Guest guest Posted October 11, 2001 Report Share Posted October 11, 2001 I am starting to make some progress. I am no longer 100% convinced that if I don't go to AA meetings that I will drink and die. As Martha would say " this is a good thing " . Also , when I was drinking I loved cider, I have actually loved cider since I was a little kid. When I was drinking I drank a lot of cider but at times I don't even think I was drinking it for the alcohol. Anyhoos, now that I haven't been drinking and of course have been in AA, I haven't even been able to drink any of the non alcohol cider that you can get in the grocery stores because they contain minor amounts of alcohol (for that matter, I haven't been allowed to use mouthwash with alcohol or cough syrup with alcohol or anything like that) I guess it would be the equivalent of " near beer " which will of course make me drink volumes of it and then drink real liqour and then of course I will die. Now, I have decided that I can have this non alcoholic cider and am planning on buying some when I get groceries this week. I am actually excited about this , that I can make this decision for myself and am fairly (not 100% committed) sure that I won't end up drinking and dying because of it. It continues to amaze me at how much crap I have been indoctrinated with over the years and how it is like whittling at it piece by piece . Another thing that has been on my mind. When someone in AA would ask me how I was and I would answer " fine thank you " , they would go ballistic on me. I can't remember what they used as the acronym for " fine " but I know that it was a really really bad word to use. Does anyone here remember what it was. I also remember when people would ask me how I was doing and I said " terrific " , well they would get ballistic about that one too because " what you don't have any problems " " what you are cured " " what you are perfect " ? ad nauseum. Anyways, end of my weekly ramble. kisses Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 << Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. >> There are many people who arrive in AA without any addiction and are there because of a DUI, other legal issue, angry spouse who decided to hold an intervention, etc. But I would think that at least a good percentage of groupers have had some difficulty in drinking minimally or moderately. Why else would they be there on their own volition? Assuming one has had difficulties relating to alcohol, doesn't it defy common sense that they would refuse to quit? As if they had a disease, perhaps, that made it impossible not to drink? AA is the foremost moderation program. Even after ten years of programming, groupers are still fixated on " one day at a time. " If you ask them, " might you drink tomorrow? The next day? " , the reply is always, " I don't know. I work the program one day at a time. " When they do drink, they often do so quite destructively, and call it a " relapse " . Since " relapse is part of recovery " , what else can one think? Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > I am starting to make some progress. I am no longer 100% convinced that if > I don't go to AA meetings that I will drink and die. As Martha > would say " this is a good thing " . > Also , when I was drinking I loved cider, I have actually loved cider since > I was a little kid. When I was drinking I drank a lot of cider but at times > I don't even think I was drinking it for the alcohol. > Anyhoos, now that I haven't been drinking and of course have been in AA, I > haven't even been able to drink any of the non alcohol cider that you can > get in the grocery stores because they contain minor amounts of alcohol > (for that matter, I haven't been allowed to use mouthwash with alcohol or > cough syrup with alcohol or anything like that) I guess it would be the > equivalent of " near beer " which will of course make me drink volumes of it > and then drink real liqour and then of course I will die. > Now, I have decided that I can have this non alcoholic cider and am > planning on buying some when I get groceries this week. I am actually > excited about this , that I can make this decision for myself and am fairly > (not 100% committed) sure that I won't end up drinking and dying because of it. > It continues to amaze me at how much crap I have been indoctrinated with > over the years and how it is like whittling at it piece by piece . > Another thing that has been on my mind. When someone in AA would ask me how > I was and I would answer " fine thank you " , they would go ballistic on me. I > can't remember what they used as the acronym for " fine " but I know that it > was a really really bad word to use. Does anyone here remember what it was. > I also remember when people would ask me how I was doing and I said > " terrific " , well they would get ballistic about that one too because " what > you don't have any problems " " what you are cured " " what you are perfect " ? > ad nauseum. FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > I am starting to make some progress. I am no longer 100% convinced that if > I don't go to AA meetings that I will drink and die. As Martha > would say " this is a good thing " . > Also , when I was drinking I loved cider, I have actually loved cider since > I was a little kid. When I was drinking I drank a lot of cider but at times > I don't even think I was drinking it for the alcohol. > Anyhoos, now that I haven't been drinking and of course have been in AA, I > haven't even been able to drink any of the non alcohol cider that you can > get in the grocery stores because they contain minor amounts of alcohol > (for that matter, I haven't been allowed to use mouthwash with alcohol or > cough syrup with alcohol or anything like that) I guess it would be the > equivalent of " near beer " which will of course make me drink volumes of it > and then drink real liqour and then of course I will die. > Now, I have decided that I can have this non alcoholic cider and am > planning on buying some when I get groceries this week. I am actually > excited about this , that I can make this decision for myself and am fairly > (not 100% committed) sure that I won't end up drinking and dying because of it. > It continues to amaze me at how much crap I have been indoctrinated with > over the years and how it is like whittling at it piece by piece . > Another thing that has been on my mind. When someone in AA would ask me how > I was and I would answer " fine thank you " , they would go ballistic on me. I > can't remember what they used as the acronym for " fine " but I know that it > was a really really bad word to use. Does anyone here remember what it was. > I also remember when people would ask me how I was doing and I said > " terrific " , well they would get ballistic about that one too because " what > you don't have any problems " " what you are cured " " what you are perfect " ? > ad nauseum. FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > I am starting to make some progress. I am no longer 100% convinced that if > I don't go to AA meetings that I will drink and die. As Martha > would say " this is a good thing " . > Also , when I was drinking I loved cider, I have actually loved cider since > I was a little kid. When I was drinking I drank a lot of cider but at times > I don't even think I was drinking it for the alcohol. > Anyhoos, now that I haven't been drinking and of course have been in AA, I > haven't even been able to drink any of the non alcohol cider that you can > get in the grocery stores because they contain minor amounts of alcohol > (for that matter, I haven't been allowed to use mouthwash with alcohol or > cough syrup with alcohol or anything like that) I guess it would be the > equivalent of " near beer " which will of course make me drink volumes of it > and then drink real liqour and then of course I will die. > Now, I have decided that I can have this non alcoholic cider and am > planning on buying some when I get groceries this week. I am actually > excited about this , that I can make this decision for myself and am fairly > (not 100% committed) sure that I won't end up drinking and dying because of it. > It continues to amaze me at how much crap I have been indoctrinated with > over the years and how it is like whittling at it piece by piece . > Another thing that has been on my mind. When someone in AA would ask me how > I was and I would answer " fine thank you " , they would go ballistic on me. I > can't remember what they used as the acronym for " fine " but I know that it > was a really really bad word to use. Does anyone here remember what it was. > I also remember when people would ask me how I was doing and I said > " terrific " , well they would get ballistic about that one too because " what > you don't have any problems " " what you are cured " " what you are perfect " ? > ad nauseum. FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. yup , yup, that was the one. I knew there was a potty mouth word at the beginning! I hated that one, I hated that they said it to me. What really bothered me is that I shut down and stopped saying it to people. Honest to the doornob I was feeling fine, I wasn't lying , I wasn't covering something up, I honestly felt fine, I didn't have any big problems, life was going smoothly and so I felt fine. No , no , no , can't have any of that nonsense. I still have a problem saying " fine " , I always expect an AA gestapo to jump in and set me free with the truth you know eh? I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. Never liked beer but loved cider. I will now enjoy my cider (oh excuse me " near cider " )! I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Oh , I am getting there and the more I get there the angrier I get. It is ridiculous , I ain't going to drink mouthwash, I ain't gonna get a high off of mouthwash, it just ain't gonna happen. Here is a great story that you will love. About 25 years ago , my first sponsor had to phone his sponsor long distance because he had eaten a " rum butter " lifesaver (I dunno if you have these in the states but I assume you have lifesavers and " rum butter " lifesavers although named " rum butter " don't taste like rum or have any rum in them, have I made myself clear eh?) and was terrified that he had had a slip and of course would die of alcoholism. Well, thank the doorknob his sponsor told him not to worry that it was only a candy with no alcohol and it didn't matter. On this subject , I have had people absolutely freak out at me when I have had Christmas cake that had alcohol in it (trust me I am not going to have 6.036 pieces of Christmas cake to get high off the fumes of it). Oh and of course there are the restaurant trips where you have to go " does this chicken sauce have wine in it? does this have alcohol in it? it almost becomes like a game and of course you are with AA folk because you don't associate with anyone else and the more questions you ask the fucking waitress about alcohol content, the happier the group is because of course you are doing a damn fine job at being careful. Remember " never leave a drink unattended " ? ha , how many AA people have " accidently " had that experience at a party, when they left a drink unattended *then* took a drink (spit it out of course, right in front of the 200 corporate executives) and called your sponsor immediately but oh oh too late, its over , that alcohol made it from your tongue into your bloodstream , the craving set in and you just had to drink yourself to the point where the next day you woke up in the Bowery and smelled really bad and didn't even have a quarter to call your sponsor . Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. I am realising slowly but surely that it is ridiculous. I suspect also that I will drink later on. Right now, I have given myself the 6 month mark before making any big decisions. I really suspect that because of the very very young age I came into the program (17 and am now 43) that I was not " alcoholic " , I suspect acting out, teenager, confused would probably be closer to the truth. But with AA of course I was programmed to believe that I am going to die if I drink. Its changing though. Trust me the " Near cider " is a really big step for me. Can't wait until I have a chilled cider in the fridge to enjoy! kisses Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. yup , yup, that was the one. I knew there was a potty mouth word at the beginning! I hated that one, I hated that they said it to me. What really bothered me is that I shut down and stopped saying it to people. Honest to the doornob I was feeling fine, I wasn't lying , I wasn't covering something up, I honestly felt fine, I didn't have any big problems, life was going smoothly and so I felt fine. No , no , no , can't have any of that nonsense. I still have a problem saying " fine " , I always expect an AA gestapo to jump in and set me free with the truth you know eh? I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. Never liked beer but loved cider. I will now enjoy my cider (oh excuse me " near cider " )! I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Oh , I am getting there and the more I get there the angrier I get. It is ridiculous , I ain't going to drink mouthwash, I ain't gonna get a high off of mouthwash, it just ain't gonna happen. Here is a great story that you will love. About 25 years ago , my first sponsor had to phone his sponsor long distance because he had eaten a " rum butter " lifesaver (I dunno if you have these in the states but I assume you have lifesavers and " rum butter " lifesavers although named " rum butter " don't taste like rum or have any rum in them, have I made myself clear eh?) and was terrified that he had had a slip and of course would die of alcoholism. Well, thank the doorknob his sponsor told him not to worry that it was only a candy with no alcohol and it didn't matter. On this subject , I have had people absolutely freak out at me when I have had Christmas cake that had alcohol in it (trust me I am not going to have 6.036 pieces of Christmas cake to get high off the fumes of it). Oh and of course there are the restaurant trips where you have to go " does this chicken sauce have wine in it? does this have alcohol in it? it almost becomes like a game and of course you are with AA folk because you don't associate with anyone else and the more questions you ask the fucking waitress about alcohol content, the happier the group is because of course you are doing a damn fine job at being careful. Remember " never leave a drink unattended " ? ha , how many AA people have " accidently " had that experience at a party, when they left a drink unattended *then* took a drink (spit it out of course, right in front of the 200 corporate executives) and called your sponsor immediately but oh oh too late, its over , that alcohol made it from your tongue into your bloodstream , the craving set in and you just had to drink yourself to the point where the next day you woke up in the Bowery and smelled really bad and didn't even have a quarter to call your sponsor . Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. I am realising slowly but surely that it is ridiculous. I suspect also that I will drink later on. Right now, I have given myself the 6 month mark before making any big decisions. I really suspect that because of the very very young age I came into the program (17 and am now 43) that I was not " alcoholic " , I suspect acting out, teenager, confused would probably be closer to the truth. But with AA of course I was programmed to believe that I am going to die if I drink. Its changing though. Trust me the " Near cider " is a really big step for me. Can't wait until I have a chilled cider in the fridge to enjoy! kisses Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 FINE = Fucked-up, Insecure, Neurotic and Emotional. Thats pretty harsh and judgmental, I suppose. yup , yup, that was the one. I knew there was a potty mouth word at the beginning! I hated that one, I hated that they said it to me. What really bothered me is that I shut down and stopped saying it to people. Honest to the doornob I was feeling fine, I wasn't lying , I wasn't covering something up, I honestly felt fine, I didn't have any big problems, life was going smoothly and so I felt fine. No , no , no , can't have any of that nonsense. I still have a problem saying " fine " , I always expect an AA gestapo to jump in and set me free with the truth you know eh? I love cider too. Never enjoyed the kind with alcohol (figured if I am drinking alcohol it might as well be something good, like beer). I get cider from the orchard, its better than the stuff at the store. It's one of the few things I drink besides juice and water. Never liked beer but loved cider. I will now enjoy my cider (oh excuse me " near cider " )! I am glad you are free of AA enough to enjoy some cider! Some day, hopefully, you'll realize just how ridiculous it is to " not be allowed " cider (or mouthwash!) That ridiculousness is probably becoming more apparent to you daily. One day at a time, eh. Oh , I am getting there and the more I get there the angrier I get. It is ridiculous , I ain't going to drink mouthwash, I ain't gonna get a high off of mouthwash, it just ain't gonna happen. Here is a great story that you will love. About 25 years ago , my first sponsor had to phone his sponsor long distance because he had eaten a " rum butter " lifesaver (I dunno if you have these in the states but I assume you have lifesavers and " rum butter " lifesavers although named " rum butter " don't taste like rum or have any rum in them, have I made myself clear eh?) and was terrified that he had had a slip and of course would die of alcoholism. Well, thank the doorknob his sponsor told him not to worry that it was only a candy with no alcohol and it didn't matter. On this subject , I have had people absolutely freak out at me when I have had Christmas cake that had alcohol in it (trust me I am not going to have 6.036 pieces of Christmas cake to get high off the fumes of it). Oh and of course there are the restaurant trips where you have to go " does this chicken sauce have wine in it? does this have alcohol in it? it almost becomes like a game and of course you are with AA folk because you don't associate with anyone else and the more questions you ask the fucking waitress about alcohol content, the happier the group is because of course you are doing a damn fine job at being careful. Remember " never leave a drink unattended " ? ha , how many AA people have " accidently " had that experience at a party, when they left a drink unattended *then* took a drink (spit it out of course, right in front of the 200 corporate executives) and called your sponsor immediately but oh oh too late, its over , that alcohol made it from your tongue into your bloodstream , the craving set in and you just had to drink yourself to the point where the next day you woke up in the Bowery and smelled really bad and didn't even have a quarter to call your sponsor . Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a lot of ridiculous stuff. I am realising slowly but surely that it is ridiculous. I suspect also that I will drink later on. Right now, I have given myself the 6 month mark before making any big decisions. I really suspect that because of the very very young age I came into the program (17 and am now 43) that I was not " alcoholic " , I suspect acting out, teenager, confused would probably be closer to the truth. But with AA of course I was programmed to believe that I am going to die if I drink. Its changing though. Trust me the " Near cider " is a really big step for me. Can't wait until I have a chilled cider in the fridge to enjoy! kisses Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > Shortly after I got sober the man who was my AA sponsor at the time > and some of his pals went to a party where there was a lot of actual > drinking going on. He and his friends brought a lot of n.-a. beer > along. He told a story of how he drank 14 bottles of the stuff and > was dancing and carrying on as if he was drunk. He said he thought he > got a little loopy on the stuff. To which I say, whatever. It was a > big make believe drunk. Silly. > > Enjoy your cider. > He must have got a contact buzz lol... reminds me of a kid who said he got a contact buzz when a bunch of other kids were tripping on acid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > Shortly after I got sober the man who was my AA sponsor at the time > and some of his pals went to a party where there was a lot of actual > drinking going on. He and his friends brought a lot of n.-a. beer > along. He told a story of how he drank 14 bottles of the stuff and > was dancing and carrying on as if he was drunk. He said he thought he > got a little loopy on the stuff. To which I say, whatever. It was a > big make believe drunk. Silly. > > Enjoy your cider. > He must have got a contact buzz lol... reminds me of a kid who said he got a contact buzz when a bunch of other kids were tripping on acid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > > In a message dated 10/12/01 11:52:03 AM, cool_guy@s... writes: > > << Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the > conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness > over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you > unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol > (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your > drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to > think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to > think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday > you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a > lot of ridiculous stuff. >> > > There are many people who arrive in AA without any addiction and are there > because of a DUI, other legal issue, angry spouse who decided to hold an > intervention, etc. But I would think that at least a good percentage of > groupers have had some difficulty in drinking minimally or moderately. Why > else would they be there on their own volition? Assuming one has had > difficulties relating to alcohol, doesn't it defy common sense that they > would refuse to quit? As if they had a disease, perhaps, that made it > impossible not to drink? An error in behaviour or common sense does not necessitate a disease or chronic illness. 50 million Americans voted for Bush, but though their acts defy common sense there is no proof or evidence that they are diseased. Most people show a " shortcoming " of common sense at some time or another, but most do not blame any " disease " for their erroneous (or lack of) thinking. > AA is the foremost moderation program. Even after ten years of programming, > groupers are still fixated on " one day at a time. " If you ask them, " might > you drink tomorrow? The next day? " , the reply is always, " I don't know. I > work the program one day at a time. " When they do drink, they often do so > quite destructively, and call it a " relapse " . Since " relapse is part of > recovery " , what else can one think? I am confused by your post. Are you saying there is nothing ridiculous about these " facts " AA teaches? Also, AA is not a moderation program... it is an abstention program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2001 Report Share Posted October 12, 2001 > > In a message dated 10/12/01 11:52:03 AM, cool_guy@s... writes: > > << Although it probably isn't a good idea until you are way past the > conditioning/brain-washing/what you learned in AA (powerlessness > over alcohol, powerlessness over self) you will eventually (if you > unlearn what you've been taught) be able to drink alcohol > (moderately, or minimally, or however you want) and control your > drinking. Then you will discover just how ridiculous it was to > think you couldn't. And you'll realize how ridiculous it was to > think you would die if you didn't stay " sober " in AA. And someday > you'll realize how ridiculous the disease theory is. AA teaches a > lot of ridiculous stuff. >> > > There are many people who arrive in AA without any addiction and are there > because of a DUI, other legal issue, angry spouse who decided to hold an > intervention, etc. But I would think that at least a good percentage of > groupers have had some difficulty in drinking minimally or moderately. Why > else would they be there on their own volition? Assuming one has had > difficulties relating to alcohol, doesn't it defy common sense that they > would refuse to quit? As if they had a disease, perhaps, that made it > impossible not to drink? An error in behaviour or common sense does not necessitate a disease or chronic illness. 50 million Americans voted for Bush, but though their acts defy common sense there is no proof or evidence that they are diseased. Most people show a " shortcoming " of common sense at some time or another, but most do not blame any " disease " for their erroneous (or lack of) thinking. > AA is the foremost moderation program. Even after ten years of programming, > groupers are still fixated on " one day at a time. " If you ask them, " might > you drink tomorrow? The next day? " , the reply is always, " I don't know. I > work the program one day at a time. " When they do drink, they often do so > quite destructively, and call it a " relapse " . Since " relapse is part of > recovery " , what else can one think? I am confused by your post. Are you saying there is nothing ridiculous about these " facts " AA teaches? Also, AA is not a moderation program... it is an abstention program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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