Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 Hi all, Tomorrow I am going to get a massage and was wondering if anyone had any articles or information that I should give the massage therapist about EDS III? I am not sure what else I need to tell her other than that I have very loose joints. This is our first session, we have had to reschedule several times. Any advice about information to give her would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 I live in Arizona, just outside of Phoenix. She runs her own massage office, not in conjuction with any medical clinics. I would like a combination of relaxation massage and problem massage. For the problem massage I would like my hips to be worked, they have been giving me more problems lately. What benefits are there to range of motion testing? thanks jen > The three main concerns I have for bodywork when dealing with EDS > are fragile skin, easy bruising, and using extra caution when doing > any form of stretching, joint mobilization or range of motion > testing. If the first two are concerns, I do not recommend any > really deep tissue work. As for range of motion testing, this really > has to be done slowly and carefully. By definition with > hypermobility, your joint range will exceed the norm. More > importantly, one of your shoulders or hips can easily be moved to > the point where extra, excessive, stress is inadvertantly placed on > the tendons and ligaments of that joint. You might not feel it at > the time, but you could have problems from it later. > > The other thing to remember is that everyone's pain tolerance is > different. It is not right. It is not wrong. It is just theirs. > Give your therapist feedback. If the pressure is too deep or a > stretch is uncomfortable, speak up and ask them to ease back. And if > they won't, do not ever hesitate to end the session right on the > spot. > > The other thing I would recommend is that you ask your therapist > right up front what types of training they have had. Is it just the > minimum level to meet their licensing requirements (assuming you are > in one of the 35 or so states that does have a state wide license) > or have they taken any extra training post-grad, and if so, what. > > I can't give you much more detail without knowing more about your > specific situation. Depending on what you are after, there are quite > a few different things I could recommend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 I live in Arizona, just outside of Phoenix. She runs her own massage office, not in conjuction with any medical clinics. I would like a combination of relaxation massage and problem massage. For the problem massage I would like my hips to be worked, they have been giving me more problems lately. What benefits are there to range of motion testing? thanks jen > The three main concerns I have for bodywork when dealing with EDS > are fragile skin, easy bruising, and using extra caution when doing > any form of stretching, joint mobilization or range of motion > testing. If the first two are concerns, I do not recommend any > really deep tissue work. As for range of motion testing, this really > has to be done slowly and carefully. By definition with > hypermobility, your joint range will exceed the norm. More > importantly, one of your shoulders or hips can easily be moved to > the point where extra, excessive, stress is inadvertantly placed on > the tendons and ligaments of that joint. You might not feel it at > the time, but you could have problems from it later. > > The other thing to remember is that everyone's pain tolerance is > different. It is not right. It is not wrong. It is just theirs. > Give your therapist feedback. If the pressure is too deep or a > stretch is uncomfortable, speak up and ask them to ease back. And if > they won't, do not ever hesitate to end the session right on the > spot. > > The other thing I would recommend is that you ask your therapist > right up front what types of training they have had. Is it just the > minimum level to meet their licensing requirements (assuming you are > in one of the 35 or so states that does have a state wide license) > or have they taken any extra training post-grad, and if so, what. > > I can't give you much more detail without knowing more about your > specific situation. Depending on what you are after, there are quite > a few different things I could recommend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 I live in Arizona, just outside of Phoenix. She runs her own massage office, not in conjuction with any medical clinics. I would like a combination of relaxation massage and problem massage. For the problem massage I would like my hips to be worked, they have been giving me more problems lately. > > What benefits are there to range of motion testing? > > thanks > jen OK - I just checked. Arizona is not one of the states with state licensing. At present, 36 states have state-wide licensing. Minimum hours of training run from as little as 250 to as high as 1000. The recommended minimum by the massage certification groups is 500. Most states follow this, but there is a wide range. For states without a state board and license, the general rule is that massage and bodywork falls under the vice laws, with all the onerus, offensive implications of those laws. Consequently, it is a total hodge-podge in those jurisdications, with licenses usually being handled by the individual city or county. That doesn't mean you are not going to find qualified practitioners in " non-license " states because you most certainly will. I know from first hand knowledge that Arizona has some outstanding practitioners. It just means that you don't have a minimum standard to use as a guide. And even in jurisdictions with the highest minimums there is no guarantee of getting a good one. One of the worst massages I have had in the last two years was in British Columbia where the requirement is 3000 hours. What it means is that you just have to ask more questions up front. You can't assume that they have had specific training in any given areas. In Washington, we have a set number of hours we have to take in Anatomy, Physiology, and Kineseology in addition to Massage Theory and Practice. And this is just the minimum. Depending on where someone takes their training, they might have just that. Other schools might require 800-1000 hours to graduate. As an example, I only needed 500 hours to meet the state requirements. However, I had to have over 800 to graduate - and I couldn't sit for the exam without having my graduation certificate in hand. If I were in your shoes, the questions I would ask would be the extent of training (number of hours and in what subjects) and the years in practice. I would also ask about specific training or experience in dealing with whatever is bothering you on your hips. Believe me, if someone has taken the time to get the training, they are going to be more than happy to tell you about it. If they can't or won't answer your questions, this would be a real red flag in my book. If you can give me a better idea of what your hips are doing or not doing that is causing the problem, I might be able to give you a bit more specific guidance on what to look out for or against. As for benefits of range of motion testing, there are actually quite a few, as long as the testing is justified in the first place. Using the hip as an example, there are six specific motions that the hip does (flexion and extension, lateral and medial rotation, abduction and adduction). There are over two dozen different muscles involved in performing these actions. There is also something called " end feel. " Basically, this tests how far a joint will move in any given action before it " stops. " There is a hard end feel (movement stopped by bone to bone contact) or a soft end feel (movement stopped because of muscle resistance.) Range of motion testing helps the therapist determine what the problem is and which muscle or muscles are involved. The reason why extreme care has to be taken with range of motion testing for someone with EDS is that the connective tissue which stabilizes the joint and literally holds it in place is weak and defective. It is too easy to not get the expected end feel and the therapist can unintentionally and inadvertantly move the limb to the point where a subluxation or actual dislocation occurs either during the test or afterwards. That doesn't mean that the testing can't be done - it just means that it has to be done slowly and carefully. And YOU have to monitor what is happening and be prepared at any time to say - enough. Don't go any further. Let me know if I can be of any further help on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 I live in Arizona, just outside of Phoenix. She runs her own massage office, not in conjuction with any medical clinics. I would like a combination of relaxation massage and problem massage. For the problem massage I would like my hips to be worked, they have been giving me more problems lately. > > What benefits are there to range of motion testing? > > thanks > jen OK - I just checked. Arizona is not one of the states with state licensing. At present, 36 states have state-wide licensing. Minimum hours of training run from as little as 250 to as high as 1000. The recommended minimum by the massage certification groups is 500. Most states follow this, but there is a wide range. For states without a state board and license, the general rule is that massage and bodywork falls under the vice laws, with all the onerus, offensive implications of those laws. Consequently, it is a total hodge-podge in those jurisdications, with licenses usually being handled by the individual city or county. That doesn't mean you are not going to find qualified practitioners in " non-license " states because you most certainly will. I know from first hand knowledge that Arizona has some outstanding practitioners. It just means that you don't have a minimum standard to use as a guide. And even in jurisdictions with the highest minimums there is no guarantee of getting a good one. One of the worst massages I have had in the last two years was in British Columbia where the requirement is 3000 hours. What it means is that you just have to ask more questions up front. You can't assume that they have had specific training in any given areas. In Washington, we have a set number of hours we have to take in Anatomy, Physiology, and Kineseology in addition to Massage Theory and Practice. And this is just the minimum. Depending on where someone takes their training, they might have just that. Other schools might require 800-1000 hours to graduate. As an example, I only needed 500 hours to meet the state requirements. However, I had to have over 800 to graduate - and I couldn't sit for the exam without having my graduation certificate in hand. If I were in your shoes, the questions I would ask would be the extent of training (number of hours and in what subjects) and the years in practice. I would also ask about specific training or experience in dealing with whatever is bothering you on your hips. Believe me, if someone has taken the time to get the training, they are going to be more than happy to tell you about it. If they can't or won't answer your questions, this would be a real red flag in my book. If you can give me a better idea of what your hips are doing or not doing that is causing the problem, I might be able to give you a bit more specific guidance on what to look out for or against. As for benefits of range of motion testing, there are actually quite a few, as long as the testing is justified in the first place. Using the hip as an example, there are six specific motions that the hip does (flexion and extension, lateral and medial rotation, abduction and adduction). There are over two dozen different muscles involved in performing these actions. There is also something called " end feel. " Basically, this tests how far a joint will move in any given action before it " stops. " There is a hard end feel (movement stopped by bone to bone contact) or a soft end feel (movement stopped because of muscle resistance.) Range of motion testing helps the therapist determine what the problem is and which muscle or muscles are involved. The reason why extreme care has to be taken with range of motion testing for someone with EDS is that the connective tissue which stabilizes the joint and literally holds it in place is weak and defective. It is too easy to not get the expected end feel and the therapist can unintentionally and inadvertantly move the limb to the point where a subluxation or actual dislocation occurs either during the test or afterwards. That doesn't mean that the testing can't be done - it just means that it has to be done slowly and carefully. And YOU have to monitor what is happening and be prepared at any time to say - enough. Don't go any further. Let me know if I can be of any further help on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 Mike, Thank you so much for your reply. As for my hips, I am not completely sure what is going on with them. They have been subluxing more than usual lately. They also crack and pop with each movement. During the day they start hurting for no reason, or atleast not a reason that i have been able to figure out yet. it is normally after i have been sitting for a while, i have to keep changing the postition i sit it. Last night when i was getting up from laying down my left hip subluxed (normally it is my right one that does this) as i was putting weight on it, which caused me to fall down. of course my husband came running when he heard me fall, he helped me up, and I was able to put weight on it with mild pain. I just assumed this was normal EDS hip problems. Jen > OK - I just checked. Arizona is not one of the states with state > licensing. At present, 36 states have state-wide licensing. Minimum > hours of training run from as little as 250 to as high as 1000. The > recommended minimum by the massage certification groups is 500. Most > states follow this, but there is a wide range. > > For states without a state board and license, the general rule is > that massage and bodywork falls under the vice laws, with all the > onerus, offensive implications of those laws. Consequently, it is a > total hodge-podge in those jurisdications, with licenses usually > being handled by the individual city or county. > > That doesn't mean you are not going to find qualified practitioners > in " non-license " states because you most certainly will. I know > from first hand knowledge that Arizona has some outstanding > practitioners. It just means that you don't have a minimum standard > to use as a guide. And even in jurisdictions with the highest > minimums there is no guarantee of getting a good one. One of the > worst massages I have had in the last two years was in British > Columbia where the requirement is 3000 hours. > > What it means is that you just have to ask more questions up front. > You can't assume that they have had specific training in any given > areas. In Washington, we have a set number of hours we have to take > in Anatomy, Physiology, and Kineseology in addition to Massage > Theory and Practice. And this is just the minimum. Depending on > where someone takes their training, they might have just that. > Other schools might require 800-1000 hours to graduate. As an > example, I only needed 500 hours to meet the state requirements. > However, I had to have over 800 to graduate - and I couldn't sit for > the exam without having my graduation certificate in hand. > > If I were in your shoes, the questions I would ask would be the > extent of training (number of hours and in what subjects) and the > years in practice. I would also ask about specific training or > experience in dealing with whatever is bothering you on your hips. > Believe me, if someone has taken the time to get the training, they > are going to be more than happy to tell you about it. If they can't > or won't answer your questions, this would be a real red flag in my > book. > > If you can give me a better idea of what your hips are doing or not > doing that is causing the problem, I might be able to give you a bit > more specific guidance on what to look out for or against. > > As for benefits of range of motion testing, there are actually quite > a few, as long as the testing is justified in the first place. Using > the hip as an example, there are six specific motions that the hip > does (flexion and extension, lateral and medial rotation, abduction > and adduction). There are over two dozen different muscles involved > in performing these actions. There is also something called " end > feel. " Basically, this tests how far a joint will move in any given > action before it " stops. " There is a hard end feel (movement > stopped by bone to bone contact) or a soft end feel (movement > stopped because of muscle resistance.) Range of motion testing helps > the therapist determine what the problem is and which muscle or > muscles are involved. > > The reason why extreme care has to be taken with range of motion > testing for someone with EDS is that the connective tissue which > stabilizes the joint and literally holds it in place is weak and > defective. It is too easy to not get the expected end feel and the > therapist can unintentionally and inadvertantly move the limb to the > point where a subluxation or actual dislocation occurs either during > the test or afterwards. That doesn't mean that the testing can't be > done - it just means that it has to be done slowly and carefully. > And YOU have to monitor what is happening and be prepared at any > time to say - enough. Don't go any further. > > Let me know if I can be of any further help on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2004 Report Share Posted January 10, 2004 All this talk of a massage therapist, makes me want one. Jill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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