me. Brilliant. -Betz

>

>

> In a message dated 10/16/2006 5:31:52 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

> muddymeadows@... writes:

>

> But I promise to keep it to no less than 3 oz a day. lol

>

>

> This is good Sandy...I read something recently about that

new " therapeutic "

> chocolate that they are marketing (can't remember, starts with a v

I

> think??). It says its not really therapeutic unless you eat

several bars a day:-)

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

There are some delicious Spelt Breads out there. Kathy...Bread

Alone makes the best one I've tried yet and it's Gluten free! Not

all Spelt breads are...you have to ask or read the lable to be

sure. -Betz

>

>

> In a message dated 10/16/2006 4:36:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

> itsbetsy@... writes:

>

> WHAT IS GOING ON HERE??? PRE-LENT????WHAT

>

>

> OK...me too...hoping not to inflame the whole food as a cure thing

but I

> KNOW I do better without gluten. I've been thinking for a while

about giving it

> up again. I don't think I can do cold turkey again (did that for

a very

> tough year, though I was able to stave off serious meds and

dropped 25 lbs). So

> I'll cut back to no more than 3 servings of gluten (wheat,

barley, rye) per

> week. I'm probably at about 2 servings per day now...:-)

>

>

>

>

> [Editor's Note: People with gluten allergies naturally do better

by eliminating gluten from their diets. , you have now joined

Sherry, from MA, and me. 5 and counting in our merry

band. Good luck in reducing gluten again. If you are tempted -

we'll talk you down, LOL. Kathy F.]

>

[Guest guest]

You can cook for me anytime!!! -Betz

> >

> > I'm now looking for something equally healthy and awful to eat

on

> > alternating days. Any other ideas?

>

[Guest guest]

Hi All,

I know I'm chiming in late to this, but...

I think it's fair to say that we are responsible for our own health and

healthcare. All idea's and or drugs can be offered as suggestions, but

should not be taken as " gospel " or the definitive cure.

I believe, as with so many other variables of this disease, the cure or

at least remedy has just as many variables.

Sure, I'd love to hear about anything that works for someone. I may not

likely try them, but simply store that info for possible future use. If

I were like some folks posting on this site, still suffering from

constant pain and still searching for something that will help, I'd be

more likely to try other options. Maybe many.

I believe the wealth of knowledge of this sites members is an

invaluable asset. I want to read of your successes, commisurate (sp?)

with your problems and offer what little advice I can.

Stay Well,

[Guest guest]

> I actually today sat through a presentation at work on flavor

trends, and

> there is a trend now toward putting chocolate into makeup, lotions,

etc and

> claiming health benefits. Crazy...

>

That's horrible! My kids & I can't eat chocolate or we get ill

(gastrointestinal symptoms), and recently I tried to find soft granola

bars for snack time at school for my son's class without chocolate...

and couldn't find any! Chocolate is starting to be in EVERYTHING, and

it's really frustrating!!

-Marietta

[Guest guest]

I'd be a willing participant in a study if you wish to mail me the

required daily amount. I'm willing to forgo the risks involved for

the sake of science and for the better good of the group. Hold your

applause. -Betz

>

>

> In a message dated 10/17/2006 5:17:04 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

> itsbetsy@... writes:

>

> lol...sounds like a marketing scam to me. Brilliant. -Betz

>

>

> I have to go to the store and find the name of it...it is totally

marketed

> as healthy chocolate but says in small print somewhere on the

packaging how

> much you need to eat to make a difference in your health and it's

several

> servings, probably a full day's worth of calories...

>

> I actually today sat through a presentation at work on flavor

trends, and

> there is a trend now toward putting chocolate into makeup,

lotions, etc and

> claiming health benefits. Crazy...

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

ok.

His miraculous highness, the lord Hershey in Pennsylvania has several

products that are very good for us. The base is an extra dark

chocolate. The varieties include but are not limited to: plain,

bluebery nut,nut,cranberry nut, etc... It's available via large bar or

a variety pack of individual bars. The best result is obtained via two

squares per day according to the package directions. It's backed up

by verifiable research and I hope nobody ever ever disclaims it.

Other companies have producesd their own versions. I'd be more than

willing to participate in a project to determine the efficacy of any of

them.

[Guest guest]

Drats!!! I ALMOST bought one of those at the supermarket today. I

have driven through Hershey PA a few times. What a cool place. First

off...it SMELLS like heaven. And then there are these cool street

lamps that look like Hershey's kisses on a big stick. -Betz

>

> ok.

>

> His miraculous highness, the lord Hershey in Pennsylvania has

several

> products that are very good for us. The base is an extra dark

> chocolate. The varieties include but are not limited to: plain,

> bluebery nut,nut,cranberry nut, etc... It's available via large

bar or

> a variety pack of individual bars. The best result is obtained via

two

> squares per day according to the package directions. It's backed

up

> by verifiable research and I hope nobody ever ever disclaims it.

>

> Other companies have producesd their own versions. I'd be more

than

> willing to participate in a project to determine the efficacy of

any of

> them.

>

[Guest guest]

Hmmmmmm OK. I'll give up liver, asparagus, tofu and white bread. Of

course, I hate liverasparagus and tofu and have not eaten white bread

in years so I guess that would be cheating. I'll exchange one cup of

coffee for one cup of hot filtered water with lemon.

BTW, folks on any of the biologicals must be careful with the quality

of their fresh (raw) food. Consume nothing that has not been cleaned

well...and eat those packaged cut up fruits and vegies carefully.

[Guest guest]

Good point about the raw foods. I haven't discussed it with my

rheumy, but I already figured out that I probably better not have any

oysters on the half shell. I love them and this is a real sacrifice!

My favorite sports bar eatery near LSU has them on Tuesdays for 25

cents apiece! I can eat a couple of dozen easy, with a couple of pints

of Guinness stout. Nowadays - no beer, no oysters.

I've also stayed away from the raw sushi since I got this diagnosis

and started taking all these drugs. Another terrible sacrifice!

I'm I denying myself in vain, or am I correct in thinking these foods

are off-limits?

not sure I'll like the answer,

sherry z

>

> BTW, folks on any of the biologicals must be careful with the

quality

> of their fresh (raw) food. Consume nothing that has not been

cleaned

> well...and eat those packaged cut up fruits and vegies carefully.

>

[Guest guest]

I have had to learn to live without the raw sushi too but it's led me

to discover all the other varieties of sushi.....the cooked types and

the vegetarian types are quite good too. Raw oysters are something I

miss though....you can't replace that. I have a genetic iron disorder

and was warned years ago about a specific bacteria that does not hurt

most people but has a higher incident of being fatal to people with my

disorder as well as anyone with challenged immune systems. I ate raw

sushi and 25 cent oysters at my favorite outdoor raw bar in Augusta GA

for years and I guess I got lucky but once I was educated, I decided

not to tempt fate. I once had an idea for a raw bar.....I wanted to

call it S.O.B.'s.....Shrimp, Oysters, and Beer. Get your minds out of

the gutter. -Betz