Re: andro gel

[Guest guest]

I think a point that should be emphasized with new people to the problem

that Androgel may cause sterility. This was a big surprise to me and my

doctor. I think it's an important point to raise!

_____

From: Dave [mailto:daultman@...]

Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 9:46 PM

Subject: RE: Re: andro gel

Something's wrong with your thermostat, but not your furnace, or maybe

both...but definitely your thermostat is part of the problem. If someone's

thermostat is fine, and only the furnace is broken, what I say makes sense.

I'm just trying to get people out of giving what I believe is inaccurate

advice when they say, like everything else, you can never say " always " or

" never, " even though I just said " never. " :-)

I don't believe it's not accurate to say " ANY amount of supplemental

testosterone will ALWAYS shut down the gonads, it's just a matter of time "

as his been posted here many times.

> RE: Re: andro gel

>

> Hi Dave if this were true then why when I started TRT my

> levels went down. I started on a very low dose and it stoped

> my Testis from making more T this showed up in my next blood

> test LH and FSH went way down. This was 20 yrs. ago the Dr.

> told me that taking T. stoped me form making my own T. and he

> had to up the dose.

> Phil

>

[Guest guest]

On Thu, 26 Aug 2004 21:40:49 -0700, you wrote:

>

>Yes, I went from 216 to 1022 to 1500, all on 5g Androgel. I suspect the

>difference is the cause of the hypogonadism.

You know it sounds like your body may have trouble metabolizing T. It

sounds like it is accumulating. If this were to happen your feedback

loop would try to turn off production. Which may be the reason you

eventually ended up with hypo-g.

http://tinyurl.com/6zbps

For some background in things like this. He mentions a case where

there's a lack of T receptors resulting in very high levels. Not

saying that's your case, but he describes various conditions and how

they come about in a way that equips understanding of these complex

issues.

- - - -

Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 04:39:52 -0000, you wrote:

>

>

>Retro,

>

>I thought the pituitary made LH and FSH?

It does, I'm speaking of a Releasing Hormone that tells the pituitary

to make these. It seems the hypothalamus is the receptor site for T

feedback to create more LH and FSH.

The hypothalamus then releases GNRH and LHRH and I'm not sure but I

believe there is a FSHRH also.

" Male Sex Hormones

Since many of the acts that are considered deviant in America involve

sex it is important to cover the basics of this system. We start the

story of sex in the male with the hypothalamus.

The hypothalamus is the site that controls many of the sexual

processes in humans. This organ produces luteinizing-releasing hormone

(LnRH) and corticotropin-releasing factor (CRF). A special system of

blood vessels transports these hormones to the anterior lobe of the

pituitary gland.

In the anterior lobe the LnRH stimulates the biosynthesis of

luteinising hormone (LH) and follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH). CRF

stimulates production of adrenocorticotropic hormone (ACTH). (ACTH

stimulates the adrenal glands to produce adrenocortical hormones,

especially glucocorticoids and male hormones known as androgens.)

From the anterior lobe of the pituitary gland, via the circulating

blood, LH and FSH arrive at the testicles. The testicles have specific

receptors for these hormones. The receptors for LH occur only on

Leydig (interstitial) cells, whose primary secretion is testosterone.

Testosterone effects its action after conversion to

dihydrotestosterone, a more potent androgen. The receptors for FSH are

found only in the Sertoli cells of the seminiferous tubules, which

produce spermatozoa. The feedback loop from these sites modulates

production of these two hormones. "

http://www.vernonjohns.org/nonracists/dvissues.html

>---

>> There's actually an additional step. The hypothalamus makes and FSH

>> and LH Releasing Hormone. It seems the first step in the feedback loop

>> is in the hypothalamus which then triggers the pituitary production.

- - - -

Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

On Thu, 26 Aug 2004 21:45:57 -0700, you wrote:

>

>Something's wrong with your thermostat, but not your furnace, or maybe

>both...but definitely your thermostat is part of the problem. If someone's

>thermostat is fine, and only the furnace is broken, what I say makes sense.

>

>I'm just trying to get people out of giving what I believe is inaccurate

>advice when they say, like everything else, you can never say " always " or

> " never, " even though I just said " never. " :-)

>

>I don't believe it's not accurate to say " ANY amount of supplemental

>testosterone will ALWAYS shut down the gonads, it's just a matter of time "

>as his been posted here many times.

You may well be right. But all (sic) the endos say it. But we now know

what their opinion is worth right. ;->

- - - -

Just another albino black sheep

[Guest guest]

Retro,

Thanks for posting that - it was a good summary.

Mark

[Guest guest]

Yes I see younger men with this problem all the time. But did your Dr.'s figure

out why your low the 2 main reasons for this are your Primary meaning your

testis are not working or your Secondary meaning you need an MRI to rule out a

Pituitary tumor it's rare to be cancer but needs to be looked at.

The other things that do this to men are a long list and if you find out what it

is and fix it levels will come back up. One younger guy had a bad tooth with a

low infection in it his levels went down over the yrs with this and when they

figured it out and pulled the tooth his levels came back up.

I tell men you age and older men don't go on TRT until you know why your low

because if you find out what it is and fix it your not on TRT for life.

Once you go on it it's very hard to find out why your low and very hard to get

off it and have your body make it's own testosterone.

Can you post your labs.

Here is a cut and past from this link as to how you can get low T.

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=450553

And read this link it's about low T this will teach you about this.

http://www.griffinmedical.com/male_hormone_modulation_therapy.html

==================================================

According to the Great Smokies Diagnostic Lab, these are the causes of

hypogonadism:

chronic/systemic illness

surgery

chemotherapy

infections

premature aging

testicular trauma

stress

Kleinfelter's syndrome

autoimmune damage

tobacco and alcohol

sleep apnea

excessive heat

obesity

hypercortisolism

medications

hyperthyroidism

malnutrition

?Subtle clinical signs of hypogonadism may include slight gynecomastia

and soft small testes. However, researchers have noted that " the

findings of physical examination in men with adult-onset hypogonadism

are often normal.?

Secondary hypogonadism can develop as a result of hypothalamic or

pituitary disease, obesity, hypothyroidism or other causes. Some

conditions, such as hypercortisolemia, AIDS and severe systemic

illnesses, can trigger hypogonadism through a combination of both

primary and secondary mechanisms.?

http://www.gsdl.com/home/assessments/malehormone/appguide/index3.html

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: joec941 <joec941@...>

> Subject: andro gel

>

> Date: Thursday, May 6, 2010, 2:51 PM

> hello im 24 m very little muscle tone

> ive been on andro gel for about 5 months seems to be working

> is it normal to be on this stuff so young 

>

>

>

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