Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!! Now: OOPS, CRAP!

[Guest guest]

I believe Pam is talking about people who go out in left field because they

can't stand not to put their two cents in on something completely off topic

which sets off a ping-pong ball reaction with others having strong feelings in a

separate direction and so on....it's just not helpful.

>

> This is a public issue Pam, especially for parents whose kids were harmed by

'health care'.? Aren't forced vaccinations going to harm our kids??

>

> How does this take us off task.? Isn't our job to support our

children/ourselves in getting well?

>

> Now, might the conversation get us into trouble is another question.? And if

so, what is becoming of our country?? And not just our country, but the world.?

What happens if only g-m food is available?? These are all important questions.

>

> Too bad for all of us that no-one questioned mercury being put into so many

things.? We've been like obedient sheep for too long, and look at the results:

epidemics of autism, cancer, diabetes, heart disease, obesity, just for

starters.

>

> Francine

>

> I *really* think this is too hot of a political button to keep here on the

public list. Could you take this privately? We will get way off task.

>

> Anyway, the only way we will see what really happens with the Health Reform

Bill is to pass a health reform bill. I just hope they do it responsibly. No

amount of rhetoric or promises or statistics is going to give us the honest

picture.

>

> Pam

>

>

>

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Politics is a tough subject to control. Of course the topic of forced

vaccinations is extremely important and I appreciate the information others

have, but not accompanying angry dialogue. I know we cannot avoid it totally

since everything is intertwined, but we should be able to recognize when the

topic has gotten off track and out of control. That is where I thought we were

and I wanted to stop it.

As you probably have witnessed, we quickly get away from the topic at hand and

move on to name calling, opinion and partisan bashing. The internet allows us

to say things we would never say to a person's face!

There used to be an Autism-Politics group that was set up just for this purpose.

And, yes, I can always skip the posts and not open them... but the base topic of

vaccinations is important to me and I hope to learn something.

Thanks.

Pam

> >

> > This is a public issue Pam, especially for parents whose kids were harmed by

'health care'.? Aren't forced vaccinations going to harm our kids??

> >

> > How does this take us off task.? Isn't our job to support our

children/ourselves in getting well?

> >

> > Now, might the conversation get us into trouble is another question.? And if

so, what is becoming of our country?? And not just our country, but the world.?

What happens if only g-m food is available?? These are all important questions.

> >

> > Too bad for all of us that no-one questioned mercury being put into so many

things.? We've been like obedient sheep for too long, and look at the results:

epidemics of autism, cancer, diabetes, heart disease, obesity, just for

starters.

> >

> > Francine

> >

> > I *really* think this is too hot of a political button to keep here on the

public list. Could you take this privately? We will get way off task.

> >

> > Anyway, the only way we will see what really happens with the Health Reform

Bill is to pass a health reform bill. I just hope they do it responsibly. No

amount of rhetoric or promises or statistics is going to give us the honest

picture.

> >

> > Pam

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> > Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> > Closer is Love than breathing,

> > Nearer than hands and feet.

> >

> > (with appreciation for Tennyson)

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear Pam and ,

I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what happens

if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows dmsa and

ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email that I won't

quote here except to say that the statements made by the president were

disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

Sincerely,

Francine

Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

Spirit with Spirit can speak.

Closer is Love than breathing,

Nearer than hands and feet.

(with appreciation for Tennyson)

[Guest guest]

Please feel free to talk about all of your concerns. My problem is when we get

angry with each other for our belief's and start the name calling and snide

remarks.

Pam

>

> Dear Pam and ,

>

> I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what

happens if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows

dmsa and ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email

that I won't quote here except to say that the statements made by the president

were disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

>

> I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

>

> This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

>

> Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

>

> Sincerely,

> Francine

>

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Let's hope this entire health care reform bill is tabled and replaced with a

real thoughtful and responsible alternative.

I agree with what you say. Contrary to what people might think from my other

post, I do not support this Bill nor did I vote for President Obama. I just

don't like it when we get snippy and snotty with each other... but I think the

topics are important to discuss.

Pam

>

>

> From: sunrose101@... <sunrose101@...>

> Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

>

> Date: Friday, July 24, 2009, 8:40 PM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Dear Pam and ,

>

> I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what

happens if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows

dmsa and ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email

that I won't quote here except to say that the statements made by the president

were disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

>

> I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

>

> This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

>

> Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

>

> Sincerely,

> Francine

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

[Guest guest]

That's not off-topic, IMHO abortion, birth certificate of pres., etc. is. I

forgot who mentioned these, so am not singling anyone out, just trying to

encourage staying on-topic.

>

> Dear Pam and ,

>

> I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what

happens if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows

dmsa and ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email

that I won't quote here except to say that the statements made by the president

were disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

>

> I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

>

> This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

>

> Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

>

> Sincerely,

> Francine

>

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Last night on The World Over on EWTN, they showed an interview with the

president stating he thought that old people should go into hospice care and

then be considerate of others (so they wouldn't be a burden)-basically it came

down to they should use assissted suicide. They also stated that the way this

bill was written that any baby that was diagnosed with down's syndrome, spina

bifida, etc. could be denied any kind of health care. Basically, there is

nothing written into it that there is any consideration for life and that

anything that is going to cost too much money will be treated, even some types

of cancers. Several European countries already do this and they were also

mentioned on the program. It is a very dangerous bill for Everyone.

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

>

> Dear Pam and ,

>

> I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what

happens if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows

dmsa and ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email

that I won't quote here except to say that the statements made by the president

were disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

>

> I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

>

> This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

>

> Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

>

> Sincerely,

> Francine

>

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

You are absolutely right! How can anyone know about it? It is over 1000 pages

long and they are trying to rush it through, like all the other bills, so no one

knows. I have heard that the House wants to wait until next session to look it

over and possibly write a new one, but the senate wants it passed.

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

________________________________

From: SHARON SMITH <ssmith0306@...>

Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 9:55:32 PM

Subject: Re: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

i havent said anything until now about this, but i could not agree more.

it is hard enough to recover your child, but now we worry about our freedoms to

choose therapies, or not vaccinate. not to mention our insurance coverage, and

the addition cost to those that carry insurance already.

this is going too fast and not enough is known about what is actually in this

bill. i for one have alot of unanswered questions, and apparently the president

himself does not know what all is in this bill.

not just my .02, but my fears!!

sharon

From: sunrose101aol (DOT) com <sunrose101aol (DOT) com>

Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

Date: Friday, July 24, 2009, 8:40 PM

Dear Pam and ,

I'm not wanting to get into name-calling and attack at all, and yet what happens

if the 'health care' decides chelating is inappropriate and disallows dmsa and

ala to be bought for chelating in autism?? I just received an email that I won't

quote here except to say that the statements made by the president were

disturbing and reminiscent of something even more disturbing.

I've probably said that I don't care about health care as long as it doesn't

infringe on our rights to choose and implement what kind, if any, we want; and

as long as it doesn't discriminate against or control children, the 'elderly'

and those perceived as 'disabled'..

This is a time for parents of those with autism to be awake and alert to

everything that is going on, and to be willing to speak up.

Am I somewhat uncomfortable speaking up because of retaliation (not from this

group)?? Yes.? Would I have ever feared that before?? No.

Sincerely,

Francine

Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

Spirit with Spirit can speak.

Closer is Love than breathing,

Nearer than hands and feet.

(with appreciation for Tennyson)

[Guest guest]

Just like the cap and trade bill, they haven't even read it. I agree with those

who say that we must focus on our children, but it doesn't take more than

fifteen minutes to call or write your rep and senators. With one, I focused on

the fact that they've opted out themselves and all federal employees out of the

plan. With another it was that I'd be forced to switch to a govt. controlled HMO

style health plan.

One party controls both the senate and the house. The only reason they have

pushed this thing through yet, is that people are educating themselves and don't

want it. They know how Safeway has lowered their cost. This isn't the only way.

And for those who have more time, you can ask others to chime in. I've enlisted

my parents who are on Medicare. The cuts to their program are severe. Maybe it

will be used to fund their mandatory end-of-life counseling sessions.

This is not about giving us universal access to healthcare. It's about

controlling every aspect of our lives. These public servants are out of control.

We've got to let them know that we are paying attention and that we don't like

what is going on.

If they truly wanted to help us, why did they vote no on bills or amendments

which would lift the ban on small businesses joining with other small businesses

to have larger risk pools and therefore lower their cost and provide more health

benefits? Why did they say no to allowing individuals to deduct their health

care premiums like corporations currently do? And why, once this thing in put in

place, will corporations ability to deduct the cost of the healthcare cost end?

The result being higher private insurance cost versus the govt. option. The cost

will increase for the corporation and the individual. At that point, the

individual or the employer will see the govt. option as the better solution.

" Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force. Like fire, it is a

dangerous servant and a fearful master. " Washington

>

> You are absolutely right! How can anyone know about it? It is over 1000

pages long and they are trying to rush it through, like all the other bills, so

no one knows. I have heard that the House wants to wait until next session to

look it over and possibly write a new one, but the senate wants it passed.

>

>

> Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

[Guest guest]

Since all of you are worried about your children, taking the time to do contact

your representatives will do more to help them in the long run than hoping it

will all go away. I'm sure there is way more to this, with the language they

use, that will end up harming them and ourselves and we can't even think of what

it could be yet. If you don't do anything now, you can't do anything later.

There are lots of groups and websites that have a form you can fill out that

will automatically send letters to your representatives and you can add your own

comments.

http://www.healthrevolutionpetition.org/

http://www.grassfire.org/

I can't remember where I signed my other one, but they are out there.

There is also a journalist who lost her job after she filed a lawsuit against

the government for the forced vaccine issue. You can watch the video here

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/07/23/Journalist-Accuses\

-WHO-of-Plan-to-Commit-Mass-Murder.aspx and her blog is here

http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

________________________________

From: orelindel <whatmattersmost@...>

Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 8:19:56 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

Just like the cap and trade bill, they haven't even read it. I agree with those

who say that we must focus on our children, but it doesn't take more than

fifteen minutes to call or write your rep and senators. With one, I focused on

the fact that they've opted out themselves and all federal employees out of the

plan. With another it was that I'd be forced to switch to a govt. controlled HMO

style health plan.

One party controls both the senate and the house. The only reason they have

pushed this thing through yet, is that people are educating themselves and don't

want it. They know how Safeway has lowered their cost. This isn't the only way.

And for those who have more time, you can ask others to chime in. I've enlisted

my parents who are on Medicare. The cuts to their program are severe. Maybe it

will be used to fund their mandatory end-of-life counseling sessions.

This is not about giving us universal access to healthcare. It's about

controlling every aspect of our lives. These public servants are out of control.

We've got to let them know that we are paying attention and that we don't like

what is going on.

If they truly wanted to help us, why did they vote no on bills or amendments

which would lift the ban on small businesses joining with other small businesses

to have larger risk pools and therefore lower their cost and provide more health

benefits? Why did they say no to allowing individuals to deduct their health

care premiums like corporations currently do? And why, once this thing in put in

place, will corporations ability to deduct the cost of the healthcare cost end?

The result being higher private insurance cost versus the govt. option. The cost

will increase for the corporation and the individual. At that point, the

individual or the employer will see the govt. option as the better solution.

" Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force. Like fire, it is a

dangerous servant and a fearful master. " Washington

>

> You are absolutely right! How can anyone know about it? It is over 1000

pages long and they are trying to rush it through, like all the other bills, so

no one knows. I have heard that the House wants to wait until next session to

look it over and possibly write a new one, but the senate wants it passed.

>

>

> Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

[Guest guest]

Yes Sharon.? Thank You for sharing your feelings and thoughts.? And what if it

becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care?? Again, I don't go to

doctors, and my daughter only the dan.? However, whatever anyone thinks of dan

doctors, they are brave.? What happens if we need a prescription for dmsa and

they aren't allowed by law to write it for autism?

It would appear that the president not only knows the purpose of the 'health

care reform', but approves of it.? I don't want to post what I read on the list;

however, it is apparently very reminiscent of another country's leader in

another time and place.

If anyone wants it emailed privately, okay.

Francine

Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

Spirit with Spirit can speak.

Closer is Love than breathing,

Nearer than hands and feet.

(with appreciation for Tennyson)

[Guest guest]

www.vaclib.org has info on a journalist (this journalist?) and legal filings to

avoid mandated vaccinations.

> >

> > You are absolutely right! How can anyone know about it? It is over 1000

pages long and they are trying to rush it through, like all the other bills, so

no one knows. I have heard that the House wants to wait until next session to

look it over and possibly write a new one, but the senate wants it passed.

> >

> >

> > Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know if it is the same but her name is Jane Burgermeister on my links.

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

________________________________

From: noaholiviaian <phaselow@...>

Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:45:14 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

www.vaclib.org has info on a journalist (this journalist?) and legal filings to

avoid mandated vaccinations.

>

> Since all of you are worried about your children, taking the time to do

contact your representatives will do more to help them in the long run than

hoping it will all go away. I'm sure there is way more to this, with the

language they use, that will end up harming them and ourselves and we can't even

think of what it could be yet. If you don't do anything now, you can't do

anything later. There are lots of groups and websites that have a form you can

fill out that will automatically send letters to your representatives and you

can add your own comments.

> http://www.healthrevolutionpetition.org/

> http://www.grassfire.org/

> I can't remember where I signed my other one, but they are out there.

>

> There is also a journalist who lost her job after she filed a lawsuit against

the government for the forced vaccine issue. You can watch the video here

http://articles. mercola.com/ sites/articles/ archive/2009/ 07/23/Journalist

-Accuses- WHO-of-Plan- to-Commit- Mass-Murder. aspx and her blog is here

http://birdflu666. wordpress. com/

>

>

[Guest guest]

There are a lot of things happening in this country that have happened in other

countries that have also lost their freedoms. We have lost a lot and it has

been set up that we could lose the rest of what we have very easily. This is

why different states are passing sovereignty laws and now the fed. government is

fighting them on that. The states are trying to get back the freedoms they have

lost and so they don't have to follow along with much of what the government is

pushing.

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

________________________________

It would appear that the president not only knows the purpose of the 'health

care reform', but approves of it.? I don't want to post what I read on the list;

however, it is apparently very reminiscent of another country's leader in

another time and place.

[Guest guest]

Commments interspersed!!!

>

> Last night on The World Over on EWTN, they showed an interview with the

president stating he thought that old people should go into hospice care and

then be considerate of others (so they wouldn't be a burden)-basically it came

down to they should use assissted suicide.

---->Gosh, I wonder if that includes him and his wife when they get older..you

can bet anything you want it doesn't. This is an elitist mentality all the

way.

They also stated that the way this bill was written that any baby that was

diagnosed with down's syndrome, spina bifida, etc. could be denied any kind of

health care.

----->Oh I be Palin loved that one!!!!! And what about Obama

wanting to have another baby....would their baby be euthanized or denied meds if

it were downs or some of the other issues that happen to older moms sometimes?

Basically, there is nothing written into it that there is any consideration

for life and that anything that is going to cost too much money will be treated,

even some types of cancers. Several European countries already do this and they

were also mentioned on the program. It is a very dangerous bill for Everyone.

This is all part of the elitist mentality...that the common aren't worth

anything and life is only worth helping if you happen to be one of the elite!!

Life shows us a lot of lessons thru the unfortunately uncomfortable things...we

seem to be like mushrooms...growing best in the dark and shitty places!!! Sorry

bad language...but it sure seems to be true...and with out the places we seem to

not grow and stretch and become our best...no I am not advocating pain and

suffering..I am just saying that we need a little of the hard times to help us

grow and appreciate the better times...and the elitists have a totally different

agenda for us...and themselves.

jmho

Ronni

[Guest guest]

> And what if it becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care??

Which both HillaryCare and ObamaCare would do.

HillaryCare would have made it a felony with 5 years in prison for the doctor to

Rx or you to take an Rx for anything Barrett of QuackWatch didn't

approve of (he wasn't named, he was the guy who wrote the first draft of the

bill and spelled out the conditions of what could and couldn't be Rx'd).

Luckily this did not pass as I would have died a few years later because of it.

ObamaCare isn't YET spelling out that it is a felony, but is creating a National

Socialist Administrative health care agency to decide what are " good, "

" effective, " etc therapies that doctors ought to Rx, and what are " bad, "

" unproven, " " not up to date, " " inappropriate, " etc. therapeis that they should

not Rx. This will be done by using the same criteria the head Quack (Barrett)

spelled out in HillaryCare.

Quite understandably, once this passes there will be licensing board

enforcement, medicare fraud prosecutions, etc. based on it.

Some of your children may die. Most will be condemned to remain autistic with

no hope of recovery.

Caring doctors (of the sort Mrs. O'Rourke discusses in an earlier post) will

still exist, will still be decent people, and will still try to do the right

thing. It will just become harder and harder for them to do and fewer will do

it.

Many of you have heard useful bits of information about this at various times

but let me lay it out: how government health care has already punished the very

doctors who give your child hope.

Holmes - massive audit by Tricare (military insurance) and others to take back

all monies ever received for seeing autistic children and trying to help them.

Bradstreet - charged with medicare fraud for trying to help autistic children.

Cave - harassed by her licensing board (and left with a $100,000 legal bill) for

daring to write a book critical of vaccinations (

www.noamalgam.com/vaccinations.html )

the list goes on and on.

I absolutely agree that health insurance companies are as a rule evil in trying

to deny valid claims just to keep more money. However this does not excuse

creating a far more evil system as Hillary Clinton proposed, and Obama now

proposes.

Remember, Hillary Clinton is the single person most responsible for turning your

children autistic - even though HillaryCare failed to be enacted, she devoted

her energies to making sure that more and more vaccines were given at younger

and younger ages. She was successful in this. It resulted in today's autism

epidemic. Hopefully Obamacare will both fail and NOT leave such a devastating

legacy.

Andy

PS

[Guest guest]

I hate politics. I generally don't bother to read anything in threads like

these. Just wanted to toss out this:

" That government is best which governs least. "

-- Paine

Carry on.

Michele

http://www.healthgazelle.com

http://www.kidslikemine.com

http://www.solanorail.com

>

> > And what if it becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care??

>

> Which both HillaryCare and ObamaCare would do.

>

> HillaryCare would have made it a felony with 5 years in prison for the doctor

to Rx or you to take an Rx for anything Barrett of QuackWatch didn't

approve of (he wasn't named, he was the guy who wrote the first draft of the

bill and spelled out the conditions of what could and couldn't be Rx'd).

>

> Luckily this did not pass as I would have died a few years later because of

it.

>

> ObamaCare isn't YET spelling out that it is a felony, but is creating a

National Socialist Administrative health care agency to decide what are " good, "

" effective, " etc therapies that doctors ought to Rx, and what are " bad, "

" unproven, " " not up to date, " " inappropriate, " etc. therapeis that they should

not Rx. This will be done by using the same criteria the head Quack (Barrett)

spelled out in HillaryCare.

[Guest guest]

Wow, I had no idea, thank you for filling us in, well stated.

>

> > And what if it becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care??

>

> Which both HillaryCare and ObamaCare would do.

>

> HillaryCare would have made it a felony with 5 years in prison for the doctor

to Rx or you to take an Rx for anything Barrett of QuackWatch didn't

approve of (he wasn't named, he was the guy who wrote the first draft of the

bill and spelled out the conditions of what could and couldn't be Rx'd).

>

> Luckily this did not pass as I would have died a few years later because of

it.

>

> ObamaCare isn't YET spelling out that it is a felony, but is creating a

National Socialist Administrative health care agency to decide what are " good, "

" effective, " etc therapies that doctors ought to Rx, and what are " bad, "

" unproven, " " not up to date, " " inappropriate, " etc. therapeis that they should

not Rx. This will be done by using the same criteria the head Quack (Barrett)

spelled out in HillaryCare.

>

> Quite understandably, once this passes there will be licensing board

enforcement, medicare fraud prosecutions, etc. based on it.

>

> Some of your children may die. Most will be condemned to remain autistic with

no hope of recovery.

>

> Caring doctors (of the sort Mrs. O'Rourke discusses in an earlier post) will

still exist, will still be decent people, and will still try to do the right

thing. It will just become harder and harder for them to do and fewer will do

it.

>

> Many of you have heard useful bits of information about this at various times

but let me lay it out: how government health care has already punished the very

doctors who give your child hope.

>

> Holmes - massive audit by Tricare (military insurance) and others to take back

all monies ever received for seeing autistic children and trying to help them.

>

> Bradstreet - charged with medicare fraud for trying to help autistic children.

>

> Cave - harassed by her licensing board (and left with a $100,000 legal bill)

for daring to write a book critical of vaccinations (

www.noamalgam.com/vaccinations.html )

>

> the list goes on and on.

>

> I absolutely agree that health insurance companies are as a rule evil in

trying to deny valid claims just to keep more money. However this does not

excuse creating a far more evil system as Hillary Clinton proposed, and Obama

now proposes.

>

> Remember, Hillary Clinton is the single person most responsible for turning

your children autistic - even though HillaryCare failed to be enacted, she

devoted her energies to making sure that more and more vaccines were given at

younger and younger ages. She was successful in this. It resulted in today's

autism epidemic. Hopefully Obamacare will both fail and NOT leave such a

devastating legacy.

>

> Andy

>

> PS

>

[Guest guest]

Amen andy!

From: andrewhallcutler <AndyCutler@...>

Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

Date: Saturday, July 25, 2009, 4:43 PM

 

> And what if it becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care??

Which both HillaryCare and ObamaCare would do.

HillaryCare would have made it a felony with 5 years in prison for the doctor to

Rx or you to take an Rx for anything Barrett of QuackWatch didn't

approve of (he wasn't named, he was the guy who wrote the first draft of the

bill and spelled out the conditions of what could and couldn't be Rx'd).

Luckily this did not pass as I would have died a few years later because of it.

ObamaCare isn't YET spelling out that it is a felony, but is creating a National

Socialist Administrative health care agency to decide what are " good, "

" effective, " etc therapies that doctors ought to Rx, and what are " bad, "

" unproven, " " not up to date, " " inappropriate, " etc. therapeis that they should

not Rx. This will be done by using the same criteria the head Quack (Barrett)

spelled out in HillaryCare.

Quite understandably, once this passes there will be licensing board

enforcement, medicare fraud prosecutions, etc. based on it.

Some of your children may die. Most will be condemned to remain autistic with no

hope of recovery.

Caring doctors (of the sort Mrs. O'Rourke discusses in an earlier post) will

still exist, will still be decent people, and will still try to do the right

thing. It will just become harder and harder for them to do and fewer will do

it.

Many of you have heard useful bits of information about this at various times

but let me lay it out: how government health care has already punished the very

doctors who give your child hope.

Holmes - massive audit by Tricare (military insurance) and others to take back

all monies ever received for seeing autistic children and trying to help them.

Bradstreet - charged with medicare fraud for trying to help autistic children.

Cave - harassed by her licensing board (and left with a $100,000 legal bill) for

daring to write a book critical of vaccinations ( www.noamalgam.

com/vaccinations .html )

the list goes on and on.

I absolutely agree that health insurance companies are as a rule evil in trying

to deny valid claims just to keep more money. However this does not excuse

creating a far more evil system as Hillary Clinton proposed, and Obama now

proposes.

Remember, Hillary Clinton is the single person most responsible for turning your

children autistic - even though HillaryCare failed to be enacted, she devoted

her energies to making sure that more and more vaccines were given at younger

and younger ages. She was successful in this. It resulted in today's autism

epidemic. Hopefully Obamacare will both fail and NOT leave such a devastating

legacy.

Andy

PS

[Guest guest]

Ronni, I love that line about growing like mushrooms!? It's fun when someone's

being real (as long as it's not hostility directed at someone).

You heard this stuff said?? It's almost like- not almost, it's the egregious

assumption that they are in power and can do and say whatever they feel like.?

Is there a video or transcript?

Francine

Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

Spirit with Spirit can speak.

Closer is Love than breathing,

Nearer than hands and feet.

(with appreciation for Tennyson)

[Guest guest]

same person

> >

> > Since all of you are worried about your children, taking the time to do

contact your representatives will do more to help them in the long run than

hoping it will all go away. I'm sure there is way more to this, with the

language they use, that will end up harming them and ourselves and we can't even

think of what it could be yet. If you don't do anything now, you can't do

anything later. There are lots of groups and websites that have a form you can

fill out that will automatically send letters to your representatives and you

can add your own comments.

> > http://www.healthrevolutionpetition.org/

> > http://www.grassfire.org/

> > I can't remember where I signed my other one, but they are out there.

> >

> > There is also a journalist who lost her job after she filed a lawsuit

against the government for the forced vaccine issue. You can watch the video

here http://articles. mercola.com/ sites/articles/ archive/2009/

07/23/Journalist -Accuses- WHO-of-Plan- to-Commit- Mass-Murder. aspx and her

blog is here http://birdflu666. wordpress. com/

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, I love the mushroom comment too!!! Hahaha, though unfortunately it's true.

Doesn't all this sound like the Matrix or Logan's Run? Just like all the other

facist/communist/socialist countries.

Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

________________________________

From: " sunrose101@... " <sunrose101@...>

Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 7:07:18 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: if not here, where?/President Elect Obama!!!!!

Now: OOPS, CRAP!

Ronni, I love that line about growing like mushrooms!? It's fun when someone's

being real (as long as it's not hostility directed at someone).

You heard this stuff said?? It's almost like- not almost, it's the egregious

assumption that they are in power and can do and say whatever they feel like.?

Is there a video or transcript?

Francine

Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

Spirit with Spirit can speak.

Closer is Love than breathing,

Nearer than hands and feet.

(with appreciation for Tennyson)

[Guest guest]

I don't know if there is anything around...I haven't looked...I learned about

some of this stuff some years ago...the elites are not a new group....just

getting bolder is all...

But serving notice....they may win the battle..but Jesus Christ has already won

the war!!

If I get a few....will try and find some references.

It is sad to me, that they want to destroy some of our best teachers...the old

and the young and the infirm. In most cultures...the old are revered....the

young are nutured and protected...as are the ill.. Our greatest life lessons

are learned

at the knees of these people...either by listening and learning or

by serving. Humility teaches that we always have more to learn and wisdom that

we can learn something from almost anyone, if we are teachable....the trick is

to sort the good from the bad...often we can learn great lessons from people

whom we do not want to mimic...we learn how not to do something and that is a

great lesson....

jmho

Ronni

> Ronni, I love that line about growing like mushrooms!? It's fun when someone's

being real (as long as it's not hostility directed at someone).

>

> You heard this stuff said?? It's almost like- not almost, it's the egregious

assumption that they are in power and can do and say whatever they feel like.?

Is there a video or transcript?

>

> Francine

>

>

> Speak with Him Thou for He hearest.

> Spirit with Spirit can speak.

> Closer is Love than breathing,

> Nearer than hands and feet.

>

> (with appreciation for Tennyson)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well if you're gonna toss that out then I'm gonna toss this out

" If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given

medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom. " Ike (Dwight D.

Eisenhower)

> >

> > > And what if it becomes illegal for doctors to prescribe alternate care??

> >

> > Which both HillaryCare and ObamaCare would do.

> >

> > HillaryCare would have made it a felony with 5 years in prison for the

doctor to Rx or you to take an Rx for anything Barrett of QuackWatch

didn't approve of (he wasn't named, he was the guy who wrote the first draft of

the bill and spelled out the conditions of what could and couldn't be Rx'd).

> >

> > Luckily this did not pass as I would have died a few years later because of

it.

> >

> > ObamaCare isn't YET spelling out that it is a felony, but is creating a

National Socialist Administrative health care agency to decide what are " good, "

" effective, " etc therapies that doctors ought to Rx, and what are " bad, "

" unproven, " " not up to date, " " inappropriate, " etc. therapeis that they should

not Rx. This will be done by using the same criteria the head Quack (Barrett)

spelled out in HillaryCare.

>

[Guest guest]

This is a pretty with-it list. I am impressed.

However, anyone kind of thinking Francine and and others are " out there "

really should watch Naomi Wolf's documentary film based on her presentation (and

book) here

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1_xocoCXM8 & feature=PlayList & p=04251AB28B01248B & \

index=0 & playnext=1) and you'll understand a lot more.

There's also another earlier homespun documentary

(http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=04251AB28B01248B) harder hitting in

some ways called The End of America: Tipping Point (Click " Play All " or right

click & open in separate windows if desired). p.s. the first link above, the

presentation has lower quality video and loads much faster than the enhanced

versions, links 2 & 3 here.

If you just want to read about it in 20 seconds, the sidebar of all the videos

(click More Info) outlines the 10 steps. These are the 10 steps which countries

always seem to take in their dismantling of Democracy and setting up of a

dictatorship like State.

And while her original lectures on the new book came out October 2007, under the

Bush administration, we can see that more and more of the parallels to

especially one certain European country, around 65 years ago, are certainly

lining up under Obama's rule.

The Left-Right paradigm is a falsehood & must be recognized for what it is, a

cat toy designed to keep us divided, distracted from the REAL issues....Naomi

Wolf hits the issues right on the button.

Liora in Beijing

>

> There are a lot of things happening in this country that have happened in

other countries that have also lost their freedoms. We have lost a lot and it

has been set up that we could lose the rest of what we have very easily. This

is why different states are passing sovereignty laws and now the fed. government

is fighting them on that. The states are trying to get back the freedoms they

have lost and so they don't have to follow along with much of what the

government is pushing.

>

>

> Einstein once said, " A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of the

truth " .

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> It would appear that the president not only knows the purpose of the 'health

care reform', but approves of it.? I don't want to post what I read on the list;

however, it is apparently very reminiscent of another country's leader in

another time and place.

>

>

>

>

>