HELP! (what is AV therapy?)

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Well, here goes. They called an IEP meeting yesterday for tomorrow, and yes, I

know by law they have to give us 5 days notice, but my husband just wants to get

in there and get something started, and we'll call another one right away if we

have to. So here I am up at 1:30 am trying to sleep, but I can't.

I went to e in MA yesterday and learned even about the services Bobby isn't

getting at the public school. I feel like I have a really good understanding of

what I want as far as a comprehensive evaluation done by members of a team of

deaf and hard of hearing teachers. I'm OK with that. But the other part I'm

not as clear on is the AV therapy. The person I spoke to at Soundbridge, the

place my school consults with for hearing impaired kids, recommended that we

fight for AV therapy because if the region doesn't agree to us to getting an

outside evaluation (they want to do it in house), she said several sessions of

AV therapy would give then a really good picture of how he can communicate, how

he can retrieve information, what he understands and how he processes

information. I don't know much about AV therapy at all, and please forgive me

if this is one of those taboo topics for this list, since I don't know anything

about it, I don't know if it is a no no to ask about it. All I know is that

it's an individual one on one with the parent kind of therapy. My search on the

web wasn't too helpful.

I'm wondering if anyone can help explain what AV therapy is, what it does, and

what my argument can be that we want this...because I have a feeling they're

going to fight us on everything.

My son has a mod/severe SNHL in one ear, and a high frequency loss in the

other. We just got the hearing aid for the " good " ear yesterday. The " bad " ear

has only been aided since Oct. We only found out about this loss in Oct, when

he was already 5 1/2 yrs old. Briefly, the loss is stable, and he had some loss

at 3 months of age from ototoxic meds, but we didn't know it, and when he had

another heart surgery last May, he received more ototoxic meds, which made the

loss worse. 5 months later we discovered it. He speaks very well, but his

comprehension stinks. Just last night I was telling him something about a

mechanic, and he kept saying what, but I knew he could hear me, and I asked him

to repeat back what he heard, and he had no idea what a mechanic was. He's

almost 6. They'll expect that he has that kind of knowledge when he starts

kindergarten next year, and he has gaps in understanding that in my opinion will

put him at a huge disadvantage with his hearing peers. But they want to give

him speech only 1 hr/wk, plus a resource teacher. I'm fighting for more.

So if anyone can help me with an argument for AV therapy, or knows a clear

simple web site I can read, I would greatly appreciate it. I have till 10:00

EST Friday (yes, today) to understand this.

Thanks, and again I will apologize in advance if I am asking something that

isn't appropriate.

Trish, mom to Bobby

[Guest guest]

Trish-

AV therapy stands for auditory-verbal therapy (AVT). It is one of the

communication methods available for people with hearing loss (so, no,

not a taboo subject!). In AVT, the therapist (who has been trained and

completed an intense certification process) guides both the parent and

the child to maximize listening skills without the use of visual cues

(like lip reading).

There are 10 unique principles of AVT; you can read about them at

http://www.auditory-verbal.org/avi_principles.asp. Please note that

this organization, AVI, recently opted to rejoin AGBell, which is why

there is talk of dissolution on the site. The site now has mostly

information about how to become certified (you can read through this

too, to see how they differ from traditional SLPs, but essentially a

person has to first have a masters in speech-language, audiology or be a

certified teacher of the deaf before they can begin the process of

becoming a certified AVT).

There are several large centers where AVT is offered, and many other

individual therapists around the world. You can view some of the

centers' websites at:

http://www.avc-atlanta.org/

http://www.learningtolisten.org/

http://www.nciohio.com/

This is just a small sampling of some of the places that have pretty

extensive websites. If you go back to the AVI website

(www.auditory-verbal.org) you can locate a local therapist through

there. Soundbridge's AVT program is discussed at

http://www.crec.org/ss/divisionunits/soundbridge/programs/avt.shtml

I'm going to email you privately some attachments that help articulate

the difference between auditory-oral (like e and Soundbridge's A/O

program) and auditory-verbal.

Kerry

HELP! (what is AV therapy?)

Hi,

Well, here goes. They called an IEP meeting yesterday for tomorrow, and

yes, I know by law they have to give us 5 days notice, but my husband

just wants to get in there and get something started, and we'll call

another one right away if we have to. So here I am up at 1:30 am trying

to sleep, but I can't.

I went to e in MA yesterday and learned even about the services

Bobby isn't getting at the public school. I feel like I have a really

good understanding of what I want as far as a comprehensive evaluation

done by members of a team of deaf and hard of hearing teachers. I'm OK

with that. But the other part I'm not as clear on is the AV therapy.

The person I spoke to at Soundbridge, the place my school consults with

for hearing impaired kids, recommended that we fight for AV therapy

because if the region doesn't agree to us to getting an outside

evaluation (they want to do it in house), she said several sessions of

AV therapy would give then a really good picture of how he can

communicate, how he can retrieve information, what he understands and

how he processes information. I don't know much about AV therapy at

all, and please forgive me if this is one of those taboo topics for this

list, since I don't know anything about it, I don't know if it is a no

no to ask about it. All I know is that it's an individual one on one

with the parent kind of therapy. My search on the web wasn't too

helpful.

I'm wondering if anyone can help explain what AV therapy is, what it

does, and what my argument can be that we want this...because I have a

feeling they're going to fight us on everything.

My son has a mod/severe SNHL in one ear, and a high frequency loss in

the other. We just got the hearing aid for the " good " ear yesterday.

The " bad " ear has only been aided since Oct. We only found out about

this loss in Oct, when he was already 5 1/2 yrs old. Briefly, the loss

is stable, and he had some loss at 3 months of age from ototoxic meds,

but we didn't know it, and when he had another heart surgery last May,

he received more ototoxic meds, which made the loss worse. 5 months

later we discovered it. He speaks very well, but his comprehension

stinks. Just last night I was telling him something about a mechanic,

and he kept saying what, but I knew he could hear me, and I asked him to

repeat back what he heard, and he had no idea what a mechanic was. He's

almost 6. They'll expect that he has that kind of knowledge when he

starts kindergarten next year, and he has gaps in understanding that in

my opinion will put him at a huge disadvantage with his hearing peers.

But they want to give him speech only 1 hr/wk, plus a resource teacher.

I'm fighting for more.

So if anyone can help me with an argument for AV therapy, or knows a

clear simple web site I can read, I would greatly appreciate it. I have

till 10:00 EST Friday (yes, today) to understand this.

Thanks, and again I will apologize in advance if I am asking something

that isn't appropriate.

Trish, mom to Bobby

[Guest guest]

When I went to the link, it said this page was no longer in use. I really want

to read this...any other way of getting at whatever it is you saw?

Thanks so much!

Trish

Trish-

AV therapy stands for auditory-verbal therapy (AVT). It is one of the

communication methods available for people with hearing loss (so, no,

not a taboo subject!). In AVT, the therapist (who has been trained and

completed an intense certification process) guides both the parent and

the child to maximize listening skills without the use of visual cues

(like lip reading).

There are 10 unique principles of AVT; you can read about them at

http://www.auditory-verbal.org/avi_principles.asp. Please note that

this organization, AVI, recently opted to rejoin AGBell, which is why

there is talk of dissolution on the site. The site now has mostly

information about how to become certified (you can read through this

too, to see how they differ from traditional SLPs, but essentially a

person has to first have a masters in speech-language, audiology or be a

certified teacher of the deaf before they can begin the process of

becoming a certified AVT).

[Guest guest]

Trish,

I was just looking at it this morning. You can get into it from the

home page:

http://www.auditory-verbal.org/

Then click " New Principles of AVT "

The unique principles are also listed on all of the center websites I

emailed earlier, including here: http://www.avcclisten.com/avt.html

Kerry

Re: HELP! (what is AV therapy?)

When I went to the link, it said this page was no longer in use. I

really want to read this...any other way of getting at whatever it is

you saw?

Thanks so much!

Trish

Trish-

AV therapy stands for auditory-verbal therapy (AVT). It is one of the

communication methods available for people with hearing loss (so, no,

not a taboo subject!). In AVT, the therapist (who has been trained

and

completed an intense certification process) guides both the parent and

the child to maximize listening skills without the use of visual cues

(like lip reading).

There are 10 unique principles of AVT; you can read about them at

http://www.auditory-verbal.org/avi_principles.asp. Please note that

this organization, AVI, recently opted to rejoin AGBell, which is why

there is talk of dissolution on the site. The site now has mostly

information about how to become certified (you can read through this

too, to see how they differ from traditional SLPs, but essentially a

person has to first have a masters in speech-language, audiology or be

a

certified teacher of the deaf before they can begin the process of

becoming a certified AVT).

[Guest guest]

Ya gotta use the groups resources. Start at

http://www.listen-up.org/oral/a-v.htm. Then, the CT AG Bell chapter

has a pretty good library of resources which we keep at Soundbridge.

It will fill in a lot more details.

Then find out exactly what tests they are going to do " in house " Ask

if they are normed for kids with hearing loss. Most aren't which

doesn't necessarily mean they aren't valuable, but it will make the

school nervous. Then ask them to consult with Soundbridge about what

evaluations need to be done to get a good picture for your son. In

districts that don't work with many kids who have hearing loss and who

are oral it tends to be preferred seating and a half hour twice a week

with the schools SLP who has only worked with two kids with hearing

loss in the past and both of them used ASL.

Then call me next week.

JMF

[Guest guest]

I'll try to make this brief. AV and auditory oral usually have the same results

and the differences while real, are somewhat disappearing due to the revolution

in CI and hearing aids. Either one would serve him well. So most everything I

say here you could use to argue for auditory oral as well.

AVT teaches the child to use the hearing they have to build their brain's

auditory and language structures and pathways. They literally " learn to listen "

There are a group of auditory skills that are developed pretty automatically in

kids with good hearing. With a hearing impaired child, even after you use

technology to improve their hearing, you still need to teach them these auditory

skills. These are things like auditory memory, auditory sequencing, phonemic

awareness etc. Typical kids learn language automatically but again with hearing

impaired kids, this needs to be intentionally taught. So you emphasize input

- pumping as much language and listening into their brain as you can. You are

using the natuaral developmental way for Bobby to learn language, but instead of

NOT using the auditory pathway and doing visual, you do what it takes to get

the language and listening skills built. Its like the computer saying " GIGO " -

garbage in, garbage out. When you realize the hearing loss is there, you've

been having " garbage in " through the auditory path, so you starting inputting

more, clearer language by listening becasue that's how verbal language is

learned/works. Input always precedes output. So that is why " speech " is not

what Bobby needs right now - you don't need to work on tuning up his output, he

needs input so that he both builds his brain and builds his language. An hour

with a speech person working on his articulation and a resource teacher that

doesn't know how to build his brain or fill in his language gaps isn't what he

needs. Typical kids learn language in a social setting - not an educational

setting. So AVT tries to duplicate that by coaching the parent to teach the

child language. The parent, child and therapist meet weekly and a lesson plan

is gone over and practiced by the parent. They then go home and do two things:

1. They implement that lesson daily and 2. They turn their child's environment

into a lanugage learning, language " pumping " in environment. You learn how far

the child can hear and how to best optimize his chances to learn language 24/7.

With the Soundbridge program, it sounds like they also train the teacher to

contribute to the input going into Bobby. So that is a win, win situation. In

auditory oral, more of the work is done by the teacher (they have the chld 5

days per week and the whole time they are working on language and concepts) and

less by the parent. In AV, the therapist coaches the parent/teacher how to do

the same things only it is for every waking hour not just school time. AV works

primarily on the language end and gives the child the tools to be able to

function in the mainstream. Auditory Oral does the same thing but doesn't

mainstream as early.

Oh, and AVT emphasizes the building blocks for literacy and actually

intentionally builds those building blocks. The philosophy is that reading is

just a written form of the language. If they don't know the lanugage and the

concepts, vocabulary etc they won't be able to learn to read. So the expected

outcome of AVT and oral is literacy - on grade level!!

Hope this helps.

HELP! (what is AV therapy?)

>

>Hi,

>

>Well, here goes. They called an IEP meeting yesterday for tomorrow, and yes, I

know by law they have to give us 5 days notice, but my husband just wants to get

in there and get something started, and we'll call another one right away if we

have to. So here I am up at 1:30 am trying to sleep, but I can't.

>

>I went to e in MA yesterday and learned even about the services Bobby

isn't getting at the public school. I feel like I have a really good

understanding of what I want as far as a comprehensive evaluation done by

members of a team of deaf and hard of hearing teachers. I'm OK with that. But

the other part I'm not as clear on is the AV therapy. The person I spoke to at

Soundbridge, the place my school consults with for hearing impaired kids,

recommended that we fight for AV therapy because if the region doesn't agree to

us to getting an outside evaluation (they want to do it in house), she said

several sessions of AV therapy would give then a really good picture of how he

can communicate, how he can retrieve information, what he understands and how he

processes information. I don't know much about AV therapy at all, and please

forgive me if this is one of those taboo topics for this list, since I don't

know anything about it, I don't know if it is a no no to ask about it. All I

know is that it's an individual one on one with the parent kind of therapy. My

search on the web wasn't too helpful.

>

>I'm wondering if anyone can help explain what AV therapy is, what it does, and

what my argument can be that we want this...because I have a feeling they're

going to fight us on everything.

>

>My son has a mod/severe SNHL in one ear, and a high frequency loss in the

other. We just got the hearing aid for the " good " ear yesterday. The " bad " ear

has only been aided since Oct. We only found out about this loss in Oct, when

he was already 5 1/2 yrs old. Briefly, the loss is stable, and he had some loss

at 3 months of age from ototoxic meds, but we didn't know it, and when he had

another heart surgery last May, he received more ototoxic meds, which made the

loss worse. 5 months later we discovered it. He speaks very well, but his

comprehension stinks. Just last night I was telling him something about a

mechanic, and he kept saying what, but I knew he could hear me, and I asked him

to repeat back what he heard, and he had no idea what a mechanic was. He's

almost 6. They'll expect that he has that kind of knowledge when he starts

kindergarten next year, and he has gaps in understanding that in my opinion will

put him at a huge disadvantage with his hearing peers. But they want to give

him speech only 1 hr/wk, plus a resource teacher. I'm fighting for more.

>

>So if anyone can help me with an argument for AV therapy, or knows a clear

simple web site I can read, I would greatly appreciate it. I have till 10:00

EST Friday (yes, today) to understand this.

>

>Thanks, and again I will apologize in advance if I am asking something that

isn't appropriate.

>

>Trish, mom to Bobby

>

>

[Guest guest]

<

>

I think that depends on where you are going to school. For Neal I would have to

say that the philosophy of teaching the parent to live the " lifestyle " every

waking hour was just as prevalent as if he had had an AV therapist. Yet he was

in an auditory oral school. So to me, I had a partner (in the school and the

teachers and therapists there) who really knew what they were doing the whole

time and communicated to the parents exactly what that was, and then it was up

to us to continue it at home. Probably that's not the case in every auditory

oral setting, but it clearly can be. The thing I like about this approach is

that as a parent, you get to go to meetings and such with other parents going

through the same stuff. You also get to know all of these other kids and watch

them progress. It was nice to have those three years with Neal going to school

with other oral deaf kids and learning what to do for him along with other

parents of oral deaf kids. Not knocking AV therapy at all. I'm sure I could

praise things about it just as much if that had been what we did. I'm just

pointing out that I liked the social aspect of the auditory oral school.

Rhonda Savage

Mom to Audrey, 9, hearing; and Neal, 6 1/2, CII at 2.9 years

" Hard does not mean impossible. "

[Guest guest]

I agree with you whole hearted ly on the social aspects. The only parents I got

to know at AV were through the waiting room. But since then the center has

started parents groups and even alumni parent groups. And really, with CI's the

distinctions between AV and AO are shrinking. I know AO parent infant programs

are pretty indistinguishable from alot of AV programs. I guess I was thinking

about e, and most of the folks I know whose kids have gone there, the kids

are older and it has been a boarding school situation. Plus I was typing at

0730 trying to give Trish a " nutshell " version of AV. I know for years the AV

and AO folks around here had kind of a feud going. That is going by the wayside

somewhat. I was one of the few that used both programs - we did an independent

eval at the AO school which the AV center did not have the capability to do

(psychologist, math and reading testing etc) and ended up doing AV because we

were more than 100 miles from the AO school.

>I think that depends on where you are going to school. For Neal I would have

to say that the philosophy of teaching the parent to live the " lifestyle " every

waking hour was just as prevalent as if he had had an AV therapist. Yet he was

in an auditory oral school.

[Guest guest]

I have to jump in and say so much depends on the center, the therapist, and the

families. I've met A/O therapists who model quite a few of the AV principles in

their work. I've met A/O parents who act as partners with their therapists, and

throw themselves into living a very oral lifestyle. Their A/O experiences

closely resemble mine as an AV parent. However, I've also met just the

opposite: A/O therapists who prefer to work with children without parents

present, A/O parents who prefer to let the therapist do all the work with little

follow up at home, etc. It all depends on what you want to get out of the

relationship with your child's therapist and how you envision your own

participation.

In our AV sessions, our therapist often overlaps families so we can meet and

spend time with each other, schedules parent meetings and family functions so we

can all get together, shares contact information between families, and keeps a

large bulletin board current with pictures, articles and achievements of the

kids and past graduates. If you want the opportunity to meet other parents with

similar goals for their children, it's available for you.

Kerry

-------------- Original message --------------

From: pcknott@...

>

> I agree with you whole hearted ly on the social aspects. The only parents I

got

> to know at AV were through the waiting room. But since then the center has

> started parents groups and even alumni parent groups. And really, with CI's

the

> distinctions between AV and AO are shrinking. I know AO parent infant programs

> are pretty indistinguishable from alot of AV programs. I guess I was thinking

> about e, and most of the folks I know whose kids have gone there, the

kids

> are older and it has been a boarding school situation. Plus I was typing at

> 0730 trying to give Trish a " nutshell " version of AV. I know for years the AV

> and AO folks around here had kind of a feud going. That is going by the

wayside

> somewhat. I was one of the few that used both programs - we did an independent

> eval at the AO school which the AV center did not have the capability to do

> (psychologist, math and reading testing etc) and ended up doing AV because we

> were more than 100 miles from the AO school.

>

>

>

> >I think that depends on where you are going to school. For Neal I would have

> to say that the philosophy of teaching the parent to live the " lifestyle "

every

> waking hour was just as prevalent as if he had had an AV therapist. Yet he was

> in an auditory oral school.

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/19/2006 5:48:50 P.M. Central Standard Time,

babydewe2@... writes:

Now if I can only pick a 2nd grade teacher that will " get " it. If we have

the problems next year that we had this year, I'm pretty sure that all of you

will hear me scream in frustration.

Hmmm, maybe it's time to call ARMED at Chicago Hearing Society and request

them to talk to the class about hearing loss. ARMED is the Adult Deaf Role

Model program that sends a deaf/hh adult to classrooms to talk about everything

under the sun related to being deaf/hh. Then maybe they'll all get it!

Putz

Illinois Families for Hands & Voices

_www.handsandvoices.org_ (http://www.handsandvoices.org/)

_www.ilhandsandvoices.org_ (http://www.ilhandsandvoices.org/)

Email: support@...

[Guest guest]

,

Although your post was not intended for us, I'm am so glad you wrote it.

You have put into words what I've been having a difficult time expressing about

speech therapists. For the past four years we have seen 9 different speech

therapists. Some of them were through the school, others we contracted outside

of school. Out of the nine that we've had, only 4 of them actually " get " what

needs. Our current ST at the school doesn't. Thankfully she is retiring

this year (She's a lovely woman, but not a good fit for ). Our school has

hired the wonderful ST we had last year for ESY. You can't begin to imgaine how

excited I am.

Now if I can only pick a 2nd grade teacher that will " get " it. If we have

the problems next year that we had this year, I'm pretty sure that all of you

will hear me scream in frustration.

Debbie, mom to , 6, moderate SNHL and , 3, hearing

pcknott@... wrote:

So that is why " speech " is not what Bobby needs right now - you don't need to

work on tuning up his output, he needs input so that he both builds his brain

and builds his language. An hour with a speech person working on his

articulation and a resource teacher that doesn't know how to build his brain or

fill in his language gaps isn't what he needs.

Some men see things as they are and ask why. Others dream things that never were

and ask why not. G.B Shaw

---------------------------------

Be a chatter box. Enjoy free PC-to-PC calls with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/19/2006 8:44:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

Parentsofdeafhoh@... writes:

ARMED is the Adult Deaf Role

Model program that sends a deaf/hh adult to classrooms to talk about

everything

under the sun related to being deaf/hh. Then maybe they'll all get it!

Putz

Illinois Families for Hands & Voices

Sheez, is there a chapter here in NY? I'd love to find a mentor for Ian.

(grin)

....off she skips to Google ARMED .... Jill

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/20/2006 10:56:45 A.M. Central Standard Time,

JillcWood@... writes:

Sheez, is there a chapter here in NY? I'd love to find a mentor for Ian.

(grin)

....off she skips to Google ARMED .... Jill

ARMED is unique to the Chicago area, I think. Other states may have similar

programs under different names. You can start one up!

Putz

Illinois Families for Hands & Voices

_www.handsandvoices.org_ (http://www.handsandvoices.org/)

_www.ilhandsandvoices.org_ (http://www.ilhandsandvoices.org/)

Email: support@...

[Guest guest]

Here are some of the wonderful posts people sent me a few months ago when I knew

nothing about AV therapy

trish

RE: HELP! (what is AV therapy?)

Trish-

AV therapy stands for auditory-verbal therapy (AVT). It is one of the

communication methods available for people with hearing loss (so, no,

not a taboo subject!). In AVT, the therapist (who has been trained and

completed an intense certification process) guides both the parent and

the child to maximize listening skills without the use of visual cues

(like lip reading).

There are 10 unique principles of AVT; you can read about them at

http://www.auditory-verbal.org/avi_principles.asp. Please note that

this organization, AVI, recently opted to rejoin AGBell, which is why

there is talk of dissolution on the site. The site now has mostly

information about how to become certified (you can read through this

too, to see how they differ from traditional SLPs, but essentially a

person has to first have a masters in speech-language, audiology or be a

certified teacher of the deaf before they can begin the process of

becoming a certified AVT).

There are several large centers where AVT is offered, and many other

individual therapists around the world. You can view some of the

centers' websites at:

http://www.avc-atlanta.org/

http://www.learningtolisten.org/

http://www.nciohio.com/

This is just a small sampling of some of the places that have pretty

extensive websites. If you go back to the AVI website

(www.auditory-verbal.org) you can locate a local therapist through

there. Soundbridge's AVT program is discussed at

http://www.crec.org/ss/divisionunits/soundbridge/programs/avt.shtml

I'm going to email you privately some attachments that help articulate

the difference between auditory-oral (like e and Soundbridge's A/O

program) and auditory-verbal.

Kerry