Re: DMSA regression group

January 17, 2007

Common reasons are:

Inappropriate doses (too high)

Inappropriate dosing schedule (too infrequent or trying to skip the night doses)

Inappropriate fillers or additives (glutathione in TD)

Yeast

Mercury amalgam dental fillings still in place

Please refer the people on that list to Andy Cutler's protocol and the hairtest

counting rules.

S S

I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together and

chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to the

group:

<a

href= " DMSAregression/ " >http://health.g\

roups..com/group/DMSAregression/</a>

Well wishes,

_______________________________________________

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January 18, 2007

,

It will be interesting if you see any patterns develop. Hopefully

everyone will accurately report their protocols. I expect high doses

and 8 hour dosing frequency to be a problem. Or suppository use.

I like that your focus is on fixing a problem and not bashing a method.

Good luck to you.

Pam

>

> I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together and

> chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

the

> group:

> DMSAregression/

>

> Well wishes,

>

January 18, 2007

There are some kids who do have a real problem with sulfur products that I don't

think can all be explained by high doses or improper protocol.

[ ] Re: DMSA regression group

,

It will be interesting if you see any patterns develop. Hopefully

everyone will accurately report their protocols. I expect high doses

and 8 hour dosing frequency to be a problem. Or suppository use.

I like that your focus is on fixing a problem and not bashing a method.

Good luck to you.

Pam

>

> I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together and

> chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

the

> group:

> DMSAregression/

>

> Well wishes,

>

January 18, 2007

I see many times that people do not supplement children with vitamins

and minerals while chelating either. And the doses are too high.

Often times when they are chelated using a safer protocol you will see

the regressions disappear.

>

> I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together

and

> chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

the

> group:

> DMSAregression/

>

> Well wishes,

>

January 18, 2007

Jan,

where can I find the info on supplementing during chelation? I've read not to

supplement except on non-chelation days and I've also read that you should

supplement certain things on chelation days. I'm sure there's a file on this

here somewhere. Can you direct me?

Thanks,

Sissy

[ ] Re: DMSA regression group

I see many times that people do not supplement children with vitamins

and minerals while chelating either. And the doses are too high.

Often times when they are chelated using a safer protocol you will see

the regressions disappear.

>

> I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together

and

> chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

the

> group:

> DMSAregression/

>

> Well wishes,

>

January 18, 2007

Just wanted to expand a bit and note that the reasoning behind the

DMSA regression group was the perplexing situation where DMSA caused

regression despite using the safest possible protocol to our knowledge

(Cutler 4-hr low dose schedule), rigorous supplementation as per

Andy's suggestions, and a hefty anti-fungal protocol. After

regression, we did further research and realized that our kids have

abnormally low selenium despite supplementation, many have low

neutrophils, and a suspected sulfur problem. When we got to talking,

these three issues came up repeatedly so it seemed advisable to get

together and compare notes.

I'm quite convinced that Andy's protocol is the safest and most

effective for most people, but as with everything other than the

proverbial death & taxes, it's not 100% guaranteed. Intolerance of

DMSA is possible, whether because of sulfur or perhaps some other

reason, and it's in the best interest of our kids to pursue that

further and determine what we can do about it and how best to heal our

extra-special special needs kids!

> >

> > I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> > group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> > regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> > most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> > PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> > so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back

together and

> > chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

> the

> > group:

> > DMSAregression/

> >

> > Well wishes,

> >

>

January 19, 2007

Hi ,

My son got a fine rash on his first round of DMSA (5mg every 3-

4hrs), started in the nappy region, then on his shoulder/belly. I

stopped about 36hrs into the round, it cleared within 24 hrs and

haven't tried again. He also seemed a bit tired.

Is this part of the reactions linked to sulphur problems or

something different?.

na

>

> Just wanted to expand a bit and note that the reasoning behind the

> DMSA regression group was the perplexing situation where DMSA

caused

> regression despite using the safest possible protocol to our

knowledge

> (Cutler 4-hr low dose schedule), rigorous supplementation as per

> Andy's suggestions, and a hefty anti-fungal protocol. After

> regression, we did further research and realized that our kids have

> abnormally low selenium despite supplementation, many have low

> neutrophils, and a suspected sulfur problem. When we got to

talking,

> these three issues came up repeatedly so it seemed advisable to get

> together and compare notes.

>

> I'm quite convinced that Andy's protocol is the safest and most

> effective for most people, but as with everything other than the

> proverbial death & taxes, it's not 100% guaranteed. Intolerance of

> DMSA is possible, whether because of sulfur or perhaps some other

> reason, and it's in the best interest of our kids to pursue that

> further and determine what we can do about it and how best to heal

our

> extra-special special needs kids!

>

January 19, 2007

Not sure, could be a detox rash. For my son rashes are usually viral

or fungal in origin. Sulfur issues cause major gut problems for him.

>

> Hi ,

>

> My son got a fine rash on his first round of DMSA (5mg every 3-

> 4hrs), started in the nappy region, then on his shoulder/belly. I

> stopped about 36hrs into the round, it cleared within 24 hrs and

> haven't tried again. He also seemed a bit tired.

>

> Is this part of the reactions linked to sulphur problems or

> something different?.

>

> na

January 19, 2007

> where can I find the info on supplementing during chelation? I've

read not to supplement except on non-chelation days and I've also read

that you should supplement certain things on chelation days. I'm sure

there's a file on this here somewhere. Can you direct me?

I'm not Jan, but see " Supplement File (HTML).htm " in

/files/.

Supplements are to be taken every day whether chelating or not.

W.

January 19, 2007

thank you, thank you!

[ ] Re: DMSA regression group

> where can I find the info on supplementing during chelation? I've

read not to supplement except on non-chelation days and I've also read

that you should supplement certain things on chelation days. I'm sure

there's a file on this here somewhere. Can you direct me?

I'm not Jan, but see " Supplement File (HTML).htm " in

/files/.

Supplements are to be taken every day whether chelating or not.

W.

January 19, 2007

According to Andy you should be supplementing ALL the time.

His body is deficient if he is metal toxic and needs this. The list

is in the files of this group. If you still have trouble just email

me and I will send it to you.

I know I tried chelating myself with less than what is recomended,

and it makes things worse. The supps really do help.

> >

> > I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a

new

> > group formed to discuss possible reasons some children

have

> > regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents

that

> > most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on

their

> > PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling

information

> > so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back

together

> and

> > chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link

to

> the

> > group:

> > DMSAregression/

> >

> > Well wishes,

> >

>

January 19, 2007

Thanks, I found the file. It's all stuff we've been doing for 18 months now. I

thought I'd seen somewhere that supplementing should be different during

chelation but maybe I imagined it. Most of the time I'm so tired I can't see

straight.

I do tend to back off on the prescription meds (except for yeast med) when we're

chelating. I don't know if it makes any difference, just seems like the

prescriptions are probably hard on his body. We've done 6 rounds of DMSA so far

with some success. Tonight my son was singing, " night, night, niiiiight night "

when I put him to bed. He has verbal apraxia so we're easily excited!

Have a good weekend!

Sissy

[ ] Re: DMSA regression group

According to Andy you should be supplementing ALL the time.

His body is deficient if he is metal toxic and needs this. The list

is in the files of this group. If you still have trouble just email

me and I will send it to you.

I know I tried chelating myself with less than what is recomended,

and it makes things worse. The supps really do help.

> >

> > I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a

new

> > group formed to discuss possible reasons some children

have

> > regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents

that

> > most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on

their

> > PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling

information

> > so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back

together

> and

> > chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link

to

> the

> > group:

> > DMSAregression/

> >

> > Well wishes,

> >

>

January 20, 2007

Consider having participants on the list compile/post their kids' hair tests and

then ask AC to look at them.

S S

" j_kalis " <j_kalis@...> wrote:

>

> I want to invite any interested individuals to take part in a new

> group formed to discuss possible reasons some children have

> regressed using DMSA. I have found in talking to other parents that

> most of these children have extremely low selenium levels on their

> PRBC analysis. I am interested in sharing and compiling information

> so that together we can find ways to put the pieces back together

and

> chelate these children safely and effectively. Here's the link to

the

> group:

> <a

href= " DMSAregression/ " >http://health.g\

roups..com/group/DMSAregression/</a>

>

> Well wishes,

>

>

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January 20, 2007

>

> Just wanted to expand a bit and note that the reasoning behind the

> DMSA regression group was the perplexing situation where DMSA

caused

> regression despite using the safest possible protocol to our

knowledge

> (Cutler 4-hr low dose schedule), rigorous supplementation as per

> Andy's suggestions, and a hefty anti-fungal protocol. After

> regression, we did further research and realized that our kids have

> abnormally low selenium despite supplementation, many have low

> neutrophils, and a suspected sulfur problem. When we got to

talking,

> these three issues came up repeatedly so it seemed advisable to get

> together and compare notes.

>

> I'm quite convinced that Andy's protocol is the safest and most

> effective for most people, but as with everything other than the

> proverbial death & taxes, it's not 100% guaranteed. Intolerance of

> DMSA is possible, whether because of sulfur or perhaps some other

> reason, and it's in the best interest of our kids to pursue that

> further and determine what we can do about it and how best to heal

our

> extra-special special needs kids!

>

, I haven't read all the other responses to your

posts about this -- so don't know if this was already

covered:

any reason why you don't drop DMSA and use ALA only?

ALA is the most important chelation agent (as I expect

you are well aware) -- DMSA is optional.

Oh, I feel dumb. I bet you are just wary of the whole

process at this point!

Good luck following the clues.

good wishes,

Moria

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/

Mercury Detox: Information, Tools, and Resources

January 20, 2007

that's a great idea. I'm certainly happy to post my son's hair

test. It easily meets counting rules and also shows very high arsenic

& bismuth. Minerals are mostly on the low side. Perhaps interesting

that one of the only exceptions is Selenium -- very high on hair test

but very low on RBC minerals, so perhaps he is dumping it for some reason.

How do you recommend that we ask AC to look at the hair test posts?

Is there someone here who can forward posts to him?

>

> Consider having participants on the list compile/post their kids'

hair tests and then ask AC to look at them.

> S S

>

January 20, 2007

> >

> > Just wanted to expand a bit and note that the reasoning behind the

> > DMSA regression group was the perplexing situation where DMSA

> caused

> > regression despite using the safest possible protocol to our

> knowledge

> > (Cutler 4-hr low dose schedule), rigorous supplementation as per

> > Andy's suggestions, and a hefty anti-fungal protocol. After

> > regression, we did further research and realized that our kids have

> > abnormally low selenium despite supplementation, many have low

> > neutrophils, and a suspected sulfur problem. When we got to

> talking,

> > these three issues came up repeatedly so it seemed advisable to get

> > together and compare notes.

> >

> > I'm quite convinced that Andy's protocol is the safest and most

> > effective for most people, but as with everything other than the

> > proverbial death & taxes, it's not 100% guaranteed. Intolerance of

> > DMSA is possible, whether because of sulfur or perhaps some other

> > reason, and it's in the best interest of our kids to pursue that

> > further and determine what we can do about it and how best to heal

> our

> > extra-special special needs kids!

> >

>

> , I haven't read all the other responses to your

> posts about this -- so don't know if this was already

> covered:

>

> any reason why you don't drop DMSA and use ALA only?

> ALA is the most important chelation agent (as I expect

> you are well aware) -- DMSA is optional.

Yes Moria, in my case I am breastfeeding, my son is 19 months old. He

has massive sensory issues and gut issues, allergic to most foods, we

are both on the same highly restrictive diet. Other than breastmilk

he will only accept certain pureed foods from the short list of foods

tolerated. He also has a weak immune system and when sick (which is

often) will only accept breastmilk, no other liquids or purees. But I

have 4 amalgams and he is getting small amounts of mercury in my milk.

So no ALA for now :-(

> Oh, I feel dumb. I bet you are just wary of the whole

> process at this point!

Yes but I know I must get the metals out somehow. But my child is

very young and very fragile. Watching my (at that time) 17 month old

try to bang a hole in the wall with his head, among many other lovely

issues and sickness that arose with the DMSA, is not an experience I

care to repeat. Yes I could have (should have) started with an even

lower dose, and I now know that a yeast protocol I had thought was

bulletproof was actually paper thin for my severe gut kid. But my

intuition still tells me something went *wrong*... maybe " allergic " to

DMSA or sulfur drugs somehow, or neutrophils issues, or something

else. I can't do that to my kid again without finding out what happened.

January 20, 2007

How were you getting the DMSA into your child? Or was the bad experience with

another older child? What about others on the list? Have they tried ALA?