JBF and adjustments

[Guest guest]

Hay, . Your brain seems to be holding up ok from my point of view.

Before the methodist discussion wanes, give us a better explication of

virgin birth, when, where, why ,how it applies to your denomination?

Lagniappe of the non-invasive dbs treatment (philosophical variety) for the

physically overchallenged homebound MSA caregiver whose mind is saturated

with medical tome offerings.

Your posts are ALWAYS so interesting and well thought out.

Hugs to you for all that you do!

LA Louise STILL trying to find some available hands-on assistance after a

WHOLE year without a doctor for deserving patient , patient Jan.

[Guest guest]

Louise,

) Remember that God " cloned " woman from man )

) Virgin birth could be much like stem cell research. )

) Hugs, Bill

[Guest guest]

Boy, am I glad He revised the design. Good engineering on His part. I am

amazed. Do you ever wonder what the originals looked like?

Nope. Virgin birth was one of a kind. No replicating.

Kiss

a frog today. Barb

--

"Dreams are illustrations from the book your soul is writing about

you" Marsha Norman

[Guest guest]

Virgin birth could also be like In Vitro

Fertilization.

Think about it!

Hugs,

Pam

--- Werre b.werre@...> wrote:

> Louise,

>

> ) Remember that God " cloned " woman from man )

>

> ) Virgin birth could be much like stem cell

> research. )

>

> ) Hugs, Bill

______________________________________________________

Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Yes if God can create man, He can certainly insert a sperm into

an egg.

Barb,

Don't forget HE created Man in His own image. Woman was

created as a companion for man ) I will agree that most men do

like his handiwork on woman )

Note only 68% of 12000 women in a survey of science questions, knew

that the Earth orbited the sun, 93% of the men knew. I think I know

some of the men )

Anne and ,

If you are watching the list, I know I will get static on this post

)

Newbies,

We do get goofy at times here, we have been reading these same questions

for years, you are not unusual. Some of these goody posts have been

going for three years or more. Sorry, you have to put up with our

jokes.

Hugs to all, Bill Werre

Pam Bower wrote:

Virgin birth could also be like In Vitro

Fertilization.

Think about it!

Hugs,

Pam

[Guest guest]

Barb,

If the Lord cloned Eve from a rib of adam, She would be a he and probaly a bit homely looking.

Re: JBF and "adjustments"

Boy, am I glad He revised the design. Good engineering on His part. I am amazed. Do you ever wonder what the originals looked like? Nope. Virgin birth was one of a kind. No replicating. Kiss a frog today. Barb -- "Dreams are illustrations from the book your soul is writing about you" Marsha Norman

[Guest guest]

Pam,

That's an invasive procedure. I don't think it qualifies! LOL

God Bless,

Jim & Judy Stark

Re: JBF and " adjustments "

> Virgin birth could also be like In Vitro

> Fertilization.

> Think about it!

> Hugs,

> Pam

>

> --- Werre b.werre@...> wrote:

> > Louise,

> >

> > ) Remember that God " cloned " woman from man )

> >

> > ) Virgin birth could be much like stem cell

> > research. )

> >

> > ) Hugs, Bill

>

>

> ______________________________________________________

> Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca

>

> If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may

> unsubscribe by sending a blank email to

>

> shydrager-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes but I meant that it didn't require sex to make a baby.

Re: JBF and " adjustments "

>

>

> > Virgin birth could also be like In Vitro

> > Fertilization.

> > Think about it!

> > Hugs,

> > Pam

> >

> > --- Werre b.werre@...> wrote:

> > > Louise,

> > >

> > > ) Remember that God " cloned " woman from man )

> > >

> > > ) Virgin birth could be much like stem cell

> > > research. )

> > >

> > > ) Hugs, Bill

> >

> >

> > ______________________________________________________

> > Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca

> >

> > If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may

> > unsubscribe by sending a blank email to

> >

> > shydrager-unsubscribe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Greetings Louise!

And careful wishes to the care receiver, Jan! ;-)

Louise, you wonder about:

> Before the Methodist discussion wanes...

Okay! One last post before we move off the subject (at least for now). I

delayed a long time on this due to work and how I feel, more than the topic.

So, don't feel as if I am offended by questions. Questions are good.

Questions are very good.

> ... give us a better explanation of virgin birth ...

LOL! I doubt quite seriously I am qualified to provide a good explanation.

But you seem to be happy for my own input. So, here is my own theology (my

belief in God and how God interacts with us).

> ... when, where, why, ...

When: About 2000 years ago, but got it's start 9 months before that time!

;-)

Where: If the texts are correct, then Nazareth for the start and Bethlehem

for the birth.

Why: Well, I've got lots of ideas on this one. (a) To drive lots of people

nuts trying to answer this question. ( 'Cause God's got a odd sense of

humor. © Because God did need to be " Wholly human AND wholly divine " .

What's my theology behind that need? Well, there is no sacrifice that

suffices except God. Only God could offer God a sacrifice that would

suffice God. And yes, that DOES hurt the head. (e) Not the least reason is

because it creates a barrier to belief. And as odd as it seems, I honestly

believe that God wants us to make small leaps of faith. If it was easy, it

wouldn't be faith.

Why do I believe in this? For the simple fact that the early church had to

deal with something that was scandalous in the least. An unwed mother in

that culture was stoned to death. Today (in rare occurrences) in this same

culture fathers LITERALLY dismember their daughters. The child of an unwed

mother is unwanted and shunned - completely.

It is most likely the story of the virgin birth did not surface until after

the crucifixion of Jesus. It must have rocked the early church. To accept

and pass along this story must have been very daunting for the church in

Jerusalem. It was not until the Church started to enter the traditional

Greco-roman society that a virgin birth (the birth of a child from a god)

started to have acceptable standing. But it almost certainly NOT why the

belief exists. Sometimes a preposterous story has merit, just because it is

so preposterous.

For example, Mark 14:51-52 says " And a young man followed him, with nothing

but a linen cloth about his body; and they seized him, but he left the linen

cloth and ran away naked. " This is the type of material that is so odd as

to have the ring of truth. If this was just a story, who would dream of

adding this into the story of the events leading to the crucifixion of

Jesus. But if someone is retelling something that happened, odd and

difficult snippets of real events become embedded into the story.

So, one reason I believe the virgin birth is because it is both so

preposterous and so scandalous. Yet, I continue to also find it quite

unbelievable.

Fortunately, you did not ask the " How " question. 'Cause " I dunno! " is about

all I can provide. Lots of people offer " How " answers. But it tends to

vary from a cover up of a scandal to an odd mutation. Neither end of the

spectrum satisfies.

> ... how it applies to your denomination?

Methodists believe in the virgin birth. Most Methodists (and most

Christians) don't understand why they believe what they believe. ly

most of us check our brain at the door of the church. " Virgin birth? Sure,

everyone knows about that. Of course I believe that, don't you? "

Boy, did I ever make some of my Sunday school teachers upset as a teen

(until I figured out they did not want someone to challenge their faith). I

want answers to the odd questions.

Fortunately, as an adult I met a retired minister / professor who kept

asking me those odd questions and wouldn't stop until *I* researched the

answers. My faith has never been the same since. It's been thousands of

times stronger!

I have answers that are mine. I have spent a LOT of time trying to develop

my own theology. My theology differs from much orthodox Christian theology

in a few points. I know those, and know WHY they differ. But I am far more

orthodox than I was before this journey started.

I now see there are points where a leap of faith is required. I now know

that divinely inspired does not mean divinely written. I understand the

process of transmission of the text, the process of interpretation and the

consequences of each. I now know that sometimes it is possible to find the

divine in the oddest situations. I now see that God has a wonderful sense

of humor. And I now know that God more deeply understands us than we can

possibly imagine.

Out of all the odds and ends, I try to daily learn that we must love God and

one another. That means we must help one another. And being fully human,

and not at all divine, I fail miserably all too often.

So, this has been my own personal journey. Perhaps it provides some answers

for others. Maybe it just raises new questions. Either way, search for

God. God wants that.

Regards,

=jbf=

B. Fisher

[Guest guest]

Thanks, .

Mine was not a frivolous request. Contemplation of many meanings for many

things occupy my mind while repetitive activities drain me physically. No

time for books valued in a remembered " other life. "

A sorta motto from the memorial nave of the cathredral in TN Suwanee applies

currently - " She hath done what she could. "

Steady that with IN neighborhood author Theo. Dreiser's " Organized religion

is the opiate of the people " and I can ignore present difficulties and look

forward to yet another warm, sunny day doing what is right for me.

(While the local ladies in line at the drugstore observe that " she doesn't

even go to church. " )

LA Louise appreciating unlimited discussion unrestricted by dogma in this

forum....with jokes.