Guest guest Posted March 3, 2007 Report Share Posted March 3, 2007 > > I just hope it keeps on doing whatever it can't be doing. Somehow >the metals are coming out whether it is chelating or not - lab tests >say something is busy in there. Then why not post the lab tests or give the post numbers where people have posted the lab tests? I am very, very happy that some people are seeing positive results from NCD. I have made the observation in adult groups that adults have reported negatives from NCD. I am not a proponent nor a sceptic, just an observer. I really wonder what the heck the stuff does anyway. I think that you are missing one important point. If what you want is to remove heavy metals from the brain the only known chelator that will do that, when used appropriately, is ALA. There are long term consequences associated with leaving heavy metals in the brain - chronic pain, chronic fatigue, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, ALS, MS, psychological problems, just to name a few. J " Maybe the NCD just sweet talks heavy metals into leaving as their escort. " Nobody really cares if it is classified as a chelator except the people who are anti-NCD. The people that use it are just grateful it works regardless of whatchacallit. I will just call it a miracle supplement from now on and it is definitely not a chelator if that will end the debate and make everyone more comfortable. NCD people don't care if it chelates squat as long as there continues to be such remarkable improvements in our children. Absolutely no one I have ever talked with has stated that NCD did as good or better job than DMSA at removing metals, BUT it does SOMETHING good and I think that is all anyone wanted to share with this group. I hope no one ever stops sharing good results with others because a few people are skeptics. If you ask the people on the NCD site, I lurked around there as the biggest skeptic picking peoples brains for 3 months and did not believe a single word until I finally tried it for myself. > > Chris > > [ ] Posts by Andy on NCD, from adult-metal-chelation > > > Here's a good post on Andy's take on NCD. Please note that his beef > is with false claims made by the NCD marketers (and the price people > have to pay for them), not with zeolites per se. If you read to the > end you will see that he does believe they can be beneficial - just > not as chelators. > > Rene > > ------------------------------------------ > > From adult-metal-chelation: > Re: Liquid Zeolite Dec. 30, 2006 > > > It claims to chelate these metals. > > I hope they will be prosecuted for fraud soon. > > > Why are you so sure it doesn't? > > 1. I am familiar with what zeolites do. While they will exchange ions > with the fluid they are in, and in this sense might be called > a " chelator, " if one abuses the term, just as one might > call other components of dirt a chelator like humic acids, peat moss, > clay, etc. it isn't absorbed from the intestines so it won't clear > the body of any metals. > > 2. This false claim (that it is clinically effective for heavy metal > chelation)was made at me by one of their MLM sales reps who really > harangued me to endorse it, despite the fact > that I told him up front that I do not endorse any product. > > Ignoring the idiotic stuff he did and said like asking me if I KNEW > what a zeolite was (I have since about 1979) he provided me a US > patent in support of his assertions that did not cover chelation or > heavy metals at all. Not one word on them. I doubt he had even > read it before asserting it as proof that NCD zeolites are clinically > effective for chelating heavy metals out of toxic people. > > When I pointed out that the patent did not cover this topic, he > assured me that he would get the actual data I needed from their head > scientific expert and forward it to me immediately. > > When I followed up with him after an adequate period of time he > admitted they had no such data but stated that DR X was conducting > studies on this topic that would soon > > * * * P R O V E * * * > > that NCD zeolites were a chelator. > > By his bad luck, Dr. X is someone I personally know. What I know is > the Doctor's history of keeping patient charts unrelated to what > happened in the clinic, which I have personally observed many times. > Needless to say whatever data Dr. X provided would not convince > me of anything, nor does their choosing to work with this doctor > convince me of their high moral character. > > Interestingly, I have seen no data on the supposed work Dr. X was > going to do for them and it has been over a year I believe since it > was promised. The doctor could easily make up some data in that time > if they were really working with Dr. X. > > Based on the lack of any evidence that zeolites remove any heavy > metals from the body, and my more than adequate understanding of > zeolites, what they are and what they do, I do not believe that NCD > or any other zeolite product is a clinically useful heavy metal > chelator. > > BTW, for those of you paying an arm and a leg for tihs expensive > product, it is my understanding that it is dirt - it is a mineral > mined from the ground. Even if it is a synthetic zeolite, these are > not very expensive. > > The first clincal report I heard on response to NCD zeolite WAS an > adverse reaction report. This moots the claim the stuff is perfectly > safe. However I otherwise am receiving lots of positive reports and > almost no negative reports so I do think it is relatively safe. > > Also these reports usually include imrpovements while taking the > product. The improvements are of the kind that usually happens when > gut dysbiosis is improved, and thus I beileve NCD or other zeolite > products affect intestinal flora balance in a positive way. > > Zeolite products have been used in animal feed for over 30 years with > beneficial effect and no noted negatives. > > So I do not believe NCD zeolite or any other zeolite product does or > even theoretically can chelate heavy metals out of people under any > of the situations relevant to those on this list. However it does > seem to have some beneficial effect, and little risk. > > Andy > --------------------------- > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2007 Report Share Posted March 3, 2007 I don't think NCD removes mercury from the brain that is what I have been trying to say. It is good stuff and does lots of good things that nobody seems to know why, it gets lose metals from somewhere obviously and that is why a lot of folks use it right after a round of DMSA. We are going to definitely do Yasko but will most likely do the really low dose DMSA of Andy's protocol as well in the future. No one is trying to argue any points, just that the stuff works wonders for some what ever apparently weird reason. To be honest the NCD whipped my butt at first, I am one of those it did not do well for, I would never give my grandchild anything that I would not take myself. But now the 7 year old is a different story, he had no problems is improving by leaps and bounds. Don't know why, magic I guess. That is a good enough explanation. Either you have faith in something or you don't. You can't make someone believe in miracles unless they have experienced the same miracle. I am not trying to convince anyone to use it, just as there is nothing that is going to convince me it is not the reason for the improvements. Enough said by me on the subject. Chris [ ] Posts by Andy on NCD, from adult-metal-chelation > > > Here's a good post on Andy's take on NCD. Please note that his beef > is with false claims made by the NCD marketers (and the price people > have to pay for them), not with zeolites per se. If you read to the > end you will see that he does believe they can be beneficial - just > not as chelators. > > Rene > > ------------------------------------------ > > From adult-metal-chelation: > Re: Liquid Zeolite Dec. 30, 2006 > > > It claims to chelate these metals. > > I hope they will be prosecuted for fraud soon. > > > Why are you so sure it doesn't? > > 1. I am familiar with what zeolites do. While they will exchange ions > with the fluid they are in, and in this sense might be called > a " chelator, " if one abuses the term, just as one might > call other components of dirt a chelator like humic acids, peat moss, > clay, etc. it isn't absorbed from the intestines so it won't clear > the body of any metals. > > 2. This false claim (that it is clinically effective for heavy metal > chelation)was made at me by one of their MLM sales reps who really > harangued me to endorse it, despite the fact > that I told him up front that I do not endorse any product. > > Ignoring the idiotic stuff he did and said like asking me if I KNEW > what a zeolite was (I have since about 1979) he provided me a US > patent in support of his assertions that did not cover chelation or > heavy metals at all. Not one word on them. I doubt he had even > read it before asserting it as proof that NCD zeolites are clinically > effective for chelating heavy metals out of toxic people. > > When I pointed out that the patent did not cover this topic, he > assured me that he would get the actual data I needed from their head > scientific expert and forward it to me immediately. > > When I followed up with him after an adequate period of time he > admitted they had no such data but stated that DR X was conducting > studies on this topic that would soon > > * * * P R O V E * * * > > that NCD zeolites were a chelator. > > By his bad luck, Dr. X is someone I personally know. What I know is > the Doctor's history of keeping patient charts unrelated to what > happened in the clinic, which I have personally observed many times. > Needless to say whatever data Dr. X provided would not convince > me of anything, nor does their choosing to work with this doctor > convince me of their high moral character. > > Interestingly, I have seen no data on the supposed work Dr. X was > going to do for them and it has been over a year I believe since it > was promised. The doctor could easily make up some data in that time > if they were really working with Dr. X. > > Based on the lack of any evidence that zeolites remove any heavy > metals from the body, and my more than adequate understanding of > zeolites, what they are and what they do, I do not believe that NCD > or any other zeolite product is a clinically useful heavy metal > chelator. > > BTW, for those of you paying an arm and a leg for tihs expensive > product, it is my understanding that it is dirt - it is a mineral > mined from the ground. Even if it is a synthetic zeolite, these are > not very expensive. > > The first clincal report I heard on response to NCD zeolite WAS an > adverse reaction report. This moots the claim the stuff is perfectly > safe. However I otherwise am receiving lots of positive reports and > almost no negative reports so I do think it is relatively safe. > > Also these reports usually include imrpovements while taking the > product. The improvements are of the kind that usually happens when > gut dysbiosis is improved, and thus I beileve NCD or other zeolite > products affect intestinal flora balance in a positive way. > > Zeolite products have been used in animal feed for over 30 years with > beneficial effect and no noted negatives. > > So I do not believe NCD zeolite or any other zeolite product does or > even theoretically can chelate heavy metals out of people under any > of the situations relevant to those on this list. However it does > seem to have some beneficial effect, and little risk. > > Andy > --------------------------- > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2007 Report Share Posted March 3, 2007 > Then why not post the lab tests or give the post numbers where people have posted the lab tests? There are some posted on the NCD list. I have many privately Parents are leery of posting .previously a few marketers have taken their testimonies without permission for personal gain. This is not looked upon favorably by the community > > I think that you are missing one important point. If what you want is to remove heavy metals from the brain the only known chelator that will do that, when used appropriately, is ALA. >> << I believe that to be true. Some parents are having success with adding ALA. I am cautiously thinking of that myself . I say cautiously not for the ALA of which I have had success with but for the Yeasty Beasties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2007 Report Share Posted March 4, 2007 [ ] Posts by Andy on NCD, from adult-metal-chelation Here's a good post on Andy's take on NCD. Please note that his beef is with false claims made by the NCD marketers (and the price people have to pay for them), not with zeolites per se. If you read to the end you will see that he does believe they can be beneficial - just not as chelators. Rene ------------------------------------------ From adult-metal-chelation: Re: Liquid Zeolite Dec. 30, 2006 > It claims to chelate these metals. I hope they will be prosecuted for fraud soon. > Why are you so sure it doesn't? 1. I am familiar with what zeolites do. While they will exchange ions with the fluid they are in, and in this sense might be called a " chelator, " if one abuses the term, just as one might call other components of dirt a chelator like humic acids, peat moss, clay, etc. it isn't absorbed from the intestines so it won't clear the body of any metals. 2. This false claim (that it is clinically effective for heavy metal chelation)was made at me by one of their MLM sales reps who really harangued me to endorse it, despite the fact that I told him up front that I do not endorse any product. Ignoring the idiotic stuff he did and said like asking me if I KNEW what a zeolite was (I have since about 1979) he provided me a US patent in support of his assertions that did not cover chelation or heavy metals at all. Not one word on them. I doubt he had even read it before asserting it as proof that NCD zeolites are clinically effective for chelating heavy metals out of toxic people. When I pointed out that the patent did not cover this topic, he assured me that he would get the actual data I needed from their head scientific expert and forward it to me immediately. When I followed up with him after an adequate period of time he admitted they had no such data but stated that DR X was conducting studies on this topic that would soon * * * P R O V E * * * that NCD zeolites were a chelator. By his bad luck, Dr. X is someone I personally know. What I know is the Doctor's history of keeping patient charts unrelated to what happened in the clinic, which I have personally observed many times. Needless to say whatever data Dr. X provided would not convince me of anything, nor does their choosing to work with this doctor convince me of their high moral character. Interestingly, I have seen no data on the supposed work Dr. X was going to do for them and it has been over a year I believe since it was promised. The doctor could easily make up some data in that time if they were really working with Dr. X. Based on the lack of any evidence that zeolites remove any heavy metals from the body, and my more than adequate understanding of zeolites, what they are and what they do, I do not believe that NCD or any other zeolite product is a clinically useful heavy metal chelator. BTW, for those of you paying an arm and a leg for tihs expensive product, it is my understanding that it is dirt - it is a mineral mined from the ground. Even if it is a synthetic zeolite, these are not very expensive. The first clincal report I heard on response to NCD zeolite WAS an adverse reaction report. This moots the claim the stuff is perfectly safe. However I otherwise am receiving lots of positive reports and almost no negative reports so I do think it is relatively safe. Also these reports usually include imrpovements while taking the product. The improvements are of the kind that usually happens when gut dysbiosis is improved, and thus I beileve NCD or other zeolite products affect intestinal flora balance in a positive way. Zeolite products have been used in animal feed for over 30 years with beneficial effect and no noted negatives. So I do not believe NCD zeolite or any other zeolite product does or even theoretically can chelate heavy metals out of people under any of the situations relevant to those on this list. However it does seem to have some beneficial effect, and little risk. Andy --------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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