Re: Behaviors from fish oil

[Guest guest]

What did the doc say exactly? Someone mentioned here that either

omega 9 or borage oil is contraindicated for autoimmune folks???

>

> After I first joined this list, I rushed out and purchased NN

ProEfa (or

> Complete Omega) for my non-verbal son with cerebral palsy. We

noticed an

> increase in his motivation to communicate almost immediately. He

received NN

> (or OmegaBrite) supplements for at least two years to try to

improve his

> overall motivation. One day I ran out of his supplements. Before I

could

> get to the store to purchase more, we noticed that he was much more

cheerful

> and compliant. We've stopped giving them and he seems happier and

mellower

> now than before.

>

>

>

> I mentioned this to his neuro and he said he had heard of this

before. Has

> anyone else experienced negative behaviors from the omega 3

supplements?

> Perhaps from a build up in his system?

>

>

>

> Randi (mom to handsome Graham, 11yo CP for lack of a better

diagnosis,

> hypotonia, non-verbal, DD)

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My son became very defiant after being on the fish oil for 5 weeks.

Everything was a battle from taking baths, diaper changes, just going

in the car. I stopped giving it to him and things have gotten so

much better. He was such an angry little boy which he wasn't before

we started the fish oil.

>

> After I first joined this list, I rushed out and purchased NN

ProEfa (or

> Complete Omega) for my non-verbal son with cerebral palsy. We

noticed an

> increase in his motivation to communicate almost immediately. He

received NN

> (or OmegaBrite) supplements for at least two years to try to

improve his

> overall motivation. One day I ran out of his supplements. Before I

could

> get to the store to purchase more, we noticed that he was much more

cheerful

> and compliant. We've stopped giving them and he seems happier and

mellower

> now than before.

>

>

>

> I mentioned this to his neuro and he said he had heard of this

before. Has

> anyone else experienced negative behaviors from the omega 3

supplements?

> Perhaps from a build up in his system?

>

>

>

> Randi (mom to handsome Graham, 11yo CP for lack of a better

diagnosis,

> hypotonia, non-verbal, DD)

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My son was very weepy when on them at age 4. He was fine the first couple

months then we went off for a while due to illness and just forgot to

restart right away. When we restarted he got very weepy and depressed. He

improved when we stopped. We stayed off for over a year and then tried

again and this time he reacted by getting very very hyper. He and his

brother would bounce off the walls and be unable to calm down. I switched

his entire dose to am and it seemed to help this. He is now more active in

the am, but it isn't a disturbance to everyone.

Miche

>

> I mentioned this to his neuro and he said he had heard of this before. Has

> anyone else experienced negative behaviors from the omega 3 supplements?

> Perhaps from a build up in his system?

>

> Randi (mom to handsome Graham, 11yo CP for lack of a better diagnosis,

> hypotonia, non-verbal, DD)

>

[Guest guest]

This comes up very often and was just talked about a few months ago.

Tanner was a " good " quiet child -no terrible twos -compliant -

lethargic and easy going -kind of out of it however little boy prior

to EFAs. After EFAs he became a 'real boy' and we couldn't be more

thrilled! Kids go through terrible twos for a developmental reason.

Don't have to say more because it's all the archives below:

Re: fish oil and behavior

-sorry for the long archive below -but this topic is very old

and so many have gone through it with success. You don't have to do

anything -give anything since in most cases it only lasts a few days

to a week (outside of Marina's child and perhaps one other in this

group?) Just remember -terrible twos are normal -perhaps the

children are doing something they should...I know from this group of

thousands most with apraxia go through it a bit later than 2.

Re: side effects of ProEFA...

Lori -Congratulations! Over the years I've learned the only

real " bad " side effect of fish oils outside of allergy of course -is

no change, good or bad, at all. The fact you notice something -

anything -that's a good thing. After all if the oils didn't " work "

you wouldn't notice a thing -good or bad. Of course let me say

before Marina that yes there are a handful if you search the

archives that have children that they pulled off the oils once the

child was verbal. In Marina's case even however -her child first

did have huge surges on them and the " bad " behavior started once the

child was up to the norm in speech. Who knows what would have

happened if instead of stopping the formula was changed? More EPA -

remove GLA, raise GLA? Or what about change in dosage or time of

day of giving the oils? Also -does the same reaction occur when the

child has a tuna fish sandwich? Perhaps it's something in the

formula outside of the fish oil? We should notice and dig to find

the truth -because for most -fish oils have literally given us back

the child we knew to be there before. And now we know about the

vitamin E thanks to Dr. . I wish so much I had the

information most of you have today -and you have the credibility and

MDs to back up your decision to supplement. Back when I started

Tanner, I had to follow my gut and my own " research " since there was

nothing for apraxia or even autism.

We learn more each day, and each of us learn the most about our own

child/children. So for those of us that have been here for years we

learn the questions don't change -but the answers may. What we

assume as fact today may be fallacy tomorrow -and what we consider

bad today may be known to be the signs that neurons that were

previously dormant are starting to fire...or possibly not just a

good sign -but a great one! I could take an educated guess that

just 2 capsules is enough for your older child to start having some

reaction -but is probably too conservative a dosage. Two capsules

is a dosage many give their two year olds.

I suggest you find a medical doctor (neurological) who is

knowledgeable about the benefits of omegas (and vitamin E) for

treatment of apraxia and similar impairments. (boy does it feel

good to almost finally be able to say that after what -almost a

decade!)

You can archive this topic since it came up a handful of times (and

notice mainly the same three or so parents answer it - " bad " side

effects are pretty far from the norm)

Wed Jun 14, 2006 6:40 pm

" kiddietalk " <kiddietalk@...>

Re: Negative reaction to proefa

I do think I found the trick to searching and even think I found the

other few parents that posted about negative behavior on EFAs...

from those that stopped as well as those that didn't. I don't think

anything here has a chance to be swept under the rug since this

grouplist has a mind of it's own -we all decide what we want to talk

about most. Like Actos was swept (ignored by most) and autism vs.

apraxia is right now the hot topic once again. But...I do believe

that some here do see signs that may be perceived as negative to

start that end up going away or being viewed as positive later- on on

EFAs or not. Actually in reading over the archives it appears

Tanner did develop some behaviors some would view as negative -but I

welcomed it as you'll read below. Then there are others like Kim

who found it best to ignore those " bad " times.

From: " frank sabel " <sawyera@...>

Date: Tue May 4, 2004 1:57 pm

Subject: Re: [ ] Poor reaction to Omega-3 EFA's?

Dave,

When I first started Nordic Naturals Pro-EFA (one soft gel per day)

for my

then two year old, his behavior became so bad I almost stopped as

well. I

was advised by other parents who'd " been there, done that " to hang

in there

and it would get better. For us, the first 3-4 weeks were awful but

by

weeks 6-8 his behavior settled back to what it was b/4 starting Pro-

EFA. I

have read on other boards that adding extra Magnesium helps with

increased

hyperactivity that sometimes accompanies the introduction of

essential fatty

acids. I never tried that b/c by the time I read that we were past

that

phase. I'm just telling you FWIW since adding Magnesium can't hurt.

There

is no know toxicity level, but too much can cause diarrhea.

Naturally you

would want to consult your son's doctor about all of this. I am not a

doctor, just a Mom.

Good luck! KIM

and

From: " Morin Family " <morinfamily4@...>

Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:41 am

Subject: RE: [ ] Re: ProEFA/bad behavior

,

When we started our son on ProEFA and when we increased his dosage,

he went

through a time of worse behavior. I have heard time and time again of

children experiencing bad behavior prior to a surge, whether on

ProEFA or

not. We waited out the crumby behavior (which subsided) and the

results

afterward were miraculous! My advice is to give it more time as your

son's

body adjusts to the ProEFA.

I have to admit though, we are waiting until summer to make another

increase

because of potential bad behavior.

Just my two cents...

Tricia

Below are some archives. Suzi, , Laurel, Dave, and

Gisele (and anyone else out of the thousands we just didn't hear

from) can perhaps update us.

Re: Hitting, EFAs, and adding extra Omega-3/Jane

" bad behavior prior to a developmental surge "

I so agree with you Tricia, and I again am so looking forward to

meeting you and your wonderful family when you vacation in Florida!

And I agree with you Jane too. This could just be frustrations of

not being able to communicate, or normal terrible twos behavior.

You guys are lucky your children are going through this stage at a

normal age in my opinion. We didn't know about EFAs when Tanner was

two. Tanner didn't go through terrible twos -after he regressed at

11 months old he didn't go through much of anything even though he

passed all developmental milestones according to his pediatricians

at the time. Yes he had many quirks from his sensory integration

dysfunction and would occasionally have a melt down, but we learned

many tricks on how to avoid them, and for the most part Tanner did

whatever we wanted him to do with no reaction. The best way to

describe it was that it was like he lost his personality. My son

Tanner was so lethargic and compliant when he was nonverbal prior to

EFAs. Maybe I'm weird but I never viewed that as

normal...or " good " The artist in me wanted self expression. For

two years Tanner had no life in his eyes -and I can show you videos

of what I meant. He was like a shell from one to two years old. He

was not autistic because he responded to one on one attempts to

communicate -he just couldn't talk, and would tire easily and didn't

seem to have any energy. The minute Tanner was offered nonverbal

ways to communicate he responded with enthusiasm and willingness -

but he was still lethargic.

I welcomed big time when Tanner went through terrible threes after

we started him on Efalex back in 1999 and he first started to become

Tanner again - every terrible (normal) moment that Tanner said " No! "

and demanded it had to be his way and not our way. We respected his

demands without spoiling him. We welcomed when he started to " run

around " in the restaurant or store (like his brother who he finally

could keep up with) while we also taught appropriate places to run

around instead.

Tanner for years now is known as the " sweetest kid " by the

teachers, other kids. He has a great sense of humor. He is the one

who goes out of his way to comfort anyone that is hurt. He has a

high receptive language ability and has no trouble understanding

more complex thoughts and feelings...even though he can't always

express them in a sophisticated way. Tanner takes ProEFA and ProEPA

every day and regresses when he is off for one day still. He takes

carn aware/carnosine on an on and off basis which we find to help

because he regresses when on or off too long. Tanner can not take

high fiber as it causes a dramatic regression in him for some

reason. Under the advice of his MD, Tanner drinks pear and papaya

nectar every day and also eats the Dole papaya jell bowls and canned

pears which keeps him regular after years of constipation. And only

uses the Milk of Magnesia once in awhile when he skips a

day. Tanner is just doing amazing in all areas -and yes I want to

share what worked for him because I believe in it...and not just for

Tanner and Dakota.

http://www.cherab.org/information/familiesrelate/letter.html

Suzanne Smolyar once said the worst side effect she can think of was

her 5 year old daughter being nonverbal -which she was until

she started EFAs, and is still doing great. And the good

news is that for those that don't agree -you can always stop the

essential oils,

or look to the gray area in the following archives:

" In rare cases where EFAs don't work -parents don't report any

changes on the oils or off - either good or bad. So bad news (or

what you view as bad news which I'll get into below) can actually be

the good news.

I'd talk it over with your child's MD and your spouse -but it's not

unusual for there to be a child that is a bit hyper right before the

surge. And yes -a word just " popping out " the other day after 4

weeks of starting is a week longer than the one day to 3 weeks -but

not that far off. If it is the EFAs kicking in -you will keep seeing

more and more.

Here is a question for you:

Your daughter before -was she " laid back " ? What we view as a " good

child " is at times a child who is not expressing normal

developmental attitudes of expressing independence. The " no " stage.

As speech increases -this stage comes in more -and most times way

after the age of two. It could happen at three -four or even older -

and it's when this stage happens that other good things kick in too -

like the child becoming more independent of you. So again -this may

not be the bad sign you think it is. You want your child to go

through normal stages of development -even if they are not

all " nice " Most don't like it -but accept it, and just remember -

this too shall pass.

Keep in mind the following is from a parent of a " normal " child -and

she doesn't mention whether or not she just started fish oil but I

suspect not.

" My 19-month-old son has always been a good boy and has done

whatever I asked him to do. Recently he started refusing to do

anything I ask of him. He has started crying and hitting me even

when I ask him to do simple things. Where have I gone wrong? What

should I be doing differently? Will he always be like this?

Redwood City, California

" The hallmark of this stage is oppositional behavior. Our wonderful

children instinctively want to do exactly the opposite of what we

want. We have nice, reasonable expectations and they say, " NO! " or

they simply dissolve into tears. Suppose you have some place to get

to in a hurry. Your son has been in a great mood all day. . . until

you say, " I need you to get into the car right now. " He will, of

course, want to do anything except get into the car.

As if this weren't enough, children in this phase of development

have a great deal of difficulty making the choices they so

desperately want to make. You ask your child what he would like for

dinner, and he says macaroni. You lovingly prepare it for him, and

then as soon as it's made he says, " I don't want that! " It is

perfectly normal for him to reverse a decision as soon as he has

made it, because at this stage, he even disagrees with himself. "

http://www.drgreene.com/21_556.html

Your options are the same I gave before -but here is a summary.

Again talk to your husband, your daughter's MD, and the teacher too:

Stop the oils

Keep a journal of what happens to see if behaviors you see as good

or bad stop

Wait a few weeks/months

Start the oils this time, perhaps with just a 1/2 capsule or a few

drops

See if good or bad behaviors come back

Slowly increase

or

Change the formula

or

Don't stop just decrease dosage

If it was up to me -I'd say hang in there. There are tons of

archives on this. "

And due to the fact that I was raised in a " non hitting " family

where we were rewarded for positive behavior and disciplined with

time outs and privileges taken away instead, and that's how we have

raised Dakota and Tanner. I do not accept any type of violence -

including hitting as a means of communication or punishment (and

some use it as a punishment for hitting!) We live in a world that

is far too violent already in my opinion but we can all help to

change our own little piece of it to try to make it a better place,

a more loving place, by teaching our children how to learn to work

out problems and differences without attacking. Here is another

archive on this:

" In response to the rest...I have another viewpoint you may not have

seen. I agree that our children require other nonverbal ways of

communicating at times -however I stand alone on this I guess in

that I never allowed or tolerated hitting as a form of communication

from my boys or anyone else. By you taking your child out to

Mcs while he is supposed to have a " time out " from the school -

is a reward from you for inappropriate behavior -in which he'll

view his actions as " mom approved " .

With our children more than others -we need to not only provide

nonverbal ways to communicate -but to stress the importance of

social skills. You don't want to be your son's only friend. Being

viewed as a bully will not bring friends -and small children won't

understand that your son hits because he's not able to say " be

quiet " Putting your pointer finger to your lips is a polite

nonverbal worldwide understood way to say " be quiet " -just like a

smile is the same for acceptance -for example.

One of the moms who posted here how she was not liked because she

would yell at parents who scolded her son for hitting had a play

date with my two boys. During that (only) playdate -her apraxic son

punched both of my boys (including my apraxic son) more than once.

I didn't scold her son -to be honest I was shocked at her attitude

that this was just his way of communicating and asking my boys to

play. That was our only playdate -we just happened to always

be " busy " after that. "

=====

[Guest guest]

Thanks for this. Helps me see more stuff.

>

> This comes up very often and was just talked about a few months

ago.

> Tanner was a " good " quiet child -no terrible twos -compliant -

> lethargic and easy going -kind of out of it however little boy

prior

> to EFAs. After EFAs he became a 'real boy' and we couldn't be more

> thrilled! Kids go through terrible twos for a developmental

reason.

> Don't have to say more because it's all the archives below:

>

> Re: fish oil and behavior

>

>

> -sorry for the long archive below -but this topic is very old

> and so many have gone through it with success. You don't have to do

> anything -give anything since in most cases it only lasts a few days

> to a week (outside of Marina's child and perhaps one other in this

> group?) Just remember -terrible twos are normal -perhaps the

> children are doing something they should...I know from this group of

> thousands most with apraxia go through it a bit later than 2.

>

> Re: side effects of ProEFA...

>

>

> Lori -Congratulations! Over the years I've learned the only

> real " bad " side effect of fish oils outside of allergy of course -is

> no change, good or bad, at all. The fact you notice something -

> anything -that's a good thing. After all if the oils didn't " work "

> you wouldn't notice a thing -good or bad. Of course let me say

> before Marina that yes there are a handful if you search the

> archives that have children that they pulled off the oils once the

> child was verbal. In Marina's case even however -her child first

> did have huge surges on them and the " bad " behavior started once the

> child was up to the norm in speech. Who knows what would have

> happened if instead of stopping the formula was changed? More EPA -

> remove GLA, raise GLA? Or what about change in dosage or time of

> day of giving the oils? Also -does the same reaction occur when the

> child has a tuna fish sandwich? Perhaps it's something in the

> formula outside of the fish oil? We should notice and dig to find

> the truth -because for most -fish oils have literally given us back

> the child we knew to be there before. And now we know about the

> vitamin E thanks to Dr. . I wish so much I had the

> information most of you have today -and you have the credibility and

> MDs to back up your decision to supplement. Back when I started

> Tanner, I had to follow my gut and my own " research " since there was

> nothing for apraxia or even autism.

>

> We learn more each day, and each of us learn the most about our own

> child/children. So for those of us that have been here for years we

> learn the questions don't change -but the answers may. What we

> assume as fact today may be fallacy tomorrow -and what we consider

> bad today may be known to be the signs that neurons that were

> previously dormant are starting to fire...or possibly not just a

> good sign -but a great one! I could take an educated guess that

> just 2 capsules is enough for your older child to start having some

> reaction -but is probably too conservative a dosage. Two capsules

> is a dosage many give their two year olds.

>

> I suggest you find a medical doctor (neurological) who is

> knowledgeable about the benefits of omegas (and vitamin E) for

> treatment of apraxia and similar impairments. (boy does it feel

> good to almost finally be able to say that after what -almost a

> decade!)

>

>

> You can archive this topic since it came up a handful of times (and

> notice mainly the same three or so parents answer it - " bad " side

> effects are pretty far from the norm)

>

> Wed Jun 14, 2006 6:40 pm

> " kiddietalk " <kiddietalk@...>

> Re: Negative reaction to proefa

>

> I do think I found the trick to searching and even think I found the

> other few parents that posted about negative behavior on EFAs...

> from those that stopped as well as those that didn't. I don't think

> anything here has a chance to be swept under the rug since this

> grouplist has a mind of it's own -we all decide what we want to talk

> about most. Like Actos was swept (ignored by most) and autism vs.

> apraxia is right now the hot topic once again. But...I do believe

> that some here do see signs that may be perceived as negative to

> start that end up going away or being viewed as positive later- on

on

> EFAs or not. Actually in reading over the archives it appears

> Tanner did develop some behaviors some would view as negative -but I

> welcomed it as you'll read below. Then there are others like Kim

> who found it best to ignore those " bad " times.

>

> From: " frank sabel " <sawyera@...>

> Date: Tue May 4, 2004 1:57 pm

> Subject: Re: [ ] Poor reaction to Omega-3 EFA's?

>

>

> Dave,

>

> When I first started Nordic Naturals Pro-EFA (one soft gel per day)

> for my

> then two year old, his behavior became so bad I almost stopped as

> well. I

> was advised by other parents who'd " been there, done that " to hang

> in there

> and it would get better. For us, the first 3-4 weeks were awful but

> by

> weeks 6-8 his behavior settled back to what it was b/4 starting Pro-

> EFA. I

> have read on other boards that adding extra Magnesium helps with

> increased

> hyperactivity that sometimes accompanies the introduction of

> essential fatty

> acids. I never tried that b/c by the time I read that we were past

> that

> phase. I'm just telling you FWIW since adding Magnesium can't hurt.

> There

> is no know toxicity level, but too much can cause diarrhea.

> Naturally you

> would want to consult your son's doctor about all of this. I am not

a

> doctor, just a Mom.

>

> Good luck! KIM

> and

> From: " Morin Family " <morinfamily4@...>

> Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:41 am

> Subject: RE: [ ] Re: ProEFA/bad behavior

>

>

>

> ,

>

> When we started our son on ProEFA and when we increased his dosage,

> he went

> through a time of worse behavior. I have heard time and time again

of

> children experiencing bad behavior prior to a surge, whether on

> ProEFA or

> not. We waited out the crumby behavior (which subsided) and the

> results

> afterward were miraculous! My advice is to give it more time as your

> son's

> body adjusts to the ProEFA.

>

> I have to admit though, we are waiting until summer to make another

> increase

> because of potential bad behavior.

>

> Just my two cents...

>

> Tricia

>

> Below are some archives. Suzi, , Laurel, Dave, and

> Gisele (and anyone else out of the thousands we just didn't hear

> from) can perhaps update us.

>

> Re: Hitting, EFAs, and adding extra Omega-3/Jane

>

>

> " bad behavior prior to a developmental surge "

> I so agree with you Tricia, and I again am so looking forward to

> meeting you and your wonderful family when you vacation in Florida!

> And I agree with you Jane too. This could just be frustrations of

> not being able to communicate, or normal terrible twos behavior.

>

> You guys are lucky your children are going through this stage at a

> normal age in my opinion. We didn't know about EFAs when Tanner was

> two. Tanner didn't go through terrible twos -after he regressed at

> 11 months old he didn't go through much of anything even though he

> passed all developmental milestones according to his pediatricians

> at the time. Yes he had many quirks from his sensory integration

> dysfunction and would occasionally have a melt down, but we learned

> many tricks on how to avoid them, and for the most part Tanner did

> whatever we wanted him to do with no reaction. The best way to

> describe it was that it was like he lost his personality. My son

> Tanner was so lethargic and compliant when he was nonverbal prior to

> EFAs. Maybe I'm weird but I never viewed that as

> normal...or " good " The artist in me wanted self expression. For

> two years Tanner had no life in his eyes -and I can show you videos

> of what I meant. He was like a shell from one to two years old. He

> was not autistic because he responded to one on one attempts to

> communicate -he just couldn't talk, and would tire easily and didn't

> seem to have any energy. The minute Tanner was offered nonverbal

> ways to communicate he responded with enthusiasm and willingness -

> but he was still lethargic.

>

> I welcomed big time when Tanner went through terrible threes after

> we started him on Efalex back in 1999 and he first started to become

> Tanner again - every terrible (normal) moment that Tanner said " No! "

> and demanded it had to be his way and not our way. We respected his

> demands without spoiling him. We welcomed when he started to " run

> around " in the restaurant or store (like his brother who he finally

> could keep up with) while we also taught appropriate places to run

> around instead.

>

> Tanner for years now is known as the " sweetest kid " by the

> teachers, other kids. He has a great sense of humor. He is the one

> who goes out of his way to comfort anyone that is hurt. He has a

> high receptive language ability and has no trouble understanding

> more complex thoughts and feelings...even though he can't always

> express them in a sophisticated way. Tanner takes ProEFA and ProEPA

> every day and regresses when he is off for one day still. He takes

> carn aware/carnosine on an on and off basis which we find to help

> because he regresses when on or off too long. Tanner can not take

> high fiber as it causes a dramatic regression in him for some

> reason. Under the advice of his MD, Tanner drinks pear and papaya

> nectar every day and also eats the Dole papaya jell bowls and canned

> pears which keeps him regular after years of constipation. And only

> uses the Milk of Magnesia once in awhile when he skips a

> day. Tanner is just doing amazing in all areas -and yes I want to

> share what worked for him because I believe in it...and not just for

> Tanner and Dakota.

> http://www.cherab.org/information/familiesrelate/letter.html

>

> Suzanne Smolyar once said the worst side effect she can think of was

> her 5 year old daughter being nonverbal -which she was until

> she started EFAs, and is still doing great. And the good

> news is that for those that don't agree -you can always stop the

> essential oils,

> or look to the gray area in the following archives:

>

> " In rare cases where EFAs don't work -parents don't report any

> changes on the oils or off - either good or bad. So bad news (or

> what you view as bad news which I'll get into below) can actually be

> the good news.

>

> I'd talk it over with your child's MD and your spouse -but it's not

> unusual for there to be a child that is a bit hyper right before the

> surge. And yes -a word just " popping out " the other day after 4

> weeks of starting is a week longer than the one day to 3 weeks -but

> not that far off. If it is the EFAs kicking in -you will keep seeing

> more and more.

>

> Here is a question for you:

>

> Your daughter before -was she " laid back " ? What we view as a " good

> child " is at times a child who is not expressing normal

> developmental attitudes of expressing independence. The " no " stage.

> As speech increases -this stage comes in more -and most times way

> after the age of two. It could happen at three -four or even older -

> and it's when this stage happens that other good things kick in

too -

> like the child becoming more independent of you. So again -this may

> not be the bad sign you think it is. You want your child to go

> through normal stages of development -even if they are not

> all " nice " Most don't like it -but accept it, and just remember -

> this too shall pass.

>

> Keep in mind the following is from a parent of a " normal " child -and

> she doesn't mention whether or not she just started fish oil but I

> suspect not.

>

> " My 19-month-old son has always been a good boy and has done

> whatever I asked him to do. Recently he started refusing to do

> anything I ask of him. He has started crying and hitting me even

> when I ask him to do simple things. Where have I gone wrong? What

> should I be doing differently? Will he always be like this?

> Redwood City, California

>

> " The hallmark of this stage is oppositional behavior. Our wonderful

> children instinctively want to do exactly the opposite of what we

> want. We have nice, reasonable expectations and they say, " NO! " or

> they simply dissolve into tears. Suppose you have some place to get

> to in a hurry. Your son has been in a great mood all day. . . until

> you say, " I need you to get into the car right now. " He will, of

> course, want to do anything except get into the car.

> As if this weren't enough, children in this phase of development

> have a great deal of difficulty making the choices they so

> desperately want to make. You ask your child what he would like for

> dinner, and he says macaroni. You lovingly prepare it for him, and

> then as soon as it's made he says, " I don't want that! " It is

> perfectly normal for him to reverse a decision as soon as he has

> made it, because at this stage, he even disagrees with himself. "

> http://www.drgreene.com/21_556.html

>

>

> Your options are the same I gave before -but here is a summary.

> Again talk to your husband, your daughter's MD, and the teacher too:

>

> Stop the oils

> Keep a journal of what happens to see if behaviors you see as good

> or bad stop

> Wait a few weeks/months

> Start the oils this time, perhaps with just a 1/2 capsule or a few

> drops

> See if good or bad behaviors come back

> Slowly increase

> or

> Change the formula

> or

> Don't stop just decrease dosage

>

> If it was up to me -I'd say hang in there. There are tons of

> archives on this. "

>

> And due to the fact that I was raised in a " non hitting " family

> where we were rewarded for positive behavior and disciplined with

> time outs and privileges taken away instead, and that's how we have

> raised Dakota and Tanner. I do not accept any type of violence -

> including hitting as a means of communication or punishment (and

> some use it as a punishment for hitting!) We live in a world that

> is far too violent already in my opinion but we can all help to

> change our own little piece of it to try to make it a better place,

> a more loving place, by teaching our children how to learn to work

> out problems and differences without attacking. Here is another

> archive on this:

>

> " In response to the rest...I have another viewpoint you may not have

> seen. I agree that our children require other nonverbal ways of

> communicating at times -however I stand alone on this I guess in

> that I never allowed or tolerated hitting as a form of communication

> from my boys or anyone else. By you taking your child out to

> Mcs while he is supposed to have a " time out " from the

school -

> is a reward from you for inappropriate behavior -in which he'll

> view his actions as " mom approved " .

>

> With our children more than others -we need to not only provide

> nonverbal ways to communicate -but to stress the importance of

> social skills. You don't want to be your son's only friend. Being

> viewed as a bully will not bring friends -and small children won't

> understand that your son hits because he's not able to say " be

> quiet " Putting your pointer finger to your lips is a polite

> nonverbal worldwide understood way to say " be quiet " -just like a

> smile is the same for acceptance -for example.

>

> One of the moms who posted here how she was not liked because she

> would yell at parents who scolded her son for hitting had a play

> date with my two boys. During that (only) playdate -her apraxic son

> punched both of my boys (including my apraxic son) more than once.

> I didn't scold her son -to be honest I was shocked at her attitude

> that this was just his way of communicating and asking my boys to

> play. That was our only playdate -we just happened to always

> be " busy " after that. "

>

>

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

I am glad someone else is having a negative reaction to the fish oils,

selfishly, because I could find no research on why *I* felt crappy

taking them...

I recently switched to Carlson's Very Finest, and feel great. I think

different people have different needs, and my old FO wasn't cutting

it... maybe it isn't the FO, per se, but the different amounts in each

of them, or the soy... whatever...

Now, for my daughter, the weepiness DID happen for a couple of days,

but it levelled off... if we skip a day of FO, or even a dose, it is

very evident in her speech...

Anyway, just wanted to chime in since I had posted about a possible

connection to fish oils causing depression and lethargy.

Aubrey

[Guest guest]

I think you hit the nail on the head with the soy. My new brand seems

to have less or something and I tolerate it better.

>

> I am glad someone else is having a negative reaction to the fish

oils,

> selfishly, because I could find no research on why *I* felt crappy

> taking them...

> I recently switched to Carlson's Very Finest, and feel great. I think

> different people have different needs, and my old FO wasn't cutting

> it... maybe it isn't the FO, per se, but the different amounts in

each

> of them, or the soy... whatever...

> Now, for my daughter, the weepiness DID happen for a couple of days,

> but it levelled off... if we skip a day of FO, or even a dose, it is

> very evident in her speech...

> Anyway, just wanted to chime in since I had posted about a possible

> connection to fish oils causing depression and lethargy.

> Aubrey

>