Re: All new posters...please read this.

[Guest guest]

Where did you buy the cream online?

All new posters...please read this.

Gentlemen,

I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent posts, in

which a new member related his story to the group. I have to admit,

that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to life

that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a trained

physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative facts, not

subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was something

less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured access to

Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab work. I

pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder. The

effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like the man I

was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my internal

vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a strong,

virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked for an

inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain the

difference.

ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE MEDICAL

COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR CONDITION. DO

WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT MEANS

DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS THERE TO

HELP YOU...

If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

contact me!

Sincerely,

Mike

[Guest guest]

Mike,

You really need to see an Endocrinologist. You absolutely must find

out what is causing your lowered Testostorone.

Hypogonadism is caused by many things - and the worse amoung them are

HIV, Cancer, Pituitary tumors and Brain tumors.

There are many qualified Endo's out there - one's that will

understand what you have gone through. I am really surprised you

were able to get T from an online Doctor. There is a reason its a

controlled substance.

Please see a Doctor for your own piece of mind and that of your

family's.

Ken

> Gentlemen,

>

> I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent posts, in

> which a new member related his story to the group. I have to admit,

> that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to life

> that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

>

> Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a trained

> physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

> obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative facts,

not

> subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

> suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was something

> less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

>

> I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured access to

> Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab work.

I

> pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

>

> As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder. The

> effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like the man

I

> was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

internal

> vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a strong,

> virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

>

> As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked for an

> inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain the

> difference.

>

>

> ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

> SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

MEDICAL

> COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR CONDITION. DO

> WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT MEANS

> DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS THERE TO

> HELP YOU...

>

> If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

> contact me!

>

> Sincerely,

> Mike

[Guest guest]

I am sorry to say,i don't agree at all with you, Mike.As Ken has said

you(or internet)cannot replace a good doctor.Don't take these matters

lightly,if you are getting any improvement it may be temporary or it

may harm you in the long run.Please consult a good endocrinologist to

clear your doubts & to be sure of the treatment you are getting.

Polkipas.

> Gentlemen,

>

> I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent posts, in

> which a new member related his story to the group. I have to admit,

> that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to life

> that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

>

> Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a trained

> physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

> obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative facts,

not

> subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

> suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was something

> less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

>

> I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured access to

> Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab work.

I

> pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

>

> As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder. The

> effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like the man

I

> was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

internal

> vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a strong,

> virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

>

> As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked for an

> inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain the

> difference.

>

>

> ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

> SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

MEDICAL

> COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR CONDITION. DO

> WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT MEANS

> DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS THERE TO

> HELP YOU...

>

> If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

> contact me!

>

> Sincerely,

> Mike

[Guest guest]

Nope, I cant do that. My situation is slightly different than most. I have

the resources available to me to repsonsibily measure my status.Labwork,

which I pay for every 30 days is easily obtained. A prostate scan...I have

scheduled every 6 months (through my PCP). Nope...I dont buy into the hype

that the medical community is the absolute and only answer.

>From: " polkipas " <polkipas@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: Re: All new posters...please read this.

>Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 20:08:28 -0000

>

>I am sorry to say,i don't agree at all with you, Mike.As Ken has said

>you(or internet)cannot replace a good doctor.Don't take these matters

>lightly,if you are getting any improvement it may be temporary or it

>may harm you in the long run.Please consult a good endocrinologist to

>clear your doubts & to be sure of the treatment you are getting.

>

>Polkipas.

>

>

>

>

> > Gentlemen,

> >

> > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent posts, in

> > which a new member related his story to the group. I have to admit,

> > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to life

> > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

> >

> > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a trained

> > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

> > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative facts,

>not

> > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

> > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was something

> > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> >

> > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured access to

> > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab work.

>I

> > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

> >

> > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder. The

> > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like the man

>I

> > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

>internal

> > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a strong,

> > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

> >

> > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked for an

> > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain the

> > difference.

> >

> >

> > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

> > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

>MEDICAL

> > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR CONDITION. DO

> > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT MEANS

> > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS THERE TO

> > HELP YOU...

> >

> > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

> > contact me!

> >

> > Sincerely,

> > Mike

>

_________________________________________________________________

Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com

[Guest guest]

Hmm,that's what i understood, you have access to lab tests(that you

claim that you are able to interpert, as good as a doctor) & you have

a routine prostate scan(however many prostate ca are easily missed

with a scan,you may need a Doctors finger for a routine PR & may be

having PSA measurements to be sure, as scan is never a popular method

for screening out prostate ca) & here you are completely satisfied

with your clinical work up.Long term testosterone(with no serum

measurements)can decrease ones immunity,create fractures,made one

susceptible to oppurtunistic infections & lead to improper healing of

your wounds,but i am sure you are happy with what you are doing.

Best of Luck to you.

Take care,

Polkipas.

> > > Gentlemen,

> > >

> > > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent posts,

in

> > > which a new member related his story to the group. I have to

admit,

> > > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to

life

> > > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

> > >

> > > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a trained

> > > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

> > > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative facts,

> >not

> > > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

> > > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was

something

> > > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> > >

> > > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured access

to

> > > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab

work.

> >I

> > > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

> > >

> > > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder.

The

> > > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like the

man

> >I

> > > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

> >internal

> > > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a strong,

> > > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

> > >

> > > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked for

an

> > > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain the

> > > difference.

> > >

> > >

> > > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

> > > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

> >MEDICAL

> > > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR CONDITION.

DO

> > > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT

MEANS

> > > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS THERE

TO

> > > HELP YOU...

> > >

> > > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

> > > contact me!

> > >

> > > Sincerely,

> > > Mike

> >

>

>

>

>

> _________________________________________________________________

> Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger:

http://messenger.msn.com

[Guest guest]

polkipas,

I wouldn't be too critical here. It doesn't take a rocket scientist

to interpret lab values. These are published numbers and there are

many resources regarding the interpretation of results. MDs don't

have some secret source of knowledge. Maybe more experience and

training, but that is only relevant if they apply it in your behalf.

Unfortunately with hypogonadism, many physicians don't use their

knowledge and experience to help their patients - they just pass

judgement and tell them to get a life, or they allow their

predjudices to affect their decisions. This board is full of stories

to that effect.

I personally had my health ruined by an incompetent MD, and I do not

trust them or hold them in some " god-like " esteem. In many instances

I have known more about certain aspects of my conditions than they

did. However, if you look long enough you CAN find physicians that

are open minded, who care, and who excel in their wisdom and the use

of the knowledge they spent so many years acquiring. Even with all my

negative experiences I would recommend seeking the advice of a GOOD

physician. However, you can get to a point where the maintenance of a

chronic condition like hypo is pretty routine and predictable. At

that point an MD is not as essential. Still, it would probably be a

good idea to have an MD review your progress periodically to make

sure you're not missing something.

Regards,

K4

> > > > Gentlemen,

> > > >

> > > > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent

posts,

> in

> > > > which a new member related his story to the group. I have to

> admit,

> > > > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir to

> life

> > > > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

> > > >

> > > > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a

trained

> > > > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed the

> > > > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative

facts,

> > >not

> > > > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I was

> > > > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was

> something

> > > > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> > > >

> > > > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured

access

> to

> > > > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own lab

> work.

> > >I

> > > > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by insurance.

> > > >

> > > > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick responder.

> The

> > > > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like

the

> man

> > >I

> > > > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

> > >internal

> > > > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a

strong,

> > > > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

> > > >

> > > > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked

for

> an

> > > > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain

the

> > > > difference.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR OWN

> > > > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

> > >MEDICAL

> > > > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR

CONDITION.

> DO

> > > > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF IT

> MEANS

> > > > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS

THERE

> TO

> > > > HELP YOU...

> > > >

> > > > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an opion,

> > > > contact me!

> > > >

> > > > Sincerely,

> > > > Mike

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > _________________________________________________________________

> > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger:

> http://messenger.msn.com

[Guest guest]

But k4 i think you wouldn't disagree with me on the issue that Use of

steroids(like testosterone)is not an OTC issue.I am not saying that

you cannot manage your case or would require a rocket scientist to

help you.Just that i can't agree to buy testo from some online doctor

(i don't know,how can he provide him with that,it's damn

illegal).Ofcourse if internet is there who ever needs a rocket

scientist?

Polkipas.

> > > > > Gentlemen,

> > > > >

> > > > > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent

> posts,

> > in

> > > > > which a new member related his story to the group. I have

to

> > admit,

> > > > > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir

to

> > life

> > > > > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

> > > > >

> > > > > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a

> trained

> > > > > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed

the

> > > > > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative

> facts,

> > > >not

> > > > > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I

was

> > > > > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was

> > something

> > > > > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> > > > >

> > > > > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured

> access

> > to

> > > > > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own

lab

> > work.

> > > >I

> > > > > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by

insurance.

> > > > >

> > > > > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick

responder.

> > The

> > > > > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like

> the

> > man

> > > >I

> > > > > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

> > > >internal

> > > > > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a

> strong,

> > > > > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

> > > > >

> > > > > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked

> for

> > an

> > > > > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain

> the

> > > > > difference.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR

OWN

> > > > > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

> > > >MEDICAL

> > > > > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR

> CONDITION.

> > DO

> > > > > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF

IT

> > MEANS

> > > > > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS

> THERE

> > TO

> > > > > HELP YOU...

> > > > >

> > > > > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an

opion,

> > > > > contact me!

> > > > >

> > > > > Sincerely,

> > > > > Mike

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger:

> > http://messenger.msn.com

[Guest guest]

And forget to add that ,numbers donot always speak the truth,there

are 1000's of factors that can effect your numbers,ofcourse it is not

difficult to compare the two numbers,indeed a 5th grade kid can do

that,but without the perfect knowledge of knowing what's effecting

them you can't be too sure.

polkipas

> > > > > Gentlemen,

> > > > >

> > > > > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent

> posts,

> > in

> > > > > which a new member related his story to the group. I have

to

> > admit,

> > > > > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir

to

> > life

> > > > > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own TRT.

> > > > >

> > > > > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a

> trained

> > > > > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS), missed

the

> > > > > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative

> facts,

> > > >not

> > > > > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME. I

was

> > > > > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was

> > something

> > > > > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> > > > >

> > > > > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured

> access

> > to

> > > > > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own

lab

> > work.

> > > >I

> > > > > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by

insurance.

> > > > >

> > > > > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick

responder.

> > The

> > > > > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel like

> the

> > man

> > > >I

> > > > > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched my

> > > >internal

> > > > > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a

> strong,

> > > > > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself internally.

> > > > >

> > > > > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I asked

> for

> > an

> > > > > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or explain

> the

> > > > > difference.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER YOUR

OWN

> > > > > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT THE

> > > >MEDICAL

> > > > > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR

> CONDITION.

> > DO

> > > > > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF

IT

> > MEANS

> > > > > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS

> THERE

> > TO

> > > > > HELP YOU...

> > > > >

> > > > > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an

opion,

> > > > > contact me!

> > > > >

> > > > > Sincerely,

> > > > > Mike

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger:

> > http://messenger.msn.com

[Guest guest]

Hmmm. You're right. How DO they sell that stuff legally??? Yes, I

would think you would at least need to start out with a prescription

from an MD.

K4

> > > > > > Gentlemen,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I have read, with great empathy, each of the new recent

> > posts,

> > > in

> > > > > > which a new member related his story to the group. I have

> to

> > > admit,

> > > > > > that with each story, I felt within me those feeling stir

> to

> > > life

> > > > > > that have been pretty much dead since I started my own

TRT.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Like many others, I have absolutely no clue how or why a

> > trained

> > > > > > physician (or im my case, MANY trained physicianS),

missed

> the

> > > > > > obvious!!! I presented clear,easily measured,quantitative

> > facts,

> > > > >not

> > > > > > subjective 'feelings', that SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH ME.

I

> was

> > > > > > suffering the ill-effects, and the quality of my life was

> > > something

> > > > > > less. I have yet to obtain medically sanctioned care.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I took my situation into my own hands, and have secured

> > access

> > > to

> > > > > > Testosterone cream, via an online doctor. I order my own

> lab

> > > work.

> > > > >I

> > > > > > pay for this out of pocket. This is NOT covered by

> insurance.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > As mentioned in previous posts, I was a very quick

> responder.

> > > The

> > > > > > effects have been speedy and dramatic. I finally feel

like

> > the

> > > man

> > > > >I

> > > > > > was intended to be. My external body never quite matched

my

> > > > >internal

> > > > > > vision of myself. Now, when I look in a mirror, I see a

> > strong,

> > > > > > virile male, which is the way I idealized myself

internally.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > As for the improvement in the quality of my life...I

asked

> > for

> > > an

> > > > > > inch...and got a mile. I cannot begin to express or

explain

> > the

> > > > > > difference.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ONCE AGAIN, I WILL POST MY MESSAGE: TAKE CONTROL OVER

YOUR

> OWN

> > > > > > SITUATION. DO NOT TAKE 'NO' FOR AN ANSWER. DO NOT ACCEPT

THE

> > > > >MEDICAL

> > > > > > COMMMUNITY'S ATTEMPTS TO SHAME/DEGRADE/DEVALUE YOUR

> > CONDITION.

> > > DO

> > > > > > WHATEVER IS NECESSARY TO SEEK THE HELP YOU NEED...EVEN IF

> IT

> > > MEANS

> > > > > > DOING SO OUTSIDE THE REALM OF 'A DOCTOR'..THE INTERNET IS

> > THERE

> > > TO

> > > > > > HELP YOU...

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If any of you need assistance, or would like to seek an

> opion,

> > > > > > contact me!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sincerely,

> > > > > > Mike

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> _________________________________________________________________

> > > > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger:

> > > http://messenger.msn.com