Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

November 1, 2006

Yes for hypo and I have heard hypo/hyper can share symptoms, although I have Hashi's I can't recall experiencing any hyper phases..........was diagnosed very late

and also have this web site

http://www.thyrophoenix.com/

................Meleese xx

-------Original Message-------

From: Kate

Wow! Is this for hypo? From what I understand, both hyper and hypo share many of the same symtoms. I'll mark mine (in the list you provided and with 4 ----)-current:

[note: I have experienced differences and some that I didn't mark below, did occur this year.]

Thanks for the list. Shoot!

>> Here is a list from > > www.stopthethyroidmadness.com > > ----> Less stamina than others ----> Less energy than others > Inability to hold children for very long ----> Arms feeling like dead weights after activity ----> Chronic Low Grade Depression ----> Often feeling cold ----> Cold hands and feet > High cholesterol > Bizarre and Debilitating reaction to exercise ----Becoming > Hard stools > Constipation > No eyebrows or thinning outer eyebrows ----Just plain funky > Dry Hair ----> Hair Loss > Dry cracking skin ----> Nodding off easily ----> Requires naps in the afternoon ----> Inability to concentrate or read long periods of time ----> Forgetfulness ----> Foggy thinking > Inability to lose weight > Always gaining weight > Inability to function in a relationship with anyone ----> NO sex drive ----> Moody periods > PMS > Excruciating pain during period > Nausea ----> Swelling/edema/puffiness ----> Aching bones/muscles > Osteoporosis ----> Bumps on legs ----starting back up> Acne on face and in hair ----starting back up> Breakout on chest and arms ----I think> Hives ----> Exhaustion in every dimension?physical, mental, spiritual, emotional > Inability to work full-time ----> Inability to stand on feet for long periods ----> Complete lack of motivation > Slowing to a snail?s pace when walking up slight grade ----trying to keep a "cap" on it> Extremely crabby, irritable, intolerant of others > Handwriting nearly illegible > Internal itching of ears > Broken/peeling fingernails ----starting back up> Dry skin or snake skin ----fluctuates but better than in March!> Major anxiety/worry > Ringing in ears > Lactose Intolerance ----> Inability to eat in the mornings ----> No hair growth, breaks faster than it grows ----> Joint pain ----> Carpal tunnel symptoms ----though it can swing > No Appetite > Fluid retention to the point of Congestive Heart Failure > Swollen legs that prevented walking ----changes > Blood Pressure problems ----> Varicose Vains > Dizziness from fluid on the inner ear ----though changing to higher now > Low body temperature ----> Sore feet (plantar fasciitis); painful soles of feet > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Kate > > > In the past, I've read so many conflicting "answers." Perhaps some > has to do with those who are on meds and those who are not. > > If TSH is truly not adequate for testing for thyroid, why do so many > doctors resort to testing only the TSH? It seems that they do not > veer off TSH unless you have been diagnosed with a thyroid condition > & taking meds. > > Is there a site, listing symptoms from patients. I do see there are > many symptoms but am wondering if there is a greater list, according > to patient's personal experience. > > One thing I am curious about, is voice. I've read that thyroid > conditions can cause a voice change i.e. hoarseness but can it simply > change the sound, though not be hoarse? > > Today I will be bringing my oldest daughter to the doctors for a > reoccurring scalp condition (like eczema) and what looks like > vitiligo around her hairline. After the exam was finished, going to > hand him my folder. As it stands, I didn't get around to finishing it > and so will ask him if he minds I take this approach. That'll be the > start for me. > > A few here have said that I should have my ft3 and ft4 checked. > Somebody else mentioned Hashimotos. Would the ft3 & 4 indicate if > there is a possibility of Hashi's? I realize there is an antibody for > that but am wondering if the ft3 & 4 will cover it. > > ~Kate>

November 1, 2006

Yes for hypo and I have heard hypo/hyper can share symptoms, although I have Hashi's I can't recall experiencing any hyper phases..........was diagnosed very late

and also have this web site

http://www.thyrophoenix.com/

................Meleese xx

-------Original Message-------

From: Kate

Wow! Is this for hypo? From what I understand, both hyper and hypo share many of the same symtoms. I'll mark mine (in the list you provided and with 4 ----)-current:

[note: I have experienced differences and some that I didn't mark below, did occur this year.]

Thanks for the list. Shoot!

>> Here is a list from > > www.stopthethyroidmadness.com > > ----> Less stamina than others ----> Less energy than others > Inability to hold children for very long ----> Arms feeling like dead weights after activity ----> Chronic Low Grade Depression ----> Often feeling cold ----> Cold hands and feet > High cholesterol > Bizarre and Debilitating reaction to exercise ----Becoming > Hard stools > Constipation > No eyebrows or thinning outer eyebrows ----Just plain funky > Dry Hair ----> Hair Loss > Dry cracking skin ----> Nodding off easily ----> Requires naps in the afternoon ----> Inability to concentrate or read long periods of time ----> Forgetfulness ----> Foggy thinking > Inability to lose weight > Always gaining weight > Inability to function in a relationship with anyone ----> NO sex drive ----> Moody periods > PMS > Excruciating pain during period > Nausea ----> Swelling/edema/puffiness ----> Aching bones/muscles > Osteoporosis ----> Bumps on legs ----starting back up> Acne on face and in hair ----starting back up> Breakout on chest and arms ----I think> Hives ----> Exhaustion in every dimension?physical, mental, spiritual, emotional > Inability to work full-time ----> Inability to stand on feet for long periods ----> Complete lack of motivation > Slowing to a snail?s pace when walking up slight grade ----trying to keep a "cap" on it> Extremely crabby, irritable, intolerant of others > Handwriting nearly illegible > Internal itching of ears > Broken/peeling fingernails ----starting back up> Dry skin or snake skin ----fluctuates but better than in March!> Major anxiety/worry > Ringing in ears > Lactose Intolerance ----> Inability to eat in the mornings ----> No hair growth, breaks faster than it grows ----> Joint pain ----> Carpal tunnel symptoms ----though it can swing > No Appetite > Fluid retention to the point of Congestive Heart Failure > Swollen legs that prevented walking ----changes > Blood Pressure problems ----> Varicose Vains > Dizziness from fluid on the inner ear ----though changing to higher now > Low body temperature ----> Sore feet (plantar fasciitis); painful soles of feet > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Kate > > > In the past, I've read so many conflicting "answers." Perhaps some > has to do with those who are on meds and those who are not. > > If TSH is truly not adequate for testing for thyroid, why do so many > doctors resort to testing only the TSH? It seems that they do not > veer off TSH unless you have been diagnosed with a thyroid condition > & taking meds. > > Is there a site, listing symptoms from patients. I do see there are > many symptoms but am wondering if there is a greater list, according > to patient's personal experience. > > One thing I am curious about, is voice. I've read that thyroid > conditions can cause a voice change i.e. hoarseness but can it simply > change the sound, though not be hoarse? > > Today I will be bringing my oldest daughter to the doctors for a > reoccurring scalp condition (like eczema) and what looks like > vitiligo around her hairline. After the exam was finished, going to > hand him my folder. As it stands, I didn't get around to finishing it > and so will ask him if he minds I take this approach. That'll be the > start for me. > > A few here have said that I should have my ft3 and ft4 checked. > Somebody else mentioned Hashimotos. Would the ft3 & 4 indicate if > there is a possibility of Hashi's? I realize there is an antibody for > that but am wondering if the ft3 & 4 will cover it. > > ~Kate>

November 2, 2006

I feel your pain Kate. I used to be very outgoing too, despite being on thyroid medication all those years. I guess that's why I'm worried when people only focus on thyroid for some of their symptoms. I've been on thyroid meds for 35 years and in those years, I've had fat ones and thin ones (with effort), happy ones and sad ones, carefree ones and anxious ones, feeling great ones and feeling like crap ones. If I had only been diagnosed with thyroid at menopause, I can see where I would want to always look there first, but for me it's easier to see that something else has changed along the way. Having said that, fatigue can also return if you miss your 'sweet spot' with thyroid meds. When I first started Armour, I increased too quickly and bypassed optimum. I was anxious, hot, sweaty and tired, sort of hyper and hypo at the same time. I cut back on the meds and I must say that I'm not doing too badly in the energy department now.

My memory failed me about the TSH and estrogen dominance. It's the Total T3 and Total T4 that are affected. I posted the full explanation in another post. I used progesterone cream before being tested and it made me very ill with migraines, nausea etc. After labwork I can see that I'm not estrogen dominant and so that explained the reaction to the progesterone.

I never ever suspected that I was hypothyroid until I was actually diagnosed. I didn't even know it existed. From age 8-18 I, and everyone around me including my dad and my teachers, thought that I was just fat, stupid and lazy. It was really only in later years that it occurred to me that it all started when I was 8 years old. Back then we had aptitude testing every fall and my numbers always matched or exceeded my 'straight A's' sister's, yet I couldn't do much better than a C on anything. When I was 18 I said to my doctor "I know that I'm a lazy person, I'll give you that, but no-one in the world could possibly be as lazy as I feel". That's when I got the testing and the diagnosis and treatment. I have no idea what tests were run or what the numbers were, but there was no TSH test back then so I think it was T4 and T3 Uptake. Those are the ones that they did for the next decade or so until the dreaded TSH. I had been battling severe constipation for about 10 years then, from the time of my tonsillectomy, so I believe that is when it all started. There's no family history and I was the only one with a weight problem, or school problems, etc. so it was never suspected. My mom used to sit on the side of the tub and press gently on my tummy while I cried in pain. We had a cupboard full of suppositories, laxatives, Metamucil etc. but none of it helped. I think that was the worst part of it all. That and my dad dubbing me 'little miss know it all' and not in a nice way. I was so eager to look smart that I researched and memorized everything I could about the current topics. Vice or not, that habit remains with me to this day. When I was 29, I went back to school and pulled straight A's myself graduating with a 3.98 GPA, so I guess I wasn't stupid after all LOL. I didn't know I was smart until I was 29 and sometimes, in a weak moment, I mourn for what might have been, but then I kick myself out of it and realize that it all brought me to where I am today. My sister is still tall and thin, and I'm still average height and overweight, but we ended up with the exact same career! Thanks for the interest and the opportunity to vent... Judy

As for fatigue, I used to be very outgoing. There wasn't a mountain I couldn't climb or an activity I wasn't up for. Mind you, I do realize the toll motherhood takes on a woman. lol I am sure, much can be attributed to pregnancy and raising children. TSH affected by estrogen dominance. Well, if my doctor thinks I need progesterone, that would indicate an estrogen dominance...I should think? Does estrogen dominance raise or lower TSH?Your TSH...obviously NO doubt in your thyroid function. WOW! How many years do you suspect that you were hypothyroid?

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November 2, 2006

It's funny Kate, but I never really thought of blaming anyone. My mom was the best at working with my symptoms as she had no idea what was really wrong. She would take me to the woods and park to study with me before a test because it was so difficult for me to concentrate at home. She would sit with me for hours every week while I tried to go to the bathroom. She even had a seamstress that would make clothes for me because there was no real clothing for plus kids back then. She never once got impatient with me over anything and was truly happy when I finally got a diagnosis. I don't know how I would have turned out if it weren't for her, so in that way, I was truly blessed, and I guess without the illness, I would have just blended in and never had those memories (smiling tears on the keyboard).

I have become much more open to people as well and I really like it that way. I'm just waiting (LOL) for the rest to catch up and start treating me that way! Everyone is dealing with their own demons and many are just trying to get by day to day. I try not to dwell on it, of course, but once in a while, it creaps back in. My dad made me quit tap dancing when I went into high school because he thought it would affect my grades, so 2 years ago, at 51 years of age, I took tap dancing lessons. I hadn't forgotten a step and it was great fun. I tell my kids, who think they're too old to start something, that you're never as old as you think you are. Thanks for the support... Judy

Reading about your life, one word came to mind. Tragedy! As a child, being held hostage by your condition was terrible. Then to have been discounted as being lazy, stupid and fat...you were placed between a rock and a hard spot. I think if it were me this happened to, would have crushed my spirit. If I were the parent, after realizing that it wasn't your fault...would have felt immense guilt. Something I suspect that I'd take to my grave, even if forgiven.

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November 2, 2006

Excellent discovery Meleese!! Good work! I wish you strength .

Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

I have recently gone gluten free after learning people with Hashi's have a high incidence of being gluten intolerant/ celiac..............I did the gluten challenge eliminated it for 2 weeks then re-introduced it................dreadful fatigue, IBS , sweating,headaches

That's it.........no more gluten for me.....................Meleese in Oz xxx

-------Original Message-------

From: Teague

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

----- Original Message -----

From: Judy P

My son went through a spell of waking up about 11:15 pm every night screaming at the top of his lungs. When we would go upstairs, he would have thrown all of his bedding, one piece at a time, out into the corner of the hallway, while he stood on his bed screaming. He said there was a cat there and every time he covered it up, it would make it's way out from underneath and he would throw the next piece. It was very bizarre and very disturbing. It was just after Easter and he had spent the 4 days with his dad, who knowing that I was against junk food for the kids, used it as a rational for pummeling him with sugar. It went on for about 5 nights while he detoxed from the overload. After that he was not allowed sugar after dinner and the problem never resurfaced.

Another time he came up to me at a bbq and asked if he could have a hot dog. "Sure", I said and he did. About 1/2 hour later, my sweet little boy had turned into a raving maniac, totally uncontrollable and inconsolable. I looked at the hotdog package and the only odd ingredient was msg. After a few mild experiments, we confirmed that he was allergic to msg and eliminated it (and the behavior problems) from his diet.

It's even harder today to get a decent snack when even my lean cuisine lunches have high fructose corn syrup in them. I never thought I was affected by sugar until menopause, but if I have sugar in the evening, I'll wake up several times with night sweats, if I don't, I won't, so there's definitely a connection for me.

I don't mean to oversimplify at all, and there can be many sources for all of these things, but I thought that the info might help someone... Judy

November 2, 2006

Good job Meleese, that's a tough one to give up!... Judy in KS

That's it.........no more gluten for me.....................Meleese in Oz xxx

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November 2, 2006

I don't know how they do it these days, but 30 years ago, you had to wait until your child was one year old before giving them eggs. So on my son's first birthday, we took him to Mcs (which was also much newer at the time). He had already had his real breakfast, but, because I could, I put a pea sized piece of egg on his tray and went back to talking to his dad. When we looked back one minute later, his face was covered in red blotches and welts. I wish I'd had a camera, because it's tough to describe. We took him immediately to emerg where they gave him an antihistamine. The doctor said it was not the egg itself, but whatever they had sprayed on the grill and there could only have been a drop of it. I was so embarrassed to tell them where I took my son for his first egg LOL... Judy

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

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November 2, 2006

LOL man... *bleeping* additives LOL!!

Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

I don't know how they do it these days, but 30 years ago, you had to wait until your child was one year old before giving them eggs. So on my son's first birthday, we took him to Mcs (which was also much newer at the time). He had already had his real breakfast, but, because I could, I put a pea sized piece of egg on his tray and went back to talking to his dad. When we looked back one minute later, his face was covered in red blotches and welts. I wish I'd had a camera, because it's tough to describe. We took him immediately to emerg where they gave him an antihistamine. The doctor said it was not the egg itself, but whatever they had sprayed on the grill and there could only have been a drop of it. I was so embarrassed to tell them where I took my son for his first egg LOL... Judy

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

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November 2, 2006

hooooooooooo could I ever inform THEM! Spiff Teague wrote: Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?) My son went through a spell of waking up about 11:15 pm every night screaming at the top of his lungs. When we would go upstairs, he would have thrown all of his bedding, one piece at a time, out into the corner of the hallway, while he stood on his bed screaming. He said there was a cat there and every time he covered it up, it would make it's way out from underneath and he would throw the next piece. It was

very bizarre and very disturbing. It was just after Easter and he had spent the 4 days with his dad, who knowing that I was against junk food for the kids, used it as a rational for pummeling him with sugar. It went on for about 5 nights while he detoxed from the overload. After that he was not allowed sugar after dinner and the problem never resurfaced. Another time he came up to me at a bbq and asked if he could have a hot dog. "Sure", I said and he did. About 1/2 hour later, my sweet little boy had turned into a raving maniac, totally uncontrollable and inconsolable. I looked at the hotdog package and the only odd ingredient was msg. After a few mild experiments, we confirmed that he was allergic to msg and eliminated it (and the behavior problems) from his

diet. It's even harder today to get a decent snack when even my lean cuisine lunches have high fructose corn syrup in them. I never thought I was affected by sugar until menopause, but if I have sugar in the evening, I'll wake up several times with night sweats, if I don't, I won't, so there's definitely a connection for me. I don't mean to oversimplify at all, and there can be many sources for all of these things, but I thought that the info might help someone... Judy My oldest son, I believe, "wakes"

with night terrors and sometimes, while his eyes are open...I think he's still sleeping. I used to be a sleep walker and his grandma on his dad's side, was a terrible night walker. We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups.

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November 2, 2006

What a cool mom!! And kudos for tap lessons!!

Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

It's funny Kate, but I never really thought of blaming anyone. My mom was the best at working with my symptoms as she had no idea what was really wrong. She would take me to the woods and park to study with me before a test because it was so difficult for me to concentrate at home. She would sit with me for hours every week while I tried to go to the bathroom. She even had a seamstress that would make clothes for me because there was no real clothing for plus kids back then. She never once got impatient with me over anything and was truly happy when I finally got a diagnosis. I don't know how I would have turned out if it weren't for her, so in that way, I was truly blessed, and I guess without the illness, I would have just blended in and never had those memories (smiling tears on the keyboard).

I have become much more open to people as well and I really like it that way. I'm just waiting (LOL) for the rest to catch up and start treating me that way! Everyone is dealing with their own demons and many are just trying to get by day to day. I try not to dwell on it, of course, but once in a while, it creaps back in. My dad made me quit tap dancing when I went into high school because he thought it would affect my grades, so 2 years ago, at 51 years of age, I took tap dancing lessons. I hadn't forgotten a step and it was great fun. I tell my kids, who think they're too old to start something, that you're never as old as you think you are. Thanks for the support... Judy

Reading about your life, one word came to mind. Tragedy! As a child, being held hostage by your condition was terrible. Then to have been discounted as being lazy, stupid and fat...you were placed between a rock and a hard spot. I think if it were me this happened to, would have crushed my spirit. If I were the parent, after realizing that it wasn't your fault...would have felt immense guilt. Something I suspect that I'd take to my grave, even if forgiven.

We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups.

November 2, 2006

What a cool mom!! And kudos for tap lessons!!

Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

It's funny Kate, but I never really thought of blaming anyone. My mom was the best at working with my symptoms as she had no idea what was really wrong. She would take me to the woods and park to study with me before a test because it was so difficult for me to concentrate at home. She would sit with me for hours every week while I tried to go to the bathroom. She even had a seamstress that would make clothes for me because there was no real clothing for plus kids back then. She never once got impatient with me over anything and was truly happy when I finally got a diagnosis. I don't know how I would have turned out if it weren't for her, so in that way, I was truly blessed, and I guess without the illness, I would have just blended in and never had those memories (smiling tears on the keyboard).

I have become much more open to people as well and I really like it that way. I'm just waiting (LOL) for the rest to catch up and start treating me that way! Everyone is dealing with their own demons and many are just trying to get by day to day. I try not to dwell on it, of course, but once in a while, it creaps back in. My dad made me quit tap dancing when I went into high school because he thought it would affect my grades, so 2 years ago, at 51 years of age, I took tap dancing lessons. I hadn't forgotten a step and it was great fun. I tell my kids, who think they're too old to start something, that you're never as old as you think you are. Thanks for the support... Judy

Reading about your life, one word came to mind. Tragedy! As a child, being held hostage by your condition was terrible. Then to have been discounted as being lazy, stupid and fat...you were placed between a rock and a hard spot. I think if it were me this happened to, would have crushed my spirit. If I were the parent, after realizing that it wasn't your fault...would have felt immense guilt. Something I suspect that I'd take to my grave, even if forgiven.

We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups.

November 2, 2006

What a cool mom!! And kudos for tap lessons!!

Re: Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

It's funny Kate, but I never really thought of blaming anyone. My mom was the best at working with my symptoms as she had no idea what was really wrong. She would take me to the woods and park to study with me before a test because it was so difficult for me to concentrate at home. She would sit with me for hours every week while I tried to go to the bathroom. She even had a seamstress that would make clothes for me because there was no real clothing for plus kids back then. She never once got impatient with me over anything and was truly happy when I finally got a diagnosis. I don't know how I would have turned out if it weren't for her, so in that way, I was truly blessed, and I guess without the illness, I would have just blended in and never had those memories (smiling tears on the keyboard).

I have become much more open to people as well and I really like it that way. I'm just waiting (LOL) for the rest to catch up and start treating me that way! Everyone is dealing with their own demons and many are just trying to get by day to day. I try not to dwell on it, of course, but once in a while, it creaps back in. My dad made me quit tap dancing when I went into high school because he thought it would affect my grades, so 2 years ago, at 51 years of age, I took tap dancing lessons. I hadn't forgotten a step and it was great fun. I tell my kids, who think they're too old to start something, that you're never as old as you think you are. Thanks for the support... Judy

Reading about your life, one word came to mind. Tragedy! As a child, being held hostage by your condition was terrible. Then to have been discounted as being lazy, stupid and fat...you were placed between a rock and a hard spot. I think if it were me this happened to, would have crushed my spirit. If I were the parent, after realizing that it wasn't your fault...would have felt immense guilt. Something I suspect that I'd take to my grave, even if forgiven.

We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups.

November 2, 2006

Was still the same 20 years ago when I had my last child....you could give them the yolk but not the white as it's the white that causes the most problems..........Meleese in Oz xxx

-------Original Message-------

From: Judy P

I don't know how they do it these days, but 30 years ago, you had to wait until your child was one year old before giving them eggs. So on my son's first birthday, we took him to Mcs (which was also much newer at the time). He had already had his real breakfast, but, because I could, I put a pea sized piece of egg on his tray and went back to talking to his dad. When we looked back one minute later, his face was covered in red blotches and welts. I wish I'd had a camera, because it's tough to describe. We took him immediately to emerg where they gave him an antihistamine. The doctor said it was not the egg itself, but whatever they had sprayed on the grill and there could only have been a drop of it. I was so embarrassed to tell them where I took my son for his first egg LOL... Judy

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

November 2, 2006

Was still the same 20 years ago when I had my last child....you could give them the yolk but not the white as it's the white that causes the most problems..........Meleese in Oz xxx

-------Original Message-------

From: Judy P

I don't know how they do it these days, but 30 years ago, you had to wait until your child was one year old before giving them eggs. So on my son's first birthday, we took him to Mcs (which was also much newer at the time). He had already had his real breakfast, but, because I could, I put a pea sized piece of egg on his tray and went back to talking to his dad. When we looked back one minute later, his face was covered in red blotches and welts. I wish I'd had a camera, because it's tough to describe. We took him immediately to emerg where they gave him an antihistamine. The doctor said it was not the egg itself, but whatever they had sprayed on the grill and there could only have been a drop of it. I was so embarrassed to tell them where I took my son for his first egg LOL... Judy

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

November 2, 2006

Was still the same 20 years ago when I had my last child....you could give them the yolk but not the white as it's the white that causes the most problems..........Meleese in Oz xxx

-------Original Message-------

From: Judy P

I don't know how they do it these days, but 30 years ago, you had to wait until your child was one year old before giving them eggs. So on my son's first birthday, we took him to Mcs (which was also much newer at the time). He had already had his real breakfast, but, because I could, I put a pea sized piece of egg on his tray and went back to talking to his dad. When we looked back one minute later, his face was covered in red blotches and welts. I wish I'd had a camera, because it's tough to describe. We took him immediately to emerg where they gave him an antihistamine. The doctor said it was not the egg itself, but whatever they had sprayed on the grill and there could only have been a drop of it. I was so embarrassed to tell them where I took my son for his first egg LOL... Judy

Isn't it amazing Judy, that most people just think that allergies surface with a runny nose and itchy eyes? lol

November 2, 2006

Yes I am still feeling this bad, I take whatever herbs I can get my

hands on to calm nerves but for the past week i havent been on anything

Deana

Kate wrote:

> It sounds incredibly stressful, that it does. Is there any physical

> reason why your son isn't sleeping through the night?

> Both my boys wake and like to find mom & dad but whether we let them

> in or put them back in their bed, they go back to sleep relatively

> quickly.

> Next month, my sons' will be 4 and 2 1/2 years of age.

>

> My oldest son, I believe, " wakes " with night terrors and sometimes,

> while his eyes are open...I think he's still sleeping. I used to be a

> sleep walker and his grandma on his dad's side, was a terrible night

> walker.

>

> Is it just you and your son at home?

>

> I also have 2 girls: 15 & 11. What I have noticed is, that boys seem

> to require more serious play time. A place (playground etc.) to burn

> off all that energy. If not, boy that energy can go " haywire " in the

> house.

>

> My opinion is, that most kids (including my own) don't get enough

> activity. Many reasons, perhaps much valid but doesn't negate the

> problem.

>

> Moms need help and moms also need breaks. Being ill, requires this

> more often. Due to nature, women are generally the " nurses " but what

> happens when we need nursing? For many women, we don't have anyone

> to " nurse " us like we do for our family. In this sense, this leaves

> us alone.

>

> All kids need some form of discipline when they act out of turn.

> Parent's have their own style and sometimes, we have to change it

> either because it doesn't work period or it begins failing (due to

> changing age). Consistency is important and for me, I admit, has been

> a challenge.

>

> Are you still feeling this bad? Are you taking any medication outside

> of thyroid?

>

> ~Kate

>

> > > > >

> > > > > Here is a list from

> > > > >

> > > > > www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

> > > > >

> > > > ----> Less stamina than others

> > > > ----> Less energy than others

> > > > > Inability to hold children for very long

> > > > ----> Arms feeling like dead weights after activity

> > > > ----> Chronic Low Grade Depression

> > > > ----> Often feeling cold

> > > > ----> Cold hands and feet

> > > > > High cholesterol

> > > > > Bizarre and Debilitating reaction to exercise

> > > > ----Becoming > Hard stools

> > > > > Constipation

> > > > > No eyebrows or thinning outer eyebrows

> > > > ----Just plain funky > Dry Hair

> > > > ----> Hair Loss

> > > > > Dry cracking skin

> > > > ----> Nodding off easily

> > > > ----> Requires naps in the afternoon

> > > > ----> Inability to concentrate or read long periods of time

> > > > ----> Forgetfulness

> > > > ----> Foggy thinking

> > > > > Inability to lose weight

> > > > > Always gaining weight

> > > > > Inability to function in a relationship with anyone

> > > > ----> NO sex drive

> > > > ----> Moody periods

> > > > > PMS

> > > > > Excruciating pain during period

> > > > > Nausea

> > > > ----> Swelling/edema/puffiness

> > > > ----> Aching bones/muscles

> > > > > Osteoporosis

> > > > ----> Bumps on legs

> > > > ----starting back up> Acne on face and in hair

> > > > ----starting back up> Breakout on chest and arms

> > > > ----I think> Hives

> > > > ----> Exhaustion in every dimension?physical, mental,

> spiritual,

> > > emotional

> > > > > Inability to work full-time

> > > > ----> Inability to stand on feet for long periods

> > > > ----> Complete lack of motivation

> > > > > Slowing to a snail?s pace when walking up slight grade

> > > > ----trying to keep a " cap " on it> Extremely crabby, irritable,

> > > intolerant of

> > > > others

> > > > > Handwriting nearly illegible

> > > > > Internal itching of ears

> > > > > Broken/peeling fingernails

> > > > ----starting back up> Dry skin or snake skin

> > > > ----fluctuates but better than in March!> Major anxiety/worry

> > > > > Ringing in ears

> > > > > Lactose Intolerance

> > > > ----> Inability to eat in the mornings

> > > > ----> No hair growth, breaks faster than it grows

> > > > ----> Joint pain

> > > > ----> Carpal tunnel symptoms

> > > > ----though it can swing > No Appetite

> > > > > Fluid retention to the point of Congestive Heart Failure

> > > > > Swollen legs that prevented walking

> > > > ----changes > Blood Pressure problems

> > > > ----> Varicose Vains

> > > > > Dizziness from fluid on the inner ear

> > > > ----though changing to higher now > Low body temperature

> > > > ----> Sore feet (plantar fasciitis); painful soles of feet

> > > > >

> > > > > -------Original Message-------

> > > > >

> > > > > From: Kate

> > > > >

> > > > > In the past, I've read so many conflicting " answers. " Perhaps

> > > some

> > > > > has to do with those who are on meds and those who are not.

> > > > >

> > > > > If TSH is truly not adequate for testing for thyroid, why do

> so

> > > many

> > > > > doctors resort to testing only the TSH? It seems that they do

> not

> > > > > veer off TSH unless you have been diagnosed with a thyroid

> > > condition

> > > > > & taking meds.

> > > > >

> > > > > Is there a site, listing symptoms from patients. I do see

> there

> > > are

> > > > > many symptoms but am wondering if there is a greater list,

> > > according

> > > > > to patient's personal experience.

> > > > >

> > > > > One thing I am curious about, is voice. I've read that

> thyroid

> > > > > conditions can cause a voice change i.e. hoarseness but can

> it

> > > simply

> > > > > change the sound, though not be hoarse?

> > > > >

> > > > > Today I will be bringing my oldest daughter to the doctors

> for a

> > > > > reoccurring scalp condition (like eczema) and what looks like

> > > > > vitiligo around her hairline. After the exam was finished,

> going

> > > to

> > > > > hand him my folder. As it stands, I didn't get around to

> > > finishing it

> > > > > and so will ask him if he minds I take this approach. That'll

> be

> > > the

> > > > > start for me.

> > > > >

> > > > > A few here have said that I should have my ft3 and ft4

> checked.

> > > > > Somebody else mentioned Hashimotos. Would the ft3 & 4

> indicate if

> > > > > there is a possibility of Hashi's? I realize there is an

> antibody

> > > for

> > > > > that but am wondering if the ft3 & 4 will cover it.

> > > > >

> > > > > ~Kate

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

November 3, 2006

Deana,

Kate has a point. There is a type of exercise called 'Breath Work' and you might want to look into it. I was doing breath work as a part of my yoga teacher cert. training and it was wonderful. There is a book you can pick up called 'The Breathing Book' by Donna Farhi. It has lots of good info on breathing and how to maximize your breath. Did you know that Americans are the LARGEST amount of shallow breathers IN THE WORLD?? We only use about 1/3 of our lung space for air. I say 1/3 because there are 3 different main types of breathing. Full breathing (like you breathe when you are laying down on the floor) and then there's 'stomach breathing' which is only breathing from your diaphragm (singers often use this) and then there's shoulder breathing, where you breathe into your shoulders. (Causing them to rise as you breathe). I had to learn all of them and implement them for my training to use with about 300 different asanas (yoga stances/postures).

It sounds soooo simple but I can tell you as someone who used to have anxiety attacks & depression.... can do a world of good. Plus you know, if you're not getting enough oxygen, you get tired more and don't have as much energy.

I hope that helps.

Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

Deana,The other thing to pay attention to, is your breathing. Holding your breath or breathing in too shallow can cause anxiety symptoms or worsen them. When you are stressed and happen to think about it, think about your breathing. Under stress, try to breath in deeply from your abdomen and exhale slowly. ~Kate> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Here is a list from> > > > > > >> > > > > > > www.stopthethyroidmadness.com> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > ----> Less stamina than others> > > > > > ----> Less energy than others> > > > > > > Inability to hold children for very long> > > > > > ----> Arms feeling like dead weights after activity> > > > > > ----> Chronic Low Grade Depression> > > > > > ----> Often feeling cold> > > > > > ----> Cold hands and feet> > > > > > > High cholesterol> > > > > > > Bizarre and Debilitating reaction to exercise> > > > > > ----Becoming > Hard stools> > > > > > > Constipation> > > > > > > No eyebrows or thinning outer eyebrows> > > > > > ----Just plain funky > Dry Hair> > > > > > ----> Hair Loss> > > > > > > Dry cracking skin> > > > > > ----> Nodding off easily> > > > > > ----> Requires naps in the afternoon> > > > > > ----> Inability to concentrate or read long periods of time> > > > > > ----> Forgetfulness> > > > > > ----> Foggy thinking> > > > > > > Inability to lose weight> > > > > > > Always gaining weight> > > > > > > Inability to function in a relationship with anyone> > > > > > ----> NO sex drive> > > > > > ----> Moody periods> > > > > > > PMS> > > > > > > Excruciating pain during period> > > > > > > Nausea> > > > > > ----> Swelling/edema/puffiness> > > > > > ----> Aching bones/muscles> > > > > > > Osteoporosis> > > > > > ----> Bumps on legs> > > > > > ----starting back up> Acne on face and in hair> > > > > > ----starting back up> Breakout on chest and arms> > > > > > ----I think> Hives> > > > > > ----> Exhaustion in every dimension?physical, mental,> > > spiritual,> > > > > emotional> > > > > > > Inability to work full-time> > > > > > ----> Inability to stand on feet for long periods> > > > > > ----> Complete lack of motivation> > > > > > > Slowing to a snail?s pace when walking up slight grade> > > > > > ----trying to keep a "cap" on it> Extremely crabby, > irritable,> > > > > intolerant of> > > > > > others> > > > > > > Handwriting nearly illegible> > > > > > > Internal itching of ears> > > > > > > Broken/peeling fingernails> > > > > > ----starting back up> Dry skin or snake skin> > > > > > ----fluctuates but better than in March!> Major > anxiety/worry> > > > > > > Ringing in ears> > > > > > > Lactose Intolerance> > > > > > ----> Inability to eat in the mornings> > > > > > ----> No hair growth, breaks faster than it grows> > > > > > ----> Joint pain> > > > > > ----> Carpal tunnel symptoms> > > > > > ----though it can swing > No Appetite> > > > > > > Fluid retention to the point of Congestive Heart Failure> > > > > > > Swollen legs that prevented walking> > > > > > ----changes > Blood Pressure problems> > > > > > ----> Varicose Vains> > > > > > > Dizziness from fluid on the inner ear> > > > > > ----though changing to higher now > Low body temperature> > > > > > ----> Sore feet (plantar fasciitis); painful soles of feet> > > > > > >> > > > > > > -------Original Message-------> > > > > > >> > > > > > > From: Kate> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > In the past, I've read so many conflicting "answers." > Perhaps> > > > > some> > > > > > > has to do with those who are on meds and those who are > not.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > If TSH is truly not adequate for testing for thyroid, why > do> > > so> > > > > many> > > > > > > doctors resort to testing only the TSH? It seems that > they do> > > not> > > > > > > veer off TSH unless you have been diagnosed with a thyroid> > > > > condition> > > > > > > & taking meds.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Is there a site, listing symptoms from patients. I do see> > > there> > > > > are> > > > > > > many symptoms but am wondering if there is a greater list,> > > > > according> > > > > > > to patient's personal experience.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > One thing I am curious about, is voice. I've read that> > > thyroid> > > > > > > conditions can cause a voice change i.e. hoarseness but > can> > > it> > > > > simply> > > > > > > change the sound, though not be hoarse?> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Today I will be bringing my oldest daughter to the doctors> > > for a> > > > > > > reoccurring scalp condition (like eczema) and what looks > like> > > > > > > vitiligo around her hairline. After the exam was finished,> > > going> > > > > to> > > > > > > hand him my folder. As it stands, I didn't get around to> > > > > finishing it> > > > > > > and so will ask him if he minds I take this approach. > That'll> > > be> > > > > the> > > > > > > start for me.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > A few here have said that I should have my ft3 and ft4> > > checked.> > > > > > > Somebody else mentioned Hashimotos. Would the ft3 & 4> > > indicate if> > > > > > > there is a possibility of Hashi's? I realize there is an> > > antibody> > > > > for> > > > > > > that but am wondering if the ft3 & 4 will cover it.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > ~Kate> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >> >>

November 3, 2006

Kate

> If antibodies skew the thyroid testing, then, could people be walking

> around with Hashi, despite a normal TSH/ft3/ft4. I take it?

Yes, this is already well documented, but the thyroid hormones aren't really

normal in these cases, the antibodies actually give a false reading of what

the thyroid hormones actually are. A lot of doc don't really know this or

understand this, so treating Hashi's strictly by testing methods is

disastrous. I think I just posted a link several days ago on these false

readings, or else it was " among " other things in an article or study?

> Because you were undertreated for so many years, did you ever

> experience hyper symtoms?

No, AFTER treatment, they were not hyper symptoms, they were hypo symptoms.

My presenting phase of Hashi's was displayed by HYPERthyroidism BEFORE I

crashed yrs later and was diagnosed as hypothyroid. This is a very common

starting phase for Hashi's because the gland initially is still working, or

rather overworking, until it becomes so scarred and damaged that it CAN'T

work any more. Some even say that it may well be a variant of Grave's

Disease. It becomes a gruesome looking thing even. (I've seen post surgery

pictures of them, and they are not pretty at all, if you can immagine

carrying THAT around in such a small space of your neck!) I could eat

anything I wanted to, that is, when I felt like eating, and never gain a lb.

As a matter of fact, I suddenly lost down to 113 lbs, but I'm 5'6 " tall, so

I was so bony at that weight. This is when I started having extreme ongoing

panic attacks, running miles and miles every single day (to quell the

anxiety) like a hamster on a wheel. I was constantly in a state of free

floating anxiety for approximately 6 yrs before the sudden crash, as in

fatigue I'd never had in my entire life, my beautiful 3 ft long hair dried

and broken like a witches, and my skin suddenly dry, pasty, and more aged in

just a matter of 3 or 4 months or so. It went caput in a very short period

of time, whereas it had been running along at full steam for yrs before

that. It was during the hypo phase that I was diagnosed, but noone ever

told me what caused it. I ran my own tests for Hashi's around 8 yrs down

the road. Backing up to WHEN I was diagnosed only as hypo, I was grossly

undertreated for around those 9 yrs or so, kept at a TSH of 5.5 ALL the

time. I did notice that my first couple of tests said that I had a 3.5,

then a 4.5, but the reason I was in for testing even then was that I felt

very bad, but not nearly as bad as I did just a couple of yrs down the road

from that. It is the nature of the disease to be either a constant

unremitting downhill slide over yrs or even months, or else to be schiz in

nature and go up down up down, etc......

> From what I've read, the sooner treatment begins with Hashi, the

> better outcome. Well, perhaps better than if you are not treated.

> Being in perfect health will always beat ilness under medication.

The sooner the treatment with Hashi's, of course the less misery and less

damage to other body parts. ly, the best treatment plan with a Hashi's

gland is to leave the gland out of the picture altogether, as that gland

will self destruct itself anyway, plus the rest of the person as well. The

treatment plan with Hashi's demands that you MUST know that it is Hashi's,

in order to treat it a certain way, i.e., nutritional protocol, a more

suppressed TSH, etc..

November 3, 2006

When you do yoga, you'll want to go to an instructor (preferably one that is certified by the yoga alliance) that fits you. is the instructor chaotic? what type of energy do you feel when you are around them? is the class a large group of 10 or more people or smaller? do they have lots of props to use? are they willing to help you maximize your body's potential... slowly? just some questions to think about.

yoga improves circulation and also helps you not only externally (losing weight, toning, etc.) but you also work your innards more and aren't as constipated, have better blood flow to organs, etc. if you do yoga you'll want a good yoga mat, which only cost a few dollars if you get them at a place like t.j. maxx or what not. you'll want yoga blocks (two of the same size) and a yoga belt. It will look a lot like a gait belt. Pillows will also help as will the right type of clothes.

In yoga, if you have too loose clothes, you trip on them and if they are too tight, you lose range of motion. What I can tell you is that yoga will help you learn to listen to your body. When you do yoga, you should not feel ANY strain at all. When I used to do yoga in my training I would do yoga for about 4 hours both days (we'd meet 2 days a month) and I couldn't tell until I went to walk to my car... my legs would feel like spaghetti LOL.

I recommend doing yoga with an instructor as not having proper alignment will really hurt you. Being a thyroid patient, we can't really afford to hurt our bodies . Classes here usually run $10-15 dollars a session in a group for an hour and a half usually. Costs will vary in your area but you can go to http://www.yogaalliance.org/teacher_search.cfm and they will have info about choosing the right yoga teacher for you.

Yoga is great for weight loss and stress reduction. It is one of the only times I can meditate because my brain refuses to slow down the traditional way. I was doing the Hatha (Ha-Ta' or Hah-tha) Yoga 200 hour program, although there are many different forms of yoga out there. Hatha is probably the most widely known. Many people who have had problems doing yoga have had problems with Hatha. Usually it is because their teacher moved too fast or didn't focus on proper feeling.

Just remember, yoga should NEVER hurt. If it does, you'll need support or to change your movement. I haven't been to a yoga class in over a month but I want to go back. I'll probably start going once a week again soon.

You can visit this link http://www.yogaalliance.org/PDF/untitled/Chart_1_Existing_RYS_200.pdf and it will show you all of the requirements that your instructor should have (minimum) to teach. If they are offering yoga training themselves but have not completed the 500 hour level, you should really know that you should report them to the alliance.

Yoga instructors must be educated in alignment, anatomy, technique, philosophy, ethics, etc. and must have so many hours in assisting and teaching before they are allowed to be certified.

I hope this helps you . Let me know how you like it if you decide to try it.

Oh.... p.s. any instructor worth their weight in salt will have you fill out a form telling them what physical limitations you have so that they can work with you. I assure you, I AM the MOST inflexible person... and if I could do yoga, anyone could.

p.p.s. Yoga is also available for those that have limited mobility, overweight, and who are in wheel chairs.

Re: So, what's the real deal with TSH (and symptoms list?)

Oh! I can testify for 2 people who are shallow breathers: my mom and me! Even worse, since I became aware of it...had even found myeslf holding my breath, briefly, at times. Ever feel like, say for example, in a debate and while you are listening...feels like something welling up? lol Well, I have...found it was my chest expanding because I was holding my breath in briefly. Kind of funny, really. When I got out, hiking...wow. Felt different and while difficult, was refreshing. All that fresh air circulating through my body. A-lot of fresh air does wonders for the mind, spirit and if you have trouble sleeping...all that fresh air helps put you to rest. ;-)Funny, you mention Yoga...my 15 year old daughter told me that she thought it might be helpful for me. Hmmmm....~Kate> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Here is a list from> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > www.stopthethyroidmadness.com> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ----> Less stamina than others> > > > > > > ----> Less energy than others> > > > > > > > Inability to hold children for very long> > > > > > > ----> Arms feeling like dead weights after activity> > > > > > > ----> Chronic Low Grade Depression> > > > > > > ----> Often feeling cold> > > > > > > ----> Cold hands and feet> > > > > > > > High cholesterol> > > > > > > > Bizarre and Debilitating reaction to exercise> > > > > > > ----Becoming > Hard stools> > > > > > > > Constipation> > > > > > > > No eyebrows or thinning outer eyebrows> > > > > > > ----Just plain funky > Dry Hair> > > > > > > ----> Hair Loss> > > > > > > > Dry cracking skin> > > > > > > ----> Nodding off easily> > > > > > > ----> Requires naps in the afternoon> > > > > > > ----> Inability to concentrate or read long periods of > time> > > > > > > ----> Forgetfulness> > > > > > > ----> Foggy thinking> > > > > > > > Inability to lose weight> > > > > > > > Always gaining weight> > > > > > > > Inability to function in a relationship with anyone> > > > > > > ----> NO sex drive> > > > > > > ----> Moody periods> > > > > > > > PMS> > > > > > > > Excruciating pain during period> > > > > > > > Nausea> > > > > > > ----> Swelling/edema/puffiness> > > > > > > ----> Aching bones/muscles> > > > > > > > Osteoporosis> > > > > > > ----> Bumps on legs> > > > > > > ----starting back up> Acne on face and in hair> > > > > > > ----starting back up> Breakout on chest and arms> > > > > > > ----I think> Hives> > > > > > > ----> Exhaustion in every dimension?physical, mental,> > > > spiritual,> > > > > > emotional> > > > > > > > Inability to work full-time> > > > > > > ----> Inability to stand on feet for long periods> > > > > > > ----> Complete lack of motivation> > > > > > > > Slowing to a snail?s pace when walking up slight grade> > > > > > > ----trying to keep a "cap" on it> Extremely crabby, > > irritable,> > > > > > intolerant of> > > > > > > others> > > > > > > > Handwriting nearly illegible> > > > > > > > Internal itching of ears> > > > > > > > Broken/peeling fingernails> > > > > > > ----starting back up> Dry skin or snake skin> > > > > > > ----fluctuates but better than in March!> Major > > anxiety/worry> > > > > > > > Ringing in ears> > > > > > > > Lactose Intolerance> > > > > > > ----> Inability to eat in the mornings> > > > > > > ----> No hair growth, breaks faster than it grows> > > > > > > ----> Joint pain> > > > > > > ----> Carpal tunnel symptoms> > > > > > > ----though it can swing > No Appetite> > > > > > > > Fluid retention to the point of Congestive Heart Failure> > > > > > > > Swollen legs that prevented walking> > > > > > > ----changes > Blood Pressure problems> > > > > > > ----> Varicose Vains> > > > > > > > Dizziness from fluid on the inner ear> > > > > > > ----though changing to higher now > Low body temperature> > > > > > > ----> Sore feet (plantar fasciitis); painful soles of feet> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > -------Original Message-------> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > From: Kate> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > In the past, I've read so many conflicting "answers." > > Perhaps> > > > > > some> > > > > > > > has to do with those who are on meds and those who are > > not.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > If TSH is truly not adequate for testing for thyroid, > why > > do> > > > so> > > > > > many> > > > > > > > doctors resort to testing only the TSH? It seems that > > they do> > > > not> > > > > > > > veer off TSH unless you have been diagnosed with a > thyroid> > > > > > condition> > > > > > > > & taking meds.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Is there a site, listing symptoms from patients. I do > see> > > > there> > > > > > are> > > > > > > > many symptoms but am wondering if there is a greater > list,> > > > > > according> > > > > > > > to patient's personal experience.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > One thing I am curious about, is voice. I've read that> > > > thyroid> > > > > > > > conditions can cause a voice change i.e. hoarseness but > > can> > > > it> > > > > > simply> > > > > > > > change the sound, though not be hoarse?> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Today I will be bringing my oldest daughter to the > doctors> > > > for a> > > > > > > > reoccurring scalp condition (like eczema) and what > looks > > like> > > > > > > > vitiligo around her hairline. After the exam was > finished,> > > > going> > > > > > to> > > > > > > > hand him my folder. As it stands, I didn't get around to> > > > > > finishing it> > > > > > > > and so will ask him if he minds I take this approach. > > That'll> > > > be> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > start for me.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > A few here have said that I should have my ft3 and ft4> > > > checked.> > > > > > > > Somebody else mentioned Hashimotos. Would the ft3 & 4> > > > indicate if> > > > > > > > there is a possibility of Hashi's? I realize there is an> > > > antibody> > > > > > for> > > > > > > > that but am wondering if the ft3 & 4 will cover it.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ~Kate> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> >>

November 4, 2006

Kate

> As for appearance of thyroid and literally feeling it, have you felt

> yours through the course of years and what have you felt, in regards

> to what your fingers were feeling?

Feeling enlargement or like there's not enough room in my neck anywhere,

feeling " tight " to my left side of my neck, yet not really seeing anything

protruding or anything like that. Also, when I touch where the front of the

thyroid is on the lower part, it feels like it is harder than it was over

the yrs, somehow (My TSH was kept by different doctors at a 5.5 for yrs on

end). Also, feels harder to swallow, and all this has been in the last yr

and a half, way after I did my own antibody levels. I didn't have any of

that going on in the earlier yrs of this.

> As for the anxiety aspect, that is really messed up...isn't it!?

> You dealt with this for 6 years!? Were you taking medication, in an

> attempt to help or were you doing this all on your own?

Oh yes, during the earlier yrs, still married, still feeling really

physically good, tireless, but at the doctor's office going " what's wrong

with me, what's wrong with me! " He says " Have you ever heard of panic

attacks or anxiety attacks? " I will never forget this. He then put me on

my first rounds of tranquilizers, antidepressants, antipsychotics, and the

like, changing them, as I would have complaints about rashes and other

symptoms that I thought were from these meds. I brought up thyroid to him,

when I finally started reading the Merck about it, he didn't test it. I

changed doctors, he wouldn't test it. I changed doctors again, he wouldn't

test it. I had one female doctor who was handling my progesterone loss,

with long long heavy periods that never stopped, who also told me that I

still had a load of estrogen, at least at that time. She never tested the

thyroid. Meanwhile, the ONLY symptoms I was having during those yrs were

the mental and emotionally ones that affected my appetite and such, I wasn't

having ANY other symptoms, except for the long heavy periods, then uterine

fibroids, with a hysterectom, finally. This was all from 1986 to 1993. I

was skinny as a rail all that time. Then, within a period of a few months,

my hair went nylon dry ALL at once, my eyes drooped, my skin got dry, I

suddenly gained around 15 to 20 lbs within a couple of months, my eyes

itched ALL the time. Then, within a two day period, I began to shake

periodically, as something that would remind you of a cerebellar attack, for

several hrs. Then it would suddenly stop, as though it had never happened,

then begin again in about 4 hrs, then stop again suddenly. (Turns out, that

was my pituitary TSH haggling the life out of my thyroid and kept doing it

because it couldn't " shake " any thyroid hormone out of my thyroid any

longer.) That's when I got on the phone with my then doc saying " You've

gotta help me, I feel like I'm going crazy here! " (I had felt very ill just

days before that, gone in and seen him, and was taking a sulfa drug for a

slight UTI, so I thought THAT could be involved with the shakes, etc..). He

said that he now thought that he knew what it was. I went in for a blood

draw and gwala, low thyroid. That was in '93, but I had no knowledge to ask

for what CAUSED it, but later on asked, and that's when he told me that

Hashi's was the most common cause, but never told me whether or not he had

run those tests. I didn't know to ask. It would be about 10 more yrs

before I ran these tests myself through HealthCheck and found out that I had

thousands of both types of antibodies for this. I still don't know, to this

day, whether or not I may have/have had both Hashi's and Graves, as I

haven't run the antibodies testing for Graves of this date. So you can see

where there is usually going to be a long nightmarish history, maybe not

feeling so bad in the beinning, or feeling " crazy " in the beginning, but

still very physically fit for yrs after that, if you don't have the right

doctor to quide you.

There is an online doctor study done by many doctors, with 4 case histories

of the Hashimoto's " crazies " , proven over and over again, as the FIRST and

FOREMOST symptoms of Hashimoto's in particular. I have a copy of that

paper, as it is a pdf download, but I will go in online and find the site

again and post it here. I believe I've posted that before, but I will

again, for those that are more new here, over this past yr or so. I think

it's called something like " Psychological Aspects of Hashimoto's

Thyroiditis " , and it was a HUGE doctor study.

> When you mention leaving the thyroid out of the picture, do you mean

> in not letting any surgeon remove it? Rather, let it run it's course

> taking medication only?

No, when I say leaving it out of the picture, I mean once you start on

medication, you do not want the thyroid itself to furnish any more hormone,

or very little, at the least, but that has to be VERY carefully titrated,

and I certainly don't have it perfect yet, to say the least, plus I believe

that I have other screwed hormonal issues. Nothing in the endocrine system

is independent of the other hormones, they all depend on each other, and in

thyroid disease, they all have a tendency to get messed up badly. Those

antibodies sort of set up the thyroid as though there is something you might

describe as an " allergy " to one's own thyroid hormone that is produced

directly in and on the thyroid. Every time this Hashi's gland produced it's

own hormone, the autoantibodies (auto meaning " self " ) attack it again, until

it kills some more of the thyroid, making it even " sicker " . Then,

production goes down because it is so sick, and the process starts all over

again. Anyway, it is many KNOWLEDGEABLE doctors' opinions that, in Hashi's,

this is why the pituitary " vexor " , TSH, must be very close to suppressed,

that is, if the person's body can handle it. That means that the thyroid

itself becomes a non-participant in making hormone, so that it will not

become " sicker " than it already is, so that it will not enlarge, form

" holes " in it, squeeze the life out of your trachea, form nodules, growths,

cancers, and the like, and make you feel generally horrible, eventually.

This does NOT mean that the thyroid will ever WORK right again, it means

that there is a possibility that you will never have to have your neck cut

open and have it removed. This is why I get soooo angry at doctors who will

not research and train themselves on this sbjct because, literally, our

lives with this disease are in their hands.

November 4, 2006