Re: Off Subject--free medical care

[Guest guest]

>

> SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need educating

> most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in the

> US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of being

> able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free - get

> meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get surgery

> free...the list is endless.

> In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my husband

> with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been able

> to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having to

> choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and

> getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.

> Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic but

> had to vent!

>

In exchange for " free " medical care, don't the citizens of these

countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not

coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.

Art

[Guest guest]

Yes, this is true. There are pro's and con's to both types of medical systems.

Many doctors that wish to make more money from Canada love to come work in the US.

Many people wait longer for medical appointments in countries with socialized medicine.

Many people in the US don't have any health care plans and can't see doctors at all when they are sick.

****

The most interesting question that I have is in regards to the political issues of why countries with socialized medicine do not embrace cheaper medicines and medical treatments like LDN. I think Dave said it best on our chat site a couple of years ago. He is from England and he believes that politics and special interests from the pharmacy companies exists in those countries as well. The issue again may come down to "big pharma". Don't our countries work for us! I think this is what we should be fighting. Who is looking out for our best interest with medicines that can be helpful, cheap and do the least harm? Apparently, at this time we (the people of socialized and non-socialized medicine countries) must look out for ourselves. We are lucky to have forums like this. Thank god for you guys.

Aletha

[low dose naltrexone] Re: Off Subject--"free" medical care

>> SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need educating > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in the > US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of being > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free - get > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get surgery > free...the list is endless. > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my husband > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been able > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having to > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.> Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic but > had to vent!> In exchange for "free" medical care, don't the citizens of these countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.Art

[Guest guest]

We do pay high taxes in Europe but everyone does and it`s deducted

from your wages so you dont even see it to miss it! Those who cant

afford it ( the elderly or unemployed) dont pay but still get taken

care of. My american stepfather lived in the UK for the last 10

years of his life (he had leukemia) and was taken care of like a

king with never so much as an aspirin to pay for! Believe me,

having lived in both countries I`d rather pay higher taxes than not

be able to see a doctor here. Before got Medical, each

time he had an MRI he would get a bill for over $5,000. The only

reason we found LDN in the first place was because we were unable

(and unwilling) to pay over $1,000 a month to inject some poison

into his body !

France actually has the best healthcare system in the world. If you

look at the list which is in the movie Sicko, the US is WAY down the

list which is crazy. It just breaks my heart to see people

struggling here to get healthcare. It should be a right not a

privilage.

> >

> > SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need

educating

> > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in

the

> > US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of

being

> > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free -

get

> > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get

surgery

> > free...the list is endless.

> > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my

husband

> > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been

able

> > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having

to

> > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and

> > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.

> > Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic

but

> > had to vent!

> >

>

> In exchange for " free " medical care, don't the citizens of these

> countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not

> coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.

>

> Art

>

[Guest guest]

The people in REAL need dont wait for attention at all. If you are

waiting for a non urgent thing like cateracts or something, then

granted, the wait might be long, but for urgent stuff, you`d be in

the same day. You can literally see a doctor the same day you phone

if it`s important. Here in San Francisco you have to plan in

advance when you might need a doctor as the wait is usually months

and then you get stuck with a huge bill!

I`m sure in a small town it`s different and you get seen quicker but

here it`s a nightmare. When broke his hand a few years ago

we sat in the emergency room at our local hospital for 9 hours with

no attention. Now, the people who were getting shot in the street

got in straight away!! Seems a bit extreme though, ha ha!!

> >

> > SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need

educating

> > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in

the

> > US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of

being

> > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free -

get

> > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get

surgery

> > free...the list is endless.

> > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my

husband

> > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been

able

> > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having

to

> > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and

> > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.

> > Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic

but

> > had to vent!

> >

>

> In exchange for " free " medical care, don't the citizens of these

> countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not

> coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.

>

> Art

>

[Guest guest]

Dearest Emmalemma (sorry if that is not your correct name),

It is good to hear that my understanding may be inaccurate regarding the longer waits for medical care in countries with socialized medicine. I am about 2 hours near you in Calif. and I too need to wait at times for our doctor, and especially for emergency care. But we have never had to wait more than a little over an hour for the emergency room. Factoring that in, perhaps (if it is possible), you should drive outside of the city to a better hospital if you have another emergency to contend with.

My best

Aletha

[low dose naltrexone] Re: Off Subject--"free" medical care

The people in REAL need dont wait for attention at all. If you are waiting for a non urgent thing like cateracts or something, then granted, the wait might be long, but for urgent stuff, you`d be in the same day. You can literally see a doctor the same day you phone if it`s important. Here in San Francisco you have to plan in advance when you might need a doctor as the wait is usually months and then you get stuck with a huge bill!I`m sure in a small town it`s different and you get seen quicker but here it`s a nightmare. When broke his hand a few years ago we sat in the emergency room at our local hospital for 9 hours with no attention. Now, the people who were getting shot in the street got in straight away!! Seems a bit extreme though, ha ha!!> >> > SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need educating > > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in the > > US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of being > > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free - get > > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get surgery > > free...the list is endless. > > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my husband > > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been able > > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having to > > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and > > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.> > Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic but > > had to vent!> > > > In exchange for "free" medical care, don't the citizens of these > countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not > coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.> > Art>

[Guest guest]

when you're sick higher taxes in exchange for free or low cost medical is a no brainer. But there are many healthy people that dont want to pay for the sick and they make sure this does not happen. Yet if they got sick themselves, watch people change their tune. Bottom line is that medical care should NOT be a luxury. And another thing, why IS it so expensive here regardless of taxes? Considering what doctors and most medicine does for us, not a whole lot, seems too much money is going their way... (ie doctors and pharmaceutical companies) i'm curious how much $ goes to R & D. Evidently the millions raised for my disease is somehow STILL not enough. Where is this money going?!?!?? There should be a cap on salaries. When you or your insrance pays hundreds a month for a med, how much of that goes to the scientists in the labs who invented the drug? And how much goes to the CEO's versus shareholders? Its not uncommon

for a top level executive to receive a 6 digit salary but then 7 digits in bonuses each year when the stock does well (and soemtimes even if it doesnt do well, the shareholders *only* lose out). Meanwhile we pay through the nose. Anyway, i wont say more since I know I am off topic. Aletha Wittmann <Aletha@...> wrote: Dearest Emmalemma (sorry if that is not your correct name), It is good to hear that my understanding may be inaccurate regarding the longer waits for medical care in countries with socialized medicine. I am about 2 hours near you in Calif. and I too need to wait at times for our doctor, and especially for emergency care. But we have never had to wait more than a little over an hour for the emergency room. Factoring that in, perhaps (if it is possible), you should drive outside of the city to a better hospital if you have another emergency to contend with. My best Aletha [low dose naltrexone] Re: Off Subject--"free" medical care The people in REAL need dont wait for attention at all. If you are waiting for a non urgent thing like

cateracts or something, then granted, the wait might be long, but for urgent stuff, you`d be in the same day. You can literally see a doctor the same day you phone if it`s important. Here in San Francisco you have to plan in advance when you might need a doctor as the wait is usually months and then you get stuck with a huge bill!I`m sure in a small town it`s different and you get seen quicker but here it`s a nightmare. When broke his hand a few years ago we sat in the emergency room at our local hospital for 9 hours with no attention. Now, the people who were getting shot in the street got in straight away!! Seems a bit extreme though, ha ha!!> >> > SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need educating > > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in the > >

US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of being > > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free - get > > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get surgery > > free...the list is endless. > > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my husband > > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been able > > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having to > > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and > > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.> > Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic but > > had to vent!> > > > In exchange for "free" medical care, don't the citizens of these > countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not > coming down in

favor or not on this issue, only asking.> > Art>

Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.

[Guest guest]

ART - in other words - we pay, one way, or the other, right??

marshirisGet a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com.

[Guest guest]

BEVKEAN - i agree wholeheartedly!! especially, the elderly, who have paid taxes, their entire adult life, should be able to get their medical needs met - FREE!! we have to pay for medicare, and its benefits - but, really, where are the benefits? where are the benefits, for the senior citizens, from the LOTTERY GAMES, etc.??

marshirisGet a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com.

[Guest guest]

You are laboring under the misapprehension that the driving force the medical industry today is to heal people. IT IS NOT. If it was, LDN would be an example of a WIDESPREAD commonly used drug to treat dozens of things. BUT it makes nobody any money. If the industry does not make money on it, whatever "it" is, it will not be promoted.

This is a $3,000,000,000,000 (3 Trillion) dollar annual industry on the North American continent. They do not make money if you are healthy. Ponder on that for a moment.

If you do not need to go to the doctor for drugs, etc... except in cases of emergency, who benefits? (hint: people in general, not the pharmacutical other health professions).

Bruce Guilmette, PhD

Author: THERE'S MORE TO LIFE THAN JUST LIVING, A Personal Story About Cancer Survival

Survive Cancer Foundation, Inc.

http://survivecancerfoundation.org

Do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own. Matt 6:34 (NIV)

From: low dose naltrexone [mailto:low dose naltrexone ] On Behalf Of VickiSent: Sunday, August 05, 2007 10:34 PMlow dose naltrexone Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: Off Subject--"free" medical care

when you're sick higher taxes in exchange for free or low cost medical is a no brainer. But there are many healthy people that dont want to pay for the sick and they make sure this does not happen. Yet if they got sick themselves, watch people change their tune.

Bottom line is that medical care should NOT be a luxury. And another thing, why IS it so expensive here regardless of taxes? Considering what doctors and most medicine does for us, not a whole lot, seems too much money is going their way... (ie doctors and pharmaceutical companies) i'm curious how much $ goes to R & D. Evidently the millions raised for my disease is somehow STILL not enough. Where is this money going?!?!?? There should be a cap on salaries. When you or your insrance pays hundreds a month for a med, how much of that goes to the scientists in the labs who invented the drug? And how much goes to the CEO's versus shareholders? Its not uncommon for a top level executive to receive a 6 digit salary but then 7 digits in bonuses each year when the stock does well (and soemtimes even if it doesnt do well, the shareholders *only* lose out). Meanwhile we pay through the nose.

Anyway, i wont say more since I know I am off topic.

Aletha Wittmann <Aletharedshift> wrote:

Dearest Emmalemma (sorry if that is not your correct name),

It is good to hear that my understanding may be inaccurate regarding the longer waits for medical care in countries with socialized medicine. I am about 2 hours near you in Calif. and I too need to wait at times for our doctor, and especially for emergency care. But we hve never had to wait more than a little over an hour for the emergency room. Factoring that in, perhaps (if it is possible), you should drive outside of the city to a better hospital if you have another emergency to contend with.

My best

Aletha

[low dose naltrexone] Re: Off Subject--"free" medical care

The people in REAL need dont wait for attention at all. If you are waiting for a non urgent thing like cateracts or something, then granted, the wait might be long, but for urgent stuff, you`d be in the same day. You can literally see a doctor the same day you phone if it`s important. Here in San Francisco you have to plan in advance when you might need a doctor as the wait is usually months and then you get stuck with a huge bill!I`m sure in a small town it`s different and you get seen quicker but here it`s a nightmare. When broke his hand a few years ago we sat in the emergency room at our local hospital for 9 hours with no attention. Now, the people who were getting shot in the street got in straight away!! Seems a bit extreme though, ha ha!!> >> > SICKO was fantastic but like you say the people that need educating > > most will not see it - socialised medicine is a dirty word in the > > US...I`m British and I cant tell you the wonderful feeling of being > > able to see a doctor for free - have one visit you for free - get > > meds free (you just pay a tiny amount for the script) get surgery > > free...the list is endless. > > In the US I have no health insurance and although it`s my husband > > with MS and he is taken care of with disability, I havent been able > > to see a doctor here for 8 years due to lack of funds. Having to > > choose between eating, paying rent, running a car for work and > > getting health care should not be an issue. Stress kills.> > Sicko will make you laugh and then cry...sorry, way off topic but > > had to vent!> > > > In exchange for "free" medical care, don't the citizens of these > countries with socialized medicine pay VERY high taxes? I'm not > coming down in favor or not on this issue, only asking.> > Art>

Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.

[Guest guest]

There's too much discussion on this off topic subject. Can those

interested in this subject please take it to a forum that allows long

discussions on off topics.

These long off topic discussions causes LDN using people to leave the

forum.

Thank you,

[Guest guest]

>

> when you're sick higher taxes in exchange for free or low cost

medical is a no brainer. But there are many healthy people that dont

want to pay for the sick and they make sure this does not happen. Yet

if they got sick themselves, watch people change their tune.

>

> Bottom line is that medical care should NOT be a luxury. And

another thing, why IS it so expensive here regardless of taxes?

Considering what doctors and most medicine does for us, not a whole

lot, seems too much money is going their way... (ie doctors and

pharmaceutical companies) i'm curious how much $ goes to R & D.

Evidently the millions raised for my disease is somehow STILL not

enough. Where is this money going?!?!?? There should be a cap on

salaries. When you or your insrance pays hundreds a month for a med,

how much of that goes to the scientists in the labs who invented the

drug? And how much goes to the CEO's versus shareholders? Its not

uncommon for a top level executive to receive a 6 digit salary but

then 7 digits in bonuses each year when the stock does well (and

soemtimes even if it doesnt do well, the shareholders *only* lose

out). Meanwhile we pay through the nose.

>

> Anyway, i wont say more since I know I am off topic.

>

" But there are many healthy people that dont want to pay for the sick

and they make sure this does not happen. "

Another way of putting it is: Working people who pay taxes don't want

to pay health care for those who aren't working and paying taxes and

are a drain on our society. Examples = illegal aliens,

welfare/disability cheats, et al.

Excuse me for being off topic.

Art