Guest guest Posted December 7, 2005 Report Share Posted December 7, 2005 E2 can go up and down fast so your better off waiting for the test post it when it comes in. Low T can make you feel like that also. Phil Jack <rockin813@...> wrote: I have symptoms of high E2...such as excess fat around my stomach and chest at the same time having well defined arms, shoulders, back, etc. i work out regularly and while i did cardio for a while i noticed my stomach/chest never toned up while the rest of my body continues to do so. as for nipples, nothing out of the ordinary. do get the hot feeling often while others don't. and also feel bloated every now and than out of nowhere..just wake up one morning and my stomach is so bloated...same with face..has the puffy look. as for morning wood...very weak. libido is not there. i had one E2 test done after taking TRT for 10 days or so...results came back at 17 which suggests i don't have a problem..yet the symptoms are there. i took another E2 test last week after being off TRT for 11 days...should get the results back here shortly along with T levels and LH levels. philip georgian <pmgamer18@...> wrote: Jack do you have any symptoms of high E2 like sore and hard nipples, feeling hot and having a red face and upper body. Do you still have morning wood and a good libido. One should have there E2 Estradiol tested first before going on DIM. Going to low is bad news ask . Phil Jack <rockin813@...> wrote: im not taking arimidex...or any type of TRT. just looking to take Indolplex with Dim to see if it can help. Summers <rsummers@...> wrote: what's this Dim/Indoplex stuff and where can one buy it? it's an aromatase (sp?) inhibitor right. ?----- DIM (Diindolylmethane) is just the opposite; it is an *androgen* inhibitor (androgen antagonist). I have never gotten the point of taking DIM esp if one is already taking Arimidex and I very much wonder if the DIM might not be compounding estradiol problems for many guys on TRT. http://tinyurl.com/7hnsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 5, 2007 Report Share Posted August 5, 2007 My new Dr. prescribed 6000 per week of HCG and to stop Androgel. This has reduced my anxiety level. T is around 397. Used to be around 900. E2 is going up but he does not want to address it yet. I am concerned about water retention and gynocomastia. I think I have gained some weight already. I go to the gym everyday to keep some form of sanity and it helps a lot! DIM can help E2 management I heard. What dosage would your recomend for the 100mg pill. How long does it take to feel any affetcs, and what are those effects exactly?? I may go back to low HCG and Androgel. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 5, 2007 Report Share Posted August 5, 2007 First I feel the need to warn you doing this high a dose of HCG 6000 IU's of HCG for to long will make your testis desenstitzed to HCG and LH, FSH you will become Primary meaning your Testis will not be able to make testostereone. The reasion I say this is because your testis can only make so much and your not a women trying to have a baby. Men with low T doing HCG have good levels at 60 IU's to 100 IU's a week anymore then 500 IU's a day will burn out your testis. HCG will make your testis make testosterone if they work but they can only make so much. I was doing 500 IU's 3 x's a week and my levels were at 1200 but my lab at the time went up to 1592 for the top of the range if it was Quest my labs were about 800. We lowed my dose to 350 IU's 2x's a week and my levels are about the same so the extra HCG you take turns into Estradiol this makes things worse. Go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for Success and the HCG Update. > > My new Dr. prescribed 6000 per week of HCG and to stop Androgel. This > has reduced my anxiety level. T is around 397. Used to be around 900. > E2 is going up but he does not want to address it yet. I am concerned > about water retention and gynocomastia. I think I have gained some > weight already. I go to the gym everyday to keep some form of sanity > and it helps a lot! > DIM can help E2 management I heard. What dosage would your recomend > for the 100mg pill. How long does it take to feel any affetcs, and > what are those effects exactly?? I may go back to low HCG and Androgel. > > Thanks. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 6, 2007 Report Share Posted August 6, 2007 Thank you , That is the seocnd Dr. who prescribed high doses to me. I think I'd better take things into my own hands. He said I was primary therefore I had to take HCG??? Isnt being primary having testes that do not produce any T? The HCG did make them produce T as I went up some. I should just go back to the gel with 250 IU X3 per week. Thank you Phil Stephan. --------------------------------- Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 6, 2007 Report Share Posted August 6, 2007 Yes men that are primary only make so much T and adding HCG the testis will not make more but there are lh cells all over the body that HCG keeps them working even in the brain so both primary and secondary men on TRT should do HCG. Do you get a feeling of well being after your HCG shot this is lh cells in the brain going to work. Doing to much can burn all the LH cells out. Dr. Johh says never do more the 500 IU's a day. Most go on gels and do 250 IU's every 3rd day. Stephan Pochet <spochet@...> wrote: Thank you , That is the seocnd Dr. who prescribed high doses to me. I think I'd better take things into my own hands. He said I was primary therefore I had to take HCG??? Isnt being primary having testes that do not produce any T? The HCG did make them produce T as I went up some. I should just go back to the gel with 250 IU X3 per week. Thank you Phil Stephan. --------------------------------- Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Ok the best one I have found you can get at 2 sites It's called Indolplex/DIM it comes in tablets so you can cut them in parts if your going down to low on your Estradiol " E2 " . There is a lot of junk out there called DIM. Here are the links only take one tablet and get on some Zinc this helps keep your testis healthy and holds down E2 levels a little I use NOW brand ZMA and Zinc lower Copper levels so take 2 mgs. of Copper at lunch never take Zinc and Copper together. http://www.myvitanet.com/indolplex-with-dim-60-tab-phytopharmica.html http://www.ritecare.com/prodsheets/PHY-15336.html http://www.myvitanet.com/zmaanspre90c.html http://www.myvitanet.com/biocitrate-copper-2-mg-60-count-solaray.html If you don't have night time and morning wood or you have lost your sex life it can be high E2 levels. So taking this form of DIM in about 2 weeks you should have your night time and morning wood back this means your at your best levels for E2 your wood is a good or best gauge for this. So if it comes back then later you lose it this means your going down to low on your E2 so stop the DIM until the wood comes back that day go back on it but cut the tablet in half. Co-Moderator Phil > From: troubledfinuser <no_reply > > Subject: DIM > > Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 7:19 PM > Hi again. > > What is the preffered DIM called and where can i get some > of these > pills? I have tried anti E2 in the past with a bad result > but im > thinking estrogen metabolism could be a completely > different story. > So im gonna give it a try. > > Thx > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Hi, I brought DIM as advised. I just swallowed the tablet. How come you have to cut it? What are the benefits in and Zinc? Thank you. > From: troubledfinuser <no_reply@group s.com> > Subject: DIM > > Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 7:19 PM > Hi again. > > What is the preffered DIM called and where can i get some > of these > pills? I have tried anti E2 in the past with a bad result > but im > thinking estrogen metabolism could be a completely > different story. > So im gonna give it a try. > > Thx > > > ------------ --------- --------- ------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 You don't need to cut the DIM in half unless later you find your Estradiol is going down to low I gauge this by my night time and morning wood it comes back on the DIM and if your wood stops your going down to low your wood is your best gage for this so stop the DIM until your wood comes back that day go back on it but take less cut the table in half. Co-Moderator Phil > > > > > From: troubledfinuser <no_reply@group > s.com> > > > Subject: DIM > > > > > > Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 7:19 PM > > > Hi again. > > > > > > What is the preffered DIM called and where can i get > some > > > of these > > > pills? I have tried anti E2 in the past with a bad > result > > > but im > > > thinking estrogen metabolism could be a completely > > > different story. > > > So im gonna give it a try. > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Thank you and I hope your health improves. I also hope your family and friends continue the moral support needed in such a difficult time. > > > > > From: troubledfinuser <no_reply@grou p > s.com> > > > Subject: DIM > > > > > > Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 7:19 PM > > > Hi again. > > > > > > What is the preffered DIM called and where can i get > some > > > of these > > > pills? I have tried anti E2 in the past with a bad > result > > > but im > > > thinking estrogen metabolism could be a completely > > > different story. > > > So im gonna give it a try. > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 I bought my Indolplex/DIM by PhytoPharmica here http://organicpharmacy.org/products/Indolplex.With.DIM/SKU:PP15336 It was a few cents cheaper than vitanet.com site, and much cheaper than the ritecare.com site. It took a couple of days to ship out, but only 2 to arrive at my door with UPS ground. Just some FYI, that I hope may save everyone some $$, ;-) Thanks, Jim On 11/24/08, philip georgian <pmgamer18@...> wrote: > > Ok the best one I have found you can get at 2 sites It's called > Indolplex/DIM it comes in tablets so you can cut them in parts if your going > down to low on your Estradiol " E2 " . There is a lot of junk out there called > DIM. Here are the links only take one tablet and get on some Zinc this helps > keep your testis healthy and holds down E2 levels a little I use NOW brand > ZMA and Zinc lower Copper levels so take 2 mgs. of Copper at lunch never > take Zinc and Copper together. > http://www.myvitanet.com/indolplex-with-dim-60-tab-phytopharmica.html > http://www.ritecare.com/prodsheets/PHY-15336.html > http://www.myvitanet.com/zmaanspre90c.html > http://www.myvitanet.com/biocitrate-copper-2-mg-60-count-solaray.html > > If you don't have night time and morning wood or you have lost your sex > life it can be high E2 levels. So taking this form of DIM in about 2 weeks > you should have your night time and morning wood back this means your at > your best levels for E2 your wood is a good or best gauge for this. So if it > comes back then later you lose it this means your going down to low on your > E2 so stop the DIM until the wood comes back that day go back on it but cut > the tablet in half. > > Co-Moderator > Phil > > > > > From: troubledfinuser <no_reply <no_reply%40> > > > > Subject: DIM > > < %40> > > Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 7:19 PM > > Hi again. > > > > What is the preffered DIM called and where can i get some > > of these > > pills? I have tried anti E2 in the past with a bad result > > but im > > thinking estrogen metabolism could be a completely > > different story. > > So im gonna give it a try. > > > > Thx > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 At 08:09 PM 11/24/2008, you wrote: >I bought my Indolplex/DIM by PhytoPharmica here does anyone know if this supplement contains vitamin K?? My guess is yes but don't know. If you are taking warfarin (coumadin) vitamin K content MATTERS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 > > >I bought my Indolplex/DIM by PhytoPharmica here > > > does anyone know if this supplement contains vitamin K?? My guess is > yes but don't know. If you are taking warfarin (coumadin) vitamin K > content MATTERS! This is the ingredient list listed on the bottle of the Indolplex/DIM brand by PhytoPharmica if it helps: Supplement Facts Serving Size: One (1) Tablet Servings Per Container: 60 Amount Per Serving Daily Value Calcium (As Calcium Carbonate) 340 mg 34% A Proprietary Complex (Indolplex Complex) Modified Food Starch, 25 Percent Diindolylmethane (DIM), D-Alpha Tocopheryl Succinate, Phosphatidylcholine (Soy), and Silicon Dioxide 120 mg ** Indolplex and DIM are trademarks of and are licensed from BioResponse, L.L.C.; U.S. patent 6,086,915. ** Daily Value Not Established. Percent Daily Values are based on a 2,000 calorie diet. Other Ingredients Carnauba Wax, Cellulose, Magnesium Stearate, Modified Cellulose, Modified Cellulose Gum, Silicon Dioxide, Soy Lecithin, Stearic Acid, Titanium Dioxide My multi-vit has Vit K in it, and I wonder since Testosterone can cause your blood to be too thick(I even have to do therapeutic phlebotomies every now and then, since I can't donate blood due to lyme disease) if I should get a multi-vitamin w/o Vit.K ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2008 Report Share Posted November 25, 2008 At 10:34 PM 11/24/2008, you wrote: > > > > > >I bought my Indolplex/DIM by PhytoPharmica here > > > > > > does anyone know if this supplement contains vitamin K?? My guess >is > > yes but don't know. If you are taking warfarin (coumadin) vitamin >K > > content MATTERS! > >This is the ingredient list listed on the bottle of the Indolplex/DIM >brand by PhytoPharmica if it helps: > >Supplement Facts >Serving Size: One (1) Tablet >Servings Per Container: 60 > >Amount >Per Serving Daily >Value >Calcium >(As Calcium Carbonate) 340 mg 34% >A Proprietary Complex >(Indolplex Complex) >Modified Food Starch, 25 Percent Diindolylmethane (DIM), D-Alpha >Tocopheryl Succinate, Phosphatidylcholine (Soy), and Silicon Dioxide >120 mg ** > >Indolplex and DIM are trademarks of and are licensed from >BioResponse, L.L.C.; U.S. patent 6,086,915. >** Daily Value Not Established. Percent Daily Values are based on a >2,000 calorie diet. > >Other Ingredients >Carnauba Wax, Cellulose, Magnesium Stearate, Modified Cellulose, >Modified Cellulose Gum, Silicon Dioxide, Soy Lecithin, Stearic Acid, >Titanium Dioxide > >My multi-vit has Vit K in it, and I wonder since Testosterone can >cause your blood to be too thick(I even have to do therapeutic >phlebotomies every now and then, since I can't donate blood due to >lyme disease) if I should get a multi-vitamin w/o Vit.K ? I saw this on the web but thanks. I e-mailed the company. hopefully i will get a reply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2008 Report Share Posted November 25, 2008 " since Testosterone can cause your blood to be too thick " This is very interesting. I did not know this. If others concur with this statement, no wonder so many men experience MI (myocardial infarction) in other words, a heart attack! Thick blood clots easily. Now my question then is if Testosterone causes thickening of the blood, and Aspirin (and other derivatives) thins the blood, are thinning agents working against the Testosterone, thereby reducing its effect? If so, by how much, and should they be taken at opposite ends of the day, i.e. Testosterone in the morning and Aspirin (et.al.) in the evening? ids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2008 Report Share Posted November 25, 2008 It's a misconception that testosterone thickens the blood. It does not. Testosterone administered exogenously, as in TRT, can cause too many red blood cells to be produced and cause a condition called polycythemia in which there is too much blood (increased hemoglobin and hematocrit). Too much blood can become thick and clot but a normal blood count, coupled with high normal testosterone levels does not put one at risk for clotting. Testosterone is actually an anti-clotting hormone. Estrogen is the hormone that can cause clots. And no, aspirin does not interfere with testosterone, in fact, men on TRT should take an aspirin daily (low dose) in case blood counts get too high so as to reduce the chances of clots. > > " since Testosterone can cause your blood to be too thick " > This is very interesting. I did not know this. If others concur with this > statement, no wonder so many men experience MI (myocardial infarction) in > other words, a heart attack! Thick blood clots easily. > > Now my question then is if Testosterone causes thickening of the blood, and > Aspirin (and other derivatives) thins the blood, are thinning agents working > against the Testosterone, thereby reducing its effect? If so, by how much, > and should they be taken at opposite ends of the day, i.e. Testosterone in > the morning and Aspirin (et.al.) in the evening? > > ids. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2008 Report Share Posted November 25, 2008 from the company!!!! --------------------------------------------------------------------------------\ --------------------------------------------------------------------------------\ --------------------------------------------------------------------------------\ ------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you for your inquiry! The Indolplex with DIM is free of Vitamin K. If we can answer further questions, we are here for you. Healthy Regards, ~Your Organic Pharmacy Team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.