was:Re: Clarification of a message: now: rebellion and mercury b

[Guest guest]

We are some of the people chelating a teen who is doing very dangerous things.

She gets around every safeguard we put in place to try to keep her safe on the

internet, and she makes very dangerous decisions and actions and just lies about

it. She has even been violent to her siblings but always denies it. Even when

two other sibs confirm a story of violence, she would say they were conspiring

together to lie about her. You should see her on round. On round she gets much

worse. Much worse side glancing and behavior.......I can literally see

this...toxicity coming out of her during chelation. She is literally sponging

out bad attitude. Like she is a sponge filled with bad attitude and chelation is

wringing her out. She gets way more " blank look " on round than off round.

Lots of side glancing. Looking through you instead of at you. Almost totally in

bed sleeping the entire round. Her behavior was so bad, we were thinking of

taking her to one of those " homes " for teens where they get a taste of detention

home living for a couple weeks to kind of shock her into reality, but instead we

are chelating.

We homeschool. If I sent her to school, I pretty much guarantee with her

attitude she would get kicked out. My mom said if she was put in detention,

they would put her in lockdown! Not that she doesn't have a really sweet person

under all that mercury just waiting to come out!!!

We haven't seen gains yet...but this is only our second round. We are also using

homeopathic remedies that have decreased her sleep from 16 hours a day to 12.

Her ability to continue living here depends on chelation working, basically.

Talk about waiting until the last minute to chelate. She too, like our first

child became much worse during puberty. Before puberty she had a occasional

problems with dishonesty or antagonizm but I wouldn't have described it beyond

normal. What we have now with her behavior is far outside of what is considered

normal social behavior. We like to call it " mercury toxic " behavior.

What is really scary is her current seeming inability or refusal to learn from

mistakes but just head on keep doing the same things to get in trouble over and

over again.

Child #3 gets grounded and says " wow, I am never going to do X again "

She gets grounded and claims it was all not her fault and I am mean. There is

no acknowledement of needing to change behavior. She doesn't even get it at

all. That is one reason why my husband and I look at each other and feel

compassion on her that she is mercury toxic and sick. This is not normal.

[Guest guest]

Thanks, , for sharing your personal experience, which, believe it or not,

is moderate to mild compared to what I have witnessed. This was very helpful.

The best to you and your family on your quest.

[ ] Re: was:Re: Clarification of a message: now:

rebellion and mercury b

We are some of the people chelating a teen who is doing very dangerous things.

She gets around every safeguard we put in place to try to keep her safe on the

internet, and she makes very dangerous decisions and actions and just lies about

it. She has even been violent to her siblings but always denies it. Even when

two other sibs confirm a story of violence, she would say they were conspiring

together to lie about her. You should see her on round. On round she gets much

worse. Much worse side glancing and behavior.......I can literally see

this...toxicity coming out of her during chelation. She is literally sponging

out bad attitude. Like she is a sponge filled with bad attitude and chelation is

wringing her out. She gets way more " blank look " on round than off round. Lots

of side glancing. Looking through you instead of at you. Almost totally in bed

sleeping the entire round. Her behavior was so bad, we were thinking of taking

her to one of those " homes " for teens where they get a taste of detention home

living for a couple weeks to kind of shock her into reality, but instead we are

chelating.

We homeschool. If I sent her to school, I pretty much guarantee with her

attitude she would get kicked out. My mom said if she was put in detention, they

would put her in lockdown! Not that she doesn't have a really sweet person under

all that mercury just waiting to come out!!!

We haven't seen gains yet...but this is only our second round. We are also

using homeopathic remedies that have decreased her sleep from 16 hours a day to

12.

Her ability to continue living here depends on chelation working, basically.

Talk about waiting until the last minute to chelate. She too, like our first

child became much worse during puberty. Before puberty she had a occasional

problems with dishonesty or antagonizm but I wouldn't have described it beyond

normal. What we have now with her behavior is far outside of what is considered

normal social behavior. We like to call it " mercury toxic " behavior.

What is really scary is her current seeming inability or refusal to learn from

mistakes but just head on keep doing the same things to get in trouble over and

over again.

Child #3 gets grounded and says " wow, I am never going to do X again "

She gets grounded and claims it was all not her fault and I am mean. There is

no acknowledement of needing to change behavior. She doesn't even get it at all.

That is one reason why my husband and I look at each other and feel compassion

on her that she is mercury toxic and sick. This is not normal.

[Guest guest]

[ ] Re: was:Re: Clarification of a message: now:

rebellion and mercury b

We are some of the people chelating a teen who is doing very dangerous things.

She gets around every safeguard we put in place to try to keep her safe on the

internet, and she makes very dangerous decisions and actions and just lies about

it. She has even been violent to her siblings but always denies it. Even when

two other sibs confirm a story of violence, she would say they were conspiring

together to lie about her. You should see her on round. On round she gets much

worse. Much worse side glancing and behavior.......I can literally see

this...toxicity coming out of her during chelation. She is literally sponging

out bad attitude. Like she is a sponge filled with bad attitude and chelation is

wringing her out. She gets way more " blank look " on round than off round. Lots

of side glancing. Looking through you instead of at you. Almost totally in bed

sleeping the entire round. Her behavior was so bad, we were thinking of taking

her to one of those " homes " for teens where they get a taste of detention home

living for a couple weeks to kind of shock her into reality, but instead we are

chelating.

We homeschool. If I sent her to school, I pretty much guarantee with her

attitude she would get kicked out. My mom said if she was put in detention, they

would put her in lockdown! Not that she doesn't have a really sweet person under

all that mercury just waiting to come out!!!

We haven't seen gains yet...but this is only our second round. We are also

using homeopathic remedies that have decreased her sleep from 16 hours a day to

12.

Her ability to continue living here depends on chelation working, basically.

Talk about waiting until the last minute to chelate. She too, like our first

child became much worse during puberty. Before puberty she had a occasional

problems with dishonesty or antagonizm but I wouldn't have described it beyond

normal. What we have now with her behavior is far outside of what is considered

normal social behavior. We like to call it " mercury toxic " behavior.

What is really scary is her current seeming inability or refusal to learn from

mistakes but just head on keep doing the same things to get in trouble over and

over again.

Child #3 gets grounded and says " wow, I am never going to do X again "

She gets grounded and claims it was all not her fault and I am mean. There is

no acknowledement of needing to change behavior. She doesn't even get it at all.

That is one reason why my husband and I look at each other and feel compassion

on her that she is mercury toxic and sick. This is not normal.

[Guest guest]

Sorry for coming on top of this but now to ..

, your daughter slept an awful lot as you point out. Ths suggests to me

some problem with sugar metabolism. Can you " sneak " some chromium in wholefoods

( see the internet) or perhaps supps into her diet ( you can srpinkle quietly

over foods). Oatmeal has chromium in it.....

Also change your house to goats milk. The conventional milk has A1 which when

digested produces betacasomorphine, makes people dopey....

I doubt you'll get her off gluten but maybe you can try.

My sleepiness has changed a lot since I introduced these changes.

[ ] Re: was:Re: Clarification of a message: now:

rebellion and mercury b

We are some of the people chelating a teen who is doing very dangerous things.

She gets around every safeguard we put in place to try to keep her safe on the

internet, and she makes very dangerous decisions and actions and just lies about

it. She has even been violent to her siblings but always denies it. Even when

two other sibs confirm a story of violence, she would say they were conspiring

together to lie about her. You should see her on round. On round she gets much

worse. Much worse side glancing and behavior.......I can literally see

this...toxicity coming out of her during chelation. She is literally sponging

out bad attitude. Like she is a sponge filled with bad attitude and chelation is

wringing her out. She gets way more " blank look " on round than off round. Lots

of side glancing. Looking through you instead of at you. Almost totally in bed

sleeping the entire round. Her behavior was so bad, we were thinking of taking

her to one of those " homes " for teens where they get a taste of detention home

living for a couple weeks to kind of shock her into reality, but instead we are

chelating.

We homeschool. If I sent her to school, I pretty much guarantee with her

attitude she would get kicked out. My mom said if she was put in detention, they

would put her in lockdown! Not that she doesn't have a really sweet person under

all that mercury just waiting to come out!!!

We haven't seen gains yet...but this is only our second round. We are also

using homeopathic remedies that have decreased her sleep from 16 hours a day to

12.

Her ability to continue living here depends on chelation working, basically.

Talk about waiting until the last minute to chelate. She too, like our first

child became much worse during puberty. Before puberty she had a occasional

problems with dishonesty or antagonizm but I wouldn't have described it beyond

normal. What we have now with her behavior is far outside of what is considered

normal social behavior. We like to call it " mercury toxic " behavior.

What is really scary is her current seeming inability or refusal to learn from

mistakes but just head on keep doing the same things to get in trouble over and

over again.

Child #3 gets grounded and says " wow, I am never going to do X again "

She gets grounded and claims it was all not her fault and I am mean. There is

no acknowledement of needing to change behavior. She doesn't even get it at all.

That is one reason why my husband and I look at each other and feel compassion

on her that she is mercury toxic and sick. This is not normal.

[Guest guest]

>>Homeschooling past a certain point 10 or 12 is, IMHO, not advisable

as I have known several children homeschooled and sent off to college

and they don't do so well. At some point you have to expose them to

the craziness of the world and teach them how to live with it.

Forgive my blood pressure for raising a bit whenever I see a blanket

recommendation such as this, but my 23 yo, home school graduate, Senior

Design Specialist at a national media company who graduated from college

with her bachelor's degree at 21 years old, having started at 17, who

also not only captured the " Outstanding Senior " in her major (a large

one) and married the previous year's " Outstanding Senior, " whose friends

also captured " Outstanding Senior " in their respective majors, many of

whom were homeschooled, and were annoyed to no end by the antics of the

" public school " refined classmates is proof that this is just whooey.

One of her professors was appalled that she was not voting her first

year at college, only to find out the student he pegged as a senior was

really only 17! And, she lived on campus with no problems. People here

made up stories about a terrible transition for her . . and really made

me ANGRY. She transitioned as well as, if not better than her public

school peers. As is my 2nd daughter who is, at 21, a Production

Supervisor after graduating from homeschooling and transitioning

smoothly to college work and full time employment. My son who is

affected, homeschooled through high school, and accepted to his school

of choice on a music scholarship, and I am also NOT concerned about his

ability to transition - more so since I've discovered this board and

have started dealing biomedically, and soon with chelation, with his

issues.

I can't stand the " I knew a few who had problems " defense for

subjecting our children to such a false entity of the public school

system. Nowhere on earth is the public school model an example of real

life. I've been there; I've been to college. I know, don't even try to

tell me differently. That is why I only recommend that parents who are

going to be fearful and let fear drive their lives send their children

to public school. I'm not at all fearful that my children will not be

properly socialized or prepared for the real world by letting them

educate at home. I've seen many go before me for whom it worked

grandly; our family is quickly becoming an example to prove these

outrageous claims of need for public school to " prepare " for the world

of adulthood wrong, and I wish people who choose not to homeschool would

stop using such tactless lines to prove we shouldn't do what succeeds.

If you want to prove how children shouldn't be prepared for life beyond

schooling, just look to the miserable failure of the public school

system. All the college drop outs my daughters know WERE public

schooled! I'm tired of defending homeschooling to people who are

fearful of it by giving the glowing examples of how I " socialize " my

children, keep structure in their lives, etc. What we do is LIVE LIFE

in reality, that has plenty of exposure to the " craziness " of real life,

not the fake life of public school. From now on, let me point to the

miserable failures of public school, which most people who bash

homeschooling and advise against it seem to be absolutely 100% blind to

when they advise people to send their children off to the public school

I call Jail. And don't you dare come back and say my family must be the

exception.

and that is not IMHO - that is my example which I lead by life and know

works, tangible, tested and tried truth and more than advisable to raise

stable adults who don't need a mold to fit into.

I'm going back to Christmas with my family now.

P.

19 years of homeschooling, homeschool support group leader, and mom who

graduated them all - but the one to go who is 13, she too will graduate

from high school as a home schooler

we even have the nerve to " unschool " much of knowledge and are not

fearful of failing

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: danasview

My #1 is 13yo and in 8th grade. On Mondays, he has chess club and

fencing club/lessons. On Tuesdays, he has Boy Scouts. On Wednesdays,

he had piano lessons and church youth group. The Boy Scouts and youth

group have several outings, camping trips, service projects, etc.

===>These are varied and nice experiences.

He also has the option of helping select his curriculum. [i don't let

him eliminate his math LOL].

===>You're no fun :-)

I asked him for his high school years, if he wanted to be enrolled in

a campus school, or continue homeschooling. [He has experience with

campus schools, he went to a private kindergarten, which was NOT a

good experience for him.]

====>He may be making this decision based on that one bad experience, if he's

detoxed enough he may find the experience enjoyable, now.

===>I had lots of friends in high school and college that did crazy things

that I would never have dreamed of doing, but I learned a whole lot, from the

crazy things I did and the crazy things others did. Things and feelings I would

never have known if I had done everything " right " , like compassion and empathy

for other people who make mistakes and a whole lot of what not to do.

I know one boy who is AS. He was homeschooled through his high school

years, and now is enrolled in an online college. He loves it.

===>Here, to me, is the problem. And what then? Online work? Online

marriage, children? Sorry, trying not to judge, but what kind of life is this?

Who would chose this life for their child? This is probably one of the many

reasons Andy advises to detox them early.

I certainly don't want him " socializing " for long hours every day with most of

the high school kids in this area who are considered " typical " .

====>Now..... " all " typical teenagers are bad? If I thought this I would have

just left ours the way she was. There are many fine typical teenagers some of

whom do some goofy things and then grow up to be fine upstanding members of

their community, I've seen it a number of times. These typical kids are the very

SAME people they are going to have contact with in college and work, what then?

Normal adolescence is a time for experimenting, with different roles,

different people and sometimes different substances. It's probably the only time

in life we have for these experiences.

Normal adolescence is not never making mistakes and the vast majority of kids

who live this way in adolescence end up making some whopper mistakes as young or

middle age adults when they realize they missed their only time for

experimentation.

Did none of you ever do anything crazy as a teenager? Boy I did. Do you not

expect your teens not to do crazy things when they're teenagers? I think it's

unrealistic and unnatural not to expect it. If I had a teen who never thought of

doing anything crazy, I'd worry and then I'd promote it.

Very interesting topic, thanks,

[Guest guest]

Thanks, for presenting another side of the story, but calm down! Noone

should be on a board unless they can handle differing opinions without getting

angry. Noone is going to force you to send your child to school, just discussing

things. It's a mark of a mature adult and a nontoxic one who can accept others'

differing opinions without experiencing disequilibrium in their mood. This is

just a discussion, treat it accordingly.

Re: [ ] was:Re: Clarification of a message: now:

rebellion and mercury b

>>Homeschooling past a certain point 10 or 12 is, IMHO, not advisable

as I have known several children homeschooled and sent off to college

and they don't do so well. At some point you have to expose them to

the craziness of the world and teach them how to live with it.

Forgive my blood pressure for raising a bit whenever I see a blanket

recommendation such as this, but my 23 yo, home school graduate, Senior

Design Specialist at a national media company who graduated from college

with her bachelor's degree at 21 years old, having started at 17, who

also not only captured the " Outstanding Senior " in her major (a large

one) and married the previous year's " Outstanding Senior, " whose friends

also captured " Outstanding Senior " in their respective majors, many of

whom were homeschooled, and were annoyed to no end by the antics of the

" public school " refined classmates is proof that this is just whooey.

One of her professors was appalled that she was not voting her first

year at college, only to find out the student he pegged as a senior was

really only 17! And, she lived on campus with no problems. People here

made up stories about a terrible transition for her . . and really made

me ANGRY. She transitioned as well as, if not better than her public

school peers. As is my 2nd daughter who is, at 21, a Production

Supervisor after graduating from homeschooling and transitioning

smoothly to college work and full time employment. My son who is

affected, homeschooled through high school, and accepted to his school

of choice on a music scholarship, and I am also NOT concerned about his

ability to transition - more so since I've discovered this board and

have started dealing biomedically, and soon with chelation, with his

issues.

I can't stand the " I knew a few who had problems " defense for

subjecting our children to such a false entity of the public school

system. Nowhere on earth is the public school model an example of real

life. I've been there; I've been to college. I know, don't even try to

tell me differently. That is why I only recommend that parents who are

going to be fearful and let fear drive their lives send their children

to public school. I'm not at all fearful that my children will not be

properly socialized or prepared for the real world by letting them

educate at home. I've seen many go before me for whom it worked

grandly; our family is quickly becoming an example to prove these

outrageous claims of need for public school to " prepare " for the world

of adulthood wrong, and I wish people who choose not to homeschool would

stop using such tactless lines to prove we shouldn't do what succeeds.

If you want to prove how children shouldn't be prepared for life beyond

schooling, just look to the miserable failure of the public school

system. All the college drop outs my daughters know WERE public

schooled! I'm tired of defending homeschooling to people who are

fearful of it by giving the glowing examples of how I " socialize " my

children, keep structure in their lives, etc. What we do is LIVE LIFE

in reality, that has plenty of exposure to the " craziness " of real life,

not the fake life of public school. From now on, let me point to the

miserable failures of public school, which most people who bash

homeschooling and advise against it seem to be absolutely 100% blind to

when they advise people to send their children off to the public school

I call Jail. And don't you dare come back and say my family must be the

exception.

and that is not IMHO - that is my example which I lead by life and know

works, tangible, tested and tried truth and more than advisable to raise

stable adults who don't need a mold to fit into.

I'm going back to Christmas with my family now.

P.

19 years of homeschooling, homeschool support group leader, and mom who

graduated them all - but the one to go who is 13, she too will graduate

from high school as a home schooler

we even have the nerve to " unschool " much of knowledge and are not

fearful of failing

[Guest guest]

That was very adult of you, , to attack me as unstable because I

found your disconnected recommendation enough to reply to in a serious,

concrete manner with real examples and enthusiasm. (learned the

appropriateness of accurate proofs in Geometry 101, not Psych)

You now have a few glowing examples of how it DOES work to add to your

analysis of the recommendation though. I would also make sure you point

out the glowing failures of public schools before you recommend it so

highly as an appropriate life experience to a perceived failure of

homeschooling. I won't " calm down! " as you put it, about something I am

passionate about that helps the children, any more than Andy will stop

raging against dangerous chelation protocols and treatments for our

children. If you can't be enthusiastic about what helps and point out

obvious error when you see it, you don't realize its importance. The

statement you made is no different than those who show up here after

trying those dangerous chelation techniques or seeing people damaged and

telling us that Andy's method won't work either, it is all a scam. You

might try seeing homeschooling in the light of what works, and in the

light of its high percentage of success compared to public school before

you make such a blanket recommendation or try to discredit an

educational opportunity that works. http://www.nheri.org/

To you this is just a discussion, obviously, but to those of us to whom

it is a way of life that deserves more than anecdotal discredit and

analysis. It is also a credible alternative for many families who are

fearful because of the anecdotal recommendation they get from those who

just treat it as a " discussion. " I've spent 15 years battling such

obvious distortions of truth from those who know nothing about

homeschooling. I've spent the last 15 years helping people homeschool

successfully amidst the clamor of those sold out to the public school

cult. I've spent the last 15 years enlightening people to the fact that

homeschooling isn't just a fad or a way to hide grammar school children

from bullies, and will not stop now just because I have been called

toxic and immature. That in itself would be immature. If you'd like to

take another bully style swat at my ability, adultness or toxicity, you

are welcome, but it doesn't look good on you. If you are afraid of an

enthusiastic reply to your discussion, maybe you should read your reply

applied to yourself.

Have a Merry Christmas.

Blessings,

P.

wrote:

>

> Thanks, for presenting another side of the story, but calm down!

> Noone should be on a board unless they can handle differing opinions

> without getting angry. Noone is going to force you to send your child

> to school, just discussing things. It's a mark of a mature adult and a

> nontoxic one who can accept others' differing opinions without

> experiencing disequilibrium in their mood. This is just a discussion,

> treat it accordingly.

>

>

>

> Re: [ ] was:Re: Clarification of a message: now:

> rebellion and mercury b

>

>

> >>Homeschooling past a certain point 10 or 12 is, IMHO, not advisable

> as I have known several children homeschooled and sent off to college

> and they don't do so well. At some point you have to expose them to

> the craziness of the world and teach them how to live with it.

>

> Forgive my blood pressure for raising a bit whenever I see a blanket

> recommendation such as this, but my 23 yo, home school graduate, Senior

> Design Specialist at a national media company who graduated from college

> with her bachelor's degree at 21 years old, having started at 17, who

> also not only captured the " Outstanding Senior " in her major (a large

> one) and married the previous year's " Outstanding Senior, " whose friends

> also captured " Outstanding Senior " in their respective majors, many of

> whom were homeschooled, and were annoyed to no end by the antics of the

> " public school " refined classmates is proof that this is just whooey.

> One of her professors was appalled that she was not voting her first

> year at college, only to find out the student he pegged as a senior was

> really only 17! And, she lived on campus with no problems. People here

> made up stories about a terrible transition for her . . and really made

> me ANGRY. She transitioned as well as, if not better than her public

> school peers. As is my 2nd daughter who is, at 21, a Production

> Supervisor after graduating from homeschooling and transitioning

> smoothly to college work and full time employment. My son who is

> affected, homeschooled through high school, and accepted to his school

> of choice on a music scholarship, and I am also NOT concerned about his

> ability to transition - more so since I've discovered this board and

> have started dealing biomedically, and soon with chelation, with his

> issues.

>

> I can't stand the " I knew a few who had problems " defense for

> subjecting our children to such a false entity of the public school

> system. Nowhere on earth is the public school model an example of real

> life. I've been there; I've been to college. I know, don't even try to

> tell me differently. That is why I only recommend that parents who are

> going to be fearful and let fear drive their lives send their children

> to public school. I'm not at all fearful that my children will not be

> properly socialized or prepared for the real world by letting them

> educate at home. I've seen many go before me for whom it worked

> grandly; our family is quickly becoming an example to prove these

> outrageous claims of need for public school to " prepare " for the world

> of adulthood wrong, and I wish people who choose not to homeschool would

> stop using such tactless lines to prove we shouldn't do what succeeds.

> If you want to prove how children shouldn't be prepared for life beyond

> schooling, just look to the miserable failure of the public school

> system. All the college drop outs my daughters know WERE public

> schooled! I'm tired of defending homeschooling to people who are

> fearful of it by giving the glowing examples of how I " socialize " my

> children, keep structure in their lives, etc. What we do is LIVE LIFE

> in reality, that has plenty of exposure to the " craziness " of real life,

> not the fake life of public school. From now on, let me point to the

> miserable failures of public school, which most people who bash

> homeschooling and advise against it seem to be absolutely 100% blind to

> when they advise people to send their children off to the public school

> I call Jail. And don't you dare come back and say my family must be the

> exception.

>

> and that is not IMHO - that is my example which I lead by life and know

> works, tangible, tested and tried truth and more than advisable to raise

> stable adults who don't need a mold to fit into.

>

> I'm going back to Christmas with my family now.

> P.

> 19 years of homeschooling, homeschool support group leader, and mom who

> graduated them all - but the one to go who is 13, she too will graduate

> from high school as a home schooler

> we even have the nerve to " unschool " much of knowledge and are not

> fearful of failing

>

>

[Guest guest]

Then you misinterpreted " the second responder, " me, who was addressing a

specific line of reasoning you were following - which was faulty and

overused by those suggest that homeschooling as a means of hiding our

children from reality, and public school as a means of exposing them to

the reality of life. It was meant to address that, and the fact that

many take up the illegitimate chant that homeschoolers don't fair well

when introduced to the " real " world - whether it be college or the work

place - that magically happens when they complete their high school

education. Maybe, in your " passion " you should reread in that context,

since the line I responded to is not an individualistic one, but the

droning line of the anti-homeschool masses who are known as public

school administrators, the NEA, and all those who take on the chant as

their " own " using a few anonymous examples of such failure to make

blanket recommendations that homeschooling beyond such and such age is

harmfully hiding the children from experiences of public school which

are necessary for proper emotional growth. If you addressed the

children who are damaged and destroyed by public school attendance with

such a blanket example, it would be more appropriate as their numbers

are more, as I also pointed out. The college drop outs and failures my

daughters know all came from that shining example you held to prepare

all children for college life - public school. How is it my example is

emotional and irrational, when yours is not? I even gave you a great

link to read more about how homeschoolers are doing,

http://www.nheri.org Yet, what I got for a response, since you couldn't

argue the point as you did so rudely with Dana, was a personal attack on

my existence and mental health, and now a complete deletion from

existence by any name. Still doesn't look good on you .

Maybe you should disengage and reread your two replies to that dialogue

with me, which attacked the thinker and not the thought, the sign of the

typical emotional response.

P. aka second responder, and you knew my name, avoiding it won't

make me go away ;-)

wrote:

>

>

> Dana's reply was passionate, she may have been angry but it wasn't

> keeping her from listening, the second responder was angry that I was

> not " thinking " the way she wanted me to, ironic as the most frequent

> reason for home schooling, and I think the quality it is best for, is

> individuality.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: bestbirths2006

We made it through another round! I have chromium picolinate left

overs from child #1, I could try adding it. She's been on gluten

free before, it did nothing for her. On round she had very little

appetite to eat the entire three days. She eats gluten. She loves

goat milk, too.

===>Congratulations!

I forgot what a hot topic homeschooling is. Homeschooling parents

can't discuss that we have problems

====>I missed anyone saying there were having problems with homeschooling. I

was discussing problems with homeschooling but wasn't aware anyone else was. We

have often discussed problems with private and public schools, but not before

this, homeschooling.

Like there are dirty little secrets about public/private eduction, they're

there for homeschooling also, as well as benefits to all.

My daughter has severe dyslexia and expressive and receptive

language disorder. She would just be humiliated in school.

====>We wouldn't have sent ours either, unless she was recovered enough to be

unnoticeable or able to compete, I agree.

The thing is that we have to find a way to teach our children to live

in this society, and that they have to act a certain way to survive

in it.

===>Yes, I call it using your power for good and not evil. This skill is very

important as is finding a way to deal with people who don't or won't follow

social mores/rules/decency. Those are the two critical life skills that noone

teaches parents' how to impart to their kids.

[Guest guest]

I quoted your text directly, that is not making anything up. You are

representing my portion improperly, and not discussing at all. I argued

against your direct quote. You are denying now it is your direct quote

and assaulting my intelligence. That, my dear , is rude whether

you mean to be or not. You attempted to not address me, while talking

about me to others on the board in the open too, that also is rude. I'm

just trying to point out that I'm not the one with the issue here, and

have you address the actual " discussion " as you like to call it, without

you getting so " emotional " as you call it.

I guess I was wrong to think that was a rational expectation. I'm sure

you will come back attempting to have the last word and paint me as

irrational and unintelligible. The points I made about the conversation

as it pertains to college bound homeschoolers and the experience of real

life are as yet unchallenged, therefore I assume valid. Attacking me

and not the thought does not change that fact.

P. (who still has a name. . .)

ladyshrink222 wrote:

>

>

> > >

> > >

> > > Dana's reply was passionate, she may have been angry but it

> wasn't

> > > keeping her from listening, the second responder was angry that

> I was

> > > not " thinking " the way she wanted me to, ironic as the most

> frequent

> > > reason for home schooling, and I think the quality it is best

> for, is

> > > individuality.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: andrewhallcutler

>

>

> This is further damage the bureaucratic worldview that naturally comes with

public

> education does - the idea that everything should be DISPASSIONATE, that if

there is

> emotion involved something is wrong.

>

> ===>A little distinction here, I don't think arguments should be devoid of

passion,

however, when the emotion goes past a certain level, people are not listening to

the

message and I usually fail to see the point of continuing.

>

> When I write that we pulled our kid out of public school and then read where

I'm

advocating public school for all kids/extolling the virtures of public

education, what would

be the point in continuing a conversation when people are so hyped up they

can't read

with any comprehension? Rhetorical.

And a good one.

This interestingly relates to something on list a while ago I've been thinking

what to say

about.

In social situations I don't talk about chelation much. Why?

Mostly because people aren't usually in a frame of mind where they can hear what

I have

to say and I don't want them to get so emotional in rejecting it that they can't

get into that

frame of mind later. So mostly I carefully dribble out information in hopes of

getting some

of it into their heads, occasionally I get pissed off and let them have both

barrels of reality

but that never seems to help anything.

> For years, I've made my living figuring out when people are listening, and

when they're

not, what is impeding the process. Dana's reply was passionate, she may have

been angry

but it wasn't keeping her from listening, the second responder was angry that I

was not

" thinking " the way she wanted me to, ironic as the most frequent reason for home

schooling, and I think the quality it is best for, is individuality.

Yup.

I had this argument with an old friend who just found me on the web a few months

ago.

He thinks public education is crucial for giving everyone some common grounding

in

assumptions and knowledge so they don't argue about everything all the time.

I on the other hand think public education has to be prohibited for exactly this

reason - in

order to maintain a civil society it is crucial that everyone learn different

assumptions and

knowledge and argue about it as adults. This is the only defense we have

against things

like the medically induced epidemic of autism, ADHD, alzheimer's, MS,

schizophrenia, etc.,

or things like the " traitor act, " which is how I prefer to think of the Patriot

Act, or of

committing crimes against humanity by invading countries without cause and

pretending

we're somehow better than the Nazis and Imperial Japanese who got hanged for

doing that

kind of thing.

However one thing that tends to be conveyed in public schools precisely because

they are

bureaucracies is to be able to talk to people and not get agitated when they

don't agree

with you. This basic virtue is essential to the kind of vigorous debate that we

need to keep

society vital. My experience has been that even compelling points are seldom

accepted or

perceived immediately so in order to 'win arguments' you have to keep them calm

enough

the other person can go home and spend some time thinking things through.

Andy

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: danasview

===>Just a couple points here. Schools are more a function of the LOCAL

government and reflect the mores/values of the area. If your local school sucks

don't blame the government, the fault lies with your neighbors who refuse to

stand up and say what they want or don't want.

The whacky social experiment they were performing when my dd went to

kindergarten would never have flown where I grew up or where we live now.

It does make me wonder, tho, about the people on this list and others

like it.

===>People are often schizophrenic in their attitude about the government.

Protect us from this or that, like the lead in toys, but go away when it comes

to something we want to do. And everytime they protect one person from something

they are curtailing the rights of someone else.

We don't like the government telling us what to do, but

there are some people here who don't have a problem choosing to give

their children to this same government for 7+ hours every weekday, to

" educate " [or in my opinion, " indoctrinate " ] their children.

====>There is a middle ground here, between keeping your kid at home and

turning them over to the school, it's parental involvement. Maybe schools are

planned indoctrination institutions where you live (and certainly was where we

lived when my dd was 5) but here the only thing they are indoctrinating the

children with is Reading and Math and supporting the parents who have chosen to

try to teach their kids how to be good people.

I forget sometimes how family oriented the Midwest is, and while that makes

some people susceptible to politicians who know how to string a few words

together and spout a Bible verse or two, it also makes for some good schools.

I can

understand a single parent who has little choice, but for the others,

this makes no sense to me.

===>Given where you live and what experience you have shared, I can get it is

puzzling, but take heart that every place in the U.S. is not like this, yet.

Dana

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: danasview

> ====>There is a middle ground here, between keeping your kid at

home and turning them over to the school, it's parental involvement.

How many times have parents posted messages here and elsewhere, about

having to fight with the school regarding the appropriate education of

their child?

===>They don't make you fight in Ohio for special services, each Autistic

child is given a $20,000 per year school voucher to be used where the parent

chooses. I've not heard any parents' grumbling, so might be okay.

We have county wide open enrollment, meaning that you can take your child to

any school, so the money follows the child. Bad school where you live?, people

won't listen to what your child needs? you can pick up your marbles and go

where they will.

The money following the child gives the parent a LOT more input and is touted

as the main reason European middle and high schools are said to be highly

superior to US schools where the districts get monies no matter how poorly they

perform. IMHO, this needs to be the case countRy wide.==>

With public schools, you also don't have much input as to what your

children are learning. Sorry, deleted your concerns about your children being

taught on their level.

====>Ours entered kindergarten several grade levels above in reading and

math. The school recruited and hired an " enrichment teacher " who spends 45

minutes morning and afternoon with her a few other kids, she's taught on her

level, as evidence by her jumping 2 grade levels in Reading and Math, just while

in kindergarten.

Each child has their own computer and spends part of the day working on their

own level. Only subjects like art, music, gym and I think, spelling, are taught

as a group.

Did you know that a parents' have the right to see the curriculum used to

teach their child before the school year starts? I've even asked to see specific

day to day lesson plans when I had concerns. Parents' have a lot more power than

they think, if they take the time to learn about it and just ask. You can't just

send them to school, hope for the best, I don't think, and say you are involved.

What do they teach kids about science and history? I also don't want them

forced to learn things that are

objectionable to me.

====>In Ohio (not sure about other states) you can opt out of any part of a

curriculum you don't agree with. We opted our dd out of creationism and sex ed.

I know of other parents who have opted their kids out of the teaching of both,

in public school, with no problem.

I WAS expecting problems, given our experience with our dd. I can't find them,

even when I look. We also don't see any bad behavior coming home, we have

surmised this is because inappropriate behavior in school is swiftly and firmly

dealt with, I've seen this for myself.

Disclaimer, again, I'm only extolling the virtues of HER particular school,

not all of them. But her school is very much like the public school I attended

and loved, this is nothing like the public school I encountered with my dd.

And how is public school having the government take care of you when the

lion's share of public education is paid for by property tax owners? It's not

welfare. Are the schools in your state paid for solely by the state?

I'm not trying to convince you to send your children anywhere, but I did want

to answer some of the ?'s you have about how anyone could send their child to

public school. I hope I've done that. We're more than satisfied with the quality

of education she is receiving at the public school.