.

[Guest guest]

No Shirley, You are not writing too much. This is interesting discussion

and informative. It is good to know you are not alone and that bloatedness

may not be due to overeating.

I learned about the bloatedness when I was having acupuncture two autumns

ago to save a kidney that was NOT showing up on M.D. testing. It was

discoved by my naturopath and she was very concerned. So I went to a

doctor with a degree from Beijing hospital and he just freaked out about

the kidneys. He spent a month trying to save them, working for almost two

hours ever other day (with the acupuncture needles in me for almost two

hours). Finally, I asked him why he left them so long and he replied, " To

get through all the water. This is not all fat. You must be holding forty

to fifty pounds of water, primarily in your stomach area, but also in

other parts of your body. " I told him that I attended the college

graduation of a young man I have known since he was twelve, and he asked

me to stay for his party at a lovely country house. He knew me when I was

thin. He wanted me to go to bed early and came and " cuddled " me and kept

poking my body in various areas, and then said, " I am not coming on to

you, I just have spent enough time studying Eastern medicine to know that

almost all of this weight gain is water, so please tell your M.D. " Of

course the M.D. was clueless, but when the Chinese doctor who has a full

fledged degree recognized in China as an M.D., said the same thing I began

to take notice.

The weight gain is especially difficult for me because I never had to

worry about weight. It made me realize that when I was put on Synthroid

for six months some years ago, I was warned that because I was allergic to

it (not realized until AFTER the six months were up--I had a polyp on the

thyroid they were trying to shrink and it did shrink) that I would " BLOW

UP QUITE SUDDENLY in ten to fifteen years, and that will indicate the

thyroid is about to die. " Well it happened just like that in 15 years.

I blew up in a matter of several months for no apparent reason. Like you,

Shirley, I am hypo. I also had and still have trouble with fruit juices

and had problems with food related to digestion, but not indigestion,

until suggested taking something, oh, digestive enzymes, in January,

I think, that made an immediate difference in digestion.

So, yes, Shirley I have bloating and digestion challenges similar or the

same as yours.

Now, I feel like apologizing for writing so much today!

Regards,

J n VT

+====>>>>>>=====>>>>>>>>........<<<<<<<<<=======<<<<<<<<==========+

" Truth is a shining goddess, always veiled, always distant,

never wholly approachable, but worthy of all the devotion

of which the human spirit is capable. " Bertrand

+====>>>>>>=====>>>>>>>>........<<<<<<<<<=======<<<<<<<<==========+

On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, Shirley Stieger wrote:

> J from Vt you said something about your stomach being bloted or holding

> water. This is somethng I have noticed for 2-3 weeks. I just thought I was

> putting on more weight and I wondered if other hypo's have notice the same

> thing? It's really frustrating because I have about 3 outfits I can wear.

> I seem to just keep getting bigger. Also doesn't seem my food wants to

> digest and get out of the stomach. Even fresh squeezed fruit and veg.

> juices don't seem to go through as fast as they should. any thoughts or is

> this something I have going and not bothering other thyroid types.

>

> I promise not to write any more to the list for a while, overdid it tonight.

> Shirley:

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> eGroups eLerts!

> Exclusive discounts on great gifts

> Join Now! http://clickhere./click/28

>

>

[Guest guest]

:So, yes, Shirley I have bloating and digestion challenges similar or the

:same as yours.

:

:Now, I feel like apologizing for writing so much today!

Dear J. .....No no, this was a big help, I know most of the people on

this list are hyper and may not have this problem. I have an accupuncturist

I could go to about this, did that work for you?? --Shirley

------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Hi Shirley,

Yes the acupuncturist helped a great deal. Evidently there were so many

toxins in my body the kidneys were having great difficulty filtering them

out properly. But after a month he was really frightened because the

kidneys were not getting better. He felt it was because of all the water

in my body. He said without the water he could have dealt with the

problem in less than six months because he had done it before.

I told my M.D., recently, that maybe the water is produced because it

perceives toxins in the body and is trying to " dilute " the toxins. But

what do I know? I suspect, in my case, the body received the Synthroid and

even Armour Thyroid as " toxins " . Then I began to wonder if the water

itself, was holding the " toxins " in a perpetual situation, and the

kidneys were so overwheled because there was no possible way to release

all those toxins at once without severely compromising kidney function.

I had to go to other alternative healers after the acupuncture doctor who

did other things to save my kidneys.

I was at a Chinese restaurant last summer, when a woman was updating

relatives on her health. She had been diagnosed hypothyroid a year before,

went on the Synthroid or whatever allopaths prescribe these days, and

immediately gained weight to the tune of 100 lbs. I have heard this story

so many times! It is usually 100 lbs, too! Now I wonder, after hearing

from you, Shirley, how much of this tonnage is WATER in these other folk?

Does the hypothyroidism produce the excess bloatedness or the medication?

THis part is a little off topic but maybe of interest:

The Chinese doctor gave me lots and lots of herbs to boil thrice daily,

including ones for cancer. He said, in China, cancer is not a problem for

them as they have used herbs to deal with it for, well, centuries. And

the herbs are not expensive. He also said fibroids are dealt with the

same way, but they don't like to use them on women past forty because

" they don't need their uteruses any longer " .

We had an " interesting " discussion about that, I tell you! He said, in

China, the herbs to save the uterus usually cost $1,000 and while they

don't always work, they often do. I told him many women in this country

are so attaches to their " uteri " that they would very willingly pay 1K to

save them! This is a bit off topic however, I mention this because now I

am wondering what the tree bark and other things in the Chinese herbs

were, I mean how they relate to vitamin supplements. They looked like some

Boy Scout had gone foraging in the woods for all the different looking

types of moss and bark and nuts he could find. There must be all sorts of

vitamins and minerals in them!

J in Vt

+====>>>>>>=====>>>>>>>>........<<<<<<<<<=======<<<<<<<<==========+

" Truth is a shining goddess, always veiled, always distant,

never wholly approachable, but worthy of all the devotion

of which the human spirit is capable. " Bertrand

+====>>>>>>=====>>>>>>>>........<<<<<<<<<=======<<<<<<<<==========+

On Sun, 11 Apr 1999, Shirley Stieger wrote:

>

> :So, yes, Shirley I have bloating and digestion challenges similar or the

> :same as yours.

> :

> :Now, I feel like apologizing for writing so much today!

>

>

> Dear J. .....No no, this was a big help, I know most of the people on

> this list are hyper and may not have this problem. I have an accupuncturist

> I could go to about this, did that work for you?? --Shirley

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Tired of waiting for your stock quotes and charts to load?

> StockMaster is super-fast for quotes, charts, news, and portfolios.

> Markets don't wait, why should you? http://clickhere./click/69

>

>

[Guest guest]

Shirley,

I am hypo as well. You describe me to a tee. Especially foods like corn

or peanuts and breads etc... Things I am trying to stay away from nowadays.

Would love a solution to the bloating and frustrating weight gains. Lots of

exercise helps but who has THAT much time everyday?

--kathleen

------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Shirley ---

I have hypothyroidism (although at times my TSH veers into the low-normal

range, like 1.8 --- this is after I've been taking a lot of zinc for

awhile), and my face is very puffy. In addition, I have major abdominal

fat/water, although I'm considered underweight! Very strange, but I do

believe the bloating is due to the thyroid dysfunction.

>J from Vt you said something about your stomach being bloted or holding

>water. This is somethng I have noticed for 2-3 weeks. I just thought I was

>putting on more weight and I wondered if other hypo's have notice the same

>thing? It's really frustrating because I have about 3 outfits I can wear.

>I seem to just keep getting bigger. Also doesn't seem my food wants to

>digest and get out of the stomach. Even fresh squeezed fruit and veg.

>juices don't seem to go through as fast as they should. any thoughts or is

>this something I have going and not bothering other thyroid types.

>

>I promise not to write any more to the list for a while, overdid it tonight.

>Shirley:

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>eGroups eLerts!

>Exclusive discounts on great gifts

>Join Now! http://clickhere./click/28

>

>

[Guest guest]

, here is a link for raw honey. I have been getting it from them for a

long time, great stuff

http://www.reallyrawhoney.com/

=====

I am drinking raw goats milk, have been

eating raw beef, make smoothies with raw eggs, and of

course there is the raw honey and everything else AV

says to get.

=====

, the thought of eating raw meat turns my stomach and that is

indication enough for me not to try it. Even though I grew up with steak

tartar in Germany. That is raw hamburger meat.

I do raw honey and raw eggs. Am unable to get raw goatsmilk here.

I find it strange that he says no salt. I am sure he means tablesalt which is

bad for you. But celtic salt too? I love that stuff in my water.

====

There is a

Whole Foods down the road from me, and I pop in there

at lunch for my daily ground round. It can also last

for days in the refrigerator, and a little bacteria is

actually good AV says. It is not gross at all. I

have had lamb, pork, hamburg,

====

You are very brave. You don't know how fresh the meat is. And it lays open in

their counters all day.Sorry, does not appeal to me.

====

AV says constipation is the result of not enough of

raw fat foods

=====

I get my fat from olive oil and virgin coconut oil. Also Flaxseed.

, I know we both have been through hell and back. If this works for

you I am glad. But as you said your intuition led you to it. Mine tells me

the opposite.

Thank you for trying to help, it's appreciated.

Love and Light

Christel

PS:

Can you give me the correct link for the live food group? Everytime I

put that in the search engine I get an entertainment page.

Thanks

[Guest guest]

Hi folks,

I'm usually quiet and don't post often...but I was wondering.

I have read story after story of your problems with Lyme and its kinda scary.

Is this what I have to look forward to later on or are the problems that you

are

having due to the fact that you have not been diagnosed for such a long time

or the fact that you cant get the treatment because of problems with

insurance companiesor both togeather?

((I hope that this is making sense))

~the quiet one~

[Guest guest]

Dear sandra,

I was diagnosed six years too late. The problem was that not only did I have

late stage neurologic Lyme, it was also that I had babesiosis, ehlriciosis,

Human herpes virusues 6 and 8, mycoplasma too. I was treated with IV several

times before i got to see Br. B but not until I saw him did he diagnose all

of my problems. It has taken him 4 years to get me so much better that now I

am working 15 hours as an RN in an office. He saved my life. I had such

excrutiating pain in my teeth, roof of mouth, throat and down my L arm that I

was almost suicidal. It was all from Lyme affecting my cranial nerves. I hope

you are diong better. Hope I answered your questions.

Helen

[Guest guest]

, Haven't had much time for writing in but just wanted to let you

know I made that banana pudding for a cookout my daughter had and it was

really good. Everybody loved it and all was devoured! I could of made two

pans of it and it would of all been eaten!! I only ate a little just to

see what it was like and it was yummy! Stupid me the night before, and

feeling really good the last couple of weeks, ate pork. Big mistake for

me. Started getting sick not long after eating it and was really out of

it all day saturday and saturday night. Was really looking forward to the

cookout saturday to relax and have some fun! Didn't bother me that

everybody could have a drink because I was drugged by the meat!!(LOL)

Never again will I eat pork!!!!! It hit me much worse than steak.

Thankyou for the banana pudding recipe. Many people want this recipe.

Hope you are doing good. Have alot of posts to write. Suppose to get done

work today early so maybe I'll be able to catch up some. Take Care

-NH

[Guest guest]

,

I just got home from the hospital today so I am behind on my mail, but this one caught my eye since you had my name in the subject. That banana pudding is definitely to die for! I have to throw away any that is left because I will end up making myself sick eating it! Beef is the one thing that I really cannot tolerate. I do okay with pork most of the time. I told my husband the next time I start to eat beef to just go ahead and cut my head off! The thing is, beef is really my least favorite of all meat! I think I will mostly stick to chicken and fish. Well, for now, I'm not going to have any meat for a few days til I'm sure my stomach is back up to par.

I do have to say that every single one of the nurses and doctors were wonderful. Never once was I made to feel like I was a druggy. I asked for pain medicine and they gave it to me. What a novel concept. I mean the doctor did order it, after all! I really am a very low maintenance patient. Just about the only thing they have to do for me is hang IV fluids, give me meds for pain and nausea, and cover my port a cath dressing once a day so I can shower. When they start letting me have stuff to drink, I typically walk to the nurses station to get it because I need to walk some when I can or my back flares up.

Well, I'm glad to be home. I'll catch up on my posts in the next few days. If there's something I need to see sooner, just put my name on the subject line.

W

Re: [ ] .

, Haven't had much time for writing in but just wanted to let youknow I made that banana pudding for a cookout my daughter had and it wasreally good. Everybody loved it and all was devoured! I could of made twopans of it and it would of all been eaten!! I only ate a little just tosee what it was like and it was yummy! Stupid me the night before, andfeeling really good the last couple of weeks, ate pork. Big mistake forme. Started getting sick not long after eating it and was really out ofit all day saturday and saturday night. Was really looking forward to thecookout saturday to relax and have some fun! Didn't bother me thateverybody could have a drink because I was drugged by the meat!!(LOL) Never again will I eat pork!!!!! It hit me much worse than steak.Thankyou for the banana pudding recipe. Many people want this recipe. Hope you are doing good. Have alot of posts to write. Suppose to get donework today early so maybe I'll be able to catch up some. Take Care -NH

[Guest guest]

Hi Helen,

Thanks for your encouraging words. Aundrea is still bed bound today

but its just day 3 of the steroids. I have been reading all of the

posts and really wonder what the next best drug would be for

Aundrea. She is still on Plaquenil. It seemed to really do the

trick for several months but now we are back to how things were last

winter.

I don't know how all the other moms on the list get thru the pred

tapers. I thought the hunger pains were bad but they are a cake

walk compared to the mood swings. She is literally telling me I am

the best mom in the whole world and the next time I enter the room

she is crying her eyes out or glaring a hole thru me. The whole

mood swing is so unlike her and it can just make everything else so

frustrating.

I know that others have had to deal with much worse than this so I

am sure that we will get thru it eventually.

I hope Nick is having a good week!

God Bless,

- In , " hburger64 " <hburger64@h...> wrote:

>

> Im so sorry to hear that Aundrea is flaring yet again..I really

had

> hoped that her brief stint with the prednisone was what was

needed.

> But,im sorry to say it does sound like her disease is

progressing (

>

> I hope that this prednisone kicks in soon and helps her out and I

> also hope that she can get into her doctors soon and get some

> answers and stronger medications, its sounds like its time...

>

> Please let us know how shes doing.. ill keep her in my thoughts

and

> prayers.

>

> hang in there mom!

>

> Hugs Helen and (7 systemic)

[Guest guest]

-,

I'm so sorry Drea is still bed bound... I would be inclined to call

the rhuemy as Alia had said in a previous post. This just suxs and I

feel for you and for Drea...Nicks not had much mood swings on the

pred, so far.. I do know his mood really changes when hes flaring

and hes does get very irritable and crabby and snaps a lot.

I really do think its time for the doctor to get more aggressive,

Drea should not have to deal with this like this... Giving her a

bunch of steriods is only a stop gap treatment and is not the answer

in the long run. The steriods dont fix the underlaying problem, only

cover it up and make it seem like everything is back to normal for a

short while. If the doctor doesnt do something more it will just

continue to be a vicious cicle and Drea deserves better than that.

I wish they could see her sooner than Jan. I really think its time

to add MTX.

Please keep us up to date on whats going on and please tell Aundrea

that shes not alone, theres a lot of us thinking of her and praying

that she starts to feel better soon.

Hugs to you too mom..

Hugs Helen and (7,systemic)

-- In , " sonia1md " <sonia1md@y...> wrote:

>

> Hi Helen,

>

> Thanks for your encouraging words. Aundrea is still bed bound

today

> but its just day 3 of the steroids. I have been reading all of

the

> posts and really wonder what the next best drug would be for

> Aundrea. She is still on Plaquenil. It seemed to really do the

> trick for several months but now we are back to how things were

last

> winter.

>

> I don't know how all the other moms on the list get thru the pred

> tapers. I thought the hunger pains were bad but they are a cake

> walk compared to the mood swings. She is literally telling me I

am

> the best mom in the whole world and the next time I enter the room

> she is crying her eyes out or glaring a hole thru me. The whole

> mood swing is so unlike her and it can just make everything else

so

> frustrating.

>

> I know that others have had to deal with much worse than this so I

> am sure that we will get thru it eventually.

>

> I hope Nick is having a good week!

>

> God Bless,

>

> - In , " hburger64 " <hburger64@h...> wrote:

> >

> > Im so sorry to hear that Aundrea is flaring yet again..I really

> had

> > hoped that her brief stint with the prednisone was what was

> needed.

> > But,im sorry to say it does sound like her disease is

> progressing (

> >

> > I hope that this prednisone kicks in soon and helps her out and

I

> > also hope that she can get into her doctors soon and get some

> > answers and stronger medications, its sounds like its time...

> >

> > Please let us know how shes doing.. ill keep her in my thoughts

> and

> > prayers.

> >

> > hang in there mom!

> >

> > Hugs Helen and (7 systemic)

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I felt so sad reading about Aundrea's recent flare. You have such a

positive attitude, despite it all, and I know you have the strength to

weather this storm ... as difficult as it can sometimes be. The

emotional aspects of living with JRA can, at times, be nearly as

challenging as the physical ones. I do hope that Aundrea will be feeling

better soon. The world seems like such a sunny place, when our children

are healthy and happy. Know that you are in our thoughts.

Aloha,

Georgina

sonia1md wrote:

>

> Hi Helen,

>

> Thanks for your encouraging words. Aundrea is still bed bound today

> but its just day 3 of the steroids. I have been reading all of the

> posts and really wonder what the next best drug would be for

> Aundrea. She is still on Plaquenil. It seemed to really do the

> trick for several months but now we are back to how things were last

> winter.

>

> I don't know how all the other moms on the list get thru the pred

> tapers. I thought the hunger pains were bad but they are a cake

> walk compared to the mood swings. She is literally telling me I am

> the best mom in the whole world and the next time I enter the room

> she is crying her eyes out or glaring a hole thru me. The whole

> mood swing is so unlike her and it can just make everything else so

> frustrating.

>

> I know that others have had to deal with much worse than this so I

> am sure that we will get thru it eventually.

>

> I hope Nick is having a good week!

>

> God Bless,

>

> - In , " hburger64 " <hburger64@h...> wrote:

>

>>Im so sorry to hear that Aundrea is flaring yet again..I really

>

> had

>

>>hoped that her brief stint with the prednisone was what was

>

> needed.

>

>>But,im sorry to say it does sound like her disease is

>

> progressing (

>

>>I hope that this prednisone kicks in soon and helps her out and I

>>also hope that she can get into her doctors soon and get some

>>answers and stronger medications, its sounds like its time...

>>

>>Please let us know how shes doing.. ill keep her in my thoughts

>

> and

>

>>prayers.

>>

>>hang in there mom!

>>

>>Hugs Helen and (7 systemic)

[Guest guest]

:

I am so sorry to hear that Aundrea is having a bad time. I hope that they are

able to determine the best course of action to get her feeling better soon. Take

care.

and Rob 15 Spondy

[Guest guest]

, Thanks for your reply

My daughter just turned four and does not have fillings. She is on

Kirman's probiotic- pro bio inulin free. She does not have

sensitivity to corn. I believe she was having viral die-off symptoms,

they appear to be decreasing but she is still running a temp and her

eye-contact and comprehension is fluctuating. We are SCDiet to help

with yeast. We will obtain a hair analysis from Doctor Data's Lab. I

will look into Lysine. I am hoping to learn more about viruses. What

are signs of heavy metal? Thanks, your info. has been helpful.

>

> <tt>

> I suspect heavy metals. What should I do?<BR>

>

> *Does she have ANY mercury amalgam dental fillings? If so, start

looking for a mercury-free dentist. Order a DDI (Doctor's Data,

Inc.) hair elements test. A doctor can do this (insist on DDI) or

you can do this yourself through DLS (Direct Lab Services). If you

mention this list DLS will give you a discount and it will then cost

$73. It's less expensive if you can get a doctor to order it. When

you get the results back apply the counting rules which can be found

in the FAQs of this list.

> <BR>

> My daughter with PDD-NOS is taking all three Houston's. She is on

<BR>

> SCDiet, Kirkman's probiotic, antigen drops for egg,(many allergies)

<BR>

> Mag chlor, vit c and o of o. <BR>

> <BR>

> In December we treated her for almost three weeks for yeast with

<BR>

> Nystatin. Her allergist who has been to a few DAN conferences gave

us <BR>

> the script but we are mostly doing this on our own. So than we

waited <BR>

> for a week and added vit c. She had been having low temps

frequently <BR>

> which tipped me off that she may have viral issues so I added vit

c. <BR>

> After we added vit c she experienced weepiness, crossing her

fingers, <BR>

> flapping her hands and started walking on her toes.

>

> *What was the source of the vit C. Some can't tolerate C from

corn. Some do better with C from sago palm or other sources.

>

> She stopped the <BR>

> crossing of fingers, flapping of hands and walking on her toes

after <BR>

> adjusting to the enzymes in June 05. She has had a low grade temp

for <BR>

> the last 11 days and has had fever blisters. We did have a break

for <BR>

> one evening which she was feeling great and than it started back up

<BR>

> again the next morning. I have no idea what is going on. I started

<BR>

> using o of o for the first time last Sunday. I am just giving her

two <BR>

> to three drops once daily and have been giving her extra no-fenol

<BR>

> between meals to help with increased yeast.<BR>

>

> *Is she on probiotics? Might be helpful. Lysine generally helps

with fever blisters.

> <BR>

> I have several o of o questions.<BR>

> Do you normally start with 2 drops and work your way up and to what

<BR>

> point? How much o of o can you safely give? Do you need to be <BR>

> concerned about what supplements you take it with and how often?<BR>

> Does it need to be rotated or can she consistenly take this?<BR>

> <BR>

> Since she appears to have viral problems does that mean that the

<BR>

> likelihood of her having heavy metals has increased and what can I

do <BR>

> about it?<BR>

> <BR>

> I am aware of Virastop and OLE but like the o of o I am not sure

<BR>

> where to start. <BR>

> <BR>

> So new. My daughter has her first appointment with Dr. Felice at

the <BR>

> Caring Med. & Rehab Services in Oak Park, IL next Friday.  Does <BR>

> anybody have good or bad experiences with this practice? I am

worried <BR>

> and am loosing sleep. Any advice is greatly apprecited.<BR>

> Thanks, Melinda<BR>

> <BR>

> <BR>

> <BR>

>

>

> _______________________________________________

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