Re: Pellets and my experience with Total T levels (long)

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I have been receiving TRT via pellets since 1991 and would like to

speak along the same lines but perhaps in a more simplistic way.

I am not informed on HCG studies regarding improved T levels. Have you

heard of any that have been completed and seen articles where they are

reviewed? My doctor was unaware of any studies. The same with the use

of HMG for this purpose.

Regarding the testicles shrinking, when receiving TRT the testicles

shut down and do shrink and a man can become sterile if TRT is

continued. It was my understanding you do not supplement pellet

therapy with anything else.

My doctor does not see high E2 associated with pellet therapy and

armidex is not used in his practice. There are men who suffer from

high E2 but it is rare to find the pellets are the cause because the

gentle 24/7 rate of dissolving doesn't cause the body to react with

conversion of T to E2. Spurts of T or ramping up T levels quickly are

supposed to shock the body's hormone regulation system into action. I

suggest you may not need armidex any longer now that you are away from

the salves and creams.

There are many other compounding pharmacies that are FDA approved to

produce hormone pellets. Dr. Gambrell, Augusta, GA has sent several

suppliers pellets off for evaluation and has not found problems with

their concentration. There are other sizes such as 100 mg and 200 mg

from what I have heard. Just getting training on the use of the trocar

to insert the pellets under the skin requires a few weeks away from

their practice to obtain this skill. There are almost no doctors the

use pellets. These pellets can not be produced by pharmaceutical

companies, only compounding pharmacies.

The testosterone cream and ointment products pharmaceutical companies

are providing bring in a very good profit. Their reps give doctors the

only technical info they have on these products. Very few doctors

involved in TRT have formal endocrinology training.

HCG and HMG should not be able to enlarge your testicles as long as

your are on pellets which shut them down. The pituitary lowers the

hormone to the testicles that causes them not to produce T as the your

hormone regulation system senses you do not need any.

I do not understand your interest in having large testicles at the

same time choosing to shut them down with pellet therapy.

Dr. Gambrell, Augusta, GA is one of the few doctors with decades of

experience treating couples for infertility and men for andropause.

I agree we need to inform ourselves on this subject by reading as many

books as possible to be able to see which books and doctors are wrong.

Our health is in the balance and we need to take several college

courses in our own behalf by reading loads of books on the subject.

I have tried to influence several doctors to begin providing pellet

TRT and they could not be convinced. I found it better to leave

instead of argue.

I have been appearing here to try and let people know about pellet

therapy hoping they will all go to their doctors and ask for pellet

therapy. It is very difficult to find a pellet doctor.

ernestnolan

>

> Having been on pellets after trying Androderm, Testim, Androgel and

> Andractim and HCG, I definitly prefer the pellets. I have heard

> that 75mg Testopel pellets by Bartor Pharmacutical group are the

> only mainstream approved FDA pellet available in the US. In Europe,

> I have heard that you can get them up to 250 mg. As and FYI the 75

> mg testopel pellets cost $15/pellet(from letter sent to me by

> Bartor).

>

> I like the consistent release of T that you get from the pellets and

> the low maintence. Also you dont have to worry about transferring

> the T to someone else which can cause problems.

>

> I would just like to second what the earlier post said. You really

> do not get the total benefit of TRT until you are in the 800-1000

> range and using a good aromatase inhibitor. If your doctor is not

> watching your E levels and your T/E ratio and working to get your E

> levels down(mine were 14)you will not get the real benefit of TRT.

>

> When i am at 800-1100 and using arimedex, i can really tell the

> difference. I feel like i am 16 again, and my muscles started to

> fill out a bit and get hard as well. If you have had low T for very

> long, your muscles will go soft and shrink.

>

> Also using HCG or even better HMG (both of these products are

> distilled from human urine-they should cost next to nothing!!!) to

> rehabilitate your testicles is very important too.

>

> If your doc or MD gives your grief about wanting this medication to

> rehab your testicles, just ask him if he would like his nuts to

> shrink up or if it is a she to have her breasts turn to just pec

> muscles. I can guarntee that those MD's and Endo's would not put up

> with it and neither should we. The MD's and Endo's will only care

> when they understand what it does to a man to have his testicles

> turn into rasins. As an FYI, your penis does not shrink from the

> exogenous T. It shrinks due to too much E. Also you can have a very

> high Total T level and still have ED problems. As the other post

> indicated, the key is getting your E levels down.

>

> The more I try to manage my condition, the more i am convinced that

> most MD's and Endo's really do not know what they are doing, and a

> few of them dont care to either.

>

> When you get the right T levels 800+ and you get your E down, you

> will see a drastic improvement in sex drive and erections and

> stamina and the abilty to excersise longer and harder and to

> recouperate much faster. Also, when E is low and T is high, my

> depression got better and i had less anxiety as well.

>

> Some how we need to put pressure on the big and medium sized drug

> companies to make more and better products for men like us and to

> make them affordable. Androgel is so expensive becuase of the gel

> delivery system and the patent. Making the T costs very little and

> there is no patent on T to help line the pockets of the drug

> company.

>

> In the end, I think the key is that you have to find a doctor that

> will listen to you and help you listen to your own body.

> Best of luck to you all

>

> my .02

>

> SB

>

[Guest guest]

Ok let me say this a older man with high levels of Estradiol and low levels of

Testosterone will still have high levels of Estradiol on Pellets because as we

get older we make Estradiol more and more by age 45 some men have higher levels

then there wife. So if they treated the Estradiol and there T levels did not go

up high enough and they went on Pellets they will still need to take something

to keep there Estradiol down.

Now let me say something about HCG when we go on TRT are brain stops sending

the LH and FSH messages to are testis to make more Testosterone and it stops the

LH for other cells that are receptive to LH. What this means is there are many

cells in are body and in are brian that are stimulated by LH. So when we are

shut down not only will are testis stop working but are levels of cortisol,

Thyroid, IGF-1 are effected not alot but enough. So when we add HCG which is a

marker like LH not only will are testis come back to as big as they can but all

the other cells in are body and brain will be stimulated again and this is good

it only makes good since to keep everything we can working.

Here is just one of many studys on HCG.

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/90/5/2595

For most men going on a low does of HCG find they get a feeling of well being

this only tells me that something was not working right and now it is.

Phil

ernestnolan <ernestnolan@...> wrote:

Hi,

I have been receiving TRT via pellets since 1991 and would like to

speak along the same lines but perhaps in a more simplistic way.

I am not informed on HCG studies regarding improved T levels. Have you

heard of any that have been completed and seen articles where they are

reviewed? My doctor was unaware of any studies. The same with the use

of HMG for this purpose.

Regarding the testicles shrinking, when receiving TRT the testicles

shut down and do shrink and a man can become sterile if TRT is

continued. It was my understanding you do not supplement pellet

therapy with anything else.

My doctor does not see high E2 associated with pellet therapy and

armidex is not used in his practice. There are men who suffer from

high E2 but it is rare to find the pellets are the cause because the

gentle 24/7 rate of dissolving doesn't cause the body to react with

conversion of T to E2. Spurts of T or ramping up T levels quickly are

supposed to shock the body's hormone regulation system into action. I

suggest you may not need armidex any longer now that you are away from

the salves and creams.

There are many other compounding pharmacies that are FDA approved to

produce hormone pellets. Dr. Gambrell, Augusta, GA has sent several

suppliers pellets off for evaluation and has not found problems with

their concentration. There are other sizes such as 100 mg and 200 mg

from what I have heard. Just getting training on the use of the trocar

to insert the pellets under the skin requires a few weeks away from

their practice to obtain this skill. There are almost no doctors the

use pellets. These pellets can not be produced by pharmaceutical

companies, only compounding pharmacies.

The testosterone cream and ointment products pharmaceutical companies

are providing bring in a very good profit. Their reps give doctors the

only technical info they have on these products. Very few doctors

involved in TRT have formal endocrinology training.

HCG and HMG should not be able to enlarge your testicles as long as

your are on pellets which shut them down. The pituitary lowers the

hormone to the testicles that causes them not to produce T as the your

hormone regulation system senses you do not need any.

I do not understand your interest in having large testicles at the

same time choosing to shut them down with pellet therapy.

Dr. Gambrell, Augusta, GA is one of the few doctors with decades of

experience treating couples for infertility and men for andropause.

I agree we need to inform ourselves on this subject by reading as many

books as possible to be able to see which books and doctors are wrong.

Our health is in the balance and we need to take several college

courses in our own behalf by reading loads of books on the subject.

I have tried to influence several doctors to begin providing pellet

TRT and they could not be convinced. I found it better to leave

instead of argue.

I have been appearing here to try and let people know about pellet

therapy hoping they will all go to their doctors and ask for pellet

therapy. It is very difficult to find a pellet doctor.

ernestnolan

>

> Having been on pellets after trying Androderm, Testim, Androgel and

> Andractim and HCG, I definitly prefer the pellets. I have heard

> that 75mg Testopel pellets by Bartor Pharmacutical group are the

> only mainstream approved FDA pellet available in the US. In Europe,

> I have heard that you can get them up to 250 mg. As and FYI the 75

> mg testopel pellets cost $15/pellet(from letter sent to me by

> Bartor).

>

> I like the consistent release of T that you get from the pellets and

> the low maintence. Also you dont have to worry about transferring

> the T to someone else which can cause problems.

>

> I would just like to second what the earlier post said. You really

> do not get the total benefit of TRT until you are in the 800-1000

> range and using a good aromatase inhibitor. If your doctor is not

> watching your E levels and your T/E ratio and working to get your E

> levels down(mine were 14)you will not get the real benefit of TRT.

>

> When i am at 800-1100 and using arimedex, i can really tell the

> difference. I feel like i am 16 again, and my muscles started to

> fill out a bit and get hard as well. If you have had low T for very

> long, your muscles will go soft and shrink.

>

> Also using HCG or even better HMG (both of these products are

> distilled from human urine-they should cost next to nothing!!!) to

> rehabilitate your testicles is very important too.

>

> If your doc or MD gives your grief about wanting this medication to

> rehab your testicles, just ask him if he would like his nuts to

> shrink up or if it is a she to have her breasts turn to just pec

> muscles. I can guarntee that those MD's and Endo's would not put up

> with it and neither should we. The MD's and Endo's will only care

> when they understand what it does to a man to have his testicles

> turn into rasins. As an FYI, your penis does not shrink from the

> exogenous T. It shrinks due to too much E. Also you can have a very

> high Total T level and still have ED problems. As the other post

> indicated, the key is getting your E levels down.

>

> The more I try to manage my condition, the more i am convinced that

> most MD's and Endo's really do not know what they are doing, and a

> few of them dont care to either.

>

> When you get the right T levels 800+ and you get your E down, you

> will see a drastic improvement in sex drive and erections and

> stamina and the abilty to excersise longer and harder and to

> recouperate much faster. Also, when E is low and T is high, my

> depression got better and i had less anxiety as well.

>

> Some how we need to put pressure on the big and medium sized drug

> companies to make more and better products for men like us and to

> make them affordable. Androgel is so expensive becuase of the gel

> delivery system and the patent. Making the T costs very little and

> there is no patent on T to help line the pockets of the drug

> company.

>

> In the end, I think the key is that you have to find a doctor that

> will listen to you and help you listen to your own body.

> Best of luck to you all

>

> my .02

>

> SB

>

---------------------------------

How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates.

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 18 Oct 2006 08:06:07 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>

>Ok let me say this a older man with high levels of Estradiol and low levels of

Testosterone will still have high levels of Estradiol on Pellets because as we

get older we make Estradiol more and more by age 45 some men have higher levels

then there wife. So if they treated the Estradiol and there T levels did not go

up high enough and they went on Pellets they will still need to take something

to keep there Estradiol down.

I believe if men keep their body fat down this is not the case.

________________

I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

Terence

[Guest guest]

Yes this would work I just read a post that had a lot of studys in it that

showed most men that stay at the same weight still have an increase in body fat

as they get older some said it was because of age and others because of higher

E2. But the bottom line was it's dam hard to keep body fat down with age. One

dam big job.

Phil

retrogrouch@... wrote:

On Wed, 18 Oct 2006 08:06:07 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>

>Ok let me say this a older man with high levels of Estradiol and low levels of

Testosterone will still have high levels of Estradiol on Pellets because as we

get older we make Estradiol more and more by age 45 some men have higher levels

then there wife. So if they treated the Estradiol and there T levels did not go

up high enough and they went on Pellets they will still need to take something

to keep there Estradiol down.

I believe if men keep their body fat down this is not the case.

________________

I am human; nothing in humanity is alien to me.

Terence

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I know nothing about how Estrodiol is produced in a man's body. I

assume it can be age related and when younger when things get out of

whack some way.

Can you help me here?

ernestnolan

> >

> > Having been on pellets after trying Androderm, Testim, Androgel and

> > Andractim and HCG, I definitly prefer the pellets. I have heard

> > that 75mg Testopel pellets by Bartor Pharmacutical group are the

> > only mainstream approved FDA pellet available in the US. In Europe,

> > I have heard that you can get them up to 250 mg. As and FYI the 75

> > mg testopel pellets cost $15/pellet(from letter sent to me by

> > Bartor).

> >

> > I like the consistent release of T that you get from the pellets and

> > the low maintence. Also you dont have to worry about transferring

> > the T to someone else which can cause problems.

> >

> > I would just like to second what the earlier post said. You really

> > do not get the total benefit of TRT until you are in the 800-1000

> > range and using a good aromatase inhibitor. If your doctor is not

> > watching your E levels and your T/E ratio and working to get your E

> > levels down(mine were 14)you will not get the real benefit of TRT.

> >

> > When i am at 800-1100 and using arimedex, i can really tell the

> > difference. I feel like i am 16 again, and my muscles started to

> > fill out a bit and get hard as well. If you have had low T for very

> > long, your muscles will go soft and shrink.

> >

> > Also using HCG or even better HMG (both of these products are

> > distilled from human urine-they should cost next to nothing!!!) to

> > rehabilitate your testicles is very important too.

> >

> > If your doc or MD gives your grief about wanting this medication to

> > rehab your testicles, just ask him if he would like his nuts to

> > shrink up or if it is a she to have her breasts turn to just pec

> > muscles. I can guarntee that those MD's and Endo's would not put up

> > with it and neither should we. The MD's and Endo's will only care

> > when they understand what it does to a man to have his testicles

> > turn into rasins. As an FYI, your penis does not shrink from the

> > exogenous T. It shrinks due to too much E. Also you can have a very

> > high Total T level and still have ED problems. As the other post

> > indicated, the key is getting your E levels down.

> >

> > The more I try to manage my condition, the more i am convinced that

> > most MD's and Endo's really do not know what they are doing, and a

> > few of them dont care to either.

> >

> > When you get the right T levels 800+ and you get your E down, you

> > will see a drastic improvement in sex drive and erections and

> > stamina and the abilty to excersise longer and harder and to

> > recouperate much faster. Also, when E is low and T is high, my

> > depression got better and i had less anxiety as well.

> >

> > Some how we need to put pressure on the big and medium sized drug

> > companies to make more and better products for men like us and to

> > make them affordable. Androgel is so expensive becuase of the gel

> > delivery system and the patent. Making the T costs very little and

> > there is no patent on T to help line the pockets of the drug

> > company.

> >

> > In the end, I think the key is that you have to find a doctor that

> > will listen to you and help you listen to your own body.

> > Best of luck to you all

> >

> > my .02

> >

> > SB

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

> How low will we go? Check out Messenger's low PC-to-Phone

call rates.

>

>

[Guest guest]

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 00:18:26 -0000, you wrote:

>Hi,

>

>I know nothing about how Estrodiol is produced in a man's body. I

>assume it can be age related and when younger when things get out of

>whack some way.

>

>Can you help me here?

Testosterone is converted to E2 by an enzyme called aromotase.

Aromotase is present in higher volumes in fat tissue - lipids.

The fatter you are the more aromotase you make and hence the more E2.

I believe that the increase in E2 reported with age is largely a

function of the fact that most men put on a significant amount of

weight between say 25 and 60.

I believe it's not so much a function of age as it is weight. But

others think differently.

________________

" You never need an argument against the use of violence, you need an

argument for it. " Noam Chomsky

[Guest guest]

Yeah, but is it a case of the chicken or the egg coming first? Maybe you

put on more weight as your T levels drop from age and your E2 goes up.

Either way, once you're overweight with high estrogen levels, it's very

difficult to get back down; something the endos won't tell you.

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of retrogrouch@...

Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 6:44 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Pellets and my experience with Total T

levels (long)

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 00:18:26 -0000, you wrote:

>Hi,

>

>I know nothing about how Estrodiol is produced in a man's body. I

>assume it can be age related and when younger when things get out of

>whack some way.

>

>Can you help me here?

Testosterone is converted to E2 by an enzyme called aromotase.

Aromotase is present in higher volumes in fat tissue - lipids.

The fatter you are the more aromotase you make and hence the more E2.

I believe that the increase in E2 reported with age is largely a

function of the fact that most men put on a significant amount of

weight between say 25 and 60.

I believe it's not so much a function of age as it is weight. But

others think differently.

________________

" You never need an argument against the use of violence, you need an

argument for it. " Noam Chomsky

[Guest guest]

Ernest,

I am new to this group and have heard of the pellets, but there does not

seem to be alot of experience locally that I have heard about. I live in a

small

town in Ontario Canada.

I get this very uncomfortable feeling when I get an injection: hot, sweaty

and dosey for 1 to 2 days. I have received feedback that this is a normal

response. I cannot do the gels, I get no response. I may be interested in the

pill if someone has experience.

A couple of questions if you do not mind:

- does it last long

- how is replacement determined

- does the pill dissolve in place i.e. not removed

- how is the T level regulated

- did you have to adjust dosing

I appreciate any experience that you can convey.

Louis

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I sent a note with all the answers last night and it went south.

I'll try again.

You mention pill instead of pellet so hope that is a typo.

1. The pellets last 4 months typically

2. No blood test is required to qualify for the next set of pellets.

You can wait longer if you wish but this typically results in symptoms

if is time for the next set of pellets.

3. The pellet is a crystilline form of testosterone and dissolves

completely. These pellets have been available since the 50's if my

memory is correct. Pharmaceutical houses can not legally manufacture

pellets and those compounding pharmacies that provide pellets do not

make a lot of money that would allow advertising to promote pellets.

The cost for me to get pellets is about $450. Medicare in GA pays for

most of it leaving me to pay about $60.

4. As the testicles shut down when the level of T in the blood stream

goes up, the pellets are your only source and that can be determined

by your body wait.

5.There was a comment by a doctor that said this formula was incorrect

but it has stood the test of time and has been used for decades by Dr.

Gambrell a noted Reproductive Endocrinologist in Augusta, GA. Subtract

30 pounds from your total weight and for every remaining 10 pounds,

you should receive a 75 mg pellet inserted under the skin with a

trocar surgical tool in the doctors office. The tool leaves the

pellets a couple of inches from the incision and they do not ooze out

as some have said.

I have been receiving pellets since 1991 and receive 20 pellets every

4 months.

It is very hard to find a good pellet doctor but because the cost in

GA is so low and the air fares so reasonable, it may be cheaper to

travel by air to GA every 4 months than pay $1500 or more every 4 months.

ernestnolan

>

> Ernest,

>

> I am new to this group and have heard of the pellets, but there does

not

> seem to be alot of experience locally that I have heard about. I

live in a small

> town in Ontario Canada.

>

> I get this very uncomfortable feeling when I get an injection: hot,

sweaty

> and dosey for 1 to 2 days. I have received feedback that this is a

normal

> response. I cannot do the gels, I get no response. I may be

interested in the

> pill if someone has experience.

>

> A couple of questions if you do not mind:

>

> - does it last long

> - how is replacement determined

> - does the pill dissolve in place i.e. not removed

> - how is the T level regulated

> - did you have to adjust dosing

>

> I appreciate any experience that you can convey.

>

> Louis

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I sent a note with all the answers last night and it went south.

I'll try again.

You mention pill instead of pellet so hope that is a typo.

1. The pellets last 4 months typically

2. No blood test is required to qualify for the next set of pellets.

You can wait longer if you wish but this typically results in symptoms

if is time for the next set of pellets.

3. The pellet is a crystilline form of testosterone and dissolves

completely. These pellets have been available since the 50's if my

memory is correct. Pharmaceutical houses can not legally manufacture

pellets and those compounding pharmacies that provide pellets do not

make a lot of money that would allow advertising to promote pellets.

The cost for me to get pellets is about $450. Medicare in GA pays for

most of it leaving me to pay about $60.

4. As the testicles shut down when the level of T in the blood stream

goes up, the pellets are your only source and that can be determined

by your body wait.

5.There was a comment by a doctor that said this formula was incorrect

but it has stood the test of time and has been used for decades by Dr.

Gambrell a noted Reproductive Endocrinologist in Augusta, GA. Subtract

30 pounds from your total weight and for every remaining 10 pounds,

you should receive a 75 mg pellet inserted under the skin with a

trocar surgical tool in the doctors office. The tool leaves the

pellets a couple of inches from the incision and they do not ooze out

as some have said.

I have been receiving pellets since 1991 and receive 20 pellets every

4 months.

It is very hard to find a good pellet doctor but because the cost in

GA is so low and the air fares so reasonable, it may be cheaper to

travel by air to GA every 4 months than pay $1500 or more every 4 months.

ernestnolan

>

> Ernest,

>

> I am new to this group and have heard of the pellets, but there does

not

> seem to be alot of experience locally that I have heard about. I

live in a small

> town in Ontario Canada.

>

> I get this very uncomfortable feeling when I get an injection: hot,

sweaty

> and dosey for 1 to 2 days. I have received feedback that this is a

normal

> response. I cannot do the gels, I get no response. I may be

interested in the

> pill if someone has experience.

>

> A couple of questions if you do not mind:

>

> - does it last long

> - how is replacement determined

> - does the pill dissolve in place i.e. not removed

> - how is the T level regulated

> - did you have to adjust dosing

>

> I appreciate any experience that you can convey.

>

> Louis

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

thanks for the response.

Yes, I am interested possibly in the pellets. I like the idea of 4 months of

not going up and down and the needles. I sweat like a pig just at the thought

of a needle. My reaction is the high dosage for two weeks which may go away

if I dose more often as I have learned from this site. I have hooked up with

a good Urologist and he has mentioned the pellets. I am not sure if he can do

it but I will find out.

Yes, it sounds a bit pricey but I may be willing to give it a try. If it is

not yet practicle I will try the lower dosing more often. Medicare is not

quite completely free up here and I do not know if this is covered.

I weigh in at 200. Therefore I would be looking at 17 - 75mg pellets. I

would need this 3 times a year from here to the grave.

How is the scarring? I am 40 and this would be a few incisions for me....120

if I make it to 80. I guess this could be my death by 120 cuts but I would

be happy if it works.

Louis

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I wish you well in finding a good doctor that will give you 17 - 75 mg

pellets.

Medicare does not pay for this therapy anywhere except in GA and the

associated area under that particular medicare region. DARN IT

I have been receiving pellets since 1991 and I have now about 45

puntures from a trocar and do not look deformed when I look at my

backside in the mirror. I feel it has all been great and that is why I

am here talking up getting more people interested in pellets.

The pharmaceutical houses have dominated the TRT field too long already.

I will tell you my first set of pellets gave me easy erections and I

thought I had found the magic solution to my ED BUT NO. It gradually

slowed down this effect as my T levels stabilized and my severe age

related ED returned just as bad as before. I thought it would be great

again with the next set of pellest, BUT NO. The doctor said this was

a wonderful effect from increasing levels of T in the body.

I went back to reading books and found in 1992 a book by Dr. Irwin

Goldstein, Boston Univ. in the local library. He mentioned trimix for

age related ED and in 3 visits I had solved my ED problems. It still

works great even today at 74. Look for his books. It is better than I

remember as a teen.

ernestnolan

>

> thanks for the response.

>

> Yes, I am interested possibly in the pellets. I like the idea of 4

months of

> not going up and down and the needles. I sweat like a pig just at

the thought

> of a needle. My reaction is the high dosage for two weeks which may

go away

> if I dose more often as I have learned from this site. I have

hooked up with

> a good Urologist and he has mentioned the pellets. I am not sure if

he can do

> it but I will find out.

>

> Yes, it sounds a bit pricey but I may be willing to give it a try.

If it is

> not yet practicle I will try the lower dosing more often. Medicare

is not

> quite completely free up here and I do not know if this is covered.

>

> I weigh in at 200. Therefore I would be looking at 17 - 75mg

pellets. I

> would need this 3 times a year from here to the grave.

>

> How is the scarring? I am 40 and this would be a few incisions for

me....120

> if I make it to 80. I guess this could be my death by 120 cuts but I

would

> be happy if it works.

>

> Louis

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ernest-

Surely you jest when you say you don't understand having an interest in

large testicles while on TRT? Even Dr references the psychological

benefits of testicle size in his TRT: Recipe for Success papers. Even if

it's just cosmetic, I think most guys would rather have normal testicle size

than little shrivelled grapes.

Use of HCG definitely stimulates testicle size in my case...I'm on cypionate

injections, not pellets, but the principle is the same.

Are there studies to show HCG works to prevent testicle shrinkage while on

TRT? I don't know, but there's plenty of patients out there who will attest

to not only that, but a sense of feeling better with HCG in the regimine.

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of ernestnolan

Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 4:55 PM

Subject: Re: Pellets and my experience with Total T levels

(long)

<snip>

Regarding the testicles shrinking, when receiving TRT the testicles

shut down and do shrink and a man can become sterile if TRT is

continued. It was my understanding you do not supplement pellet

therapy with anything else.

<snip>

HCG and HMG should not be able to enlarge your testicles as long as

your are on pellets which shut them down. The pituitary lowers the

hormone to the testicles that causes them not to produce T as the your

hormone regulation system senses you do not need any.

I do not understand your interest in having large testicles at the

same time choosing to shut them down with pellet therapy.

..

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=6305854/grpspId=1705061124/msgId

=37248/stime=1161129467/nc1=3848634/nc2=3848506/nc3=3848538>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

This note goes back a long way. I probably will repeat myself in some

of my comments.

I used to feel strongly in my 20's about loosing my wisdom teeth which

didn't come in straight and had to be dug out. I felt I would not be

totally me anymore. Then I lost my hair on top. I wasn't happy about

that either.

I lost one testicle in high school thru something called a

strangulation of the testicle. It swelled up the size of my fist,

really, and I could not walk for more than a month. Mom had a DO treat

me with spinal manipulation who knew nothing about this condition. It

gradually reduced in size so I could return to school wearing a jock

strap. I worried I wouldn't be able to have a normal sex life and the

4 kids we had.

When I turned 60 and found out my remaining testicle was not working

well and I needed TRT to get back my health. I somehow didn't mind

like others do when my testicle shrank down to the size of a large

grape. The benefits of TRT were great and the smaller testicle didn't

bother me. It was still bigger than the other one that atrophied in

the 40's. I do not know if there was an alternative treatment in 1991

but my testicle was being driven with a high level of the hormone

messenger from the pituitary that tries to get the testicle to produce.

I have also heard some are very concerned about the quantity of semen

when they ejaculate. That is something that I never thought of. I knew

my semen was fertile as we had kids within a couple of months of

making the decision to have another.

I know some people feel very strongly about this subject. I think we

are all different and some things matter more than others to us all.

ernestnolan

>

> Ernest-

>

> Surely you jest when you say you don't understand having an interest in

> large testicles while on TRT? Even Dr references the psychological

> benefits of testicle size in his TRT: Recipe for Success papers.

Even if

> it's just cosmetic, I think most guys would rather have normal

testicle size

> than little shrivelled grapes.

>

> Use of HCG definitely stimulates testicle size in my case...I'm on

cypionate

> injections, not pellets, but the principle is the same.

>

> Are there studies to show HCG works to prevent testicle shrinkage

while on

> TRT? I don't know, but there's plenty of patients out there who

will attest

> to not only that, but a sense of feeling better with HCG in the

regimine.

>

>

> _____

>

> From:

[mailto: ]

> On Behalf Of ernestnolan

> Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 4:55 PM

>

> Subject: Re: Pellets and my experience with Total T

levels

> (long)

>

>

>

> <snip>

>

> Regarding the testicles shrinking, when receiving TRT the testicles

> shut down and do shrink and a man can become sterile if TRT is

> continued. It was my understanding you do not supplement pellet

> therapy with anything else.

>

> <snip>

>

> HCG and HMG should not be able to enlarge your testicles as long as

> your are on pellets which shut them down. The pituitary lowers the

> hormone to the testicles that causes them not to produce T as the your

> hormone regulation system senses you do not need any.

>

> I do not understand your interest in having large testicles at the

> same time choosing to shut them down with pellet therapy.

>

>

>

> .

>

>

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=6305854/grpspId=1705061124/msgId

> =37248/stime=1161129467/nc1=3848634/nc2=3848506/nc3=3848538>

>

>

>

>

>