Re: New findings regarding autism -- Andy, pls chime in

[Guest guest]

This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

If you watch Dr. Grier's discussion, he states that they have " seen " mercury

binding to testosterone and have test results which back that up -- listen to

the video -- especially those of you who understrand medical terminology.

Once the mercury and testosterone are stuck togethor, the mercury can't be

chelated. Only way is to knock out the testosterone.

Can someone please give the other side -- why this may not work? Why it may

be dangerous ...

Again, watch the short videos. Autiemom4 provided a link below.

Cochran <Ladyshrink111@...> wrote:

Talk to Andy, he seems to think that there are reasons not to use Lupron. Drs

use lots of drugs that aren't necessarily good for people, think about the

cholesterol drugs that do lower cholesterol, but cause liver disease in an

alarming number of people.

[ ] New findings regarding autism

Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify before

the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537, authored by

Senator Hensley. The bill reads as such, " Children 8 years

old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not receive vaccine

containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public health

emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident. Penalties

and civil liability listed. " http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

E8F

While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak at the

Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu visit,

they did not have handouts but did have their computer with

powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes. Since then,

I have found a similar presentation (that they had given in the

recent past) online at http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four segments of

this talk

They feel they have found a definite link in high levels of

testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury from

vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that general

statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that prevents

normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually affect

testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds to

mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics cannot get

rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's a vicious

cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps that

aren't in this video presentation if you would want them. Just let

me know.

Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

(successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose mercury but

not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an additional

treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven children (ages 4-

9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron Depot

(there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the test

program). Lupron decreases the body's production of testosterone.

Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of chelation to

remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved dramatically in

the children being tested. He presented pictures and school reports

of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old student went

from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to sit in a

swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills on his

school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative student who

has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school now,

and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

Administering Lupron does not come without its problems. The

question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron when

he/she is supposed to naturally be going through puberty? " Because

this study has only gone on for a short time, that question cannot

be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently doing

trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question arises, " When do

we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? " It is also

costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on the cost.

On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the US Public

Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the removal of

thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment from the

FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on this

recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation banning

vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California, Delaware,

Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since August of

2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas has

rapidly decreased.

They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have implications

with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in the

brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy metals.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

I don't know much about this, really haven't read it...but if mercury can't be

chelated when bonded to testosterone then why are so many getting mercury out

per test results? It could just come back to how Hg has effected certain kids.

We all know our kids are very similar but still very different with their

issues. Some are aggressive and others are not. Maybe those who are aggressive

have mercury bonded to their hormones, Hg is known to affect hormones. Not

sure?

The danger likely lies in the giving of hormones and the possible fallout of

that and the fact that they come from a pharmacutical company and everything

they say has to be taken with a chunk of salt...safety data for instance. I

would want to know what exactly is happening on a cellular level and know that

messing with these hormones isn't going to have major lasting problems. I know

of too many issues women have when their hormones are not balanced. I would not

be comfortable messing with such an important area without a serious amount of

research.

Just thoughts,

Abid Khan <a_bit_solutions@...> wrote:

This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

If you watch Dr. Grier's discussion, he states that they have " seen " mercury

binding to testosterone and have test results which back that up -- listen to

the video -- especially those of you who understrand medical terminology.

Once the mercury and testosterone are stuck togethor, the mercury can't be

chelated. Only way is to knock out the testosterone.

Can someone please give the other side -- why this may not work? Why it may

be dangerous ...

Again, watch the short videos. Autiemom4 provided a link below.

Cochran <Ladyshrink111@...> wrote:

Talk to Andy, he seems to think that there are reasons not to use Lupron. Drs

use lots of drugs that aren't necessarily good for people, think about the

cholesterol drugs that do lower cholesterol, but cause liver disease in an

alarming number of people.

[ ] New findings regarding autism

Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify before

the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537, authored by

Senator Hensley. The bill reads as such, " Children 8 years

old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not receive vaccine

containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public health

emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident. Penalties

and civil liability listed. " http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

E8F

While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak at the

Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu visit,

they did not have handouts but did have their computer with

powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes. Since then,

I have found a similar presentation (that they had given in the

recent past) online at http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four segments of

this talk

They feel they have found a definite link in high levels of

testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury from

vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that general

statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that prevents

normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually affect

testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds to

mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics cannot get

rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's a vicious

cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps that

aren't in this video presentation if you would want them. Just let

me know.

Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

(successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose mercury but

not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an additional

treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven children (ages 4-

9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron Depot

(there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the test

program). Lupron decreases the body's production of testosterone.

Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of chelation to

remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved dramatically in

the children being tested. He presented pictures and school reports

of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old student went

from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to sit in a

swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills on his

school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative student who

has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school now,

and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

Administering Lupron does not come without its problems. The

question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron when

he/she is supposed to naturally be going through puberty? " Because

this study has only gone on for a short time, that question cannot

be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently doing

trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question arises, " When do

we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? " It is also

costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on the cost.

On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the US Public

Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the removal of

thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment from the

FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on this

recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation banning

vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California, Delaware,

Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since August of

2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas has

rapidly decreased.

They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have implications

with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in the

brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy metals.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

>

> This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

Here's post #153888:

The theory that testosterone ties up the mercury and keeps it there is

insane. Also the theory that testosterone creates the susceptibility

in some direct sense.

Also Lupron does NOT simply reduce testosterone. It does a lot more

complicated stuff than that.

I have heard positive reports from its use.

I generally consider messing with steroid metabolism in children to be

fraught with risk of messing up their sexual development so I suggest

great caution in using Lupron.

However I don't suggest people automatically avoid it.

The question as always is whether there is some reason to take it - an

indication in medical terms - more specific than being autistic.

Andy

[let me make a big plug for onibasu -- Andy's not here much but you

can often find his posts on nearly every subject on onibasu...

Nell

[Guest guest]

From what I have read, it was my understanding that Lupron was being suggested

for kids who do not appear to excrete mercury, even though there have been

efforts at chelation.

So, much easier to try to chelate first, then if no improvement move on to other

things that appear plausible.

:

lvchefmel wrote:

I don't know much about this, really haven't read it...but if mercury can't be

chelated when bonded to testosterone then why are so many getting mercury out

per test results? It could just come back to how Hg has effected certain kids.

We all know our kids are very similar but still very different with their

issues. Some are aggressive and others are not. Maybe those who are aggressive

have mercury bonded to their hormones, Hg is known to affect hormones. Not

sure?

The danger likely lies in the giving of hormones and the possible fallout of

that and the fact that they come from a pharmacutical company and everything

they say has to be taken with a chunk of salt...safety data for instance. I

would want to know what exactly is happening on a cellular level and know that

messing with these hormones isn't going to have major lasting problems. I know

of too many issues women have when their hormones are not balanced. I would not

be comfortable messing with such an important area without a serious amount of

research.

Just thoughts,

Abid Khan <a_bit_solutions@...> wrote:

This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

If you watch Dr. Grier's discussion, he states that they have " seen " mercury

binding to testosterone and have test results which back that up -- listen to

the video -- especially those of you who understrand medical terminology.

Once the mercury and testosterone are stuck togethor, the mercury can't be

chelated. Only way is to knock out the testosterone.

Can someone please give the other side -- why this may not work? Why it may

be dangerous ...

Again, watch the short videos. Autiemom4 provided a link below.

Cochran <Ladyshrink111@...> wrote:

Talk to Andy, he seems to think that there are reasons not to use Lupron. Drs

use lots of drugs that aren't necessarily good for people, think about the

cholesterol drugs that do lower cholesterol, but cause liver disease in an

alarming number of people.

[ ] New findings regarding autism

Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify before

the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537, authored by

Senator Hensley. The bill reads as such, " Children 8 years

old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not receive vaccine

containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public health

emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident. Penalties

and civil liability listed. " http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

E8F

While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak at the

Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu visit,

they did not have handouts but did have their computer with

powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes. Since then,

I have found a similar presentation (that they had given in the

recent past) online at http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four segments of

this talk

They feel they have found a definite link in high levels of

testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury from

vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that general

statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that prevents

normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually affect

testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds to

mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics cannot get

rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's a vicious

cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps that

aren't in this video presentation if you would want them. Just let

me know.

Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

(successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose mercury but

not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an additional

treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven children (ages 4-

9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron Depot

(there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the test

program). Lupron decreases the body's production of testosterone.

Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of chelation to

remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved dramatically in

the children being tested. He presented pictures and school reports

of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old student went

from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to sit in a

swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills on his

school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative student who

has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school now,

and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

Administering Lupron does not come without its problems. The

question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron when

he/she is supposed to naturally be going through puberty? " Because

this study has only gone on for a short time, that question cannot

be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently doing

trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question arises, " When do

we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? " It is also

costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on the cost.

On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the US Public

Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the removal of

thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment from the

FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on this

recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation banning

vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California, Delaware,

Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since August of

2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas has

rapidly decreased.

They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have implications

with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in the

brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy metals.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

Yes, this is my understanding, and I think most of the original

patients were ones who tested as toxic but didn't improve with

chelation. Chelation and improving methylation pathways both lower

testoterone on their own. The Geier's assertion is that they are

not as effective as Lupron. I will test my son's testoterone, but

we are getting great improvements with these methods, so I'm not

sure that messing wiht Lupron is going to be warranted for us. If

you can lower testoterone and get the metals out without it, then I

say more power to you.

Ruth

> Hi,

> If you read the article below they are currently doing a study

on 13 and 14 year olds.

> Does anyone have their web page?

> [ ] New findings regarding autism

>

>

> Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify

before

> the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537,

authored by

> Senator Hensley. The bill reads as

such, " Children 8 years

> old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not

receive vaccine

> containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public

health

> emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident.

Penalties

> and civil liability listed. "

http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

>

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

> E8F

>

> While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak

at the

> Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu

visit,

> they did not have handouts but did have their computer

with

> powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes.

Since then,

> I have found a similar presentation (that they had given

in the

> recent past) online at

http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

> You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four

segments of

> this talk

>

> They feel they have found a definite link in high levels

of

> testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury

from

> vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that

general

> statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that

prevents

> normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually

affect

> testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds

to

> mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics

cannot get

> rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's

a vicious

> cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

>

> I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps

that

> aren't in this video presentation if you would want them.

Just let

> me know.

>

> Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

> (successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose

mercury but

> not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an

additional

> treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven

children (ages 4-

> 9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron

Depot

> (there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the

test

> program). Lupron decreases the body's production of

testosterone.

> Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of

chelation to

> remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

> subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved

dramatically in

> the children being tested. He presented pictures and

school reports

> of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old

student went

> from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to

sit in a

> swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills

on his

> school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative

student who

> has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school

now,

> and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

>

> Administering Lupron does not come without its problems.

The

> question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron

when

> he/she is supposed to naturally be going through

puberty? " Because

> this study has only gone on for a short time, that

question cannot

> be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently

doing

> trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question

arises, " When do

> we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? "

It is also

> costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on

the cost.

>

> On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the

US Public

> Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the

removal of

> thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment

from the

> FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on

this

> recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation

banning

> vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California,

Delaware,

> Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since

August of

> 2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas

has

> rapidly decreased.

>

> They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have

implications

> with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in

the

> brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy

metals.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> =======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

See comments.

lvchefmel <lvchefmel@...> wrote: I don't know much about this, really

haven't read it...but if mercury can't be chelated when bonded to testosterone

then why are so many getting mercury out per test results?

This is the problem -- not all are getting mercury out. Autistic symptoms

remain and so does the mercury because it is stuck to testosterone.

It could just come back to how Hg has effected certain kids. We all know our

kids are very similar but still very different with their issues. Some are

aggressive and others are not. Maybe those who are aggressive have mercury

bonded to their hormones, Hg is known to affect hormones. Not sure?

The danger likely lies in the giving of hormones and the possible fallout of

that and the fact that they come from a pharmacutical company and everything

they say has to be taken with a chunk of salt...safety data for instance. I

would want to know what exactly is happening on a cellular level and know that

messing with these hormones isn't going to have major lasting problems. I know

of too many issues women have when their hormones are not balanced. I would not

be comfortable messing with such an important area without a serious amount of

research.

Agreed -- research, research research

Just thoughts,

Abid Khan <a_bit_solutions@...> wrote:

This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

If you watch Dr. Grier's discussion, he states that they have " seen " mercury

binding to testosterone and have test results which back that up -- listen to

the video -- especially those of you who understrand medical terminology.

Once the mercury and testosterone are stuck togethor, the mercury can't be

chelated. Only way is to knock out the testosterone.

Can someone please give the other side -- why this may not work? Why it may

be dangerous ...

Again, watch the short videos. Autiemom4 provided a link below.

Cochran <Ladyshrink111@...> wrote:

Talk to Andy, he seems to think that there are reasons not to use Lupron. Drs

use lots of drugs that aren't necessarily good for people, think about the

cholesterol drugs that do lower cholesterol, but cause liver disease in an

alarming number of people.

[ ] New findings regarding autism

Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify before

the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537, authored by

Senator Hensley. The bill reads as such, " Children 8 years

old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not receive vaccine

containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public health

emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident. Penalties

and civil liability listed. " http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

E8F

While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak at the

Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu visit,

they did not have handouts but did have their computer with

powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes. Since then,

I have found a similar presentation (that they had given in the

recent past) online at http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four segments of

this talk

They feel they have found a definite link in high levels of

testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury from

vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that general

statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that prevents

normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually affect

testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds to

mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics cannot get

rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's a vicious

cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps that

aren't in this video presentation if you would want them. Just let

me know.

Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

(successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose mercury but

not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an additional

treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven children (ages 4-

9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron Depot

(there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the test

program). Lupron decreases the body's production of testosterone.

Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of chelation to

remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved dramatically in

the children being tested. He presented pictures and school reports

of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old student went

from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to sit in a

swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills on his

school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative student who

has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school now,

and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

Administering Lupron does not come without its problems. The

question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron when

he/she is supposed to naturally be going through puberty? " Because

this study has only gone on for a short time, that question cannot

be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently doing

trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question arises, " When do

we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? " It is also

costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on the cost.

On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the US Public

Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the removal of

thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment from the

FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on this

recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation banning

vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California, Delaware,

Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since August of

2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas has

rapidly decreased.

They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have implications

with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in the

brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy metals.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

I am hoping that Andy (or anyone) can elaborate on Andy's statement:

" The theory that testosterone ties up the mercury and keeps it there is

insane " .

Why is it insane? I hope someone can elaborate.

In addition, Andy states:

" The question as always is whether there is some reason to take it - an

indication in medical terms - more specific than being autistic. "

The indication in medical terms to use Lupron-Depot (or something else) is to

reduce testosterone levels to make chelation more effective. Dr. Grier in his

video discusses evidence of testosterone attaching itself to mercury which will

not allow chelation.

lanellici <lanellici@...> wrote:

>

> This is really worth discussing. Andy, (or anyone) please chime in.

Here's post #153888:

The theory that testosterone ties up the mercury and keeps it there is

insane. Also the theory that testosterone creates the susceptibility

in some direct sense.

Also Lupron does NOT simply reduce testosterone. It does a lot more

complicated stuff than that.

I have heard positive reports from its use.

I generally consider messing with steroid metabolism in children to be

fraught with risk of messing up their sexual development so I suggest

great caution in using Lupron.

However I don't suggest people automatically avoid it.

The question as always is whether there is some reason to take it - an

indication in medical terms - more specific than being autistic.

Andy

[let me make a big plug for onibasu -- Andy's not here much but you

can often find his posts on nearly every subject on onibasu...

Nell

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

I agree with Ruth.

I have some questions for anyone who can help:

I have been looking for side-effects of Lupron-Depot in children but only

found minor issues.

Does anyone have a pointer to a page listing side-effects of Lupron Depot-PED?

I have read many items about the many side-effects in ADULTS using Lupron.

Is adult Lupron the same as the child version?

How long has Lupron Depot-PED been used for kids?

Ruth <dan-ruth-setlak@...> wrote:

Yes, this is my understanding, and I think most of the original

patients were ones who tested as toxic but didn't improve with

chelation. Chelation and improving methylation pathways both lower

testoterone on their own. The Geier's assertion is that they are

not as effective as Lupron. I will test my son's testoterone, but

we are getting great improvements with these methods, so I'm not

sure that messing wiht Lupron is going to be warranted for us. If

you can lower testoterone and get the metals out without it, then I

say more power to you.

Ruth

> Hi,

> If you read the article below they are currently doing a study

on 13 and 14 year olds.

> Does anyone have their web page?

> [ ] New findings regarding autism

>

>

> Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to testify

before

> the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537,

authored by

> Senator Hensley. The bill reads as

such, " Children 8 years

> old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not

receive vaccine

> containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential public

health

> emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident.

Penalties

> and civil liability listed. "

http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

>

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

> E8F

>

> While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak

at the

> Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an impromptu

visit,

> they did not have handouts but did have their computer

with

> powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes.

Since then,

> I have found a similar presentation (that they had given

in the

> recent past) online at

http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

> You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four

segments of

> this talk

>

> They feel they have found a definite link in high levels

of

> testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury

from

> vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that

general

> statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that

prevents

> normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually

affect

> testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone binds

to

> mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics

cannot get

> rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people. It's

a vicious

> cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

>

> I do have written notes that may fill in some of the gaps

that

> aren't in this video presentation if you would want them.

Just let

> me know.

>

> Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

> (successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose

mercury but

> not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an

additional

> treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven

children (ages 4-

> 9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron

Depot

> (there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in the

test

> program). Lupron decreases the body's production of

testosterone.

> Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of

chelation to

> remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the test

> subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved

dramatically in

> the children being tested. He presented pictures and

school reports

> of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old

student went

> from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance to

sit in a

> swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills

on his

> school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative

student who

> has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at school

now,

> and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

>

> Administering Lupron does not come without its problems.

The

> question arises " What happens to a child receiving Lupron

when

> he/she is supposed to naturally be going through

puberty? " Because

> this study has only gone on for a short time, that

question cannot

> be answered yet in how to handle that. They are currently

doing

> trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question

arises, " When do

> we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? "

It is also

> costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on

the cost.

>

> On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and the

US Public

> Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the

removal of

> thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment

from the

> FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on

this

> recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation

banning

> vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California,

Delaware,

> Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since

August of

> 2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these areas

has

> rapidly decreased.

>

> They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have

implications

> with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven in

the

> brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy

metals.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> =======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

Accoeding to the Geier's they say there are many more side effects

in adults including low libido, etc. They say these are not the same

for children. I too woudl like to look into the side effects, but

was having the same difficulty - only fiding side effects in women

who use it for endometroisis or for men.

RUth

> > Hi,

> > If you read the article below they are currently doing a study

> on 13 and 14 year olds.

> > Does anyone have their web page?

> > [ ] New findings regarding autism

> >

> >

> > Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to

testify

> before

> > the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No. 537,

> authored by

> > Senator Hensley. The bill reads as

> such, " Children 8 years

> > old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not

> receive vaccine

> > containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential

public

> health

> > emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident.

> Penalties

> > and civil liability listed. "

> http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

> >

>

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

> > E8F

> >

> > While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to speak

> at the

> > Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an

impromptu

> visit,

> > they did not have handouts but did have their computer

> with

> > powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take notes.

> Since then,

> > I have found a similar presentation (that they had given

> in the

> > recent past) online at

> http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

> > You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four

> segments of

> > this talk

> >

> > They feel they have found a definite link in high levels

> of

> > testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury

> from

> > vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that

> general

> > statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link that

> prevents

> > normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually

> affect

> > testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone

binds

> to

> > mercury and increases levels left in the body. Autistics

> cannot get

> > rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people.

It's

> a vicious

> > cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the video.

> >

> > I do have written notes that may fill in some of the

gaps

> that

> > aren't in this video presentation if you would want

them.

> Just let

> > me know.

> >

> > Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by many

> > (successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose

> mercury but

> > not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an

> additional

> > treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven

> children (ages 4-

> > 9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using Lupron

> Depot

> > (there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in

the

> test

> > program). Lupron decreases the body's production of

> testosterone.

> > Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of

> chelation to

> > remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the

test

> > subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved

> dramatically in

> > the children being tested. He presented pictures and

> school reports

> > of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old

> student went

> > from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance

to

> sit in a

> > swing, who was only able to master a hand full of skills

> on his

> > school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative

> student who

> > has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at

school

> now,

> > and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

> >

> > Administering Lupron does not come without its

problems.

> The

> > question arises " What happens to a child receiving

Lupron

> when

> > he/she is supposed to naturally be going through

> puberty? " Because

> > this study has only gone on for a short time, that

> question cannot

> > be answered yet in how to handle that. They are

currently

> doing

> > trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question

> arises, " When do

> > we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should we? "

> It is also

> > costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up on

> the cost.

> >

> > On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and

the

> US Public

> > Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the

> removal of

> > thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment

> from the

> > FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting on

> this

> > recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation

> banning

> > vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California,

> Delaware,

> > Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since

> August of

> > 2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these

areas

> has

> > rapidly decreased.

> >

> > They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have

> implications

> > with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven

in

> the

> > brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of heavy

> metals.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > =======================================================

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 15/03/2006 20:04:57 GMT Standard Time, lanellici@...

writes:

On FAIR AUtism Media they have an interview with Rev. Sykes,

> who saiys that her child is being treated by the Geier's and is

> making improvements. Her chidl actually tested high in mercury

> (they show the tests), yet he sis not improve wiht chelation, but

> was still nonverbal. It coudl have bene the protocal, though you

> would think they would have seen some improvement.

>>>They were chelating many years, back when peeps did oral DMSA/ALA, he did

progress but not as much as he should. Same as Sam - I have done 104 rounds

now (and 9 months of Buttar), I thought 2 years and 50 round I'd be enrolling

him in mainstream.

He still does not have words, he still has metals coming out, he IS

actually on a roll right now, he is the best ever actually

yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

LDN is all positives no negatives s far 6 days in <- that is a REALLY BIG

smikle in cas eyou were wondering.

Ye olde timer Mandi fom UK

Mum to Sam 47XYY, Autism, Heavy Metal Toxicity, Possible Seizure DIsorder &

Severe Cuteness:)

[Guest guest]

>

> This is the problem -- not all are getting mercury out. Autistic

symptoms remain and so does the mercury because it is stuck to

testosterone.

At least that's Geier's theory. I'd be curious to know what chelators

and which protocol these kids were using. Chelation doesn't work for

about 25% of autistic kids -- because those kids aren't Hg-toxic.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember people here

meeting the counting rules and not improving from chelation. I

remember cases in which chelation didn't help, but weren't those hair

tests not definitive?

Nell

[Guest guest]

We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during the

night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all the

time (sorry to be graphic) day or night. We don't think this is

normal. He doesn't have pubic hairs yet, but has big thick dark

eyebrows and a pretty hairy back. His voice is huskier than his twin

NT brother, and has larger mojo. He grew much taller, and is

physically extremely powerful for his age, and he looks it. He is

not fat, just very muscular, probably from stimming & climbing. Kids

a year older than him are afraid of him on the playground. So I'm

not too worried about my son loosing his mojo at this age. He's

already got quite a head start I think. I'm more worried about his

little brain.

Mark

> > > Hi,

> > > If you read the article below they are currently doing a

study

> > on 13 and 14 year olds.

> > > Does anyone have their web page?

> > > [ ] New findings regarding autism

> > >

> > >

> > > Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to

> testify

> > before

> > > the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No.

537,

> > authored by

> > > Senator Hensley. The bill reads as

> > such, " Children 8 years

> > > old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not

> > receive vaccine

> > > containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential

> public

> > health

> > > emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident.

> > Penalties

> > > and civil liability listed. "

> > http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

> > >

> >

>

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

> > > E8F

> > >

> > > While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to

speak

> > at the

> > > Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an

> impromptu

> > visit,

> > > they did not have handouts but did have their computer

> > with

> > > powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take

notes.

> > Since then,

> > > I have found a similar presentation (that they had

given

> > in the

> > > recent past) online at

> > http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

> > > You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four

> > segments of

> > > this talk

> > >

> > > They feel they have found a definite link in high

levels

> > of

> > > testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury

> > from

> > > vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that

> > general

> > > statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link

that

> > prevents

> > > normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually

> > affect

> > > testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone

> binds

> > to

> > > mercury and increases levels left in the body.

Autistics

> > cannot get

> > > rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people.

> It's

> > a vicious

> > > cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the

video.

> > >

> > > I do have written notes that may fill in some of the

> gaps

> > that

> > > aren't in this video presentation if you would want

> them.

> > Just let

> > > me know.

> > >

> > > Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by

many

> > > (successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose

> > mercury but

> > > not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an

> > additional

> > > treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven

> > children (ages 4-

> > > 9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using

Lupron

> > Depot

> > > (there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in

> the

> > test

> > > program). Lupron decreases the body's production of

> > testosterone.

> > > Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of

> > chelation to

> > > remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the

> test

> > > subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved

> > dramatically in

> > > the children being tested. He presented pictures and

> > school reports

> > > of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old

> > student went

> > > from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance

> to

> > sit in a

> > > swing, who was only able to master a hand full of

skills

> > on his

> > > school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative

> > student who

> > > has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at

> school

> > now,

> > > and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

> > >

> > > Administering Lupron does not come without its

> problems.

> > The

> > > question arises " What happens to a child receiving

> Lupron

> > when

> > > he/she is supposed to naturally be going through

> > puberty? " Because

> > > this study has only gone on for a short time, that

> > question cannot

> > > be answered yet in how to handle that. They are

> currently

> > doing

> > > trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question

> > arises, " When do

> > > we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should

we? "

> > It is also

> > > costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up

on

> > the cost.

> > >

> > > On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and

> the

> > US Public

> > > Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the

> > removal of

> > > thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment

> > from the

> > > FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting

on

> > this

> > > recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation

> > banning

> > > vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California,

> > Delaware,

> > > Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since

> > August of

> > > 2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these

> areas

> > has

> > > rapidly decreased.

> > >

> > > They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have

> > implications

> > > with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven

> in

> > the

> > > brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of

heavy

> > metals.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > =======================================================

> > >

[Guest guest]

Mark,

Why don't you test him?

redrackem <redrackem@...> wrote:

We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during the

night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all the

time (sorry to be graphic) day or night. We don't think this is

normal. He doesn't have pubic hairs yet, but has big thick dark

eyebrows and a pretty hairy back. His voice is huskier than his twin

NT brother, and has larger mojo. He grew much taller, and is

physically extremely powerful for his age, and he looks it. He is

not fat, just very muscular, probably from stimming & climbing. Kids

a year older than him are afraid of him on the playground. So I'm

not too worried about my son loosing his mojo at this age. He's

already got quite a head start I think. I'm more worried about his

little brain.

Mark

> > > Hi,

> > > If you read the article below they are currently doing a

study

> > on 13 and 14 year olds.

> > > Does anyone have their web page?

> > > [ ] New findings regarding autism

> > >

> > >

> > > Dr. Mark Geier and his son, , were in town to

> testify

> > before

> > > the Kansas Senate regarding Kansas Bill Subject No.

537,

> > authored by

> > > Senator Hensley. The bill reads as

> > such, " Children 8 years

> > > old or under and knowingly pregnant women; shall not

> > receive vaccine

> > > containing mercury; exemptions; actual or potential

> public

> > health

> > > emergency or actual or potential bioterrorist incident.

> > Penalties

> > > and civil liability listed. "

> > http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-

> > >

> >

>

billSubj/searchBillNumber.do;jsessionid=47708B5F42E22CEBF5F8086A532A8

> > > E8F

> > >

> > > While in town, Dr. Geier and were invited to

speak

> > at the

> > > Autism Asperger Resource Center. As this was an

> impromptu

> > visit,

> > > they did not have handouts but did have their computer

> > with

> > > powerpoint. I frantically wrote and wrote to take

notes.

> > Since then,

> > > I have found a similar presentation (that they had

given

> > in the

> > > recent past) online at

> > http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

> > > You will find it very valuable to go listen to all four

> > segments of

> > > this talk

> > >

> > > They feel they have found a definite link in high

levels

> > of

> > > testosterone and autism (which are affected by mercury

> > from

> > > vaccines). That is simplifying it too much to make that

> > general

> > > statement, but it all has to do with a genetic link

that

> > prevents

> > > normal metabolism of certain enzymes that eventually

> > affect

> > > testosterone levels (increasing them). Testosterone

> binds

> > to

> > > mercury and increases levels left in the body.

Autistics

> > cannot get

> > > rid of mercury in their urine like " normal " people.

> It's

> > a vicious

> > > cycle that makes more sense when you listen to the

video.

> > >

> > > I do have written notes that may fill in some of the

> gaps

> > that

> > > aren't in this video presentation if you would want

> them.

> > Just let

> > > me know.

> > >

> > > Oral chelating therapy has been used in the past by

many

> > > (successfully and unsuccessfully because it binds loose

> > mercury but

> > > not imbedded mercury), but Dr. Mark Geier recommends an

> > additional

> > > treatment to this protocol. He has treated eleven

> > children (ages 4-

> > > 9) from November 2004 through February 2005 using

Lupron

> > Depot

> > > (there is an eligibility assessment for enrollment in

> the

> > test

> > > program). Lupron decreases the body's production of

> > testosterone.

> > > Testosterone suppression might increase the efficacy of

> > chelation to

> > > remove mercury. MARKED RESULTS HAVE COME ABOUT in the

> test

> > > subjects. Cognitive and sociability have improved

> > dramatically in

> > > the children being tested. He presented pictures and

> > school reports

> > > of pre- and post- treatment children. One 9 year old

> > student went

> > > from nonverbal, flat affect, who couldn't even balance

> to

> > sit in a

> > > swing, who was only able to master a hand full of

skills

> > on his

> > > school assessment, to becoming a talking, communicative

> > student who

> > > has mastered 90% of the skills for his age level at

> school

> > now,

> > > and " asks " to be pushed in the swing.

> > >

> > > Administering Lupron does not come without its

> problems.

> > The

> > > question arises " What happens to a child receiving

> Lupron

> > when

> > > he/she is supposed to naturally be going through

> > puberty? " Because

> > > this study has only gone on for a short time, that

> > question cannot

> > > be answered yet in how to handle that. They are

> currently

> > doing

> > > trials on 13 and 14 year olds. Also, the question

> > arises, " When do

> > > we stop administering the Lupron, or can we/should

we? "

> > It is also

> > > costly, about $1500/month but HMO's currently pick up

on

> > the cost.

> > >

> > > On July 7, 1999 the American Academy of Pediatrics and

> the

> > US Public

> > > Health Service issued a joint statement calling for the

> > removal of

> > > thimerosal from vaccines, prompted by a risk assessment

> > from the

> > > FDA. However, they are working very slowly at acting

on

> > this

> > > recommendation. Currently, six states have legislation

> > banning

> > > vaccines with thimerosal (Missouri, Iowa, California,

> > Delaware,

> > > Illinois, and New York). England has banned it since

> > August of

> > > 2004. The incidence of new cases of autism in these

> areas

> > has

> > > rapidly decreased.

> > >

> > > They are suspiciuos that this finding could even have

> > implications

> > > with diseases like Alzheimers' where it has been proven

> in

> > the

> > > brains of corpses that they had elevated levels of

heavy

> > metals.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > =======================================================

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Abid;

We have an appt w/ the DAN tomorrow in fact, and I will ask for

testosterone levels test.

Mark

> We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during the

> night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all the

<snip>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 15/03/2006 22:29:23 GMT Standard Time, lanellici@...

writes:

> LDN is all positives no negatives s far 6 days in <- that is a

REALLY BIG

> smikle in cas eyou were wondering.

Yay for Sam! What effects are you seeing?

>>>Increaed socialisation, wnating to play with us and sbs rather than watch

video, more oral motor imitation, using new signs (sentances), atributes on

his PECS request (sentances) he has not used before, up to all sorts of new

mischief, and increaed receptive langauage. So excited and scared it may stop

at the same time

Mandi in UK

Mum to Sam 47XYY, Autism, Heavy Metal Toxicity, Possible Seizure DIsorder &

Severe Cuteness:)

[Guest guest]

Hello Mark,

I am doing something similar.

I am sceptical that my DAN will do this test/treatment but I'll try. As an

alternative you can go to your kids pediatrician and tell him you suspect

" Precocious Puberty " because of the reasons you mentioned.

If the tests come out positive, then they will treat him. Dr. Geier uses the

" standard treatment for Precocious Puberty " for his patients. He uses this with

DMSA.

I don't know what protocal he uses but want to find out.

However, note that " normal " kids with Precocious Puberty have high FSH & LH

with high testosterone. Autistic kids have LOW FSH & LH with high testosterone.

The only way this can happen is if the kid has a brain tumor -- which he does

not. Just beware that the pediatrician might scare you and insist on a check-up

for a brain tumor.

Initially, all I want are test results -- not yet sure as to the treatment.

Lots of luck.

redrackem <redrackem@...> wrote:

Hi Abid;

We have an appt w/ the DAN tomorrow in fact, and I will ask for

testosterone levels test.

Mark

> We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during the

> night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all the

<snip>

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

Hi Abdi;

I am also skeptical - our DAN doc sort of scoffs at ideas that I

present from newsgroups. He only believes in TD-DMPS and MB12 and

nothing else can ever be useful, seems like.

Brain tumor - you're seriously scaring me now. I guess these levels

are just something that autistic kids have in common with brain tumor

patients?

I worry seriously about the tumor thing already because my kid's SCFA

test showed extremely high acetate and low butyrate - an condition

predictive of colon cancer.

http://tinyurl.com/raj4s

Mark

> > We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during

the

> > night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all

the

>

>

> <snip>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> =======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

THe Geier's use DMSA, but i " m not sure which protocal - probably not

Andy's, as I have yet to find a doc that promotes it as their

primary protocal. THey do a battery of tests to determine whether

the child qualifies, so I don' thtink they are saying this is the

answer for everyone. High testoterone is one criteria.

On FAIR AUtism Media they have an interview with Rev. Sykes,

who saiys that her child is being treated by the Geier's and is

making improvements. Her chidl actually tested high in mercury

(they show the tests), yet he sis not improve wiht chelation, but

was still nonverbal. It coudl have bene the protocal, though you

would think they would have seen some improvement. Soes anyone know

what tests they are using to determine mercury toxicity?

My husband was very excited to do this treatment after seeing the

Geier's talk, and what they show IS compelling. I, however, will sit

back and watch for awhile. I wish Andy or someone else would

actually tackle of the science of it, if they are going to discredit

it. This would help us a ton. And, if there is information about

negative effects of Lupron for kids, please help us and give us the

link. (BTW, this is the same I feel for Andy's protocal. The fact

that noone has ever tried to discredit the science or come up with

an alternative plan that is backed by science bothers me. Either

have something solid with which to refute it, or don't ding it!)

For me, again, we are getting great improvement with chelation and

the addition of ALA on Andy's protocal has been marvelous. I don't

see the point in taking additional risks if I don't have to, so I'm

reigning in my husband on this one.

Incidentally, if someone doesn't meet the counting rules, and

doesn't make progress with chelation, what would you all recommend?

Looking at viral issues? HBOT?

Ruth

> >

> > This is the problem -- not all are getting mercury out.

Autistic

> symptoms remain and so does the mercury because it is stuck to

> testosterone.

>

> At least that's Geier's theory. I'd be curious to know what

chelators

> and which protocol these kids were using. Chelation doesn't work

for

> about 25% of autistic kids -- because those kids aren't Hg-toxic.

> Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember people here

> meeting the counting rules and not improving from chelation. I

> remember cases in which chelation didn't help, but weren't those

hair

> tests not definitive?

>

> Nell

>

[Guest guest]

Mark,

Sorry to scare about the brain tumor thing. Got that from Dr. Geier's video.

The results of low FSH and LH with high testosterone mean possibility of brain

tumor for standard doctors. However, in the case of certain autistic kids it

means mercury is holding on to the testosterone -- not brain tumor.

redrackem <redrackem@...> wrote:

Hi Abdi;

I am also skeptical - our DAN doc sort of scoffs at ideas that I

present from newsgroups. He only believes in TD-DMPS and MB12 and

nothing else can ever be useful, seems like.

Brain tumor - you're seriously scaring me now. I guess these levels

are just something that autistic kids have in common with brain tumor

patients?

I worry seriously about the tumor thing already because my kid's SCFA

test showed extremely high acetate and low butyrate - an condition

predictive of colon cancer.

http://tinyurl.com/raj4s

Mark

> > We change our little boys (ASD 3.5 YO) a couple times during

the

> > night (to avoid wet sheets). Anyways he's got wood nearly all

the

>

>

> <snip>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> =======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

> On FAIR AUtism Media they have an interview with Rev. Sykes,

> who saiys that her child is being treated by the Geier's and is

> making improvements. Her chidl actually tested high in mercury

> (they show the tests), yet he sis not improve wiht chelation, but

> was still nonverbal. It coudl have bene the protocal, though you

> would think they would have seen some improvement.

I've read plenty of parent reports of TD-DMPS doing nothing, and then

when they switch to AC's protocol with ALA, steady improvement. Glad

her child is doing better though.

> Incidentally, if someone doesn't meet the counting rules, and

> doesn't make progress with chelation, what would you all recommend?

> Looking at viral issues? HBOT?

Andy has mentioned viral as being the next step, plus some other

things like brain autoimmunity? I may not have that right.

And I'm so with you on the dissing Andy's method with no science, no

nothing to back it up. It's so frustrating.

Nell

[Guest guest]

> LDN is all positives no negatives s far 6 days in <- that is a

REALLY BIG

> smikle in cas eyou were wondering.

Yay for Sam! What effects are you seeing?

Nell

[Guest guest]

> Incidentally, if someone doesn't meet the counting rules, and

> doesn't make progress with chelation, what would you all recommend?

> Looking at viral issues? HBOT?

My son made improvements with chelation, but the improvements

disappeared after several weeks. Certain supplements, especially

anti-virals, are causing the improvements to come back. So I vote for

anti-virals.

Dana