Re: Duragesic/ Vee-- Some extra info

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/5/2004 1:41:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

v.waller@... writes:

The withdrawal symptoms were Feeling very cold - shivery......Snuffly

nose...mild diarrhoea.....tiredness.

Hi

After having to take narcotics on a regular basis for at least 10 years or

so, there have been times that I have felt that I wanted to stop everything,

ALWAYS, WITH THE ASSISTANCE OF AN MD, mainly because I still, I guess, needed to

convince myself that I really did need all of it & forever. There is also a

medical reason to do so. Some doctors call it " Resetting your thermostat. "

Basically at times, in order " to get more drugs, " your brain NOT YOU, ups the

level of your pain. Yup, your brain can do this. And you TRULY physically feel

the pain even though it's your brain that caused the pain. Yes, YOU DO FEEL

the pain. And really, the only way to find out if you really are completely &

totally, in need of the medication physically & it's not your brain trying to

make this happen, just about the only way to do it, is to stop everything.

That's why they call it " Resetting your thermostat. " You don't have to do it,

it was just something that was important to me. BUT if you do, you really

shouldn't do it on your own, if you've been on any addictive narcotic for any

length of time. It's much easier & much better for you, to do it under a

doctor's

care. It doesn't mean having to be in-patient in a hospital, just under

their care. I have done it a few times on my own, very early in this, when I

really wasn't taking much at all, but soon realized that it was best to do with

a

doctor. Also, honestly, then you can yell & scream at the doctor, instead of

yourself when you feel crummy!!! It serves a dual purpose! As an aside,

there are natural ways out there now, to decrease the severity of withdrawal

symptoms, including acupuncture, etc.

Seriously, don't mess with it on your own, it's much better to do it with

medical assistance. Over the years I have really kept a very close watch on

myself, you truly have to be your own " policeman. " I have always been very

careful to try to use the same pharmacy, when possible, but I guess that doesn't

matter much anymore, now that everything is computerized. BUT, the biggest

thing, I think, is to make every attempt to have one & only one doctor do all of

the prescribing. The only time I ever brake that rule, is for example, if I

have some nasty dental work done & really only need a little something (and in

that case I always use a different narcotic than I normally take) to get past

the acute stage & in that rare situation, I don't think it's worth annoying my

pain Doc with it. And in fact you may not be able to reach your pain Doc.

BUT, the next time I do see my pain Doc, I tell him about it.

I think the most important thing in your ongoing need for someone to write

for, what truly is/are major league doses & amounts of meds, is & you have to

keep, is your credibility, your integrity & your honesty. You need you main Doc

to have complete trust & faith in you, for them to undertake the

responsibility for writing meds for you on a regular basis. Because, without a

doubt, for

every 1 (one) Doc out there that is willing to do this you are likely to find

100 (one hundred) that won't. So, if you have someone, hang onto them with

all 3 hands (LOL) & be sure they can trust you.

Actually, I was so uncomfortable with the thought that I actually had to take

all of the medication that I needed forever & I had to be so sure, that I

talked to my main ortho MD about it & he helped me find a place to seriously

check this all out. And if you know me, you know I've had a lot of surgery, but

detest being in the hospital & run as fast as I can to get out & have often

have had day surgery, when I probably should have stayed a couple of days. BUT,

about 12 years ago, I voluntarily, without the escort of the NYC police (just

joking) checked in to an absolutely fabulous program at " The Hospital For

Joint Diseases " in NYC for 11 days! It was strictly designed for chronic pain

patients, where it had been clear for a long time that, Yes, you have chronic

pain, No, it's not going to get better & no, it's never going away. It was the

most amazing program & I still feel that I remember things that still affect me

today & I am still learning from it all. It was a multidisciplinary program

& was absolutely fabulous. Was it difficult to be there with 11 other people

(they only take 12 at a time)? Yes, very difficult. But I learned a lot, I

can't say enough about it, but the funniest thing, is that while almost everyone

else left the program either at the same meds & dosages that they came in

with, or left with less meds & dosages, I was one of the very few that this ever

happened to, I actually left on MORE medication! The real reason for that,

probably is that prior to that I had been having my meds written by my

orthopedic

surgeon. And while they are great at orthopedics, they aren't the best at

prescribing pain medications. That's what Pain Specialists are for. And in

fact, after that admission, I began seeing a Pain Physician. In response to your

list of difficulties, knowing what mine have been, I actually looked up a few

medical sites & these are the S & S that are listed for withdrawal. I had

always described it as feeling like you have the worst flu you ever had, plus

always had terrible restless legs, especially during the night. I was never

tired though. And for you, that may have just been something that happened to

you, but nothing I could find anywhere anyone else. Here are the lists.........

* enlarged pupils

* excessive sweating

* muscle aches

* abdominal pains

* insomnia

* cold symptoms

* diarrhea

* blood pressure fluctuations - from high BP to low BP

* flushing of the skin

* confusion

I hope this is of some help to you & /ot anyone else. Good luck,

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/5/2004 1:41:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

v.waller@... writes:

The withdrawal symptoms were Feeling very cold - shivery......Snuffly

nose...mild diarrhoea.....tiredness.

Hi

After having to take narcotics on a regular basis for at least 10 years or

so, there have been times that I have felt that I wanted to stop everything,

ALWAYS, WITH THE ASSISTANCE OF AN MD, mainly because I still, I guess, needed to

convince myself that I really did need all of it & forever. There is also a

medical reason to do so. Some doctors call it " Resetting your thermostat. "

Basically at times, in order " to get more drugs, " your brain NOT YOU, ups the

level of your pain. Yup, your brain can do this. And you TRULY physically feel

the pain even though it's your brain that caused the pain. Yes, YOU DO FEEL

the pain. And really, the only way to find out if you really are completely &

totally, in need of the medication physically & it's not your brain trying to

make this happen, just about the only way to do it, is to stop everything.

That's why they call it " Resetting your thermostat. " You don't have to do it,

it was just something that was important to me. BUT if you do, you really

shouldn't do it on your own, if you've been on any addictive narcotic for any

length of time. It's much easier & much better for you, to do it under a

doctor's

care. It doesn't mean having to be in-patient in a hospital, just under

their care. I have done it a few times on my own, very early in this, when I

really wasn't taking much at all, but soon realized that it was best to do with

a

doctor. Also, honestly, then you can yell & scream at the doctor, instead of

yourself when you feel crummy!!! It serves a dual purpose! As an aside,

there are natural ways out there now, to decrease the severity of withdrawal

symptoms, including acupuncture, etc.

Seriously, don't mess with it on your own, it's much better to do it with

medical assistance. Over the years I have really kept a very close watch on

myself, you truly have to be your own " policeman. " I have always been very

careful to try to use the same pharmacy, when possible, but I guess that doesn't

matter much anymore, now that everything is computerized. BUT, the biggest

thing, I think, is to make every attempt to have one & only one doctor do all of

the prescribing. The only time I ever brake that rule, is for example, if I

have some nasty dental work done & really only need a little something (and in

that case I always use a different narcotic than I normally take) to get past

the acute stage & in that rare situation, I don't think it's worth annoying my

pain Doc with it. And in fact you may not be able to reach your pain Doc.

BUT, the next time I do see my pain Doc, I tell him about it.

I think the most important thing in your ongoing need for someone to write

for, what truly is/are major league doses & amounts of meds, is & you have to

keep, is your credibility, your integrity & your honesty. You need you main Doc

to have complete trust & faith in you, for them to undertake the

responsibility for writing meds for you on a regular basis. Because, without a

doubt, for

every 1 (one) Doc out there that is willing to do this you are likely to find

100 (one hundred) that won't. So, if you have someone, hang onto them with

all 3 hands (LOL) & be sure they can trust you.

Actually, I was so uncomfortable with the thought that I actually had to take

all of the medication that I needed forever & I had to be so sure, that I

talked to my main ortho MD about it & he helped me find a place to seriously

check this all out. And if you know me, you know I've had a lot of surgery, but

detest being in the hospital & run as fast as I can to get out & have often

have had day surgery, when I probably should have stayed a couple of days. BUT,

about 12 years ago, I voluntarily, without the escort of the NYC police (just

joking) checked in to an absolutely fabulous program at " The Hospital For

Joint Diseases " in NYC for 11 days! It was strictly designed for chronic pain

patients, where it had been clear for a long time that, Yes, you have chronic

pain, No, it's not going to get better & no, it's never going away. It was the

most amazing program & I still feel that I remember things that still affect me

today & I am still learning from it all. It was a multidisciplinary program

& was absolutely fabulous. Was it difficult to be there with 11 other people

(they only take 12 at a time)? Yes, very difficult. But I learned a lot, I

can't say enough about it, but the funniest thing, is that while almost everyone

else left the program either at the same meds & dosages that they came in

with, or left with less meds & dosages, I was one of the very few that this ever

happened to, I actually left on MORE medication! The real reason for that,

probably is that prior to that I had been having my meds written by my

orthopedic

surgeon. And while they are great at orthopedics, they aren't the best at

prescribing pain medications. That's what Pain Specialists are for. And in

fact, after that admission, I began seeing a Pain Physician. In response to your

list of difficulties, knowing what mine have been, I actually looked up a few

medical sites & these are the S & S that are listed for withdrawal. I had

always described it as feeling like you have the worst flu you ever had, plus

always had terrible restless legs, especially during the night. I was never

tired though. And for you, that may have just been something that happened to

you, but nothing I could find anywhere anyone else. Here are the lists.........

* enlarged pupils

* excessive sweating

* muscle aches

* abdominal pains

* insomnia

* cold symptoms

* diarrhea

* blood pressure fluctuations - from high BP to low BP

* flushing of the skin

* confusion

I hope this is of some help to you & /or anyone else. Good luck,

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/5/2004 1:41:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

v.waller@... writes:

The withdrawal symptoms were Feeling very cold - shivery......Snuffly

nose...mild diarrhoea.....tiredness.

Hi

After having to take narcotics on a regular basis for at least 10 years or

so, there have been times that I have felt that I wanted to stop everything,

ALWAYS, WITH THE ASSISTANCE OF AN MD, mainly because I still, I guess, needed to

convince myself that I really did need all of it & forever. There is also a

medical reason to do so. Some doctors call it " Resetting your thermostat. "

Basically at times, in order " to get more drugs, " your brain NOT YOU, ups the

level of your pain. Yup, your brain can do this. And you TRULY physically feel

the pain even though it's your brain that caused the pain. Yes, YOU DO FEEL

the pain. And really, the only way to find out if you really are completely &

totally, in need of the medication physically & it's not your brain trying to

make this happen, just about the only way to do it, is to stop everything.

That's why they call it " Resetting your thermostat. " You don't have to do it,

it was just something that was important to me. BUT if you do, you really

shouldn't do it on your own, if you've been on any addictive narcotic for any

length of time. It's much easier & much better for you, to do it under a

doctor's

care. It doesn't mean having to be in-patient in a hospital, just under

their care. I have done it a few times on my own, very early in this, when I

really wasn't taking much at all, but soon realized that it was best to do with

a

doctor. Also, honestly, then you can yell & scream at the doctor, instead of

yourself when you feel crummy!!! It serves a dual purpose! As an aside,

there are natural ways out there now, to decrease the severity of withdrawal

symptoms, including acupuncture, etc.

Seriously, don't mess with it on your own, it's much better to do it with

medical assistance. Over the years I have really kept a very close watch on

myself, you truly have to be your own " policeman. " I have always been very

careful to try to use the same pharmacy, when possible, but I guess that doesn't

matter much anymore, now that everything is computerized. BUT, the biggest

thing, I think, is to make every attempt to have one & only one doctor do all of

the prescribing. The only time I ever brake that rule, is for example, if I

have some nasty dental work done & really only need a little something (and in

that case I always use a different narcotic than I normally take) to get past

the acute stage & in that rare situation, I don't think it's worth annoying my

pain Doc with it. And in fact you may not be able to reach your pain Doc.

BUT, the next time I do see my pain Doc, I tell him about it.

I think the most important thing in your ongoing need for someone to write

for, what truly is/are major league doses & amounts of meds, is & you have to

keep, is your credibility, your integrity & your honesty. You need you main Doc

to have complete trust & faith in you, for them to undertake the

responsibility for writing meds for you on a regular basis. Because, without a

doubt, for

every 1 (one) Doc out there that is willing to do this you are likely to find

100 (one hundred) that won't. So, if you have someone, hang onto them with

all 3 hands (LOL) & be sure they can trust you.

Actually, I was so uncomfortable with the thought that I actually had to take

all of the medication that I needed forever & I had to be so sure, that I

talked to my main ortho MD about it & he helped me find a place to seriously

check this all out. And if you know me, you know I've had a lot of surgery, but

detest being in the hospital & run as fast as I can to get out & have often

have had day surgery, when I probably should have stayed a couple of days. BUT,

about 12 years ago, I voluntarily, without the escort of the NYC police (just

joking) checked in to an absolutely fabulous program at " The Hospital For

Joint Diseases " in NYC for 11 days! It was strictly designed for chronic pain

patients, where it had been clear for a long time that, Yes, you have chronic

pain, No, it's not going to get better & no, it's never going away. It was the

most amazing program & I still feel that I remember things that still affect me

today & I am still learning from it all. It was a multidisciplinary program

& was absolutely fabulous. Was it difficult to be there with 11 other people

(they only take 12 at a time)? Yes, very difficult. But I learned a lot, I

can't say enough about it, but the funniest thing, is that while almost everyone

else left the program either at the same meds & dosages that they came in

with, or left with less meds & dosages, I was one of the very few that this ever

happened to, I actually left on MORE medication! The real reason for that,

probably is that prior to that I had been having my meds written by my

orthopedic

surgeon. And while they are great at orthopedics, they aren't the best at

prescribing pain medications. That's what Pain Specialists are for. And in

fact, after that admission, I began seeing a Pain Physician. In response to your

list of difficulties, knowing what mine have been, I actually looked up a few

medical sites & these are the S & S that are listed for withdrawal. I had

always described it as feeling like you have the worst flu you ever had, plus

always had terrible restless legs, especially during the night. I was never

tired though. And for you, that may have just been something that happened to

you, but nothing I could find anywhere anyone else. Here are the lists.........

* enlarged pupils

* excessive sweating

* muscle aches

* abdominal pains

* insomnia

* cold symptoms

* diarrhea

* blood pressure fluctuations - from high BP to low BP

* flushing of the skin

* confusion

I hope this is of some help to you & /or anyone else. Good luck,