Re: Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel better, then b...

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/16/2004 6:41:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,

FlyingDreams@... writes:

> How long did the bad days last, a week, a month? I was going along

> really well and then this. I was hoping for even better days not

> back to the beginning before meds bad.

>

>

less than a week. 3-5 days. and then I'd have good days. and then some bad

days. I told my husband around that time that I needed to start circling the

good days on the calendar....cause I knew I was having more good days...but

those bad days sure did take it out of me.

Did you do anything different prior to having the 4 days of drowsiness?

Cindi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/16/2004 6:41:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,

FlyingDreams@... writes:

> How long did the bad days last, a week, a month

let me clarify. when I had the bad days..they only lasted for a few days.

But this went on for months. Like month 3 thru month 8. But what happen now

is I bounce back really fast from whatever causes the bad days (not enough

sleep, didn't eat right, weather colder, did too much, sometimes no reason).

And

somehow things have just balanced out a lot better and I rarely ever have a

really bad day.

Cindi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/17/2004 11:32:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,

MamaMaha@... writes:

> Anger/Self-righteous indignation should be expressed somehow in verbal

> words, conversation or in writing, even if we toss out what we've written

> afterwards & it never gets to the person(s) we're angry at.

yea...i did that. both doctors got letters expressing how i felt about their

neglect...and why they were wrong to try to keep me sick...with a lot of info

about how hypo should be treated.

cindi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/17/2004 11:32:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,

MamaMaha@... writes:

> That is the question? IMHO...if I don't care, nobody else is going

> to...especially not my doctors. At least so far...

caroline,

i loved your post. not the pain it expressed...but just hearing someone lay

out all the truth about doctors. it's a sad truth, isn't it? as far as you

feeling better...I believe you can. you are on a low dose of Armour and have

been without it a long time. my experience is that every month can bring

subtle improvement...and that it is worth the journey. every month i get

stronger

in ways...even though i know my body is weakened from years of low

thyroid...my spirit gets stronger. hang in there for awhile with the Armour,

Caroline...i think more good things can happen with you.

cindi

[Guest guest]

I think most of us here have about this same story to share, unfortunately! I

know how you feel, !

I lost 10 years of my life from age 39 - 49, my currant age, but now I am on

Armour, so hopefully I will be getting better and better each day. Enjoyed

reading your letter, Cindi. I can't help to think about all the women out there

that needs help and are not going to find it. It is very sad and aggravating!!

Kathy

Re: Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel

better, then b...

In a message dated 12/17/2004 12:23:40 AM Eastern Standard Time,

FlyingDreams@... writes:

> I'm so sick of trying to get well.

> Defending and begging for meds. And the dr asks me why I am angry?

> Get real! 15 yrs of my life GONE. Give me those years back! The

> best time of my life, in my prime and it's all gone, gone gone never

> to be seen again. Give me a break! 37 yrs old and it's gone

,

I know EXACTLY how you feel. I went thru this with two doctors.

The first one was the ENT who diagnosed me. At my first lab check after

starting Armour....while on 1 grain he thought (1 1/2 grain actually)...he

wrote

on the lab sheet " Thyroid OKAY " . WHAT? My TSH was 1. something but the Free

T4 had not even budged from where it was at diagnosis which was .77. And he's

saying thyroid okay? I exchanged some angry words with his nice nurse. And

fired him pretty quickly.

So I decided to go to a endo doc on the Top Doc list. HAHAHA. By that time

I was feeling pretty good on 3 grains with about all hypo symptoms gone. But

when she did lab work she wanted me to drop 1/2 grain because my TSH was

suppressed. I WAS FURIOUS. I mean what the heck is going on I was thinking?

Why

are they trying to keep us sick?

And I was still mad from this diagnosis having been missed for 25 years which

is how long I had been having some bad symptoms. And for 15 years really bad.

And now they weren't even going to let me get well?

I said the HECK WITH THEM....I ordered my some more Armour enough to last for

over 6 months...and I determined that i needed to get well enough for a while

before I could deal with any more stupid doctors. Because I knew the stress

of dealing with this while I was trying to heal was very detrimental.

Best decision I ever made for myself. I've been treating myself for over 6

months and am doing pretty well. And far better than I would have been had I

continued to listen to a doctor.

This treatment of us is criminal in my opinion. There is no excuse for this

type of malpractice in treating a hypo person and using their labs to

determine how they feel. I remember asking the first doctor's nurse - does he

even

CARE how I feel? Do you suppose he might ask?

Anyway...that 's my story. My husband helped me work thru the anger and he's

been supportive of me self medicating. I do plan to look for a doctor after

Christmas..but this time I'm well enough (as in my brain functions pretty well

- and I'll blow them away if they start crap with me) to deal with the

doctors.

So yes...I understand. I truly do. Doctors..by their failure to listen to

ME and instead relied on a TSH test...stole most of my life. I've had a good

life, but it's been hard many times because of the way I felt. That's why I'm

here now - I do NOT want anyone else to go thru what I have...and lose

precious years.

Cindi

[Guest guest]

OMG that's a horribly long time to be mistreated by doctors. I sure feel for

you. It's criminal is right!! You have a HUGE right to be extremely angry. Anger

is healthy...never worry that you're angry unless you're planning to harm

someone else in a vengeful act. That's not anger then, its revenge.

Otherwise it's just self-righteous indignation which is extremely healthy,

especially when it's expressed & not held inside which can cause depression.

I've been depressed nearly all my adult life, looking back on it now, having

been taught that anger is a sin. So I'd be thinking everything was my fault &

there's something wrong with me that I should be fixing myself because I was

causing my own problems, even health-related ones. I've had lots & lots of

counseling & group therapy for that in my time which was good to an extent

because I was able to express my anger that way quite a lot to get on with life

but it didn't help my health to get better for very long, tho it did for a

while, but not completely better.

Anger/Self-righteous indignation should be expressed somehow in verbal words,

conversation or in writing, even if we toss out what we've written afterwards &

it never gets to the person(s) we're angry at. I'm on an another egroup that

suggests writing out our anger for at least a week every day if we're angry with

someone else, even several others. In my case after I told my story of being

sick & gone undiagnosed for my symptoms for over 20 years at least, I was told

to write out my anger against doctors. I've never gotten mad at my any of my

doctors, thinking they were doing they were doing their best for me on

Synthroid, anti-depressants & Rx pain pills or Estrogen & told I need to see a

shrink or get more exercise & watch my diet but kept getting worse & worse even

when I did all that to the very best of my ability.

I never had an inkling I was being misdiagnosed of mistreated because of thyroid

or general endocrine-related dysfunction & that taking what the doctors

prescribed or substituting myself with natural remedies like herbs & nutritional

supplements, was all that was necessary. So I never knew why I wasn't getting

better but relied on the doctors' tests & diagnosis & prescribing to " fix " me

which it never did.

Its gotten so bad now that even taking a strong opiate/heavy pain pills doesn't

work very well anymore. What's next? Being on morphine? Some people are with my

kind of back, joint & tissue pain. And forget exercise, it's too painful to even

THINK about doing anymore tho I used to be dedicated to formal exercising at

least 1-2 hours every day, going on veggie & fruit juice fasts, doing enemas to

clear out the toxins, & taking scads of nutritional supplements, etc. etc. etc.

Some of which did help...but I kept deteriorating anyway having to give up more

& more of my former activities & " life " in the process.

And it showed on my x-rays, bone density, MRIs & other such tests plus I could

see my hair was thinning & body hair disappearing, eyebrows gone, rough patches

of skin forming, getting connective tissue disease, warts, skin tags, blotchy

skin, fuzzy thinking, lost creativity & spunk, osteoarthritis/bone spurs, carpal

tunnel, the full range of fibromyalgia & rheumatoid arthritis symptoms,

excrutiatingly painful muscles spasms every day, major teeth

decaying/absesseces/extractions & on & on. Every time I went to the doctor or

dentist or even a chiropractor & was told I now have this or that new disease

or got a new batch of test results & saw them...specially x-rays, I'd go home,

cry my eyes out & be depressed for weeks afterwards feeling so sorry for my poor

body falling apart & degenerating as it has been. Lately I've been in such

despair over it all, I'd sooner die than live this way in more & more pain &

incapacitation...that's no way to live & it's not a " life " at all. So why live

at all then?

Well I'm still not feeling any better on the Armour. I guess because so much

cellular damage has been done & I cannot expect miracles at my age with general

aging ongoing. But I'm sure angry with all the doctors who didn't even bother to

address all my symptoms & relied on their lab-created blood tests now that I've

heard it all on this thyroid group.

I cannot get into the rut of depression again about being so stupid & ignorant

myself, not knowing so much of it is thyroid related & being mistreated for it.

I cannot blame myself for being undereducated or not taking care of myself

properly when I didn't know enough to even know what to read up on & educate

myself about & wasn't guided by any doctors or other health practioners to do

so. For that's self-defeatism & turning the angry energy onto myself which is

self destructive & causes worse depression.

So who am I supposed to be mad at then? Myself? The Great Spirit? The Supreme

Being? The patriarchal male-egoistic encultured system we live in? My parents?

I've been there, done that but what good does it do? Better to get angry with

doctors who're the real culprits, IMHO. Many of whom are merely greedy & don't

really care to take the time to educate themselves about their patients'

symptoms & welfare. They aren't there to help people get better, only to line

their own pockets & have the " good life " themselves, not caring so much if their

patients continue to suffer....or die....for that matter. What in blazes do they

spend umpteen years in school to learn anyway? How to push drugs & surgery on

people & get royalities & perks from corporate pharmarceutical companies &

insurance companies? What a racket & so many people are the innocent victims.

More people die of allopathic, (medical doctors) mistreatment & drug overdosing

or botched surgeries than anything else...at least 75,000 or more people every

year. So what use are doctors anyway except to make us sicker when looked at

that way?

I wish I knew enough to treat myself for everything & know exactly what to do

but even when I've studied & read myself to distraction & tired everything it

still didn't work. I guess it's a matter of finding the right doctor...I think

naturpathic ones or other really educated holisitic healers are the best answer.

I just wish they were covered by Medicare which is what I've got. MediCal &

MediCaid doesn't even cover them from what my senior citizen friends who've got

it tell me. So what does this tell us? Either we get mistreated & drugged, cut

up & insulted/abused by doctors who experiment with us....the ones who're

covered by our insurance because we cannot afford any truly humane treatment by

natural practitioners paid for out of pocket.....or else we get sicker, suffer &

die. Does anyone really care? That is the question? IMHO...if I don't care,

nobody else is going to...especially not my doctors. At least so far.......

Re: Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel

better, then b...

In a message dated 12/17/2004 12:23:40 AM Eastern Standard Time,

FlyingDreams@... writes:

> I'm so sick of trying to get well.

> Defending and begging for meds. And the dr asks me why I am angry?

> Get real! 15 yrs of my life GONE. Give me those years back! The

> best time of my life, in my prime and it's all gone, gone gone never

> to be seen again. Give me a break! 37 yrs old and it's gone

,

I know EXACTLY how you feel. I went thru this with two doctors.

The first one was the ENT who diagnosed me. At my first lab check after

starting Armour....while on 1 grain he thought (1 1/2 grain actually)...he

wrote

on the lab sheet " Thyroid OKAY " . WHAT? My TSH was 1. something but the Free

T4 had not even budged from where it was at diagnosis which was .77. And he's

saying thyroid okay? I exchanged some angry words with his nice nurse. And

fired him pretty quickly.

So I decided to go to a endo doc on the Top Doc list. HAHAHA. By that time

I was feeling pretty good on 3 grains with about all hypo symptoms gone. But

when she did lab work she wanted me to drop 1/2 grain because my TSH was

suppressed. I WAS FURIOUS. I mean what the heck is going on I was thinking?

Why

are they trying to keep us sick?

And I was still mad from this diagnosis having been missed for 25 years which

is how long I had been having some bad symptoms. And for 15 years really bad.

And now they weren't even going to let me get well?

I said the HECK WITH THEM....I ordered my some more Armour enough to last for

over 6 months...and I determined that i needed to get well enough for a while

before I could deal with any more stupid doctors. Because I knew the stress

of dealing with this while I was trying to heal was very detrimental.

Best decision I ever made for myself. I've been treating myself for over 6

months and am doing pretty well. And far better than I would have been had I

continued to listen to a doctor.

This treatment of us is criminal in my opinion. There is no excuse for this

type of malpractice in treating a hypo person and using their labs to

determine how they feel. I remember asking the first doctor's nurse - does he

even

CARE how I feel? Do you suppose he might ask?

Anyway...that 's my story. My husband helped me work thru the anger and he's

been supportive of me self medicating. I do plan to look for a doctor after

Christmas..but this time I'm well enough (as in my brain functions pretty well

- and I'll blow them away if they start crap with me) to deal with the

doctors.

So yes...I understand. I truly do. Doctors..by their failure to listen to

ME and instead relied on a TSH test...stole most of my life. I've had a good

life, but it's been hard many times because of the way I felt. That's why I'm

here now - I do NOT want anyone else to go thru what I have...and lose

precious years.

Cindi

[Guest guest]

Excellent idea. Maybe they learned something. I reported one of my doctors to

the State Medical Board for neglect. Long story..too long for here. I also

reported one of my attorneys to the Bar Association. Did that after either

writing or verbally telling them what the problem was which was sheer neglect on

their parts & uncalled for at that. Sometimes it not only pays to get mad but

also to get even.

----- Original Message -----

From: nc2406@...

yea...i did that. both doctors got letters expressing how i felt about their

neglect...and why they were wrong to try to keep me sick...with a lot of info

about how hypo should be treated.

cindi

[Guest guest]

I'm affirming a better life for myself too because of this wonderfully

supportive, informative group & the Armour in increasing doses.

I think as I express my anger, even if only to the thin air or walls in my home

or on paper, that will clear my mind & body more to think better & find

solutions & a better doctor. There's already more people & opportunities coming

into my life lately for having done so.

They say anger expressed clears the air so later calmer discussion & resolution

can take place. I should think it would also clear the body/mind of blocked,

depressing thought forms that stay stuck in there that obstructs new energy from

entering. They say Mother Nature abhors a void & rushes to fill it. When we're

expressing our anger outward, out of our body/minds, we're creating a void

inside ourselves where all that anger became depressing...anger festering inside

& often turned against ourselves. It's like saying, " I'm sick & tired of all

this crap & not going to take it anymore " !!!

So when there's a void inside us because we've expressed our anger, then we

create a void for new energies in the form of better doctors or solutions to our

problems or contacts with groups or others who can help us. That's what makes

expressing anger a very constructive, healing thing to do. Not something to be

ashamed of as if we're a bitch or witch because we're angry & are supposed to be

" ladylike " or " humble " & never complain but " turn the other cheek " instead.

That's okay for masochists but not for people who want to find a constructive

healing solution.

We're *worth* it!! Just my 2 cents. I think because I can get angry & often do,

that will in itself will help me continue to find constructive healing solutions

that fill the void I'm emptying out by expressing my anger outward at those

responsible for mistreating/abusing me, even doctors.

Re: Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel

better, then b...

In a message dated 12/17/2004 11:32:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,

MamaMaha@... writes:

> That is the question? IMHO...if I don't care, nobody else is going

> to...especially not my doctors. At least so far...

caroline,

i loved your post. not the pain it expressed...but just hearing someone lay

out all the truth about doctors. it's a sad truth, isn't it? as far as you

feeling better...I believe you can. you are on a low dose of Armour and have

been without it a long time. my experience is that every month can bring

subtle improvement...and that it is worth the journey. every month i get

stronger

in ways...even though i know my body is weakened from years of low

thyroid...my spirit gets stronger. hang in there for awhile with the Armour,

Caroline...i think more good things can happen with you.

cindi

[Guest guest]

Did you say all this to her? You should express yourself to her, then order

your OWN meds.

Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel better,

then b...

>

>

> This month has been really stressful - hubby out of town 2 wks in a

> row and going back to the dr - that always stresses me out. Tends

> to make me depressed for at least a week. I knew my results would

> be out of normal. 3.04 TSH last time and I still felt like crap.

> I knew going on much more meds I would be much lower and that the dr

> would be saying drop your meds. That stress alone is driving me

> crazy. Having to beg for meds that I finally found to help me is

> upsettting. My Mom felt better in 2 months on meds. It was

> immediate relief for her and not for me. 3 months on synthroid not

> a single tiny bit of relief. 2 months on armour (5 months total on

> meds) and I get relief and hope to get my life back. That's why

> after reading about drs dropping meds when someone on paper (test

> results) was to them hyper was in fact still hypo and needed more

> meds. The sad fact is that I could have defended and begged for the

> correct meds better only a week ago and here I am in a complete

> brain fog and unable to defend myself. She upset me greatly, I knew

> she would. Top dr. - what a joke! Why should I have to beg for my

> meds!?!?!??! I'm so angry. She mentioned 3x's I seemed angry. How

> dare she! I wish I told her off! How dare she piss off an already

> pissed off patient. Was she trying to get rid of me? What is the

> motivation of her saying that??!?!? Why shouldn't I be! I waited 15

> yrs to get these meds and you want to take them away from me?!?!

> Give me a break. She tried to push the antidepressants on me.

> After being on them for 14 yrs with no relief only a pill to get me

> out of the drs office without a cure. I had a really bad day. I

> got lost on the way there. In such a state of drowsiness I lost my

> way. And mind you normally you could take me blindfold anywhere and

> I could tell you where is North, South, etc. I'm so out of it.

> Here I was thinking finally I was getting relief. 2 month of a

> little taste of normal. Some energy, motivation and less brain fog

> and here it is back and the dr says ok less meds. Excuse me but

> that doesn't make sence. I'm so sick of trying to get well.

> Defending and begging for meds. And the dr asks me why I am angry?

> Get real! 15 yrs of my life GONE. Give me those years back! The

> best time of my life, in my prime and it's all gone, gone gone never

> to be seen again. Give me a break! 37 yrs old and it's gone. Why

> shouldn't I be angry. She even admitted to me that I probably knew

> more than her. How depressing is that?!?!? Asked me what tests to

> do. What's the deal with that!?!?! I have absolutely NO confidence

> in the drs on this planet. I hear so much bad and very little

> good. All they want is a paycheck and they could care less about

> their patients. They consider us all a big paycheck nothing more

> nothing less. I'd like to sue them for the loss of the last 15

> years! I wanted and planned to do so much and it's all gone. Gone,

> gone, gone!

>

> Thanks for listening,

>

> Yeh, I AM angry!

[Guest guest]

That's good that you sent them a letter. Everyone of us should do that

when we get a doctor that doesn't know how to treat AND doesn't want to

learn things.

Kate

At 10:42 AM 12/17/2004, you wrote:

>In a message dated 12/17/2004 11:32:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,

>MamaMaha@... writes:

>

> > Anger/Self-righteous indignation should be expressed somehow in verbal

> > words, conversation or in writing, even if we toss out what we've written

> > afterwards & it never gets to the person(s) we're angry at.

>

>yea...i did that. both doctors got letters expressing how i felt about their

>neglect...and why they were wrong to try to keep me sick...with a lot of info

>about how hypo should be treated.

>cindi

[Guest guest]

I'd love to see your letters!

and I'd be curious to have been a fly on the wall when they received them!

Cris

Re: Cindi Re: 2 months on Armour feel better,

then b...

That's good that you sent them a letter. Everyone of us should do that

when we get a doctor that doesn't know how to treat AND doesn't want to

learn things.

Kate

At 10:42 AM 12/17/2004, you wrote:

>In a message dated 12/17/2004 11:32:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,

>MamaMaha@... writes:

>

> > Anger/Self-righteous indignation should be expressed somehow in verbal

> > words, conversation or in writing, even if we toss out what we've written

> > afterwards & it never gets to the person(s) we're angry at.

>

>yea...i did that. both doctors got letters expressing how i felt about their

>neglect...and why they were wrong to try to keep me sick...with a lot of info

>about how hypo should be treated.

>cindi