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I was just at Cranial tech yesterday and asked about the tightness on

the cheek. There was a visiting tech from Dallas (Vicki) I really

liked her. I said that Maggie's band looked tight around her right

cheek and she said that the band is resting there so that the band on

that side could remain loose to allow for growth in that area. Am I

explaining this right? It made sense to me when she said it.

Thought this would reassure you. Kaycee in Albany

> as I understand it, it doesn't take much to inhibit growth. so I am

> wondering, if the sides of the band that are resting on the cheeks

> like sideburns, will it inhibit growth of the cheeks where it is

> " pressing " ? because as this band is, it is pressing on the side of

> his face that is already smaller. we don't need any more asymmetry

> over there! but on the side that is fuller, it's not pressing at

all,

> but if anything is up on the ear. diane and andy

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My daughter was in a DOC Band this past summer with about 70%

correction. Her " sideburn " on the recessed side of her face rested

on her cheekbone, too, which bothered me, actually. I asked several

times about it and was always reassured, but I still question whether

it inhibited growth outward of that cheek. The cheekbone wasn't up

higher than the prominent side, so I don't think that drove the

design (i.e. an attempt to encourage the cheekbone downward).

Perhaps we're trading forehead correction for cheek correction? Not

sure ... but I'd sure like to hear from others on this. Seems to me

you'd want the cheek unihibited to allow it to grow outward as much

as possible on the smooshed side. Her forehead did " pop out " nicely

.... but that cheek not so well.

Joan

> > as I understand it, it doesn't take much to inhibit growth. so I

am

> > wondering, if the sides of the band that are resting on the

cheeks

> > like sideburns, will it inhibit growth of the cheeks where it is

> > " pressing " ? because as this band is, it is pressing on the side

of

> > his face that is already smaller. we don't need any more

asymmetry

> > over there! but on the side that is fuller, it's not pressing at

> all,

> > but if anything is up on the ear. diane and andy

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hhmmm.. my problem is that that is the side of the buldge for us!! I really

think they messed up this band big time. diane

geoconlaw@... wrote:

> I was just at Cranial tech yesterday and asked about the tightness on

> the cheek. There was a visiting tech from Dallas (Vicki) I really

> liked her. I said that Maggie's band looked tight around her right

> cheek and she said that the band is resting there so that the band on

> that side could remain loose to allow for growth in that area. Am I

> explaining this right? It made sense to me when she said it.

> Thought this would reassure you. Kaycee in Albany

>

>

> > as I understand it, it doesn't take much to inhibit growth. so I am

> > wondering, if the sides of the band that are resting on the cheeks

> > like sideburns, will it inhibit growth of the cheeks where it is

> > " pressing " ? because as this band is, it is pressing on the side of

> > his face that is already smaller. we don't need any more asymmetry

> > over there! but on the side that is fuller, it's not pressing at

> all,

> > but if anything is up on the ear. diane and andy

>

>

>

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  • 2 years later...
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http://www.growthcharts.com

Question about Growth

Today we went to the Cardiology Clinic to have our annual echocardiogram of

Blake's heart. Blake had a AVSD repaired when he was 3 months old. I was a

little worried about how it would turn out because I've had doctors tell just

within the past few months that they hear a murmur. Also, he hasn't grown at

all for about 7 months. Whenever we go to the doctor I record his height and

weight on a chart I printed off the internet for kids with DS.

The cardiologist says Blake has a high pitched murmur, which is usually

caused by a valve. He said the echocardiogram showed nothing though.

I'm still a little worried. I can't figure out why he isn't growing. He's

always been a little chubby, so the fact that he hasn't gained weight isn't as

distressing as the fact that he is not growing in height. I think at his age

that 7 months is a long time to not grow. We've had GERD and aspiration issues,

but I think we have them resolved. Our last thyroid test showed " compensated

hypothyroidism " , but it is still within the range that they don't medicate.

He's been having some feeding issues (food refusal) and aggressive behavior that

may or may not be connected.

Any ideas???

Schulte

Mom to Blake - 2 1/2 with ds

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In a message dated 4/1/2003 8:53:22 PM Eastern Standard Time,

_Schulte@... writes:

<< We've had GERD and aspiration issues, but I think we have them resolved.

Our last thyroid test showed " compensated hypothyroidism " , but it is still

within the range that they don't medicate. He's been having some feeding

issues (food refusal) and aggressive behavior that may or may not be

connected.

>>

,

Is he walking or trying to? The extra effort burns up a lot of energy. I

see it in my great niece (18 months). She used to have the most chubby

thighs I ever saw on a little one, but once she started walking they went

away.

Sounds like you're right smack in the terrible two's (food refusal was the

hint.) By " compensated hypothyroidism " , does it mean TSH is up and T3 and T4

are ok? That may just be a zinc issue. I'll attach my favorite Medscape

abstract on zinc just in case. It worked for Liam.

Kathy, Liam's mom( 5)

1: Biol Trace Elem Res 1999 Mar;67(3):257-68

Related Articles, Books, LinkOut

Zinc sulfate supplementation improves thyroid function in hypozincemic

Down children.

Bucci I, Napolitano G, Giuliani C, Lio S, Minnucci A, Di Giacomo F, Calabrese

G,

Sabatino G, Palka G, Monaco F

Cattedra di Endocrinologia, Universita G. D'Annunzio, Chieti, Italy.

In subjects affected by trisomy 21 (Down syndrome), hypothyroidism is the

most common

endocrinological deficit. Plasma zinc levels, which are commonly detected

below the normal

range in Down patients, are related to some endocrinological and

immunological functions; in fact,

zinc deficiency has been shown to impair immune response and growth rate.

Aims of this study

were to evaluate (1) the role of zinc deficiency in subclinical

hypothyroidism and (2) thyroid

function changes in Down children cyclically supplemented with zinc sulfate.

Inverse correlations

have been observed between age and triiodotironine (T3) and between zinc and

thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH); higher TSH levels have been found in

hypozincemic patients

at the beginning of the study. After 6 mo of supplementation, an improvement

of thyroid function

(TSH levels: 3.96 1.84 vs 2.64 1.33 mUI/mL basally and after 6 mo,

respectively) was

observed in hypozincemic patients. In the second cycle of supplementation, a

similar trend of

TSH was observed. At the end of the study, TSH significantly decreased in

treated hypozincemic

subjects (4.48 1.93 vs 2.96 1.20 mUI/mL) and it was no longer different in

comparison

to normozincemic patients. We suggest zinc supplementation to the diet in

hypozincemic Down

children as a simple and useful therapeutic tool.

Publication Types:

Clinical trial

PMID: 10201332, UI: 99215515

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Yes the T4 was is a little low, but still ok and the Thyroid Stimutlating

Hormone (TSH) is elevated. Meaning it's keeping the T4 in check.

Thanks for the article. I give Blake zinc. We were giving him 15 mgs. but

I increased it to30 mgs. That's about 1mg. per lb. of body weight? How

much is too much zinc?

Schulte

By " compensated hypothyroidism " , does it mean TSH is up and T3 and T4

> are ok? That may just be a zinc issue. I'll attach my favorite Medscape

> abstract on zinc just in case. It worked for Liam.

>

> Kathy, Liam's mom( 5)

>

>

> 1: Biol Trace Elem Res 1999 Mar;67(3):257-68

> Related Articles, Books, LinkOut

>

>

> Zinc sulfate supplementation improves thyroid function in hypozincemic

> Down children.

>

> Bucci I, Napolitano G, Giuliani C, Lio S, Minnucci A, Di Giacomo F,

Calabrese

> G,

> Sabatino G, Palka G, Monaco F

>

> Cattedra di Endocrinologia, Universita G. D'Annunzio, Chieti, Italy.

>

> In subjects affected by trisomy 21 (Down syndrome), hypothyroidism is the

> most common

> endocrinological deficit. Plasma zinc levels, which are commonly detected

> below the normal

> range in Down patients, are related to some endocrinological and

> immunological functions; in fact,

> zinc deficiency has been shown to impair immune response and growth rate.

> Aims of this study

> were to evaluate (1) the role of zinc deficiency in subclinical

> hypothyroidism and (2) thyroid

> function changes in Down children cyclically supplemented with zinc

sulfate.

> Inverse correlations

> have been observed between age and triiodotironine (T3) and between zinc

and

> thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH); higher TSH levels have been found in

> hypozincemic patients

> at the beginning of the study. After 6 mo of supplementation, an

improvement

> of thyroid function

> (TSH levels: 3.96 1.84 vs 2.64 1.33 mUI/mL basally and after 6 mo,

> respectively) was

> observed in hypozincemic patients. In the second cycle of supplementation,

a

> similar trend of

> TSH was observed. At the end of the study, TSH significantly decreased in

> treated hypozincemic

> subjects (4.48 1.93 vs 2.96 1.20 mUI/mL) and it was no longer different in

> comparison

> to normozincemic patients. We suggest zinc supplementation to the diet in

> hypozincemic Down

> children as a simple and useful therapeutic tool.

>

> Publication Types:

> Clinical trial

>

> PMID: 10201332, UI: 99215515

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I didn't really explain " food refusal " very well. I don't mean when a 2-yr

old doesn't want to eat when his parents want to feed him. It is a term I

picked up off a " feeding list " that I am on. Many of the parents on this

list have kids with GERD. One mom told me that her son would sign EAT, but

then when it was time to eat he would put his face up to the food and shake

his head " NO " . She said when he got older he told her that he did this

because he knew it would hurt if he ate, (because of the reflux) but he was

hungry.

Blake does a version of this. He signs " eat " , but when I try to feed him

getting the first bite down is tough. He sees the food and covers his eyes

and grimaces.

Maybe he's just a really character. I'll be sooooo glad when he can talk!

Schulte

>He's been having some feeding

> issues (food refusal) and aggressive behavior that may or may not be

> connected.

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Blake's T4 has been yoyo'ing for about a year and a half. Two different

doctors have told me as long as his TSH is keeping the T4 in check that

medicating him won't help. (It also says this in the book " medical care of

children with ds " ) I got a second opinion on this. This last thyroid test

was about a month ago.

Blake is at the highest dose of PPI's (reflux meds) allowed for a child his

age. I've been working very hard to keep him away from foods that will

encourage GERD. Citric Acid (acid found in citrus fruit) is a big one, so

I've started reading the label of everything I give him to ensure this isn't

in his food. They put this stuff in as a preservative. It's even in

children's vitamins.

The only option left for him as far as reflux goes is surgery. Many parents

on the " feeding list " say abdominal surgery for reflux should be treated as

a last resort, because there are often complications due to hypotonia in the

abdominal wall. We are trying to avoid surgery, but haven't ruled it out all

together.

Thank you for the suggestions.

Schulte

> How long ago was Thyroid tested? If it is borderline, why not treat and

for 3 -6 months and see if there is a difference?

>

> I would question the GERD issue more. Maybe the meds aren't working well.

>

> mom to Bridget almost 10...she can talk, but rarely tells me when

something hurts like a headache/stomach ache/ or even leg pain she has with

growing.....

> Re: Question about Growth

>

>

> I didn't really explain " food refusal " very well. I don't mean when a

2-yr

> old doesn't want to eat when his parents want to feed him. It is a term

I

> picked up off a " feeding list " that I am on. Many of the parents on

this

> list have kids with GERD. One mom told me that her son would sign EAT,

but

> then when it was time to eat he would put his face up to the food and

shake

> his head " NO " . She said when he got older he told her that he did this

> because he knew it would hurt if he ate, (because of the reflux) but he

was

> hungry.

>

> Blake does a version of this. He signs " eat " , but when I try to feed

him

> getting the first bite down is tough. He sees the food and covers his

eyes

> and grimaces.

>

> Maybe he's just a really character. I'll be sooooo glad when he can

talk!

>

> Schulte

>

> >He's been having some feeding

> > issues (food refusal) and aggressive behavior that may or may not be

> > connected.

>

>

>

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We also took him off milk and wheat because I thought he might be allergic

and it could be encouraging the reflux.

The surgery sometimes doesn't affectively stop the GERD and some kids end up

with feeding tubes after surgery. Then you have to wean them off the tube

and there are often reflux issues again.

I learned at the health food store over the weekend that calcium supplements

have helped with reflux, so we are trying that too.

Schulte

> I would question the GERD issue more. Maybe the meds aren't working well.

>

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Guest guest

,

How long ago was Thyroid tested? If it is borderline, why not treat and for 3

-6 months and see if there is a difference?

I would question the GERD issue more. Maybe the meds aren't working well.

mom to Bridget almost 10...she can talk, but rarely tells me when

something hurts like a headache/stomach ache/ or even leg pain she has with

growing.....

Re: Question about Growth

I didn't really explain " food refusal " very well. I don't mean when a 2-yr

old doesn't want to eat when his parents want to feed him. It is a term I

picked up off a " feeding list " that I am on. Many of the parents on this

list have kids with GERD. One mom told me that her son would sign EAT, but

then when it was time to eat he would put his face up to the food and shake

his head " NO " . She said when he got older he told her that he did this

because he knew it would hurt if he ate, (because of the reflux) but he was

hungry.

Blake does a version of this. He signs " eat " , but when I try to feed him

getting the first bite down is tough. He sees the food and covers his eyes

and grimaces.

Maybe he's just a really character. I'll be sooooo glad when he can talk!

Schulte

>He's been having some feeding

> issues (food refusal) and aggressive behavior that may or may not be

> connected.

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Guest guest

>

>

>Blake does a version of this. He signs " eat " , but when I try to feed him

>getting the first bite down is tough. He sees the food and covers his eyes

>and grimaces.

>

>

Sounds like ! She did this for a long time, even after she

could talk. We never figured out if it was reflux (she had a little,

but nothing major), or a contol issue, but it made mealtimes miserable

for all. Breakfast was the worst meal by far..... lunch and dinner were

usually better, but occasionally dinner was ugly too! Before she was

verbal, she would sign eat, and then start to cry when you gave her

food. At the beginning, of course, we tried everything because we

assumed she was trying to communicate that she wanted something

different, etc (wrong color plate, who knows!) or that something hurt

(like reflux). Sometimes feeding her made things better ( a last resort

when the bus was coming), but even then, it didn't always make things

OK..... she would cry, push the plate/bowl away, yell no. Then, she

became much more verbal, and could tell us what she wanted, and we

thought that " of course, if she tells me she wants X, then we will serve

it and things will be fine " . Not the case. Although over time the " food

refusal " decreased, she would still have a fit even after she had been

given choices, agreed to them, and then pushed the food away. We did

everything we could to make sure it wasn't a communication thing..... a

typical breakfast was like this (about age 4)...... , do you

want cereal or oatmeal for breakfast? (She said cereal). Do you want

Honey Nut Cheerios or MiniWheats? (She says Cheerios). I then show her

the boxes (in case she is just choosing, but doesn't know what she is

picking, even though I know she knows) and say " Show me which one is

Cheerios " (she chooses the correct box). Then I say, OK do you want to

help me pour the Cheerios? (she says yes, helps me pour them into her

bowl, helps me pour the milk, etc.). Then, as I stand back and hold me

breath, she will look at the bowl like I had filled it with dog food,

start to cry, yell no, and push the bowl away.

We began treating it like a power struggle, and it worked much better.

After the " first move " , usually her screaming and pushing the food away,

we would tell her that " she did not have to eat, but it was not OK to

scream at the table or push food " . I would usuually move the food

towards her (within reach), and IGNORE ANYTHING FURTHER! She often

carried on, pouted, yelled at me for awhile, but that got boring after

awhile, and 95% of the time, she would just eat. Then, once she started

eating, she was back to her pleasant self. I was still a little worried

that there was an underlying physical reason for her refusal to eat, but

when we finally saw her eating (after being ignored) and she was fine,

we figured she was just using the oldest power struggle in the book :-)

It is nice when they can communicate more!

I know Blake has serious reflux issues, and this of course is probably

playing a big role, but for whatever reason he is doing this, I hope it

gets better soon. We probably have less than one table meltdown per

week now...... it's great!

, mom to (7), (5 DS), and (3)

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Guest guest

LOL!!

Thanks . It's nice to hear I'm not alone!

Take Care,

Schulte

> Sounds like ! She did this for a long time, even after she

> could talk. We never figured out if it was reflux (she had a little,

> but nothing major), or a contol issue, but it made mealtimes miserable

> for all. Breakfast was the worst meal by far..... lunch and dinner were

> usually better, but occasionally dinner was ugly too! Before she was

> verbal, she would sign eat, and then start to cry when you gave her

> food. At the beginning, of course, we tried everything because we

> assumed she was trying to communicate that she wanted something

> different, etc (wrong color plate, who knows!) or that something hurt

> (like reflux). Sometimes feeding her made things better ( a last resort

> when the bus was coming), but even then, it didn't always make things

> OK..... she would cry, push the plate/bowl away, yell no. Then, she

> became much more verbal, and could tell us what she wanted, and we

> thought that " of course, if she tells me she wants X, then we will serve

> it and things will be fine " . Not the case. Although over time the " food

> refusal " decreased, she would still have a fit even after she had been

> given choices, agreed to them, and then pushed the food away. We did

> everything we could to make sure it wasn't a communication thing..... a

> typical breakfast was like this (about age 4)...... , do you

> want cereal or oatmeal for breakfast? (She said cereal). Do you want

> Honey Nut Cheerios or MiniWheats? (She says Cheerios). I then show her

> the boxes (in case she is just choosing, but doesn't know what she is

> picking, even though I know she knows) and say " Show me which one is

> Cheerios " (she chooses the correct box). Then I say, OK do you want to

> help me pour the Cheerios? (she says yes, helps me pour them into her

> bowl, helps me pour the milk, etc.). Then, as I stand back and hold me

> breath, she will look at the bowl like I had filled it with dog food,

> start to cry, yell no, and push the bowl away.

>

> We began treating it like a power struggle, and it worked much better.

> After the " first move " , usually her screaming and pushing the food away,

> we would tell her that " she did not have to eat, but it was not OK to

> scream at the table or push food " . I would usuually move the food

> towards her (within reach), and IGNORE ANYTHING FURTHER! She often

> carried on, pouted, yelled at me for awhile, but that got boring after

> awhile, and 95% of the time, she would just eat. Then, once she started

> eating, she was back to her pleasant self. I was still a little worried

> that there was an underlying physical reason for her refusal to eat, but

> when we finally saw her eating (after being ignored) and she was fine,

> we figured she was just using the oldest power struggle in the book :-)

> It is nice when they can communicate more!

>

> I know Blake has serious reflux issues, and this of course is probably

> playing a big role, but for whatever reason he is doing this, I hope it

> gets better soon. We probably have less than one table meltdown per

> week now...... it's great!

>

> , mom to (7), (5 DS), and (3)

>

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