Re: no-fenol making pro yeast sugars more avaliable

[Guest guest]

Yeah!!!! for !!!

I was just beginning to wonder since many of the " phenol " things are

fruits if somehow it may be " helping " yeast, but then we have a

contradiction in what is going on. I just went to the Enzymedica

site and looked at the Candidase:

" Recommended Usage:

For moderate symptoms take 2 capsules, 3 times a day at least ½ hour

before or 2 hours after a meal for 7 days (for maintenance 2 a day).

For acute symptoms:

take 2 capsules, 3 times a day at least ½ hour before or 2 hours

after a meal for 14 days. In extreme cases more time may be needed.

For best results 4 capsules of Purify may be added each time

Candidase is taken. "

Well it might help to read the directions, lol. So, if you have

yeast, is it helping or hindering....or both. The plot thickens. I

have been looking up yeast die-off symptoms but they appear to be

the same as the yeast growth symptoms and one place even said it is

very difficult to tell if it is growing or dieing at any particular

time.

.

> since it breaks down fiber it may be making sugars the yeast like

> more avaliable

>

> so it could be both helping and hindering yeast depending....

[Guest guest]

Ack!! So are you saying taking the No Fenol could make a yeast

problem worse??

Kathy ---

In @y..., " jornmatt " <kjorn@t...> wrote:

> Yeah!!!! for !!!

>

> I was just beginning to wonder since many of the " phenol " things

are

> fruits if somehow it may be " helping " yeast, but then we have a

> contradiction in what is going on. I just went to the Enzymedica

> site and looked at the Candidase:

>

> " Recommended Usage:

> For moderate symptoms take 2 capsules, 3 times a day at least ½

hour

> before or 2 hours after a meal for 7 days (for maintenance 2 a day).

>

> For acute symptoms:

> take 2 capsules, 3 times a day at least ½ hour before or 2 hours

> after a meal for 14 days. In extreme cases more time may be needed.

> For best results 4 capsules of Purify may be added each time

> Candidase is taken. "

>

> Well it might help to read the directions, lol. So, if you have

> yeast, is it helping or hindering....or both. The plot thickens. I

> have been looking up yeast die-off symptoms but they appear to be

> the same as the yeast growth symptoms and one place even said it is

> very difficult to tell if it is growing or dieing at any particular

> time.

> .

>

>

> > since it breaks down fiber it may be making sugars the yeast like

> > more avaliable

> >

> > so it could be both helping and hindering yeast depending....

[Guest guest]

> Ack!! So are you saying taking the No Fenol could make a yeast

> problem worse??

I wouldn't panic...yet! This is still a work in progress. This is

where we are so far:

1. It seems that if someone does not have a yeast problem, the No-

Fenol works great on most phenolic foods. These guys are pleased as

punch.

2. If the person has a bad yeast problem, the No-Fenol seems to work

well on the yeast, and maybe the phenolic foods too. This may be

because the yeast is already so bad that that whack the No-Fenol

sends is helpful. These guys are really thrilled.

3. If the person notices lack of bowel movements with No-Fenol, this

is fine because there is simply less " waste " in the intestines. It

does not necessarily reflect constipation building up.

4. If you want to use No-Fenol for yeast treatment, then you should

give 1 or 2 capsules in between meals to act on the yeast directly

(just as you give proteases inbetween meals for detox), and probably

do this twice or three times a day.

5. If you have irritable bowel or colitis or Crohn's or something

like that, the No-Fenol can act similar to the Specific Carbohydrate

Diet and keep all the roughage and extra waste to a minimum. This

keeps the yeast and bacteria down and doesn't irritate the sensitive

intestines. These guys (including us) are very happy.

6. The gray area: The people in the middle who get a slight reaction

which seems to indicate either phenols getting through so they

should increase the dose; or too much die-off, so decreasing the

dose helps; or maybe even yeast getting a bit of a boost, so it is

not clear what to do. Unfortunately since all these reactions have

the same symptoms, this part has not clarified itself yet. At this

point, you may need to use your best judgement on whether the

symptoms seem similar to previous reactions or not. These guys are

really confused and not smiling at the moment.

Also, if the symptoms appear to get worse, by all means stop or

change course. I would suggest monitoring what types of foods you

give too. If it does seem to be yeast increaseing and not die-off,

then you can switch to using the No-Fenol inbetween meals.

Stayed tuned to this listserve for the latest updates on this

matter. This is , reporting live from Enzymes and Autism.

[Guest guest]

LOL thanks for trying to help,karen. I really don't know what to

think. We haven't given our daughter much as far as phenols go so I

don't think its phenols getting through. Yesterday I gave her just

small amounts of NF in her juice with the other enzymes and the nasty

bm happened along with a brief behavior flare up but...all the rest

of the day she was fabulous. I honestly don't want to promote alot

of die off right now if this is what we are facing because she goes

back to school Monday. I guess I will not increase the NF for now and

save it for summer vac coming then increase it gradually. I won't

send the NF to school and just give her a little at home like I have

been and see how it goes. She also just finished some antibiotics so

maybe the yeast was there from that? I don't really think its

increasing a yeast problem because she is improving like crazy and it

would be the other way around, wouldn't it?? Its just weird-I never

thought she had a problem with yeast. I'll keep you posted.

---

In @y..., " jornmatt " <kjorn@t...> wrote:

> > Ack!! So are you saying taking the No Fenol could make a yeast

> > problem worse??

>

> I wouldn't panic...yet! This is still a work in progress. This is

> where we are so far:

> 1. It seems that if someone does not have a yeast problem, the No-

> Fenol works great on most phenolic foods. These guys are pleased as

> punch.

> 2. If the person has a bad yeast problem, the No-Fenol seems to

work

> well on the yeast, and maybe the phenolic foods too. This may be

> because the yeast is already so bad that that whack the No-Fenol

> sends is helpful. These guys are really thrilled.

> 3. If the person notices lack of bowel movements with No-Fenol,

this

> is fine because there is simply less " waste " in the intestines. It

> does not necessarily reflect constipation building up.

> 4. If you want to use No-Fenol for yeast treatment, then you should

> give 1 or 2 capsules in between meals to act on the yeast directly

> (just as you give proteases inbetween meals for detox), and

probably

> do this twice or three times a day.

> 5. If you have irritable bowel or colitis or Crohn's or something

> like that, the No-Fenol can act similar to the Specific

Carbohydrate

> Diet and keep all the roughage and extra waste to a minimum. This

> keeps the yeast and bacteria down and doesn't irritate the

sensitive

> intestines. These guys (including us) are very happy.

>

> 6. The gray area: The people in the middle who get a slight

reaction

> which seems to indicate either phenols getting through so they

> should increase the dose; or too much die-off, so decreasing the

> dose helps; or maybe even yeast getting a bit of a boost, so it is

> not clear what to do. Unfortunately since all these reactions have

> the same symptoms, this part has not clarified itself yet. At this

> point, you may need to use your best judgement on whether the

> symptoms seem similar to previous reactions or not. These guys are

> really confused and not smiling at the moment.

>

> Also, if the symptoms appear to get worse, by all means stop or

> change course. I would suggest monitoring what types of foods you

> give too. If it does seem to be yeast increaseing and not die-off,

> then you can switch to using the No-Fenol inbetween meals.

>

> Stayed tuned to this listserve for the latest updates on this

> matter. This is , reporting live from Enzymes and Autism.

[Guest guest]

> 1. It seems that if someone does not have a yeast problem, the No-

> Fenol works great on most phenolic foods. These guys are pleased as

> punch.

Okay another AS moment. What is " pleased as punch " ?? How can punch

be pleased? Or is it spiked punch [which I could really use some of

right now LOL, but I would definitely understand how spiked punch

could be pleased!] Or is it sarcasm, and punch is never pleased, so

you are actually saying these people are really NOT pleased? I am

very confused.

> 6. The gray area: The people in the middle who get a slight reaction

> which seems to indicate either phenols getting through so they

> should increase the dose; or too much die-off, so decreasing the

> dose helps; or maybe even yeast getting a bit of a boost, so it is

> not clear what to do. Unfortunately since all these reactions have

> the same symptoms, this part has not clarified itself yet. At this

> point, you may need to use your best judgement on whether the

> symptoms seem similar to previous reactions or not. These guys are

> really confused and not smiling at the moment.

EVERYTHING requires the parents to use best judgment! And altho I am

still confused about certain aspects of many things, so far I am

overall smiling, so being confused does NOT always mean people are not

smiling [unless you mean " guys " would not be smiling, altho perhaps

" ladies " might still be able to smile?].

> Also, if the symptoms appear to get worse, by all means stop or

> change course. I would suggest monitoring what types of foods you

> give too.

For my kids, bananas and red grapes require less No-Fenol than

strawberries and blueberries, so there is definitely a difference in

how much NF is required for different foods.

Dana

[Guest guest]

" pleased as punch " means " really happy about it. " I believe it is

because drinking punch is pleasing. Punch is usually served at a

happy occassion. Not to be confused with receiving a punch in the

face because this would not be pleasing....unless you were the

person delivering the punch to someone you detested. Then you would

be pleased, no doubt!

At this moment, I am leaning strongly toward all of these " marginal "

cases as being die-off, and not really so much a surge in yeast

growth. A few people added more detail today, such as good signs

accompaning questionable ones. This ususally indicates a positive

direction. Or if someone had a long-standing yeast problem anyway,

they would be in a delicate balance with yeast. The No-Fenol would

knock it back a bit.

I have a bit of confusion on yeast treatment in general. According

to the Specific Carbohydrate Diet you can eat all the fruit you like

because it is easily digestible. You are to avoid all the complex

carbs because these leave " waste " and residue which allow the yeast

and bacteria to grow, and also irritate a sensitive/damaged gut. By

only eating the simple carbs you digest the food and absorb the

energy and nutrition for yourself leaving nothing for the bugs.

Sounds reasonable. This is also the strategy used in animal science.

Now most other anti-yeast diets say don't even look at a piece of

fruit because the simple carbs go to the bugs first and feed them.

So this is the opposite strategy for the same condition. If it were

me I would go with the SCD diet because fruit is a basic food group

and provides needed nutrition, but I don't have a yeast problem, so

it is easier for me to sit back and speculate about these things.

The SCD diet seems to address ALL bugs and gut problems, not just

yeast.

Another thing about yeast is that it can be located in many parts of

the body, whereas the No-Fenol would be working only in the gut.

Some of these variable yeast symptoms may be dependent on where the

yeast is.

But if you want to address a yeast problem with No-Fenol directly,

then taking it inbetween meals seems helpful. Taking a little bit

with meals would help with phenolic foods. And most people without

yeast to consider are doing well with No-Fenol for phenolic foods.

The dose may vary by food type.

.

[Guest guest]

Hi there, the mothers that were using PCA with their children, could you

please give us an update. And question for Dana, we can't use GSE as we use

busperone and so I think it would be potentially dangerous - how do you

think using no-phenol once a day away from meals would be for keeping the

yeast at bay while chelating - would appreciate your opinion

Cheers H

----- Original Message -----

[Guest guest]

>And question for Dana, we can't use GSE as we use

> busperone and so I think it would be potentially dangerous - how do

you

> think using no-phenol once a day away from meals would be for

keeping the

> yeast at bay while chelating - would appreciate your opinion

> Cheers H

I think it would help, depending on how bad your child's yeast issue

can get. You can always try it and see what happens. Otherwise I

don't know. Do you also use probiotics or rx medication?

Dana

[Guest guest]

Thanks Dana, what is rx medication - and no we don't use probiotics,

whenever have child has become hyper, same with vitamins - so don't use, we

use busperone, and enzymes with each eating time (6 times per day) - just

found no fenol also has made him hyper - every now and then I have treated

yeast with diflucan or ampeterican and it makes a difference but not a long

term solution - know we have a yeast issue but not a big one, - we also

chelate with ALA and have used PCA - while chelating use ampeterican - was

hoping to use no fenol as a daily treatment of yeast to try and lessen the

highs and lows - child on normal diet and doing fine with that and enzymes.

Thanks for your help.

Cheers H

[ ] Re: no-fenol making pro yeast sugars more

avaliable

>

> >And question for Dana, we can't use GSE as we use

> > busperone and so I think it would be potentially dangerous - how do

> you

> > think using no-phenol once a day away from meals would be for

> keeping the

> > yeast at bay while chelating - would appreciate your opinion

> > Cheers H

>

>

> I think it would help, depending on how bad your child's yeast issue

> can get. You can always try it and see what happens. Otherwise I

> don't know. Do you also use probiotics or rx medication?

>

> Dana

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> > 1. It seems that if someone does not have a yeast problem, the No-

> > Fenol works great on most phenolic foods. These guys are pleased

as

> > punch.

>

>

> Okay another AS moment. What is " pleased as punch " ?? How can

punch

> be pleased? Or is it spiked punch [which I could really use some

of

> right now LOL, but I would definitely understand how spiked punch

> could be pleased!] Or is it sarcasm, and punch is never pleased,

so

> you are actually saying these people are really NOT pleased? I am

> very confused.

>

>

> > 6. The gray area: The people in the middle who get a slight

reaction

> > which seems to indicate either phenols getting through so they

> > should increase the dose; or too much die-off, so decreasing the

> > dose helps; or maybe even yeast getting a bit of a boost, so it

is

> > not clear what to do. Unfortunately since all these reactions

have

> > the same symptoms, this part has not clarified itself yet. At

this

> > point, you may need to use your best judgement on whether the

> > symptoms seem similar to previous reactions or not. These guys

are

> > really confused and not smiling at the moment.

>

>

> EVERYTHING requires the parents to use best judgment! And altho I

am

> still confused about certain aspects of many things, so far I am

> overall smiling, so being confused does NOT always mean people are

not

> smiling [unless you mean " guys " would not be smiling, altho perhaps

> " ladies " might still be able to smile?].

>

>

> > Also, if the symptoms appear to get worse, by all means stop or

> > change course. I would suggest monitoring what types of foods you

> > give too.

>

>

> For my kids, bananas and red grapes require less No-Fenol than

> strawberries and blueberries, so there is definitely a difference

in

> how much NF is required for different foods.

>

> Dana