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Blondie, we think the fiancee is borderline. She just hides it well. We

noticed that when she moved in with him she had a big fight with his

roommate - a nice kid - and they were telling us how crazy the ex-roommate

was. We wondered. Then we heard stories about how there was this crazy

person at work, and that crazy woman lived up the street. Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

signs that she is borderline.

a

PJ, I haven't been here very long, so forgive me if I am asking weird

questions. What I am trying to figure out is, why would you seek help

from parents

of borderline personality kids if your son, and no one in your family at

all

is borderline? His fiancee is not borderline. In fact, not even

codependency is in your family, you have said.

Am I missing something? Was there someone you know/knew who has BPD?

Was

it because the counselors in your therapy group that you saw after the

affair

with the psychiatrist stated they thought you had borderline tendencies?

That was an awful thing for a doctor to do, abusing trust, among other

things.

So far I have only heard bits and pieces of your story dealing with

reactions, anger, control issues, con men, and manipulative behavior.

Somehow I feel compelled to help, but these questions puzzle me.

Please forgive my candor.

There are so many reasons why your son might have stopped interacting

with

the family. Perhaps he is thinking that he needs alone time with the

fiancee

to cement their relationship. Maybe he is unsure of how she would react

in a

family setting. Maybe he is asserting his need for independence. I have

friends who get involved in relationships and absolutely forget they have

friends. (Or family) They spend every moment with the person, obsess

about the

person when they can't be around them, and talk about nothing but their

relationship. (When it is new...) Then after the novelty wears off,

they seem to

come out of this trance-like behavior. Begin acting like they used to

act.

This is hard on others, since relationships ideally are a two way street.

I am so glad your health is improving, and you say that you are not

obsessing over your son at this time. That is great!

Blondie

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I get it now a.

Many, many times my daughter thinks people are crazy, and she will state it

in no uncertain terms.

You didn't mention my question regarding relationships. Do you think he

might just have his head stuck so far in the relationship because the novelty

hasn't worn off yet? People who do this remind me of people in a hypnotic

state. My friend hardly calls me if she is deeply involved in a relationship.

(first 6 months or so) Then when she surfaces again, it's almost like... now

who are you again?

Blondie

Blondie

In a message dated 1/18/2006 5:07:21 P.M. Central Standard Time, pj7@...

writes:

Blondie, we think the fiancee is borderline. She just hides it well. We

noticed that when she moved in with him she had a big fight with his

roommate - a nice kid - and they were telling us how crazy the ex-roommate

was. We wondered. Then we heard stories about how there was this crazy

person at work, and that crazy woman lived up the street. Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

signs that she is borderline.

a

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The fiance is thought to be BP.

TxCoastGal@... wrote:

PJ, I haven't been here very long, so forgive me if I am asking weird

questions. What I am trying to figure out is, why would you seek help from

parents

of borderline personality kids if your son, and no one in your family at all

is borderline? His fiancee is not borderline. In fact, not even

codependency is in your family, you have said.

Am I missing something? Was there someone you know/knew who has BPD? Was

it because the counselors in your therapy group that you saw after the affair

with the psychiatrist stated they thought you had borderline tendencies?

That was an awful thing for a doctor to do, abusing trust, among other things.

So far I have only heard bits and pieces of your story dealing with

reactions, anger, control issues, con men, and manipulative behavior.

Somehow I feel compelled to help, but these questions puzzle me.

Please forgive my candor.

There are so many reasons why your son might have stopped interacting with

the family. Perhaps he is thinking that he needs alone time with the fiancee

to cement their relationship. Maybe he is unsure of how she would react in a

family setting. Maybe he is asserting his need for independence. I have

friends who get involved in relationships and absolutely forget they have

friends. (Or family) They spend every moment with the person, obsess about

the

person when they can't be around them, and talk about nothing but their

relationship. (When it is new...) Then after the novelty wears off, they seem

to

come out of this trance-like behavior. Begin acting like they used to act.

This is hard on others, since relationships ideally are a two way street.

I am so glad your health is improving, and you say that you are not

obsessing over your son at this time. That is great!

Blondie

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In a message dated 1/18/2006 6:07:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, pj7@...

writes:

Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

signs that she is borderline.

a,

This bit of news is interesting. Won't allow her picture to be taken?

What's up with that? Where is this girl from? Is she a local girl from your

area that everyone knows? Or someone that's a newcomer and your son met her?

This is very odd, because, first and foremost, people w/BPD don't " hide " the

disorder, or maybe you are considering her " devil at home, angel away " persona

as hiding. This would be BPD showing full fledged, AND, very surprised as my

experience with picture taking is that they MUST be in the limelight.

I'm curious as to why this fiance of his is " hiding " . Sounds to me she is

running from something and doesn't want to be found.

DebbieL

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Very strange, Helen, as my daughter loved/loves having her picture taken.

Guess that's the narcissism or being histrionic that brings that out. So many

disorders overlap.

DebbieL

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My daughter, also diagnosed with BPD, has always been very reluctant to have

her picture taken. It had to be " just so " to get it taken, and that, of

course, never happened. The best I could do was get a picture of her with my

telephoto lens when we were hiking. I'd take it early in my picture taking

spree, and then when she realized the camera out and I was using it, she'd

say " Mom, please don't take my picture " . At that point, I was glad to say

" OK, I won't " because I'd already done it. In the days of film, you couldn't

go back and " untake " it.

Helen

_____

From: WTOParentsOfBPs

[mailto:WTOParentsOfBPs ] On Behalf Of funnygirl1154@...

Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:38 AM

To: WTOParentsOfBPs

Subject: Re: PJ/ question

In a message dated 1/18/2006 6:07:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, pj7@...

writes:

Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

signs that she is borderline.

a,

This bit of news is interesting. Won't allow her picture to be taken?

What's up with that? Where is this girl from? Is she a local girl from

your

area that everyone knows? Or someone that's a newcomer and your son met

her?

This is very odd, because, first and foremost, people w/BPD don't " hide " the

disorder, or maybe you are considering her " devil at home, angel away "

persona

as hiding. This would be BPD showing full fledged, AND, very surprised as

my

experience with picture taking is that they MUST be in the limelight.

I'm curious as to why this fiance of his is " hiding " . Sounds to me she is

running from something and doesn't want to be found.

DebbieL

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Blondie,

Our son is this kind, gentle person. His 19 month older brother is very

strong and dominant. I think the younger son is using this powerful

girlfriend to enable him to be strong - no matter what she does. Also, she

has emotionally hurt him if not physically. She is the one who told us we

would never see him again or know where they lived. I had just asked him for

his new phone number and address the day before. I think he was going to

look it up but she was in the room telling him not to give it to me.

The next day SHE told us that " You are all so crazy I am not sure I want

to marry your son. " She said this to me on the phone while he was listening

in the background. I quietly asked to speak to him and he hung up on me.

He is completely under her control now. He has to believe that everything

she thinks about us is true or she will leave him.

They have been together for 3 years, so it is not a new relationship. His

contact with us over the 3 years has dimished. We can see where all of his

separating from us is related to her. Keep in mind we only saw him about 4

times a year and spoke on the phone a couple of times a month. He was 27 and

in grad school half way across the country.

Once she told me she kicked him when they had a fight. I thought then it

was just like a light slap or kick on the leg. I guess I cannot imagine

violence. No one in our family is like this. I can't prove she is abusing

him, but I know we are not the type to hit back. My husband and older son

are very strong. Husband used to work as a state constable, and he will

control someone who is violent, but he never hits or loses control of his

temper. The sons are the same way.

I probably need to stop writing about us for awhile. I am finding that the

past 3 days I am not able to focus on my daily life and joy. Maybe this is a

sign that you folks are right - it is not time to even think about writing

our son again.

Thanks for reading,

PJ

I get it now a.

Many, many times my daughter thinks people are crazy, and she will state

it

in no uncertain terms.

You didn't mention my question regarding relationships. Do you think he

might just have his head stuck so far in the relationship because the

novelty

hasn't worn off yet? People who do this remind me of people in a

hypnotic

state. My friend hardly calls me if she is deeply involved in a

relationship.

(first 6 months or so) Then when she surfaces again, it's almost

like... now

who are you again?

Blondie

Blondie

In a message dated 1/18/2006 5:07:21 P.M. Central Standard Time,

pj7@...

writes:

Blondie, we think the fiancee is borderline. She just hides it well. We

noticed that when she moved in with him she had a big fight with his

roommate - a nice kid - and they were telling us how crazy the

ex-roommate

was. We wondered. Then we heard stories about how there was this crazy

person at work, and that crazy woman lived up the street. Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I

see

signs that she is borderline.

a

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Our son was in Austin in grad school. We lived in SC. She is from Seattle

and met him in Austin.

We met her mom - a lovely person.

Odd things we know:

She has cut off other family members.

Her sister said she would not come to their wedding unless it was catholic.

She was married before and says her ex was abusive.

We tried to contact her ex to ask about her. He got our message but did not

choose to respond - not surprising.

My take on the picture taking that it is a sign of extremely low self-esteem

in spite of good looks and high success in her career.

PJ

In a message dated 1/18/2006 6:07:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, pj7@...

writes:

Also, she would

never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

signs that she is borderline.

a,

This bit of news is interesting. Won't allow her picture to be

taken?

What's up with that? Where is this girl from? Is she a local girl from

your

area that everyone knows? Or someone that's a newcomer and your son met

her?

This is very odd, because, first and foremost, people w/BPD don't " hide "

the

disorder, or maybe you are considering her " devil at home, angel away "

persona

as hiding. This would be BPD showing full fledged, AND, very surprised as

my

experience with picture taking is that they MUST be in the limelight.

I'm curious as to why this fiance of his is " hiding " . Sounds to me she is

running from something and doesn't want to be found.

DebbieL

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We actually have one picture of our son and girlfriend which my husband took

with a telephoto lens. We gave them a copy but it never showed up at their

home or at our son's office. I guess she wouldn't allow it. There are no

pictures of anyone in their house.

PJ

My daughter, also diagnosed with BPD, has always been very reluctant to

have

her picture taken. It had to be " just so " to get it taken, and that, of

course, never happened. The best I could do was get a picture of her with

my

telephoto lens when we were hiking. I'd take it early in my picture taking

spree, and then when she realized the camera out and I was using it, she'd

say " Mom, please don't take my picture " . At that point, I was glad to say

" OK, I won't " because I'd already done it. In the days of film, you

couldn't

go back and " untake " it.

Helen

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My dauighter doesn't like her picture taken either. She doesn't smile a lot.

She isn't happy inside.

Carol

-------------- Original message --------------

From: funnygirl1154@...

> In a message dated 1/18/2006 6:07:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, pj7@...

> writes:

> Also, she would

> never allow her picture to be taken. So...I joined this list because I see

> signs that she is borderline.

> a,

>

> This bit of news is interesting. Won't allow her picture to be taken?

> What's up with that? Where is this girl from? Is she a local girl from your

> area that everyone knows? Or someone that's a newcomer and your son met her?

> This is very odd, because, first and foremost, people w/BPD don't " hide " the

> disorder, or maybe you are considering her " devil at home, angel away " persona

> as hiding. This would be BPD showing full fledged, AND, very surprised as my

> experience with picture taking is that they MUST be in the limelight.

> I'm curious as to why this fiance of his is " hiding " . Sounds to me she is

> running from something and doesn't want to be found.

>

> DebbieL

>

>

>

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