Re: 's first endo. And next doctor.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

To find a competent doctor, call College Pharmacy. Ask them the names of

doctors doing male hormone therapy in your area. They say:

" Feel free to contact us anytime. Our office is located in the beautiful city of

Colorado Springs, CO and our office hours are 08:00AM - 06:00PM, Mountain

Time, Monday through Friday. The following is our contact information:

Address: 3505 Austin Bluffs Parkway, Suite 101 Colorado Springs, CO 80918

Phone Numbers:

Main Phone: (800) 888-9358 or (719) 262-0022

Fax: (800) 556-5893 or (719) 262-0035

Menopause/PMS Helpline: (800) 888-9358 or (719) 262-0022 Extension 148

Shipping Status: (800) 888-9358 or (719) 262-0022 Extension 110

Email Addresses:

Main: info@c...

(Thanks to Phil for the above cut & paste)

* If the endo you saw implied " normal " T (yours was 261 then 304, R:241-827)

as not needing treatment, fire him.

* If he thinks he can tell if you're primary by feeling your balls, fire him.

* He didn't order an E2 (estradiol) test, indicating he doesn't think E2 is

important. Suggests he won't treat E2 imbalance. Fire him.

* He didn't order an E2 (estradiol) test, so he'll have no idea what your

pre-therapy E2 baseline is. He'll have no idea if E2 is binding up serum T, so

lowering free T. Fire him.

* He didn't order free T tests, so he'll have no idea how much testosterone is

bioavailable. Fire him.

* He did order SGBH, which will bind to serum T so it is not bioavailable. He

may intend to use that result to get an approximate free T level, but that won't

take E2 into consideration. Fire him.

* He doesn't know hCG is a therapy. Perhaps the one you should use. Fire

him.

Others reading this: please look over the above & check for technical

mistakes. I may be projecting, but this endo sounds identical to two of mine.

They not only were providing substandard treatment, my faith in them stood

between me and good clinical treatment. For years. So I'm pissed, and that

affects my judgement.

Biased advice: , if you haven't gotten blood drawn for his test order, IMO

don't bother. The doctor you find will know and order the full range of tests

you

need, know why they're important, what they mean, what can be done and

what should be done. My new (and great) doc mailed me a complete test

order in advance so we (WE!) could get started immediately. If you've already

gotten tested, merely pick up a copy of the tests to take to your next doc.

Best,

Bruce

> Well I just got back from the endo's office for my first visit. I

> showed him the old bloodtest results and he said they may be less

> than the mean of someone my age, but that they're still normal.

>

> Based on the facts that my genitals are normal sized and I have good

> muscles, he didn't think there was a problem and that I look good.

> So he's ordered another T test with SHBG.

>

> I asked about HCG. His thoughts were that HCG is used as a test, not

> as a treatment. I felt like that might be the ticket.

>

> Well, I guess we'll wait to see how this test comes out.

> Hypogonadism or hypochondria, which can it be?

[Guest guest]

May be he should be added to the list of doctors who need to learn

more about " Male Hermone Therapy " by being Castrated so they can

learn about it.

That way they will have an idea about what is or is not " Normal " .

They are only fooling themselves.

Now where's that list.

Magenta.

> > Well I just got back from the endo's office for my first visit.

I

> > showed him the old bloodtest results and he said they may be

less

> > than the mean of someone my age, but that they're still normal.

> >

> > Based on the facts that my genitals are normal sized and I have

good

> > muscles, he didn't think there was a problem and that I look

good.

> > So he's ordered another T test with SHBG.

> >

> > I asked about HCG. His thoughts were that HCG is used as a

test, not

> > as a treatment. I felt like that might be the ticket.

> >

> > Well, I guess we'll wait to see how this test comes out.

> > Hypogonadism or hypochondria, which can it be?

[Guest guest]

Bruce,

My endo didn't have a clue about E2 management when I first met

him. He was reluctant to order an E2 test. But I stuck with him

because he seemed intelligent and willing to learn. I was able to

convince him pretty easily (using my own research and some of the

helpful posts here) to order the E2 test and to research the topic

on his own. Sure enough, a couple weeks later (and after my E2 test

came back high) he agreed that my E2 levels need to come down.

So I think the key is to find a doc that has an open mind and is

willing to learn even he he/she is a little behind when it comes to

E2 management or testosterone treatments. Let's face it...it's very

difficult to find an endo that is an expert on anything but

diabetes. And furthermore, a lot of docs have big egos and would

never admit that a patient is more knowledgable on a medical topic.

Constantly changing docs can really set someone back because you

almost always have to go back to square one. I would only " fire " a

doc if they showed an unwillingness to learn and/or if they didn't

take my situation seriously. Unfortunately there are many out there

like this. Had I fired my current endo when he told me he didn't

know about E2 management, I'm sure I would still be in limbo as far

as treatment is concerned.

So my advice is to the newbies is to show up to your appointments

prepared with plenty of research. Bring printouts to help bring your

points across. If you've found a good doc, he/she will listen before

jumping to conclusions. If not...as Mr. Trump would say " You're

fired!! "

Dave K.

> > Well I just got back from the endo's office for my first visit.

I

> > showed him the old bloodtest results and he said they may be

less

> > than the mean of someone my age, but that they're still normal.

> >

> > Based on the facts that my genitals are normal sized and I have

good

> > muscles, he didn't think there was a problem and that I look

good.

> > So he's ordered another T test with SHBG.

> >

> > I asked about HCG. His thoughts were that HCG is used as a

test, not

> > as a treatment. I felt like that might be the ticket.

> >

> > Well, I guess we'll wait to see how this test comes out.

> > Hypogonadism or hypochondria, which can it be?

[Guest guest]

Dave,

I wholeheartedly agree here.

Brad

> > > Well I just got back from the endo's office for my first visit.

> I

> > > showed him the old bloodtest results and he said they may be

> less

> > > than the mean of someone my age, but that they're still normal.

> > >

> > > Based on the facts that my genitals are normal sized and I have

> good

> > > muscles, he didn't think there was a problem and that I look

> good.

> > > So he's ordered another T test with SHBG.

> > >

> > > I asked about HCG. His thoughts were that HCG is used as a

> test, not

> > > as a treatment. I felt like that might be the ticket.

> > >

> > > Well, I guess we'll wait to see how this test comes out.

> > > Hypogonadism or hypochondria, which can it be?

[Guest guest]

Hi Dave,

You've got a good point. A good, consciencious doctor willing to learn would

be a good way to go. You have an arrangement like that, and it works very

well for you. I checked back to your post about your first visit with the guy in

June. My response was petty negative on the subject of endos in general. I

was put off by him ordering thyroid tests (long story). I was wrong.

Your method will work if the guy is open to suggestions and willing to be

trained by a patient. , did you get a feeling for this? Was he interested

in

what you had to say, or did he brush it off? If he was skeptical of your

opinions, was it out of caution or from arrogance? Did it feel right? (Whoops,

rapid fire questions. Sorry. No pressure.) If you think your endo's the right

person, go with him.

Now I did use the words " fire him " enough to raise eyebrows. I've also known

doctors where the words would repeatedly be " keep him " .

Now, if I had to take a repair manual to my mechanic, tax instructions to my

accountant, legal forms to my lawyer... they'd be history. But a good mechanic,

accountant or lawyer are hard to find. They ARE out there, and it's worth the

effort.

So what do I want in a doctor who treats male hormone issues,

endocrinologist or other specialty?

1. I want him/her to know more about hormone therapy than me.

2. I want someone who had studied this more than me.

3. I want someone who does this as part of his/her regular practice.

4. I want someone who had successfully treated over fifty men.

5. I want someone who has already familiar with AACE guidlines.

6. I want someone I can trust.

And I finally found that doctor. But first I had to find out HOW to find that

doctor.

I found out how to do that from this group.

I absolutely agree that constantly changing docs can really set someone back.

Because I did jump from doctor to doctor to doctor to (finally) a DOCTOR! I

don't want to confuse new members. I want to reduce their confusion. If I can

help them find the right doctor the first time, they won't have to go through

the

confusion I did.

Does that make sense?

Bruce

(By the way, I don't think Trump fires his doctors. He undoubtedly

made sure they were good before he hired them.)

> > > Well I just got back from the endo's office for my first visit.

> I

> > > showed him the old bloodtest results and he said they may be

> less

> > > than the mean of someone my age, but that they're still normal.

> > >

> > > Based on the facts that my genitals are normal sized and I have

> good

> > > muscles, he didn't think there was a problem and that I look

> good.

> > > So he's ordered another T test with SHBG.

> > >

> > > I asked about HCG. His thoughts were that HCG is used as a

> test, not

> > > as a treatment. I felt like that might be the ticket.

> > >

> > > Well, I guess we'll wait to see how this test comes out.

> > > Hypogonadism or hypochondria, which can it be?