Re: Banter on a new Endocrine doctor and an Urology question.

[Guest guest]

Just from reading these posts here at it seems the endo's don't

know jack about HRT. Aren't hormones their specialty? Aren't endo's

also quite pricey to visit?

>

> Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

> regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

>

> I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

> refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

> important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

> She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

>

> She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

> range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

>

> She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

> to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

>

> I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

>

> She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

> write down my srink number.

>

> I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

> normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

> isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

>

> How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

>

> =======================================================

>

> I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

> finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

> keep ignoring it.

>

> Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it

mean?

>

> Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

>

[Guest guest]

Elliot I hate to say this but you have the same problem most of us have a bad

Dr. any Dr. that would tell a man his Estradiol at 51 is low is sure full of it.

This is way you have no libido and it can give you ED. As for your prostate

problem getting this down to say 20 should take care of this. I had the same

problem when my Estradiol was high. I feel like shit when my Estradiol is over

30. Find a new Dr. go to the files section at the home page and read Finding a

male hormone Dr. then go to this link

http://www.tuneupyourt.com/

click on Find a Dr. then put in your state.

You will get a list of Dr.'s in your area start calling them and ask a lot of

questions like how many men does he treat for low T does he test for high

Estradiol and treat it with Arimidex. Also aks if he use's HCG to treat men

that are Secondary I know your not Secondary but ask this if you have found a

good one you will know.

Phil

Elliot <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

write down my srink number.

I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

=======================================================

I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

keep ignoring it.

Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it mean?

Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

[Guest guest]

Hello Phil,

If someone is not a patient with a doctor, What can he do to get past

the receptionist/nurse to talk to the doctor directly.

~Chip

>

> Elliot I hate to say this but you have the same problem most of us

have a bad Dr. any Dr. that would tell a man his Estradiol at 51 is

low is sure full of it. This is way you have no libido and it can

give you ED. As for your prostate problem getting this down to say

20 should take care of this. I had the same problem when my

Estradiol was high. I feel like shit when my Estradiol is over 30.

Find a new Dr. go to the files section at the home page and read

Finding a male hormone Dr. then go to this link

> http://www.tuneupyourt.com/

> click on Find a Dr. then put in your state.

> You will get a list of Dr.'s in your area start calling them and

ask a lot of questions like how many men does he treat for low T does

he test for high Estradiol and treat it with Arimidex. Also aks if

he use's HCG to treat men that are Secondary I know your not

Secondary but ask this if you have found a good one you will know.

> Phil

[Guest guest]

thanks for the sond information once again Mr Phil. I went to a new Endocrine

doctor for a second opinion. Geesh... Now I have to find a third doctor...

So, you think I have a prostate problem?

philip georgian <pmgamer18@...> wrote:

Elliot I hate to say this but you have the same problem most of us have a bad

Dr. any Dr. that would tell a man his Estradiol at 51 is low is sure full of it.

This is way you have no libido and it can give you ED. As for your prostate

problem getting this down to say 20 should take care of this. I had the same

problem when my Estradiol was high. I feel like shit when my Estradiol is over

30. Find a new Dr. go to the files section at the home page and read Finding a

male hormone Dr. then go to this link

http://www.tuneupyourt.com/

click on Find a Dr. then put in your state.

You will get a list of Dr.'s in your area start calling them and ask a lot of

questions like how many men does he treat for low T does he test for high

Estradiol and treat it with Arimidex. Also aks if he use's HCG to treat men

that are Secondary I know your not Secondary but ask this if you have found a

good one you will know.

Phil

Elliot <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

write down my srink number.

I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

=======================================================

I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

keep ignoring it.

Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it mean?

Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

[Guest guest]

You can't so ask to speck to the aide that works under the Dr. And hope for the

best.

And what ever you do don't call Endo's they are the worst for low t.

Phil

loaded_vasdeferens <no_reply > wrote:

Hello Phil,

If someone is not a patient with a doctor, What can he do to get past

the receptionist/nurse to talk to the doctor directly.

~Chip

>

> Elliot I hate to say this but you have the same problem most of us

have a bad Dr. any Dr. that would tell a man his Estradiol at 51 is

low is sure full of it. This is way you have no libido and it can

give you ED. As for your prostate problem getting this down to say

20 should take care of this. I had the same problem when my

Estradiol was high. I feel like shit when my Estradiol is over 30.

Find a new Dr. go to the files section at the home page and read

Finding a male hormone Dr. then go to this link

> http://www.tuneupyourt.com/

> click on Find a Dr. then put in your state.

> You will get a list of Dr.'s in your area start calling them and

ask a lot of questions like how many men does he treat for low T does

he test for high Estradiol and treat it with Arimidex. Also aks if

he use's HCG to treat men that are Secondary I know your not

Secondary but ask this if you have found a good one you will know.

> Phil

[Guest guest]

On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 23:11:56 -0000, you wrote:

>Just from reading these posts here at it seems the endo's don't

>know jack about HRT. Aren't hormones their specialty? Aren't endo's

>also quite pricey to visit?

90% of endo work is tied to diabetes, some 10% to thyroid issues, the

rest is evidently more trouble than it's worth for them to keep

current on.

________________

I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

Terence

[Guest guest]

-Uroogists are considered the " Male " specialists and I agree, most

Endo's are focused where the big money is..in treating diabetes. It

wouldn't hurt more GP's to keep up on their patient needs. This

however, seems to be asking too much of a Primary these days.

It is very difficult finding a good Endo who is proficient with even

thyroid disorders. These clowns are so busy treating diabetes it's

taken 6 months for my wife to get a biopsy date for suspected

thyroid cancer. Socialized medicine is faster than this! So, all we

have to do is all become diabetic and maybe they'll pay attention?

Sheesh! (fire56)

-- In , retrogrouch@... wrote:

>

> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 23:11:56 -0000, you wrote:

>

> >Just from reading these posts here at it seems the endo's

don't

> >know jack about HRT. Aren't hormones their specialty? Aren't

endo's

> >also quite pricey to visit?

>

>

> 90% of endo work is tied to diabetes, some 10% to thyroid issues,

the

> rest is evidently more trouble than it's worth for them to keep

> current on.

>

> ________________

> I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

> Terence

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Elliot,

I think you need to get a new doctor and fast. Anyone who says that 52

is not high E2 is sadly in error or don't know anything about treating ED.

Also you won't need 400 ml every two weeks. Most on here are on 100 ml

every week. There is too much drop there. The half life of your shot is only

about 7 or 8 days so you go down from there. I myself only take 80ml

every week and my Total T got too high. Also with that high dosage it Will

only drive up the E2 more. This is just my opinion

Roy

Elliot <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

write down my srink number.

I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

=======================================================

I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

keep ignoring it.

Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it mean?

Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Hi

I don't know about others but Phil and I say the same thing, they don't know

squat about treating ED. I am on my third one now and I have to tell him

what to order on my blood test. When I told him that my E2 was too high

he said there is nothing I can do. I told him I wanted a script for Armidex

and he put me on ONE pill a day for 30 days. If I had taken that much I

would have been out of my mind. I scheduled it for 1/4 pill every week and

then it went too low. So now you understand what we are saying about

Endos. We have to find a doctor who has treated many men first I guess.

I am still waiting for my E2 to come up as I went down to 6, should be

around 20.

Roy

<that_fiend@...> wrote:

Just from reading these posts here at it seems the endo's don't

know jack about HRT. Aren't hormones their specialty? Aren't endo's

also quite pricey to visit?

>

> Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

> regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

>

> I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

> refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

> important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

> She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

>

> She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

> range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

>

> She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

> to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

>

> I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

>

> She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

> write down my srink number.

>

> I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

> normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

> isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

>

> How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

>

> =======================================================

>

> I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

> finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

> keep ignoring it.

>

> Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it

mean?

>

> Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

>

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Morning All,

I have been to Endo's and I have been to Urologists and none of them

where worth my time, most know nothing about balancing hormones.

I was talking to a passed doctor about seeing some one to help me

and he told me that Endo's and Urologists are they only ones that

deal in men's health and I they can't find anything wrong, then I'm

ok.

That's when I knew I was stuffed.

My current Endo doesn't think high E2 is a problem, go

figure...........Now I know I'm stuffed.

magenta.

> >

> > Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment

options

> > regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot

down.

> >

> > I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status

but she

> > refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are

not

> > important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she

focuses on.

> > She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH

levels.

> >

> > She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the

high

> > range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

> >

> > She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she

needs

> > to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

> >

> > I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced,

and sad.

> >

> > She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field.

She did

> > write down my srink number.

> >

> > I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still

isn't

> > normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope

it

> > isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

> >

> > How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

> >

> > =======================================================

> >

> > I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

> > finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest

but I

> > keep ignoring it.

> >

> > Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does

it

> mean?

> >

> > Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> How low will we go? Check out Messenger's low PC-to-Phone

call rates.

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think we have to give them somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition

relatively speaking. They do not have the time to bone up on things they don't

see too often. For example, how many of us have learned all about changing out

our transmissions in our vehicles?

My personal opinion on this issue is that it is up to us to find out what is

the best treatment for me! Then find a doctor (ENDO, URO, GP.......) who is

willing to sit down with you as an individual and evaluate the options. If there

first response is " I am the doctor here and I know best " then your chances of

success is minimal.

Using this forum and the internet is the best we can do. There are a hand full

of doctors out there that have taken an interest in this area and would be

considered experts, but for the most part, it is up to us to deal with our

situation.

Arkansas

magenta_1996 <no_reply > wrote:

Morning All,

I have been to Endo's and I have been to Urologists and none of them

where worth my time, most know nothing about balancing hormones.

I was talking to a passed doctor about seeing some one to help me

and he told me that Endo's and Urologists are they only ones that

deal in men's health and I they can't find anything wrong, then I'm

ok.

That's when I knew I was stuffed.

My current Endo doesn't think high E2 is a problem, go

figure...........Now I know I'm stuffed.

magenta.

> >

> > Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment

options

> > regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot

down.

> >

> > I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status

but she

> > refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are

not

> > important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she

focuses on.

> > She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH

levels.

> >

> > She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the

high

> > range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

> >

> > She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she

needs

> > to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

> >

> > I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced,

and sad.

> >

> > She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field.

She did

> > write down my srink number.

> >

> > I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still

isn't

> > normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope

it

> > isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

> >

> > How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

> >

> > =======================================================

> >

> > I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

> > finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest

but I

> > keep ignoring it.

> >

> > Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does

it

> mean?

> >

> > Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> How low will we go? Check out Messenger's low PC-to-Phone

call rates.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Dan and toward the others. About 8 years of college, and 4 of them dealing

with their " speciality " doesn't give the Endocrine profession the right to not

have some form of solidarity in how to best treat folks like us with different

side effects and situations in a humane and compassionate way.

No male should have to go to multi specialities just to have a better well being

and improved potential existence Dan. I don't have time to give paid

professionals a " break " , given I didn't receive one the first day I was let us

of Mom's stomach and professional eyes either failed to miss I had an

undescended teste and the other one was small, or just didn't care. Mind you

folks I am American...

I just had a birthday on Sat. and much like the others it was very lonely and

sadden. I was thinking about all I couldn't succeed within, and how the side

effects from never being treated for this health problem was a direct result and

how no one cares rather only see you has a failure.

Yea, I should give Endocrine doctors a break....While, I wait patiently, I still

suffer.

While, the Endocrine profession continues to treat hypogonadism based on partial

studies and patial text book cases without using a practical approach and

without just visiting forums like this and simply asking folks that have

excessively researched and have found formulas of success that may work better

than those case studies and text books, their patients that relies on

professional knowledge continue to suffer without being on the correct formula.

It shouldn't be " hit or miss " with TRT including HCG and E2 blockers,

Some males can lead a successful existence while dealing with hypogonadism Dan,

and some cannot like myself. I shouldn't have to further suffer while doing my

part reseaching, understanding feedback from all you folks, and then puting them

all together in HOPES, I find a doctor or my current doctor gives what-ever

practical formula for success a chance instead of being cold hearted.

If I went for 8 years of college my humanity and compassionate would still be in

place and my mentality wouldn't be about having a nasty attitude toward those

that have researched and isnt trying to do a doctors job, but working with that

individual to improve his or her existence in all areas.

===============================================

Dan Meatheany <dmeatheany@...> wrote: I

think we have to give them somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition

relatively speaking. They do not have the time to bone up on things they don't

see too often. For example, how many of us have learned all about changing out

our transmissions in our vehicles?

..

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Hey Elliot - I appreciate your position on this. I would counter by saying that

it is apparent you have a lot of anger associated with you misdiagnosis. That is

very understandable. My point on all of this is most doctors are not going to

take the time to investigate the hundreds of conditions that might see once in a

blue moon. That is just the reality of it. Therefore, it is up to us as

individuals to research our individual situations and find a doctor that is

willing to work with you. Unless they feel confident that you are on top of the

situation and have adequately researched it, they will not go out on a limb.

Malpractice insurance is just too high for them to take chances and they have

too many patients to take the time to do the research themselves.

It doesn't seem fair but that is how I read it - if we don't try to figure out

what to do, no one will. Sorry if this rocks your cart - just trying to help -

Arkansas

ELLIOT BAKER <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

Hello Dan and toward the others. About 8 years of college, and 4 of

them dealing with their " speciality " doesn't give the Endocrine profession the

right to not have some form of solidarity in how to best treat folks like us

with different side effects and situations in a humane and compassionate way.

No male should have to go to multi specialities just to have a better well being

and improved potential existence Dan. I don't have time to give paid

professionals a " break " , given I didn't receive one the first day I was let us

of Mom's stomach and professional eyes either failed to miss I had an

undescended teste and the other one was small, or just didn't care. Mind you

folks I am American...

I just had a birthday on Sat. and much like the others it was very lonely and

sadden. I was thinking about all I couldn't succeed within, and how the side

effects from never being treated for this health problem was a direct result and

how no one cares rather only see you has a failure.

Yea, I should give Endocrine doctors a break....While, I wait patiently, I still

suffer.

While, the Endocrine profession continues to treat hypogonadism based on partial

studies and patial text book cases without using a practical approach and

without just visiting forums like this and simply asking folks that have

excessively researched and have found formulas of success that may work better

than those case studies and text books, their patients that relies on

professional knowledge continue to suffer without being on the correct formula.

It shouldn't be " hit or miss " with TRT including HCG and E2 blockers,

Some males can lead a successful existence while dealing with hypogonadism Dan,

and some cannot like myself. I shouldn't have to further suffer while doing my

part reseaching, understanding feedback from all you folks, and then puting them

all together in HOPES, I find a doctor or my current doctor gives what-ever

practical formula for success a chance instead of being cold hearted.

If I went for 8 years of college my humanity and compassionate would still be in

place and my mentality wouldn't be about having a nasty attitude toward those

that have researched and isnt trying to do a doctors job, but working with that

individual to improve his or her existence in all areas.

===============================================

Dan Meatheany <dmeatheany@...> wrote: I think we have to give them

somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition relatively speaking. They do not

have the time to bone up on things they don't see too often. For example, how

many of us have learned all about changing out our transmissions in our

vehicles?

..

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Hey Dan and it's cool, I understand. Sometimes I let my banter get in the way of

sound emphasis. It does suck for us the patients, to go out and research

excessively, for results that should already be within a qualitied doctor.

The whole angle on finding the proper and compassionate or pitied doctor to just

work with you on what you have researched instead of being cold hearted and

refusing, shouldn't be existing within the medical profession in general. While

us, the patients, continue to find a professional that will be practical and

understanding we continue to suffer doing those times.

I think if us, the patients, take a more direct approach and maybe file on

record our point of views in which-ever legal binding avenue available, we can

change how professionals view hypogonadism and to make them or just that

specific clinic, etc review more research from patients and from other avenues

for a more successful percentage. Doctors have to realize, patients who research

shouldn't be preceived as contradicting their professional knowledge.

Dan Meatheany <dmeatheany@...> wrote: Hey

Elliot - I appreciate your position on this. I would counter by saying that it

is apparent you have a lot of anger associated with you misdiagnosis. That is

very understandable. My point on all of this is most doctors are not going to

take the time to investigate the hundreds of conditions that might see once in a

blue moon. That is just the reality of it. Therefore, it is up to us as

individuals to research our individual situations and find a doctor that is

willing to work with you. Unless they feel confident that you are on top of the

situation and have adequately researched it, they will not go out on a limb.

Malpractice insurance is just too high for them to take chances and they have

too many patients to take the time to do the research themselves.

It doesn't seem fair but that is how I read it - if we don't try to figure

out what to do, no one will. Sorry if this rocks your cart - just trying to help

- Arkansas

ELLIOT BAKER <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

Hello Dan and toward the others. About 8 years of college, and 4 of

them dealing with their " speciality " doesn't give the Endocrine profession the

right to not have some form of solidarity in how to best treat folks like us

with different side effects and situations in a humane and compassionate way.

No male should have to go to multi specialities just to have a better well

being and improved potential existence Dan. I don't have time to give paid

professionals a " break " , given I didn't receive one the first day I was let us

of Mom's stomach and professional eyes either failed to miss I had an

undescended teste and the other one was small, or just didn't care. Mind you

folks I am American...

I just had a birthday on Sat. and much like the others it was very lonely and

sadden. I was thinking about all I couldn't succeed within, and how the side

effects from never being treated for this health problem was a direct result and

how no one cares rather only see you has a failure.

Yea, I should give Endocrine doctors a break....While, I wait patiently, I

still suffer.

While, the Endocrine profession continues to treat hypogonadism based on

partial studies and patial text book cases without using a practical approach

and without just visiting forums like this and simply asking folks that have

excessively researched and have found formulas of success that may work better

than those case studies and text books, their patients that relies on

professional knowledge continue to suffer without being on the correct formula.

It shouldn't be " hit or miss " with TRT including HCG and E2 blockers,

Some males can lead a successful existence while dealing with hypogonadism Dan,

and some cannot like myself. I shouldn't have to further suffer while doing my

part reseaching, understanding feedback from all you folks, and then puting them

all together in HOPES, I find a doctor or my current doctor gives what-ever

practical formula for success a chance instead of being cold hearted.

If I went for 8 years of college my humanity and compassionate would still be

in place and my mentality wouldn't be about having a nasty attitude toward those

that have researched and isnt trying to do a doctors job, but working with that

individual to improve his or her existence in all areas.

===============================================

Dan Meatheany <dmeatheany@...> wrote: I think we have to give them

somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition relatively speaking. They do not

have the time to bone up on things they don't see too often. For example, how

many of us have learned all about changing out our transmissions in our

vehicles?

.

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1�/min.

[Guest guest]

Well Dan it's sad but your right most of us did not get the right treatment

until we came here and read a lot and did a lot of research on what the problem

is with us. Here we are all of us and not one the same close but no one

treatment works for all. So yes figure this out find a Dr. that will work with

you and hope for the best. Hell I have been at it for 22 yrs. Last yr. I

though after reading Dr. 's TRT: A Recipe for Success and his HCG update I

was on top of this for good. Little did I know that this was just a step up.

Now I find out adding HCG and it doubling my levels I am not Primary but now

it's Pituitary. So guess what now I am back to base one and feel this is over

my Dr.'s head. I am hoping when I see him next time that he has got some

knowledge on this problem and will try to treat it. I now know it's more then

just doing TRT and keeping E2 down. I need my thyroid, DHEA, Cortisol and

Growth Hormones looked after. IF he can't do this I am back

to finding a Dr.

Phil

Dan Meatheany <dmeatheany@...> wrote:

Hey Elliot - I appreciate your position on this. I would counter by saying

that it is apparent you have a lot of anger associated with you misdiagnosis.

That is very understandable. My point on all of this is most doctors are not

going to take the time to investigate the hundreds of conditions that might see

once in a blue moon. That is just the reality of it. Therefore, it is up to us

as individuals to research our individual situations and find a doctor that is

willing to work with you. Unless they feel confident that you are on top of the

situation and have adequately researched it, they will not go out on a limb.

Malpractice insurance is just too high for them to take chances and they have

too many patients to take the time to do the research themselves.

It doesn't seem fair but that is how I read it - if we don't try to figure out

what to do, no one will. Sorry if this rocks your cart - just trying to help -

Arkansas

ELLIOT BAKER wrote:

Hello Dan and toward the others. About 8 years of college, and 4 of them dealing

with their " speciality " doesn't give the Endocrine profession the right to not

have some form of solidarity in how to best treat folks like us with different

side effects and situations in a humane and compassionate way.

No male should have to go to multi specialities just to have a better well being

and improved potential existence Dan. I don't have time to give paid

professionals a " break " , given I didn't receive one the first day I was let us

of Mom's stomach and professional eyes either failed to miss I had an

undescended teste and the other one was small, or just didn't care. Mind you

folks I am American...

I just had a birthday on Sat. and much like the others it was very lonely and

sadden. I was thinking about all I couldn't succeed within, and how the side

effects from never being treated for this health problem was a direct result and

how no one cares rather only see you has a failure.

Yea, I should give Endocrine doctors a break....While, I wait patiently, I still

suffer.

While, the Endocrine profession continues to treat hypogonadism based on partial

studies and patial text book cases without using a practical approach and

without just visiting forums like this and simply asking folks that have

excessively researched and have found formulas of success that may work better

than those case studies and text books, their patients that relies on

professional knowledge continue to suffer without being on the correct formula.

It shouldn't be " hit or miss " with TRT including HCG and E2 blockers,

Some males can lead a successful existence while dealing with hypogonadism Dan,

and some cannot like myself. I shouldn't have to further suffer while doing my

part reseaching, understanding feedback from all you folks, and then puting them

all together in HOPES, I find a doctor or my current doctor gives what-ever

practical formula for success a chance instead of being cold hearted.

If I went for 8 years of college my humanity and compassionate would still be in

place and my mentality wouldn't be about having a nasty attitude toward those

that have researched and isnt trying to do a doctors job, but working with that

individual to improve his or her existence in all areas.

===============================================

Dan Meatheany wrote: I think we have to give them somewhat a break. This is a

very rare condition relatively speaking. They do not have the time to bone up on

things they don't see too often. For example, how many of us have learned all

about changing out our transmissions in our vehicles?

..

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Thank you, you have said it more eloquently then I ever could.

It does not matter what Doctor or Professional you, if he/she claims

to be a specialist in a certain area, then they should be, other

wise they are taking my money under false pretences.

To me if you take my money to do a job and don't do it. then that is

fraud.

Ok so they go to collage for 8 years, it doesn't mean they are god

and have they right to treat you like they do.

Later.

I think we have to give them

somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition relatively speaking.

They do not have the time to bone up on things they don't see too

often. For example, how many of us have learned all about changing

out our transmissions in our vehicles?

>

>

>

>

>

> .

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.

Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi All,

There is hope for finding someone that can treat andropause, but it is

rarely a specialty you will be able to find.

Yes endocrinologists do tend to be diabetic and thyroid oriented. T

Those OB/GYN's that treat couples for fertility problems are the best

clue to your kind of specialist. Their endocrinology studies involved

the sexual hormones. Yes, they are rare. Dr. Gambrell of Augusta, GA

is one of those that treats men for andropause. His waiting room has

both men and women patients which is rather unusual for an OB/GYN.

Dr. Greenblatt, now deceased was one of the few that taught hormone

therapy. I think he was a pioneer in the 50's working to understanding

sexual hormones as well as the means of treatment. He worked with both

estrogen and testosterone hormone pellets almost entirely long before

other forms of TRT therapy became available at great expense.

Today most of the technical information is provided by pharmaceutical

reps and the dosages are rarely enough and the cost is high. Benefits

from the therapy rarely are what they should be. The experienced

doctors can give higher doses without concern and the patients benefit.

ernestnolan

I think we have to give them

> somewhat a break. This is a very rare condition relatively speaking.

> They do not have the time to bone up on things they don't see too

> often. For example, how many of us have learned all about changing

> out our transmissions in our vehicles?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > .

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.

> Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

" Today most of the technical information is provided by

pharmaceutical reps and the dosages are rarely enough and the cost is

high. Benefits " .

Sound information Sir or Ma'am. It's a shame when Pharmaceutical Reps.

or sales-people are the more valid and informative piece of research

and case studys relating toward hypogonadism and other health

disorders doctors seek and thus, treat based upon.

Geesh, the more experience members here that do excessive research

should be the Pharmaceutical Reps. and not some super hot model type

that traps out of-shape-male doctors into buying anything... I'll

leave it at that.

====================================================================

I went to my old Endocrine clinic and will stay given they listen to

my research and actually will sit with me thru diferent options. It's

just a pain to sit hours in a more public clinic then somewhere more

personal but with a not so understanding doctor.

=====================================================================

I have a MRI set to see if the minor discomfort from my teste is back

pain or an unbalanced nerve. Doctor said, Im too young for it to be a

prostate problem.

=====================================================================

I talked about my E2 and he thought it was a bit high unlike the other

doctor. He said it may be because of the fat I have. Im 5'11 and 255.

He didnt give me a script for a blocker rather, gave me Metformin HCL

Er 500 MG which is from him a sugar, and E2 blocker. And I think it

does something for cholestrol. He said, it should help me loose weight

and then my E2 should lessen.

=====================================================================

I will get back on anti depressants. I just didnt want to be so

dependent on so many medications.

====================================================================

My other Endocrine attending doctor which is a female, hot in a non

sexy way, but Im not picky. She was telling me about something new she

just heard about. The TRT that goes thru the gums and sends out a

" refreshing " pulse of testosterone. I played dumb because she was the

first female in a while to smile while chatting with me.

No, I didnt have an erection. After reading up on it, its not for me.

I would have went to the female doctor but I had to talk about

masturbation and why Im doing it so much, and I felt the male doctor

given he is a hippie with no fashion quotas, would be better.

[Guest guest]

Elliot I wish you good luck with this sounds like your getting some where. I am

not up on what the Dr. gave you for high E2 keep us posted how it goes.

Phil

Elliot <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

" Today most of the technical information is provided by

pharmaceutical reps and the dosages are rarely enough and the cost is

high. Benefits " .

Sound information Sir or Ma'am. It's a shame when Pharmaceutical Reps.

or sales-people are the more valid and informative piece of research

and case studys relating toward hypogonadism and other health

disorders doctors seek and thus, treat based upon.

Geesh, the more experience members here that do excessive research

should be the Pharmaceutical Reps. and not some super hot model type

that traps out of-shape-male doctors into buying anything... I'll

leave it at that.

====================================================================

I went to my old Endocrine clinic and will stay given they listen to

my research and actually will sit with me thru diferent options. It's

just a pain to sit hours in a more public clinic then somewhere more

personal but with a not so understanding doctor.

=====================================================================

I have a MRI set to see if the minor discomfort from my teste is back

pain or an unbalanced nerve. Doctor said, Im too young for it to be a

prostate problem.

=====================================================================

I talked about my E2 and he thought it was a bit high unlike the other

doctor. He said it may be because of the fat I have. Im 5'11 and 255.

He didnt give me a script for a blocker rather, gave me Metformin HCL

Er 500 MG which is from him a sugar, and E2 blocker. And I think it

does something for cholestrol. He said, it should help me loose weight

and then my E2 should lessen.

=====================================================================

I will get back on anti depressants. I just didnt want to be so

dependent on so many medications.

====================================================================

My other Endocrine attending doctor which is a female, hot in a non

sexy way, but Im not picky. She was telling me about something new she

just heard about. The TRT that goes thru the gums and sends out a

" refreshing " pulse of testosterone. I played dumb because she was the

first female in a while to smile while chatting with me.

No, I didnt have an erection. After reading up on it, its not for me.

I would have went to the female doctor but I had to talk about

masturbation and why Im doing it so much, and I felt the male doctor

given he is a hippie with no fashion quotas, would be better.

[Guest guest]

It will take you a while to find a good doc. I'm on my third and will probably

be looking for another one after thursday. I did get some good news this week

though. My new PCP seems to be just as frustrated as I am and will be sending be

to UT Southwestern Medical School's hospital for evaluation. Maybe I'll be a lab

rat for you guys.

L

ELLIOT BAKER <elliotbkr@...> wrote:

thanks for the sond information once again Mr Phil. I went to a new Endocrine

doctor for a second opinion. Geesh... Now I have to find a third doctor...

So, you think I have a prostate problem?

philip georgian

wrote: Elliot I hate to say this but you have the same problem most of us have a

bad Dr. any Dr. that would tell a man his Estradiol at 51 is low is sure full of

it. This is way you have no libido and it can give you ED. As for your prostate

problem getting this down to say 20 should take care of this. I had the same

problem when my Estradiol was high. I feel like shit when my Estradiol is over

30. Find a new Dr. go to the files section at the home page and read Finding a

male hormone Dr. then go to this link

http://www.tuneupyourt.com/

click on Find a Dr. then put in your state.

You will get a list of Dr.'s in your area start calling them and ask a lot of

questions like how many men does he treat for low T does he test for high

Estradiol and treat it with Arimidex. Also aks if he use's HCG to treat men that

are Secondary I know your not Secondary but ask this if you have found a good

one you will know.

Phil

Elliot wrote:

Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine doctor for treatment options

regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

write down my srink number.

I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

=======================================================

I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

keep ignoring it.

Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it mean?

Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

[Guest guest]

OMG!!!! RUN!!!!!!

Elliot <elliotbkr@...> wrote: Hello gentlemen. Saw the new Endocrine

doctor for treatment options

regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

write down my srink number.

I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

=======================================================

I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

keep ignoring it.

Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it mean?

Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Did you get your sugar checked yet? The frequency of urination is a

strong clue you need to get it checked. Diabetics frequently suffer

premature ED because of nerve damage that alerts the doctor to diabetes.

Simple and quick test. Had it done yet?

ernestnolan

Hello gentlemen. Saw the new

Endocrine doctor for treatment options

> regarding HCG and Armindix and once again, the ideas were shot down.

>

> I know the HCG was practical at best toward my primary status but she

> refused to try it and stated, " the numbers (blood results) are not

> important " . Meaning she feels TRT is the only formula she focuses on.

> She stated also, nothing can be done to improve my LH and FSH levels.

>

> She also stated, my E2 wasn't high (51) rather low. I stated the high

> range starts at 52 doc. More blah from her.

>

> She took more blood test and will call me Monday to see if she needs

> to up my doses of 400 ML per two weeks.

>

> I told her I have been feeling very very fatigued, unbalanced, and sad.

>

> She thinks it's more of a mental situation and not her field. She did

> write down my srink number.

>

> I think its a medical problem related toward low T which still isn't

> normal. I eat a lot of sugar so I hope it isn't diabetes. I hope it

> isn't pratate or tesiclar cancer neither.

>

> How can my E2 at 51 be considered normal?

>

> =======================================================

>

> I also have a problem with going to the bathroom and not fully

> finishing up. My under-wear has been getting wet for the longest but I

> keep ignoring it.

>

> Anyone, can relate and if so, how do you combat it and what does it

mean?

>

> Thanks and I hope the weekend is balanced for you all.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>