Hashimoto's & Fibromyalgia connection? etc.

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

I've got some questions for you. I have Hashimoto's

and was taking Armour for about 1 year. It didn't seem

to be helping me at all, so on 12/25, I decided to

stop taking it to see what happens. I really don't

feel any different except for 2 things...and I'm not

sure if they're related to me stopping the Armour or

not.

1. I've always had fribromyalgia but haven't had a

whole lot of trouble for a while. But in the past few

days, since I stopped the Armour, I've been having

horrible lower back pain, particularly after being on

my feet (even if it's only for 10 minutes). Do you

think it's related somehow?

2. Since I stopped the Armour, I move my bowels about

every other day instead of daily, like I used to.

I've been tracking my basal temperature, which has

gone from an average of 97.6 to 98.0 since I stopped

the Armour. I know this might mean that my thyroid is

going hyper...actually, that's what I'm hoping for so

I can get the RAI and just get the thing out of me.

If my thyroid is making more hormone on it's own,

could that be related to my back pain and change in

bowels? Or could it be related more specifically to

the Armour somehow? Or could it all just be

coincidence? *sigh* I swear, anymore, I think

everything is related to the Hashimoto's...and it

probably is.

Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!!

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Unless you had been taking way too much thyroid hormone(s), then what you're

doing by stopping it all cold turkey, with Hashimoto's, is downright

dangerous. Yes, you WILL cause your sick lame thyroid to work on it's own,

to it's detriment (further destruction of the thyroid itself with much

higher antibodies). I've been there. I can't remember what your thyroid

hormone lab values are at this point, so I have no idea how well you are

converting your T4 to T3, etc....FREE T4 and FREE T3, that is.....so there

is no way to know whether you were already taking way too much, or whether

what you are/have been experiencing before you got off of the hormone is

more adrenal in nature or even more profound symptoms of LOW thyroid or

inability to absorb the hormone into your body cells. I do know, however,

that going completely off of all thyroid hormones with Hashi's, when it's

all unexplained, is detrimental to what's going to happen within your

thyroid gland and to your health. It's only been 5 little days since you

went off of it, and what you're experiencing right now with the fibro may

very well be a drop in the bucket compared to what you're going to be

feeling weeks and months from now, if you STAY off of it. Five days is very

little time. With Hashi's, it would be better for you to be on SOMEthing

rather than nothing at all, unless you are actually hyper, and there is no

proof of that, unless your pulse rate has gone way up past 80 to 90 or

higher. Body temps' changes with thyroid hormone treatment are not that

fast to change, IF that's what would be causing the sudden temp changes.

What a lot of people don't know is that, with Adrenal Fatigue, the body

temps can run both high and low back to normal and very very erratic, even

from hour to hour or one part of the day to the next part. Also, it is

normal for the body temp to change from morning to evening through night

time, but, of course, the temps shouldn't be running regularly below 97.7.

This is documented just about everywhere I've read on this sbjct, so where

anyone gets that the body temp should be running 98.6 axillary (under arm),

I don't know where they're getting it. The ORAL temp (mouth) should run

about 98.6. The axillary temp will always be anywhere from 1/2 to 1 degree

higher than the reading on the thermometer, when it is taken axilllary. I'm

certainly no doc, so this is just IMO, but you appear to have something

going on with one or more of your adrenal gland substances, so you need to

go to a doctor who knows what he/she is doing in this realm.

Hashimoto's & Fibromyalgia connection?

etc.

> Hi everyone,

>

> I've got some questions for you. I have Hashimoto's

> and was taking Armour for about 1 year. It didn't seem

> to be helping me at all, so on 12/25, I decided to

> stop taking it to see what happens. I really don't

> feel any different except for 2 things...and I'm not

> sure if they're related to me stopping the Armour or

> not.

>

> 1. I've always had fribromyalgia but haven't had a

> whole lot of trouble for a while. But in the past few

> days, since I stopped the Armour, I've been having

> horrible lower back pain, particularly after being on

> my feet (even if it's only for 10 minutes). Do you

> think it's related somehow?

>

> 2. Since I stopped the Armour, I move my bowels about

> every other day instead of daily, like I used to.

>

> I've been tracking my basal temperature, which has

> gone from an average of 97.6 to 98.0 since I stopped

> the Armour. I know this might mean that my thyroid is

> going hyper...actually, that's what I'm hoping for so

> I can get the RAI and just get the thing out of me.

>

> If my thyroid is making more hormone on it's own,

> could that be related to my back pain and change in

> bowels? Or could it be related more specifically to

> the Armour somehow? Or could it all just be

> coincidence? *sigh* I swear, anymore, I think

> everything is related to the Hashimoto's...and it

> probably is.

>

> Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated!

>

> Thanks!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Thanks for your response. I didn't give enough info to

you...let me tell you more and give you my labs. I was

diagnosed in the summer of 2004 with hashimoto's and

was really hyper. The docs wanted to do RAI, but at

the time, I wanted to know my other options. So I jusr

didn't get any treatment, and then by mid 2005, my

labs showed " normal " - I was no longer hyper but

didn't feel well. I couldn't find a doc to help me in

any way - meds or RAI.

Finally, I found a doc that looked at my symptoms, not

just my labs. He prescribed me Cortef for adrenal

fatigue, and I've been taking it since January

2006...that has helped me so much - more than

anything. And then in February, he wanted to see how

I'd feel on Armour (thinking it might give me more

energy on top of what the Cortef did for me). I

started at 30mg and worked my way up to 120mg and felt

nothing from it. As of this month, I had worked my way

down to 60mg and still felt no difference. Here are my

labs from 12/12/06 (on 60mg of Armour):

TSH: <.004

Free T3: 354 (normal = 230-420)

Free T4: 1.20 (normal = .76-1.79)

I never felt the same from day to day - would go from

tired and having some energy, kind of in a fog,

somedays I'd have tremors and go between hot and cold.

So I've decided I want rid of my thyroid...if my

thyroid goes hyper on its own, then I can have the

" appropriate " bloodwork and get RAI...go hypo and get

treatment for that - no longer having to deal with the

fluctuations.

Since I stopped the Armour on 12/25, I have lower back

pain, but that's really my only complaint. I'm just

not sure if it's related or not?

Currently, my heart rate is about 87 beats per minute.

My basal temp is about 98.0. Sometimes I feel like I

actually might have a little more energy since I

stopped the Armour. I'm tracking my temps, pulse, and

weight every day to get a feel for what my thyroid is

doing.

Any more thoughts?

Thanks so much!!

--- marin@...> wrote:

> Unless you had been taking way too much thyroid

> hormone(s), then what you're

> doing by stopping it all cold turkey, with

> Hashimoto's, is downright

> dangerous. Yes, you WILL cause your sick lame

> thyroid to work on it's own,

> to it's detriment (further destruction of the

> thyroid itself with much

> higher antibodies). I've been there. I can't

> remember what your thyroid

> hormone lab values are at this point, so I have no

> idea how well you are

> converting your T4 to T3, etc....FREE T4 and FREE

> T3, that is.....so there

> is no way to know whether you were already taking

> way too much, or whether

> what you are/have been experiencing before you got

> off of the hormone is

> more adrenal in nature or even more profound

> symptoms of LOW thyroid or

> inability to absorb the hormone into your body

> cells. I do know, however,

> that going completely off of all thyroid hormones

> with Hashi's, when it's

> all unexplained, is detrimental to what's going to

> happen within your

> thyroid gland and to your health. It's only been 5

> little days since you

> went off of it, and what you're experiencing right

> now with the fibro may

> very well be a drop in the bucket compared to what

> you're going to be

> feeling weeks and months from now, if you STAY off

> of it. Five days is very

> little time. With Hashi's, it would be better for

> you to be on SOMEthing

> rather than nothing at all, unless you are actually

> hyper, and there is no

> proof of that, unless your pulse rate has gone way

> up past 80 to 90 or

> higher. Body temps' changes with thyroid hormone

> treatment are not that

> fast to change, IF that's what would be causing the

> sudden temp changes.

> What a lot of people don't know is that, with

> Adrenal Fatigue, the body

> temps can run both high and low back to normal and

> very very erratic, even

> from hour to hour or one part of the day to the next

> part. Also, it is

> normal for the body temp to change from morning to

> evening through night

> time, but, of course, the temps shouldn't be running

> regularly below 97.7.

> This is documented just about everywhere I've read

> on this sbjct, so where

> anyone gets that the body temp should be running

> 98.6 axillary (under arm),

> I don't know where they're getting it. The ORAL

> temp (mouth) should run

> about 98.6. The axillary temp will always be

> anywhere from 1/2 to 1 degree

> higher than the reading on the thermometer, when it

> is taken axilllary. I'm

> certainly no doc, so this is just IMO, but you

> appear to have something

> going on with one or more of your adrenal gland

> substances, so you need to

> go to a doctor who knows what he/she is doing in

> this realm.

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

:

low thryoid....equals slow bowels and fibro pains...

E:)

> >

> > 1. I've always had fribromyalgia but haven't had a

> > whole lot of trouble for a while. But in the past

> few

> > days, since I stopped the Armour, I've been having

> > horrible lower back pain, particularly after being

> on

> > my feet (even if it's only for 10 minutes). Do you

> > think it's related somehow?

> >

> > 2. Since I stopped the Armour, I move my bowels

> about

> > every other day instead of daily, like I used to.

> >

> > I've been tracking my basal temperature, which has

> > gone from an average of 97.6 to 98.0 since I

> stopped

> > the Armour. I know this might mean that my thyroid

> is

> > going hyper...actually, that's what I'm hoping for

> so

> > I can get the RAI and just get the thing out of

> me.

> >

TOTAL-Thyroidectomy 26 months post-op.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

:

I just have theories...cuz there is simply no way to

know for sure...

I actually think the bloods look good. That doesn't

mean they are okay for you though. You may be feeling

more energy since stopping the Armour...because the t3

in the lab was too high...with that much t4...and that

can sometimes sort of make you feel flattened.

The reason you may be feeling less bowel and back pain

is because you have less t3 now....

So..the way to fix ths...(theory remember) is to maybe

shave off a bit of the armour and add in some t4 so

you can get enough hormone to get rid of the pains and

slow bowels..without the flattening effect.

~E:)

--- " J. McCormick " mccormicklj@...>

wrote:

> Hi ,

>

> Thanks for your response. I didn't give enough info

> to

> you...let me tell you more and give you my labs. I

> was

> diagnosed in the summer of 2004 with hashimoto's and

> was really hyper. The docs wanted to do RAI, but at

> the time, I wanted to know my other options. So I

> jusr

> didn't get any treatment, and then by mid 2005, my

> labs showed " normal " - I was no longer hyper but

> didn't feel well. I couldn't find a doc to help me

> in

> any way - meds or RAI.

>

> Finally, I found a doc that looked at my symptoms,

> not

> just my labs. He prescribed me Cortef for adrenal

> fatigue, and I've been taking it since January

> 2006...that has helped me so much - more than

> anything. And then in February, he wanted to see how

> I'd feel on Armour (thinking it might give me more

> energy on top of what the Cortef did for me). I

> started at 30mg and worked my way up to 120mg and

> felt

> nothing from it. As of this month, I had worked my

> way

> down to 60mg and still felt no difference. Here are

> my

> labs from 12/12/06 (on 60mg of Armour):

>

> TSH: <.004

> Free T3: 354 (normal = 230-420)

> Free T4: 1.20 (normal = .76-1.79)

>

> I never felt the same from day to day - would go

> from

> tired and having some energy, kind of in a fog,

> somedays I'd have tremors and go between hot and

> cold.

> So I've decided I want rid of my thyroid...if my

> thyroid goes hyper on its own, then I can have the

> " appropriate " bloodwork and get RAI...go hypo and

> get

> treatment for that - no longer having to deal with

> the

> fluctuations.

>

> Since I stopped the Armour on 12/25, I have lower

> back

> pain, but that's really my only complaint. I'm just

> not sure if it's related or not?

>

> Currently, my heart rate is about 87 beats per

> minute.

> My basal temp is about 98.0. Sometimes I feel like I

> actually might have a little more energy since I

> stopped the Armour. I'm tracking my temps, pulse,

> and

> weight every day to get a feel for what my thyroid

> is

> doing.

>

> Any more thoughts?

>

> Thanks so much!!

>

>

>

> --- marin@...> wrote:

>

> > Unless you had been taking way too much thyroid

> > hormone(s), then what you're

> > doing by stopping it all cold turkey, with

> > Hashimoto's, is downright

> > dangerous. Yes, you WILL cause your sick lame

> > thyroid to work on it's own,

> > to it's detriment (further destruction of the

> > thyroid itself with much

> > higher antibodies). I've been there. I can't

> > remember what your thyroid

> > hormone lab values are at this point, so I have no

> > idea how well you are

> > converting your T4 to T3, etc....FREE T4 and FREE

> > T3, that is.....so there

> > is no way to know whether you were already taking

> > way too much, or whether

> > what you are/have been experiencing before you got

> > off of the hormone is

> > more adrenal in nature or even more profound

> > symptoms of LOW thyroid or

> > inability to absorb the hormone into your body

> > cells. I do know, however,

> > that going completely off of all thyroid hormones

> > with Hashi's, when it's

> > all unexplained, is detrimental to what's going to

> > happen within your

> > thyroid gland and to your health. It's only been

> 5

> > little days since you

> > went off of it, and what you're experiencing right

> > now with the fibro may

> > very well be a drop in the bucket compared to what

> > you're going to be

> > feeling weeks and months from now, if you STAY off

> > of it. Five days is very

> > little time. With Hashi's, it would be better for

> > you to be on SOMEthing

> > rather than nothing at all, unless you are

> actually

> > hyper, and there is no

> > proof of that, unless your pulse rate has gone way

> > up past 80 to 90 or

> > higher. Body temps' changes with thyroid hormone

> > treatment are not that

> > fast to change, IF that's what would be causing

> the

> > sudden temp changes.

> > What a lot of people don't know is that, with

> > Adrenal Fatigue, the body

> > temps can run both high and low back to normal and

> > very very erratic, even

> > from hour to hour or one part of the day to the

> next

> > part. Also, it is

> > normal for the body temp to change from morning to

> > evening through night

> > time, but, of course, the temps shouldn't be

> running

> > regularly below 97.7.

> > This is documented just about everywhere I've read

> > on this sbjct, so where

> > anyone gets that the body temp should be running

> > 98.6 axillary (under arm),

> > I don't know where they're getting it. The ORAL

> > temp (mouth) should run

> > about 98.6. The axillary temp will always be

> > anywhere from 1/2 to 1 degree

> > higher than the reading on the thermometer, when

> it

> > is taken axilllary. I'm

> > certainly no doc, so this is just IMO, but you

> > appear to have something

> > going on with one or more of your adrenal gland

> > substances, so you need to

> > go to a doctor who knows what he/she is doing in

> > this realm.

> >

> >

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

JMO..but only being off the Armour since the 25th is a little too

early to tell..

The slower bowel movements etc..are signs of hypo, but with the direct

T3 from Armour not really sure what is from lack of T3 and what is

from lack of your body being used to the T3, you may need a few weeks

for your body to become accustommed to no T3 directly to swing into

producing it on its own to tell what your real levels are at.

I will say though that your T4 looked low and could be a little higher

from your last set of labs..Considering your swings have you tried

Synthroid or other T4 only med?

You really wanna keep an eye on things as I have a feeling you may

drop hypo instead of doing the hyper swing you are hoping for..

Kats3boys

[Guest guest]

This is a much bigger picture now, and I'm thinking that you talked more

about the details earlier, just not so much in the time sequence of all of

it. Another possibility----Have you ever been allergy tested or do you have

allergies that you just automatically know are there? Have you ever had a

reaction to ingredients in food, drugs, and other things? Some of the

filler things used to stick medicines together can be detrimental to some

people. Do you consume soy, a lot of cruciferous veggies, and many other

things that can quite blocking on the thyroid hormones? Do you take calcim

or iron supps close to your thyroid meds? Have you ever been exposed to

chemicals over and over again, as insecticides, work in a chemical plant?

Do you take iodine in your vitamin supplements? I'm just trying to think of

anything that might be blocking your thyroid hormones or irritating your

Hashi's (iodine), or things such as the allergies. The Free testing is what

you should have had and did, and they look fine, but that doesn't mean that

it's getting a cellular response. Have you ever had an insulin test?

Re: Hashimoto's & Fibromyalgia

connection? etc.

> Hi ,

>

> Thanks for your response. I didn't give enough info to

> you...let me tell you more and give you my labs. I was

> diagnosed in the summer of 2004 with hashimoto's and

> was really hyper. The docs wanted to do RAI, but at

> the time, I wanted to know my other options. So I jusr

> didn't get any treatment, and then by mid 2005, my

> labs showed " normal " - I was no longer hyper but

> didn't feel well. I couldn't find a doc to help me in

> any way - meds or RAI.

>

> Finally, I found a doc that looked at my symptoms, not

> just my labs. He prescribed me Cortef for adrenal

> fatigue, and I've been taking it since January

> 2006...that has helped me so much - more than

> anything. And then in February, he wanted to see how

> I'd feel on Armour (thinking it might give me more

> energy on top of what the Cortef did for me). I

> started at 30mg and worked my way up to 120mg and felt

> nothing from it. As of this month, I had worked my way

> down to 60mg and still felt no difference. Here are my

> labs from 12/12/06 (on 60mg of Armour):

>

> TSH: <.004

> Free T3: 354 (normal = 230-420)

> Free T4: 1.20 (normal = .76-1.79)

>

> I never felt the same from day to day - would go from

> tired and having some energy, kind of in a fog,

> somedays I'd have tremors and go between hot and cold.

> So I've decided I want rid of my thyroid...if my

> thyroid goes hyper on its own, then I can have the

> " appropriate " bloodwork and get RAI...go hypo and get

> treatment for that - no longer having to deal with the

> fluctuations.

>

> Since I stopped the Armour on 12/25, I have lower back

> pain, but that's really my only complaint. I'm just

> not sure if it's related or not?

>

> Currently, my heart rate is about 87 beats per minute.

> My basal temp is about 98.0. Sometimes I feel like I

> actually might have a little more energy since I

> stopped the Armour. I'm tracking my temps, pulse, and

> weight every day to get a feel for what my thyroid is

> doing.

>

> Any more thoughts?

>

> Thanks so much!!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Fibro is usually due to under treated thyroid, it is also possible

that you have adreanl stress, which can make you feel bad. you can

have a adreanl stress index done through the canary club.

you should not stop taking your meds. unfort we who have hashis will

have to take it the rest of our lives, 'to me armour saved my life, i

took syn for 6 yrs and felt terrible, i switched to armour in May 06,

and have worked my way up to 3.50 then i check my adreanal glands and

found that i do have some adrenal stress and will start taking HC this

month,

Hi everyone,

>

> I've got some questions for you. I have Hashimoto's

> and was taking Armour for about 1 year. It didn't seem

> to be helping me at all, so on 12/25, I decided to

> stop taking it to see what happens. I really don't

> feel any different except for 2 things...and I'm not

> sure if they're related to me stopping the Armour or

> not.

>