Re: Terrified that there is more than Apraxia

[Guest guest]

A dev psych told me pretend play comes in between 18-24 mos but my

pediatrician said it's closer to age 3. Forgive me because I don't

know much about ABA, but if they are taught pretend play using ABA,

are they really pretending or just modelling the behavior they were

taught? This goes back to my " does it count if you have to teach

them " question. Sorry, I'm just trying to make sure.

Don't get upset over this...My son

> > @ 3y.o. was not playing to his SLP's

> > > liking either and even when I took him to the dev.

pediatrician at

> > 3y.o.,

> > > she expressed concern, but told me to play pretend with him as

> > much as

> > > possible. I went out and bought him a doll, a doll-house,

pretend

> > foods,

> > > puppets...and did just that. I found that the more he obtained

> > Speech, the

> > > more the pretend play manifested itself. Now at 4.5 y.o., he is

> > constantly

> > > pretend playing and having these pretend conversations back and

> > forth with

> > > his toys...so, it's the language factor...(in my case). My son

is

> > > intelligible only about 50% of the time..he speaks 4-6 word

> > phrases and

> > > cannot yet dialogue but he is pretend playing. So, give it a

> > chance. I

> > > think professionals today are labeling children too quickly

with

> > Autism &

> > > PDD and not taking into account other factors like their

> > immaturity and

> > > lack of Speech into play. Don't be SCARED! You would know as

his

> > mother if

> > > there was something more than the Apraxia to deal with...

> > >

> > > " april_twin_mom "

> > > <april_twin_mom@

> > > m> cc:

> > > Sent by: Subject: [ ] Terrified that there is

> > more than Apraxia

> > > @yaho

> > > ogroups.com

> > >

> > >

> > > 06/13/2006 01:22 PM

> > > Please respond to

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I have 2 year old twin boys who have been in speech thereapy

since

> > > October. The speech therepist and their special ed teacher are

both

> > > leaning toward apraxia. To get a diagnoses the boys need to

see a

> > > developmental pediatrician...the appointment is 4 months away.

Both

> > > teacher DO NOT see any sines of autism or any other PDD

problems.

> > The

> > > special ed teach has said she is concerned about the way they

play

> > > with toys. They don't do anyhitng autistic weird, but they do

not

> > > pretend as much as she thinks 2 year olds should. They still do

> > mouth

> > > a lot of ites, but the speech therepist said the the apraxic

girl

> > she

> > > just finished working with always did too. It is just so long

to

> > wait

> > > for that 4 month visit, to " rule out " everything. I'm just

> > scared...

> > > Does anyone have anything they can tell me?

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

My daughter's slp's have made a big deal out of the pretend play thing

for a while. Each time she improved the current slp still thought it

wasn't enought. I provided the toys, etc but no success. Then I had

an idea....

I encouraged pretend play with my daughter by letting her watch me.

She was big into imitating so I would take one of her dolls and

rock/feed/burb it. I put the doll at the dinner table every night and

would " feed the baby " some of my dinner. I gave the baby something to

drink, etc. Day after day, night after night, I took care of the baby.

I didn't say much to Grace about what I was doing or make a big

deal. I'd just say " here baby, time to eat. " or something like that.

All of a sudden things clicked after about 10 days and my daughter

started taking care of the baby by feeding, etc. Now pretend play is a

strength, not a weakness, per the slp and its only been about 3 months.

I think my daughter just needed to observe someone providing care for

the baby dolls for her to know what to " pretend " (she's an only child

and hasn't been around many babies).

Kris

On Jun 13, 2006, at 10:53 AM, myra.bauza@... wrote:

>> Don't get upset over this...My son @ 3y.o. was not playing to his

>> SLP's

>> liking either and even when I took him to the dev. pediatrician at

>> 3y.o.,

>> she expressed concern, but told me to play pretend with him as much

>> as

>> possible. I went out and bought him a doll, a doll-house, pretend

>> foods,

>> puppets...and did just that. I found that the more he obtained

>> Speech, the

>> more the pretend play manifested itself. Now at 4.5 y.o., he is

>> constantly

>> pretend playing and having these pretend conversations back and

>> forth with

>> his toys...so, it's the language factor...(in my case). My son is

>> intelligible only about 50% of the time..he speaks 4-6 word phrases

>> and

>> cannot yet dialogue but he is pretend playing. So, give it a chance.

>> I

>> think professionals today are labeling children too quickly with

>> Autism &

>> PDD and not taking into account other factors like their immaturity

>> and

>> lack of Speech into play. Don't be SCARED! You would know as his

>> mother if

>> there was something more than the Apraxia to deal with...

>>

>> " april_twin_mom "

>> <april_twin_mom@...

>> m> cc:

>> Sent by: Subject: [ ] Terrified that there is more

>> than Apraxia

>> @yaho

>> ogroups.com

>>

>>

>> 06/13/2006 01:22 PM

>> Please respond to

>>

>>

>>

>>

>> I have 2 year old twin boys who have been in speech thereapy since

>> October. The speech therepist and their special ed teacher are both

>> leaning toward apraxia. To get a diagnoses the boys need to see a

>> developmental pediatrician...the appointment is 4 months away. Both

>> teacher DO NOT see any sines of autism or any other PDD problems. The

>> special ed teach has said she is concerned about the way they play

>> with toys. They don't do anyhitng autistic weird, but they do not

>> pretend as much as she thinks 2 year olds should. They still do mouth

>> a lot of ites, but the speech therepist said the the apraxic girl she

>> just finished working with always did too. It is just so long to wait

>> for that 4 month visit, to " rule out " everything. I'm just scared...

>> Does anyone have anything they can tell me?

>>

[Guest guest]

Many kids with high functioning autism and Asperger's have the

*desire* to interact, but not the skills to interact. Social

interaction (and the skills to interact socially) becomes amazingly

complex even by early elementary age. At one of my local support

groups, I recently had a chance to hear a couple of high school kids

with Asperger's/HFA talk about how hard it was to be made fun of and

be ostracized - they want to fit in and have friends, but it's hard

for them. A kid may want to play with others, but if they can't relate

appropriately and pick up on social cues, other kids will think they

are weird and reject them, or they just won't know how to join in. One

thing we taught my son in ABA was how to approach other children to

join in their play, have a conversation, invite another child to play,

etc. Picking up on unspoken messages (body language, facial gestures

and so on) is hard for children with autism.

> > >

> > > ,

> > >

> > > Do you think that the ASD dx for your daughter was correct since

> it

> > > was later dropped? I didn't think you could " outgrow " autism,

> > > though the more I learn about ASD and PDD the more confused I

> > > become. What therapies (prescribed b/c of her dx) do you think

> > > helped your daughter? And if you don't mind my asking, how was

> your

> > > children's play " abnormal " ? I'm trying to judge the normalcy of

> my

> > > child's play.

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > > Kristi

[Guest guest]

Based on the children I've seen at my children's preschools, I feel a

little dubious about your pediatrician's view. Pretend play is common

before age 2 - this is what we were told by our neuropsychologist and

neurologist, and it's part of the basis for the CHAT autism screening,

which has been shown to be quite accurate. Google " CHAT autism " if you

want to see the CHAT.

Initially they may model behavior and imitate (which can be a valuable

skill also), but then you work on generalizing any skill learned in

ABA. If you and your child practice pretending to hop like a bunny,

scratch and wag your tail like a dog, and jump like a frog, and then

your child later whinnies and gallops like a horse at his/her

playgroup, then (s)he has generalized, because you didn't teach

him/her to pretend to be a horse. After a while in therapy you don't

*show* the child how to pretend to do X, you just say, " pretend to do

X/pretend you are a X " , and see if they can do it. Then you work on

making the pretense more complex, e.g., " pretend that you are a

fireman putting out a fire " , etc.

> >

> > Joint attention and pretend play are commonly taught skills in ABA

> > therapy for children with autism. If a child doesn't do these

> things,

> > he/she needs to be taught. Pointing and pretend play are

> prominently

> > featured on the CHAT screening test that is given by some

> > pediatricians at 18 months (by that time, these skills should be

> > developed).

> >

> >