Re: Re: Potty Training/Cathy

[Guest guest]

Deni,

I'm going to e-mail you off-list.

On Apr 14, 2005, at 9:24 AM, deni_co2002 wrote:

>

>

> , I haven't read it. I don't know the name, either. What's the

> title?

>

> Deni

>

[Guest guest]

Just curious, the only book I have been able to find is Toilet Training for

Individuals with Autism and Related Disorders by Wheeler. Is this what

you are looking for? I found it on Amazon for $14.

cathylynn2 <cathylynn2@...> wrote:Deni,

I'm going to e-mail you off-list.

On Apr 14, 2005, at 9:24 AM, deni_co2002 wrote:

>

>

> , I haven't read it. I don't know the name, either. What's the

> title?

>

> Deni

>

---------------------------------

[Guest guest]

,

Right, that was the one I sent Deni the link on, and she said she

already has it. We both agree that it's a very good reference to have.

I think the only Azrin and Fox book is " Toilet Training in Less Than a

Day " , and that was written primarily for typical children. The Wheeler

book is specifically for special needs individuals, particularly autism

spectrum.

On Apr 14, 2005, at 1:50 PM, Bolling wrote:

>

> Just curious, the only book I have been able to find is Toilet

> Training for Individuals with Autism and Related Disorders by

> Wheeler. Is this what you are looking for? I found it on Amazon for

> $14.

>

> cathylynn2 <cathylynn2@...> wrote:Deni,

>

> I'm going to e-mail you off-list.

>

>

>

> On Apr 14, 2005, at 9:24 AM, deni_co2002 wrote:

>

>>

>>

>> , I haven't read it. I don't know the name, either. What's the

>> title?

>>

>> Deni

>>

>

[Guest guest]

I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ

[Guest guest]

I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ

[Guest guest]

, I have also done the same thing with the same result. often does

not care if his undies are wet or soiled. I have turned off the computer

because of an accident. He pitched a fit for just a minute or two and then

moved on to something else. No effect. After numerous accidents we just went

back to pull-ups. I am going to try the naked thing this weekend. I think my 2

1/2 year old son who is typical will have some accidents until he remembers he

doesn't have a diaper on but I think just might be inclined to use the

toilet. We shall see. I am sorry your father isn't as supportive as he could

have been. Sometimes we have to do things with our ASD kids that are unorthodox

and different from others.

I think we just have to decide what our kids understand and meet them where they

are. Is there any medical reason why they can't. That has been a concern of

mine. Then it is getting them motivated, the really hard part. Then teaching

them, try pictures. That was mentioned by someone else and it is a great idea.

A friend who was doing ABA had a chart with pictures that went in order of what

you do in the bathroom. Being able to visualize it has to be of benefit.

There have been some great ideas thrown out here, I have saved all of them and

are going to be trying some new things this weekend. Hopefully I will only have

my infant daughter in diapers soon! Take care and hang in there!

" S. " <selenejs@...> wrote:

AJ,

Totally understand what you are saying and agree with you. I just don't think

it will phase my son if I say I'm going to punish him. The other day I did turn

off his movie he was watching because he peed in his pants. Should I keep doing

that? I live with my father and he gave me crap for doing that but I argued

that I need to do something and the other stuff I have tried doesn't work. I'm

just confused of what I should or should not do as far as potty training is

concerned.

Thanks,

AJ <Ajwilson@...> wrote:

I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ

[Guest guest]

, just my two cents again. If you are confused about what to do for your

child then you are probably being inconsistent. And I think our kids verbal or

non verbal use the inconsistency to do what they want or is comfortable to them.

Not in a bad way meaning they are being disobedient it's just what they know,

what they have control over and that makes them comfortable. I would suggest you

pick one way and stick with it over a long period of time. And yes tell your dad

what you are doing to hopefully gain his cooperation. You don't need someone in

the background creating doubt in your mind everytime you try something with your

child. You both need to work as a team. HTH, Jackie D.

" S. " <selenejs@...> wrote:AJ,

Totally understand what you are saying and agree with you. I just don't think

it will phase my son if I say I'm going to punish him. The other day I did turn

off his movie he was watching because he peed in his pants. Should I keep doing

that? I live with my father and he gave me crap for doing that but I argued

that I need to do something and the other stuff I have tried doesn't work. I'm

just confused of what I should or should not do as far as potty training is

concerned.

Thanks,

AJ <Ajwilson@...> wrote:

I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the encouragement . My father needs to realize I am the mommy

and I know best. What's hilarious is he always tells me he's done the raising

of the kids before and I just hear a lot of laughing in my head. Not only was

he at work a lot and my mother did the raising but my brother and I were typical

children. He's one of those males that's never wrong (more laughing in my

head). I'm going to try some things this weekend as well but not the naked

thing. If we don't have this under control by summer, that's when I will try

that.

Thanks again,

Bolling <lvchefmel@...> wrote:

, I have also done the same thing with the same result. often does not

care if his undies are wet or soiled. I have turned off the computer because of

an accident. He pitched a fit for just a minute or two and then moved on to

something else. No effect. After numerous accidents we just went back to

pull-ups. I am going to try the naked thing this weekend. I think my 2 1/2 year

old son who is typical will have some accidents until he remembers he doesn't

have a diaper on but I think just might be inclined to use the toilet. We

shall see. I am sorry your father isn't as supportive as he could have been.

Sometimes we have to do things with our ASD kids that are unorthodox and

different from others.

I think we just have to decide what our kids understand and meet them where they

are. Is there any medical reason why they can't. That has been a concern of

mine. Then it is getting them motivated, the really hard part. Then teaching

them, try pictures. That was mentioned by someone else and it is a great idea. A

friend who was doing ABA had a chart with pictures that went in order of what

you do in the bathroom. Being able to visualize it has to be of benefit.

There have been some great ideas thrown out here, I have saved all of them and

are going to be trying some new things this weekend. Hopefully I will only have

my infant daughter in diapers soon! Take care and hang in there!

" S. " wrote:

AJ,

Totally understand what you are saying and agree with you. I just don't think it

will phase my son if I say I'm going to punish him. The other day I did turn off

his movie he was watching because he peed in his pants. Should I keep doing

that? I live with my father and he gave me crap for doing that but I argued that

I need to do something and the other stuff I have tried doesn't work. I'm just

confused of what I should or should not do as far as potty training is

concerned.

Thanks,

AJ wrote:

I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ

[Guest guest]

I would agree with Jackie about the inconsistent issue - this was probably

part of my problem and why my son trained so quickly when I 'got serious'.

At the time, I would try to make him use the potty/toilet from time to time

and then I would let it go if he protested or didn't comply. If I had made

a programme to get him trained and had stuck to it for any period of time,

anything might have worked.

Regards

AJ

If you are confused about what to do for your child then you are probably

being inconsistent.

[Guest guest]

Okay, I know my neighbors must think I am some kind of strange person but I am

loving the naked butts in my house!! has actually peed in the toilet for

the first time in months and Zach my typical has jumped on board, with the help

of chocolate! So far no accidents but they are in preschool half-day. Thanks

for the great ideas!!!

" S. " <selenejs@...> wrote:

Hi Jackie,

Yeah, I think pullups just confuse my son but I tell you, him pooping in those

is a lot easier on my patience that pooping in his underwear. He actually went

to the bathroom by himself last night (to urinate) and instead of telling him

today, I keep asking him if he needs to go and I keep reminding him that pee pee

goes in the potty. I think I need to get a handle on that one before I worry

about the BM's. One thing at a time I guess.

Thanks for your advice.

Jackie <jdavis5122@...> wrote:

, when she came to get me to show me she had done it in the potty we of

course did great high 5's, much praise, then I showed her what I was going to do

with it. So I proceded to pick the little potty up and take it to the bath room

and had her follow me. I then showed her that I was going to put it in the big

toilet and flush it away. So we did that . I honestly can't remember how many

times we went through this routine before she started to use the big toilet. I

just remember it was no longer an issue and she never had an accident. By the

way, my older dd with some ADHD issues was potty trained using the naked way. I

used to hate those pull ups because I thought it confused kids. HTH, Jackie D.

" S. " wrote:Jackie,

How did you make the transition to the bathroom toilet? I think I'll have to try

that.

Bolling wrote:

Not a bad idea, I just might have to try that. Thanks,

Jackie wrote:OK, I will chime in on this also, you never know what may

help. My dd also was difficult to BM train. No amount of bribing, conjoling,

nothing would induce her to use the tiolet. I even came very close one day to

losing my temper with her and knew I had to stop. I gave up and accepted that

she would use the toilet in her own good time. At that point in our lives she

spent a lot of her time in our family room. Had a tv and all her toys there.

After this one episode, I picked up the little kid porta potty, took it out to

the family room and just put it down and said " there, if you have to go poopers

(sorry it's what we called it) use your potty there. Damn, if later that day if

she didn't use it! Never had an accident since then. Smooth transition over to

big potty also. She was 4 1/2. I think with her it was all about control. HTH,

Jackie.

AJ wrote:I had some difficulty getting my son to do BMs in the toilet. He

is very

high functioning and was 4 1/2 when I decided enough was enough. He wore a

nappy/diaper at night because of wetting and would wait until I put it on to

do his BM. One day when I had had enough, right before his bath time, I

told him that I was going to punish him if he didn't use the potty for his

BM. He had done it maybe once before at about 3 so I knew he could do it.

And he had control or he wouldn't have been able to wait for the nappy in

the evening. Once he knew I was going to punish, he decided to use the

child potty instead. But he obviously had enough control to wait before I

took this route.

You would have to KNOW that they know what to do but just don't want to do

it.

My point is that with some of the kids, it is a control issue. Some of you

say that your child knows what they are supposed to do but don't want to do

it. I've had a lot of control issues with my ASD son. He is very clever

and used to fight me for control. I come from a very stubborn family. So

my advice would be to make their lack of acceptable behaviour difficult.

With NT kids, this isn't such an issue just because they are socialised and

they don't want to be embarrassed. ASD kids often don't care for much

longer.

Okay, no one flame me for this - if you don't agree, that's fine with me as

I know this is not appropriate for all ASD children. I have a high

functioning child so I don't know what would work for lower functioning

children. You do have to know your own child. But like someone said

recently about training her child to take pills, if something is important

enough, you can find a way. I wouldn't treat this quite as seriously, but

it is a big financial and stress issue. We simply couldn't afford the

nappies for a child that could use the toilet but wouldn't because of

control issues. And yes at one point I went through the 'Oh maybe he is

afraid and my forcing him will harm him' though but eventually I could see

that he just didn't want to do it and no amount of praise and cajoling were

going to change it.

Regards

AJ