Serotonin

[Guest guest]

I haven't tried serotonin, but you can get the precursers to it by

taking Rhodiola Rosea (vin). From the book " Arctic Root " by Carl

Germano, R.D. C.N.S. L.D.N. and Zakir Ramazanov, Ph.D.

" ...scientists have found that extracts of Rhodiola Rosea, namely

rosavin and salidroside, enhance the transport of the serotonin

precursers, tryptophan, and 5-hydroxytryptophan, into the brain. "

I've been taking vin for about 6 weeks and I've found that my

mood has been generally much lighter than previously and I've far

coped better with stress.

I think that dark moods may be also due to oxygen deprivation from

hypercoagulation (IMHO), and if I find myself slipping into one

because of pain or stress, I take Piracetam and Wobenzyme and an

aspirin. This makes a very quick difference.

Laurie Lassesen

[Guest guest]

Hi Laurie,

Does vin help with sleep? I noticed the morning dose wakes me and

the afternoon tablet of Rhodiola I took made me sleepy.

Al

Re: Serotonin

> I haven't tried serotonin, but you can get the precursers to it by

> taking Rhodiola Rosea (vin). From the book " Arctic Root " by Carl

> Germano, R.D. C.N.S. L.D.N. and Zakir Ramazanov, Ph.D.

>

> " ...scientists have found that extracts of Rhodiola Rosea, namely

> rosavin and salidroside, enhance the transport of the serotonin

> precursers, tryptophan, and 5-hydroxytryptophan, into the brain. "

>

> I've been taking vin for about 6 weeks and I've found that my

> mood has been generally much lighter than previously and I've far

> coped better with stress.

>

> I think that dark moods may be also due to oxygen deprivation from

> hypercoagulation (IMHO), and if I find myself slipping into one

> because of pain or stress, I take Piracetam and Wobenzyme and an

> aspirin. This makes a very quick difference.

>

> Laurie Lassesen

>

>

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>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/11/00 6:52:57 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

laurie@... writes:

<< Hi ,

vin is supposed to help the body make tryptophan, a precurser for

serotonin. vin can act as a stimulant, so I don't know about it

for bedtime, but overall, it has helped me greatly with excitability

and irritability, and I suspect also depression. I'm just more

mellow since taking it, at 300mg per day. 800mg per day or more can

have the opposite effect you would want, irritibility and insom >>

Thank you Laurie, I am also on the vin-only 100mg a day because it

increases my blood sugar drastically. What brand of vin are you taking?

The material on vin says it helps for hypoglycemia and since I have just

the opposite it is making my condition worse or else I would increase it.

Maybe its just the brand I am taking or something. That is interesting about

the OLE, I would take more of it if it really does decrease blood sugar.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/11/00 8:29:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

pcumming1@... writes:

<< Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor. The mechanism is not to increase

the

Serotonin but to hold of the Reuptake of the neurotransmitter Serotonin,

which

in effect acts like an increase in Serotonin.

SAMe is a precurser to Serotonin which may accomplish what you are asking

about more directly.

NOTE: People with Bipolar Disorder should not use SAMe

As far as the hypoglycemia condition, perhaps this book will help:

>>

I thought SAM-e increases Dopamine mainly not serotonin. Also, I am

hyperglycemic not hypoglycemic but thank you for taking time to write down

the info you sent.

[Guest guest]

What kinds of problems did you have with St. 's Wort? I suspect that it may

not be agreeing with me either even though I only take a very small dose. I'd

appreciate any info.

thanks.

I take 10 mg. of Amitriptylene; I used to take 40 mg. for years but slowly, very

slowly, weaned down to 10.

> -----Original Message-----

> From: lbinujrsy@...

>

>

> Is anyone taking really really small doses of an antidepressant like celexa

> or prozac just to raise there serotonin a little to help them sleep and not

> be as hungry? I am thinking about doing this. I can't take 5htp or st.

> johns wort so I am stuck having to take a " drug " to raise my serotonin

> levels.

<snipped>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

vin is supposed to help the body make tryptophan, a precurser for

serotonin. vin can act as a stimulant, so I don't know about it

for bedtime, but overall, it has helped me greatly with excitability

and irritability, and I suspect also depression. I'm just more

mellow since taking it, at 300mg per day. 800mg per day or more can

have the opposite effect you would want, irritibility and insomnia.

Also, you might want to try " Potatoes not Prozac " . The website is

http://www.radiantrecovery.com

and they suggest dietary changes to help with sugar, relative to

brain chemistry, as I recall.

I believe Olive Leaf Extract lowers blood sugar. I have to go

offline for a couple of hours, but will look that up when I get back,

I think I can find a reference for it, unless someone else does in

the meantime. OLE also helps me sleep, by making me drowsy from

herxing.

Laurie Lassesen

[Guest guest]

,

If you are taking a anti-depressant, like Celexa, to raise your

Serotonin level,

what is actually happening is that it is an SSRI.

Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor. The mechanism is not to increase the

Serotonin but to hold of the Reuptake of the neurotransmitter Serotonin, which

in effect acts like an increase in Serotonin.

SAMe is a precurser to Serotonin which may accomplish what you are asking

about more directly.

NOTE: People with Bipolar Disorder should not use SAMe

As far as the hypoglycemia condition, perhaps this book will help:

Stop the Rollercoaster :

How to Take Charge of Your Blood Sugars in Diabetes

by Walsh, Ruth , Lois Jovanovic-

http://www.amazon.com Price: $21.95

Paperback (December 1996) Torrey Pines Press

ISBN: 1884804829

This book is also available at the Diabetes Mall:

http://www.diabetesnet.com/

For $17.95

http://www.diabetesnet.com/str1.html

Good luck, good helth to you,

[Guest guest]

If you are eating a lot of cheese or aged foods with St. 's Wort

then you will be suffering a level of hypotension.

St. 's Wort is either an MAIO or an SSRI, it is unclear because

the herbal industry has not done the research to inform the consumers.

It is frustrating, and I don't mean to be negative at any industry group,

buy, jeez, a friend called me last week to tell me how much work he has

missed since starting St. 's Wort due to extreme headaches.

I suggested he go on the MAOI recommended diet. He did. He no longer

has any headaches and has not missed a day of work.

What does the label say? Nothing! It is frustrating.

Good luck,

[Guest guest]

on 7/11/00 8:16 PM, lbinujrsy@... at lbinujrsy@... wrote:

> Is anyone taking really really small doses of an antidepressant like celexa

> or prozac just to raise there serotonin a little to help them sleep and not

> be as hungry? I am thinking about doing this. I can't take 5htp or st.

> johns wort so I am stuck having to take a " drug " to raise my serotonin

> levels. This is very frustrating to me. I have high blood sugar (very high

> blood sugar that I can't seem to get a handle on) and antidepressants seem to

> help this a little bit. I am also it will help with sleep. Anyone??

Alpha lipoic acid is an excellent supplement for persons with high blood

sugar problems. It improves insulin sensitivity and has numerous other

benefits for both diabetics and others.

Also, the renowned Jim Duke has stated that only 1/4 teaspoon of cinnamon

increases insulin efficiency by 100%!

Hud

[Guest guest]

, do you know what the MAOI diet recommends?

I see an experienced, respected naturopath; I'm upset that he told me nothing

about SJW. In fact, I could only tolerate one sixth of the dose he recommended.

You're not kidding it's frustrating!

-----Original Message-----

> From: D. Cumming [mailto:pcumming1@...]

snipped

> I suggested he go on the MAOI recommended diet. He did. He no longer

> has any headaches and has not missed a day of work.

>

> What does the label say? Nothing! It is frustrating.

>

> Good luck,

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

Laurie,

If OLE lowers blood sugar, then it may not be good for those of us with

hypoglycemic problems.

Thanks,

C.

[Guest guest]

Hi -

I'm not taking an antidepressant but taking amino

acids has really helped me with feeling hungry all the

time. I take L-Glutamine and L-Carnitine twice a day

but the Amino Acid complex sold by Immunesupport.com

taken twice a day also helped me with this.

Best, Jennie

--- lbinujrsy@... wrote:

> Is anyone taking really really small doses of an

> antidepressant like celexa

> or prozac just to raise there serotonin a little to

> help them sleep and not

> be as hungry? I am thinking about doing this. I

> can't take 5htp or st.

> johns wort so I am stuck having to take a " drug " to

> raise my serotonin

> levels. This is very frustrating to me. I have

> high blood sugar (very high

> blood sugar that I can't seem to get a handle on)

> and antidepressants seem to

> help this a little bit. I am also it will help with

> sleep. Anyone??

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/5/01 9:51:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

jgoodlatte@... writes:

> What is MGN3?

Made from rice bran and two mushrooms, it is very expensive but has been

shown to boost NK activity by 300% or more sometimes. I suppose Cheney

doesn't use it b/c many patients are allergic to fungi? Cheney does use Cell

Forte which seems to have similar results as the MGN3. Which one's better?

Who knows. I just ordered 12 bottles from NEEDS for $39.99--they have it on

sale. They also have Cell Forte on sale right now. I ordered 3 cans of Cell

Forte too.

-

[Guest guest]

Hi Joyce,

MGN3 is a product sold by Lane Labs to improve immune function,

particularly NK cells. Used widely in cancer fighting and immune

boosting. Read about it at www.lanelabs.com

Some in this group have received benefit from using it.

Mark and

> What is MGN3? Joyce

[Guest guest]

There is a much more economical way to get the benefits of rice bran:

http://www.cfsdoc.org/superfood.htm

There is also a more economical way of getting Cell Forte:

http://www.cfsdoc.org/between.htm

> What is MGN3?

Made from rice bran and two mushrooms, it is very expensive but has been

shown to boost NK activity by 300% or more sometimes. I suppose Cheney

doesn't use it b/c many patients are allergic to fungi? Cheney does use

Cell

Forte which seems to have similar results as the MGN3. Which one's

better?

Who knows. I just ordered 12 bottles from NEEDS for $39.99--they have

it on

sale. They also have Cell Forte on sale right now. I ordered 3 cans of

Cell

Forte too.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Thanks for the below post. What is the suggested serving of this

homemade formula? Also isn't/wasn't the Cell Forte or original

mixture of inositol and ip6 used in the first study a 4:1 IP6 to

inositol ratio. I noticed your using a 1:1 ratio between these.

Thanks

Ps Your website is excellent!

> There is a much more economical way to get the benefits of rice

bran:

> http://www.cfsdoc.org/superfood.htm

>

> There is also a more economical way of getting Cell Forte:

> http://www.cfsdoc.org/between.htm

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

This is not an exact science by any means. You can use about one heaping

teaspoonfull twice a day. It is tasteless so you can just put it in your

mouth and rinse it down with water. I used more inositol because it is much

cheaper and has other benefits as explained, but yes the original mixture

was 4:1 and you can make it up any way you want.

============================

Hi ,

Thanks for the below post. What is the suggested serving of this

homemade formula? Also isn't/wasn't the Cell Forte or original

mixture of inositol and ip6 used in the first study a 4:1 IP6 to

inositol ratio. I noticed your using a 1:1 ratio between these.

Thanks

Ps Your website is excellent!

> There is a much more economical way to get the benefits of rice

bran:

> http://www.cfsdoc.org/superfood.htm

>

> There is also a more economical way of getting Cell Forte:

> http://www.cfsdoc.org/between.htm

>

>

>

>

>

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

Just be careful of the whole " Serotonin " thing. It is a word promoted

highly by psychiatrists who try to push their harmful drugs on people.

-----Original Message-----

M:

After WEEKS of reading these oatmeal emails, and ignoring some of them, I

finally GOT IT!!

This is sooooo helpful. SEROTONIN!!! That was the buzzword that just

registered w/me, plus - " helping you STAY asleep " (I wake up at 3:00am every

nite-very aggravating).

A big thanks!

:>)

Best wishes,

karenb

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/3/05 12:17:34 AM Mountain Standard Time,

SSRI medications writes:

> I don't think they do know what causes depression but I think they do

> know that Serotonin is low in people who are depressed so they use

> the simplest cause and effect rationale to deduce that:

>

> 1) if depressed people have low brain Serotonin levels then simply by

> adding Serotonin to their brains, then their depression should

> be 'cured'

>

Nope! They don't even know that for sure because there is NO way to measure

the serotonin in the brain while the person is alive -- maybe a spinal tap

would give you some indication but not really. And what they are measuring

usually is metabolites, not the actual serotonin levels, which can only be

accurately measured post-mortem by grinding up the brain and THEN measuring

serotonin,

and how much or how little is a person supposed to have???? This whole

theory is B.S. Pure and simple. And if it was JUST serotonin, why are there

ADs

that raise dopamine, or norepinephrine? And then ADs that raise a combination

of neurotransmitters? It's a shell game. And the only one who wins is Big

Pharma who makes all the money on the drugs, because once a person starts taking

these phoney pills they have to take other drugs, and then eventaully they get

some other disease, diabetes, heart problems, cancer, which of course

requires MORE meds. And so on and so forth.

" Blind Reason "

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/28/2005 3:30:09 PM Pacific Standard Time,

SSRI medications writes:

Maybe they're related. Maybe how much Serotonin you have anywhere in

the body is related to how much you have in the brain.

95% of the serotonin in your body is in your gut. Nobody knows for sure

just how much is in the brain, how much we should have, and how little is too

little. It's all smoke and mirrors.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/28/2005 3:30:09 PM Pacific Standard Time,

SSRI medications writes:

Maybe they're related. Maybe how much Serotonin you have anywhere in

the body is related to how much you have in the brain.

95% of the serotonin in your body is in your gut. Nobody knows for sure

just how much is in the brain, how much we should have, and how little is too

little. It's all smoke and mirrors.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/30/2005 1:14:44 AM Pacific Standard Time,

SSRI medications writes:

I enjoy your posts. Ann has said that about 80% of serotonin is

produced in the gut. She thinks that is why there are so many

intestinal adverse effects. I hope you have her book and if not get

it. Have you read, " Serotonin and the Pineal gland " at

www.antidepressantsfacts.com?

Hi, Jay -- Yes, I read Ann 's book -- years and years ago when I was

first researching this drug epidemic to write my own book Blind Reason. I've

also read what Charly wrote on the Pineal gland -- in fact, I think I either

edited that or contributed to it in some way -- I've done so much in the last

8 years I can't remember all the things I have done!!!!

[Guest guest]

Trina

My experience with SAM-e has been life-giving with NO side effects, just

continuing gains.

SSRIs work to recycle what serotonin exists, amongst other things.

In my case, there was very little serotonin to do anything with..... I now

also take l-Tryptophan and find that helpful, too.

Recent article on SSRIs indicate that they also impact the immune system.

mjh

In a message dated 2/21/06 1:00:28 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

tvpro36@... writes:

I was just reading something where Cheney said SSRIs fry your brain.

So do serotonin boosters like SAM-e do the same thing? Or is the

problem with SSRIs that they stop the excess serotonin from

being " vacuumed up " ?

Trina (formerly Katrina from California)

[Guest guest]

Trina and Dave

RIck put together a progression of supplements to help with the methylation

pathway based on the Pangborn book.

It starts with Magnesium and B6 or P5P for a few days or a week or so then

adds, one by one, other supplements.

I got lucky in that in 1999, I had been on fairly high doses of B vitamins

and had been on Magnesium (though not effectively) for over two years. Hence

I probably unknowingly had opened the pathways that made SAM-e such a

powerful ally for me.

I continue to work on the HPA axis stuff and recently posted Thyroid test

for folks to comment on and will have an AM fasting cortisol test in a month. My

daytime temperature at the time of testing was 96.9.

MInd you, I've been affected for almost 16 years and am just now getting

cortisol measured. I said to the Endocrinologist just this morning.... but

Licorice root and Siberian ginseng help me, does not that suggest something

about

the adrenals?

My other huge challenge is what I call scrambled brain syndrome aka

dysfunction of the executive function of the brain.

mjh

[Guest guest]

Hi, Trina.

" tvpro36 " <tvpro36@...> wrote:

>

> I was just reading something where Cheney said SSRIs fry your brain.

> So do serotonin boosters like SAM-e do the same thing? Or is the

> problem with SSRIs that they stop the excess serotonin from

> being " vacuumed up " ?

>

> Trina (formerly Katrina from California)

***Dr Cheney got his information primarily from the book called " Prosac

Backlash " written by the well regarded Harvard psychiatrist, Dr Glenmullen.

You can google the books name to bring up more background info..

***SSRIs force brain cells into an increased firing potential and for PWCs whose

brains are already shifted toward seizure this is not the direction we want

things to go is I recall Cheney's argument against them. I think besides

potential dangers of SSRIs there is plenty of anecdotal evidence and reports by

doctors who treat PWCs that they usually don't help and when they do its of only

modest benefit.

***SAMe doesn't force the firing potential but many PWCs, like I have in the

past, get uncomfortable side effects from it. Correcting ones methylation cycle

and doing what it takes to either replete or improve one glutathione metabolism

is a biochemically rational way to go to get ones body producing its own SAMe

effectively.

***The new book by Pangborn and Baker called, Autism: Effective Biomedical

Treatments, covers these topics, which apply to many PWCs, and how to go about

them. I think Amazon.com carries this book now.