Re: OT: ADHD Inattentive Type -- any good online resources/books?

December 14, 2007

a lot of seizure disorders can be misdiagnosed as ADHD Inattentive type. This

happened to my son, who had a brain injury from a seizure a few years later

because he wasn't being treated.

bigcheech91 <bigcheech91@...> wrote: A friend of mine just told

me that she is probably going to have to

pull her daughter from our Catholic school because she has been

identified as having ADHD inattentive type. Since we all know how hard

it is to get up and running when you get a dx, I thought I'd give her

the benefit of our collective wisdom. I have already sent her links to

www.feingold.org and the site of my DAN doctor (stocktonfp.com --

limited but good info on ADHD). Do any of you have any recommendations

of great books, listservs, supplements, etc.? Unlike apraxia, the

Internet and libraries are loaded with information, but it's hard to

tell on first glance which is useful and which is not. Also, any

online resources comparing ADHD and APD would also be helpful. I think

a lot of APD is misdiagnosed as ADHD inattentive type, but I am not

expert at all on that topic. (Her daughter did not have a

speech/language delay, which is commonly seen with APD, but again, I'm

no expert.)

in NJ

---------------------------------

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

December 14, 2007

The Dr. Bock book is a good resource.

>

> A friend of mine just told me that she is probably going to have to

> pull her daughter from our Catholic school because she has been

> identified as having ADHD inattentive type. Since we all know how

hard

> it is to get up and running when you get a dx, I thought I'd give

her

> the benefit of our collective wisdom. I have already sent her

links to

> www.feingold.org and the site of my DAN doctor (stocktonfp.com --

> limited but good info on ADHD). Do any of you have any

recommendations

> of great books, listservs, supplements, etc.? Unlike apraxia, the

> Internet and libraries are loaded with information, but it's hard

to

> tell on first glance which is useful and which is not. Also, any

> online resources comparing ADHD and APD would also be helpful. I

think

> a lot of APD is misdiagnosed as ADHD inattentive type, but I am not

> expert at all on that topic. (Her daughter did not have a

> speech/language delay, which is commonly seen with APD, but again,

I'm

> no expert.)

>

> in NJ

>

December 14, 2007

Hi ,

You don't mention the age of the child -but just in case it's my

understanding that it's difficult/not appropriate to diagnose a

preschool child with CAPD. (central auditory processing disorder) I

know that Dr. Tallal told me about the book " Like Sound Through

Water " which is about a child with CAPD written by the parent that

talks about how Fast For Word really helped her.

And don't know if you can accurately diagnose a preschool child ADHD either.

(one neuroMD suspected my son Dakota of ADHD at 3!)

I can tell you that my now 13 year old son Dakota has over the years

been diagnosed with ADHD and suspected CAPD but same child was tested

in 3rd grade by the public school system to be in the 99th percentile

when tested one on one. In the public school he would be known

as " gifted learning disabled " What diagnosis is accurate? I'd say

the ADHD -but based on what professional he saw they may agree or

disagree. Doesn't change that he's an awesome student with lots of

friends and a goal to be an architect...and/or comedian/actor (He

just got cast into an MTI stage production without the audition

because he is known for his theatrical improve " gift " ) You can't

always know for sure which is accurate unless you see someone who is

an expert in diagnosis of both I found. For sure none of us would be

able to know as some of the symptoms overlap.

Dakota has been on fish oils -ProEFA and ProEPA 50/50 5 of each -10 a

day for years now. His concentration appears to be affected if that

dosage is reduced -but there is much in the archives about

neurologist and other medical professional's amazement at his change

on the oils. such as:

/message/69053

We were told about all the special diets for ADHD -and like with

apraxia we never had to do that thankfully. However we buy as much

organic food as possible (LOVE Whole Foods!) -but when we go to the

movies my kids eat the movie theater popcorn and candy and even coke

icees at time as a treat. I don't notice much of a difference with

Dakota even with food changes like that. But forget his fish oil!!!

You know when we do that's for sure!! Tanner we try to keep the

saturated and transfats low -but we do that for our whole family -so

for us with diet alone if we went that route we wouldn't see much -

thank goodness for fish oils for sure! (and now the added benefit of

vitamin E for Tanner) I just started Tanner on another supplement

www.solarxhealth.com

Anyway -I " m curious why an ADHD diagnosis would mean the child would

have to be " pulled " from the school she is in? Is she aggressive? I

know they can expel a child that is a bully -but for ADHD? Is that

even legal?

=====

December 14, 2007

It is a private school and it is legal.

>

> Hi ,

>

> You don't mention the age of the child -but just in case it's my

> understanding that it's difficult/not appropriate to diagnose a

> preschool child with CAPD. (central auditory processing disorder) I

> know that Dr. Tallal told me about the book " Like Sound Through

> Water " which is about a child with CAPD written by the parent that

> talks about how Fast For Word really helped her.

> And don't know if you can accurately diagnose a preschool child

ADHD either. (one neuroMD suspected my son Dakota of ADHD at 3!)

>

> I can tell you that my now 13 year old son Dakota has over the years

> been diagnosed with ADHD and suspected CAPD but same child was

tested

> in 3rd grade by the public school system to be in the 99th

percentile

> when tested one on one. In the public school he would be known

> as " gifted learning disabled " What diagnosis is accurate? I'd say

> the ADHD -but based on what professional he saw they may agree or

> disagree. Doesn't change that he's an awesome student with lots of

> friends and a goal to be an architect...and/or comedian/actor (He

> just got cast into an MTI stage production without the audition

> because he is known for his theatrical improve " gift " ) You can't

> always know for sure which is accurate unless you see someone who is

> an expert in diagnosis of both I found. For sure none of us would

be

> able to know as some of the symptoms overlap.

>

> Dakota has been on fish oils -ProEFA and ProEPA 50/50 5 of each -10

a

> day for years now. His concentration appears to be affected if that

> dosage is reduced -but there is much in the archives about

> neurologist and other medical professional's amazement at his change

> on the oils. such as:

>

/message/69053

>

> We were told about all the special diets for ADHD -and like with

> apraxia we never had to do that thankfully. However we buy as much

> organic food as possible (LOVE Whole Foods!) -but when we go to the

> movies my kids eat the movie theater popcorn and candy and even coke

> icees at time as a treat. I don't notice much of a difference with

> Dakota even with food changes like that. But forget his fish oil!!!

> You know when we do that's for sure!! Tanner we try to keep the

> saturated and transfats low -but we do that for our whole family -so

> for us with diet alone if we went that route we wouldn't see much -

> thank goodness for fish oils for sure! (and now the added benefit

of

> vitamin E for Tanner) I just started Tanner on another supplement

> www.solarxhealth.com

>

> Anyway -I " m curious why an ADHD diagnosis would mean the child would

> have to be " pulled " from the school she is in? Is she aggressive?

I

> know they can expel a child that is a bully -but for ADHD? Is that

> even legal?

>

> =====

>

December 14, 2007

How do you know it's legal? Did this already go to court? Do you

know that this private school doesn't receive any federal funding?

And even if they don't from just quick searching this is not open and

shut legal/not legal from what I'm finding. Even if it's a Catholic

school which can exclude students under the guise of " religious

freedom " or something -if they receive federal money then they may

be bound by the same rules as public and those fed funded private

schools when it comes to things like 504 plans. Religious schools

don't always get away with discrimination thank God (pardon the pun)

You may want to read for example this one document (section 4) that

recommends that religious schools do try to work with students with

disabilities because in some cases a suit filed will be won in some

courts.

http://www.bodmanllp.com/publications/articles/pdfs/ArchidioceseOfDetroitMeeting\

..pdf

" Q: What about ADHD? Is it covered under the law?

A: Yes, if it meets the criteria of the particular law. ADHD has been found to

be an impairment under the Rehabilitation Act and ADA and, like learning

disabilities, is a disability if it substantially limits a major life activity,

such as learning. "

http://www.ldonline.org/article/6098

Protection under ADA -school complaints filed

" Back to School - Appendix I: Complaints Received by the Office for Civil

Rights, U.S. Department of Education, Related to Primary or Secondary Schools "

42% of cases filed were for admission to educational programs

(and many for ADHD)

http://search.access.gpo.gov/ncd/SearchRight.asp?ct=ncd & q1=adhd

And the 504 law is this:

Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973

Section 504 is a civil rights statute that makes it illegal for

schools to discriminate against children with disabilities and

requires them to provide reasonable accommodations, which may include

the provision of services.

Section 504 protects individuals with disabilities against

discrimination in any program or activity receiving federal financial

assistance. This includes all public schools and day care centers and

those private schools and centers that receive federal funds. To

qualify for protection under Section 504, a child must have a

physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more

major life activities (such as learning), have a record of such an

impairment, or be regarded as having such an impairment. Parents of

qualifying children have the right to develop a Section 504 plan with

their child's school. Schools can lose federal funding if they do not

comply with this law.

" What could and should my child's school be doing to help?

Children with ADHD may qualify for special school services or

accommodations under either of two federal laws: the Individuals with

Disabilities Education Act, Part B [iDEA] or Section 504 of the

Rehabilitation Act of 1973.

Children covered by IDEA are entitled to education services that meet

the standards of a free appropriate education. IDEA also requires

that if a child's behavior impedes learning, a functional behavior

analysis must be conducted and a positive behavior plan developed. In

addition, schools are prohibited from suspending for more than 10

days and expelling students whose behavior results from their

disability, unless drugs or weapons are involved or the child is a

danger to himself or others. "

http://psychcentral.com/lib/2006/frequently-asked-questions-about-adhd/

" Before contemplating a change in schools, I would contact CHADD

(Children and Adults with Attention Deficit Disorders) at 1-800-233-

4050 to see if there is a branch of this advocacy group in your

community. They may have already had dealings with this school and

may be able to help you work through the system. In any case, someone

there should be able to provide you with support as well as

information about this student's rights under the law. "

http://school.familyeducation.com/add-and-adhd/private-school/42075.html

Educational Rights

Section 504

IDEA (The Individual with Disabilities Education Act)

State Departments of Education / Special Education

Educational Rights for Children with AD/HD in Public Schools (WWK4)

AD/HD can impact education and development from a very young age.

Child Find, public school systems, some private schools and even

colleges and universities are obligated to help their students with

AD/HD and other disabilities rise to meet education challenges.

For a free copy of our guide, Educational Rights for Children with

Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (AD/HD): A Primer for

Parents, call us at 1-800-233-4050 or request your copy online. (This

single guide is printed in both English and Spanish.)

http://www.help4adhd.org/en/education/rights

You may also want to just pass on the information in the archives

because as I've said before -my now 13 YO son didn't need any special

diets -just fish oils -higher EPA than for apraxia -and he has been

mainstreamed and a bright student since kindergarten. If the child

doesn't " act " ADHD there's no way to prove a diagnosis of ADHD is

there. Then again who would even want to send their child to a

school that expels children diagnosed with ADHD? But I still

wouldn't let them get away with their discrimination without

reporting it.

=====

December 15, 2007

I know because it is private and they are not required to keep the

child. That is the law. Now whether a discrimination suit can be

filed on specific grounds I do not know as it is not my case and I do

not know all the details and as a lawyer I can only comment on the

law generally and not specifically since these are not my clients.

>

> How do you know it's legal? Did this already go to court? Do you

> know that this private school doesn't receive any federal funding?

> And even if they don't from just quick searching this is not open

and

> shut legal/not legal from what I'm finding. Even if it's a Catholic

> school which can exclude students under the guise of " religious

> freedom " or something -if they receive federal money then they may

> be bound by the same rules as public and those fed funded private

> schools when it comes to things like 504 plans. Religious schools

> don't always get away with discrimination thank God (pardon the pun)

> You may want to read for example this one document (section 4) that

> recommends that religious schools do try to work with students with

> disabilities because in some cases a suit filed will be won in some

> courts.

>

http://www.bodmanllp.com/publications/articles/pdfs/ArchidioceseOfDetr

oitMeeting.pdf

>

> " Q: What about ADHD? Is it covered under the law?

>

> A: Yes, if it meets the criteria of the particular law. ADHD has

been found to be an impairment under the Rehabilitation Act and ADA

and, like learning disabilities, is a disability if it substantially

limits a major life activity, such as learning. "

> http://www.ldonline.org/article/6098

>

> Protection under ADA -school complaints filed

> " Back to School - Appendix I: Complaints Received by the Office for

Civil Rights, U.S. Department of Education, Related to Primary or

Secondary Schools "

> 42% of cases filed were for admission to educational programs

> (and many for ADHD)

> http://search.access.gpo.gov/ncd/SearchRight.asp?ct=ncd & q1=adhd

>

> And the 504 law is this:

>

> Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973

> Section 504 is a civil rights statute that makes it illegal for

> schools to discriminate against children with disabilities and

> requires them to provide reasonable accommodations, which may

include

> the provision of services.

>

> Section 504 protects individuals with disabilities against

> discrimination in any program or activity receiving federal

financial

> assistance. This includes all public schools and day care centers

and

> those private schools and centers that receive federal funds. To

> qualify for protection under Section 504, a child must have a

> physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more

> major life activities (such as learning), have a record of such an

> impairment, or be regarded as having such an impairment. Parents of

> qualifying children have the right to develop a Section 504 plan

with

> their child's school. Schools can lose federal funding if they do

not

> comply with this law.

>

> " What could and should my child's school be doing to help?

>

> Children with ADHD may qualify for special school services or

> accommodations under either of two federal laws: the Individuals

with

> Disabilities Education Act, Part B [iDEA] or Section 504 of the

> Rehabilitation Act of 1973.

>

> Children covered by IDEA are entitled to education services that

meet

> the standards of a free appropriate education. IDEA also requires

> that if a child's behavior impedes learning, a functional behavior

> analysis must be conducted and a positive behavior plan developed.

In

> addition, schools are prohibited from suspending for more than 10

> days and expelling students whose behavior results from their

> disability, unless drugs or weapons are involved or the child is a

> danger to himself or others. "

> http://psychcentral.com/lib/2006/frequently-asked-questions-about-

adhd/

>

> " Before contemplating a change in schools, I would contact CHADD

> (Children and Adults with Attention Deficit Disorders) at 1-800-233-

> 4050 to see if there is a branch of this advocacy group in your

> community. They may have already had dealings with this school and

> may be able to help you work through the system. In any case,

someone

> there should be able to provide you with support as well as

> information about this student's rights under the law. "

> http://school.familyeducation.com/add-and-adhd/private-

school/42075.html

>

> Educational Rights

>

> Section 504

> IDEA (The Individual with Disabilities Education Act)

> State Departments of Education / Special Education

> Educational Rights for Children with AD/HD in Public Schools (WWK4)

> AD/HD can impact education and development from a very young age.

> Child Find, public school systems, some private schools and even

> colleges and universities are obligated to help their students with

> AD/HD and other disabilities rise to meet education challenges.

> For a free copy of our guide, Educational Rights for Children with

> Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (AD/HD): A Primer for

> Parents, call us at 1-800-233-4050 or request your copy online.

(This

> single guide is printed in both English and Spanish.)

> http://www.help4adhd.org/en/education/rights

>

> You may also want to just pass on the information in the archives

> because as I've said before -my now 13 YO son didn't need any

special

> diets -just fish oils -higher EPA than for apraxia -and he has been

> mainstreamed and a bright student since kindergarten. If the child

> doesn't " act " ADHD there's no way to prove a diagnosis of ADHD is

> there. Then again who would even want to send their child to a

> school that expels children diagnosed with ADHD? But I still

> wouldn't let them get away with their discrimination without

> reporting it.

>

> =====

>

December 15, 2007

As far as I know, our school receives no direct funding from any

governmental body. It is funded by tuition, fundraising, and a large

subsidy from the parish. (We aren't one of the prep-school type

Catholic schools.) However, I should clarify that the school is NOT

giving this child the boot. The girl is in first grade and is having

attention-related learning and behavior issues. The teacher and the

parent filled out one of those checklists, and the results strongly

suggested ADHD. The teacher simply suggested that they seek

evaluation for an official diagnosis and guidance on how to proceed

educationally and behaviorially.

The parents think that the public school system might be better able

to serve her, but I'm not sure why they believe that. As I posted a

few weeks ago, a friend's child was recently sent out of district

from the Princeton public schools to a special public school because

they couldn't handle his ADHD or the resulting learning issues. I

have sat for this kid in the past, and while he obviously has some

issues, he is far from the most severe case of ADHD that I've seen.

I was stunned they would send him to a special school, and more

stunned that the mom would accept that without trying other

interventions like fish oil, diets, etc. She assumes the school

knows best.

I personally have found our school to be very accomodating. We

requested a special screening when applying for , and after

the screening they gave us the go-ahead to register. Since then,

they have been completely supportive of our use of enzymes and a

dairy-free diet (even better compliance than we got in public

preschool). In fact, they don't seem to see any problems with

at all right now, which is great news (although these things

aren't as obvious in kindergarten, which is still lots of fun). Last

year, my daughter's second grade class of 21 had 6 kids with IEP's

(28.6%).

The bottom-line is that most districts have at least 10% of the kids

receiving some kind of assistance, services, or accomodations due to

various classifications. In our district, that number is closer to

20%! If the Catholic schools gave 20% of their students the boot,

they'd have to shut down. That said, they don't really have the

staff or facility to accomodate a child with many needs (severe

handicaps, autism, etc.) It's actually a great environment for a

child who needs moderate assistance, since the most severe cases

aren't there to dominate the teacher's attention, and kindness to all

is strongly emphasized. 's teacher has a different child

accompany him to the nurse each day when he goes for his enzymes, and

the room parents had a completely dairy free Halloween party so that

wouldn't have to have different foods. I thought that was so

sweet!

I'm sure not all Catholic schools handle things appropriately, but

everything I've seen tells me ours is a real jewel. If they were to

ever ask a child to leave, it would be because they were admitting

their own failure to help him rather than their desire to avoid

special needs.