Re: puke

December 9, 2001

I

WHY WE WERE CHOSEN

God in His wisdom selected this group of men and women to be the purveyors of His goodness................blah,blah,blah

And this pompous ass knows this how?

Mark

December 9, 2001

The important part of this dribble is the line

"Well might He have said to us: "

Well might He have NOT said unto us (them) too!

I have this mental image of God up there listening to XA members praying, and slapping his forehead........."Not another fucking alcky!!.......Sometimes I don't know why I bothered inventing the brain!"

Barnsey

December 9, 2001

You're right Tomboy. This is disgusting. I only got through the first paragraph, and I can not stomach any more. Strange part is, is that I almost know exactly what the rest of it will say. That somehow the "recovering" alcoholic is higher than other "earth people". That they are justified in what they do by God. Yada, yada, yada. Some more sick validation for the torture that they undergo, and dish out. I'm going to go brush my teeth now. puke since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt it my obligation to share it with you:kisses Buoy WHY WE WERE CHOSEN God in His wisdom selected this group of men and women to be the purveyors of His goodness. In selecting them through whom to bring this about this phenomenon, He went not to the proud, the mighty, the famous, nor the brilliant. He went instead to the humble, to the sick, to the unfortunate. He went right to the drunkard, the so-called weakling of the world.Well might He have said to us: "Unto your weak and feeble hands I have entrusted a power beyond estimate. To you has been given that which has been denied the most learned of your fellows. Not to scientists or statesmen, not to wives or mothers, not even to my priests or ministers have I given this gift of healing other alcoholics, which I entrust to you."It must be used unselfishly; it carries with it grave responsibility. No day can be too long, no demands upon your time can be too urgent, no case too pitiful, no task too hard, and no effort too great. It must be used with tolerance for I have restricted its appreciation to no race, no creed, and no denomination. Personal criticism you must expect; lack of appreciation will be common. Ridicule will be your lot; your motives will be misjudged. You must be prepared for adversity, for what men call adversity is the ladder you must use to ascend the rungs toward spiritual perfection. And remember, in the exercise of this power I shall not exact from you beyond your capabilities."You are not selected because of exceptional talents. And be careful always, if success attends your effort, not to ascribe to personal superiority that to which you can lay claim only by virtue of My gift. If I had wanted learned men to accomplish this mission, the power would have been entrusted to the physician and scientist. If I had wanted eloquent men, there would have been many anxious for the assignment, for talk is the easiest used of all talent with which I have endowed mankind. If I had wanted scholarly men, the world is filled with those better qualified than you who would be available. You were selected because you have been the outcasts of the world and your long experience as drunkard has made or should make you humbly alert to the cries of distress that come from the lonely hearts of alcoholics everywhere."Keep ever in mind the admission you made on the day of your profession in AA, namely that you are powerless and that it was only with your willingness to turn your life and will unto My keeping, that relief came to you."---Fulton Oursler ...You may shoot me with your words,You may cut me with your eyes,You may kill me with your hatefulness,But still, like air, I'll rise....--Maya Angelou

December 9, 2001

You're right Tomboy. This is disgusting. I only got through the first paragraph, and I can not stomach any more. Strange part is, is that I almost know exactly what the rest of it will say. That somehow the "recovering" alcoholic is higher than other "earth people". That they are justified in what they do by God. Yada, yada, yada. Some more sick validation for the torture that they undergo, and dish out. I'm going to go brush my teeth now. puke since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt it my obligation to share it with you:kisses Buoy WHY WE WERE CHOSEN God in His wisdom selected this group of men and women to be the purveyors of His goodness. In selecting them through whom to bring this about this phenomenon, He went not to the proud, the mighty, the famous, nor the brilliant. He went instead to the humble, to the sick, to the unfortunate. He went right to the drunkard, the so-called weakling of the world.Well might He have said to us: "Unto your weak and feeble hands I have entrusted a power beyond estimate. To you has been given that which has been denied the most learned of your fellows. Not to scientists or statesmen, not to wives or mothers, not even to my priests or ministers have I given this gift of healing other alcoholics, which I entrust to you."It must be used unselfishly; it carries with it grave responsibility. No day can be too long, no demands upon your time can be too urgent, no case too pitiful, no task too hard, and no effort too great. It must be used with tolerance for I have restricted its appreciation to no race, no creed, and no denomination. Personal criticism you must expect; lack of appreciation will be common. Ridicule will be your lot; your motives will be misjudged. You must be prepared for adversity, for what men call adversity is the ladder you must use to ascend the rungs toward spiritual perfection. And remember, in the exercise of this power I shall not exact from you beyond your capabilities."You are not selected because of exceptional talents. And be careful always, if success attends your effort, not to ascribe to personal superiority that to which you can lay claim only by virtue of My gift. If I had wanted learned men to accomplish this mission, the power would have been entrusted to the physician and scientist. If I had wanted eloquent men, there would have been many anxious for the assignment, for talk is the easiest used of all talent with which I have endowed mankind. If I had wanted scholarly men, the world is filled with those better qualified than you who would be available. You were selected because you have been the outcasts of the world and your long experience as drunkard has made or should make you humbly alert to the cries of distress that come from the lonely hearts of alcoholics everywhere."Keep ever in mind the admission you made on the day of your profession in AA, namely that you are powerless and that it was only with your willingness to turn your life and will unto My keeping, that relief came to you."---Fulton Oursler ...You may shoot me with your words,You may cut me with your eyes,You may kill me with your hatefulness,But still, like air, I'll rise....--Maya Angelou

December 9, 2001

You're right Tomboy. This is disgusting. I only got through the first paragraph, and I can not stomach any more. Strange part is, is that I almost know exactly what the rest of it will say. That somehow the "recovering" alcoholic is higher than other "earth people". That they are justified in what they do by God. Yada, yada, yada. Some more sick validation for the torture that they undergo, and dish out. I'm going to go brush my teeth now. puke since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt it my obligation to share it with you:kisses Buoy WHY WE WERE CHOSEN God in His wisdom selected this group of men and women to be the purveyors of His goodness. In selecting them through whom to bring this about this phenomenon, He went not to the proud, the mighty, the famous, nor the brilliant. He went instead to the humble, to the sick, to the unfortunate. He went right to the drunkard, the so-called weakling of the world.Well might He have said to us: "Unto your weak and feeble hands I have entrusted a power beyond estimate. To you has been given that which has been denied the most learned of your fellows. Not to scientists or statesmen, not to wives or mothers, not even to my priests or ministers have I given this gift of healing other alcoholics, which I entrust to you."It must be used unselfishly; it carries with it grave responsibility. No day can be too long, no demands upon your time can be too urgent, no case too pitiful, no task too hard, and no effort too great. It must be used with tolerance for I have restricted its appreciation to no race, no creed, and no denomination. Personal criticism you must expect; lack of appreciation will be common. Ridicule will be your lot; your motives will be misjudged. You must be prepared for adversity, for what men call adversity is the ladder you must use to ascend the rungs toward spiritual perfection. And remember, in the exercise of this power I shall not exact from you beyond your capabilities."You are not selected because of exceptional talents. And be careful always, if success attends your effort, not to ascribe to personal superiority that to which you can lay claim only by virtue of My gift. If I had wanted learned men to accomplish this mission, the power would have been entrusted to the physician and scientist. If I had wanted eloquent men, there would have been many anxious for the assignment, for talk is the easiest used of all talent with which I have endowed mankind. If I had wanted scholarly men, the world is filled with those better qualified than you who would be available. You were selected because you have been the outcasts of the world and your long experience as drunkard has made or should make you humbly alert to the cries of distress that come from the lonely hearts of alcoholics everywhere."Keep ever in mind the admission you made on the day of your profession in AA, namely that you are powerless and that it was only with your willingness to turn your life and will unto My keeping, that relief came to you."---Fulton Oursler ...You may shoot me with your words,You may cut me with your eyes,You may kill me with your hatefulness,But still, like air, I'll rise....--Maya Angelou

December 9, 2001

> since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt

it my

> obligation to share it with you:

>

> kisses

> Buoy

>

Hi Tomboy,

My xa group passed these out in the secret meetings.

Was mentioned here b/4, and they are not AA literature.

Who's printing em and passing em on? My copy only says

reprint-author unknown.

netty

December 9, 2001

At 04:55 AM 12/10/01 -0000, caenemy wrote:

>

>> since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt

>it my

>> obligation to share it with you:

>>

>> kisses

>> Buoy

>>

>

> Hi Tomboy,

>

> My xa group passed these out in the secret meetings.

> Was mentioned here b/4, and they are not AA literature.

> Who's printing em and passing em on?

Since it's not (or no longer) 'official AA literature', it could

be anyone.

>My copy only says

> reprint-author unknown.

I recall a few years ago on this list, or the previous one, the

now-defunct X-AA list), or maybe even in his book, Ken Ragge saying

this " Why we were chosen " thing was an official AA phamplet up until

the 1970's. Someone repeated it from memory at a meeting I was in,

in 1988.

>

> netty

----------

http://listen.to/benbradley

December 10, 2001

>

> Since it's not (or no longer) 'official AA literature', it could

> be anyone.

>

> I recall a few years ago on this list, or the previous one, the

> now-defunct X-AA list), or maybe even in his book, Ken Ragge saying

> this " Why we were chosen " thing was an official AA phamplet up until

> the 1970's. Someone repeated it from memory at a meeting I was in,

> in 1988.

>

Hi Ben,

Interesting, very interesting!

So at one time this was an official AA phamplet?

Is there any way to prove this?

And why then do they not publish it anymore?

Was there a group conscience on this decision?

Any info out there?

netty

December 10, 2001

he went to the " humble " ?

the arrogant fuck who wrote this is putting word into gods mouth,

expects the reader to believe it and go on a AA Crusade, and if

we dont , we might expect not to remain sober. hows that for

humble?

i love " spiritual " types. they are the living embodiment of

hypocritism.

> WHY WE WERE CHOSEN

> God in His wisdom selected this group of men and women to

be the purveyors

> of His goodness. In selecting them through whom to bring this

about this

> phenomenon, He went not to the proud, the mighty, the

famous, nor the

> brilliant. He went instead to the humble, to the sick, to the

unfortunate.

> He went right to the drunkard, the so-called weakling of the

world.

> Well might He have said to us:

> " Unto your weak and feeble hands I have entrusted a power

beyond estimate.

> To you has been given that which has been denied the most

learned of your

> fellows. Not to scientists or statesmen, not to wives or

mothers, not even

> to my priests or ministers have I given this gift of healing other

> alcoholics, which I entrust to you.

> " It must be used unselfishly; it carries with it grave

responsibility. No

> day can be too long, no demands upon your time can be too

urgent, no case

> too pitiful, no task too hard, and no effort too great. It must be

used

> with tolerance for I have restricted its appreciation to no race,

no creed,

> and no denomination. Personal criticism you must expect; lack

of

> appreciation will be common. Ridicule will be your lot; your

motives will

> be misjudged. You must be prepared for adversity, for what

men call

> adversity is the ladder you must use to ascend the rungs

toward spiritual

> perfection. And remember, in the exercise of this power I shall

not exact

> from you beyond your capabilities.

> " You are not selected because of exceptional talents. And be

careful

> always, if success attends your effort, not to ascribe to

personal

> superiority that to which you can lay claim only by virtue of My

gift. If I

> had wanted learned men to accomplish this mission, the

power would have

> been entrusted to the physician and scientist. If I had wanted

eloquent

> men, there would have been many anxious for the

assignment, for talk is the

> easiest used of all talent with which I have endowed mankind.

If I had

> wanted scholarly men, the world is filled with those better

qualified than

> you who would be available. You were selected because you

have been the

> outcasts of the world and your long experience as drunkard

has made or

> should make you humbly alert to the cries of distress that

come from the

> lonely hearts of alcoholics everywhere.

> " Keep ever in mind the admission you made on the day of your

profession in

> AA, namely that you are powerless and that it was only with

your

> willingness to turn your life and will unto My keeping, that relief

came to

> you. "

> ---Fulton Oursler

>

> ...You may shoot me with your words,

> You may cut me with your eyes,

> You may kill me with your hatefulness,

> But still, like air, I'll rise....

>

> --Maya Angelou

December 10, 2001

secret meetings?

> > since it says at Sober24 to freely pass the following on, I felt

> it my

> > obligation to share it with you:

> >

> > kisses

> > Buoy

> >

>

> Hi Tomboy,

>

> My xa group passed these out in the secret meetings.

> Was mentioned here b/4, and they are not AA literature.

> Who's printing em and passing em on? My copy only says

> reprint-author unknown.

>

> netty

December 10, 2001

Netty,

The " secret meetings " is one I do wish you would elaborate on.

Firtst you bring up " the code " and now " secret meetings, " were

you follwing Bill 's program or was it Bond's

version of AA?

My experience of AA was never this exciting, 99% of the meetings

I remember were like watching paint dry.

Devin

> >

> > Since it's not (or no longer) 'official AA literature', it could

> > be anyone.

> >

> > I recall a few years ago on this list, or the previous one, the

> > now-defunct X-AA list), or maybe even in his book, Ken

Ragge saying

> > this " Why we were chosen " thing was an official AA phamplet

up until

> > the 1970's. Someone repeated it from memory at a meeting I

was in,

> > in 1988.

> >

>

> Hi Ben,

>

> Interesting, very interesting!

> So at one time this was an official AA phamplet?

> Is there any way to prove this?

> And why then do they not publish it anymore?

> Was there a group conscience on this decision?

> Any info out there?

>

> netty

December 10, 2001

I have been trying to find out who wrote this and the only thing I can

find is the good ol' " anonymous " guy.

It definitely wasn't " Fulton Oursler " as they attributed it to

in the Sober24 posting. The closest thing I can find to the truth is the

following:

http://www.a-1associates.com/AA/Why%20We%20Were%20Chosen.htm

Address by Judge T.4th Anniversary of the Chicago Group October 5,

1943

and if you thought the first " Why we were chosen " was sick

crap, wait until you check out the above url.

kisses

Tom Boy

At 04:02 PM 10/12/01 +0000, you wrote:

he went to the " humble " ?

the arrogant fuck who wrote this is putting word into gods mouth,

expects the reader to believe it and go on a AA Crusade, and if

we dont , we might expect not to remain sober. hows that for

humble?

i love " spiritual " types. they are the living embodiment

of

hypocritism.

> WHY WE WERE CHOSEN

December 10, 2001

> >he went to the " humble " ?

> >

> >the arrogant fuck who wrote this is putting word into gods mouth,

> >expects the reader to believe it and go on a AA Crusade, and if

> >we dont , we might expect not to remain sober. hows that for

> >humble?

> >

> >i love " spiritual " types. they are the living embodiment of

> >hypocritism.

> >

> > > WHY WE WERE CHOSEN

December 10, 2001

> secret meetings?

>

Hi,

Yes, the cult inside the cult. Did not know it at the

time though. At one of my last talkins to - before i left,

said something like, i have to get deprogrammed. He laughed,

saying 'you don't need to be deprogrammed'.

I knew somehow, something was way off.

A few weeks later found AAdeprogramming and Ken's book.

I just cried, it confirmed i wasn't crazy, having just got

out of the nut house.

We had 'secret' AA meetings at (mainly) his house. Only those

who were invited. (I screwed that one up alot)brought people

who weren't invited by 'them'. It took me awhile to learn i

wasn't one who could do the inviting. They had some squirming

around to do not to look suspicious. Changed meeting times and

days, and get me to follow directions better. Burn on them, yes.

No...did not know this was what was going on till i got out and

did some searching and talking.

I had gone to AA many times b/4. Always went back out. This group

of AA people did things a bit different and i was much more

willing to do things the way the BB said. So i thought i had

found a group who knew how it all worked and i would get better.

At the club, many just wanted to socialize and not get 'serious'

about getting well. So they had these 'secret' meetings for us

more willing fools. These were more about 'god' stuff and the

big book and the steps. This is where i got the copy of the

original big book.

Bible stuff was even mentioned now and

then, which later lead to the bible studies, and then on to the

church out of his home, which by the way i got to name. Oh lucky

me. Aren't we special. Crazy shit - fell right into it.

netty

December 10, 2001

I held 'secret meetings' at my house. We called them house meetings, well

we called them house meetings to 'outsiders' and 'secret meetings' to the

group. Did a couple of big book studies this way (I was the leader of

course) and we started from the beginning of the big book and went

through the first 164 pages. Wouldn't go any further until everyone had

agreed and done the part that was read (ie step 3, 4,5...), it was very

military and very very serious stuff. Have had people say that I

" saved their lives " with my knowledge and wisdom of the big

book. Still have people crediting me for their sobriety.

Oh you didn't *know* that I was in it BIG TIME???

Anyways, there are lots of secret meetings out there and yes it is the

cult within a cult. Most time secret meetings are started (at least in my

case) because it is believed that others are not taking the program

seriously enough. Being a fundamentalist Big Book freak (I never read

anything else but the big book for the first 6 years of AA) it was

important that the Big Book was followed *exactly* word for word, so that

was the need for the secret meetings. Wanted to only be with people who

understood " recovery " . I was very concerned that I could help

people RECOVER from alcoholism .

IT amazes me the knowledge I have of 164 pages of text. At one time, I

could probably recite by memory 90% of the first 164 pages.

Also one time I got my hands on a copy of the " Saturday Evening

Post " and I was so excited that I nearly peed my pants. I was like

almost " wet " with excitement. My husband (yes I was once

married) and I were going to New York for a holiday and of course at the

top of the list was the G.S.O. (I am looking right now at the G.S.O.

Welcome badge that they give you when you go to the G.S.O., suspect its

worth some money as I got it back in 1979) and I took along that copy of

the Saturday Evening Post so that I could give it to GSO and the

archives. I was so proud of myself. It was the best copy of the magazine

they had ever seen and it is still on display at G.S.O. if you ever want

to go and see it !!! hee heee.

Dunno what this ramble is all about, except to say there is hope for the

fanatics. Some of us do leave and I suspect we will see AA go downhill

simply because of the Internet. If it hadn't been for the internet I

would still be sitting in a chair at a meeting, in fact probably at this

moment since it is my day off and of course day off means a meeting!

BTW I am not proud of any of this stuff but it does show how someone can

get really hooked into a cult. Be vigilant at all times of anything that

sounds wacky because it probably is.

kisses

Tom Boy

> secret meetings?

>

Hi,

Yes, the cult inside the cult. Did not

know it at the

time though. At one of my last

talkins to - before i left,

said something like, i have to get deprogrammed.

He laughed,

saying 'you don't need to be deprogrammed'.

I knew somehow, something was way off.

A few weeks later found AAdeprogramming and

Ken's book.

I just cried, it confirmed i wasn't crazy,

having just got

out of the nut house.

We had 'secret' AA meetings at (mainly) his

house. Only those

who were invited. (I screwed that one up

alot)brought people

who weren't invited by 'them'. It took me awhile

to learn i

wasn't one who could do the inviting. They had

some squirming

around to do not to look suspicious. Changed

meeting times and

days, and get me to follow directions better.

Burn on them, yes.

No...did not know this was what was going on

till i got out and

did some searching and talking.

I had gone to AA many times b/4. Always went

back out. This group

of AA people did things a bit different and i

was much more

willing to do things the way the BB said. So i

thought i had

found a group who knew how it all worked and i

would get better.

At the club, many just wanted to socialize and

not get 'serious'

about getting well. So they had these

'secret' meetings for us

more willing fools. These were more about 'god'

stuff and the

big book and the steps. This is where i got the

copy of the

original big book.

Bible stuff was even mentioned now and

then, which later lead to the bible studies, and

then on to the

church out of his home, which by the way i got

to name. Oh lucky

me. Aren't we special. Crazy shit - fell

right into it.

netty

December 10, 2001

> Netty,

>

> The " secret meetings " is one I do wish you would elaborate on.

> Firtst you bring up " the code " and now " secret meetings, " were

> you follwing Bill 's program or was it Bond's

> version of AA?

>

> My experience of AA was never this exciting, 99% of the meetings

> I remember were like watching paint dry.

>

> Devin

>

Hi Devin,

Kinda answer that- -back a few post-#?

The 'secret' meetings appeared soon after i got my sponsor.

She was the wife of mr. guru - who was hubbies sponsor.

The 'code' i noticed while i was losing my mind, but it stayed

with me and i just watch for it, almost trying to make it not

work. I don't like what it could mean otherwise.

Bond - i do need a detective, lots of lies and secrets to

uncover. Maybe it's just my 'thing' to keep me going...who knows.

Would love to have a decoy....bust their asses good. Some day

that might just happen. In the meantime, just stay low, and learn

have so much to catch up on and to learn. Yet some days that

doesn't even matter...so it's a fight. A fight i want to win.

netty

December 10, 2001

> > Netty,

> >

> > The " secret meetings " is one I do wish you would elaborate

on.

> > Firtst you bring up " the code " and now " secret meetings, "

were

> > you follwing Bill 's program or was it Bond's

> > version of AA?

> >

> > My experience of AA was never this exciting, 99% of the

meetings

> > I remember were like watching paint dry.

> >

> > Devin

> >

> Hi Devin,

>

> Kinda answer that- -back a few post-#?

> The 'secret' meetings appeared soon after i got my sponsor.

> She was the wife of mr. guru - who was hubbies sponsor.

> The 'code' i noticed while i was losing my mind, but it stayed

> with me and i just watch for it, almost trying to make it not

> work. I don't like what it could mean otherwise.

> Bond - i do need a detective, lots of lies and secrets

to

> uncover. Maybe it's just my 'thing' to keep me going...who

knows.

> Would love to have a decoy....bust their asses good. Some

day

> that might just happen. In the meantime, just stay low, and

learn

> have so much to catch up on and to learn. Yet some days

that

> doesn't even matter...so it's a fight. A fight i want to win.

>

> netty

Come to think of it, I did get involved in one of those " Big Book

studies " they were held at peoples' houses. We would go

through the BB paragraph by paragraph, and discuss each

paragragh. I got hooked up with this through a guy I was working

with. I went to it for about six cosecutive meetings, then got bored

with it. It's funny that I've run into members of that group since I

left the cult and they act like they never knew me. I guess I'm not

doing god's will and I'm incapable of being honest, so who can

blame those good folks for shunning me, I'm sure god told them

that it's the right thing to do.

Devin

December 10, 2001

In my first doins with rehab, I heard the " counselors " quote over and over

again that " I know we sound like a cult, but were really not, honest " ! By

the way, if anyone tells you that, then they are a cult. Why else would you

need to convince someone you're not?

>

>Reply-To: 12-step-free

>To: 12-step-free

>Subject: Re: Re: puke

>Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2001 11:44:43 -0800

>

>I held 'secret meetings' at my house. We called them house meetings, well

>we called them house meetings to 'outsiders' and 'secret meetings' to the

>group. Did a couple of big book studies this way (I was the leader of

>course) and we started from the beginning of the big book and went through

>the first 164 pages. Wouldn't go any further until everyone had agreed and

>done the part that was read (ie step 3, 4,5...), it was very military and

>very very serious stuff. Have had people say that I " saved their lives "

>with my knowledge and wisdom of the big book. Still have people crediting

>me for their sobriety.

>Oh you didn't *know* that I was in it BIG TIME???

>Anyways, there are lots of secret meetings out there and yes it is the cult

>within a cult. Most time secret meetings are started (at least in my case)

>because it is believed that others are not taking the program seriously

>enough. Being a fundamentalist Big Book freak (I never read anything else

>but the big book for the first 6 years of AA) it was important that the Big

>Book was followed *exactly* word for word, so that was the need for the

>secret meetings. Wanted to only be with people who understood " recovery " . I

>was very concerned that I could help people RECOVER from alcoholism .

>IT amazes me the knowledge I have of 164 pages of text. At one time, I

>could probably recite by memory 90% of the first 164 pages.

>Also one time I got my hands on a copy of the " Saturday Evening Post " and I

>was so excited that I nearly peed my pants. I was like almost " wet " with

>excitement. My husband (yes I was once married) and I were going to New

>York for a holiday and of course at the top of the list was the G.S.O. (I

>am looking right now at the G.S.O. Welcome badge that they give you when

>you go to the G.S.O., suspect its worth some money as I got it back in

>1979) and I took along that copy of the Saturday Evening Post so that I

>could give it to GSO and the archives. I was so proud of myself. It was the

>best copy of the magazine they had ever seen and it is still on display at

>G.S.O. if you ever want to go and see it !!! hee heee.

>Dunno what this ramble is all about, except to say there is hope for the

>fanatics. Some of us do leave and I suspect we will see AA go downhill

>simply because of the Internet. If it hadn't been for the internet I would

>still be sitting in a chair at a meeting, in fact probably at this moment

>since it is my day off and of course day off means a meeting!

>BTW I am not proud of any of this stuff but it does show how someone can

>get really hooked into a cult. Be vigilant at all times of anything that

>sounds wacky because it probably is.

>

>kisses

>Tom Boy

>

>>

>> > secret meetings?

>> >

>>

>> Hi,

>>

>> Yes, the cult inside the cult. Did not know it at the

>> time though. At one of my last talkins to - before i left,

>> said something like, i have to get deprogrammed. He laughed,

>> saying 'you don't need to be deprogrammed'.

>> I knew somehow, something was way off.

>> A few weeks later found AAdeprogramming and Ken's book.

>> I just cried, it confirmed i wasn't crazy, having just got

>> out of the nut house.

>> We had 'secret' AA meetings at (mainly) his house. Only those

>> who were invited. (I screwed that one up alot)brought people

>> who weren't invited by 'them'. It took me awhile to learn i

>> wasn't one who could do the inviting. They had some squirming

>> around to do not to look suspicious. Changed meeting times and

>> days, and get me to follow directions better. Burn on them, yes.

>> No...did not know this was what was going on till i got out and

>> did some searching and talking.

>> I had gone to AA many times b/4. Always went back out. This group

>> of AA people did things a bit different and i was much more

>> willing to do things the way the BB said. So i thought i had

>> found a group who knew how it all worked and i would get better.

>> At the club, many just wanted to socialize and not get 'serious'

>> about getting well. So they had these 'secret' meetings for us

>> more willing fools. These were more about 'god' stuff and the

>> big book and the steps. This is where i got the copy of the

>> original big book.

>> Bible stuff was even mentioned now and

>> then, which later lead to the bible studies, and then on to the

>> church out of his home, which by the way i got to name. Oh lucky

>> me. Aren't we special. Crazy shit - fell right into it.

>>

>> netty

>>

December 10, 2001

The headings are hilarious, " yank thier chains " and " puke, " " yank

thier chans " and " puke. " Reminds me of the punk days.

Anyway , I'm supprised that they even said the word " cult "

when you were in rehab, when I was ther, it was never

suggested, not at all, not ever. This was going to help you get

sober and that was that.

As far as the internet actually causing XA to vanish, highly

unlikely, but I bet in five years we will se a significant drop in

12-step activity. In ten years there will probaly be one tenth the

meetings that exist today. In 20 years XA will be a tiny cult that will

for the most part be a thing of the past. There will be a few

die-hard that will hang on forever, like the Moonies, Church

Universal and Triumphant was huge in the late 70s early 80s, no

just a scattering remain. That is what my crystal ball says will be

the fate of the 12-step program. It's happening now, the ball is

rolling in the anti 12-step direction.

Devin

> >>

> >> > secret meetings?

> >> >

> >>

> >> Hi,

> >>

> >> Yes, the cult inside the cult. Did not know it at the

> >> time though. At one of my last talkins to - before i left,

> >> said something like, i have to get deprogrammed. He

laughed,

> >> saying 'you don't need to be deprogrammed'.

> >> I knew somehow, something was way off.

> >> A few weeks later found AAdeprogramming and Ken's

book.

> >> I just cried, it confirmed i wasn't crazy, having just got

> >> out of the nut house.

> >> We had 'secret' AA meetings at (mainly) his house. Only

those

> >> who were invited. (I screwed that one up alot)brought

people

> >> who weren't invited by 'them'. It took me awhile to learn i

> >> wasn't one who could do the inviting. They had some

squirming

> >> around to do not to look suspicious. Changed meeting

times and

> >> days, and get me to follow directions better. Burn on

them, yes.

> >> No...did not know this was what was going on till i got out

and

> >> did some searching and talking.

> >> I had gone to AA many times b/4. Always went back out.

This group

> >> of AA people did things a bit different and i was much

more

> >> willing to do things the way the BB said. So i thought i

had

> >> found a group who knew how it all worked and i would

get better.

> >> At the club, many just wanted to socialize and not get

'serious'

> >> about getting well. So they had these 'secret' meetings

for us

> >> more willing fools. These were more about 'god' stuff

and the

> >> big book and the steps. This is where i got the copy of

the

> >> original big book.

> >> Bible stuff was even mentioned now and

> >> then, which later lead to the bible studies, and then on to

the

> >> church out of his home, which by the way i got to name.

Oh lucky

> >> me. Aren't we special. Crazy shit - fell right into it.

> >>

> >> netty

> >>

December 10, 2001

What are you drinkin?