Re: (blushing) yes, MORE fish oil questions

[Guest guest]

we give the same fish oils to our boys every day -even in

one day my son Tanner regresses without his oil. He gets bumpy in

speech. If a professional told me to rotate or change his formula I

would not unless there was a danger to what he was taking which there

is not. For the most part there is not enough education and

awareness about the PUFAs. In fact the more you learn the more you

realize you have to still find out. It's complex in that

way...simple in that it works even if you don't understand why -and

even if you are skeptical about it working. Doesn't matter. For

most it just works!

The Omega 369 is the commercial line and the same thing as the ProEFA

which is the professional line that used to be anyway less expensive

since you get 90 vs. 60 capsules. If you want to raise anything you

want to raise the EPA -most of us do that for apraxia with a 2/1

ratio. So for every two ProEFA capsules you would use one ProEPA.

Some go up to three times a day with that.

The archive below was written when we used to raise the dosage very

slow over months -with Dr. ' findings however many

today including Dr. ' own son moved to the 9 capsules a day

fairly quick.

Just a note that my ADHD child needs a 1/1 ratio of ProEFA to ProEPA

and he gets 5 of each a day. When I tried to raise the EPA any

higher with Tanner he regressed -so the 2/1 is it. Tanner we've

learned over the years if pretty typical of the majority of children

with apraxia.

Did you see the following archive?

Below is a new member archived message, and an " EFA 101 basics "

archived message to hopefully answer more of your

questions for now (did you read The Late Talker yet?) For updated

information on vitamin E and more - please visit the links section

here

/links

What type of apraxic like speech behaviors are you seeing that makes

you and the SLP suspect your child has apraxia vs. a simple delay in

speech? Is your child talking at all yet? At your child's age -

without speech, it's difficult to diagnose verbal apraxia -they

could " suspect " verbal apraxia and begin treatment just in case,

which wouldn't hurt your child if he ended up just having a simple

delay. Just a few questions before we could provide more accurate

answers:

Does your child have signs of oral apraxia? (for example, can he on

command smile, imitate funny faces, blow bubbles...if you put peanut

butter anywhere around his mouth can he lick it off no matter where

it is?)

http://www.cherab.org/information/speechlanguage/oralapraxia.html

Does your child have any neurological " soft signs " such as hypotonia

or sensory integration dysfunction?

http://www.cherab.org/information/speechlanguage/parentfriendlysoftsigns.html

Who else evaluated your child? Was it only the SLP through your

town school or was he also in Early Intervention through the state?

(birth to three) Was he evaluated by both a speech pathologist as

well as an occupational therapist? Was/were they knowledgeable

about apraxia? (If your child wasn't diagnosed by an occupational

therapist as well and professionals suspect apraxia -I highly

recommend you request that too either through both the school as

well as private through insurance for many reasons)

To answer any questions you may have about taking your child to see a

neurodevelopmental MD if he has not yet been to one and apraxia is

suspected... in one word - " Yes!!! " I would have your child diagnosed

(private) by a neurodevelopmental medical doctor (developmental

pediatrician or pediatric neurologist) who is knowledgeable about

apraxia and other neurologically based multi-faceted communication

impairments for numerous reasons. Reasons include (but not limited

to)

*having a " hero " on the outside of the school who can assist in a

therapeutic plan and oversee your child's development over the years

*advocacy support with the insurance company

* ruling out or confirming any neurological soft signs or any other

reasons for the delay in speech

*help those that ask " why isn't he talking yet " understand this is a

medical condition -and has nothing to do with your child's cognitive

ability. (if in your child's case it doesn't. Apraxia in itself

does not affect a child's cognitive ability -and speaking early or

late is no indication of a child's intelligence. Also contrary to

popular belief -most who have speech impairments have average to

above average intelligence)

Here's an article written by Neurodevelopmental Pediatrician Dr.

Marilyn Agin that was featured as a cover article in Contemporary

Pediatrics -a trade magazine for hundreds of thousands of pediatric

medical professionals across the US. (I wrote the parent guide)

" The " late talker " -when silence isn't golden

Not all children with delayed speech are " little Einsteins " or garden

variety " late bloomers. " Some have a speech-language disorder that

will persist unless warning signs are recognized and intervention

comes early. Includes a Guide for Parents. "

Cover feature article by Late Talker co-author Marilyn Agin MD

http://www.contemporarypediatrics.com/contpeds/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=1327\

20

Parent guide of article by Late Talker co-author

[Guest guest]

I am just trying to see if I am up on the " current thinking " on fish oil.

I understood we were supposed to add the ProEFA and ProEPA slowly -- like over a

period

of months. I have a seven-year-old who has been on the equivalent of two ProEFA

and

one ProEPA twice a day. I would like to increase to three times a day. How

long should I

stay on the current twice a day before upping it?

Also, once you have increased, do you ever go down -- not cut it out, but are

you ever

able to reduce?

Finally, what level of Vitamin E are most on? We've been using Vitamin World

High Gamma

for several months -- 2 capsules a day. We've played around with this quite a

bit. My

child did really well on the Yasoo Liquid, but I stopped that on 's

advice. The

Vitamin E capsules haven't given us the same result, but we keep on them anyway.

What would y'all increase first -- the fish oil or Vitamin E -- or would you

increase both at

the same time?

Thanks for all the help. I just wanted to say that over Thanksgiving, our

family had a

horrible stomach virus. I had to stop all supplements, and as it was going

through the

whole family, I forgot to start it all back up until one day my child said

something to me

and for the first time in a long, long time I realized I couldn't understand

what she was

saying!!! I realized that her speech had become less clear during the first

week, and by the

second week, there was a dramatic decrease in intelligibility.

>

> we give the same fish oils to our boys every day -even in

> one day my son Tanner regresses without his oil. He gets bumpy in

> speech. If a professional told me to rotate or change his formula I

> would not unless there was a danger to what he was taking which there

> is not. For the most part there is not enough education and

> awareness about the PUFAs. In fact the more you learn the more you

> realize you have to still find out. It's complex in that

> way...simple in that it works even if you don't understand why -and

> even if you are skeptical about it working. Doesn't matter. For

> most it just works!

>

> The Omega 369 is the commercial line and the same thing as the ProEFA

> which is the professional line that used to be anyway less expensive

> since you get 90 vs. 60 capsules. If you want to raise anything you

> want to raise the EPA -most of us do that for apraxia with a 2/1

> ratio. So for every two ProEFA capsules you would use one ProEPA.

> Some go up to three times a day with that.

>

> The archive below was written when we used to raise the dosage very

> slow over months -with Dr. ' findings however many

> today including Dr. ' own son moved to the 9 capsules a day

> fairly quick.

>

> Just a note that my ADHD child needs a 1/1 ratio of ProEFA to ProEPA

> and he gets 5 of each a day. When I tried to raise the EPA any

> higher with Tanner he regressed -so the 2/1 is it. Tanner we've

> learned over the years if pretty typical of the majority of children

> with apraxia.

>

> Did you see the following archive?

>

> Below is a new member archived message, and an " EFA 101 basics "

> archived message to hopefully answer more of your

> questions for now (did you read The Late Talker yet?) For updated

> information on vitamin E and more - please visit the links section

> here

> /links

>

> What type of apraxic like speech behaviors are you seeing that makes

> you and the SLP suspect your child has apraxia vs. a simple delay in

> speech? Is your child talking at all yet? At your child's age -

> without speech, it's difficult to diagnose verbal apraxia -they

> could " suspect " verbal apraxia and begin treatment just in case,

> which wouldn't hurt your child if he ended up just having a simple

> delay. Just a few questions before we could provide more accurate

> answers:

>

> Does your child have signs of oral apraxia? (for example, can he on

> command smile, imitate funny faces, blow bubbles...if you put peanut

> butter anywhere around his mouth can he lick it off no matter where

> it is?)

> http://www.cherab.org/information/speechlanguage/oralapraxia.html

>

> Does your child have any neurological " soft signs " such as hypotonia

> or sensory integration dysfunction?

> http://www.cherab.org/information/speechlanguage/parentfriendlysoftsigns.html

>

> Who else evaluated your child? Was it only the SLP through your

> town school or was he also in Early Intervention through the state?

> (birth to three) Was he evaluated by both a speech pathologist as

> well as an occupational therapist? Was/were they knowledgeable

> about apraxia? (If your child wasn't diagnosed by an occupational

> therapist as well and professionals suspect apraxia -I highly

> recommend you request that too either through both the school as

> well as private through insurance for many reasons)

>

> To answer any questions you may have about taking your child to see a

> neurodevelopmental MD if he has not yet been to one and apraxia is

> suspected... in one word - " Yes!!! " I would have your child diagnosed

> (private) by a neurodevelopmental medical doctor (developmental

> pediatrician or pediatric neurologist) who is knowledgeable about

> apraxia and other neurologically based multi-faceted communication

> impairments for numerous reasons. Reasons include (but not limited

> to)

>

> *having a " hero " on the outside of the school who can assist in a

> therapeutic plan and oversee your child's development over the years

> *advocacy support with the insurance company

> * ruling out or confirming any neurological soft signs or any other

> reasons for the delay in speech

> *help those that ask " why isn't he talking yet " understand this is a

> medical condition -and has nothing to do with your child's cognitive

> ability. (if in your child's case it doesn't. Apraxia in itself

> does not affect a child's cognitive ability -and speaking early or

> late is no indication of a child's intelligence. Also contrary to

> popular belief -most who have speech impairments have average to

> above average intelligence)

>

> Here's an article written by Neurodevelopmental Pediatrician Dr.

> Marilyn Agin that was featured as a cover article in Contemporary

> Pediatrics -a trade magazine for hundreds of thousands of pediatric

> medical professionals across the US. (I wrote the parent guide)

>

> " The " late talker " -when silence isn't golden

> Not all children with delayed speech are " little Einsteins " or garden

> variety " late bloomers. " Some have a speech-language disorder that

> will persist unless warning signs are recognized and intervention

> comes early. Includes a Guide for Parents. "

>

> Cover feature article by Late Talker co-author Marilyn Agin MD

>

http://www.contemporarypediatrics.com/contpeds/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=1327\

20

> Parent guide of article by Late Talker co-author

[Guest guest]

Thank you. And so to clarify, the omega 3 is the EPA? What is cod

liver oil then? EPA or something different?

Why is this so darn hard for me? I really am smart. Really.

Ahhhh.

Michele

[Guest guest]

I have read a lot on the fish oils but when I just looked at my NN

Complete 3 6 9 (60)gelcaps, I noticed the quantity of the levels aer

a bit off from what is being stated on this list as optimal. It says:

PER 2 softgels ==

EPA 270 mg DHA 180mg Other Omega 3s 115mg

GLA 66mg

OA 160mg

Is this the right one??? How much should I be giving of it?

I wish they just sold one type. I have been researching DAN for a

long time, but for some reason, the fish oils which you would think

should be easy, is by far the most confusing.

Thanks.

Michele

>

> I have asked so many fish oil questions, I am soooo embarrassed to

> bring up the subject again but here goes...

>

> I bought from the store NN complete omega 3-6-9 and Omega-3

purified

> fish oil. Are these the correct ones or was I supposed to buy a

> kids' one that is lower dose?

>

> Okay, now according to his genetics from Yasko testing (I posted

> about her biomed approach on this site before, I believe), my son

> needs lipids like fish oil rotated. Is it okay to give 3-6-9 one

day

> and omega 3 the next or do they need to be given on the same day to

> have the correct ratio?

>

> I gave my son half a capsule of the 3-6-9 yesterday. He is hyper

on

> it already ... not sure if this is good or bad but it is typical

for

> my son to react right away to supplements. He seems to have better

> eye contact and be 'seeing' things more (like he was checking out a

> toy lizard on his brother's dresser as though he never saw it

before

> when it has been there a looooooong time) and is making many more

> sounds but they sound like verbal stims to me. I am going to push

> foward. I will post if I see any language gains.

>

> Thanks in advance to anyone who knows the answers to my questions

and

> takes the time to respond!

>

> Michele

>

[Guest guest]

I would love an answer to this too. I was going over formulas as we are

switching from

Equazen's Eye Q to Nordic Naturals.

What is the exact brand that everyone is using now and is NN Complete 3 6 9

(which I can

find at Whole Foods) the same as ProEFA (which I would need to order). As I am

switching,

I was to use the EXACT formula that has shown the best results.

Also, how long should one stay on 2-a-day dosing before moving to 3-a-day

dosing?

> >

> > I have asked so many fish oil questions, I am soooo embarrassed to

> > bring up the subject again but here goes...

> >

> > I bought from the store NN complete omega 3-6-9 and Omega-3

> purified

> > fish oil. Are these the correct ones or was I supposed to buy a

> > kids' one that is lower dose?

> >

> > Okay, now according to his genetics from Yasko testing (I posted

> > about her biomed approach on this site before, I believe), my son

> > needs lipids like fish oil rotated. Is it okay to give 3-6-9 one

> day

> > and omega 3 the next or do they need to be given on the same day to

> > have the correct ratio?

> >

> > I gave my son half a capsule of the 3-6-9 yesterday. He is hyper

> on

> > it already ... not sure if this is good or bad but it is typical

> for

> > my son to react right away to supplements. He seems to have better

> > eye contact and be 'seeing' things more (like he was checking out a

> > toy lizard on his brother's dresser as though he never saw it

> before

> > when it has been there a looooooong time) and is making many more

> > sounds but they sound like verbal stims to me. I am going to push

> > foward. I will post if I see any language gains.

> >

> > Thanks in advance to anyone who knows the answers to my questions

> and

> > takes the time to respond!

> >

> > Michele

> >

>

[Guest guest]

they are all fish oil -just different formulas. Cod liver

oil is fish oil -but fish oil made from the liver of the fish so it

contains naturally vitamin A. Fish oil not made from the liver of

the fish does not contain vitamin A. All fish oil has omega 3/DHA

and/or EPA -but some are also supplemented with a small amount of

omega 6/GLA such as primrose or borage seed oil (make sure it's

always the borage seed and not the borage plant -Nordic uses the

seed) We have found in this group that the small amount of Omega 6

is needed to see more dramatic surges. If you use the cod liver oil

and the ProEFA you changed the formula and raised the DHA -so you

either won't see a surge -or less of one. (in almost all cases -yes

there are around 10-20% exceptions we found)

http://www.cherab.org/information/historyEFA.html

Hope that helps -it's lots to learn all at once for sure!

Here's more info on EFAs from CHERAB

http://www.cherab.org/information/indexinformation.html#diet

=====