Help! My son is deteriorating

[Guest guest]

Hi everybody,

I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

story as I can piece it together.

Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict rotation

diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

and yeasty.

A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it out

for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to focus

on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

before.

It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary, I

noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school called

again. Things are not getting better.

WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

I feel like the worst mom in the world.

Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

Thanks,

Christiane

[Guest guest]

I'm sure I won't be much help but can you clarify, you back off of what

probiotic, the probio gold? and what enzyme? the peptizyde? so your son is

now back on the original June start up stuff? plus the threelac and no-fenol?

The only things that struck me where a vague memory that perhaps pro bio gold is

cultured on dairy and wow, that sounds like a lot to start with, 2 a day.

I am no expert by any means and I have had to back off and restart with my 4 yr

9 month old twice due to boo boos on my part. You're not alone, hang in there,

take a break for yourself and get a grip. You won't unless you clear your head

and take care of yourself first. Your son is young, you'll get back to where

you were. I remember watching my wild child rub his forehead on the floor as he

crawled along, thinking, oops, I goofed somewhere along the line. It's painful.

I'll be thinking of you and praying for a speedy turn around.

Kathy

Help! My son is deteriorating

Hi everybody,

I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

story as I can piece it together.

Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict rotation

diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

and yeasty.

A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it out

for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to focus

on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

before.

It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary, I

noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school called

again. Things are not getting better.

WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

I feel like the worst mom in the world.

Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

Thanks,

Christiane

[Guest guest]

I am much too unqualified to speak to a diet/enzyme factor. My thought is

to consider if there might be some chemical exposure that may be affecting

him, i.e. pesticides, herbicides, perfumes, dry erase markers.

Also, my son is now 6.5 years old. He gets severe headaches (haven't been

able to figure out why yet) and when his head hurts his writing gets real

'creative' and his ability to focus, which is usually pretty reasonable, is

very difficult. He tries but he just can't.

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Christiane Kuechler

Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 11:08 AM

Subject: Help! My son is deteriorating

Hi everybody,

I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

story as I can piece it together.

Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict rotation

diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

and yeasty.

A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it out

for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to focus

on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

before.

It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary, I

noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school called

again. Things are not getting better.

WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

I feel like the worst mom in the world.

Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

Thanks,

Christiane

[Guest guest]

So the Pep is too much, have you tried the AFP Pep? That was a little easier for

my son. The couple of months following the introduction of enzymes were the

worst, absolute worst for us. But, I'd read a lot and knew my son was in pretty

bad shape and I knew what was coming. If what he's experiencing isn't anything

new, then I'd think, it's the adjustment phase to enzymes. My son left the house

just a handful of times during the adjustment months to enzymes. It was that

bad. Took about 2 mo. to introduce all three enzymes. But, and this is a big

" but " , my son was originally diagnosed moderate/severe autistic (depended on who

was doing the diagnosing) is now mainstreamed in a first grade class. Doing

extremely well and very happy. I was told at one point that I'd be lucky if my

son ever dressed himself. See how far we've come? I'd back off of school for

now, why send him if he's just miserable. Besides, the school could kick him

out. Why wait for that to happen? Tell them he's not feeling well, keep him home

and figure out what happened. If it's adjustment to the enzymes, then read

's book and decide how you want to handle it. If it is the Three lac,

perhaps you can use an alternate product that will do the same thing but in a

more gentle, slow manner.

Help! My son is deteriorating

Hi everybody,

I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

story as I can piece it together.

Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict rotation

diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

and yeasty.

A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it out

for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to focus

on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

before.

It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary, I

noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school called

again. Things are not getting better.

WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

I feel like the worst mom in the world.

Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

Thanks,

Christiane

[Guest guest]

My son wasn't as severe, but when I started enzymes, he started stemming

with his hands and had day time accidents. The stemming lasted almost 2

weeks (not all the time, but they were gone completely and then came back).

His daytime accidents had the school puzzled and me sad and I didn't' know

what to do. Not just a trickle.he soaked his pants at school a hand full of

time and was almost 5. I got a couple of emails that said 3 weeks was the

magic time frame and to keep going. We did and those symptoms went away and

he has improved so much. Not an expert, just sharing our experience. Hang

in there!! It is so hard.

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of ammattson

Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 9:54 PM

Subject: Re: Help! My son is deteriorating

So the Pep is too much, have you tried the AFP Pep? That was a little easier

for my son. The couple of months following the introduction of enzymes were

the worst, absolute worst for us. But, I'd read a lot and knew my son was in

pretty bad shape and I knew what was coming. If what he's experiencing isn't

anything new, then I'd think, it's the adjustment phase to enzymes. My son

left the house just a handful of times during the adjustment months to

enzymes. It was that bad. Took about 2 mo. to introduce all three enzymes.

But, and this is a big " but " , my son was originally diagnosed

moderate/severe autistic (depended on who was doing the diagnosing) is now

mainstreamed in a first grade class. Doing extremely well and very happy. I

was told at one point that I'd be lucky if my son ever dressed himself. See

how far we've come? I'd back off of school for now, why send him if he's

just miserable. Besides, the school could kick him out. Why wait for that to

happen? Tell them he's not feeling well, keep him home and figure out what

happened. If it's adjustment to the enzymes, then read 's book and

decide how you want to handle it. If it is the Three lac, perhaps you can

use an alternate product that will do the same thing but in a more gentle,

slow manner.

Help! My son is deteriorating

Hi everybody,

I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

story as I can piece it together.

Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict rotation

diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

and yeasty.

A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it out

for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to focus

on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

before.

It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary, I

noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school called

again. Things are not getting better.

WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

I feel like the worst mom in the world.

Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

Thanks,

Christiane

[Guest guest]

Our DAN! said nearly 75% of her asd patients cannot tolerate

Kirkman's Pro Bio Gold. I would maybe pull that completely out and

go with Culturelle (works awesome for us, even though dd is casein-

free).

S.

>

> So the Pep is too much, have you tried the AFP Pep? That was a

little easier for my son. The couple of months following the

introduction of enzymes were the worst, absolute worst for us. But,

I'd read a lot and knew my son was in pretty bad shape and I knew

what was coming. If what he's experiencing isn't anything new, then

I'd think, it's the adjustment phase to enzymes. My son left the

house just a handful of times during the adjustment months to

enzymes. It was that bad. Took about 2 mo. to introduce all three

enzymes. But, and this is a big " but " , my son was originally

diagnosed moderate/severe autistic (depended on who was doing the

diagnosing) is now mainstreamed in a first grade class. Doing

extremely well and very happy. I was told at one point that I'd be

lucky if my son ever dressed himself. See how far we've come? I'd

back off of school for now, why send him if he's just miserable.

Besides, the school could kick him out. Why wait for that to happen?

Tell them he's not feeling well, keep him home and figure out what

happened. If it's adjustment to the enzymes, then read 's book

and decide how you want to handle it. If it is the Three lac,

perhaps you can use an alternate product that will do the same thing

but in a more gentle, slow manner.

> Help! My son is deteriorating

>

>

> Hi everybody,

>

> I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's

behavior to

> deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

>

> I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is

the full

> story as I can piece it together.

>

> Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

>

> My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the

Pfeiffer

> Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag,

biotin, zinc,

> Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a

strict rotation

> diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to

linger, so

> we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the

stimms went

> down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were

still mush

> and yeasty.

>

> A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day,

and a low

> dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

>

> Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive

stimming, counting

> with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles,

starting at

> breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We

waited it out

> for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

>

> Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost

impossible to focus

> on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

>

> We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to

what we did

> before.

>

> It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the

contrary, I

> noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place

and

> backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the

school called

> again. Things are not getting better.

>

> WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

>

> I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

>

> I feel like the worst mom in the world.

>

> Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email

me.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Christiane

>

>

[Guest guest]

>Hey there,

I have a feeling this is a die off and you are moving too fast with

your yeast protocol. Are his bowel movements regular? If they are

not then pushing too hard means that the die off is not coming out as

it should but is lingering in the intestines and bowels causing trouble.

Also do they have you doing the MTP II from the Pfeiffer? We have

done that and had to slow it down because it was moving metals too

fast for my son and kicking up the gut bugs.

Cut way down on the three lac and probio gold and give it a week to

level off. Re start it slowly and wait a while to build it up.

Stop blaming yourself, this really is trial and error alone, and is no

way to avoid the ups and downs. Your son will progress and it will be

sooner than you think.

Epsom salt baths should help him calm down and give charcoal pills

away from the supplements he is taking for die off. If he wont sleep

melatonin helps too.

Elaine

> Hi everybody,

>

> I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

> deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

>

>

>

> I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

> story as I can piece it together.

>

> Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

>

>

>

> My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

> Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin,

zinc,

> Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict

rotation

> diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to

linger, so

> we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

> down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still

mush

> and yeasty.

>

> A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and

a low

> dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

>

> Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming,

counting

> with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles,

starting at

> breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We

waited it out

> for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

>

> Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible

to focus

> on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

>

> We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

> before.

>

> It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the

contrary, I

> noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

> backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school

called

> again. Things are not getting better.

>

>

>

> WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

>

>

>

> I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

>

> I feel like the worst mom in the world.

>

>

>

> Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Christiane

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Christiane,

Hang in there!! You're NOT a terrible mom!!!!! None of us are!!!

That's why we're here, getting help and support and giving our kids a

fighting chance!!!!!

Our experience has been 2 steps forward, one step back, and sometimes

more than one step back.... My son is also 4 and while the " official "

DX is PDD-NOS, I really think he is more Asperger's with his symptoms.

I agree with the school thing!! If he's miserable and if you don't have

the support you need (and deserve!!) from the school , then there's no

reason for him to be there. He's young enough to not get too far

behind, and if possible, you could try to do as much as you could

" home-schooling. " We had to pull my son out for 3 months to get things

in order and find the best place for him and get a " successful "

treatment plan going. Maybe you should try to find him a better school

situation. We have been very fortunate to have a great program in our

public school and they are VERY good about working with the parents to

find the best place for the child, even if it means a different school

in the district. They are obligated by law to find the best place for

your son where he can succeed, and you have every right to say you

aren't happy with the present one.

Best of luck and PLEASE don't go down the guilt road...your son needs

his momma right now, and if you're burdening yourself with unnecessary

guilt, then you're taking away energy that needs to go to him!! You are

doing the best you can with the knowledge and resources you have. Keep

reading, keep trying, keep praying, and keep loving him and know that

you have his best interest in mind and THAT'S what matters!!!

Hang in there!

Susie, mom to Corbin &

[Guest guest]

My child completely lost it on Pro-Bio Gold (took just a few days) in June.

It took the entire summer to lose that...But the state and quality of stims

has not come down to levels since before then. Still working on it.

On 11/2/06, Christiane Kuechler <christianekwilliams@...>

wrote:

>

> Hi everybody,

>

> I am at the end of my rope. I believe I have caused my son's behavior to

> deteriorate and now I can not get him back.

>

> I have posted bits and pieces over the last months, but here is the full

> story as I can piece it together.

>

> Hopefully somebody out there can help me.

>

> My son is 4, has Asperger's and started on supplements with the Pfeiffer

> Treatment Center in June. (CLO, Bio-Kult probiotic, Cal/Mag, biotin, zinc,

> Evening primrose oil). We also went first CFGFSF, then on a strict

> rotation

> diet with elimination of all allergy foods. The yeast seemed to linger, so

> we started ThreeLac twice a day with one No-Fenol. While the stimms went

> down with rotation diet and ThreeLac, the bowel movements were still mush

> and yeasty.

>

> A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and a low

> dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

>

> Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming, counting

> with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles, starting at

> breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We waited it

> out

> for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

>

> Then the preschool called and told me that he is almost impossible to

> focus

> on anything and basically not function for his mixed classroom.

>

> We then backed off the probiotic and enzyme. We went back to what we did

> before.

>

> It has been two weeks and the stimming has not subsided. On the contrary,

> I

> noticed his writing also fell apart (letters all over the place and

> backwards instead of the nice name he could write). Today the school

> called

> again. Things are not getting better.

>

> WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

>

> I destroyed all progress and I can not get my son back.

>

> I feel like the worst mom in the world.

>

> Thanks for reading and if you have ANY suggestion, please email me.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Christiane

>

>

[Guest guest]

> A month ago, I started giving Kirkman's Probio Gold, two a day, and

a low

> dose of Peptizyde (we eventually want to go off the diet).

>

> Within 2 days, my son completely fell apart - obsessive stimming,

counting

> with his fingers into the 1000s, beeping, walking in circles,

starting at

> breakfast, continuing late into the night in his dark room. We

waited it out

> for 2 weeks thinking it might be die-off.

These are viral symptoms for my son, and giving the Peptizyde may have

started addressing viruses. Try adding an anti-viral protocol:

Vitamins A and C, Virastop enzyme, olive leaf extract, Lauricidin,

etc. Watch for yeast, because viral " die off " tends to increase yeast.

> WHAT HAVE I DONE????????

You have started addressing certain biomedical issues, which has now

caused other ones to come to the surface. I had to deal with this for

7 years. It is not fun, but you will come to the end eventually.

Dana

[Guest guest]

>>However, today we are beginning valtrex, the anti-viral, which from

reading might increase yeast. Do you think continuing the nystatin,

watching the diet, and adding the culturelle will keep the yeast down?

It might. Or you might need a stronger yeast protocol.

>> Will I just know by his stools becoming loose again that the yeast

might be returning?

My son's yeast that was caused by anti-virals, was never in the gut,

so never showed in the bms. It only showed in behaviors and stims.

More info here

http://www.danasview.net/yeast.htm

> I am excited about the anti-virals because he has the Rubella

virus and the Epstein Barr virus. Will all of these issues continue

to get better as we chelate more?

Chelation did not affect my son's virus issues. Only anti-virals did.

I have used high dose vitamin A protocol [for measles virus]. High

dose vitamin C [for other viruses]. Lauricidin [caused more problems

than it helped]. And olive leaf extract and Virastop enzyme, which

worked very well.

> It's always 2 steps forward, 1 back. We actually went out to eat

as a family last week and he sat still at the table (which is soooo

huge) didn't fuss or make a big scene (extra huge) and I just was so

happy afterwards!

Congrats!

Dana