Re: I'm reading The Late Talker...

[Guest guest]

School is not the only place that can help children, but for some it is

necessary. For some kids they need to interact with others in a place away

from

home. It is good to be able to get some of these kids out in the world,

getting used to routines and rules, etc. Home schooling is fine for some kids,

don't let anyone make you feel bad. Every parent knows what is right for

their own child. I just know on days when my son doesn't have school I know he

gets bored and he wants to go. Initially it was hard but now he is used to it

and I don't have an anxiety attack every time I drop him off. Sometimes he

cried when he goes through the doors, but they assure me he stops as quickly

as he starts. The other day I felt so good, he was actually sledding with the

other kids, instead of being concerned that he had snow on his boots.

Sometimes other can get your kids to do things you can't. Again, every parent

knows what is best.

>

> Hi, my youngest son is 32 months old and has " all the markers for

> apraxia " as his SLP says it. I'm currently reading " The Late Talker "

> and I'm finding it very helpful and informative. I just have one

> issue with it and I'm hoping for some clearification. In the

> section " Fear of Starting School " , I cannot understand why the

> authors are making such a big deal about school being a place for

> socialization for a child. It is not the only place for children to

> be socialized or helped. I find it interesting that in less than 20

> pages the book talks about rude people, bullies, and teasing, then

> says school is a must for late talking children. I homeschool my 6

> year old and plan to do the same with my youngest, this section

> offended me as a homeschooler and made me feel like I would be doing

> my youngest a disservice by homeschooling him. I'm sure that was not

> the intent by the authors but I really felt the need to express my

> feelings on this subject because I know many people who homeschool

> their special needs children and receive services from the schools

> and private providers and are exceeding in raising well rounded

> children. I also didn't want another parent to feel the same way I'm

> currently feeling. I just feel that there is a better way to express

> the feeling that a school environment can be beneficial without

> making it seem like a neccessity. Again, I'm sure it wasn't meant

> the way I took it but I had to voice my concern.

>

> Thanks for reading,

> Kim mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Kim,

The Late Talker was a collaborate book actually written by this

group's needs. It was co authored by me -mom to 2 " late talkers "

neurodevelopmental pediatrician Dr. Marilyn Agin who was Medical

Director for about a decade for the EI system of NYC -and Malcolm

Nicholl who is an International Journalist that used to be Editor in

Chief of the London Mirror. Most of the stories were pulled direct

from the archives with permission -and these parents were also

interviewed by Malcolm in depth. Almost 300 pages were edited out of

the book because the publisher believed there was too much

information that would overwhelm the parent of the " typical late

talker " child. The needs in the book while they might not pertain to

all -pertain to the majority. If you check the archives most parents

here do send their child to some type of school -public or private -

but as a group we have a number of home schoolers and share that

information as well. Hopefully being the mom of a child that is not

quite 3 yet you will never have to experience the rudeness that

doesn't happen to parents of late talkers when they are younger then

3 -that typically doesn't happen until your child is a bit older -and

many of us here can recall the first time a stranger asked us right

in front of our child " What's wrong with him? "

While I'm a huge believer in mainstream for K-12 -I am a huge

believer in " preschool disabled " programs. I know this may bother

you but I have to say that based on the many needs of a preschool

apraxic child I truly do have my doubts about home schooling for the

preschool disabled child. Yes of course those parents can take that

child for outside speech and occupational therapy -but it's the

entire couple of hour day that's planned in those types of schools.

And again in my mind I'm thinking of where my own son went for

preschool -the Summit Speech School for the hearing impaired in New

Providence, NJ which is state of the art and proven to get children

up to speed for the mainstream. And that's the goal -isn't it?

Don't we all want to do whatever we can to help our child to get up

to speed as quickly as possible?

I'm not here to judge those that choose to home school a preschool

apraxic child -however what you have is a special child who requires

specific strategies and therapies to get them up to speed as quickly

as possible in speech and motor skills -to me social aspects are

besides the point for preschool for apraxia. Most of us as parents are not SLPs

or OTs to know best how to work with our children -and I can't even

begin to tell you how many SLPs or OTs are parents here that don't

know how to work best with their apraxic child. Apraxia is a severe

impairment that one can overcome -but they require appropriate therapy -and

earlier is better -and most require that daily and intensive.

While there are a handful of nightmare school experiences as far as teasing or

bullying -we have found as a group the larger problem is advocacy

with the right IEP to secure appropriate placement and therapy for

our child. Perhaps at some point we'll do a book 2 which focuses

more on school age (K through 12 -not preschool) and you will be

interviewed for your opinions for that book!

And by the way -'most' of our children in mainstream here are not teased or

bullied in school.

(anymore than the " norm " )

=====

[Guest guest]

I haven't read the book in a couple of years so I don't remember this

section. I can tell you that my son with verbal apraxia needed to go

Preschool when he was 3 yrs. We sent him to a church program 3 days

a week for 3 hours. Where we live there aren't any kids his age, and

I could have done the play groups and library meetings, but he really

needed to be around other children his age not just for listening to

them speak, but to play and have fun with kids his age. He also

learned many things that he wouldn't allow me to teach him. My

oldest was the same way, I would try to get him to practice things

and he didn't like it when I tried to play teacher. I know that I

could never handle homeschooling...I can't even imagine how so many

parents accomplish this huge task!! So I think it depends on many

things to determine homeschool vs. school. Socializing can be done

in other ways, but you have to also factor in the special needs

part. At this age EI is coming to your house, when your child ages

out of EI will you be taking him to the school for therapies? Some

people have reported unfortunately that some states won't do services

unles the child is in a preschool setting. If there is more than

just speech therapies are you prepared to handle those challenges

like a special education teacher would be able to? I really can't

remember this section of the book, but I believe there is more to

homeschooling vs. Preschool than just socialization.

Everyone knows their own child the best and seems to know what their

child needs to further them along!!

Good luck to you-

Tina

>

> Hi, my youngest son is 32 months old and has " all the markers for

> apraxia " as his SLP says it. I'm currently reading " The Late

Talker "

> and I'm finding it very helpful and informative. I just have one

> issue with it and I'm hoping for some clearification. In the

> section " Fear of Starting School " , I cannot understand why the

> authors are making such a big deal about school being a place for

> socialization for a child. It is not the only place for children

to

> be socialized or helped. I find it interesting that in less than

20

> pages the book talks about rude people, bullies, and teasing, then

> says school is a must for late talking children. I homeschool my 6

> year old and plan to do the same with my youngest, this section

> offended me as a homeschooler and made me feel like I would be

doing

> my youngest a disservice by homeschooling him. I'm sure that was

not

> the intent by the authors but I really felt the need to express my

> feelings on this subject because I know many people who homeschool

> their special needs children and receive services from the schools

> and private providers and are exceeding in raising well rounded

> children. I also didn't want another parent to feel the same way

I'm

> currently feeling. I just feel that there is a better way to

express

> the feeling that a school environment can be beneficial without

> making it seem like a neccessity. Again, I'm sure it wasn't meant

> the way I took it but I had to voice my concern.

>

> Thanks for reading,

> Kim mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

>

[Guest guest]

I am in the same ballpark with you. Not sure if we'll homeschool or

not yet but I am SICK TO DEATH of therapists telling me how much

better would do in a full time preschool program - where she

can supposedly make friends! Meanwhile, I fight to get to see the

friends we already have, you know, family friends that we'll continue

to see year after year no matter where our kids go to school. She is

getting very little socialization and peer interaction now because

therapists screw around with our schedule. And since when were

mothers deemed to be too stupid to teach their own children anyway???

What is wrong with this country???

GRRR!

Darlene

>

> Hi, my youngest son is 32 months old and has " all the markers for

> apraxia " as his SLP says it. I'm currently reading " The Late Talker "

> and I'm finding it very helpful and informative. I just have one

> issue with it and I'm hoping for some clearification. In the

> section " Fear of Starting School " , I cannot understand why the

> authors are making such a big deal about school being a place for

> socialization for a child. It is not the only place for children to

> be socialized or helped. I find it interesting that in less than 20

> pages the book talks about rude people, bullies, and teasing, then

> says school is a must for late talking children. I homeschool my 6

> year old and plan to do the same with my youngest, this section

> offended me as a homeschooler and made me feel like I would be doing

> my youngest a disservice by homeschooling him. I'm sure that was not

> the intent by the authors but I really felt the need to express my

> feelings on this subject because I know many people who homeschool

> their special needs children and receive services from the schools

> and private providers and are exceeding in raising well rounded

> children. I also didn't want another parent to feel the same way I'm

> currently feeling. I just feel that there is a better way to express

> the feeling that a school environment can be beneficial without

> making it seem like a neccessity. Again, I'm sure it wasn't meant

> the way I took it but I had to voice my concern.

>

> Thanks for reading,

> Kim mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

>

[Guest guest]

I don't recall this section as my homeschool decision was made prior

to the delays. I do live in a place where services are attached to a

preschool that our EI therapists deemed wrong for my son, mostly

because most of the typicals do not speak well so he'd reinforce bad

language. I had my own misgivings about the school and the services

so we waived both. Despite my decision to homeschool, both my kids

are going to attend a private preschool. My daughter does learn well

at home but real socializing never occurred at the library programs

and playdates with working moms and busy kids occurred sporadically.

My son, the speech kid, must go to school to be away from me and

learn to fen for himself as he still does the selective mutism thing

in front of others while talking his head off at home with just us.

Learningwise he does well at home. Once the friend and social bases

are covered from school when we homeschool, old friends and new ones

from the five activities per week, per kid, we have set up for them

will get them where they need to go...at least that is our hope. If

not, they can always go to school. Some homeschoolers have a lot of

other kids and the home army is plenty for socialization. Others

belong to homeschool groups or do other things. I am with Tina on

this one. We all know our individual kids, our neighborhood situation

and what is best for our kids. I am unconcerned about what any book

says. I take from it what seems to apply, read the rest, and see if

it ever applies. If it never does I discard the info for my situation

but am not offended as the book was not written for me or my kid in

particular.

> >

> > Hi, my youngest son is 32 months old and has " all the markers for

> > apraxia " as his SLP says it. I'm currently reading " The Late

> Talker "

> > and I'm finding it very helpful and informative. I just have one

> > issue with it and I'm hoping for some clearification. In the

> > section " Fear of Starting School " , I cannot understand why the

> > authors are making such a big deal about school being a place for

> > socialization for a child. It is not the only place for children

> to

> > be socialized or helped. I find it interesting that in less than

> 20

> > pages the book talks about rude people, bullies, and teasing,

then

> > says school is a must for late talking children. I homeschool my

6

> > year old and plan to do the same with my youngest, this section

> > offended me as a homeschooler and made me feel like I would be

> doing

> > my youngest a disservice by homeschooling him. I'm sure that was

> not

> > the intent by the authors but I really felt the need to express

my

> > feelings on this subject because I know many people who

homeschool

> > their special needs children and receive services from the

schools

> > and private providers and are exceeding in raising well rounded

> > children. I also didn't want another parent to feel the same way

> I'm

> > currently feeling. I just feel that there is a better way to

> express

> > the feeling that a school environment can be beneficial without

> > making it seem like a neccessity. Again, I'm sure it wasn't

meant

> > the way I took it but I had to voice my concern.

> >

> > Thanks for reading,

> > Kim mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Kim-

As a mom who has home schooled for 12 years now-- all I can say is that I

wholeheartedly agree to all that you've said in your email.

I feel as though it's bad enough to have the parents already feeling

inadequate to a late talking child, but it makes things WORSE when someone would

outright tell you that school is a necessity. It's not only FALSE information,

it's false information which demeans the parents who ARE home schoolers. I'm

sure that this wasn't the intent of the authors, and yet, I have to say that

there's definitely a " feeling " of anti-home schooling going on within the

book, whether it's meant to come across that way or not.

I just wanted to tell you that your feelings have merit, and as a fellow

home schooler I was also highly offended, and felt that there was a much better

thing to focus on. (like what about ALTERNATIVES the families might have,

INCLUDING home schooling???)

I, along with most other home schoolers have long realized that

" socialization " within the school system is a total myth, and I hardly want my

children

picking up the atrocious habits that these kids display on buses, in the

cafeteria, on the playground etc.

I don't want my kids acting that way-- so I prefer meeting their

socialization needs through REAL LIFE situations where they aren't *just* with

their

peer group, but where they learn to interact with myriads of people in society,

since that *IS PRECISELY WHAT WE WANT THEM TO LEARN* isn't it?

Anyway-- I'm SURE that I have plenty more to say on this topic, but I would

risk offending other parents who may feel that the school setting is the best

thing out there. I'm not that type of person-- so rather than continuing

with my own thoughts, I'll resist the urge LOL :-)

But yes, your thoughts have merit, and I wish that the book hadn't demeaned

home schooling, but alas, it's nothing new-- and there are many people who

TRULY don't get what home schooling is all about, and they miss the point.

Becky

**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL

Home.

(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030\

000000001)

[Guest guest]

Hi Becky!

Everyone is entitled to their position and we all want to hear more

from you. However even if you share your unique situation which is

great -there aren't enough examples for us to know as a group if the

preschool age apraxic child is better off schooled at home or in a

certified preschool disabled program. We do know overwhelmingly that

most that attend an appropriate preschool program have children that

are mainstreamed and on level by kindergarten. I'm not talking about

horror situation preschool programs of course -but ones that are

appropriate.

I said I had my doubts about homeschooling for the preschool years

for an apraxic child because a preschool disabled program isn't just

education and apraxic children don't really need the social aspect -

it's a special program that is overseen by an SLP, OT and special

needs teacher. Here's what most preschool disabled program include

Listening, language, and speech development

Cognitive skills

Pre-reading, writing, and math skills

Gross motor activities

Snack

Storytelling

Social skill activities

Gross motor activities

Fine motor activities

Small group activities

Art

Music

Field trips

(and of course) speech and oral motor therapy

occupational therapy

and if needed physical therapy

You say your the homeschooling mother to seven children? How many

children are you homeschooling right now? Seven? In preschool

Tanner was in placement with a 2-1 ratio and then a 4-1 ratio. And

again all the professionals need to be specifically trained in the

unique learning styles of their students and who are proficient in

accommodating the needs of each individual to help all students reach

their highest potential. While we have information on appropriate

education needs for homeschool -we don't have that for preschool for

apraxia -but we do have what has worked for the majority.

And to recap why I am a huge believer in preschool disabled programs

for apraxia:

" While I'm a huge believer in mainstream for K-12 -I am a huge

believer in " preschool disabled " programs. I know this may bother

you but I have to say that based on the many needs of a preschool

apraxic child I truly do have my doubts about home schooling for the

preschool disabled child. Yes of course those parents can take that

child for outside speech and occupational therapy -but it's the

entire couple of hour day that's planned in those types of schools.

And again in my mind I'm thinking of where my own son went for

preschool -the Summit Speech School for the hearing impaired in New

Providence, NJ which is state of the art and proven to get children

up to speed for the mainstream. And that's the goal -isn't it?

Don't we all want to do whatever we can to help our child to get up

to speed as quickly as possible?

I'm not here to judge those that choose to home school a preschool

apraxic child -however what you have is a special child who requires

specific strategies and therapies to get them up to speed as quickly

as possible in speech and motor skills -to me social aspects are

besides the point for preschool for apraxia. Most of us as parents

are not SLPs or OTs to know best how to work with our children -and I

can't even begin to tell you how many SLPs or OTs are parents here

that don't know how to work best with their apraxic child. Apraxia is

a severe impairment that one can overcome -but they require

appropriate therapy -and earlier is better -and most require that

daily and intensive.

=====

[Guest guest]

Thanks to everyone for their comments, I truely do appreciate reading

all the views on this topic. I certainly didn't intend for it to

become a which is better debate, I really only wanted to other side

shown. Each child is different, we know not all therapies,

medications, environments, diets work for all children, so saying

that one type of school setting works for all children is contrary to

helping the individual.

If the reason the books takes such a profound pro-traditional school

approach is because you couldn't find any homeschoolers to help with

the book, then all I can say is either you didn't look or you didn't

ask. Being new to this board and to apraxia and even to

homeschooling, I've found that when you are looking for something you

tend to find it no matter how hard you have to look. When it comes

to our kids I think we've all determined that we will move heaven and

earth to help our children. To that extent, if all you need is some

anecdotes about how a child with special needs progresses in the

homeschool environment, I'd gladly offer to keep a journal/blog so as

another parent like me won't feel the way I felt. I'm glad to have

the support that has been shown, and I " d like to be able to offer

that type of support back. So I will keep a journal at home and

online. I'll update the online journal at elast weekly and I will

post the link when it is set up, anyone that is interested is more

than welcome to take a peek into our journey thru homeschooling and

pre-schooling with apraxia. I will do whatevr is neccessary to help

my mime find his words, even if it means group therapy. I don't see

at this time how preschool will benefit him academically. He's not

even three yet, there's plenty of time for ABC's and 123's, for now

finding his words is our top priority.

Thank you all again!

Kim, mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

>

> Having been there done ALL of that, I would say that 'both' options

are correct.... at different times.

>

> I believe that at the preschool age, the dyspraxic/apraxic child

can keep up with their peer group and still find acceptance. But

when the child enters grade school, he/she may struggle for social

acceptance. This really depends on how far the individual child has

come and where he/she is in comparison to the other kids.

>

> BUT at some juncture the child may be absolutely miserable, feel

isolated and alone in the school environment and this can happen at

any age.... it really is 'skill' dependent. For us, this occurred at

grade 3.... a very tough year for my child.

>

> In grade 4, Mark was placed in special education but now I regret

that decision and realized that he should have been homeschooled

instead.

>

> Thus, the realization I have is that our kids will ALWAYS thrive in

the homeschool environment but will only thrive in the regular school

if their skills sets are relatively on par with their peers or if

they can find acceptence socially. Otherwise they suffer torment and

bullying. This is really a horrible nightmare and must be avoided at

all costs.

>

> Do what works.... and if it isn't working, don't pussy foot around,

change it and change it fast.....

>

> Janice

> Mother of Mark, 13

>

>

>

>

> [sPAM]Re: [ ] Re: I'm reading " The

Late Talker " ...

>

>

> I disagree that most kids do better in a home environment. Some

children for

> various reasons, family, personal, etc do better at home, but I

feel more

> kids do better in a school environment. If you have seven

children and they

> are all home schooled, obviously you believe that this is the

best. I have a

> child on the autism spectrum also with apraxia, he is 4 1/2. He

is in the early

> childhood education program and I couldn't ask for a better set

up. I guess

> I am one of the lucky ones. People shouldn't make general

statements like

> most kids do better at home, that is not true. One of the best

things I ever did

> was get my child into school, I wanted to home school him for

fear he

> couldn't do it, or he would have problems or he would feel upset

and I was wrong,

> he has little speech at the moment, but he does great, and I am

so proud of

> him. They have taught him many things and he loves his teacher,

the classes

> are small and they are very attentive. The right classes for

these children

> make the difference.

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the

video on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

[Guest guest]

Can you email me offlist with your thoughts. I don't want anyone

offended either but if I am going to try the homechool route I need

to hear from someone who has done it.

Thanks!

Liz

>

> Kim-

>

> As a mom who has home schooled for 12 years now-- all I can say

is that I

> wholeheartedly agree to all that you've said in your email.

> I feel as though it's bad enough to have the parents already

feeling

> inadequate to a late talking child, but it makes things WORSE when

someone would

> outright tell you that school is a necessity. It's not only FALSE

information,

> it's false information which demeans the parents who ARE home

schoolers. I'm

> sure that this wasn't the intent of the authors, and yet, I have to

say that

> there's definitely a " feeling " of anti-home schooling going on

within the

> book, whether it's meant to come across that way or not.

>

>

> I just wanted to tell you that your feelings have merit, and as a

fellow

> home schooler I was also highly offended, and felt that there was a

much better

> thing to focus on. (like what about ALTERNATIVES the families might

have,

> INCLUDING home schooling???)

> I, along with most other home schoolers have long realized that

> " socialization " within the school system is a total myth, and I

hardly want my children

> picking up the atrocious habits that these kids display on buses,

in the

> cafeteria, on the playground etc.

> I don't want my kids acting that way-- so I prefer meeting their

> socialization needs through REAL LIFE situations where they aren't

*just* with their

> peer group, but where they learn to interact with myriads of people

in society,

> since that *IS PRECISELY WHAT WE WANT THEM TO LEARN* isn't it?

>

> Anyway-- I'm SURE that I have plenty more to say on this topic, but

I would

> risk offending other parents who may feel that the school setting

is the best

> thing out there. I'm not that type of person-- so rather than

continuing

> with my own thoughts, I'll resist the urge LOL :-)

> But yes, your thoughts have merit, and I wish that the book hadn't

demeaned

> home schooling, but alas, it's nothing new-- and there are many

people who

> TRULY don't get what home schooling is all about, and they miss

the point.

>

> Becky

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Have you considered blogging? in NJ on this board did that and

it has helped a lot of people.

I wish you well on your journey and look forward to hearing the story

of your child finding his voice.

Best wishes!

Liz

> >

> > Having been there done ALL of that, I would say that 'both'

options

> are correct.... at different times.

> >

> > I believe that at the preschool age, the dyspraxic/apraxic child

> can keep up with their peer group and still find acceptance. But

> when the child enters grade school, he/she may struggle for social

> acceptance. This really depends on how far the individual child

has

> come and where he/she is in comparison to the other kids.

> >

> > BUT at some juncture the child may be absolutely miserable, feel

> isolated and alone in the school environment and this can happen at

> any age.... it really is 'skill' dependent. For us, this occurred

at

> grade 3.... a very tough year for my child.

> >

> > In grade 4, Mark was placed in special education but now I regret

> that decision and realized that he should have been homeschooled

> instead.

> >

> > Thus, the realization I have is that our kids will ALWAYS thrive

in

> the homeschool environment but will only thrive in the regular

school

> if their skills sets are relatively on par with their peers or if

> they can find acceptence socially. Otherwise they suffer torment

and

> bullying. This is really a horrible nightmare and must be avoided

at

> all costs.

> >

> > Do what works.... and if it isn't working, don't pussy foot

around,

> change it and change it fast.....

> >

> > Janice

> > Mother of Mark, 13

>

[Guest guest]

The preschool value, I was told by my OT, was that they hear other

kids speaking and the whole fen for themselves thing. For my kid, the

reason I agreed not to wait to Sept, was the fen for himself thing.

It took a lot to find the right place. I never fully bought the hear

other kids talk thing since he hears his sister talk all day long.

[Guest guest]

Here in NY all the laws have been changed and all parents who home

school will be denied services as of the Summer sessions and most

definitely the Fall School year. Many parents in my online local groups

are being told no more services from the school district. Many of them

are getting across the board services. Some of the therapists and

parents are trying to fight it, but its tough to fight Albany. Ex- Gov

Spitzer made lots of cuts to BOCES and Special Ed. Services- but I

don't know if this new governor will support keeping things as they are.

> the intent by the authors but I really felt the need to express my

> feelings on this subject because I know many people who homeschool

> their special needs children and receive services from the schools

> and private providers and are exceeding in raising well rounded

> children. I also didn't want another parent to feel the same way I'm

> currently feeling. I just feel that there is a better way to express

> the feeling that a school environment can be beneficial without

> making it seem like a neccessity. Again, I'm sure it wasn't meant

> the way I took it but I had to voice my concern.

>

> Thanks for reading,

> Kim mom to Austin, my talker, and Aydan, my mime.

>

[Guest guest]

I don't believe anyone is offended and why not continue to discuss

this here so we can as a group come up with an intelligent answer for

the majority. Yes some home school and that's great -but let's recap

as this topic has twisted from the original message posted which was

in regards to information in The Late Talker book. Since I'm one of

the co authors I wish to clarify.

While some of the aspects of The Late Talker can be applied to older

children -the book is geared for parents of preschool children who

are not yet talking for known or unknown reasons referred to by

society as " late talkers " -thus the name of the book. I repeatedly

said " preschool " and yet this debate somehow has transcended into a

debate over home schooling for K-12. So let me be clear (again) that

a preschool disabled program is not about education -and it's not

about social for an apraxic child -it's about a special program that

helps with that child's fine and gross motor skills and

communication. If after reading one persons thoughts some of you

wish to consider this route that's your prerogative. Just like

anything else that is debated here -there is no question in my mind

that some of you will be sorry. You can be wrong -but you can't go

back and do preschool years over. I would understand this passion

for home schooling preschool apraxic children if there was an example

of a child that was thriving today -older -yet severe profound

apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert cricket sound here) On the other

hand

tons of children from this group have gone the preschool disabled

program route and (again) the main problems is securing the

appropriate services through the IEP -not social aspects -and not

rude people (outside of some of the people at the IEP meeting at

times but that's besides the point)

There is so much more to preschool disabled programs than " hearing

other children speak " or " socialization " as a child can get that

at 'any' preschool or local park. An appropriate placement will get

your PRESCHOOL apraxic child up to speed so that you can make that

choice whether homeschooling or private schooling or public schooling

will be best for that child (not us as parents) from K-12.

My 11 yo son is just one of hundreds that are thriving today.

(and his preschool was Summit Speech School in New Providence NJ)

I WISH SSS went up to HS!!

=====

[Guest guest]

They do? On the intro cd he said he pushed parents to get the most

out of school and do more on their own.

[Guest guest]

Liz and Janice,

I may be mistaken and would have to go back and listen to the NACD CDs

again but I got the clear impression from Bob Doman that he was no fan

of preschools vs. what the parents can do with the kids on their own in

terms of appropriate neurological stimulation taylored to that child.

>

> They do? On the intro cd he said he pushed parents to get the most

> out of school and do more on their own.

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Children with special needs, need to get out in the real world,

they need to

> be exposed to school, and to teachers, other than their parents,

who are not

> teachers in the school system. I agree parents can teach their

kids many

> things, but many things they cannot. I still don't believe that

number of

> children do better at home. It just isn't a normal thing to home

school your

> child, and these children need some normalcy in their lives. This

isn't being

> said to be rude, it just isn't the norm to keep your kids home and

try to teach

> them there, that is what I mean by normal. Like you said that is

your

> opinion and this is mine. I have posted things too just to get the

other side and

> have often got what resulted in a debate. I am done on the

subject, but it

> seems like more people agree with school than not. Special

situations are

> fine for home schooling, but these kids need to get out and learn

to be a part

> of society.

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Children with special needs, need to get out in the real world,

they need to

> be exposed to school, and to teachers, other than their parents,

who are not

> teachers in the school system. I agree parents can teach their

kids many

> things, but many things they cannot. I still don't believe that

number of

> children do better at home. It just isn't a normal thing to home

school your

> child, and these children need some normalcy in their lives. This

isn't being

> said to be rude, it just isn't the norm to keep your kids home and

try to teach

> them there, that is what I mean by normal. Like you said that is

your

> opinion and this is mine. I have posted things too just to get the

other side and

> have often got what resulted in a debate. I am done on the

subject, but it

> seems like more people agree with school than not. Special

situations are

> fine for home schooling, but these kids need to get out and learn

to be a part

> of society.

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'm not a homeschooling mom. In fact, I'm a public school educator.

And that's really offensive to say to a homeschooling mom that it's

not " normal " to do what she's doing. I think this debate is good but

I'm also reading some ingnorant and hurtful things

here...historically (when we look back thousands of years) parents

were considered the #1 educator in their childrens' lives. To say

it's more normal that a kid is educated (and therefore) normalized

into society better at a school than at home is leaving the most

prescious job of raising up a child with a moral compass to a school

(which for many is going to be a public school.)

>

> Children with special needs, need to get out in the real world,

they need to

> be exposed to school, and to teachers, other than their parents,

who are not

> teachers in the school system. I agree parents can teach their

kids many

> things, but many things they cannot. I still don't believe that

number of

> children do better at home. It just isn't a normal thing to home

school your

> child, and these c

hildren need some normalcy in their lives. This isn't being

> said to be rude, it just isn't the norm to keep your kids home and

try to teach

> them there, that is what I mean by normal. Like you said that is

your

> opinion and this is mine. I have posted things too just to get the

other side and

> have often got what resulted in a debate. I am done on the

subject, but it

> seems like more people agree with school than not. Special

situations are

> fine for home schooling, but these kids need to get out and learn

to be a part

> of society.

>

>

>

> **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video

on AOL

> Home.

> (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?

ncid=aolhom00030000000001)

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

One problem with this is you are assuming we all have access to good

sped preschools. That's not the case in my area (a large

metropolitan area, so I'm sure I'm not alone). I'm not pro sped

preschool, pro typical preschool or pro homeschooling. I'm pro

whatever works:-) We could probably find a good sped preschool if we

looked in other counties, but I'm not willing to have my 4 year old

son spend 2 hours on a bus each day. What works for us is a typical

preschool program with and aide in the mornings and ABA/VB in the

afternoon. The therapies he receives at school are barely helpful,

so we supplement with ST 2x/wk and OT. He also has swim lessons 2x

wk and we are looking into hippo therapy.

There's lots of ways to skin a cat. I don't think anyone should

claim people should only go the sped preschool route or they will be

sorry. If I sent my son to our local sped preschool, I truly would

be sorry. I'm glad you had such a wonderful resource in your area.

M.

>

> I don't believe anyone is offended and why not continue to discuss

> this here so we can as a group come up with an intelligent answer

for

> the majority. Yes some home school and that's great -but let's

recap

> as this topic has twisted from the original message posted which was

> in regards to information in The Late Talker book. Since I'm one of

> the co authors I wish to clarify.

>

> While some of the aspects of The Late Talker can be applied to older

> children -the book is geared for parents of preschool children who

> are not yet talking for known or unknown reasons referred to by

> society as " late talkers " -thus the name of the book. I repeatedly

> said " preschool " and yet this debate somehow has transcended into a

> debate over home schooling for K-12. So let me be clear (again)

that

> a preschool disabled program is not about education -and it's not

> about social for an apraxic child -it's about a special program that

> helps with that child's fine and gross motor skills and

> communication. If after reading one persons thoughts some of you

> wish to consider this route that's your prerogative. Just like

> anything else that is debated here -there is no question in my mind

> that some of you will be sorry. You can be wrong -but you can't go

> back and do preschool years over. I would understand this passion

> for home schooling preschool apraxic children if there was an

example

> of a child that was thriving today -older -yet severe profound

> apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert cricket sound here) On

the other hand

> tons of children from this group have gone the preschool disabled

> program route and (again) the main problems is securing the

> appropriate services through the IEP -not social aspects -and not

> rude people (outside of some of the people at the IEP meeting at

> times but that's besides the point)

>

> There is so much more to preschool disabled programs than " hearing

> other children speak " or " socialization " as a child can get that

> at 'any' preschool or local park. An appropriate placement will get

> your PRESCHOOL apraxic child up to speed so that you can make that

> choice whether homeschooling or private schooling or public

schooling

> will be best for that child (not us as parents) from K-12.

>

> My 11 yo son is just one of hundreds that are thriving today.

> (and his preschool was Summit Speech School in New Providence NJ)

>

> I WISH SSS went up to HS!!

>

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

Here is what I did when I was trying to decide where to put Landon

when he aged out of EI. He had an OT, ST, and developmental

evaluation when he aged out. We had our transition meeting and

somehow he ended up being eligible for disabled classroom setting. I

listened to what was available for him, asked my questions about the

classroom, some even go and view the classroom, made many phone calls

and talked to people and got there opinions on where to put him, and

then I made my decision based on all the information that was

available to me. Landon didn't have fine/gross motor delays and had

about 50+ words that he was spontaneously speaking. So for him

disabled classroom was not the appropriate setting. I turned down

disabled preschool and went private church program--2 days a week,

with 3 speech sessions. Right after he started school I had upped

his fish oil dose and 6 months later he tested age appropriate for

expressive speech. So for him the church program gave him the

opportunity to around other kids his age and to be in an environment

to learn what was age apropriate for 3 year olds--introducing colors,

shapes, circle time, constructive play time. This year he is 4 and I

again turned down disabled classroom and went private church program

3 days a week with 4 speech sessions. It comes down to what is the

appropriate setting for the child looking at the entire picture of

the child's needs to determine what the appropriate setting is. I

would think this would also be important for those that want to

homeschool--weighing the pros and cons, finding out what your child

would be learning in a preschool disabled classroom or private

preschool, securing therapies and other special needs, having a

transition meeting and listening to what the professionals opinions

are based on your child's needs, and then making the decision for the

best fit to further your child in overcoming whatever the delays are.

This was the hardest decision for me to know what he needed and where

he needed to be to help him the most!

Tina

>

> I don't believe anyone is offended and why not continue to discuss

> this here so we can as a group come up with an intelligent answer

for

> the majority. Yes some home school and that's great -but let's

recap

> as this topic has twisted from the original message posted which was

> in regards to information in The Late Talker book. Since I'm one of

> the co authors I wish to clarify.

>

> While some of the aspects of The Late Talker can be applied to older

> children -the book is geared for parents of preschool children who

> are not yet talking for known or unknown reasons referred to by

> society as " late talkers " -thus the name of the book. I repeatedly

> said " preschool " and yet this debate somehow has transcended into a

> debate over home schooling for K-12. So let me be clear (again)

that

> a preschool disabled program is not about education -and it's not

> about social for an apraxic child -it's about a special program that

> helps with that child's fine and gross motor skills and

> communication. If after reading one persons thoughts some of you

> wish to consider this route that's your prerogative. Just like

> anything else that is debated here -there is no question in my mind

> that some of you will be sorry. You can be wrong -but you can't go

> back and do preschool years over. I would understand this passion

> for home schooling preschool apraxic children if there was an

example

> of a child that was thriving today -older -yet severe profound

> apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert cricket sound here) On

the other hand

> tons of children from this group have gone the preschool disabled

> program route and (again) the main problems is securing the

> appropriate services through the IEP -not social aspects -and not

> rude people (outside of some of the people at the IEP meeting at

> times but that's besides the point)

>

> There is so much more to preschool disabled programs than " hearing

> other children speak " or " socialization " as a child can get that

> at 'any' preschool or local park. An appropriate placement will get

> your PRESCHOOL apraxic child up to speed so that you can make that

> choice whether homeschooling or private schooling or public

schooling

> will be best for that child (not us as parents) from K-12.

>

> My 11 yo son is just one of hundreds that are thriving today.

> (and his preschool was Summit Speech School in New Providence NJ)

>

> I WISH SSS went up to HS!!

>

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

My child started ST at 30 mos. He could say " mama " , " dada " , and " nana "

for his sister not banana.

Now at 58mos he can say the " h " sound and " no " and many others. Just

yesterday he pointed to the cabinet where the plates are kept and

said " Pate " instead if " Pay " and I understood he wanted a " plate " .

He has improved so much from always crying and head banging in his

frustration to actually repeating himself several times in order to be

understood.

My son has severe apraxia, dysarthria, hypotonia in his tongue, and a

short tongue. He was also born with physical birth defects. I don't

want to compare my child to yours but I wonder how many children out

there just have apraxia? My child has to work harder than many children

because he has more issues.

I will be glad to post when he is older to seak of his gains as a

homeschooler. Right now he's about the age of many children on this

board.

No one at my local public school had heard the word " apraxia " . No one

in my family ever heard the word. We never heard a doctor say it until

years after we started looking for help for my son. Just because you

haven't heard of apraxic children who are homeschooled who are thriving

doesn't mean they don't exist. Except for your child and Kahlid (SP?) I

haven't heard of any children thriving who have apraxia and I read your

book and donated it to my son's ped who hadn't heard of it either.

>

I would understand this passion for home schooling preschool apraxic

children if there was an example of a child that was thriving today -

older -yet severe profound apraxic preschool age. Name one...(insert

cricket sound here)

[Guest guest]

This is precisely why I homeschool my four children:

" ...Special situations are fine for home schooling, but these kids need

to get out and learn to be a part of society... "

If my child was in an institutional setting they would miss out on

being a part of society!

[Guest guest]

I wanted to post to say I tried my local public school system for my

disabled child and it did not work out.

I am very open minded. I want to try everything for my 58 mo son to

help him. Unfortunately my local Pre-Kindergarten Disability Class is

terrible!

>

> One problem with this is you are assuming we all have access to good

sped preschools. That's not the case in my area (a large

> metropolitan area, so I'm sure I'm not alone). I'm not pro sped

> preschool, pro typical preschool or pro homeschooling. I'm pro

> whatever works:-)

I don't think anyone should claim people should only go the sped

preschool route or they will be sorry. If I sent my son to our local

sped preschool, I truly would be sorry. I'm glad you had such a

wonderful resource in your area.

[Guest guest]

I can't comment on CA homeschooling because I don't know their laws.

>

> Hi Kim, What is your reaction to California's requirement that home

school instructors be credentialed????? Fay, Damon's grandma

>

[Guest guest]

The original law there required group affiliation. Someone's kid came

up abused and in that criminal case an extension of the law was

attached now requiring all homeschoolers to be credentialed teachers.

It will likely be overuled as it does not transport well federally but

for now that law will be Cali law effective within a month. Happened

once before there I think.

> >

> > Hi Kim, What is your reaction to California's requirement that home

> school instructors be credentialed????? Fay, Damon's grandma

> >

>