Guest guest Posted August 12, 2005 Report Share Posted August 12, 2005 Could be.... but... Weren't you also moving DIM doses around quite a bit over that time period? Specifically the week to two weeks just prior to the test that showed the Total T of 522 and E2 of 47? Also alterations in your Thy meds " may " have boosted E2 levels (on the Testim). Not too sure on that, but seems it could be possible... Just making the point that it may have been an unfair comparison between the AndroGel level and the Testim level. As far as I know, there's no difference whatsoever between the active ingredient in AG or Testim... (it is " Testosterone USP " and is usually synthesized from soy oil), so the testosterone is exactly the same. I would believe that Testim itself could only push your E2 levels up via the mechanism of raising your Total T levels. The T then gets aromatized into E2 by your own body... not by anything that's in the Testim. Under that theory... If it was the Testim alone that was responsible for raising your E2 levels to a 47 - compared to AndroGel's 31 - well, that is a 152% difference, so Testim SHOULD have raised your Total T to 762 to have accounted for that raise in your E2. But Testim has your Total T level at 522 which is just barely above the 500 that you were on with AndroGel. Also you don't have the more vital Free T numbers to give a more accurate comparison which complicates things. So unless there's some factor that I'm missing - maybe like Testim somehow delivering a huge spike early which somehow stimulates E 2 production - I would tend to think that it's not the different brands of the transdermal gels that are of concern. And then the other involved factors complicate the situation quite a bit - different DIM doses, days w/out DIM at all, different levels of Thy meds, etc., all cloud the picture and complicate pointing a finger to a causative factor..... Maybe someone on the Boards will have some further experience in that regard??? I would be interested in finding out if any other members have experienced significantly higher levels of E2 on Testim (as compared to AG) while their T levels remained closely the same... and if they were made aware as to why that was the case? Does Testim have an initial " plasma burst effect " initial absorption that might trigger a higher response of E2??? Larry > Although Testim seems to have better absorbtion than Androgel, it > seems that Testim pushed E2 up higher than Androgel. I was on 2 Andro > and had Total T of 500 with E2 of 31 and then went to 1 1/2 testim > with Total T of 522 and E2 of 47. Free on Testim is 159. I didn't get > free on Androgel. > > Anyone have any thoughts on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2005 Report Share Posted August 12, 2005 From what I understand if total T stays basically the same then one way that E2 could go up is if SHBG falls. In the setting of lower SHBG you would see an increase in free T which would likely cause E2 to rise as well (more so in overweight individuals.) Simply put, falling SHBG levels and stable total T could account for higher E2. Would have been nice to know what the free T was on Androgel. I don't know why you would have falling SHBG so this is probably not it but I thought I'd throw it out there. P.S. This assumes that my understanding of this is correct. I'm still new to this. > > Although Testim seems to have better absorbtion than Androgel, it > > seems that Testim pushed E2 up higher than Androgel. I was on 2 Andro > > and had Total T of 500 with E2 of 31 and then went to 1 1/2 testim > > with Total T of 522 and E2 of 47. Free on Testim is 159. I didn't get > > free on Androgel. > > > > Anyone have any thoughts on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2005 Report Share Posted August 12, 2005 > Although Testim seems to have better absorbtion than Androgel, it > seems that Testim pushed E2 up higher than Androgel. I was on 2 Andro > and had Total T of 500 with E2 of 31 and then went to 1 1/2 testim > with Total T of 522 and E2 of 47. Free on Testim is 159. I didn't get > free on Androgel. > > Anyone have any thoughts on that. The boost in T might have caused seroconversion. If you are able to afford it (or if your insurance supports it), perhaps you ought to be tested again. Your body may have become accustomed to the higher T levels and achieved equilibrium. In other words, your E2 level may have subsided by now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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