Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Hi Everyone, I'm feeling a little crazy, so I thought I'd post this question (scenario) to you guys to see if I can gain a little clarity..... My son (he'll be 3 at the end of March) receives one hour each week of OT, and I'm incredibly grateful to have it. From the very beginning, I wasn't completely comfortable with the OTs approach, but life isn't perfect.....Anyway, last Tuesday when I took my son for his session, I let her know that I'm not using the program (Vital Sounds) at home because I wanted to see if some of his behaviors decreased (Vital Sounds had been his auditory program). He'd been getting pretty difficult at home (hitting and kicking), and hitting other kids (not constantly.....but there's an increase in behaviors). I'd actually stopped a couple of things (vital sounds and a homeopathic remedy that my homeopath gave him). I've seen a HUGE leap in development, dramatic play and language, but a lot of difficult behaviors, too. Furthermore, the OT doesn't seem to know THAT MUCH about this program (but I've never said anything like that to her -- I was extremely nice). ANyway, she seemed very offended or frustrated by the fact that I've suspended it for " a couple of weeks " . During the session, she was also very irritible and rough with my son. He works so hard when he's at OT, so to see her jerking him or pulling on him in a pretty rough manner almost made me cry. As I mentioned before, I've never been incredibly impressed with the way in which she speaks to him, but it began to really irritate me at this session. She's always saying things like, " NO.....not that way.....what are you doing.....pay attention.....you're not paying attention......you're not trying, work harder " , and it's in this drill sergent tone. She doesn't yell, but it's in a very loud and condensending way. So my question is this -- is this a standard approach for an OT session?? To see my son lying on his belly on a swinging innertube (that's suspended from the ceiling), trying his best to pick up beanbags from the floor while she (OT) is physically jerking his arms in an effort to correct his body position and saying pretty negative things, seems like the wrong approach for a two year old. Am I overracting? I'm grateful to have the service, but my gut is telling me that this is the wrong therapist for my son. One more thing.....someone from another list serv said they'd seen aggressive behaviors from this program. I'm going to contact them for more information. I merely wanted to suspend this program until I understand it a little better. Any feedback or information is appreciated. Thanks _________________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser.msn.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 - I'm not an expert but I don't think you're crazy or overreacting. Just reading your post makes me so mad I want to grab the OT by the arm roughly and ask her " what are you doing!!! " and maybe shake her a couple of times too boot. I would lose my mind if I saw anyone treating my son that way, much less a therapist who is supposed to be helping him. If your gut is telling you this person is wrong for your boy I say trust your gut. What are your options for addressing the issue? ~Dylan~ God loves you just the way you are, And he loves you too much to let you stay that way. [ ] OT Questions Hi Everyone, I'm feeling a little crazy, so I thought I'd post this question (scenario) to you guys to see if I can gain a little clarity..... My son (he'll be 3 at the end of March) receives one hour each week of OT, and I'm incredibly grateful to have it. From the very beginning, I wasn't completely comfortable with the OTs approach, but life isn't perfect.....Anyway, last Tuesday when I took my son for his session, I let her know that I'm not using the program (Vital Sounds) at home because I wanted to see if some of his behaviors decreased (Vital Sounds had been his auditory program). He'd been getting pretty difficult at home (hitting and kicking), and hitting other kids (not constantly.....but there's an increase in behaviors). I'd actually stopped a couple of things (vital sounds and a homeopathic remedy that my homeopath gave him). I've seen a HUGE leap in development, dramatic play and language, but a lot of difficult behaviors, too. Furthermore, the OT doesn't seem to know THAT MUCH about this program (but I've never said anything like that to her -- I was extremely nice). ANyway, she seemed ! very offended or frustrated by the fact that I've suspended it for " a couple of weeks " . During the session, she was also very irritible and rough with my son. He works so hard when he's at OT, so to see her jerking him or pulling on him in a pretty rough manner almost made me cry. As I mentioned before, I've never been incredibly impressed with the way in which she speaks to him, but it began to really irritate me at this session. She's always saying things like, " NO.....not that way.....what are you doing.....pay attention.....you're not paying attention......you're not trying, work harder " , and it's in this drill sergent tone. She doesn't yell, but it's in a very loud and condensending way. So my question is this -- is this a standard approach for an OT session?? To see my son lying on his belly on a swinging innertube (that's suspended from the ceiling), trying his best to pick up beanbags from the floor while she (OT) is physically jer! king his arms in an effort to correct his body position and saying pretty negative things, seems like the wrong approach for a two year old. Am I overracting? I'm grateful to have the service, but my gut is telling me that this is the wrong therapist for my son. One more thing.....someone from another list serv said they'd seen aggressive behaviors from this program. I'm going to contact them for more information. I merely wanted to suspend this program until I understand it a little better. Any feedback or information is appreciated. Thanks __________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser <http://biggestloser.msn.com/> .msn.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 After writing this post last night, I laid in bed for hours thinking about how " crazy " I am.....I'm crazy for not recognizing and admitting this earlier!!!!! I've been so grateful to get the service that I didn't want to entertain the thoughts that this OT is not good AT ALL for my son. I feel like each time I call my coordinator from EI, there's more and more excuses why we shouldn't get certain services, etc, and the atmosphere is thick with " Oh no, here she comes again " .....so I didn't want to have to address a complaint issue. You're right, and I can't take him back there. She's horrible with him. Having a child with special needs is making me fight for what's right for him, and I've never been that great with conflict -- but I'm learning and getting better. Thanks so much for your input, Dylan. @...: msdylan@...: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 07:32:52 -0800Subject: RE: [ ] OT Questions - I'm not an expert but I don't think you're crazy oroverreacting. Just reading your post makes me so mad I want to grab theOT by the arm roughly and ask her " what are you doing!!! " and maybeshake her a couple of times too boot. I would lose my mind if I sawanyone treating my son that way, much less a therapist who is supposedto be helping him. If your gut is telling you this person is wrong foryour boy I say trust your gut. What are your options for addressingthe issue? ~Dylan~God loves you just the way you are,And he loves you too much to let you stay that way. -----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of HanaganSent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 12:34 AMTo: @...: [ ] OT QuestionsHi Everyone,I'm feeling a little crazy, so I thought I'd post this question(scenario) to you guys to see if I can gain a little clarity.....My son (he'll be 3 at the end of March) receives one hour each week ofOT, and I'm incredibly grateful to have it. From the very beginning, Iwasn't completely comfortable with the OTs approach, but life isn'tperfect.....Anyway, last Tuesday when I took my son for his session, Ilet her know that I'm not using the program (Vital Sounds) at homebecause I wanted to see if some of his behaviors decreased (Vital Soundshad been his auditory program). He'd been getting pretty difficult athome (hitting and kicking), and hitting other kids (notconstantly.....but there's an increase in behaviors). I'd actuallystopped a couple of things (vital sounds and a homeopathic remedy thatmy homeopath gave him). I've seen a HUGE leap in development, dramaticplay and language, but a lot of difficult behaviors, too. Furthermore,the OT doesn't seem to know THAT MUCH about this program (but I've neversaid anything like that to her -- I was extremely nice). ANyway, sheseemed ! very offended or frustrated by the fact that I've suspended itfor " a couple of weeks " . During the session, she was also very irritibleand rough with my son. He works so hard when he's at OT, so to see herjerking him or pulling on him in a pretty rough manner almost made mecry. As I mentioned before, I've never been incredibly impressed withthe way in which she speaks to him, but it began to really irritate meat this session. She's always saying things like, " NO.....not thatway.....what are you doing.....pay attention.....you're not payingattention......you're not trying, work harder " , and it's in this drillsergent tone. She doesn't yell, but it's in a very loud andcondensending way. So my question is this -- is this a standard approachfor an OT session?? To see my son lying on his belly on a swinginginnertube (that's suspended from the ceiling), trying his best to pickup beanbags from the floor while she (OT) is physically jer! king hisarms in an effort to correct his body position and saying prettynegative things, seems like the wrong approach for a two year old. Am Ioverracting? I'm grateful to have the service, but my gut is telling methat this is the wrong therapist for my son. One more thing.....someone from another list serv said they'd seenaggressive behaviors from this program. I'm going to contact them formore information. I merely wanted to suspend this program until Iunderstand it a little better. Any feedback or information isappreciated.Thanks __________________________________________________________Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser!http://biggestloser <http://biggestloser.msn.com/> .msn.com/[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 I had these kind of misgivings from an OT in EI. She IMO manhandled my son and said he had this sensory issue and this other one. Well a private OT who was an expert in sensory said he didn't! My son was acting in a certain way because he didn't like the OT! I stopped with her. I also had misgivings about another therapist he worked with for about 8 months. I just never felt quite right, but nothing was awful either and I was right there during every therapy. He also didn't enjoy going like he did with speech and his new OT. At our last session when he was uncooperative she grabbed him and pulled him to the ground. That was our last session! I heard other complaints in later years from other parents. You've given it a chance, now listen to your gut! Miche On Jan 24, 2008 8:32 AM, Dylan Whitlow <msdylan@...> wrote: > - I'm not an expert but I don't think you're crazy or > overreacting. Just reading your post makes me so mad I want to grab the > OT by the arm roughly and ask her " what are you doing!!! " and maybe > shake her a couple of times too boot. I would lose my mind if I saw > anyone treating my son that way, much less a therapist who is supposed > to be helping him. If your gut is telling you this person is wrong for > your boy I say trust your gut. What are your options for addressing > the issue? > > > ~Dylan~ > God loves you just the way you are, > And he loves you too much to let you stay that way. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Therapy should be fun from the child's point of view. Granted, they have to work, but it should be fun and rewarding. During vision therapy, one day my child didn't want to go. I talked with the lead therapist that day, and told her he didn't want to come. She asked what his interests were and what he liked. She switched up the order of thing they worked on that day. The next time we came, they had a backhoe and dump truck sitting in the middle of the floor for him to play with (his favorites). He never complained again! Go with your gut!!! > > I had these kind of misgivings from an OT in EI. She IMO manhandled my son > and said he had this sensory issue and this other one. Well a private OT > who was an expert in sensory said he didn't! My son was acting in a certain > way because he didn't like the OT! I stopped with her. I also had > misgivings about another therapist he worked with for about 8 months. I > just never felt quite right, but nothing was awful either and I was right > there during every therapy. He also didn't enjoy going like he did with > speech and his new OT. At our last session when he was uncooperative she > grabbed him and pulled him to the ground. That was our last session! I > heard other complaints in later years from other parents. You've given it a > chance, now listen to your gut! > > Miche > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 It is a horrible predictament. Firstly we have to BEG for services. The process itself makes us seem like complete battle-axes for that is how hard we must fight to get our children's needs met. Then we FINALLY get therapy only to have our child ABUSED by some incompetent B.I. So..... do we complain and then completely alienate ourselves from the 'system' higher ups, who will then label us as being 'impossible to please' thus forever banning us from the services stream..... (we will always and forever be last on the 'list' and guess what.... we will always be faced with the most incompetent and horrible of OT's)....?? Soooo..... what DO you do? Is it possible to speak to the OT privately and make kind 'suggestions' as to how your little baby responds best? Is it possible to jump into the therapy room and give her a hand? She's struggling with him on her own because she obviously doesn't understand babies all that well. (I'll bet she doesn't have any). Perhaps if you offered to go in there to help out, to help speak your son's language and to take the pressure and the 'edge' off of her, then you will get a better outcome. Sometimes, we need to 'train' people who work for us and develop them so that they can do their job the way we want them to. Don't necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the therapist is young, I would say that you have a good opportunity to work with her and develop her skills. If she is older and 'been around the block a few times'..... forget it..... don't waste your time since her pattern of working with kids is already set. The question is..... if you discontinue this 'free therapy'..... are you going to get any more? Or will you get completely 'shut-down' by the system.... careful here! I've definately been there, done that! Janice [sPAM]RE: [ ] OT Questions After writing this post last night, I laid in bed for hours thinking about how " crazy " I am.....I'm crazy for not recognizing and admitting this earlier!!!!! I've been so grateful to get the service that I didn't want to entertain the thoughts that this OT is not good AT ALL for my son. I feel like each time I call my coordinator from EI, there's more and more excuses why we shouldn't get certain services, etc, and the atmosphere is thick with " Oh no, here she comes again " .....so I didn't want to have to address a complaint issue. You're right, and I can't take him back there. She's horrible with him. Having a child with special needs is making me fight for what's right for him, and I've never been that great with conflict -- but I'm learning and getting better. Thanks so much for your input, Dylan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Don't beat yourself up. You've learned a lesson, listen to your instincts. I know we all think (in the beginning) therapy is going to fix my kid, I need to fight for therapy, bla bla bla... The harsch reality is the majority - and I would go as far as 90%+ are grossly UNDERTRAINED. My guess is that therapist was using ABA (obviously incorrectly)- probably had one class or seminar, so now she's an expert. Did it occur to her that maybe she's looking at a boy with low seratonin in his brain? Or, here's a boy going through a yeast flare? NOOOOOOOO... they don't know, they don't want to know... they just collect their money... shame! What you were seeing in your child was something totally different right... you see a sick child - he's got metabollic and nutritional deficiencies (because he's probably toxic) which are at the root of this behavior. Did the OT see this? NO, they don't even subscribe to the whole " my kid is toxic " thing. Do any of them bother to do any self study? Or read any of the literature we Mom's are begging them to look into. No, when you walk out that door, you get an eye roll, your info got pitched and she's chalked you up to another hysterical Mom. But, they've got no problemo taking their 130.00 + bene's. It sickens me. IT's the same thing with our Pediatritons... we ASSUME they are in the know... they are NOT, and eventhough they are seeing streams of kids with similiar problems the LAZY lot of them aren't bothering to look outside the box. That's why, in my opinion, I think it's best to become your kids therapist. The NACD program is not new, why don't we see these techniques practiced anywhere in the mainstream? Get a DAN! and help your son/daughter to get physically well step by step. Mainstream therapy was useless while my sons gut and brain was a mess. Now that he's come so far, Montessori school has been like all day OT. Not all kids can recover, but many many can. Moms need to stop depending on these self-prfessed mainstream experts and listen to their instinct. > > It is a horrible predictament. > > Firstly we have to BEG for services. The process itself makes us seem like complete battle-axes for that is how hard we must fight to get our children's needs met. Then we FINALLY get therapy only to have our child ABUSED by some incompetent B.I. > > So..... do we complain and then completely alienate ourselves from the 'system' higher ups, who will then label us as being 'impossible to please' thus forever banning us from the services stream..... (we will always and forever be last on the 'list' and guess what.... we will always be faced with the most incompetent and horrible of OT's)....?? > > Soooo..... what DO you do? > > Is it possible to speak to the OT privately and make kind 'suggestions' as to how your little baby responds best? Is it possible to jump into the therapy room and give her a hand? She's struggling with him on her own because she obviously doesn't understand babies all that well. (I'll bet she doesn't have any). Perhaps if you offered to go in there to help out, to help speak your son's language and to take the pressure and the 'edge' off of her, then you will get a better outcome. > > Sometimes, we need to 'train' people who work for us and develop them so that they can do their job the way we want them to. Don't necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the therapist is young, I would say that you have a good opportunity to work with her and develop her skills. > > If she is older and 'been around the block a few times'..... forget it..... don't waste your time since her pattern of working with kids is already set. > > The question is..... if you discontinue this 'free therapy'..... are you going to get any more? Or will you get completely 'shut- down' by the system.... careful here! > > I've definately been there, done that! > > Janice > > > [sPAM]RE: [ ] OT Questions > > > > After writing this post last night, I laid in bed for hours thinking about how " crazy " I am.....I'm crazy for not recognizing and admitting this earlier!!!!! I've been so grateful to get the service that I didn't want to entertain the thoughts that this OT is not good AT ALL for my son. I feel like each time I call my coordinator from EI, there's more and more excuses why we shouldn't get certain services, etc, and the atmosphere is thick with " Oh no, here she comes again " .....so I didn't want to have to address a complaint issue. You're right, and I can't take him back there. She's horrible with him. Having a child with special needs is making me fight for what's right for him, and I've never been that great with conflict -- but I'm learning and getting better. Thanks so much for your input, Dylan. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Hi Janice, You make some good points. This is exactly how I feel. I finally got the therapy after EI has told me on numerous occasions that I couldn't have it. Now I'm stuck with someone incompetent. But to clarify some things, I always, always, always go to the sessions with my son. I'm involved physically and verbally in OT as well as ST. I help the therapist (OT) out each time by swinging, throwing bean bags, whatever. I also model how to talk to him. My son gives her no problems whatsoever. He is completely compliant during sessions (wish he was like that at home). She was rough with him when he couldn't physically do the tasks, and this happened several times during the session. My son actually got red blotches on his face after one of her " jerking " episodes., which indicated to me that he was embarrassed. I could tell that he was working as hard as he could. In fact, she was inappropriate with him during the entire session. She was insulted (I feel) when I did not comply with her requests to do the auditory program (to temporarly suspend it). The speech therapist has questioned some of her observations of my son as well, and questioned her qualifications. I always let things go because I felt that he desperately needed the services and as long as she was not harming him.....an so on. She's also at least 40 years old and has an adult son, so this isn't a case of youth. I guess I'll need to confront her, because I can't let go of these services. Thanks for reminding me to move with caution I'm going to work on being more professional and cautious with these situations. I know their game, I probably need to start playing it too. @...: jscott@...: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 10:29:12 -0800Subject: RE: [ ] OT Questions It is a horrible predictament.Firstly we have to BEG for services. The process itself makes us seem like complete battle-axes for that is how hard we must fight to get our children's needs met. Then we FINALLY get therapy only to have our child ABUSED by some incompetent B.I.So..... do we complain and then completely alienate ourselves from the 'system' higher ups, who will then label us as being 'impossible to please' thus forever banning us from the services stream..... (we will always and forever be last on the 'list' and guess what.... we will always be faced with the most incompetent and horrible of OT's)....??Soooo..... what DO you do? Is it possible to speak to the OT privately and make kind 'suggestions' as to how your little baby responds best? Is it possible to jump into the therapy room and give her a hand? She's struggling with him on her own because she obviously doesn't understand babies all that well. (I'll bet she doesn't have any). Perhaps if you offered to go in there to help out, to help speak your son's language and to take the pressure and the 'edge' off of her, then you will get a better outcome.Sometimes, we need to 'train' people who work for us and develop them so that they can do their job the way we want them to. Don't necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the therapist is young, I would say that you have a good opportunity to work with her and develop her skills. If she is older and 'been around the block a few times'..... forget it..... don't waste your time since her pattern of working with kids is already set.The question is..... if you discontinue this 'free therapy'..... are you going to get any more? Or will you get completely 'shut-down' by the system.... careful here!I've definately been there, done that!Janice [sPAM]RE: [ ] OT QuestionsAfter writing this post last night, I laid in bed for hours thinking about how " crazy " I am.....I'm crazy for not recognizing and admitting this earlier!!!!! I've been so grateful to get the service that I didn't want to entertain the thoughts that this OT is not good AT ALL for my son. I feel like each time I call my coordinator from EI, there's more and more excuses why we shouldn't get certain services, etc, and the atmosphere is thick with " Oh no, here she comes again " .....so I didn't want to have to address a complaint issue. You're right, and I can't take him back there. She's horrible with him. Having a child with special needs is making me fight for what's right for him, and I've never been that great with conflict -- but I'm learning and getting better. Thanks so much for your input, Dylan. _________________________________________________________________ Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star power. http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Thanks.....but to clarify, his behavior was appropriate. He has no behavior problems while in therapy. He's a maniac at home, but with others, he's perfect. She should not be using ABA with my son, because he's completely compliant. @...: renee@...: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 19:08:27 +0000Subject: [ ] Re: OT Questions Don't beat yourself up. You've learned a lesson, listen to your instincts. I know we all think (in the beginning) therapy is going to fix my kid, I need to fight for therapy, bla bla bla...The harsch reality is the majority - and I would go as far as 90%+ are grossly UNDERTRAINED. My guess is that therapist was using ABA (obviously incorrectly)- probably had one class or seminar, so now she's an expert. Did it occur to her that maybe she's looking at a boy with low seratonin in his brain? Or, here's a boy going through a yeast flare? NOOOOOOOO... they don't know, they don't want to know... they just collect their money... shame!What you were seeing in your child was something totally different right... you see a sick child - he's got metabollic and nutritional deficiencies (because he's probably toxic) which are at the root of this behavior. Did the OT see this? NO, they don't even subscribe to the whole " my kid is toxic " thing. Do any of them bother to do any self study? Or read any of the literature we Mom's are begging them to look into. No, when you walk out that door, you get an eye roll, your info got pitched and she's chalked you up to another hysterical Mom.But, they've got no problemo taking their 130.00 + bene's. It sickens me. IT's the same thing with our Pediatritons... we ASSUME they are in the know... they are NOT, and eventhough they are seeing streams of kids with similiar problems the LAZY lot of them aren't bothering to look outside the box. That's why, in my opinion, I think it's best to become your kids therapist. The NACD program is not new, why don't we see these techniques practiced anywhere in the mainstream? Get a DAN! and help your son/daughter to get physically well step by step. Mainstream therapy was useless while my sons gut and brain was a mess. Now that he's come so far, Montessori school has been like all day OT. Not all kids can recover, but many many can. Moms need to stop depending on these self-prfessed mainstream experts and listen to their instinct. >> It is a horrible predictament.> > Firstly we have to BEG for services. The process itself makes us seem like complete battle-axes for that is how hard we must fight to get our children's needs met. Then we FINALLY get therapy only to have our child ABUSED by some incompetent B.I.> > So..... do we complain and then completely alienate ourselves from the 'system' higher ups, who will then label us as being 'impossible to please' thus forever banning us from the services stream..... (we will always and forever be last on the 'list' and guess what.... we will always be faced with the most incompetent and horrible of OT's)....??> > Soooo..... what DO you do?> > Is it possible to speak to the OT privately and make kind 'suggestions' as to how your little baby responds best? Is it possible to jump into the therapy room and give her a hand? She's struggling with him on her own because she obviously doesn't understand babies all that well. (I'll bet she doesn't have any). Perhaps if you offered to go in there to help out, to help speak your son's language and to take the pressure and the 'edge' off of her, then you will get a better outcome.> > Sometimes, we need to 'train' people who work for us and develop them so that they can do their job the way we want them to. Don't necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the therapist is young, I would say that you have a good opportunity to work with her and develop her skills.> > If she is older and 'been around the block a few times'..... forget it..... don't waste your time since her pattern of working with kids is already set.> > The question is..... if you discontinue this 'free therapy'..... are you going to get any more? Or will you get completely 'shut-down' by the system.... careful here!> > I've definately been there, done that!> > Janice> > > [sPAM]RE: [ ] OT Questions> > > > After writing this post last night, I laid in bed for hours thinking about how " crazy " I am.....I'm crazy for not recognizing and admitting this earlier!!!!! I've been so grateful to get the service that I didn't want to entertain the thoughts that this OT is not good AT ALL for my son. I feel like each time I call my coordinator from EI, there's more and more excuses why we shouldn't get certain services, etc, and the atmosphere is thick with " Oh no, here she comes again " .....so I didn't want to have to address a complaint issue. You're right, and I can't take him back there. She's horrible with him. Having a child with special needs is making me fight for what's right for him, and I've never been that great with conflict -- but I'm learning and getting better. Thanks so much for your input, Dylan.> > > _________________________________________________________________ Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star power. http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 , Although I am not an expert, I do not think you are overreacting at all. If this was my child, I would have taken him right out of that room and demanded a supervisor as well as request another OT. A therapist should not be grabbing a two year old or any child at that. They are supposed to encourage and praise the child on trying (even if wrong) - not degrade them. Steph Hanagan <hanagan_8@...> wrote: Hi Everyone, I'm feeling a little crazy, so I thought I'd post this question (scenario) to you guys to see if I can gain a little clarity..... My son (he'll be 3 at the end of March) receives one hour each week of OT, and I'm incredibly grateful to have it. From the very beginning, I wasn't completely comfortable with the OTs approach, but life isn't perfect.....Anyway, last Tuesday when I took my son for his session, I let her know that I'm not using the program (Vital Sounds) at home because I wanted to see if some of his behaviors decreased (Vital Sounds had been his auditory program). He'd been getting pretty difficult at home (hitting and kicking), and hitting other kids (not constantly.....but there's an increase in behaviors). I'd actually stopped a couple of things (vital sounds and a homeopathic remedy that my homeopath gave him). I've seen a HUGE leap in development, dramatic play and language, but a lot of difficult behaviors, too. Furthermore, the OT doesn't seem to know THAT MUCH about this program (but I've never said anything like that to her -- I was extremely nice). ANyway, she seemed very offended or frustrated by the fact that I've suspended it for " a couple of weeks " . During the session, she was also very irritible and rough with my son. He works so hard when he's at OT, so to see her jerking him or pulling on him in a pretty rough manner almost made me cry. As I mentioned before, I've never been incredibly impressed with the way in which she speaks to him, but it began to really irritate me at this session. She's always saying things like, " NO.....not that way.....what are you doing.....pay attention.....you're not paying attention......you're not trying, work harder " , and it's in this drill sergent tone. She doesn't yell, but it's in a very loud and condensending way. So my question is this -- is this a standard approach for an OT session?? To see my son lying on his belly on a swinging innertube (that's suspended from the ceiling), trying his best to pick up beanbags from the floor while she (OT) is physically jerking his arms in an effort to correct his body position and saying pretty negative things, seems like the wrong approach for a two year old. Am I overracting? I'm grateful to have the service, but my gut is telling me that this is the wrong therapist for my son. One more thing.....someone from another list serv said they'd seen aggressive behaviors from this program. I'm going to contact them for more information. I merely wanted to suspend this program until I understand it a little better. Any feedback or information is appreciated. Thanks __________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser.msn.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I agree, I would not let anyone be rough with my child. I was once taught when teaching these kids you are not supposed to you the word NO, in response to something they do incorrectly. People working with children should know better. Jen **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 1) You are not crazy 2) To do the thing she is doing with the inner tube you can have him lay on a coffee table and fish for stuff on the floor (we actually have a magnetic fishing puzzle for this) and the idea is to move his hand as he picks the thing up above his head...it strengthens the core. I did this as a superman type exercise in pt for back stuff. 3) Roughness is abusive and unwarranted. 3) Saying no patiently and calmly while making adjustments, etc. is what is correct. I have seen our OT do this many times with my son, who was extremely uncooperative and I am thankful we have her because she had the patience and wherewithall to do it the right way. 4) Getting someone who knows vital sounds involved is key. All these listening things are great and I have often read that increase in bad behaviors precedes great strides but still you need someone who knows it well overseeing it to be sure that is all it is. We have seen great and steady progress on The Listening Program only because our OT is good and knows it well. 5) I think if you can get a better OT at the same facility for these last few weeks before he ages out it would help. Even if it is a short period and they make little headway with him they can assess where he is at and give you homework to get him where he needs to be. You are an awesome mommy for sure.Do not question your own sanity. We warrior moms have enough people doing that to us. No need for self- harm. I have watched you fight hard to help your son on this board. He will surely benefit. Don't doubt yourself. Keep going. You can do this! .. > > [ ] OT Questions > > > > > Hi Everyone, > > I'm feeling a little crazy, so I thought I'd post this question > (scenario) to you guys to see if I can gain a little clarity..... > > My son (he'll be 3 at the end of March) receives one hour each week of > OT, and I'm incredibly grateful to have it. From the very beginning, I > wasn't completely comfortable with the OTs approach, but life isn't > perfect.....Anyway, last Tuesday when I took my son for his session, I > let her know that I'm not using the program (Vital Sounds) at home > because I wanted to see if some of his behaviors decreased (Vital Sounds > had been his auditory program). He'd been getting pretty difficult at > home (hitting and kicking), and hitting other kids (not > constantly.....but there's an increase in behaviors). I'd actually > stopped a couple of things (vital sounds and a homeopathic remedy that > my homeopath gave him). I've seen a HUGE leap in development, dramatic > play and language, but a lot of difficult behaviors, too. Furthermore, > the OT doesn't seem to know THAT MUCH about this program (but I've never > said anything like that to her -- I was extremely nice). ANyway, she > seemed ! very offended or frustrated by the fact that I've suspended it > for " a couple of weeks " . During the session, she was also very irritible > and rough with my son. He works so hard when he's at OT, so to see her > jerking him or pulling on him in a pretty rough manner almost made me > cry. As I mentioned before, I've never been incredibly impressed with > the way in which she speaks to him, but it began to really irritate me > at this session. She's always saying things like, " NO.....not that > way.....what are you doing.....pay attention.....you're not paying > attention......you're not trying, work harder " , and it's in this drill > sergent tone. She doesn't yell, but it's in a very loud and > condensending way. So my question is this -- is this a standard approach > for an OT session?? To see my son lying on his belly on a swinging > innertube (that's suspended from the ceiling), trying his best to pick > up beanbags from the floor while she (OT) is physically jer! king his > arms in an effort to correct his body position and saying pretty > negative things, seems like the wrong approach for a two year old. Am I > overracting? I'm grateful to have the service, but my gut is telling me > that this is the wrong therapist for my son. > > One more thing.....someone from another list serv said they'd seen > aggressive behaviors from this program. I'm going to contact them for > more information. I merely wanted to suspend this program until I > understand it a little better. Any feedback or information is > appreciated. > > Thanks > > > __________________________________________________________ > Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! > http://biggestloser <http://biggestloser.msn.com/> .msn.com/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Thank you, Liz.....thank you thank you. I'm calling my coordinator today to talk to her about my options. @...: lizlaw@...: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 04:41:58 +0000Subject: [ ] Re: OT Questions 1) You are not crazy2) To do the thing she is doing with the inner tube you can have him lay on a coffee table and fish for stuff on the floor (we actually have a magnetic fishing puzzle for this) and the idea is to move his hand as he picks the thing up above his head...it strengthens the core. I did this as a superman type exercise in pt for back stuff.3) Roughness is abusive and unwarranted. 3) Saying no patiently and calmly while making adjustments, etc. is what is correct. I have seen our OT do this many times with my son, who was extremely uncooperative and I am thankful we have her because she had the patience and wherewithall to do it the right way.4) Getting someone who knows vital sounds involved is key. All these listening things are great and I have often read that increase in bad behaviors precedes great strides but still you need someone who knows it well overseeing it to be sure that is all it is. We have seen great and steady progress on The Listening Program only because our OT is good and knows it well.5) I think if you can get a better OT at the same facility for these last few weeks before he ages out it would help. Even if it is a short period and they make little headway with him they can assess where he is at and give you homework to get him where he needs to be.You are an awesome mommy for sure.Do not question your own sanity. We warrior moms have enough people doing that to us. No need for self-harm. I have watched you fight hard to help your son on this board. He will surely benefit. Don't doubt yourself. Keep going. You can do this!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 I have been blessed with a truly wonderful OT for my son. (He was 3 in Nov...PDD-NOS diagnosis). He attends a full time autism pre-school and he gets 2 OT sessions there each week and he also gets 2 OT sessions outside of school each week, and she's the woman who has had the most impact on my son's behavior. He has been using the Vital Sounds program for about 2 months now. I do 30 minutes each morning before school and 30 minutes after school. I do it 5 days a week, usually skipping 2 days during the week as I like to use it on weekends when he has no services. He has responded very positively to it, with no " abberent behavior " that I have been aware of. I use a mini trampoline (I got it online at LillianVernon.com for $60)at home and a physio-ball ($12 at TJMaxx)to calm him when he seems to " stim out " and I got him a play tunnel ($15 at Target)that I have him crawl through with puzzle pieces to put in place at the other end and give him a food reinforcer to get him to crawl through the tunnel. I like the lay on a table suggestion and I'll have to try to add that to his routine. Best of luck to you and hang in there! Tracey, Long Island Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 I have to say " I am SO sorry " for you and for your child that you had to go through this. Good thing is yes it can end and perhaps it did already (one could hope) No this is not what any occupational therapy is like for the overwhelming majority. I highly recommend professional occupational therapy even though yes of course there are things we can do at home to help too (such as what we wrote in The Late Talker book) So many of our children have multifaceted aspects to their communication impairment -have motor planning deficits in the body -low tone- sensory issues - and a good OT will work on all of the above and more and also work with and compliment your child's SLP or SLPs. Also school age OTs compliment what is going on in the classroom. My son Tanner always had so much fun in OT with various OTs both private and through school, and was in it from 2 years old to 7 years old -he transitioned out in kindergarten and has not needed OT since. Also it's most important if you are going to use Vital Links to have someone with knowledge behind it as supposedly the wrong programs can create additional issues such as what you saw in your son. My son Tanner was on Vital Links for awhile through his SLP and I do recommend it (with someone that is certified and trained in it) If you check the archives we maybe had a few random horror speech therapist stories -there are two of the only ones below -but even less mentioned about horrible OTs for some reason. Below are some archives about SLPs and even though it's geared to speech therapists gone wrong -it implies to any professional who doesn't work well with your child. In short -therapists -mediocre and bad ones anyway -are a dime a dozen. Finding a great one may be hard yet so worth it -but it appears that if you switch to just about any other OT anywhere -it will be an improvement from the lemon you have now! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~start of archives Re: Am I being too sensitive " Hello is anyone in THERE?! " Boy do I wish I could say that to that horrid SLP your child got stuck with. We all have that inner ability to know when something isn't right -and you don't have to ask here. You know you are not being too sensitive which is why you are removing your child from this woman's presence. She is a perfect example of someone that should not be dealing with the public no less innocent children. And you stay with your child - I can't imagine what cruel things she might say if you weren't around! Your child's SLP should be one of the first people you want to share breakthroughs with. Someone who delights in each new sound it seems as much as you. You want a therapist like some of those Tanner has or had, or like Hoffmann CCC SLP, President of the Missouri Speech Language Hearing Association and the SLP for Tricia Morin's son who would write a poem like this about your child. http://www.cherab.org/information/silentnomore.html I wouldn't only confront her as to why you are leaving, but I would put it in writing. Below is an archive on why to advocate for good SLPs. And by good I don't just mean nice -but one would hope that at least they are that! In my experience there are quite a few SLPs who may not be very knowledgeable about apraxia, but at least the majority are very sweet people who honestly love children and want to help which is why they became SLPs to begin with. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~archive Re: Question about Speech Therapist Tue Feb 20, 2001 10:31 pm kiddietalk@ Hi Jeanne, OK after reading some of the responses here, perhaps I'm the only one who feels this way, but personally, I have a major problem with forcing an apraxic-crying three year old to go to a speech therapist. Jeanne, I don't know where you live, but please let us know so we can help. There has GOT to be someone else you can go to in your area. It may not be that the therapist you have for your child now is bad, (but maybe she is) but perhaps a personality conflict? Children with apraxia have a long road of therapy ahead with three to five days a week of therapy for years, and you don't want to burn them out when they are still so little. Is your child in the preschool disabled program? Is that where the therapist is from? Or is it through insurance, or just private? And to answer your question, either Glenn or myself have always been in the room with Tanner for all of his therapy. For Dakota's too. We were part of the " home therapy " team, so how would we know what to do if we didn't observe. I've seen just the opposite of your experience with Tanner. Tanner has sensory integration disorder, and I don't have to explain the " fits " to anyone else who has a child that has that, but if you don't know what a SI fit is-then your child probably doesn't have it. But when Tanner is in one of his SI fits, it's hard to break. Fortunately because of therapy, Tanner rarely has SI fits anymore, but he had one once in the car on the way to his therapist - nothing to do with her. I watched her in amazement not only break the fit, but get him to start actively participating in therapy. As I said to you privately, therapy should be a fun time where they don't even know they are learning to talk, they just are. I was so upset by this email that I called Tanner's therapist and she agreed that something doesn't sound right. She too never heard of such a thing, and said this is not acceptable. 2 of the speech therapists I work the closest with through CHERAB Foundation are unfortunately not able to answer this right away, and I really felt it important to address. Lori is on vacation, and Cheryl just had surgery, but I know that they will have more than two cents to add to this. I was waiting to see if any of the other SLPs on this list would because I knew I felt strong about this, and wanted the response to be professional-and not emotional, but I can't help being so bothered by this. How severe is your child? You said she tries to get him to say words he can't say yet. How many words does he have? Before words, the therapist should be working on sounds first. A skilled therapist does know how to push, and when, but to observe a three year old time after time crying and knowing that he doesn't want to be there and just letting that continue makes her sound incompetent to be working with young children. Hope that helps, Best, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Thanks to everyone for their support in helping me sort through this matter. I was completely baffled during last Tuesday's session, and was unsure about how to deal with it.BUT..... I am happy to say that today I spoke with my EI coordinator, and she was COMPLETELY supportive!! I was very afraid of possible negative fallout, for I'd been pretty pushy in getting services. I was convinced that she was going to say, " GREAT!! We gave you the services you demanded, and now they're not good enough! " Anyway, the complete opposite happened. She encouraged me to talk to the OT, and state all of my concerns. If the OT could not comply with my requests (being less of a drill sergent, doing away with the negative talk and the jerking-my-child-around behavior) then we would look at switching therapists. My coordinator has a reputation of being very difficult with parents, but I saw a completely different side of her today. She shared how she's stood up for neices (with their teachers) in the past, so we were able connect with each other due to similar experiences. Thanks to everyone for supporting me. The knowledge and support from this forum is truly saving my little boy! I'll let you know how things go tomorrow. @...: kiddietalk@...: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 02:25:47 +0000Subject: [ ] Re: OT Questions I have to say " I am SO sorry " for you and for your child that you had to go through this. Good thing is yes it can end and perhaps it did already (one could hope) No this is not what any occupational therapy is like for the overwhelming majority. I highly recommend professional occupational therapy even though yes of course there are things we can do at home to help too (such as what we wrote in The Late Talker book) So many of our children have multifaceted aspects to their communication impairment -have motor planning deficits in the body -low tone- sensory issues - and a good OT will work on all of the above and more and also work with and compliment your child's SLP or SLPs. Also school age OTs compliment what is going on in the classroom. My son Tanner always had so much fun in OT with various OTs both private and through school, and was in it from 2 years old to 7 years old -he transitioned out in kindergarten and has not needed OT since. Also it's most important if you are going to use Vital Links to have someone with knowledge behind it as supposedly the wrong programs can create additional issues such as what you saw in your son. My son Tanner was on Vital Links for awhile through his SLP and I do recommend it (with someone that is certified and trained in it) If you check the archives we maybe had a few random horror speech therapist stories -there are two of the only ones below -but even less mentioned about horrible OTs for some reason. Below are some archives about SLPs and even though it's geared to speech therapists gone wrong -it implies to any professional who doesn't work well with your child. In short -therapists -mediocre and bad ones anyway -are a dime a dozen. Finding a great one may be hard yet so worth it -but it appears that if you switch to just about any other OT anywhere -it will be an improvement from the lemon you have now!~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~start of archivesRe: Am I being too sensitive " Hello is anyone in THERE?! " Boy do I wish I could say that to thathorrid SLP your child got stuck with. We all have that innerability to know when something isn't right -and you don't have toask here. You know you are not being too sensitive which is why youare removing your child from this woman's presence.She is a perfect example of someone that should not be dealing withthe public no less innocent children. And you stay with your child -I can't imagine what cruel things she might say if you weren'taround!Your child's SLP should be one of the first people you want to sharebreakthroughs with. Someone who delights in each new sound it seemsas much as you. You want a therapist like some of those Tanner hasor had, or like Hoffmann CCC SLP, President of the MissouriSpeech Language Hearing Association and the SLP for Tricia Morin'sson who would write a poem like this about your child.http://www.cherab.org/information/silentnomore.htmlI wouldn't only confront her as to why you are leaving, but I wouldput it in writing.Below is an archive on why to advocate for good SLPs. And by good Idon't just mean nice -but one would hope that at least they arethat! In my experience there are quite a few SLPs who may not bevery knowledgeable about apraxia, but at least the majority are verysweet people who honestly love children and want to help which iswhy they became SLPs to begin with.~~~~~~~~~~~~~archiveRe: Question about Speech TherapistTue Feb 20, 2001 10:31 pmkiddietalk@Hi Jeanne,OK after reading some of the responses here, perhaps I'm the only onewho feels this way, but personally, I have a major problem withforcing an apraxic-crying three year old to go to a speechtherapist. Jeanne, I don't know where you live, but please let usknow so we can help. There has GOT to be someone else you can go toin your area.It may not be that the therapist you have for your child now is bad,(but maybe she is) but perhaps a personality conflict? Children withapraxia have a long road of therapy ahead with three to five days aweek of therapy for years, and you don't want to burn them out whenthey are still so little.Is your child in the preschool disabled program? Is that where thetherapist is from? Or is it through insurance, or just private?And to answer your question, either Glenn or myself have always beenin the room with Tanner for all of his therapy. For Dakota's too.We were part of the " home therapy " team, so how would we know what todo if we didn't observe.I've seen just the opposite of your experience with Tanner. Tannerhas sensory integration disorder, and I don't have to explainthe " fits " to anyone else who has a child that has that, but if youdon't know what a SI fit is-then your child probably doesn't haveit. But when Tanner is in one of his SI fits, it's hard to break.Fortunately because of therapy, Tanner rarely has SI fits anymore,but he had one once in the car on the way to his therapist -nothing to do with her. I watched her in amazement not only breakthe fit, but get him to start actively participating in therapy. AsI said to you privately, therapy should be a fun time where theydon't even know they are learning to talk, they just are.I was so upset by this email that I called Tanner's therapist and sheagreed that something doesn't sound right. She too never heard ofsuch a thing, and said this is not acceptable. 2 of the speechtherapists I work the closest with through CHERAB Foundation areunfortunately not able to answer this right away, and I really feltit important to address. Lori is on vacation, and Cheryl just hadsurgery, but I know that they will have more than two cents to add tothis. I was waiting to see if any of the other SLPs on this listwould because I knew I felt strong about this, and wanted theresponse to be professional-and not emotional, but I can't help beingso bothered by this. How severe is your child? You said she triesto get him to say words he can't say yet. How many words does hehave? Before words, the therapist should be working on soundsfirst. A skilled therapist does know how to push, and when, but toobserve a three year old time after time crying and knowing that hedoesn't want to be there and just letting that continue makes hersound incompetent to be working with young children.Hope that helps,Best, GengPresident CHERAB Foundation> Hello,>> My child has Apraxis,he is going to be 3 in April. He has being> seeing a speech therapist for a couple of months. He does not liketo> go because he does not want to say any words he can't. He cryalmost> the whole time, anytime it gets hard where he can't say the word he> gives up. Is there any suggestions to try and help him to at least> try?>> Thank you> Jeanne===== Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Make no mistake , you are saving that boy! I have found that while negative warnings came to me about certain people or processes many of these same things have worked out fine as well. Way to go! > > > Thanks to everyone for their support in helping me sort through this matter. I was completely baffled during last Tuesday's session, and was unsure about how to deal with it.BUT..... I am happy to say that today I spoke with my EI coordinator, and she was COMPLETELY supportive!! I was very afraid of possible negative fallout, for I'd been pretty pushy in getting services. I was convinced that she was going to say, " GREAT!! We gave you the services you demanded, and now they're not good enough! " Anyway, the complete opposite happened. She encouraged me to talk to the OT, and state all of my concerns. If the OT could not comply with my requests (being less of a drill sergent, doing away with the negative talk and the jerking-my- child-around behavior) then we would look at switching therapists. My coordinator has a reputation of being very difficult with parents, but I saw a completely different side of her today. She shared how she's stood up for neices (with their teachers) in the past, so we were able connect with each other due to similar experiences. > > Thanks to everyone for supporting me. The knowledge and support from this forum is truly saving my little boy! I'll let you know how things go tomorrow. > > > > > @...: kiddietalk@...: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 02:25:47 +0000Subject: [ ] Re: OT Questions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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