Re: Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

[Guest guest]

my Son is 14 and still is a bouncy kid at night, he is up until 1-2 am

almost every night then drags all Morning, until about 2pm then he suddenly

wakes

up, and is on the go, non stop, until way late, its hard on parents who have

to get sleep for work, I know........

[Guest guest]

My 15 year old sleeps all day and is up all night. This has become an

ongoing problem with him. Some days/nights it is worse than others. Pam

[Guest guest]

I know that we tried " adjusting " his body clock a few times...worked

initially but then back to the same old up all night, sleep most of the day.

You

may want to try contacting a local university or children's hospital to see if

they have a sleep study program. We have a good one here but I've never

really looked into it. I feel it is something my son has to want to change and

until he does there isn't alot I can do about it. It affected his schooling

last year as he missed 16 days of school because he couldn't get up. Pam

[Guest guest]

Thanks Tabitha. I think I will contact the hospital that does the sleep

studies. My concern for him is the ability to get up and be ready for school.

Unfortunately he does have to conform to the " real world " ...and schedules.

Pam

[Guest guest]

Thanks for this information. We have a pediatrician's appt. next month and

I'm going to ask him about this. Pam

[Guest guest]

Hi Pam,

I understand your frustration but I just wanted to give you my two

cents on this subject. You may actually want to look into the sleep

study for your son as well. I say this because, while it may be in his

control, it also may not be. I know this as I have always struggled

with a variable circadian rhythm which no matter how I try, cannot be

set in any general place. I usually end up staying up until 2 and

sometimes up to 4 or so. Then I sleep until 11 if I can but I have to

get up early, it's a struggle. So, I have tried digital reminders to go

to bed at the same time, doesn't work. I have tried making myself wake

up at the same time every morning, doesn't work. I have tried sleeping

pills, doesn't work. I have tried more things than I can count.

Basically, there is nothing in my power to change this problem at this

point and I have been dealing with this since puberty. There is

actually a disorder with some peoples circadian rhythm which they just

came out with research on, but for the life of me I can't remember

anymore. Personally, since I have this issue, and have most of my life,

I have realized society places way too much importance on time,

schedules and punctuality, since it is not natural to the human body to

follow such, but unfortunately it is fact of modern life. It's always

irked me that society somehow came to the consensus that the work day

has to start around 8:30 am or even earlier. There's some small

reliance on a mindless drone mentality there :-) but I rarely mention

that. Anyway, if something can be done, I would look into it for him,

especially if it's been going on for awhile. It may be something he'll

grow out of (which I hope for him) but there is a chance that he could

have a lifelong problem as I do. I hope it all works out for you and he

in the end though.

Best wishes,

Tabitha

Re: ( ) Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

I know that we tried " adjusting " his body clock a few times...worked

initially but then back to the same old up all night, sleep most of the

day. You

may want to try contacting a local university or children's hospital to

see if

they have a sleep study program. We have a good one here but I've never

really looked into it. I feel it is something my son has to want to

change and

until he does there isn't alot I can do about it. It affected his

schooling

last year as he missed 16 days of school because he couldn't get up. Pam

[Guest guest]

Just for my own enlightenment, I looked up the disorder I mentioned. I

am pretty sure this is it -

" Circadian Rhythm Disorder Overview

A person's circadian rhythm is an internal biological clock that

regulates a variety of biological processes according to an approximate

24-hour period. Most of a person's body systems demonstrate circadian

variations. The body systems with the most prominent circadian

variations are the sleep-wake cycle, the temperature regulation system,

and the endocrine system.

* Chronic disorders

* Delayed sleep-phase syndrome (DSPS)

* DSPS is characterized by a persistent (that is, lasting longer

than 6 months) inability to fall asleep and awaken at socially

acceptable times. Individuals with DSPS fall asleep late (for example,

in the early morning hours) and wake up late (for example, in the late

morning hours or in the early afternoon hours).

* Once asleep, however, persons with DSPS are able to maintain

their sleep and have normal total sleep times. In contrast, persons

without DSPS who are unable to sleep because of difficulties initiating

and maintaining sleep have a lower than normal total sleep time than

persons with DSPS. "

This may also apply -

* " Irregular sleep-wake cycle

* An irregular sleep-wake schedule features multiple sleep

episodes without evidence of recognizable ultradian (a series of shorter

biological rhythms occurring within a 24-hour period) or circadian

features of sleep and wakefulness.

* As in persons with ASPS and DSPS, total sleep time is normal in

persons with an irregular sleep-wake schedule.

* Daily sleep logs demonstrate irregularity not only of sleep but

also of daytime activities, including eating. "

Re: ( ) Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

I know that we tried " adjusting " his body clock a few times...worked

initially but then back to the same old up all night, sleep most of the

day. You

may want to try contacting a local university or children's hospital to

see if

they have a sleep study program. We have a good one here but I've never

really looked into it. I feel it is something my son has to want to

change and

until he does there isn't alot I can do about it. It affected his

schooling

last year as he missed 16 days of school because he couldn't get up. Pam

[Guest guest]

Becky, Are you living in my basement with my 17 yo boys? Cuz

it sounds JUST like them.... Depression, feeling bad about

not accomplishing something then time to RETREAT to the bed

because they are too overwhelmed!! Toni

>

> This has been a very big problem in my son's life and

> mine. It is not so bad during the week when he is in

> school-he is entering his last year of college in

> September-but on weekends or when school is not in

> session-xmas break, spring break or summer vacation-we

> have never been able to break this circuler problem. I

> call it circuler because it is one big frustrating

> circle. He sleeps all day-we have tried all kinds of

> different alarms, sleeping medication at night, me waking

> him up, consequences when he was younger-then he gets up

> at 4 or 5pm and is depressed because he did not get

> anything accomplished- homework, work on his website,

> chores, etc-he then stays up all night on his computer or

> playing video games, cannot get up the next day because

> of staying up all night and also because he is depressed

> about not getting anything done the previous day. This

> just spirals faster and faster each day until he is

> sleeping all day and all night and is so depressed he can

> barely function. My waking him up only escalates into a

> battle where I try to wake him up and he either does not

> get up, even with me trying all day or gets up and takes a

> shower and when I have gone to work he goes back to

> sleep.Nothing has worked and so far he in his life he has

> only had one job-an internship in computer programming

> which is his major-and this problem caused him to be very

> far behind in his work and he had to quit three different

> times because he was so depressed. Luckily, the first two

> time he quit they were willing to take him back. The

> third time he quit was last xmas break and when he tried

> to work for them again this summer they have apparantly

> grown tired of this problem.

>

> Sorry for the long post. I am very worried about his

> future and any suggestions would be VERY greatly

> appreciated.

>

> Becky

>

>

>

>

I, not events, have the power to make me happy or unhappy

today. I can CHOOSE which it shall be. Groucho Marx

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[Guest guest]

Both of my boys with HFA have sleep problems just like this. We have used a

medication called " clonidine " with wonderful results. My older ds is now 17 yo

and he prefers to get ambien but he says it only works sometimes and not all the

time. I wish he'd take clonidine instead but he has his own mind.

Roxanna

( ) Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

>

> My 15 year old sleeps all day and is up all night. This has become

an

> ongoing problem with him. Some days/nights it is worse than

others. Pam

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

NOPE!! I wish... At least your son is going to college and

doing well. Right now, I don't see my kids being able to

even do that, unless they grow up ALOT this year... Toni

>

> >

> > Becky, Are you living in my basement with my 17 yo boys?

> > Cuz it sounds JUST like them.... Depression, feeling bad

> > about not accomplishing something then time to RETREAT

> > to the bed because they are too overwhelmed!! Toni

>

> Hi Toni,

> No I don't THINK I am living there but who knows, somedays

> I feel like I must be having a nightmare when things get

> out of control. It is so nice to know that somebody else

> has the same problem! Have you found anything that helps?

> >

> > I, not events, have the power to make me happy or

> > unhappy today. I can CHOOSE which it shall be. Groucho

> > Marx

> > _________________________________________

> >

> > Check your Email accounts at MyEmail.com

> >

> > Login from home, work, school. Anywhere!

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

I, not events, have the power to make me happy or unhappy

today. I can CHOOSE which it shall be. Groucho Marx

_________________________________________

Check your Email accounts at MyEmail.com

Login from home, work, school. Anywhere!

[Guest guest]

No side effects were noted with either of my ds's. My younger ds tried Tenex

before and we didn't like it. I once had a doc explain that Tenex was for kids

who didn't stay asleep while Clonidine was for kids who couldn't fall asleep.

But both my kids stay asleep on the clonidine just fine. With Tenex, my ds was

falling asleep like a day and a half later. lol.

Roxanna

( ) Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

Roxanna,

I have a question about Chlonidine. Have you noticed any

negative side effects to it? My son was taking one similar,

called " Tenex " He became very depressed, angry and aggressive. The

Dr. said Chlonidine is next to try. I told him I wanted one month

where my son was only on one medication which is Lexapro.

Thanks for any input you can give me on Chlonidine.

Sue

[Guest guest]

Clonidine is a med they use for blood pressure but which has the side effect of

making people sleepy. So I guess it is used in smaller dosages for kids who

have sleep problems. I don't think it stays in the system all that long to

cause problems the next day. Neither of mine have ever noted problems with it.

My older ds tried Luminex(?) but didn't like that one either so he stuck with

Ambien. He isn't thrilled with Ambien. But he doesn't want to change - he is

against change even when it works for his benefit.

Roxanna

( ) Re: Sleepless nights with bouncy boy.

.

>

> Both of my boys with HFA have sleep problems just like this. We

have used a medication called " clonidine " with wonderful results. My

older ds is now 17 yo and he prefers to get ambien but he says it

only works sometimes and not all the time. I wish he'd take

clonidine instead but he has his own mind.

>

>

> Roxanna

Thanks for responding Roxanna. Glad to know I am not alone. This

problem has depressed me for years! I will tell my son

about " clonidine " and suggest he ask his p-doc about it. Is it a

sleeping medication? I tried giving him an Ambien but he said that it

caused " halucinations " and made him feel " drugged " the next day. He

has never had that kind of reaction before and has never had

halucinations.

[Guest guest]

It sounds like you and he have a good plan that is working!

I'm proud of both of you. Excellant planning and ideas.

Thanks Becky! Toni

>

> >

> > NOPE!! I wish... At least your son is going to college

> > and doing well. Right now, I don't see my kids being

> > able to even do that, unless they grow up ALOT this

> > year... Toni

> > I felt exactly the same thing with both children. I

> insisted, right or wrong, that they go to college because

> I knew that with their problems, they absolutely had to

> have a degree to help them make it in this world. I am 42

> and have never even finished a two year degree at a

> community college and that has hurt my paycheck and my

> work opportunities greatly to the point that I am barely

> making it(I am in accounting).

>

> I won't lie to you, the first year was a nightmare for my

> son and even worse for my daughter-they are one year

> apart in school, two years apart in age.

>

> My son tried to live on campus the first year. NOT! He

> could not get up to go to class, he could not relate to

> any of the kids in his dorm-he is not into partying,

> which seemed to be the norm at this LUTHERAN College! We

> had everything from " I can't do this, I can't go to

> College, it is too hard for me " -this from a child who

> easily earned A's in evey class, on every test, paper or

> project and was in AP classes in high school-and yes we

> had problems with high school too, just not academic

> ones-to one suicide threat-he didn't do anything, just

> told me over the phone, I had to call the campus police,

> the counseling department had to be involved, etc. He

> also had the same pattern of being overwhelmed by his

> homework, avoiding it for that reason and then being

> depressed and overwhelmed when the back-log became so

> huge. He still did well on tests-when he showed up for

> class.

>

> The methods I used to help him get through each year-yes

> we have had the same problems in varying degrees every

> year-I am listing below. Again, this was my choice, right

> or wrong because I feel so strongly about having a

> college degree. And these worked with him but I've

> learned through dealing with my daughter that EVERY CHILD

> IS DIFFERENT! THIS SHOULD BE TATOOED ON EACH TEACHER,

> PRINCIPAL, THERAPIST, PSYCHIATRIST, ETC. And, like Harry

> Potter's scar, should burn unbearable when they are not

> REMEMBERING this.

>

> 1) He moved back home where I could get him up each day

> and monitor his school work-yes this was as fun as having

> a root canal but necessary!

>

> 2) He started seeing a different therapist-one from the

> school-whom he seemed to respond to better that the one

> we had had for several years even though she had helped

> him in many ways. I think he responded better because he

> felt that, because it was at school and not something

> that I was involved in, it was more his

> idea/responsiblity.

>

> 3) I insisted his P-doc change his medication and give him

> something for sleep at night. I have seen this many times

> when they get in an over-whelming pattern that seems

> unable to be solved that a change of medication-he is

> only on one anti-depressant-seems to help and no don't

> lecture me about changing medicine too often I know that

> already thanks to the constant irritirations from his

> doctors for the last eight years!

>

> 4) I made him talk to each of his teachers, explain why he

> was behind and let them know that he had a plan for

> getting caught up. In California they are required to

> make SOME adjustments for college such as letting them

> take a test in a separate room, allowing tape recorders

> to record the class in case he was too over-whelmed/in his

> own world when the lecture was going on and allowing more

> time for homework to be turned in.

>

> 5) I made him see the coordinator at school for kids with

> special needs- he refused at first but I was not going to

> back down. She was able to suggest helpful ways to solve

> some of his problems and even talked to some of the

> teachers about different ways to help him learn. Some of

> the teachers were great and, as we know, some of the

> teachers were jerks. He had to drop his speach

> class-which he liked!??-because the teacher was so nasty

> to him. It was funny because she insulted him one time to

> many and he stood up, told her off and went and

> immediately dropped the class! I was so proud of him!

> This episode became a rule that he used with each teacher

> after that. He paid close attention for the first two

> classes and when he realized that their attitude, style

> of teaching or personality was not going to work for him

> he was able to to drop that class and take another.

>

> 6) When he became over-whelmed with the amount of work

> that had piled up because he was trying to ignore it-his

> normal pattern-we sat down and made a list of everything

> that needed to get done, when it was due andhow long it

> would take to finish. Then each day, we would go over

> what he had accomplished/what had been added to the list.

> We decided what was most important to work on each day

> and how much time he should spend on each task. This

> helped him see that some things were not as time

> consuming as he had thought and I was able to correct

> him(boy was that fun) on how much time he SHOULD spend

> studying something or how " perfect " a paper had to be-he

> is a perfectionist which is why he gets overwhelmed. He

> also learned-by my telling him day after day through

> gritted teath that no, you don't have to take notes on

> EVERYTHING on each page. Don't they teach that in school

> anymore? My daughter has the same problem.

>

> 7) I insisted that he tell me when he was feeling

> overwhelmed so that we could talk it out and I could get

> his thinking on a more rational level.

>

> 8)We agreed that he could not spend all his time studying

> and came up with time limits for video games etc, so that

> he would not get burned out. I also required that he

> spend at least 30 minutes with the family instead of

> being shut up in his room. This helped because he wasn't

> so isolated. I've learned (from my own experience) that

> isolating is a disaster if you have social problems.

>

> 9)I offered to let him switch to community college but he

> hated that idea so it never happened but at least he had

> a choice.

>

> 10) Finally, I made sure to remind him often that he

> didn't have to get all A's on his college work. As long

> as he kept a " B " average it would not affect his

> financial aid and that no job interviewer was going togo

> back and pull his transcripts to see what grade he made in

> each class(I could be wrong on this but I felt it was

> necessary to say that to relieve some of the pressure. I

> told him that all he needed to do was pass the class to

> get his degree.

>

> My daughter, on the other hand, is a whole different story

> for another day-or morning as it were as I can't sleep

> since 3am and it is now 5am!

>

> Oh the joys of single-parenthood!

>

> Sorry for the looooooooooooooong post.

>

> Becky

>

>

>

>

>

I, not events, have the power to make me happy or unhappy

today. I can CHOOSE which it shall be. Groucho Marx

_________________________________________

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