Re: One reason for joint ain

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/5/2003 10:05:24 AM Central Standard Time,

kimpayne@... writes:

> Hey Deb,

>

> I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can cause pain,

> especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can cause

> tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported in which

> achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro because the

> tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

>

> I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her daughter

> (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around 12 years

> old.

>

> Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't walk -- they

> had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and is tiny

> teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!). They'd

> give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

>

> If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in their

> diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

>

> Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and bones

> where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then calcium

> leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and tissues,

> causing arthritic pain.

>

> I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related diabetes " and

> " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the meds we

> take deplete the body of magnesium.

>

> Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that our

> foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your house,

> then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all the

> minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

>

> Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates ATP, cell

> signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose and

> maintaining calcium in bone.

>

> Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium contracts the

> muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the cows

> come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all that

> calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

>

> If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption problems,

> severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches, asthma, heart

> disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase your

> magnesium.

>

> Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't count on it

> working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form of all

> magnesiums.

>

> You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium are

> magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium citrate,

> etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the body in

> minerals.

>

> After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January 2002

> (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium chloride. He

> did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice an

> improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't seeing

> improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to magnesium

> glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now fall

> asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep restfully all

> night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but frequency

> has decreased again.

>

> One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after 5:00 pm

> or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So don't

> give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to sleep

>

> Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide (it was in

> his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium glycinate.

> We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

>

> But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500 mg.

> magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the break down

> of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200 mg.

> Solgar magnesium glycinate.

>

> If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline, Cipro,

> Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're losing

> magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a daily supply

> of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not getting

> enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits that

> contain any good amount of magnesium.

>

> The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics within

> two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets containing

> magnesium!

>

> Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium compete for

> the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut the

> potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving your kids a

> multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving antibiotics,

> stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

>

> Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so it's just

> a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral supplements

> and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why you

> shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

>

> You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in buying

> Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a good

> price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on sale and

> stock up.

>

> Kim

> Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma no cf)

Thanks Kim you are so good at all of this mineral stuff! I am so glad we have

you around to help us out with all of this stuff. I will get some magnesium

for her and see if it help. Deb A

[Guest guest]

---Kim thanks so much for the information, I didn't know that much

about Magnesium. I do know Amber some times complains of her legs

aching or even her knee's hurting after a brief ride on her horse.

She is on Tobi every other month, but does concern me that she does

take her vitamins along with breakfast and thats right after her

Tobi. We couldn't do it any other way because she is in school all

day and needs the vits in the morning. She also takes most of the

same vitamins at night too, and thats about an hr before her Tobi.

Margo, mother of Amber 14 w/cf

In cfparents , " paynekimj <kimpayne@c...> "

<kimpayne@c...> wrote:

> Hey Deb,

>

> I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can cause

pain,

> especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

cause

> tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported in

which

> achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro because

the

> tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

>

> I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

daughter

> (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around 12

years

> old.

>

> Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't walk --

they

> had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and is

tiny

> teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

They'd

> give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

>

> If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

their

> diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

>

> Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and bones

> where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

calcium

> leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and tissues,

> causing arthritic pain.

>

> I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related diabetes "

and

> " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the meds

we

> take deplete the body of magnesium.

>

> Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that our

> foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

house,

> then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all the

> minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

>

> Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates ATP,

cell

> signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose and

> maintaining calcium in bone.

>

> Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium contracts

the

> muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

cows

> come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

that

> calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

>

> If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

problems,

> severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches, asthma,

heart

> disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase your

> magnesium.

>

> Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't count on

it

> working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form of

all

> magnesiums.

>

> You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium are

> magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

citrate,

> etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the body

in

> minerals.

>

> After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

2002

> (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium chloride.

He

> did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice an

> improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

seeing

> improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

magnesium

> glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now fall

> asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep restfully

all

> night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but frequency

> has decreased again.

>

> One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after 5:00

pm

> or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

don't

> give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to sleep

>

> Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide (it

was in

> his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

glycinate.

> We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

>

> But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500 mg.

> magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the break

down

> of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200 mg.

> Solgar magnesium glycinate.

>

> If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

Cipro,

> Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

losing

> magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a daily

supply

> of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

getting

> enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits that

> contain any good amount of magnesium.

>

> The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

within

> two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

containing

> magnesium!

>

> Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium compete

for

> the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut the

> potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving your

kids a

> multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

antibiotics,

> stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

>

> Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so it's

just

> a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

supplements

> and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why you

> shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

>

> You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

buying

> Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

good

> price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on sale

and

> stock up.

>

> Kim

> Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma no

cf)

[Guest guest]

Margo,

Can she slip her vitamin in her pocket and take it at school w/

enough time between that and TOBI. THen at night take the Vitamins

right after school or TOBI right after and the other one just before

getting into bed? I think that's what I'll end up doing with Wyatt

though he only takes Vitamins once a day. Christy

> > Hey Deb,

> >

> > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can cause

> pain,

> > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> cause

> > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported in

> which

> > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro because

> the

> > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> >

> > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> daughter

> > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around 12

> years

> > old.

> >

> > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't walk --

> they

> > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and is

> tiny

> > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> They'd

> > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> >

> > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> their

> > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> >

> > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and bones

> > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> calcium

> > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

tissues,

> > causing arthritic pain.

> >

> > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related diabetes "

> and

> > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the meds

> we

> > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> >

> > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that our

> > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> house,

> > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

the

> > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> >

> > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates ATP,

> cell

> > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose and

> > maintaining calcium in bone.

> >

> > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium contracts

> the

> > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> cows

> > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> that

> > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> >

> > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> problems,

> > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches, asthma,

> heart

> > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase your

> > magnesium.

> >

> > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't count

on

> it

> > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form of

> all

> > magnesiums.

> >

> > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium are

> > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> citrate,

> > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

body

> in

> > minerals.

> >

> > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> 2002

> > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium chloride.

> He

> > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice an

> > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> seeing

> > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> magnesium

> > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

fall

> > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep restfully

> all

> > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

frequency

> > has decreased again.

> >

> > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after 5:00

> pm

> > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> don't

> > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to sleep

> >

> > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide (it

> was in

> > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> glycinate.

> > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> >

> > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500 mg.

> > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the break

> down

> > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

mg.

> > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> >

> > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> Cipro,

> > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> losing

> > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a daily

> supply

> > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> getting

> > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits that

> > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> >

> > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> within

> > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> containing

> > magnesium!

> >

> > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium compete

> for

> > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

the

> > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving your

> kids a

> > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> antibiotics,

> > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> >

> > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so it's

> just

> > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> supplements

> > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

you

> > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

> >

> > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> buying

> > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> good

> > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on sale

> and

> > stock up.

> >

> > Kim

> > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma no

> cf)

[Guest guest]

--- Christy, in the morning after her Toby and breakfast she takes,

Calcium, Sporanox, Ultrase, Vit C, and ADEKs, and every other

morning prednisone. The only way she could take that at school is if

I got a doctors permit for every single one of them. If I had to I

would, but hopefully there will be another way around this so she

can get her Magnesium also.

Thanks

Margo, mother of Amber 14 w/cf

In cfparents , " Christy <seabeewife2@h...> "

<seabeewife2@h...> wrote:

> Margo,

> Can she slip her vitamin in her pocket and take it at school w/

> enough time between that and TOBI. THen at night take the Vitamins

> right after school or TOBI right after and the other one just

before

> getting into bed? I think that's what I'll end up doing with Wyatt

> though he only takes Vitamins once a day. Christy

>

>

>

>

>

> > > Hey Deb,

> > >

> > > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can

cause

> > pain,

> > > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> > cause

> > > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported

in

> > which

> > > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro

because

> > the

> > > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> > >

> > > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> > daughter

> > > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around

12

> > years

> > > old.

> > >

> > > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't

walk --

> > they

> > > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and

is

> > tiny

> > > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> > They'd

> > > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> > >

> > > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> > their

> > > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> > >

> > > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and

bones

> > > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> > calcium

> > > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

> tissues,

> > > causing arthritic pain.

> > >

> > > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related

diabetes "

> > and

> > > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the

meds

> > we

> > > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> > >

> > > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that

our

> > > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> > house,

> > > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

> the

> > > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> > >

> > > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates

ATP,

> > cell

> > > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose

and

> > > maintaining calcium in bone.

> > >

> > > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium

contracts

> > the

> > > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> > cows

> > > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> > that

> > > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> > >

> > > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> > problems,

> > > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches,

asthma,

> > heart

> > > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase

your

> > > magnesium.

> > >

> > > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't

count

> on

> > it

> > > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form

of

> > all

> > > magnesiums.

> > >

> > > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium

are

> > > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> > citrate,

> > > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

> body

> > in

> > > minerals.

> > >

> > > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> > 2002

> > > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium

chloride.

> > He

> > > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice

an

> > > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> > seeing

> > > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> > magnesium

> > > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

> fall

> > > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep

restfully

> > all

> > > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

> frequency

> > > has decreased again.

> > >

> > > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after

5:00

> > pm

> > > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> > don't

> > > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to

sleep

> > >

> > > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide

(it

> > was in

> > > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> > glycinate.

> > > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> > >

> > > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500

mg.

> > > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the

break

> > down

> > > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

> mg.

> > > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> > >

> > > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> > Cipro,

> > > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> > losing

> > > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a

daily

> > supply

> > > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> > getting

> > > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits

that

> > > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> > >

> > > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> > within

> > > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> > containing

> > > magnesium!

> > >

> > > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium

compete

> > for

> > > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

> the

> > > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving

your

> > kids a

> > > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> > antibiotics,

> > > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> > >

> > > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so

it's

> > just

> > > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> > supplements

> > > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

> you

> > > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

> > >

> > > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> > buying

> > > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> > good

> > > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on

sale

> > and

> > > stock up.

> > >

> > > Kim

> > > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma

no

> > cf)

[Guest guest]

Christy,

Remember, while magnesium can help you sleep more restfully, if you

take it in the evening it can pep you up. Unless you want to be

chasing Wyatt around the house at 2:00 am, I recommend you don't give

magnesium in the evening. I've learned that if I take it as late as

7:00 then I'm not ready to go to bed until 2:00 or 3:00 am. So I try

to take my last dose by 5:00 or 5:30.

I usually take 2 tablets per day (100 mg. each) but it depends on

my needs that day. If I feel stressed, pre-migraine due to changing

whether, or my IBS is flaring up, then I take 3 tablets.

I take one with breakfast, then if I'm home during the day, I'll take

another midmorning or at noon. Then I take the last in the afternoon.

But if it's a day I'm away from home, teaching and on the run, then I

take one with breakfast and another when I get home (usually between

2:00 and 3:00).

Kim

> > > Hey Deb,

> > >

> > > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can cause

> > pain,

> > > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> > cause

> > > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported in

> > which

> > > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro because

> > the

> > > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> > >

> > > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> > daughter

> > > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around 12

> > years

> > > old.

> > >

> > > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't walk

--

> > they

> > > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and

is

> > tiny

> > > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> > They'd

> > > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> > >

> > > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> > their

> > > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> > >

> > > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and

bones

> > > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> > calcium

> > > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

> tissues,

> > > causing arthritic pain.

> > >

> > > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related

diabetes "

> > and

> > > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the meds

> > we

> > > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> > >

> > > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that our

> > > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> > house,

> > > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

> the

> > > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> > >

> > > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates ATP,

> > cell

> > > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose

and

> > > maintaining calcium in bone.

> > >

> > > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium contracts

> > the

> > > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> > cows

> > > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> > that

> > > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> > >

> > > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> > problems,

> > > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches, asthma,

> > heart

> > > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase

your

> > > magnesium.

> > >

> > > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't count

> on

> > it

> > > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form of

> > all

> > > magnesiums.

> > >

> > > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium are

> > > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> > citrate,

> > > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

> body

> > in

> > > minerals.

> > >

> > > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> > 2002

> > > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium chloride.

> > He

> > > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice

an

> > > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> > seeing

> > > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> > magnesium

> > > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

> fall

> > > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep restfully

> > all

> > > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

> frequency

> > > has decreased again.

> > >

> > > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after

5:00

> > pm

> > > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> > don't

> > > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to sleep

> > >

> > > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide (it

> > was in

> > > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> > glycinate.

> > > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> > >

> > > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500 mg.

> > > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the break

> > down

> > > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

> mg.

> > > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> > >

> > > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> > Cipro,

> > > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> > losing

> > > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a daily

> > supply

> > > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> > getting

> > > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits that

> > > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> > >

> > > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> > within

> > > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> > containing

> > > magnesium!

> > >

> > > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium

compete

> > for

> > > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

> the

> > > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving your

> > kids a

> > > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> > antibiotics,

> > > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> > >

> > > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so it's

> > just

> > > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> > supplements

> > > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

> you

> > > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

> > >

> > > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> > buying

> > > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> > good

> > > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on

sale

> > and

> > > stock up.

> > >

> > > Kim

> > > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma

no

> > cf)

[Guest guest]

Christy,

Remember, while magnesium can help you sleep more restfully, if you

take it in the evening it can pep you up. Unless you want to be

chasing Wyatt around the house at 2:00 am, I recommend you don't give

magnesium in the evening. I've learned that if I take it as late as

7:00 then I'm not ready to go to bed until 2:00 or 3:00 am. So I try

to take my last dose by 5:00 or 5:30.

I usually take 2 tablets per day (100 mg. each) but it depends on

my needs that day. If I feel stressed, pre-migraine due to changing

whether, or my IBS is flaring up, then I take 3 tablets.

I take one with breakfast, then if I'm home during the day, I'll take

another midmorning or at noon. Then I take the last in the afternoon.

But if it's a day I'm away from home, teaching and on the run, then I

take one with breakfast and another when I get home (usually between

2:00 and 3:00).

Kim

> > > Hey Deb,

> > >

> > > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can cause

> > pain,

> > > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> > cause

> > > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported in

> > which

> > > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro because

> > the

> > > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> > >

> > > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> > daughter

> > > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around 12

> > years

> > > old.

> > >

> > > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't walk

--

> > they

> > > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and

is

> > tiny

> > > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> > They'd

> > > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> > >

> > > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> > their

> > > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> > >

> > > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and

bones

> > > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> > calcium

> > > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

> tissues,

> > > causing arthritic pain.

> > >

> > > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related

diabetes "

> > and

> > > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the meds

> > we

> > > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> > >

> > > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that our

> > > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> > house,

> > > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

> the

> > > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> > >

> > > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates ATP,

> > cell

> > > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose

and

> > > maintaining calcium in bone.

> > >

> > > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium contracts

> > the

> > > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> > cows

> > > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> > that

> > > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> > >

> > > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> > problems,

> > > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches, asthma,

> > heart

> > > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase

your

> > > magnesium.

> > >

> > > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't count

> on

> > it

> > > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form of

> > all

> > > magnesiums.

> > >

> > > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium are

> > > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> > citrate,

> > > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

> body

> > in

> > > minerals.

> > >

> > > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> > 2002

> > > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium chloride.

> > He

> > > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice

an

> > > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> > seeing

> > > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> > magnesium

> > > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

> fall

> > > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep restfully

> > all

> > > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

> frequency

> > > has decreased again.

> > >

> > > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after

5:00

> > pm

> > > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> > don't

> > > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to sleep

> > >

> > > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide (it

> > was in

> > > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> > glycinate.

> > > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> > >

> > > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500 mg.

> > > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the break

> > down

> > > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

> mg.

> > > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> > >

> > > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> > Cipro,

> > > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> > losing

> > > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a daily

> > supply

> > > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> > getting

> > > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits that

> > > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> > >

> > > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> > within

> > > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> > containing

> > > magnesium!

> > >

> > > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium

compete

> > for

> > > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

> the

> > > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving your

> > kids a

> > > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> > antibiotics,

> > > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> > >

> > > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so it's

> > just

> > > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> > supplements

> > > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

> you

> > > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your antibiotics!

> > >

> > > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> > buying

> > > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> > good

> > > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on

sale

> > and

> > > stock up.

> > >

> > > Kim

> > > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma

no

> > cf)

[Guest guest]

Margo,

First, get her off ADEKS. They're pretty useless and an incomplete

source of vitamins and minerals. Get her a complete

multivitamin/mineral such as Centrum (or a generic equivalent). At age

14, she's old enough for GNC's Women's Ultra, which though pricey, is

better.

To supplement A and E, just get her an over-the-counter water soluble

version. You can find water soluble E quite easily. Finding water

soluble A isn't as easy, but I finally located a source: Grandmom

Bev's pharmacy in Florida. You don't need prescriptions for these.

If you get at least 20 minutes of sunlight per week, your body gets

enough vitamin D.

If you maintain good intestinal health, then you should have adequate

vitamin K, because that's where vitamin K is made -- from the good

bacteria in your gut. Other sources of K are alfalfa.

Not everyone needs to supplement D and K. Some only supplement K if

they have a spontaneous lung bleed.

But bottom line, you cannot use ADEKs hoping to round out missing

nutrients -- ADEKs is just not complete and it's absolutely criminal

that CF doctors do not automatically put all patients on a complete

multivitamin/mineral.

For gosh sakes, CF is a disease that affects digestion AND absorption.

Unless you're one of the people with CF whose digestion is not

affected, then there is no way you can absorb all necessary calories

and nutrients from your food.

Kim

> > > > Hey Deb,

> > > >

> > > > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can

> cause

> > > pain,

> > > > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> > > cause

> > > > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported

> in

> > > which

> > > > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro

> because

> > > the

> > > > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> > > >

> > > > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> > > daughter

> > > > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around

> 12

> > > years

> > > > old.

> > > >

> > > > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't

> walk --

> > > they

> > > > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and

> is

> > > tiny

> > > > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> > > They'd

> > > > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> > > >

> > > > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > > > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> > > their

> > > > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> > > >

> > > > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and

> bones

> > > > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> > > calcium

> > > > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

> > tissues,

> > > > causing arthritic pain.

> > > >

> > > > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related

> diabetes "

> > > and

> > > > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the

> meds

> > > we

> > > > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that

> our

> > > > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> > > house,

> > > > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

> > the

> > > > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> > > >

> > > > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates

> ATP,

> > > cell

> > > > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose

> and

> > > > maintaining calcium in bone.

> > > >

> > > > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > > > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium

> contracts

> > > the

> > > > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> > > cows

> > > > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> > > that

> > > > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> > > >

> > > > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> > > problems,

> > > > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches,

> asthma,

> > > heart

> > > > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase

> your

> > > > magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > > > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't

> count

> > on

> > > it

> > > > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form

> of

> > > all

> > > > magnesiums.

> > > >

> > > > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium

> are

> > > > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> > > citrate,

> > > > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

> > body

> > > in

> > > > minerals.

> > > >

> > > > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> > > 2002

> > > > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium

> chloride.

> > > He

> > > > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice

> an

> > > > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> > > seeing

> > > > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> > > magnesium

> > > > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

> > fall

> > > > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep

> restfully

> > > all

> > > > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

> > frequency

> > > > has decreased again.

> > > >

> > > > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after

> 5:00

> > > pm

> > > > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> > > don't

> > > > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to

> sleep

> > > >

> > > > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide

> (it

> > > was in

> > > > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> > > glycinate.

> > > > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> > > >

> > > > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > > > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500

> mg.

> > > > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the

> break

> > > down

> > > > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

> > mg.

> > > > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> > > >

> > > > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> > > Cipro,

> > > > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> > > losing

> > > > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a

> daily

> > > supply

> > > > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> > > getting

> > > > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits

> that

> > > > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> > > within

> > > > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> > > containing

> > > > magnesium!

> > > >

> > > > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium

> compete

> > > for

> > > > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

> > the

> > > > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving

> your

> > > kids a

> > > > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> > > antibiotics,

> > > > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> > > >

> > > > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so

> it's

> > > just

> > > > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> > > supplements

> > > > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

> > you

> > > > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your

antibiotics!

> > > >

> > > > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> > > buying

> > > > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> > > good

> > > > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on

> sale

> > > and

> > > > stock up.

> > > >

> > > > Kim

> > > > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma

> no

> > > cf)

[Guest guest]

Margo,

First, get her off ADEKS. They're pretty useless and an incomplete

source of vitamins and minerals. Get her a complete

multivitamin/mineral such as Centrum (or a generic equivalent). At age

14, she's old enough for GNC's Women's Ultra, which though pricey, is

better.

To supplement A and E, just get her an over-the-counter water soluble

version. You can find water soluble E quite easily. Finding water

soluble A isn't as easy, but I finally located a source: Grandmom

Bev's pharmacy in Florida. You don't need prescriptions for these.

If you get at least 20 minutes of sunlight per week, your body gets

enough vitamin D.

If you maintain good intestinal health, then you should have adequate

vitamin K, because that's where vitamin K is made -- from the good

bacteria in your gut. Other sources of K are alfalfa.

Not everyone needs to supplement D and K. Some only supplement K if

they have a spontaneous lung bleed.

But bottom line, you cannot use ADEKs hoping to round out missing

nutrients -- ADEKs is just not complete and it's absolutely criminal

that CF doctors do not automatically put all patients on a complete

multivitamin/mineral.

For gosh sakes, CF is a disease that affects digestion AND absorption.

Unless you're one of the people with CF whose digestion is not

affected, then there is no way you can absorb all necessary calories

and nutrients from your food.

Kim

> > > > Hey Deb,

> > > >

> > > > I also meant to comment on the joint pain. Yes, Cipro can

> cause

> > > pain,

> > > > especially leg pain. Quinolone antibiotics, such as Cipro, can

> > > cause

> > > > tendon weakening and rupture. There have been cases reported

> in

> > > which

> > > > achilles tendon rupture occured months after using Cipro

> because

> > > the

> > > > tendon was weakend by the antibiotic.

> > > >

> > > > I remember the first time a friend of mine gave Cipro to her

> > > daughter

> > > > (with CF). This was maybe 1999, so she would have been around

> 12

> > > years

> > > > old.

> > > >

> > > > Her legs hurt so bad that she'd cry in pain; she couldn't

> walk --

> > > they

> > > > had to carry her to the bathroom (she was a tiny girl then and

> is

> > > tiny

> > > > teen now -- but then, her parents are both quite small too!).

> > > They'd

> > > > give her Tylenol 'round the clock but it didn't help.

> > > >

> > > > If there is joint/bone pain and you're not using a quinolone

> > > > antibiotic, please be sure they're getting enough magnesium in

> > > their

> > > > diets. This is so crucial, Deb.

> > > >

> > > > Magnesium is necessary for keeping calcium IN the teeth and

> bones

> > > > where most of it belongs. When you're low on magnesium, then

> > > calcium

> > > > leaches out of teeth and bones and deposits in joints and

> > tissues,

> > > > causing arthritic pain.

> > > >

> > > > I believe the reason we're seeing a rise in " CF-related

> diabetes "

> > > and

> > > > " CF-related arthritis " is because many (many, many!) of the

> meds

> > > we

> > > > take deplete the body of magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > Additionally, our soils are now so depleted of minerals that

> our

> > > > foods are inferior. And if you have a water softener in your

> > > house,

> > > > then you're not getting minerals in your drinking water -- all

> > the

> > > > minerals have been removed to make the water soft.

> > > >

> > > > Aside from the cellular importance of magnesium (regulates

> ATP,

> > > cell

> > > > signaling, etc.,) magnesium is crucial for regulating glucose

> and

> > > > maintaining calcium in bone.

> > > >

> > > > Muscle cramps are a sign of magnesium deficiency. Calcium and

> > > > magnesium work together so you need a balance. Calcium

> contracts

> > > the

> > > > muscle, magnesium relaxes muscle. You can drink milk until the

> > > cows

> > > > come home, but if you're not getting enough magnesium then all

> > > that

> > > > calcium in dairy products is just wasted.

> > > >

> > > > If you or family members have digestive and malabsorption

> > > problems,

> > > > severe menstrual cramps, migraine or vascular headaches,

> asthma,

> > > heart

> > > > disease, hypertension, diabetes -- then you need to increase

> your

> > > > magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > Most magnesium sold today is magnesium oxide. Look at your

> > > > multivitamin/mineral label. If it's magnesium oxide don't

> count

> > on

> > > it

> > > > working well; magnesium oxide is the least bioavailable form

> of

> > > all

> > > > magnesiums.

> > > >

> > > > You have to be careful to get the right type. Some magnesium

> are

> > > > magnesium salts, such as magnesium gluconate and magnesium

> > > citrate,

> > > > etc. These can cause loose stools, which further depletes the

> > body

> > > in

> > > > minerals.

> > > >

> > > > After I discovered a magnesium deficiency in my son in January

> > > 2002

> > > > (no thanks to his doctor!), I started him on magnesium

> chloride.

> > > He

> > > > did fine with this. I also started taking it but didn't notice

> an

> > > > improvement. I switched to magnesium citrate but still wasn't

> > > seeing

> > > > improvement that I hoped for, so last August I switched to

> > > magnesium

> > > > glycinate. In TWO days I noticed a huge difference! I can now

> > fall

> > > > asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and I sleep

> restfully

> > > all

> > > > night and wake up well rested. I still get migraines but

> > frequency

> > > > has decreased again.

> > > >

> > > > One big thing I learned is that I can't take magnesium after

> 5:00

> > > pm

> > > > or it peps me up so much that I'm up working until 2:00 am. So

> > > don't

> > > > give it to your kids in the evening if you expect them to

> sleep

> > > >

> > > > Since August, has been taking 200 mg. magnesium oxide

> (it

> > > was in

> > > > his GNC multivitamin/mineral) and another 200 mg. magnesium

> > > glycinate.

> > > > We use Solgar's " amino acid chelate, magnesium glycinate. "

> > > >

> > > > But last month (Jan. 18), he switched to a different

> > > > multi-vitamin/mineral (Glycentials by Mannatech). It has 500

> mg.

> > > > magnesium oxide and magnesium glycinate (I don't know the

> break

> > > down

> > > > of how much of each). And he still takes an additional 100-200

> > mg.

> > > > Solgar magnesium glycinate.

> > > >

> > > > If you or your kids are using TOBI, albuterol, theophylline,

> > > Cipro,

> > > > Zithromax, etc. -- and drink caffeine beverages -- then you're

> > > losing

> > > > magnesium and need to supplement. If you aren't getting a

> daily

> > > supply

> > > > of fish, dried beans, some dark green veggies then you're not

> > > getting

> > > > enough magnesium from foods. There are only a couple fruits

> that

> > > > contain any good amount of magnesium.

> > > >

> > > > The most important thing to remember: DON'T take antibiotics

> > > within

> > > > two hours of taking magnesium or vitamin/mineral tablets

> > > containing

> > > > magnesium!

> > > >

> > > > Antibiotics (including Zithromax and Cipro) and magnesium

> compete

> > > for

> > > > the same receptor site. If you take them together then you cut

> > the

> > > > potency of the antibiotics by 50%-90%. So if you're giving

> your

> > > kids a

> > > > multivitmain/mineral at the same time as you're giving

> > > antibiotics,

> > > > stop now! You MUST space them MINIMUM two hours apart!

> > > >

> > > > Many antibiotics shouldn't be taken with calcium either, so

> it's

> > > just

> > > > a good idea to dose antibiotics away from vitamin/mineral

> > > supplements

> > > > and antacids (i.e., Tums, Rolaids, etc.). And this is also why

> > you

> > > > shouldn't drink calcium-fortified juices with your

antibiotics!

> > > >

> > > > You can go to www.houseofnutrition.com if you're interested in

> > > buying

> > > > Solgar magnesium amino acid chelate (magnesium glycinate) at a

> > > good

> > > > price. I buy it locally at Whole Foods Store when it goes on

> sale

> > > and

> > > > stock up.

> > > >

> > > > Kim

> > > > Mom of (23 1/2 with cf and asthma) and (20 asthma

> no

> > > cf)

[Guest guest]

Kim,

Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and ADEK? Is there

another option for someone this young? Emma has severe acid reflux and

if this is really acidic like n mentioned then it would make sense

for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and see if this helps her reflux

at all.

Thanks,

- mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and Emma 2 1/2

w/cf and acid reflux

________________________________________________________________

Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today

Only $9.95 per month!

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

The last info I have on ADEKs says that it contains the following:

3 mg Beta-Carotene

50 mcg Biotin

150 IU D-Alpha Tocopherol

10 mg D-Pantothenic Acid (Calcium D-Pantothenate)

0.2 mg Folic acid

10 mg Niacin

4000 IU Vitamin A Palmitate

1.2 mg VITAMIN B1

12 mcg Vitamin B12

1.3 mg Vitamin B2

1.5 mg Vitamin B6

60 mg Vitamin C

400 IU Vitamin D3

0.15 mg Vitamin K1

7.5 mg Zinc (zinc gluconate)

You might want to take your bottle of ADEKs and compare it to any

children's chewable multi.

When my kids were infants, their ped put them on Poly-Vi-Sol drops. As

they grew, I tried different chewable vitamins -- you know,

Flintstones... whatever I had a coupon for and as long as it was a

complete multi. I ended up sticking with Centrum Jr. for a long time

because it was most complete. Then a generic version of Centrum Jr.

came along.

When was diagnosed at age 4, I asked his CF doctor if he needed

a different vitamin/mineral supplement. He seemed surprised I was

giving anything at all, but said it was fine whatever I wanted

to give him. He was also suprised that I gave extra C every

day. The only change he made was the addition of water-soluble vitamin

E water-soluble vitamin A capsules and told me to give those with a

meal, when took a enzyme, so they would be absorbed.

When ADEKs first came out, would have had to chew 7.75 ADEKs

tablets to equal the amount of vitamin A that he takes. Even the

Scandipharm rep thought that was pretty insane and agreed I should

stick with what I had.

Kids with CF need complete supplementation, and ADEKs won't do it. I

don't know about the acidity of all the above elements, but I do know

that magnesium is an alkaline mineral. And if reflux is a problem then

it's especially important to look at underlying magnesium deficiency.

Way back in the olden days that's why plain ol' Milk of Magnesium was

so popular for tummy aches...

But you have to be careful. There are so many types of magnesium on

the market; most are magnesium salts and those sometimes can cause

loose stools in high doses.

If you really want what I consider the " gold standard " of

multivitamin/minerals, I'd really take a look at those chewable

Glyco-Bears made my Mannatech.

If I knew back when my kids were young, what I know now, then

absolutely I would have bought those. In fact--I DID just buy a bottle

for my 20-year old daughter because she swears she still can't swallow

pills, but she agreed to a chewable if I found one for her.

Kim

Kim,

Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and ADEK?

Is there another option for someone this young? Emma has severe acid

reflux and if this is really acidic like n mentioned then it

would make sense for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and see if

this helps her reflux at all.

Thanks,

- mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and Emma 2

1/2 w/cf and acid reflux

[Guest guest]

,

I'm not sure if this is the BEST way but when Wyatt was around age

2 we stopped using ADEK and started using a complete children's

multivitamin (chewable) such as Sesame Street Complete or Centrum

Complete for Children (I think the characters are Rugrats)He also

takes an extra E supplement and K supplement. Christy Mom of Wyatt

7wcf and Hunter 2.5wocf

-- In cfparents , M Law <maria_law@j...> wrote:

> Kim,

>

> Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and

ADEK? Is there

> another option for someone this young? Emma has severe acid reflux

and

> if this is really acidic like n mentioned then it would make

sense

> for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and see if this helps her

reflux

> at all.

>

>

> Thanks,

>

> - mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and Emma

2 1/2

> w/cf and acid reflux

>

>

> ________________________________________________________________

> Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today

> Only $9.95 per month!

> Visit www.juno.com

[Guest guest]

Kim

What is Mannatech's website again and will it show prices for the

vitamins? If it's not to bad I think I'd like to try those for Wyatt.

He swallows pills wonderfully but if they are better than what I buy

at the store I want him on the better vitamins. :)Thanks, Christy

> Kim,

>

> Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and ADEK?

> Is there another option for someone this young? Emma has severe

acid

> reflux and if this is really acidic like n mentioned then it

> would make sense for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and see

if

> this helps her reflux at all.

>

>

> Thanks,

>

> - mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and Emma

2

> 1/2 w/cf and acid reflux

[Guest guest]

Christy,

The link to the Glyco-Bear PDF file is:

http://www.mannapages.com/ShopNow/fod.asp?fodnumber=1011

The link to the Glyco-Bear page follows, but it's long, so if it's not

hyperlinked in blue, then you'll have to copy and paste all of it into

your browser:

http://www.mannapages.com/ShopNow/PRDGlycoBears.asp?sMainMenu=ShopNow &

sMain2Menu=ProductList & sSubMenu=Products & sSubMenuItem=PRDGlycoBears.as

p & sSubMenu2Item=na & sSubMenu3Item=na & UN=

Or you can go to www.mannatech.com, click on USA, then click on

Products/Shop, then scroll down to Glyco-Bears on the left and click

that to access the page. I found the site works better if you use

Internet Explorer, not Netscape.

What jazzes me about these vitamins is that they're naturally based

from fruits and vegetables, not synthetic. And they use glycinated

forms of minerals, which are better absorbed than other forms.

A bottle of 60 tablets costs $22.50. Or if you join as an associate,

the cost drops to $20.50. If you sign up for automatic monthly

shipments, then you get an additional 10% price break each month, plus

you can choose another bottle free with your first automatic shipment.

I figure a bottle of 60, at 2 per day would last a month -- so the

autoship plan seems worth it. You can cancel autoshipment any time. So

even if you sign up for autoship for one month, you get a 10% price

break and can get a bottle of free Glyco-Bears or free Phyto-Bears.

It says children under age 4 should take 1 tablet daily, over age 4

they should take 1 tablet twice a day.

Kim

> > Kim,

> >

> > Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and ADEK?

> > Is there another option for someone this young? Emma has severe

> acid

> > reflux and if this is really acidic like n mentioned then it

> > would make sense for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and see

> if

> > this helps her reflux at all.

> >

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> > - mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and Emma

> 2

> > 1/2 w/cf and acid reflux

[Guest guest]

Thanks Kim! I'll check it out this weekend :)Christy

> > > Kim,

> > >

> > > Oh most knowledgeable one, what about a two year old and ADEK?

> > > Is there another option for someone this young? Emma has

severe

> > acid

> > > reflux and if this is really acidic like n mentioned then

it

> > > would make sense for us to look into taking her off ADEKs and

see

> > if

> > > this helps her reflux at all.

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > > - mom to the butterfly girls Isabelle 4 years wo/cf and

Emma

> > 2

> > > 1/2 w/cf and acid reflux