Re: I'm reading The Late Talker...

[Guest guest]

In response to 's post below, I agree that it's good to debate

this here respectfully but I completely disagree that we should come

up with an " intelligent answer for the majority. " There is NO

intelligent answer for the majority. This is way too personal of a

decision. And it alarms me that the initiator of the CHERAB

discussion group would want to alienate (potential homeschooling)

moms from this board by coming up with what you believe is an

intelligent answer for the majority. I think it'd be best whenever a

mom posts with questions like this to direct her to posts that lay

out all the options, and to hear from all sides.

>

> I don't believe anyone is offended and why not continue to discuss

> this here so we can as a group come up with an intelligent answer

for

> the majority. Yes some home school and that's great -but let's

recap

> as this topic has twisted from the original message posted which was

> in regards to information in The Late Talker book. Since I'm one of

> the co authors I wish to clarify.

>

> While some of the aspects of The Late Talker can be applied to older

> children -the book is geared for parents of preschool children who

> are not yet talking for known or unknown reasons referred to by

> society as " late talkers " -thus the name of the book. I repeatedly

> said " preschool " and yet this debate somehow has transcended into a

> debate over home schooling for K-12. So let me be clear (again)

that

> a preschool disabled program is not about education -and it's not

> about social for an apraxic child -it's about a special program that

> helps with that child's fine and gross motor skills and

> communication. If after reading one persons thoughts some of you

> wish to consider this route that's your prerogative. Just like

> anything else that is debated here -there is no question in my mind

> that some of you will be sorry. You can be wrong -but you can't go

> back and do preschool years over. I would understand this passion

> for home schooling preschool apraxic children if there was an

example

> of a child that was thriving today -older -yet severe profound

> apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert cricket sound here) On

the other hand

> tons of children from this group have gone the preschool disabled

> program route and (again) the main problems is securing the

> appropriate services through the IEP -not social aspects -and not

> rude people (outside of some of the people at the IEP meeting at

> times but that's besides the point)

>

> There is so much more to preschool disabled programs than " hearing

> other children speak " or " socialization " as a child can get that

> at 'any' preschool or local park. An appropriate placement will get

> your PRESCHOOL apraxic child up to speed so that you can make that

> choice whether homeschooling or private schooling or public

schooling

> will be best for that child (not us as parents) from K-12.

>

> My 11 yo son is just one of hundreds that are thriving today.

> (and his preschool was Summit Speech School in New Providence NJ)

>

> I WISH SSS went up to HS!!

>

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

do you honestly believe I'm writing just about my own

experiences? This group is not just made up from people like me

that lived in NJ -nor just from the US -so check the archives as I'm

stating what has worked for the majority for years.

But speaking of me -when we were in NJ back when Tanner was in

preschool we too lived in a large metropolitan area -and our town

school which was a blue ribbon school district did not have

appropriate preschool placement for my son. So was my option to home

school? No way!!! I advocated and proved that in district

preschool was not appropriate placement and secured out of district

placement for him at the Summit Speech School for his preschool

placement. This was written into his IEP and it was paid for in

full by our town. What you seek is appropriate placement -commuting

a 3 year old 2 hours a day would not be appropriate. Out of district

placement will place your child in another public school -or private

school that is appropriate if your local town can't provide what is

needed.

Certainly none of us would accept someone that is not a qualified

speech language pathologist providing speech therapy on our child

(some didn't even allow professionals to work with their child if

they weren't PROMPT trained etc) or to allow someone that is not an

occupational therapist to provide occupational therapy. Many of us

here in the past were furious if the special ed teacher felt she

could provide our preschool child's speech therapy -and as the

archives stated -we fought that and won. And speaking of special ed

teachers -none of us would accept a regular teacher as our child's

preschool special education teacher as you require a teacher that has

specific qualifications and training. Not only that but many of us

checked with special ed attorneys in our area and from there you can

learn where the most appropriate placement would be for your child as

many of them have heard it all before. They can provide you with a

list of public schools with the least amount of law suits filed

against them -the schools they find to be better -which private

schools are the ones that others seek due to high success rates. For

sure most of us here in the past would assume that we as parents no

matter how much we love our child are capable of providing

appropriate therapy and strategies as provided in an appropriate

preschool placement.

Once you get your child through preschool -again then decide what is

best for k-12.

=====

[Guest guest]

Especially since no one in the thread asked for permission to

homeschool. The thread was started with someone asking why it was not

written about in conjunction with sped options.

> >

> > I don't believe anyone is offended and why not continue to discuss

> > this here so we can as a group come up with an intelligent answer

> for

> > the majority. Yes some home school and that's great -but let's

> recap

> > as this topic has twisted from the original message posted which

was

> > in regards to information in The Late Talker book. Since I'm one

of

> > the co authors I wish to clarify.

> >

> > While some of the aspects of The Late Talker can be applied to

older

> > children -the book is geared for parents of preschool children who

> > are not yet talking for known or unknown reasons referred to by

> > society as " late talkers " -thus the name of the book. I

repeatedly

> > said " preschool " and yet this debate somehow has transcended into

a

> > debate over home schooling for K-12. So let me be clear (again)

> that

> > a preschool disabled program is not about education -and it's not

> > about social for an apraxic child -it's about a special program

that

> > helps with that child's fine and gross motor skills and

> > communication. If after reading one persons thoughts some of you

> > wish to consider this route that's your prerogative. Just like

> > anything else that is debated here -there is no question in my

mind

> > that some of you will be sorry. You can be wrong -but you can't

go

> > back and do preschool years over. I would understand this passion

> > for home schooling preschool apraxic children if there was an

> example

> > of a child that was thriving today -older -yet severe profound

> > apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert cricket sound here)

On

> the other hand

> > tons of children from this group have gone the preschool disabled

> > program route and (again) the main problems is securing the

> > appropriate services through the IEP -not social aspects -and not

> > rude people (outside of some of the people at the IEP meeting at

> > times but that's besides the point)

> >

> > There is so much more to preschool disabled programs than " hearing

> > other children speak " or " socialization " as a child can get that

> > at 'any' preschool or local park. An appropriate placement will

get

> > your PRESCHOOL apraxic child up to speed so that you can make that

> > choice whether homeschooling or private schooling or public

> schooling

> > will be best for that child (not us as parents) from K-12.

> >

> > My 11 yo son is just one of hundreds that are thriving today.

> > (and his preschool was Summit Speech School in New Providence NJ)

> >

> > I WISH SSS went up to HS!!

> >

> >

> > =====

> >

[Guest guest]

I should have never brought this up. My kid had apraxic and AP signs

and lost words after shots and a surgery. He is and always has been a

puzzle. At the time that was stated to us he was talking but doing a

selective mutism thing. For a good while he has had the ability to

make all sounds and recently can put most but not all togeher. He has

tubes in his ears, did TLP, is on a GFCFSF diet and has some fish oil

and great pains are made to get and keep vitamins in him and he was

recently taken off probiotics. Whether this progress continues

remains to be seen but at the time the fen for himself asssessent was

made it was, in part, accurate. It was proven to be true in prompt

therapy where he is pitted against his sister to fight with words for

what he wants.

>

> > The preschool value, I was told by my OT, was that they hear

other

> > kids speaking and the whole fen for themselves thing. For my kid,

the

> > reason I agreed not to wait to Sept, was the fen for himself

thing.

> > It took a lot to find the right place. I never fully bought the

hear

> > other kids talk thing since he hears his sister talk all day long.

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't have the $10K retainer to fight the good fight nor the time

to do that myself (as a lawyer). For us it is cheaper and hopefully

will prove more effective to use a portion of that same $ toward

appropriate therapy and regular preschool and homeschooling resources

as our local sped program is very different from what you describe.

By the way was my formula responses censored?

>

> do you honestly believe I'm writing just about my own

> experiences? This group is not just made up from people like me

> that lived in NJ -nor just from the US -so check the archives as I'm

> stating what has worked for the majority for years.

>

> But speaking of me -when we were in NJ back when Tanner was in

> preschool we too lived in a large metropolitan area -and our town

> school which was a blue ribbon school district did not have

> appropriate preschool placement for my son. So was my option to

home

> school? No way!!! I advocated and proved that in district

> preschool was not appropriate placement and secured out of district

> placement for him at the Summit Speech School for his preschool

> placement. This was written into his IEP and it was paid for in

> full by our town. What you seek is appropriate placement -commuting

> a 3 year old 2 hours a day would not be appropriate. Out of

district

> placement will place your child in another public school -or private

> school that is appropriate if your local town can't provide what is

> needed.

>

> Certainly none of us would accept someone that is not a qualified

> speech language pathologist providing speech therapy on our child

> (some didn't even allow professionals to work with their child if

> they weren't PROMPT trained etc) or to allow someone that is not an

> occupational therapist to provide occupational therapy. Many of us

> here in the past were furious if the special ed teacher felt she

> could provide our preschool child's speech therapy -and as the

> archives stated -we fought that and won. And speaking of special ed

> teachers -none of us would accept a regular teacher as our child's

> preschool special education teacher as you require a teacher that

has

> specific qualifications and training. Not only that but many of us

> checked with special ed attorneys in our area and from there you can

> learn where the most appropriate placement would be for your child

as

> many of them have heard it all before. They can provide you with a

> list of public schools with the least amount of law suits filed

> against them -the schools they find to be better -which private

> schools are the ones that others seek due to high success rates.

For

> sure most of us here in the past would assume that we as parents no

> matter how much we love our child are capable of providing

> appropriate therapy and strategies as provided in an appropriate

> preschool placement.

>

> Once you get your child through preschool -again then decide what is

> best for k-12.

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

The cd I was referring to mentioned getting the most out of school

and home generally. Not specific to preK just to clarify. I am not

worried as I know they give you a program and that, plus our own

stuff, drawing on the help of family and friends who know subjects

better than us, and activities plus ST should cover us enough for

now.

> >

> > They do? On the intro cd he said he pushed parents to get the most

> > out of school and do more on their own.

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I have started a public blog, there's not much onit since I just

started it today, but I welcome anyone interested to read it.

http://www.homeschoolblogger.com/profiles/momtomime/ I intend to

write about homeschooling my boys, about Aydan's therapies, and

whatever decisions I have to make in regards to his speech issue. I

really think it's important for parents to know that there are

alternatives to everything, even if it's seen by some as abnormal. I

do intend to check out the early intervention program even though

I've heard some not so good things about it from some of the people

that I know how's children are currently in it. I have to see for

myself is I think it would be beneficial for my son. I will talk to

his doctor and SLP. I intend to fight with his insurance compny is

need be to get the help he needs. I've been known to write to

elected officials to get the needs of my children met. I figure I " m

not the only person out there having these same (or similar) issues

and if no one speaks up about it, then how can we advance.

> > >

> > > Having been there done ALL of that, I would say that 'both'

> options

> > are correct.... at different times.

> > >

> > > I believe that at the preschool age, the dyspraxic/apraxic child

> > can keep up with their peer group and still find acceptance. But

> > when the child enters grade school, he/she may struggle for social

> > acceptance. This really depends on how far the individual child

> has

> > come and where he/she is in comparison to the other kids.

> > >

> > > BUT at some juncture the child may be absolutely miserable,

feel

> > isolated and alone in the school environment and this can happen

at

> > any age.... it really is 'skill' dependent. For us, this occurred

> at

> > grade 3.... a very tough year for my child.

> > >

> > > In grade 4, Mark was placed in special education but now I

regret

> > that decision and realized that he should have been homeschooled

> > instead.

> > >

> > > Thus, the realization I have is that our kids will ALWAYS thrive

> in

> > the homeschool environment but will only thrive in the regular

> school

> > if their skills sets are relatively on par with their peers or if

> > they can find acceptence socially. Otherwise they suffer torment

> and

> > bullying. This is really a horrible nightmare and must be avoided

> at

> > all costs.

> > >

> > > Do what works.... and if it isn't working, don't pussy foot

> around,

> > change it and change it fast.....

> > >

> > > Janice

> > > Mother of Mark, 13

> >

>

[Guest guest]

What is NACD? Is it in the archives? I " d like to know mor about it.

Thanks

>

> The cd I was referring to mentioned getting the most out of school

> and home generally. Not specific to preK just to clarify. I am not

> worried as I know they give you a program and that, plus our own

> stuff, drawing on the help of family and friends who know subjects

> better than us, and activities plus ST should cover us enough for

> now.

>

[Guest guest]

Where are you? We had a great EI experience.

> > > >

> > > > Having been there done ALL of that, I would say that 'both'

> > options

> > > are correct.... at different times.

> > > >

> > > > I believe that at the preschool age, the dyspraxic/apraxic

child

> > > can keep up with their peer group and still find acceptance.

But

> > > when the child enters grade school, he/she may struggle for

social

> > > acceptance. This really depends on how far the individual child

> > has

> > > come and where he/she is in comparison to the other kids.

> > > >

> > > > BUT at some juncture the child may be absolutely miserable,

> feel

> > > isolated and alone in the school environment and this can

happen

> at

> > > any age.... it really is 'skill' dependent. For us, this

occurred

> > at

> > > grade 3.... a very tough year for my child.

> > > >

> > > > In grade 4, Mark was placed in special education but now I

> regret

> > > that decision and realized that he should have been homeschooled

> > > instead.

> > > >

> > > > Thus, the realization I have is that our kids will ALWAYS

thrive

> > in

> > > the homeschool environment but will only thrive in the regular

> > school

> > > if their skills sets are relatively on par with their peers or

if

> > > they can find acceptence socially. Otherwise they suffer

torment

> > and

> > > bullying. This is really a horrible nightmare and must be

avoided

> > at

> > > all costs.

> > > >

> > > > Do what works.... and if it isn't working, don't pussy foot

> > around,

> > > change it and change it fast.....

> > > >

> > > > Janice

> > > > Mother of Mark, 13

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

http://nacd.org/tour/videosection.html

>

> What is NACD? Is it in the archives? I " d like to know mor about it.

>

> Thanks

>

[Guest guest]

An out of district placement would involve a one hour bus ride for my

son. Good sped preschools do not exist everywhere.

>

> do you honestly believe I'm writing just about my own

> experiences? This group is not just made up from people like me

> that lived in NJ -nor just from the US -so check the archives as I'm

> stating what has worked for the majority for years.

>

> But speaking of me -when we were in NJ back when Tanner was in

> preschool we too lived in a large metropolitan area -and our town

> school which was a blue ribbon school district did not have

> appropriate preschool placement for my son. So was my option to

home

> school? No way!!! I advocated and proved that in district

> preschool was not appropriate placement and secured out of district

> placement for him at the Summit Speech School for his preschool

> placement. This was written into his IEP and it was paid for in

> full by our town. What you seek is appropriate placement -commuting

> a 3 year old 2 hours a day would not be appropriate. Out of

district

> placement will place your child in another public school -or private

> school that is appropriate if your local town can't provide what is

> needed.

>

> Certainly none of us would accept someone that is not a qualified

> speech language pathologist providing speech therapy on our child

> (some didn't even allow professionals to work with their child if

> they weren't PROMPT trained etc) or to allow someone that is not an

> occupational therapist to provide occupational therapy. Many of us

> here in the past were furious if the special ed teacher felt she

> could provide our preschool child's speech therapy -and as the

> archives stated -we fought that and won. And speaking of special ed

> teachers -none of us would accept a regular teacher as our child's

> preschool special education teacher as you require a teacher that

has

> specific qualifications and training. Not only that but many of us

> checked with special ed attorneys in our area and from there you can

> learn where the most appropriate placement would be for your child

as

> many of them have heard it all before. They can provide you with a

> list of public schools with the least amount of law suits filed

> against them -the schools they find to be better -which private

> schools are the ones that others seek due to high success rates.

For

> sure most of us here in the past would assume that we as parents no

> matter how much we love our child are capable of providing

> appropriate therapy and strategies as provided in an appropriate

> preschool placement.

>

> Once you get your child through preschool -again then decide what is

> best for k-12.

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

if you let us know what town you live in (or email me at

lisa@... and let me know) perhaps we can help you find

something closer. Or at least post the state or which large

metropolitan area it is.

=====

[Guest guest]

Liz I didn't pay anything to advocate as I did it myself. Back then

we didn't have the support we have today for apraxic children so you

had to do it yourself -or it didn't get done. Advocacy for apraxia I

mean -not preschool. Back when Tanner was 3 SLPs used to debate if

apraxia existed -and nobody but this group knew about oral apraxia -

hypotonia and everything else we know that goes hand in hand with

apraxia. I also secured support from various neurodevelopmental

medical doctors by evaluations and letters from them to help support

me in protecting and securing appropriate services for Tanner. So

guess that took some money -but much was covered by our insurance as

these were traditional neurologist type medical doctors.

I did call special ed attorneys and if you do which I encourage

everyone to -you'll find that most of them will speak to you over the

phone or even meet with you without charging for that initial visit.

Paper trail -have your facts -and bring a tape recorder and The Late

Talker -that's all you need. What is your formula -I don't know what

you are talking about?

=====

[Guest guest]

Exposure is up to the parent. For peer socialization many use

scounting, sports, music, art and religious classes if that is their

thing.

For general ocialization, family and everyday sctivities with

practice deling with strangers, cashiers, etc. works and allows for

impromptu math lessons, etc.

There are homeschooling groups, both in person and meetup things

where field trips are organized to museums, theme parks, etc. Some

families get together at one house if a parent is gifted in a subject

area that others are not. Very popular with math and science.

Like anything, homeschooling is what you make of it and can be

tailored to your child.

It sounds like your child is in a great school situation so for you,

that is an awesome choice. If you want to know more about

homeschooling generally and why and how people do it there is a book

that profiles 21 families who homeschool for different reasons and do

it differently. Here is the link:

http://www.amazon.com/Real-Life-Homeschooling-Stories-Families-

Children/dp/0743442296

>

> Can you tell me what exposure does a home schooler have? I may be

grossly

> misinformed and I should learn something new so tell me. You might

try to be a

> little more open too, and accept that you may be mis informed

about children

> going to school and learning. There is nothing that makes me

happier than

> to see my child at school with his backpack on smiling. In a group

setting

> with other kids, doing what other kids his age are doing. I

believe when you

> have a child with special needs there are other professionals that

have had

> many more years of education on how to help these kids. I don't

know what

> challenges your child has mine is on the autism spectrum with

apraxia. This

> structured setting with Occupational therapy, and speech, and

playing with other

> kids is just what he needs. Certain things my son would avoid

doing at home he

> does at school and it isn't a big deal to him there, he is

learning and they

> are providing for him wonderful learning. I just know with all

the toys and

> disruptions during a typical day at home, he learns better for the

2 1/2

> hours he is there. If I didn't feel that the teachers were

qualified or it was a

> good set up I would never leave my child with these teachers. I

know these

> are wonderful women who really like my son, and they provide a

nice program

> for him. When he comes home we also learn things and play but he

has a

> speech person and an autism specialist come to the house and I can

tell you he

> likes the school part better, it is an easier transition for

him " In general " !

> My opinion doesn't matter to you and it wont make a difference

about if you

> home school your child or not, If you believe in your heart it

is the best

> etc why even bring it up, you should have know people were going

to challenge

> you? It makes those people that respond differently than you look

like they

> are being difficult, when that is not the case. Difference of

opinion that

> makes the world go round. No one was saying they were better than

you because

> their child goes to school, they were just making a different

point. I have

> had my feelings hurt on this board when I take to heart too

closely what

> someone says whom I don't really know. Then I think about it and

go " Why did I

> let that get to me " That person obviously has no clue and I move

on with my

> day, I think I will do that now.

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well I can tell you first hand, apraxia in NJ is still debated in NJ

and when it is diagnosed it is frowned upon, at least here. Down the

street from me you can get a drive-by apraxia diagnosis from a doc

who does not know it the way Dr. Agin and the real experts of this

do.

I am more than familiar with the world of specialed law. They do

generously talk to you pro bono often but to get the job done they

have to charge and the average retainer is $7500-10K.

Bottom line for us is so far things are moving in the right direction

this way and the last successful lawsuit in my district yielded

nothing helpful other than a higher tax bill and crappy services.

If I have to fight the good fight in the future I know what I need to

do. Thankfully that is not my current concern and I can focus on

ruling in and out the medical sources of some of my son's issues so

we can live a more liberated life.

>

> Liz I didn't pay anything to advocate as I did it myself. Back then

> we didn't have the support we have today for apraxic children so you

> had to do it yourself -or it didn't get done. Advocacy for apraxia

I

> mean -not preschool. Back when Tanner was 3 SLPs used to debate if

> apraxia existed -and nobody but this group knew about oral apraxia -

> hypotonia and everything else we know that goes hand in hand with

> apraxia. I also secured support from various neurodevelopmental

> medical doctors by evaluations and letters from them to help support

> me in protecting and securing appropriate services for Tanner. So

> guess that took some money -but much was covered by our insurance as

> these were traditional neurologist type medical doctors.

>

> I did call special ed attorneys and if you do which I encourage

> everyone to -you'll find that most of them will speak to you over

the

> phone or even meet with you without charging for that initial visit.

>

> Paper trail -have your facts -and bring a tape recorder and The Late

> Talker -that's all you need. What is your formula -I don't know

what

> you are talking about?

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

I hope your feelings are not hurt. We actually should be able

to express different opinions without being attacked. I understand

some of you are stressed out and perhaps even angry because of the

situation your child is in -but this group embraces all views. None

of us has the time to really analyze every single word before we post

a message -so give a break to simple things like normal vs.

typical. is a mom to a child diagnosed with both autism and

apraxia -who reports her child is doing well in preschool and wants

to share that with others. What she's sharing is priceless and can

help others in her situation who have children diagnosed with apraxia

and autism. And it's OK here to say normal -we all know there is

no such thing but we all understand what that word means -typical for

the rest of the world.

It's good some from here are starting blogs because it's clear that

some don't know how to go back and forth and let others express

opinion that differ from their own. A difference of opinion is not

an attack -it's called conversation. Posting the same point is a

blog not a " grouplist "

It would be awesome if all of us could meet in person and get to know

each others kids -because like me many of you will find that the main

topics of what matters and what has worked/helped for most for years

and years is simple (and before that one person jumps in -just like

the normal typical debate -simple doesn't mean easy). Preschool

disabled program, therapy, EFAs and now vitamin E, mainstream (or

homeschool) k-12 has worked- some of you can't say the same -perhaps

you will down the road but you are creating new ones. I'm all for

new roads but when Tanner was 3 I wished there was a proven path I

could follow- and there wasn't. SLPs and MDs alike were dismal about

Tanner's prognosis. Today the future is bright for apraxia -so why

mess it up and get all complicated -unless you have to which I

understand for a handful of you the basics didn't work.

In general you want to follow success stories -which is why I always

following Khalid for my son Tanner and today he's a success story.

So that's a second generation success story!

Nobody is attacking home schooling -there are questions...and the

points brought up are valid. If you check the archives home

schooling is embraced here -however it (still) is not the choice for

preschool as those are precious years to get your child up to speed

with fine-gross motor and communication skills and quite frankly all

of you with 3 year olds have limited experience in dealing with

apraxia -no less being your child's special education teacher and

therapists.

And about preschool - most of us in the US will find that either

there will be an appropriate option close to their home -or a school

will accommodate that child to make it appropriate. Don't

underestimate how far a school will go to provide services if they

are brought to the table.

And -thanks for sharing. Congratulations on how well things

are going for your little guy! Go give him a huge hug for me!

=====

[Guest guest]

I think what is trying to be shown is that the typical homeschooled

child doesn't spend all day everyday in the home. For instance, my

boys go with me everywhere. We make a trip to the supermarket a

learning activity, math, colors, shapes, nutrition, and interpersonal

skills. I'm not against traditional schooling, I just think parents

should be informed of all their options especially regarding

education as that is the one thing that will have the biggest impact

on their life (outside of health/physical issues). When you have a

well educated, well adjusted child, you will get a well educated,

well adjusted adult. Homeschooling is not such a new topic, it's

just been brought to the mainstream recently. It wasn't until the

industrial revolution that public education even necessary. Some

places have great schools and great programs for children with

special needs, my area isn't one of them. You make a good point

about taking things to heart that maybe shouldn't be.

My youngest gets only 30 minutes a week of speech therapy because

that's all the insurance company will allow. At home we take what

the SLP has begun and expand on it. We can do this all day because I

am with him all day. Since we began ST my youngest has added at

least 3 new words to his vocab. He only says them when prompted but

it's progress. I " m not saying professionals don't have their place,

but parents can make just as much progress with their kids. But it

all depends on the child, the parent, and the situation.

>

> Can you tell me what exposure does a home schooler have? I may be

grossly

> misinformed and I should learn something new so tell me. You might

try to be a

> little more open too, and accept that you may be mis informed

about children

> going to school and learning. There is nothing that makes me

happier than

> to see my child at school with his backpack on smiling. In a group

setting

> with other kids, doing what other kids his age are doing. I

believe when you

> have a child with special needs there are other professionals that

have had

> many more years of education on how to help these kids. I don't

know what

> challenges your child has mine is on the autism spectrum with

apraxia. This

> structured setting with Occupational therapy, and speech, and

playing with other

> kids is just what he needs. Certain things my son would avoid

doing at home he

> does at school and it isn't a big deal to him there, he is

learning and they

> are providing for him wonderful learning. I just know with all

the toys and

> disruptions during a typical day at home, he learns better for the

2 1/2

> hours he is there. If I didn't feel that the teachers were

qualified or it was a

> good set up I would never leave my child with these teachers. I

know these

> are wonderful women who really like my son, and they provide a

nice program

> for him. When he comes home we also learn things and play but he

has a

> speech person and an autism specialist come to the house and I can

tell you he

> likes the school part better, it is an easier transition for

him " In general " !

> My opinion doesn't matter to you and it wont make a difference

about if you

> home school your child or not, If you believe in your heart it

is the best

> etc why even bring it up, you should have know people were going

to challenge

> you? It makes those people that respond differently than you look

like they

> are being difficult, when that is not the case. Difference of

opinion that

> makes the world go round. No one was saying they were better than

you because

> their child goes to school, they were just making a different

point. I have

> had my feelings hurt on this board when I take to heart too

closely what

> someone says whom I don't really know. Then I think about it and

go " Why did I

> let that get to me " That person obviously has no clue and I move

on with my

> day, I think I will do that now.

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'm in the western suburbs of Philadelphia.

>

> if you let us know what town you live in (or email me at

> lisa@... and let me know) perhaps we can help you find

> something closer. Or at least post the state or which large

> metropolitan area it is.

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

Out of the following resources I pulled from the archives -perhaps

one of the parents or professionals can help. I left all emails and

names and also included some clips I thought interesting. Of most

interest to me would be the Association Method school. How far are

you from that?! It seems like Berwyn, PA where TALK Association

Method school is would only be about a ½ hour away? But I only have

google maps to go by -so perhaps this was the school that's an hour

away?

http://www.talkinc.org/ And more about Association Method since this

one is proven and talked about many times here and all over. I wish

there was one near me -and I'd even consider an hour commute for a

school like this!!

alludepl <lesliep@...> wrote:

Nikki,

I am familiar with the Association Method and The Magnolia School. I

have

actually spoken with another mom in Philadelphia who just opened an

Association Method school as well as the current director of The

Magnolia

School (Ann Sullivan). I, along with an OT and a Special Ed teacher

are

planning on making a trip to Mississippi to visit the Magnolia School

in

September and then intend on opening an Association Method School in

Charlotte, NC next Fall (Fall of '06).

I would be happy to let you know about what I learn when we go visit

and to

talk to you about the school, etc. Feel free to e-mail me directly at

lesliep@... lesliep at carolina.rr.com

Warmest regards,

http://www.icantalk.org/talk.htm

http://www.talkinc.org/

The rest are clips and rough -many contact to go through for sure!

(and some very strong " old timers " who I want to come back!!)

Karyn you there? (kissmekate) And Kimmie -you're in Philly now...

Re: [ ] speech therapist in Philly area?

Whoever asked for the SLP in Philly......please let me know what area

you are

in, I can check the hospital I am affiliated with, to see if there

are any on

our recommendation list.

~karyn KissmeKaate@...

Re: [ ] Re: THESE KIDS DON'T HAVE APRAXIA, THEY

HAVE PHOENETIC DISORDER

Hi Karyn,

I interjected some comments for you in your post that follows my

contacts. You

mentioned that you live in PA. I have a couple of contacts for you

that may be

able to assist you.

Pennsylvania P & A Inc.

116 Pine Street

burg, PA 17101

1-800-692-7443

This is a protection and advocacy organization.

Parents Union for Public Schools

311 South Juniper Street, Suite 200

Philadelphia, PA 19107

1-215-546-1166

and

Parent Education Network

333 East 7th Avenue

York, PA 17404

1-717-845-9722; 800-522-5827

These are your state's parent training and information programs. They

do free

trainings/workshops for parents on special ed. and also provide I & R

and

technical assistance. I strongly urge to you to check these out. My

state's

PTI has free IEP Partners that are available and trained to help you

throughout

the IEP process and attend meetings as well.

Good luck,

Tammy

I had a conversation today with the director, and mentioned several

points

which and I talked about on the phone this morning.....ie., that

children

with phonological disorder in MOST instances will not show as

hypotonic or have

SID. Apraxic children will. I also pointed out to her that although

he is

getting speech services, which cannot HURT, he isn't getting the

specific type

of therapy which is what he NEEDS. She said that she did notice that

the SLP

got very uncomfortable when I questioned her with several specific

points.

She'd like another SLP to look at him.......I told her that's always

her option,

but it's my decision to follow the guidance of the medical people who

I have

entrusted my child to, and this is their dx and their recommendation.

And it

needs to be followed. There was little resistance today.....not sure

why.

Because they know they're wrong....

We'll see what happens in the next week or two, but I did tell her

that I

would not be signing off on that new IEP until I felt confident that

the speech

and language services he was going to receive were ADEQUATE to fit his

dx.....the dx that was given to him by a neuro developmental ped, a

neurologist

and a pediatrician. All 3 who are involved in his routine care. She

said she

would look into this a little more and " get back to me. " Best I don't

hold my

breath.

Adequate is NOT the right word for them to be using APPROPRIATE

is....and

appropriate is the LAW! FAPE stands for Free Appropriate Public

Education.

Have you asked for an IEE?

~Karyn

The Parents' Empowerment Academy: Professional Parent Advocacy

Training

Empowering the Parent Team

Barbara Ransom, Esq., Public Interest Law Center of Philadelphia

/message/74424

jodispeech@... Jodi Schechtman MA-CCC-SLP (in Marlton NJ but may

have suggestions for schools since she isn't that far)

Re: [ ] speech therapist in Philly area?

My son is taking speech therapy from private therapist

who is staying near philadelphia. Her name is Ela

Britchkow and phone number is 215-322-0308. She has

more than 20 years of experience in this area and I

found her very good. Also she comes to home for the

therapy if the child resides in 13 mile radius.

Hope that helps.

Praveen Mital

I don't know about the Philly area but, you could call Good Shepherd

in

town and inquire about Philly doctors. Good Shepherd is " home " of

developmental pediatricians Dr. Senft & Dr. . Appropriate

therapies for

apraxia are done by qualified ST, OT, PT......if the receptionist

cannot help

you ask to speak to the social worker or speech therapist.(610) 776-

3578

Jeanet@...

parents

nadine_silber@... nadine_silber

ryancooper716@...

nicholas1227@... Russo

gabydevelbiss@... martha develbiss

msmarynj@... F

ezzieklein@... ezzie klein

capetalker@... Cheryl

bernadette_photographer@... Bernadette

WendiChapman@... Wendi K. Chapman

kimxoxo77@... Kim

glmastrobuono@... Lotte Mastrobuono

irishboney@... Holly

kimmiev@... Kim Vallin

johnjudi@... Judi

smom05@... Lori

KissmeKaate@... Karyn

dks0564@... dks

South Jersey Apraxia Support Group 5/24 Meeting Topic:

Social Communication

Our next meeting will be on Wednesday May 24th from 7-9 pm at the

Cherry Hill Library (10 minutes west of Philadelphia). Joining us

will be Jodi Schectman, MA-CCC-SLP from Interactive Kids in Marlton,

NJ. http://www.interactivekidsllc.com/home

The discussion topic will be SOCIAL COMMUNICATION. Jodi will

discuss the importance of social interaction and play, how to

facilitate social interaction in your child, and how to have a

structured and successful playdate with your child who has

communication issues.

Jodi is a licensed and certified speech pathologist with over 10

years experience working with the autistic population. She is

currently in private practice in Marlton New Jersey.

Contact (856) 616-9835 theslagers@... if you have any

questions.

jodispeech@...

Sent by: To:

@yaho cc: (bcc: Cecilia

/Downstate)

ogroups.com Subject:

[ ] Interactive Kids NOW has Preschool Play Groups

12/30/2005 10:33 PM

Please respond to

This group is located in Marlton NJ (Near Philadelphia, Pa. and Cherry

Hill,N.J. Area).

A team of professionals (SLP, Preschool Teacher, Social Worker,

Elementary

School Teacher, Special Educator, and Behavior Analyst) work together

to

design

group instruction to meet the needs of all children.

AGES 2-3 (Mommy and Me)

Ages 4-5 (On my Own)

Language Enrichment and Socialization are specific areas of focus.

Movement,

music, and art projects are incorporated into our sessions. A progress

report is provided at the end of the 4 week or 7 week session.

Weekend and week day sessions available.

For more information

Contact:

Interactive Kids

3002 M Lincoln Dr. W

Marlton NJ 08053

856-810-2555

fax: 856-810-2557

_www.interactivekidsllc.com_ (http://www.interactivekidsllc.com)

Children's Apraxia Network of PA

(Philadelphia, PA and surrounding area)

Contact:

Phone: (610) 725-8815

Email: wenobrooks@... or

Contact: Lia Gorman

Phone: (610) 296-2330

Email: jimliagorman@... or

Contact: Helene Teufel

Phone: (215) 579-6268

Email: hteufel@...

Meets: Monthly throughout school year at Kencrest Plymouth Meeting

Office, Suite

200 at Plymouth Meeting Mall Office Building Plymouth Meeting,

Pennsylvania.

Support Contacts*:

Contact: Barbara Eckert

Tionesta/Clarion, Pennsylvania

E-Mail: borjeckert@...

Contact:Melonie Mackey

Greensburg, PA

Phone: (724) 837-9303

E-mail: vondreele@...

Website: http://www.geocities.com/vondreele/hlthmed.html

Families of special needs children in Pennsylvania who are fighting

the good fight.

This list is restricted. When you ask to join, you will be asked to

affirm that you are not employed by any school district as an

administrator, educator, staff, or employed by the State either as a

contractor or in any other capacity.

Parents who are educators, ect. may request to join at

PaSpEd

and

see pa_comply/message/2

pa_comply/ 515 members

carolsadler@...

Sat Feb 11, 2006 1:17 pm

ESY - Extended School Year

Even though not from your area -may be able to ask her opinion of

where in your area since she's a member here reaching out

FYI - It's getting time to schedule those meetings with your schools

to discuss

ESY. Do not let the schools jump past the ESY portion in your IEP

meeting and

merely tell you your child doesn't qualify (no regression), so no

need for ESY.

Regression is NOT the only requirement for ESY, I've bolded important

information below.

Also, don't let the school tell you ESY is traditional summer school,

it is not,

although it can be if it is appropriate to meet the child's IEP goals.

I often use ESY services to negotiate additional services for

children where the

school has " Failed to Identify " , appropriately remediate a child's

learning

problem, and/or failed to provide identified spec. ed. support or

related

services. I've used it to give the school one more chance to teach a

child to

read or to teach a child appropriate social skills, before pulling

out and

privately placing the child at public expense. The school system can

pay for

traditional summer school classes as ESY services for instance, if a

school

failed to identify a child with a disability, and the child failed

the first

semester of High School, and now needs to make up courses during

Summer School.

Extended School Year can look at many things. Don't let the schools

tell you no

automatically, and don't let them tell you it is only for the

severely disabled.

NOT TRUE! Talk with an advocate, attorney, or disability organization

to find

out more information.

Carol Sadler

Special Education Consultant/Advocate

GA Advocacy Office PLSP I Graduate

770-442-8357

1105 Rock Pointe Look

Woodstock, GA 30188

CarolSadler@...

www.IEPadvocate4You.com

http://iepadvocate4you.blogspot.com/

=====

[Guest guest]

The Magnolia School has moved to Newtown Square which would probably

take 1.5 hours with traffic in the morning. It's on my radar when he

is older if I think it's still appropriate. I called them before he

turned 3 to get some preschool recommendations. They recommended a

language preschool program at Bryn Mawr College's Child Study

Institute with Chaplick. With traffic, it would take an hour

to get to this program.

I observed the preschool program and got some suggestions from

. was very helpful. She recommended an ABA/VB program

and a typical preschool with an aide. I followed her suggestions and

I'm very happy with our program. When I observed her program, it

seemed to follow a lot of the ABA/VB program, so I don't think I'm

missing out on anything by not sending him to this preschool (though

has an excellent reputation as a SLP).

has a somewhat extreme case of ADHD, so he requires a lot a 1:1

aide for constant redirection and assistance with fine motor skills.

His typical preschool is associated with a college and they are great

about accepting kids with disabilities. He has learned a lot from

his ABA/VB program. Until we get his ADHD under control, he will

only learn through this type of 1:1 instruction. Once he is school

age, we will have a lot more options if the typical classroom no

longer seems appropriate.

> Nikki,

>

> I am familiar with the Association Method and The Magnolia School. I

> have

> actually spoken with another mom in Philadelphia who just opened an

> Association Method school as well as the current director of The

> Magnolia

> School (Ann Sullivan). I, along with an OT and a Special Ed teacher

> are

> planning on making a trip to Mississippi to visit the Magnolia

School

> in

> September and then intend on opening an Association Method School in

> Charlotte, NC next Fall (Fall of '06).

>

> I would be happy to let you know about what I learn when we go visit

> and to

> talk to you about the school, etc. Feel free to e-mail me directly

at

> lesliep@... lesliep at carolina.rr.com

>

> Warmest regards,

>

>

>

> http://www.icantalk.org/talk.htm

> http://www.talkinc.org/

>

> The rest are clips and rough -many contact to go through for sure!

> (and some very strong " old timers " who I want to come back!!)

> Karyn you there? (kissmekate) And Kimmie -you're in Philly now...

>

>

> Re: [ ] speech therapist in Philly area?

>

> Whoever asked for the SLP in Philly......please let me know what

area

> you are

> in, I can check the hospital I am affiliated with, to see if there

> are any on

> our recommendation list.

>

> ~karyn KissmeKaate@...

>

> Re: [ ] Re: THESE KIDS DON'T HAVE APRAXIA, THEY

> HAVE PHOENETIC DISORDER

>

> Hi Karyn,

> I interjected some comments for you in your post that follows my

> contacts. You

> mentioned that you live in PA. I have a couple of contacts for you

> that may be

> able to assist you.

>

> Pennsylvania P & A Inc.

> 116 Pine Street

> burg, PA 17101

> 1-800-692-7443

> This is a protection and advocacy organization.

>

> Parents Union for Public Schools

> 311 South Juniper Street, Suite 200

> Philadelphia, PA 19107

> 1-215-546-1166

> and

> Parent Education Network

> 333 East 7th Avenue

> York, PA 17404

> 1-717-845-9722; 800-522-5827

>

> These are your state's parent training and information programs.

They

> do free

> trainings/workshops for parents on special ed. and also provide I & R

> and

> technical assistance. I strongly urge to you to check these out. My

> state's

> PTI has free IEP Partners that are available and trained to help you

> throughout

> the IEP process and attend meetings as well.

>

> Good luck,

> Tammy

>

> I had a conversation today with the director, and mentioned several

> points

> which and I talked about on the phone this morning.....ie.,

that

> children

> with phonological disorder in MOST instances will not show as

> hypotonic or have

> SID. Apraxic children will. I also pointed out to her that although

> he is

> getting speech services, which cannot HURT, he isn't getting the

> specific type

> of therapy which is what he NEEDS. She said that she did notice that

> the SLP

> got very uncomfortable when I questioned her with several specific

> points.

> She'd like another SLP to look at him.......I told her that's always

> her option,

> but it's my decision to follow the guidance of the medical people

who

> I have

> entrusted my child to, and this is their dx and their

recommendation.

> And it

> needs to be followed. There was little resistance today.....not sure

> why.

> Because they know they're wrong....

>

>

> We'll see what happens in the next week or two, but I did tell her

> that I

> would not be signing off on that new IEP until I felt confident that

> the speech

> and language services he was going to receive were ADEQUATE to fit

his

> dx.....the dx that was given to him by a neuro developmental ped, a

> neurologist

> and a pediatrician. All 3 who are involved in his routine care. She

> said she

> would look into this a little more and " get back to me. " Best I

don't

> hold my

> breath.

> Adequate is NOT the right word for them to be using APPROPRIATE

> is....and

> appropriate is the LAW! FAPE stands for Free Appropriate Public

> Education.

> Have you asked for an IEE?

>

>

> ~Karyn

>

>

> The Parents' Empowerment Academy: Professional Parent Advocacy

> Training

> Empowering the Parent Team

> Barbara Ransom, Esq., Public Interest Law Center of Philadelphia

>

/message/74424

>

> jodispeech@... Jodi Schechtman MA-CCC-SLP (in Marlton NJ but may

> have suggestions for schools since she isn't that far)

>

> Re: [ ] speech therapist in Philly area?

>

> My son is taking speech therapy from private therapist

> who is staying near philadelphia. Her name is Ela

> Britchkow and phone number is 215-322-0308. She has

> more than 20 years of experience in this area and I

> found her very good. Also she comes to home for the

> therapy if the child resides in 13 mile radius.

> Hope that helps.

>

> Praveen Mital

>

> I don't know about the Philly area but, you could call Good Shepherd

> in

> town and inquire about Philly doctors. Good Shepherd is " home "

of

> developmental pediatricians Dr. Senft & Dr. . Appropriate

> therapies for

> apraxia are done by qualified ST, OT, PT......if the receptionist

> cannot help

> you ask to speak to the social worker or speech therapist.(610) 776-

> 3578

> Jeanet@...

>

>

> parents

> nadine_silber@... nadine_silber

> ryancooper716@...

> nicholas1227@... Russo

> gabydevelbiss@... martha develbiss

> msmarynj@... F

> ezzieklein@... ezzie klein

> capetalker@... Cheryl

> bernadette_photographer@... Bernadette

> WendiChapman@... Wendi K. Chapman

> kimxoxo77@... Kim

> glmastrobuono@... Lotte Mastrobuono

> irishboney@... Holly

> kimmiev@... Kim Vallin

> johnjudi@... Judi

> smom05@... Lori

> KissmeKaate@... Karyn

> dks0564@... dks

>

>

>

>

> South Jersey Apraxia Support Group 5/24 Meeting Topic:

> Social Communication

>

> Our next meeting will be on Wednesday May 24th from 7-9 pm at the

> Cherry Hill Library (10 minutes west of Philadelphia). Joining us

> will be Jodi Schectman, MA-CCC-SLP from Interactive Kids in Marlton,

> NJ. http://www.interactivekidsllc.com/home

>

> The discussion topic will be SOCIAL COMMUNICATION. Jodi will

> discuss the importance of social interaction and play, how to

> facilitate social interaction in your child, and how to have a

> structured and successful playdate with your child who has

> communication issues.

>

> Jodi is a licensed and certified speech pathologist with over 10

> years experience working with the autistic population. She is

> currently in private practice in Marlton New Jersey.

>

> Contact (856) 616-9835 theslagers@... if you have any

> questions.

>

> jodispeech@...

> Sent by: To:

>

> @yaho cc: (bcc: Cecilia

> /Downstate)

> ogroups.com Subject:

> [ ] Interactive Kids NOW has Preschool Play Groups

>

>

> 12/30/2005 10:33 PM

> Please respond to

>

>

>

>

>

>

> This group is located in Marlton NJ (Near Philadelphia, Pa. and

Cherry

> Hill,N.J. Area).

>

> A team of professionals (SLP, Preschool Teacher, Social Worker,

> Elementary

>

> School Teacher, Special Educator, and Behavior Analyst) work

together

> to

> design

> group instruction to meet the needs of all children.

>

> AGES 2-3 (Mommy and Me)

> Ages 4-5 (On my Own)

>

> Language Enrichment and Socialization are specific areas of focus.

> Movement,

> music, and art projects are incorporated into our sessions. A

progress

> report is provided at the end of the 4 week or 7 week session.

>

> Weekend and week day sessions available.

>

> For more information

> Contact:

> Interactive Kids

> 3002 M Lincoln Dr. W

> Marlton NJ 08053

> 856-810-2555

> fax: 856-810-2557

> _www.interactivekidsllc.com_ (http://www.interactivekidsllc.com)

>

> Children's Apraxia Network of PA

>

>

> (Philadelphia, PA and surrounding area)

>

> Contact:

> Phone: (610) 725-8815

> Email: wenobrooks@... or

> Contact: Lia Gorman

> Phone: (610) 296-2330

> Email: jimliagorman@... or

> Contact: Helene Teufel

> Phone: (215) 579-6268

> Email: hteufel@...

> Meets: Monthly throughout school year at Kencrest Plymouth Meeting

> Office, Suite

> 200 at Plymouth Meeting Mall Office Building Plymouth Meeting,

> Pennsylvania.

>

> Support Contacts*:

>

>

> Contact: Barbara Eckert

> Tionesta/Clarion, Pennsylvania

> E-Mail: borjeckert@...

>

> Contact:Melonie Mackey

> Greensburg, PA

> Phone: (724) 837-9303

> E-mail: vondreele@...

> Website: http://www.geocities.com/vondreele/hlthmed.html

>

> Families of special needs children in Pennsylvania who are fighting

> the good fight.

>

> This list is restricted. When you ask to join, you will be asked to

> affirm that you are not employed by any school district as an

> administrator, educator, staff, or employed by the State either as a

> contractor or in any other capacity.

>

> Parents who are educators, ect. may request to join at

> PaSpEd

>

> and

> see pa_comply/message/2

> pa_comply/ 515 members

>

> carolsadler@...

> Sat Feb 11, 2006 1:17 pm

> ESY - Extended School Year

>

> Even though not from your area -may be able to ask her opinion of

> where in your area since she's a member here reaching out

>

>

> FYI - It's getting time to schedule those meetings with your schools

> to discuss

> ESY. Do not let the schools jump past the ESY portion in your IEP

> meeting and

> merely tell you your child doesn't qualify (no regression), so no

> need for ESY.

> Regression is NOT the only requirement for ESY, I've bolded

important

> information below.

>

> Also, don't let the school tell you ESY is traditional summer

school,

> it is not,

> although it can be if it is appropriate to meet the child's IEP

goals.

>

> I often use ESY services to negotiate additional services for

> children where the

> school has " Failed to Identify " , appropriately remediate a child's

> learning

> problem, and/or failed to provide identified spec. ed. support or

> related

> services. I've used it to give the school one more chance to teach a

> child to

> read or to teach a child appropriate social skills, before pulling

> out and

> privately placing the child at public expense. The school system can

> pay for

> traditional summer school classes as ESY services for instance, if a

> school

> failed to identify a child with a disability, and the child failed

> the first

> semester of High School, and now needs to make up courses during

> Summer School.

>

> Extended School Year can look at many things. Don't let the schools

> tell you no

> automatically, and don't let them tell you it is only for the

> severely disabled.

> NOT TRUE! Talk with an advocate, attorney, or disability

organization

> to find

> out more information.

>

>

> Carol Sadler

> Special Education Consultant/Advocate

> GA Advocacy Office PLSP I Graduate

> 770-442-8357

> 1105 Rock Pointe Look

> Woodstock, GA 30188

> CarolSadler@...

> www.IEPadvocate4You.com

> http://iepadvocate4you.blogspot.com/

>

>

> =====

>