Re: high T but low libido

[Guest guest]

You should lower your E2 and see if that makes a difference. High E2

will cause libido issues as well even with a good T:E ratio

> On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

>

> Total T 409 (240-950)

> SHBG 24 (7-100)

> Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> (couldn't get a free t test)

> Estradiol 52 (0-76)

>

> A few months later on 100mg T:

>

> Total T 1022 (240-950)

> free T 622 (62-512)

> Estradiol 60 0-76)

>

> I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

exactly

> the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

very

> few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of a libido.

> With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be a

> teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

would

> like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition developed

> (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire. Now if

I'm

> not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable and

> ejaqulate volume is down as well.

>

> I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to estradiol

> ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I even

began

> T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but hasn't

> affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T and

> free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at a

> loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

>

> thom

[Guest guest]

Get the E2 down to under 40 or so and see what happens.

Dave K.

> On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

>

> Total T 409 (240-950)

> SHBG 24 (7-100)

> Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> (couldn't get a free t test)

> Estradiol 52 (0-76)

>

> A few months later on 100mg T:

>

> Total T 1022 (240-950)

> free T 622 (62-512)

> Estradiol 60 0-76)

>

> I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

exactly

> the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

very

> few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of a

libido.

> With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

a

> teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

would

> like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition developed

> (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire. Now if

I'm

> not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable and

> ejaqulate volume is down as well.

>

> I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to estradiol

> ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I even

began

> T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

hasn't

> affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T

and

> free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at a

> loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

>

> thom

[Guest guest]

My Dr. tells me that the best range for E2 is 25 to 35 using the lab range I had

was <20 to 56 when I started to try to lower my E2 it was 79. When I got it

down my libido went way up and my ED got 80% better and the orgasm I have not

had for over 10 years came back. My testosterone shot up so today I am on less

T meds.

Phil

thombow <thombow@...> wrote:

On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

Total T 409 (240-950)

SHBG 24 (7-100)

Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

(couldn't get a free t test)

Estradiol 52 (0-76)

A few months later on 100mg T:

Total T 1022 (240-950)

free T 622 (62-512)

Estradiol 60 0-76)

I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel exactly

the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get very

few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of a libido.

With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be a

teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just would

like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition developed

(48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire. Now if I'm

not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable and

ejaqulate volume is down as well.

I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to estradiol

ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I even began

T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but hasn't

affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T and

free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at a

loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

thom

[Guest guest]

One more thing, if anyone plans on lowering E2 with Arimidex, get

your IGF-1 tested beforehand, its Arimidex is known to lower IGF-1.

As for sex drive its also important to see what your DHT levels are

at.

> > On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

> >

> > Total T 409 (240-950)

> > SHBG 24 (7-100)

> > Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> > (couldn't get a free t test)

> > Estradiol 52 (0-76)

> >

> > A few months later on 100mg T:

> >

> > Total T 1022 (240-950)

> > free T 622 (62-512)

> > Estradiol 60 0-76)

> >

> > I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

> exactly

> > the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

> very

> > few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of a

> libido.

> > With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> > there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

> a

> > teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

> would

> > like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition

developed

> > (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> > connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire. Now if

> I'm

> > not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> > sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable and

> > ejaqulate volume is down as well.

> >

> > I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to

estradiol

> > ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> > taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I even

> began

> > T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

> hasn't

> > affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T

> and

> > free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at a

> > loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

> >

> > thom

[Guest guest]

You sound just like me. I have posted here before about the very

same problem. At one point my T level was over 1200 and I still

had a low libido. Your E2 level of 60 is a little high, but mine got

down to 14 while I was taking an aromatase inhibitor and that

stiill didn't solve the libido problem. I thought I had finally got

back my sex drive when I first started HCG, but the effect only

lasted about a week. My endocrinologist recently told me that

there is nothing else he can do to help solve this problem. I

think there might be some other factors involved than just the

standard hormonal measurements, T, E2, DHT, etc. One

possibility is the levels of sex hormone receptors. If you find out

anything useful, let me know. I'll do the same. After my prior

posts, it didn't sound like many others had this same kind of

problem.

> On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

>

> Total T 409 (240-950)

> SHBG 24 (7-100)

> Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> (couldn't get a free t test)

> Estradiol 52 (0-76)

>

> A few months later on 100mg T:

>

> Total T 1022 (240-950)

> free T 622 (62-512)

> Estradiol 60 0-76)

>

> I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

exactly

> the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

very

> few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of

a libido.

> With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

a

> teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

would

> like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition developed

> (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire.

Now if I'm

> not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable

and

> ejaqulate volume is down as well.

>

> I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to estradiol

> ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I

even began

> T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

hasn't

> affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T and

> free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at

a

> loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

>

> thom

[Guest guest]

Bringing your E2 down to 14 is too low, try getting it btwn 25-30.

Also have your thyroid functions checked.

> > On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

> >

> > Total T 409 (240-950)

> > SHBG 24 (7-100)

> > Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> > (couldn't get a free t test)

> > Estradiol 52 (0-76)

> >

> > A few months later on 100mg T:

> >

> > Total T 1022 (240-950)

> > free T 622 (62-512)

> > Estradiol 60 0-76)

> >

> > I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

> exactly

> > the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

> very

> > few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of

> a libido.

> > With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> > there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

> a

> > teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

> would

> > like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition

developed

> > (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> > connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire.

> Now if I'm

> > not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> > sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable

> and

> > ejaqulate volume is down as well.

> >

> > I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to

estradiol

> > ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> > taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I

> even began

> > T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

> hasn't

> > affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T

and

> > free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at

> a

> > loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

> >

> > thom

[Guest guest]

Why are you not a viagra candidate?

In a message dated 9/13/2004 12:17:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

jackhanchette@... writes:

You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and my E2 level is

not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to go from here. My lab

work looks great and I am not a Viagra candidate. Everything works just fine as

far as the plumbing and yet without any libido and very weak orgasms and low

ejaculate volume it all amounts to nothing. If anyone has any ideas I would

love to hear them.

[Guest guest]

You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and my E2 level is

not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to go from here. My lab work

looks great and I am not a Viagra candidate. Everything works just fine as far

as the plumbing and yet without any libido and very weak orgasms and low

ejaculate volume it all amounts to nothing. If anyone has any ideas I would

love to hear them.

Re: high T but low libido

You sound just like me. I have posted here before about the very

same problem. At one point my T level was over 1200 and I still

had a low libido. Your E2 level of 60 is a little high, but mine got

down to 14 while I was taking an aromatase inhibitor and that

stiill didn't solve the libido problem. I thought I had finally got

back my sex drive when I first started HCG, but the effect only

lasted about a week. My endocrinologist recently told me that

there is nothing else he can do to help solve this problem. I

think there might be some other factors involved than just the

standard hormonal measurements, T, E2, DHT, etc. One

possibility is the levels of sex hormone receptors. If you find out

anything useful, let me know. I'll do the same. After my prior

posts, it didn't sound like many others had this same kind of

problem.

> On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

>

> Total T 409 (240-950)

> SHBG 24 (7-100)

> Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> (couldn't get a free t test)

> Estradiol 52 (0-76)

>

> A few months later on 100mg T:

>

> Total T 1022 (240-950)

> free T 622 (62-512)

> Estradiol 60 0-76)

>

> I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

exactly

> the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

very

> few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of

a libido.

> With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

a

> teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

would

> like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition developed

> (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire.

Now if I'm

> not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable

and

> ejaqulate volume is down as well.

>

> I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to estradiol

> ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I

even began

> T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

hasn't

> affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T and

> free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at

a

> loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

>

> thom

[Guest guest]

You are not reporting a value for total estrogen. You are only

reporting Estradiol (E2).

Have the total estrogen determined and see its relation to total T.

Maybe your ratio is too high!

If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly, depending on your age

it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

Flaco

> > On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

> >

> > Total T 409 (240-950)

> > SHBG 24 (7-100)

> > Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> > (couldn't get a free t test)

> > Estradiol 52 (0-76)

> >

> > A few months later on 100mg T:

> >

> > Total T 1022 (240-950)

> > free T 622 (62-512)

> > Estradiol 60 0-76)

> >

> > I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

> exactly

> > the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

> very

> > few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of

> a libido.

> > With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> > there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

> a

> > teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

> would

> > like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition

developed

> > (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> > connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire.

> Now if I'm

> > not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> > sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable

> and

> > ejaqulate volume is down as well.

> >

> > I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to

estradiol

> > ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> > taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I

> even began

> > T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

> hasn't

> > affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T

and

> > free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at

> a

> > loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

> >

> > thom

[Guest guest]

Hi Flaco Total E is not as important as E2 Estradiol testing for Totla Estrogen

is a waste of money. And I could never figure out this stuff about ratio's I

have had my levels in a good raio and felt very bad. I don't think we are all

the same to use ratio's.

Phil

rndchemist <rndchemist@...> wrote:

You are not reporting a value for total estrogen. You are only

reporting Estradiol (E2).

Have the total estrogen determined and see its relation to total T.

Maybe your ratio is too high!

If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly, depending on your age

it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

Flaco

> > On 75mg of compounded T I got these results:

> >

> > Total T 409 (240-950)

> > SHBG 24 (7-100)

> > Free androgen index 58 (14-94)

> > (couldn't get a free t test)

> > Estradiol 52 (0-76)

> >

> > A few months later on 100mg T:

> >

> > Total T 1022 (240-950)

> > free T 622 (62-512)

> > Estradiol 60 0-76)

> >

> > I couldn't believe it when I saw these numbers because I feel

> exactly

> > the same as before. I still don't get any morning erections, get

> very

> > few and weak spontaneous ones and just don't have much of

> a libido.

> > With a little viagra I can perform fine but the desire is barely

> > there. My doctor says to cut back on the T and don't expect to be

> a

> > teenager again. I told him I don't want or expect that but just

> would

> > like to feel like I did at 45 just before this condition

developed

> > (48 now). I want that feeling of 'horniness', that brain to penis

> > connection where thoughts lead to an erection and desire.

> Now if I'm

> > not physically stimulated...nothing. There's also a loss of

> > sensitivity in my penis and orgasms are not as pleasurable

> and

> > ejaqulate volume is down as well.

> >

> > I know the estradiol is a little high but the total T to

estradiol

> > ratio is 17. Plenty high. Where's the libido? I recently started

> > taking tamoxifen as I have some gyno which began before I

> even began

> > T replacement. It's stopped the occasional 'breast' pain but

> hasn't

> > affected libido either. Any ideas? I thought that getting the T

and

> > free T up would take care of things. I'm so disappointed and at

> a

> > loss of what to do and as usual the doctor is useless. Thanks.

> >

> > thom

[Guest guest]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2004 20:39:02 -0000, you wrote:

>One more thing, if anyone plans on lowering E2 with Arimidex, get

>your IGF-1 tested beforehand, its Arimidex is known to lower IGF-1.

Do you have a cite for this?

Thanks.

- - - -

Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 01:23:44 -0000, you wrote:

>You sound just like me. I have posted here before about the very

>same problem. At one point my T level was over 1200 and I still

>had a low libido. Your E2 level of 60 is a little high, but mine got

>down to 14 while I was taking an aromatase inhibitor and that

>stiill didn't solve the libido problem. I thought I had finally got

>back my sex drive when I first started HCG, but the effect only

>lasted about a week. My endocrinologist recently told me that

>there is nothing else he can do to help solve this problem. I

>think there might be some other factors involved than just the

>standard hormonal measurements, T, E2, DHT, etc. One

>possibility is the levels of sex hormone receptors. If you find out

>anything useful, let me know. I'll do the same. After my prior

>posts, it didn't sound like many others had this same kind of

>problem.

Low E-2 estrogen can kill libido as much (or I think more) than high

E2. I believe there's a narrow optimum between the high and low range

that is ideal. The hard part is getting there and staying there long

enough to recognize it.

My experience was similar. Great libido changes after starting TRT and

then over time it diminished. Nipple issues and breast pains led to

finding my E2 was too high (Around 46 for me).. I started Arimidex and

one the way down had a couple weeks or more of great libido, and

changes in erection and urine passage. And then my libido totally

crashed. Far worse for me than when it was too high.

I stopped Arimidex for several weeks and then started on a reduced

dosage and again found a couple weeks with great libido, lots of

sexual interest, and darn those pretty women are everywhere. That's

pretty much where I am now. I've stopped Arimidex briefly again as I

thought I was expeirnce=ing the beginning symptoms of going too low.

I'm waiting on a lab result to reconfigure my dosage.

Anyway I see E2 as one of the major impacts on libido for me. Both too

high and too low impacts it.

- - - -

Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

HI Retro,

I don't have a source for it, but it was mentioned by several people

here who said when they were on Arimidex their IGF-1 levels dropped.

>

> >One more thing, if anyone plans on lowering E2 with Arimidex, get

> >your IGF-1 tested beforehand, its Arimidex is known to lower IGF-1.

>

>

> Do you have a cite for this?

>

> Thanks.

>

> - - - -

> Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

> You are not reporting a value for total estrogen.

> You are only reporting Estradiol (E2).

>

> Have the total estrogen determined and see its

> relation to total T. Maybe your ratio is too high!

>

> If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly,

> depending on your age

> it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

This is incorrect. Shippen doesn't test for total estrogens. He only

tests for Estradiol (E2). See page 170 of his book.

The reason is that E2 is by far THE most powerful estrogen. Therefore,

the amount of other estrogens present is irrelevant with regard to the

T/E2 balance question.

[Guest guest]

Because I have no problem getting an erection and Viagra does nothing to

stimulate libido.

Re: Re: high T but low libido

Why are you not a viagra candidate?

In a message dated 9/13/2004 12:17:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

jackhanchette@... writes:

You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and my E2 level is

not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to go from here. My lab

work looks great and I am not a Viagra candidate. Everything works just fine

as

far as the plumbing and yet without any libido and very weak orgasms and low

ejaculate volume it all amounts to nothing. If anyone has any ideas I would

love to hear them.

[Guest guest]

If you read the book's index, Estradiol is only mentioned in pages 16 & 170. In

the rest of the book, he refers to Estrogen (Estradiol + Estrone). Estrone is

nowhere mentioned in the book.

Chapter 5 is titled: Estrogen The Culprit (he does not call it Estradiol).

I do not deny Estradiol being the most important one; the book does not state

that when it says Estrogen = Estradiol.

Sorry to be so detailed oriented, but I am a chemist and there is significant

difference between the two words chemistry wise.

Flaco

" Z " <davidzxxx2004@...> wrote:

>> You are not reporting a value for total estrogen.

>> You are only reporting Estradiol (E2).

>>

>> Have the total estrogen determined and see its

>> relation to total T. Maybe your ratio is too high!

>>

>> If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly,

>> depending on your age

>> it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

>

>This is incorrect. Shippen doesn't test for total estrogens. He only

>tests for Estradiol (E2). See page 170 of his book.

>

>The reason is that E2 is by far THE most powerful estrogen. Therefore,

>the amount of other estrogens present is irrelevant with regard to the

>T/E2 balance question.

>

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

> You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and my

E2 level is not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to go

from here. My lab work looks great and I am not a Viagra candidate.

Everything works just fine as far as the plumbing and yet without any

libido and very weak orgasms and low ejaculate volume......

Hi RD. My T levels are very low normal, Free T off the chart on the

low end, E2 midrange normal. Had (still have but less) all the

symptoms of low T (no energy, low libido, ED, anorgasmic, lethargic

etc, etc). 2 monthts ago I started taking 10 mg of C every 72 hrs,

but found it to be too little. Now take 10 mg every other day, and it

does the trick (for me anyway). As for immediate side effects I have

found none with the 10 mg regimen, but found the traditional ones

when taking 20 mg. Not only do I feel my libido is stronger, but

erections easier to obtain (must have physical stimulation though). I

also take 50 mg of Zinc, double the recomended dose of Multi

vitamins, and 6 g of Maca (3 x 2 g). In addition I take 3 g of L-

Carnitine in the morning. I must say that the combo Cialis/Maca/L-

Carnitine does something. When only taking C and L-Carnitine I had

trouble reaching orgasm, but after starting with Maca it is easier

and the ejaculate volume has increased. Am still seriously

considering HRT, but with BHP and troublesome PSA values I will

continue with what I described above. It works for me, even if I am

still far away from my performance/experience from 10 yrs ago. In the

meantime I am fairly happy with the results.

Tomas

[Guest guest]

Dr. Shippen is my doctor. He only tests for E2. When I asked him about

the other Estrogens, he said they are not significant.

In much of the literature (including Shippen's book), Estrogen and

Estradiol are used interchangeably. (I mention this in 8th paragraph of

my 1 of 8 primer in the files section of this group.) Don't make the

mistake of taking this literally.

Re: Re: high T but low libido

> If you read the book's index, Estradiol is only mentioned in pages 16

& 170. In the rest of the book, he refers to Estrogen (Estradiol +

Estrone). Estrone is nowhere mentioned in the book.

>

> Chapter 5 is titled: Estrogen The Culprit (he does not call it

Estradiol).

>

> I do not deny Estradiol being the most important one; the book does

not state that when it says Estrogen = Estradiol.

>

> Sorry to be so detailed oriented, but I am a chemist and there is

significant difference between the two words chemistry wise.

>

> Flaco

>

> " Z " <davidzxxx2004@...> wrote:

>

> >> You are not reporting a value for total estrogen.

> >> You are only reporting Estradiol (E2).

> >>

> >> Have the total estrogen determined and see its

> >> relation to total T. Maybe your ratio is too high!

> >>

> >> If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly,

> >> depending on your age

> >> it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

> >

> >This is incorrect. Shippen doesn't test for total estrogens. He

only

> >tests for Estradiol (E2). See page 170 of his book.

> >

> >The reason is that E2 is by far THE most powerful estrogen.

Therefore,

> >the amount of other estrogens present is irrelevant with regard to

the

> >T/E2 balance question.

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

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[Guest guest]

Thanks for the clarification.

Flaco

> >

> > >> You are not reporting a value for total estrogen.

> > >> You are only reporting Estradiol (E2).

> > >>

> > >> Have the total estrogen determined and see its

> > >> relation to total T. Maybe your ratio is too high!

> > >>

> > >> If I understood Dr. Shippens' book correctly,

> > >> depending on your age

> > >> it should be 1/20 or less (5% or less) of the total T.

> > >

> > >This is incorrect. Shippen doesn't test for total estrogens. He

> only

> > >tests for Estradiol (E2). See page 170 of his book.

> > >

> > >The reason is that E2 is by far THE most powerful estrogen.

> Therefore,

> > >the amount of other estrogens present is irrelevant with regard to

> the

> > >T/E2 balance question.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > __________________________________________________________________

> > Switch to Netscape Internet Service.

> > As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at

> http://isp.netscape.com/register

> >

> > Netscape. Just the Net You Need.

> >

> > New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer

> > Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups.

> > Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Tomas, please excuse my ignorance, but with all of the abbreviations used on

this site I am not sure if you are referring to vitamin C supplements or

something else? Also, what is the conversion of " grams " to " milligrams " in the

dosages you suggest? Thanks.

Re: high T but low libido

> You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and my

E2 level is not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to go

from here. My lab work looks great and I am not a Viagra candidate.

Everything works just fine as far as the plumbing and yet without any

libido and very weak orgasms and low ejaculate volume......

Hi RD. My T levels are very low normal, Free T off the chart on the

low end, E2 midrange normal. Had (still have but less) all the

symptoms of low T (no energy, low libido, ED, anorgasmic, lethargic

etc, etc). 2 monthts ago I started taking 10 mg of C every 72 hrs,

but found it to be too little. Now take 10 mg every other day, and it

does the trick (for me anyway). As for immediate side effects I have

found none with the 10 mg regimen, but found the traditional ones

when taking 20 mg. Not only do I feel my libido is stronger, but

erections easier to obtain (must have physical stimulation though). I

also take 50 mg of Zinc, double the recomended dose of Multi

vitamins, and 6 g of Maca (3 x 2 g). In addition I take 3 g of L-

Carnitine in the morning. I must say that the combo Cialis/Maca/L-

Carnitine does something. When only taking C and L-Carnitine I had

trouble reaching orgasm, but after starting with Maca it is easier

and the ejaculate volume has increased. Am still seriously

considering HRT, but with BHP and troublesome PSA values I will

continue with what I described above. It works for me, even if I am

still far away from my performance/experience from 10 yrs ago. In the

meantime I am fairly happy with the results.

Tomas

[Guest guest]

Jack, the C is Cialis, not Vitamin C. Cialis comes in 20 mg tablets,

and most vitamins/supplements are measured in mg units. The L-

Carnitine I take comes from Life Extension (www.lef.org) and is

called Chrono Forte. The capsules also contain L-Carnosine, Nettle,

Biotin, Vitamin B1 and Zinc. Maca comes in different shapes and

forms, but I take powder in pill form - 4 pills (500 mg ea) 3 times a

day with meals. 1000 mg is one gram. Hope this helps.

Tomas

> > You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and

my

> E2 level is not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to

go

> from here. My lab work looks great and I am not a Viagra

candidate.

> Everything works just fine as far as the plumbing and yet without

any

> libido and very weak orgasms and low ejaculate volume......

>

> Hi RD. My T levels are very low normal, Free T off the chart on

the

> low end, E2 midrange normal. Had (still have but less) all the

> symptoms of low T (no energy, low libido, ED, anorgasmic,

lethargic

> etc, etc). 2 monthts ago I started taking 10 mg of C every 72 hrs,

> but found it to be too little. Now take 10 mg every other day,

and it

> does the trick (for me anyway). As for immediate side effects I

have

> found none with the 10 mg regimen, but found the traditional ones

> when taking 20 mg. Not only do I feel my libido is stronger, but

> erections easier to obtain (must have physical stimulation

though). I

> also take 50 mg of Zinc, double the recomended dose of Multi

> vitamins, and 6 g of Maca (3 x 2 g). In addition I take 3 g of L-

> Carnitine in the morning. I must say that the combo Cialis/Maca/L-

> Carnitine does something. When only taking C and L-Carnitine I had

> trouble reaching orgasm, but after starting with Maca it is easier

> and the ejaculate volume has increased. Am still seriously

> considering HRT, but with BHP and troublesome PSA values I will

> continue with what I described above. It works for me, even if I

am

> still far away from my performance/experience from 10 yrs ago. In

the

> meantime I am fairly happy with the results.

>

> Tomas

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, that does help.

Re: high T but low libido

Jack, the C is Cialis, not Vitamin C. Cialis comes in 20 mg tablets,

and most vitamins/supplements are measured in mg units. The L-

Carnitine I take comes from Life Extension (www.lef.org) and is

called Chrono Forte. The capsules also contain L-Carnosine, Nettle,

Biotin, Vitamin B1 and Zinc. Maca comes in different shapes and

forms, but I take powder in pill form - 4 pills (500 mg ea) 3 times a

day with meals. 1000 mg is one gram. Hope this helps.

Tomas

> > You guys are just like me. I have the exact same symptoms and

my

> E2 level is not the issue. I am at a total loss as to where to

go

> from here. My lab work looks great and I am not a Viagra

candidate.

> Everything works just fine as far as the plumbing and yet without

any

> libido and very weak orgasms and low ejaculate volume......

>

> Hi RD. My T levels are very low normal, Free T off the chart on

the

> low end, E2 midrange normal. Had (still have but less) all the

> symptoms of low T (no energy, low libido, ED, anorgasmic,

lethargic

> etc, etc). 2 monthts ago I started taking 10 mg of C every 72 hrs,

> but found it to be too little. Now take 10 mg every other day,

and it

> does the trick (for me anyway). As for immediate side effects I

have

> found none with the 10 mg regimen, but found the traditional ones

> when taking 20 mg. Not only do I feel my libido is stronger, but

> erections easier to obtain (must have physical stimulation

though). I

> also take 50 mg of Zinc, double the recomended dose of Multi

> vitamins, and 6 g of Maca (3 x 2 g). In addition I take 3 g of L-

> Carnitine in the morning. I must say that the combo Cialis/Maca/L-

> Carnitine does something. When only taking C and L-Carnitine I had

> trouble reaching orgasm, but after starting with Maca it is easier

> and the ejaculate volume has increased. Am still seriously

> considering HRT, but with BHP and troublesome PSA values I will

> continue with what I described above. It works for me, even if I

am

> still far away from my performance/experience from 10 yrs ago. In

the

> meantime I am fairly happy with the results.

>

> Tomas

>

>

>

>

>

>

>